Author Topic: Please step In to reality  (Read 7197 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2005, 01:12:00 PM »
Why can't Kerry speak for herself?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2005, 10:54:00 PM »
i'm sure she can but she doesn't check this ridiculous website anymore.  it's not like our posting about her sent a message to her to check fornits IMMEDIATELY to respond for herself.  she' sa friend of mine and i talked to her a lot at the reunion so i know what she was feeling
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #17 on: August 21, 2005, 05:35:00 PM »
woah woah....and woah..What a way to avoid the whole issue..speaking of someting else. Well didn't John ever tell you not to change subjects when your being confronted. To all of you who keep on walking around this issue TALK ABOUT IT.

Why did a man without a thraputic licence have the right to listen in on young girls speaking of their detailed sexualities/ sexual experiences? You still have not said anything about it. WHY

Betsy I trully don't know you but I read many of your posts....I wish you would speak your mind on this topic because you seem very confident when speaking about other things but...seems as though you dare not justify this one.

I KNOW MANY OF YOU MMS ALUMNI HAVE READ THIS ..WHY HAVE YOU NOT MADE A COMMENT ABOUT IT?
If you believe John Mercer is right please explain..I would rather belive he is normal rather be in the position that I am right now beliveing that he used us for his own perverted reasons.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #18 on: September 05, 2005, 09:29:00 PM »
Whoever is writing this seems like they want an argument.  Specifically, a reason to get into a nasty back and forth, which is personally what I think this website has become.  It all seems to come down to "those who support it" and those "who dont" and I am making this assertion because of your pointed comment to Besty regarding this topic.  Why hasn't Betsy responded?  I don't know... But I would venture to guess it's because most of her posts are attacked.  Point being, I am an advocate of MMS as well.  And my response to your post is not for an argument, but for clarification from anothers perspective.  And the first thing I am wondering is are you a student?  It seems like you might be an outsider that is forming opinions based on those posts made by girls who had a negative experience at MMS. So please clarify that to help me understand better.  (And if you are a student, my apology to you for the assumption).
As a sidenote, I am friends with girls who had negative experiences at MMS.  I am empathetic towards their bad experience, just as they are willing to accept the fact that I had a good experience.  So, to clarify, I AM NOT discounting those girls who had bad experiences.  For some people MMS was just not meant to be and its unfortunate that they had to suffer 1-2+ years of their life there going untreated.  My hearts are with you girls, for those of you who know who I am, you know that I support you fully.
Now onto the arguable topic that you are so desperate to have someone respond to...... I never had sex before MMS.  I had made out with one guy.  So my sexual history was of very little interest, except for the part that I masturbated.  Like, a lot.  And John never made me divulge in this part of my history.  Do you know who did though?  Some of the girls I was there with.  One girl called me out in group about it, and even went as far as to call me a "sex addict" because I masturbated so much.  That was pretty funny to me.  If I moved the wrong way in my bunk, my bunkmate would be like "are you masturbating?!?!" as if it was a bad thing.  And then they would call me out in group, or say something about it during my therapy time after my call with my parents.  Anyway, I digress.  So do I think John is a pervert?  Absoloutly not.  No way, never, uh-uh.  And like you, I will never agreee or even entertain the thought that he was.  I dont like to make assumptions about people that were there, so I guess I don't know what it was like for someone to share with their parents the intimate details of the 1-40 people they may have slept with.  But I know what it has been like for me to share those details with my parents today, and in all honesty, it has helped.
In my current life, I have slept with people, had sex, I masturbated god forbid!!!  One of those experiences I had though was extremely negative and painful for me: i was raped.  And I told my parents.  And it helped.  My dad pays for my birth control; my mom and I talk about sex, or people I've slept with.  When I was in high school, post MMS, I found out that I had cervical cancer.  My parents were there for me through treatment and never made me feel bad; they only helped.  Had all this occured before going to MMS, and I had shared it with my parents while John was sitting across his desk reading my history, I would have felt just as nervous and sad about it as I did when I did it on my own.  Not because John was there, but because thats hard for anyone to look into the faces of their parents and tell them.  in some ways, I was have felt more comforted knowing I had someone that I trusted and cared about- John- to listen to me without my parents.  Someone who I could just fall apart to and someone who would give me advice.  I was never that close with John while I was at MMS; I was personally much closer with Gary.  But since leaving the school, I have maintained a very close relationship with John and Colleen and I speak/email with them close to 2-3 times a month.  
I sat with girls during their histories.  I can remember their names, their calls, their histories... And to be specific, I was a phone call partner for 5 girls during their history sharing.  And John never got all creepy and googly eyed... His breathing didn't increase and he didnt get all excited and touch himself.  He asked honest questions and led the girls through the sharing of a painful part of their lives with their parents.  He was honest and helpful.  He was understanding and supportive.  Was he a dickhead sometimes?  Yes.  He was an asshole to me during that process, but he wasn't a pervert.  He is not a pervert.  Someone said "god help his children.  I pray for them."  Or something like that.  My response?  God bless his children for they are lucky to have a good hearted and caring father.  And I apologize to those of you this may offend since I know you don't like John, but my whole point is not how great John is, but that he is not a sick pervert. Never was, never will be.  Signed, NO NAME (I don't need an argument... The back and forth gives me a headache and I know the girls who I keep in touch with love me, despite the differences in our experiences).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #19 on: September 05, 2005, 09:29:00 PM »
Whoever is writing this seems like they want an argument.  Specifically, a reason to get into a nasty back and forth, which is personally what I think this website has become.  It all seems to come down to "those who support it" and those "who dont" and I am making this assertion because of your pointed comment to Besty regarding this topic.  Why hasn't Betsy responded?  I don't know... But I would venture to guess it's because most of her posts are attacked.  Point being, I am an advocate of MMS as well.  And my response to your post is not for an argument, but for clarification from anothers perspective.  And the first thing I am wondering is are you a student?  It seems like you might be an outsider that is forming opinions based on those posts made by girls who had a negative experience at MMS. So please clarify that to help me understand better.  (And if you are a student, my apology to you for the assumption).
As a sidenote, I am friends with girls who had negative experiences at MMS.  I am empathetic towards their bad experience, just as they are willing to accept the fact that I had a good experience.  So, to clarify, I AM NOT discounting those girls who had bad experiences.  For some people MMS was just not meant to be and its unfortunate that they had to suffer 1-2+ years of their life there going untreated.  My hearts are with you girls, for those of you who know who I am, you know that I support you fully.
Now onto the arguable topic that you are so desperate to have someone respond to...... I never had sex before MMS.  I had made out with one guy.  So my sexual history was of very little interest, except for the part that I masturbated.  Like, a lot.  And John never made me divulge in this part of my history.  Do you know who did though?  Some of the girls I was there with.  One girl called me out in group about it, and even went as far as to call me a "sex addict" because I masturbated so much.  That was pretty funny to me.  If I moved the wrong way in my bunk, my bunkmate would be like "are you masturbating?!?!" as if it was a bad thing.  And then they would call me out in group, or say something about it during my therapy time after my call with my parents.  Anyway, I digress.  So do I think John is a pervert?  Absoloutly not.  No way, never, uh-uh.  And like you, I will never agreee or even entertain the thought that he was.  I dont like to make assumptions about people that were there, so I guess I don't know what it was like for someone to share with their parents the intimate details of the 1-40 people they may have slept with.  But I know what it has been like for me to share those details with my parents today, and in all honesty, it has helped.
In my current life, I have slept with people, had sex, I masturbated god forbid!!!  One of those experiences I had though was extremely negative and painful for me: i was raped.  And I told my parents.  And it helped.  My dad pays for my birth control; my mom and I talk about sex, or people I've slept with.  When I was in high school, post MMS, I found out that I had cervical cancer.  My parents were there for me through treatment and never made me feel bad; they only helped.  Had all this occured before going to MMS, and I had shared it with my parents while John was sitting across his desk reading my history, I would have felt just as nervous and sad about it as I did when I did it on my own.  Not because John was there, but because thats hard for anyone to look into the faces of their parents and tell them.  in some ways, I was have felt more comforted knowing I had someone that I trusted and cared about- John- to listen to me without my parents.  Someone who I could just fall apart to and someone who would give me advice.  I was never that close with John while I was at MMS; I was personally much closer with Gary.  But since leaving the school, I have maintained a very close relationship with John and Colleen and I speak/email with them close to 2-3 times a month.  
I sat with girls during their histories.  I can remember their names, their calls, their histories... And to be specific, I was a phone call partner for 5 girls during their history sharing.  And John never got all creepy and googly eyed... His breathing didn't increase and he didnt get all excited and touch himself.  He asked honest questions and led the girls through the sharing of a painful part of their lives with their parents.  He was honest and helpful.  He was understanding and supportive.  Was he a dickhead sometimes?  Yes.  He was an asshole to me during that process, but he wasn't a pervert.  He is not a pervert.  Someone said "god help his children.  I pray for them."  Or something like that.  My response?  God bless his children for they are lucky to have a good hearted and caring father.  And I apologize to those of you this may offend since I know you don't like John, but my whole point is not how great John is, but that he is not a sick pervert. Never was, never will be.  Signed, NO NAME (I don't need an argument... The back and forth gives me a headache and I know the girls who I keep in touch with love me, despite the differences in our experiences).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #20 on: September 05, 2005, 09:31:00 PM »
Sorry for posting twice.  My computer was going slow and I accidently hit send twice.  My mistake- I am not trying to "spam"
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #21 on: September 06, 2005, 01:41:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-09-05 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Whoever is writing this seems like they want an argument.  Specifically, a reason to get into a nasty back and forth, which is personally what I think this website has become.  It all seems to come down to "those who support it" and those "who dont" and I am making this assertion because of your pointed comment to Besty regarding this topic.  Why hasn't Betsy responded?  I don't know... But I would venture to guess it's because most of her posts are attacked.  Point being, I am an advocate of MMS as well.  And my response to your post is not for an argument, but for clarification from anothers perspective.  And the first thing I am wondering is are you a student?  It seems like you might be an outsider that is forming opinions based on those posts made by girls who had a negative experience at MMS. So please clarify that to help me understand better.  (And if you are a student, my apology to you for the assumption).

As a sidenote, I am friends with girls who had negative experiences at MMS.  I am empathetic towards their bad experience, just as they are willing to accept the fact that I had a good experience.  So, to clarify, I AM NOT discounting those girls who had bad experiences.  For some people MMS was just not meant to be and its unfortunate that they had to suffer 1-2+ years of their life there going untreated.  My hearts are with you girls, for those of you who know who I am, you know that I support you fully.

Now onto the arguable topic that you are so desperate to have someone respond to...... I never had sex before MMS.  I had made out with one guy.  So my sexual history was of very little interest, except for the part that I masturbated.  Like, a lot.  And John never made me divulge in this part of my history.  Do you know who did though?  Some of the girls I was there with.  One girl called me out in group about it, and even went as far as to call me a "sex addict" because I masturbated so much.  That was pretty funny to me.  If I moved the wrong way in my bunk, my bunkmate would be like "are you masturbating?!?!" as if it was a bad thing.  And then they would call me out in group, or say something about it during my therapy time after my call with my parents.  Anyway, I digress.  So do I think John is a pervert?  Absoloutly not.  No way, never, uh-uh.  And like you, I will never agreee or even entertain the thought that he was.  I dont like to make assumptions about people that were there, so I guess I don't know what it was like for someone to share with their parents the intimate details of the 1-40 people they may have slept with.  But I know what it has been like for me to share those details with my parents today, and in all honesty, it has helped.

In my current life, I have slept with people, had sex, I masturbated god forbid!!!  One of those experiences I had though was extremely negative and painful for me: i was raped.  And I told my parents.  And it helped.  My dad pays for my birth control; my mom and I talk about sex, or people I've slept with.  When I was in high school, post MMS, I found out that I had cervical cancer.  My parents were there for me through treatment and never made me feel bad; they only helped.  Had all this occured before going to MMS, and I had shared it with my parents while John was sitting across his desk reading my history, I would have felt just as nervous and sad about it as I did when I did it on my own.  Not because John was there, but because thats hard for anyone to look into the faces of their parents and tell them.  in some ways, I was have felt more comforted knowing I had someone that I trusted and cared about- John- to listen to me without my parents.  Someone who I could just fall apart to and someone who would give me advice.  I was never that close with John while I was at MMS; I was personally much closer with Gary.  But since leaving the school, I have maintained a very close relationship with John and Colleen and I speak/email with them close to 2-3 times a month.  

I sat with girls during their histories.  I can remember their names, their calls, their histories... And to be specific, I was a phone call partner for 5 girls during their history sharing.  And John never got all creepy and googly eyed... His breathing didn't increase and he didnt get all excited and touch himself.  He asked honest questions and led the girls through the sharing of a painful part of their lives with their parents.  He was honest and helpful.  He was understanding and supportive.  Was he a dickhead sometimes?  Yes.  He was an asshole to me during that process, but he wasn't a pervert.  He is not a pervert.  Someone said "god help his children.  I pray for them."  Or something like that.  My response?  God bless his children for they are lucky to have a good hearted and caring father.  And I apologize to those of you this may offend since I know you don't like John, but my whole point is not how great John is, but that he is not a sick pervert. Never was, never will be.  Signed, NO NAME (I don't need an argument... The back and forth gives me a headache and I know the girls who I keep in touch with love me, despite the differences in our experiences).  "


I would have to agree. I am not an MMS supporter, and I don't like John. In fact, I loathe John but I still don't think he's a pervert. He's an asshole and on a power trip, but still not a pervert. In my years at MMS I was given lots of reasons to think John is a bad person, but never one to make me think he's a pervert.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline BarnardlyB

  • Posts: 84
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #22 on: September 06, 2005, 03:12:00 PM »
HEEELLLLOOOOOO, You want a resoponse so bad Anon, here it is.

Now I agree this whole topic has gotten to a back and forth, whos right, whos wrong and its not about that..
Now its no secret I am a big advocate of MMS. I love the school and the people there.
If you have read other posts of mine you would know some of my history. But let me tell you again.
To be perfectly honest, I had never had sex before MMS. I was one of the first youngest girls to have gone to MMS. MMS opened in 1990 and I went in '94.I had just turend 13 before I went to Wilderness.
I had no sexual history, well i had a little one.I don't know how to say this without being rude or aggressive to other girls and their histories. The girls i went to school with were 15-18 years old. And honestly their histories scared me, I had no idea what you could or couldn't do while having sex and i sure found out. (I didn't mean to offend anyone, if i did im sorry)
Along with that. I didn't know of John Credentials or even cared tell later......long after MMS.
Once I found out I thought it was interesting, but it didn't matter. I talk to my parents about it and they knew but they still trusted.
I love John and would do anything for him and any of the other 5 founding staff.
During group john, mike and gary asked specifics but not inapproriate questions. Johns not the only one that was not certified that asked questions!
i even remember Deb group.
One of my first groups was with mike and deb, and it was around graduation time, i had befriended Jason, their son. I was being confronted by another student. Now i remember she had a hard time telling me and Deb said "its okay i know what your going to say"
She than told me i had sexual energy towrds Jason.
I didn't even knw what sexual energy was. I was than told i had to tell Jason I had sexual energy twords him and was not allowned to go near him.
So I don't think John was the only one that possibly crossed lines.
I know John deictated alot of what happened at MMS. But the other 4 staff agreeded. It was John and mIke that I felt were the "heads" of the school.
I don't remember questions being so inapproprate that I was uncomfortable, I do remember being uncomfortable just hearing what girls had to say.

Now after MMS I was raped and I told my mom and she said "im sorry you put yourself in that situation". Let me tell you.....NEVER, NEVER would i have heard that from John, or anyone at MMS.
John would have questions just like my therapist did. What, where, when, how. All of the above.
So bottom line NO i don't think it was in appropriate for john to ask what he did. Or even be hold group.  John groups were insense and very hard....but never inappropriate. ( we didn't have confrence calls then where girls sat in)
The staff were supportive and helpful. Yes they all had there own way of doing it but none the less they were helpful and supportive.
John was not a pervert about any of this.

I know ive kinda answered in circles.
If you want more specifc topics answered just ask.
Ill try.
I know this isn't the response you wanted but it is a response.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
ou are you
I am I,
Two individuals dancing on our own two feet, & when were together...its beautiful

Offline katfish

  • Posts: 543
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • http://www.cafety.org
Please step In to reality
« Reply #23 on: September 06, 2005, 05:43:00 PM »
I can see that the invasion of privacy as that- a violation, but not really in the pervey kind of a way.  I did sometimes wonder if Mike ever got off, to be honest, but I didn't get that idea too often.  I didn't sense John was getting off on it in the way I think, ANON you may be implying, I think it was a little subtler than that, it seemed to me only the sense of power he got in being able to force us to tell  him everything.  I have never heard of that being acceptable outside of MMS, either- "the 'forced-to-reveal-everything' or do labor and be prevented longer from going home" therapeutic-model .  So, I don't agree with where ANON is leading, but I think the fact that it happened kind of indicative of way of violating your right to privacy or, at least you have a basic right not to reveal some things about yourself and not feel forced...know what I mean?

On the other hand, I have heard from alumni who thought Mike and John were getting off on it too.    So, I sometimes wonder what the reality was.   It makes me to quesy to think about, though.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.
Margaret Mead

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #24 on: September 06, 2005, 11:57:00 PM »
BB,
Sounds like we have a lot in common.  Ill get in touch with you through myspace!  i would love to chat!!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline BarnardlyB

  • Posts: 84
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #25 on: September 07, 2005, 08:49:00 PM »
sounds great Anon, either that or email me
betsyb4165@hotmail.com
hope to hear from you soon
B
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
ou are you
I am I,
Two individuals dancing on our own two feet, & when were together...its beautiful

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2005, 06:24:00 PM »
I agree with you 100% :nworthy:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #27 on: September 29, 2005, 01:34:00 AM »
Anon,
what do u agree with?

thanks
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #28 on: October 21, 2005, 01:43:00 PM »
I apologize for taking so long to respond. I have been extremely bussy. Anyway thank you for finally responding. My purpose in creating this topic was not to make any kind of argument. I wanted those who are attempting to protect the school to explain to me what exacly is right about a man without a PHd and licence trying to therapurize young girls. I want to know if you would let your own daughters- speak about their sexual experieneces to a man but more complex- a man masking himself as a therapist. Would you be concerned if your own relative, friend, or neighboor were presenting themselves as licenced therapists? What if you found out that your daughter was speaking to a grown man about her sexual experiences at a bench in the park? Or at school? Just because MMS is called a theraputic school does not make it right. John Mercer may be a sexual predator. There is no way around it. and no one else has said it but there it is. I will be calling whomever I can to have that man stoppped!

Also I a mission mountain school allumni. The school holds all of my personal records. Everything that has happened to me and every which way I was molested.I was never properly treated at MMS for what happened to me. I feel that I was used.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Please step In to reality
« Reply #29 on: October 21, 2005, 02:19:00 PM »
Sorry if I sound psycho about John how he listened to our sexual histories. I just want to make it clear that it really disgusted me having to retell him and about 34 other people about my private body parts and how other people touched me etc. I have never had to do something so strange. I honestly felt like I was being manipulated to tell every detail and having tom make up things to satisfy John when he said my sexual history wasn't long enough. Also when he asked me if I was sexually attracted to girls or other male staff at the school. Some things are supposed to keep to ourselves. invading my privacy. I felt so violated. I am currently  seeking a therapist to help me through all of this.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »