Cedu ruined good music

[Anonymous]

if everyone has the right, then, to their opinion, without judgement, why do you make your own judgement and become so reactive about someone who voices their opinion?  "Everyone has their right to their opinion, and can share it here."   Rhetorical question, please...

[If u want to know..then a]

ok, you say it's rhetorical but I feel the need to answer you.  I wasn't reactive by anything you said.  I just made a statement concerning the fact that you say you weren't trying to offend anyone.  If it makes you feel better, just think of it as you offended me.  There ya go!

[Anonymous]

I think that the poster called ¨if you want to know...¨has a bit of an attitude. ¨So to¨ïf you want to know...¨, I´m getting the sense that maybe you think of this site as your own private play pen cuz you seem to be laying down a lot of rules for other people (like me) who don´t know you from Adam.  

I´m the anon poster who said that people here act like asses sometimes (they do, it´s a fact...any unbiased group of people would agree, I think, and whether or not they like to look like asses, well I´m not sure what the answer is, in spite of your definitie comments on the subject) (btw I´m not the anon poster who posted just before ïf you wan to know´´´´s last post).

I have to say,¨if you want to know...¨, I do take offense at the way that you try to micro manage what other people say here(like, as in your recent posts, I should answer this for you, I shouldn´t say that because it bothers you). Who died and appointed you king, that´s my reaction to your style of communication anyway.

How about just listening to what other people say, in their own way, in their own words, and responding to that, instead of directing them on how to express themselves, how to feel, what their experiences should be based on your opinion?

You can´t seem to interact that way, you always want to order, correct, and direct.

I don´t know if you´re a bossy person in real life, but I have to bet that you are, based on what I´m seeing in your posts before, and just now.  Bet that´s not the first time somebody told you this, probably won´t make a difference but it´s what I see going on here

[If u want to know..then a]

Thanks for sharing!  :grin:

[Anonymous]

what an articulate response, "if you want to know".  So be quiet already.

 Everyone has the right, as you say, on this forum, to articulate their feelings, their thoughts, their opinions.  If you say that everyone has the right to say whatever they want, of course there will be some that will be offended.  Duh.  

So try to interact in a more positive way and stop trying to tell people what to say.

[Anonymous]

Liked your post, it's reasonable and not unnecessarily bashing anyone

This is the idea that occurs to me, what if people who really are of good faith and wanting to really communicate, did just that.  They can disagree with facts or opinions of course but reasonably  and without the ad hominum stuff, you know cheap personal attacks

So at this site, people who wanted to interact politely just would.  

If for example, I said that I had a bad experience at, say, BCA, I,d decribe that experience and others who were of good faith would take it at face value instead of saying I was drug infested or whatever. They might ask questions and disagree with my interpretations but just not be nasty jerks with an attitude.

And if I had a great experience at, say RMA, I could say so and tell why, and people could ask reasonable questions as they could of anyone and disagree with my interpretations, but nobody would start saying that I was a CEDU plant or brainwashed or other gratuitous insults.

And people who wanted to be of good faith like that would just do so and either ignore or kind of gently respond and try to reshape the style of the more strident and opinionated among us

I think this is kind of important, personally to find out what really went on at CEDU schools, what went on in a helpful and in a destructive sense.

Not only to help grads and people who left process their own experiences but because I hear pretty credible info that CEDU is coming back under new investors but in a similar form after the bankrupty is processed. And it would be good to offer these people input and experience that was really productive in terms of helping and protecting the kids who are sent there

[If u want to know..then a]

On 2005-06-08 19:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

"what an articulate response, "if you want to know".  So be quiet already.



 Everyone has the right, as you say, on this forum, to articulate their feelings, their thoughts, their opinions.  If you say that everyone has the right to say whatever they want, of course there will be some that will be offended.  Duh.  



So try to interact in a more positive way and stop trying to tell people what to say."

Um, ANON (not the one that just posted, the one before)!  Please, take a moment and re-read every post you have written in response to something I said.  I never told you what to say.  I told you that you offended me, and "thanks for sharing".  I don't know what you are so upset about.  No one was bossing you around, and if that is how you take it, then please do not blame me for YOUR interpretations.  I have no control over those.  If you want to sit on here and say "DUH" and all those things, fine, no problem!  It doesn't bother me that you decide to use those words to express yourself.  How funny that you tell me how articulate I am, (sarcastically of course) and then you turn around and say something like that.  

Anon, I hope you have fun bashing other people on this site.  I am not going to engage in this any longer with you because now you are really insulting my intelligence.  Have a good day, and I hope you get EVERYTHING out of this experience that you NEED!   :wave:  [ This Message was edited by: If u want to know..then ask on 2005-06-09 09:53 ]

[Anonymous]

¨if you want to know...´´ there´s no need to flounce off in a huff, you can just tone down the attitude.  Why don´t we all just start over in a more respectful way because we may have things to learn from each other even if we differ on a lot of things.

[If u want to know..then a]

Just don't like to be disrespected.  But no one is going off in a huff, and I never had an attitude.  I am sure that we have many things to offer to each other but I just don't like the way you come across and obviously you don't like the way I come across.  But this is how I am and I am sure that is how you are.  Sorry.

[Anonymous]

Not to be disrespectful but you really do, whether you realize it or not.   Sorry if you don't like my way of expressing myself, it's the only way I've got and I'd rather be real than a people pleaser

But my interest is hearing why certain people hated their emotional growth school experience and certain people didnt

I personally don't get offended very easily unless someone is obviously trying to attack me, so I don't care if anyone out there describes their experience just perfectly in some particular way that I would like it to be done.

So I'd like to hear about what happened at these schools especially the high schools and why some of you feel the way you do, either pro or con.

[If u want to know..then a]

I will give you the last word.....So, I am going to continue to talk to my friends and good luck with what you are looking for...

[Son Of Serbia]

On 2005-06-09 14:09:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
So I'd like to hear about what happened at these schools especially the high schools and why some of you feel the way you do, either pro or con."

You can't be serious!  There are over 8,000 posts on this board, which contain exactly what you're looking for.  This site is filled with accounts of people's suffering at these schools, and we've repeatedly stated our reasons for hating Cedu. Cedu was a bad place that hurt kids and ripped off their parents. This site is filled with countless examples of why this is true.


To the contrary, despite their threats, repeated personal attacks on us, and vehement defense of the program: No Cedu supporter has ever been able to explain what is good about this program, or exactly how it helps people.  To date they haven't provided one solid example to support the alledged validity of the so-called "Emotional Growth Therapy."

I suggest you do some more research on this forum board before you make anymore statements like the one I quoted above. Because the information you claim to be looking for is already here, and has been here for quite some time.


.[ This Message was edited by: Son Of Serbia on 2005-06-10 05:53 ]

[Anonymous]

Maybe I wasn´t clear about what I´m looking for.  I have of course looked at the forum archives and read that some people saw or experienced abuse.

What I have not seen (maybe I missed them)is either cases where somebody is not alleging abuse and still think these programs did not work and why they thought this was so(that is, what was lacking in the program).

Also from what I read, people who actually thought the programs helped them seem to get called names and chased off before they explain what worked for them in any detail

BTW I have read many of your posts Son of Serbia and seen that you tend to be a little touchy about people thinking that these programs worked for them.  

Just want to say I have no quarrel with you but I do think based on what I know personally and other posts here that your story is not the whole story. I have reason to believe for example that there was not always abusive behavior, even in the raps you describe, unless you consider the act of placing a kid in a controlled environment abusive (I personally don´t). Let me say up front that I¨m not going to get into any swearing matches with you, you´d probably do it better than I did and that´s not my interest

[Son Of Serbia]

On 2005-06-10 06:04:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

Just want to say I have no quarrel with you but I do think based on what I know personally and other posts here that your story is not the whole story. I have reason to believe for example that there was not always abusive behavior, even in the raps you describe, unless you consider the act of placing a kid in a controlled environment abusive (I personally don´t). Let me say up front that I¨m not going to get into any swearing matches with you, you´d probably do it better than I did and that´s not my interest"

Well it's obvious that you never sat in a rap then, or spent any time as a "student" in one of these hell holes.  

I have no desire to "quarrel" with you either, and I am quite capable of having rational discussions with people without them degenerating into swearing matches.  It all depends on who I'm talking to.  And you are correct: my story is not the whole story. This website is filled with stories, and each person must tell their own.  Your intentions here seem innocent enough.  Still, we all heard similar claims from Ottawa 5, and well, I'm sure by now you know how that turned out.

If you really are just trying to get some answers, then I hope you find what you're looking for.  But if you start acting like Ottawa 5 did: calling us liars, dismissing the abuses we suffered, and so on...then I swear to god that I'll be all over your case like flies on shit.

[shanlea]

Anon:

I did try to engage in rational discussion without namecalling on the "benefits" of CEDU's programs.  In fact, I defended pro-program people against name calling and they turned on me anyway.  Although their have been numerous posts from people describing prevalent, systemic problems with CEDU, no pro CEDU person has done the opposite. And they have the forum even if some people don't receive it well.

It's difficult because, as Son of Serbia describes, in spite of the testimony of REAL abuses or breaches of ethics, a few pro CEDU posters totally gloss over these issues.  That is insulting.  It's like telling a rape victim she wasn't raped.  

And the thing is, these incidences were NOT isolated. They were systemic.

To people who say "get over high school."  Well, it wasn't high school.  (It wasn't a SCHOOL--it was a group home)  The fact is that things that happen to us, good and bad, especially at crucial developmental stages, affect us.  It is silly to think it doesn't.  If you are isolated in a cult-like setting for a few years, it is naive to believe it wouldn't have long lasting effects.  

In fact, I know a lot of students who were still high on CEDU indoctrination (and that is exactly what it is) when they graduated only to gradually confront the true nature of the program.  It takes awhile, sometimes, for the Kool Aid to wear off.  Moreover, you don't want to accept that the program was worthless after investing two years at CEDU.  Two years of indoctrination, isolation, and intense, mindfucking raps and "experentials".

The other thing that happens is even though you resist at first, you eventually buy the lie CEDU tells you in order to survive.  You are simply broken down until you submit.

Last, many pro CEDU people talk about how difficult it was to re-acclimate to the real world. Well, no shit!! You weren't living in one.  For a $100,000, CEDU's priority should have been to help youths live a healthy life in the REAL WORLD. Instead, we learned how to live at CEDU.  This is why some of the most abusive, well trained bullies went back to CEDU as staff so they could perpetuate it all over again.