GOODBYE!!!

[the wet noodle]

I can't believe that I am being sucked back into this...but maybe you all are right...I shouldn't leave...or I can't leave...I think I need to join a new 12 step program because I am powerless over this site!  :smokin:  :smokin:

But I doubt that will happen anytime soon...

Take care...and I guess (grudgingly) you have not seen the last of The Wet Noodle.

[shady grove]

But antigen those of us who do use the 12-steps get really beat down if we talk about it here. I could talk about Buddhism alot and maybe get a few trolls to give me shit, but 12-steps, forget it. All threads become full time, shit giving.

So it is clear to us that you don't want us here. (it's your website). But we are survivors, too. We got hurt in that insane place and we can actually help, too, in these discussions. Antigen, I personally have always respected you as an intelligent voice here, so this tact you've taken lately has really surprised me.

I haven't read ANYTHING yet that you have posted that proves NA/AA and straight are cohorts. Yes, I agree that somewhere along the line law-enforcement started dumping DUIs in meetings. I don't know why...maybe Bill W was friends with a judge, I dunno. Do you? Facts. I have asked those that know more than I and no one knows.

But the thing is, it is against traditions. NA/AA officially does not want to be associated with any other organization. Having your court slip signed is against traditions. I personally will not do it.

Yes, many other organizations would like to associate themselves with NA/AA, such as rehabs. But b/c NA/AA has no opinion on this, NA/AA do not denounce the association. This is what is written in the literature. I know many see a conspiracy despite this. I just feel I have to give this perspective when I read these claims. Anitgen, your statements are shocking to ME.

When people say I am pathetic, or that my beliefs are tragic, or that they are sorry to find out about something I believe it DOES hurt. Maybe I'm just a wuss. But I would never speak to anyone that way. How can one possibly feel welcome here with this? I have gained alot from this site in the last year and a half and I plan to stick around. Despite the crazies and the assholes.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-15 10:46:00, the wet noodle wrote:



That is the reason why your whole rant about people being forced into 12 step programs is ridiculous!!! People who are court ordered into AA/NA sit in the back of the room, do not pay attention, relate out and leave as soon as they can...they only have to attend meeting once or twice a week for gods sake...people who are court ordered into treatment centers are choosing them instead of jail...and these centers may use the 12 steps...but they are not endorsed by AA/NA..

Jail vs. Stepcult indoctrination is no choice at all, and for you to think that Stepsters like yourself are not behind the practice is ludicrous.  Do you think that Anheuser Busch or Seagram's lobbied to get the courts to send people to meetings?

NA/AA uses the loophole "oh, we don't endorse any causes, but our members might" as their justification for their disgusting practices.  And the 12th Step says to "carry the message", which is dangerous, because the ideas espoused by this cult with which you are so enamored are not only false, but detrimental.  If the Stepcult was some harmless little sect of kooks, I'd let it go, but it is not---it is a fucked-up organization that has been making inroads in our culture for far too long.

And you , Wet Noodle, are a fucking hypocrite.  You whine about me bashing your idiotic religion, yet several times you have accused me of "perpetuating Straight's abuse" by doing this, and have made other personal attacks when you were unable to respond to questions or assertions I have made about Stepcraft.  How typical of your ilk---you can not defend the ridiculous notions espoused by your cult, notions which are not only false, but dangerous, so you whine about being attacked while you spout inane accusations and insults.  You also erroneously state that I feel the way I do about your dime-store philosophy is a result of Straight and only Straight.  This is not the case.  I have attended meetings of your cult and know exactly what it is, firsthand.  

Your belief that treatment centers such as Straight are not part of the Stepcult is completely at odds with reality.  The 12 Step groups are frequently invoked, with mandatory meetings at most of them, and speakers from the local AA/NA diocese are brought in by many of them.  

Enjoy the Kool-Aid.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-15 07:48:00, the wet noodle wrote:

" a bunch of people on this site aren't just anti Str8...they are anti recovery...which is one of the most unforgiveable and ignorant things i have ever seen..."

you don't get out much, do you.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-15 10:46:00, the wet noodle wrote:






The main diference between AA/NA and treatment centers like Str8 is a little something called FREEWILL. AA/NA does not work unless it is voluntary...

Free will being brought up by somone who is "powerless over (whatever)".  Does this strike anyone else besides me as being a little odd?  Careful, Wet Noodle, entertaining ideas that free will exists is gonna get you on the road to relapse.  

Seriously, if someone has "free will" enough to sign up with the Stepcult, why can't they have "free will" enough to stop or moderate their ingestion of certain chemical compounds that they believe are causing them problems?

Oh, yeah, I'm high on pot as I write this..... :smokin:

[Anonymous]

"When people say I am pathetic, or that my beliefs are tragic, or that they are sorry to find out about something I believe it DOES hurt. Maybe I'm just a wuss."

shady buddy, would you please take up some martial arts or boxing or something. i sincerely think that you have been emotionally battered by all this program jive. that's what i think, and i am posting it. i am not concerned with whether or not it hurts your feelings. i think you have been trained so severely that even when you are alone in your car and somebody cuts you off or rides your tail, you think you have to work your program and "forgive them" or "see them as a child of light" (your words, not mine).

this sort of training is violent to a normal, functioning psyche. it is constant internal criticism. tell the truth now. how much of the day do you spend reviewing your reactions to things and what you "need" to share about with someone later?

you might want to give up all that sugar crap and junk food, too. that can wreck your emotions. here is some unsolicited and yet first rate dietary advice: you go spend some money in the produce section. get yourself some of that florida fish. don't eat anything that doesn't resemble what it looked like when it was alive. trash all the other food in the house. do it now. i should charge you good money for how fucking Beautiful People* this is going to make you feel. but, check into fornits once in a while. i'll keep giving you free tips.

*don't forget us little fornits friends when you and sophie are walking the red carpet!

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-15 07:48:00, the wet noodle wrote:

 as far as I am concerned I owe it all to AA and god and the steps...

Give up the lawyer gig, and get into stand-up comedy---you're cracking me up!!!!! :lol:  :lol:

[Antigen]

I don't know where you get the idea that I don't want you here. This is a relavent discussion or it wouldn't keep coming up all the time. Seems to me that you require that everyone tip toe around your sacred faith or you'll take your ball and go home. Ok, if that's how you feel then do that. As much as I've enjoyed this (and I'm not being facetious, it's actually bit a bit more civil and coherent than most discussions on one of these hot topics) I value meaningful free and open discussion far more than your tender feelings or participation.

I don't find anything printed in the Big Book any more compelling than "Honesty, the first and most impotent rule."

Unless you can make a damned compelling argument to support your notion that someone other than stepcraft believers* are the ones coercing stepcraft participation, that particular tradition doesn't really mean anything easier. Where do you think they get their staff? You think they hire non members and just give them a 6 wk course in the Program then turn them loose?

Never mind what they say, whatch what they do!

But what else would you expect. Your cult promotes the idea that you will die if you leave the cult. Shit, was it Shady or Noodle who accused anon of trying to kill people by criticizing your cult? So you personally promote this idea. The politicians are listening! They hear you and they've got their finger on the pulse of the rest of the public who are almost as scared to honestly discuss your cult as some people are to use the word nigger in any context.

What the hell do you think they'll do with that? Pretend you're a politican for a moment. "Hey, everybody who might object to my handing my buddy a few mil in public funding is scared shitless to say so." And, again, your pretending that it's either not happening or that your cult has nothing to do with it is detrimental to the cause of putting a stop to it. But only if people keep walking on egg shells around the issue.


*AA/NA/GA or any other XA belief system that attributes mystical power to personal powerlessness.

The Internet is now safe for free speech.
-- Christopher A. Hansen on the overturning of the Communications Decency Act

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-15 10:56:00, shady grove wrote:

"When people say I am pathetic, or that my beliefs are tragic, or that they are sorry to find out about something I believe it DOES hurt."

i know JUST what you mean. i feel the exact same way when people don't get why i like outkast so much. it tears me up. i fling myself across the bedcovers and weep bitter tears of being misunderstood. they just don't get it, and maybe they never will!!!!!!

every boy and girl, woman to man,

when you feel you've done about the best you can,

muthafuck the wagon come join the band

vibrate, vibrate higher!

-Andre Benjamin

[the wet noodle]

I have changed my mind.... at first I was offended by everyones constant digging against the program (AA) that saved my life...

But now I think this forum is kind of fun... ::soapbox::

Love ya...have a seat!!!

 ::dove::

[shady grove]

Thank you anon. I believe I know who you are and I do miss talking on PMs. I am assuming that we no longer do b/c you've realized that I'm a stepcult nazi automaton.

But thanks for the advice. I love fresh veggies but having trouble taking the time to cook them. I'm actually a good cook. Started a new diet (again) so wish me luck. It's weight watchers, no steps!

Good guess about the self-questioning. I do this too much but the the other extreme is far worse.

Antigen, I didn't mean that you can't discuss this topic b/c of my poor infant feelings. I was referring specifically to when forniters make  personal remarks. And if I am welcome, well thanks.

BTW- i never said anyone here would die for any reason or cause another to do so.

I'm going down to the schoolyard now to indoctrinate some new stepcultists. Wish me luck.

[the wet noodle]

On 2005-09-16 09:36:00, shady grove wrote:

"
I'm going down to the schoolyard now to indoctrinate some new stepcultists. Wish me luck."

Dude...wait for me...

[Sophie]

Wait for me guys! I'll bring the robes and the flowers. Shady don't forget your tambourine sweetie. ::bigsmilebounce::


Seriously, I have been wondering...

What is the suggestion for the person with addiction?  Oh..addiction isn't real unless we are talking about physical addiction?  Is that what I understand?  Compulsive behavior isn't real?  I think I am missing something.

So if not XA... then what?  What is your solution for the "junkie snatching purses or the sweet little old lady getting drugs from her doctor"?  That's the part that confuses me.  I get it why you don't like straight and the 12 step fellowships.  What I don't get is ...what is YOUR solution.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-16 16:15:00, Sophie wrote:

" ...what is YOUR solution."

 :smokin:

thanks for asking.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-16 09:36:00, shady grove wrote:

"Thank you anon. I believe I know who you are and I do miss talking on PMs."[/qoute]

b.s. you ditched me months ago. don't come crying if i don't write you back the first day.

"I am assuming that we no longer do b/c you've realized that I'm a stepcult nazi automaton."

again, b.s. you clearly feel guilty for ditching me so you are making it look like my fault.

"But thanks for the advice. I love fresh veggies but having trouble taking the time to cook them."

maybe you shouldn't spend so much time either on the internet or going to meetings.

[quote}I'm actually a good cook. Started a new diet (again) so wish me luck. It's weight watchers, no steps!"

best of luck to ya dear. if that don't work, how bout you and the missus come up to my spa. i'll give you a real cut rate. war vets and all.

"Good guess about the self-questioning. I do this too much but the the other extreme is far worse."

please explain. NOW.

"I'm going down to the schoolyard now to indoctrinate some new stepcultists. Wish me luck."

gross. but since it is a "joke" i will let it slide. i will NOT however let slide the fact that Straight gave you O.C.D. - your post, buddy, not mine - I mean, that place motherfukkin child abused you, and you are happy to keep drinking the cool aid. it really is extraordinary, on the level of CIA extraordinary, what a good job these government sponsored thought reform camps do in long term pacification of a certain percentage of prisoners. i mean, they are motherfucking perverts, not only in the brain with all their rules about you are supposed to organize your thoughts and emotions Just So so that you psychologically self-flagellate all day, but in  the body too! motherfuckers want to stick a needle in people to see what's in that blood! i mean, you'd think I'd be used to it, with the dogs and the sniffing and all that. but i think the taking of the blood is not only creepy, it's like rape.

and, yes you are so on their side.