New Article

[Anonymous]

Here is a new article in regards to the program:

http://www.pianofinders.com/InsidersView/theseed.htm

[JaLong]

Thanks for the info. Brought back many memories, and most not so great.

[Anonymous]

Powerful Stuff:


I remember a moment of horror, on the evening of my seventh or eighth day, when I realized that I was unable to "think" any longer. I had lost the ability to retreat into the sanctuary of my own mind and think things through, because I had grown so accustomed to being intruded upon without a moment's notice. It was as if I'd had a sealed off room in my head that had previously been accessible only to myself, and now even I could not enter. (I think I may known even then, in my heart of hearts, that I would regain access to this room at some point in my life, but it would be a long time, much longer than I could accept at age 14.)

[cleveland]

Amazing article. I can't believe how well he remembered this...wow, I will have to read it again.

[marshall]

Absolutely awesome! :nworthy: Great analysis of the program and I could relate  :lol: to nearly every point. Thanks...though reading that did bring back that sick, unsettled feeling of being back there.

[cleveland]

Bump!

Everyone should read this. It's great!

http://www.pianofinders.com/InsidersView/theseed.htm

Read the other article too, from an adult perspective.

[GregFL]

Marc...my friend....You ROCK!

[marcwordsmith]

Thank you Walter, Ja Long, Marshall, Greg, Stripe, Ginger, and anyone else who took the time to read my  account. I had written about the Seed a few times in my twenties. The online piece is a synthesis of those writings, with some editing and a little extra commentary to bring it up to date.

It means a lot to me that people on this web site have read it. I was going to announce it in this forum, but for some reason I hesitated. I'm glad though that people found it.

Ja Long, I'm sorry it brought back painful memories. I have read about some of the horrors you suffered in particular, and I want to say I'm deeply sorry for what you endured, and I marvel at your spirit. Marshall, I know what you mean by "sick, unsettled feeling." Well put.

[landyh]

On 2005-12-02 17:57:00, marcwordsmith wrote:

"Thank you Walter, Ja Long, Marshall, Greg, Stripe, Ginger, and anyone else who took the time to read my  account. I had written about the Seed a few times in my twenties. The online piece is a synthesis of those writings, with some editing and a little extra commentary to bring it up to date.



It means a lot to me that people on this web site have read it. I was going to announce it in this forum, but for some reason I hesitated. I'm glad though that people found it.



Ja Long, I'm sorry it brought back painful memories. I have read about some of the horrors you suffered in particular, and I want to say I'm deeply sorry for what you endured, and I marvel at your spirit. Marshall, I know what you mean by "sick, unsettled feeling." Well put."

By now most of you here know and maybe even have some understanding of my conflicted views on The Seed. Reading some of the posts here and your story Marc has brought back some "sick and unsettled" feelings for me as well. Deeply buried ones that conflict on every level with my memories of the first time I was there. I only bring this up because no matter how accurate my depiction of some of the positive aspects of my first time around I am beginning to find here something of myself that was lost. Without this forum to which I don't think I found by accident those issues would have remained buried. While the digging itself is painful to question things as I thought they were I have some hope in that darkness cannot exist in light.

"Nothing real can be threatened.
Nothing unreal exists.
Herein lie's the peace of God"
From the introduction to:
A Course In Miracles

[TRUCKER]

A good article! However, for every negative there is a positive. I am pretty sure that my 18 months at the mind controlling Seed was much better than the 20 years at florida's hotel at Raiford. What do ya think? Its to bad we all dont live in countries like singapore where programs like the Seed dont exist.Its was such a terrible thing! I really hate what the Seed did for me.I am so glad for this site because it reminds me how bad my life has been ruined because someone cared. :wink:

                       TRUCKER

[GregFL]

On 2005-12-03 03:39:00, TRUCKER wrote:

"A good article! However, for every negative there is a positive. I am pretty sure that my 18 months at the mind controlling Seed was much better than the 20 years at florida's hotel at Raiford. What do ya think? Its to bad we all dont live in countries like singapore where programs like the Seed dont exist.Its was such a terrible thing! I really hate what the Seed did for me.I am so glad for this site because it reminds me how bad my life has been ruined because someone cared. :wink:



                       TRUCKER"

another Non sequitur.  Hmm.

Yes trucker, 18 months  at the seed is "better" than 20 years at raiford.

Also, cutting off my toe is better than losing my leg.  

Thanks for being Mr. Obvious!

hmm...lets look further..

Having recently spent some time in Singapore, yes  America is freer and a different style society than Singapore, but are you sure they don't have behavior modification programs?  What is the point here anyway? This is what we who debate call a straw-man Trucker.  Thought you might like to know that. :wink:

your last point...."I really hate what the Seed did for me.I am so glad for this site because it reminds me how bad my life has been ruined because someone cared."

Okay, the rest was window dressing and this is your point.

First, the site.  I assume when you say "I am so glad for this site because it reminds me how bad my life.."
That you are using sarcasm to ridicule 1) the site and 2) the people who post here.

Well, the site is voluntary and open, and the people who post here are doing so because they want to, including you. So, if the site "reminds" you of anything it is because of the free flow of information contained within, which again is voluntary.  Therefore, you are being sarcastic about the free flow of information.  

Hmm...maybe you should move to singapore?

The second point I have already covered in another thread.  Just because someone's adult life is not ruinous does not validate a childhood experience.  How lame is that reasoning?

Trucker, stick to more sound arguments please.

[GregFL]

On 2005-12-02 20:50:00, landyh wrote:

 I only bring this up because no matter how accurate my depiction of some of the positive aspects of my first time around I am beginning to find here something of myself that was lost.

Then this site is dedicated to you Landy and all like you (us) who want/need to put this experience into proper focus.  

Just where does it belong in the history of our lives?  Just what really happened...negative, positive or neutral?  Were we really "saved" or were we conditioned to believe an urban myth, that we were dying? Did we need addiction treatment? Was this treatment secondary to other techniques used?  What were those techniques? Why were we seperated from TV and the news? Our families?   Were we "loved" or were we part of a group dynamic that used "love" as a binding force and a weapon of exclusion?  Was this "love" different than real world capital L love? Just where did these techniques come from, and where have they gone?  And on and on...the subject matter is captivating  and also sometimes a bit disturbing.

It is a fascinating journey thru self-realization that you are now a part of.  We are all glad you are here as well.

[FueLaw]

The funny thing about Trucker  and other similar post is that even more than 30 years later they still do not realize that they were lied to in order to get them to enroll or enter the Seed. For example, take Trucker, he was arrested for a small ammount of controlled substances and goes to court and winds up in the Seed. He thinks he was facing 20 years in Raiford, not just any prison but "THE FLORIDA STATE PRISON".

Nothing could be further from the truth. He was probably a first offender and not facing anything more than probation. In Florida people are sentenced according to guidelines which rank offenses by their severity. Drug offenses are not very severe. However, in a worst case senario, a person with numerous prior convictions, could face alot of time in prison for somewhat minor offenses.

In order to scare young offenders judges will always tell them that they face alot of time in prison even though they know its not true. In the early to mid 70's, when courts were still sending young offenders to the Seed, they did it pre trial or as a condition of probation.

Pre Trial means that if person entered the Seed, or another drug rehab program, and completed it the charges against them were dismissed. The judges like this because it gives a chance for young offenders to straighten themselves out without having a criminal record. If a person quit or was kicked out of the Seed , while they were in  Pre trial, there case simply goes back in the hopper and continues as if it just started. In most cases they were sent to another program or given a different plea deal which was usually probation.  

If on probabtion the person would have to complete the program or risk being in violation of probation. If they violated they could be subject to county jail time, usually less than 1 year.

The threats, made regularly by staff, of being sent to some hardcore prisons where you would almost be certainly beaten and raped was part of the implied violence made by staff that we discussed in other threads.  

Finally, why Raiford ? Florida has many prison facilities. Why would the State Department of Corrections, send a young offender to a prison which houses death row and other harccore prisoners doing life for crimes like murder, rape, kidnapping ect..? They wouldn't because each prisoner is classified and sent to a prison based on their classificiation. Muderers dont usually wind up in the same cell as a young drug offender.

The use Raiford, as threat, was just part of the Seed dogma. Just like the come down sessions when people would say if you were on the streets....... all the is horrible stuff would happen to you. The use of Raiford by kids in the group was just a way of them building their egos or credibility in the group.

So even more than 30 years after the fact people like Trucker do not even realize that they were suckers not truckers.

Finally, to Mark that was a great article.

[landyh]

On 2005-12-03 09:09:00, GregFL wrote:

"

On 2005-12-02 20:50:00, landyh wrote:


 I only bring this up because no matter how accurate my depiction of some of the positive aspects of my first time around I am beginning to find here something of myself that was lost.

Then this site is dedicated to you Landy and all like you (us) who want/need to put this experience into proper focus.  



Just where does it belong in the history of our lives?  Just what really happened...negative, positive or neutral?  Were we really "saved" or were we conditioned to believe an urban myth, that we were dying? Did we need addiction treatment? Was this treatment secondary to other techniques used?  What were those techniques? Why were we seperated from TV and the news? Our families?   Were we "loved" or were we part of a group dynamic that used "love" as a binding force and a weapon of exclusion?  Was this "love" different than real world capital L love? Just where did these techniques come from, and where have they gone?  And on and on...the subject matter is captivating  and also sometimes a bit disturbing.



It is a fascinating journey thru self-realization that you are now a part of.  We are all glad you are here as well.



"

Thanks Greg!

[Antigen]

On 2005-12-02 20:50:00, landyh wrote:

While the digging itself is painful to question things as I thought they were I have some hope in that darkness cannot exist in light.

"There lives more faith in honest doubt, believe me, than in half the creeds."--Lord Alfred Tennyson (I think?)

"Don't be skeered"--Schmeel

The Mann family was only one of a host of influential voices being raised against the traditional reading instructions in the most literate nation on earth.
http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/chapters/3n.htm' target='_new'>John Taylor Gatto