TEEN REHAB: AN INVESTIGATIVE REPORT

[Nihilanthic]

PURE really surprises me.

They fill their pages with warnings about the camps and the need to regulate, and how awful the programs are. Then, turn around and admit they are funded by schools, and then say "sure, use OUR transporters and OUR schools!"

Its kind of obvious they're out to make money for SOMEONE.

But, hey, as much as they make aware the possiblity of BS in programs, the stupid secrecy, and the need for reform, if they are sending kids to bad places, their own desire to reform is going to bite them in their ass eventually.

Personally, I'd like WWASPS and PURE to totally tear eachother open so anyone with a pair of eyes (or fingers for braile dots?) could read for themselves what goes on inside of their respective programs.

PURE's slammed WWASPS badly. WWASPS has the legal muscle (money) to do the same to PURE.

I say pass out the popcorn and pull up a lawn chair.

Whenever the General Government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force.
http://laissezfairebooks.com/product.cfm?op=view&pid=FF7485&aid=10247' target='_new'>Thomas Jefferson: Kentucky Resolutions, 1798

[BuzzKill]

Ginger to Carey:
And I don't assume that, just because Sue's got it in for you that you must be an advocate of WWASP.

Me:
I wouldn't either, based on this. I don't think she is any kind of advocate. She is a paid informant. She sold out a large group of people, whom had nothing to do with her vendetta against Sue, for the cash, and the transient pleasure she got from upsetting Sue; and cared not a hoot who it was doing the buying, or how many it might hurt. No, she wouldn't advocate for them, but she'll do business with them. She isn't an advocate for WWASP; but she has made herself an associate of wwasp by virtue of her actions and acceptance of their money and the hiring of their Florida Lawyer. I mean, out of all the attorneys in Florida, she hires Alan Kipinis?  There is plenty of evidence who her associates are.
No bout a dout it. And in light of who they are, Her credibility is non existent.

As for Montel - he has a much more intelligent show than the average day time talk shop. It is completely unfair to put him in the same category as Jerry and that ilk. They put together one of the better shows on the subject and do deserve some credit. If PURE helped with back ground info and phone numbers and so on, then that is reason enough to give them a nod at the end of the show.
I just wish they had given ISAC at least as much credit.

Yes, PURE is controversial and we can all debate day and night the virtues and vices - but it is clear that PURE does mean well, and is trying to help provide alternatives to the more abusive programs. This is not an all together bad thing, even if your opposed to all programs - Simply b/c there are so many families that will insist on alternatives before pulling from a proven gulag; and many others looking for an answer that will find a better alternative due to PUREs efforts. Maybe not perfect - but way better - at least in the opinions of many.

And Ginger, again, the Trekkers list had nothing to do with PURE; and the members have no idea what programs PURE might refer to - except that they aint wwasp. Your a bit out of line hammering Jeff on this point. He likely wouldn't know and neither do I.

And for those who aren't familiar with all this - PURE does not have programs. They are not at all comparable with WWASP. They would be more comparable to Lon Woodberry or Tom Croke. There are programs PURE refers to  - but there are no PURE programs.

[Anonymous]

why don't we attack the public high schools and their dismal record with drugs, alcohol,
teenage pregnancy, suicide, abuse, rapes, shootings,  
knifings, depression, dropouts, drunk driving.
sorry, but i don't want my daughter in that environment any longer and as an individual i have seen the positive results in my daughter and that is all i need, not any sensationalistic viewpoints from people i don't know or care about.

[Anonymous]

Its too bad they didnt mention WWASPS' affiliate/referral program where parents make thousands off sending teens to these facilities.

[Nihilanthic]

What are you supposed to be geting at with your post, anon?

Send her to a REAL private school, not a private program.

Theology: The effort to explain the unknowable in terms of the not worth knowing.
--H. L. Mencken, American publisher

[Anonymous]

On 2005-01-18 22:34:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Its too bad they didnt mention WWASPS' affiliate/referral program where parents make thousands off sending teens to these facilities."

Making thousands of dollars?  That's funny!  They are extended a free month of tuition. It is not a money making business, but a passion for their family. Sharing what has changed their lives to friends who are losing their own child is not selfish.  

Geez.  I know a few therapists who extend a free session to anyone who refers someone to them.

P.S.  The parents don't send other peoples teens to the programs - They actually take the time to talk with other parents about it - not just the "good" stuff either. No parent is stupid enough to make it sound too good to be true.  

I didn't see the Montel show.  Don't care to either.  If it was as one-sided as it reads here, then he was looking for ratings, not the truth.

I pray PURE's heart is in the right place for the lost kids and their families and not for their 'hate" for the best thing (Cross Creek and WWASPS) that was there for our family in a time of crisis.

Be tsy

[Nihilanthic]

Yeah, just ignore everything he said and we have to say, just block it out, and repeat your press-releases, denials, and program speak.

Just ignore the lack of oversight and regulation, that its a money making business, that everything leads back to gilcrease's seminars, that people in there if they are abused have no way to call out for help, and that we still havent seen any kind of real therapy or screening for NECESSITY of the program.

Yeah. Good idea! Just look at the "end results" and dont give any attention to the methods and initial conditions! INNER CHILD! BEAT THE CHAIR!

I swear by my life and my love of it, that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine.
http://laissezfairebooks.com/product.cfm?op=view&pid=AR5564&aid=10247' target='_new'>* - ~ Galt's Creed ~ - *

[Perrigaud]

Not so PURE is PURE. But nowadays corruption rears it's ugly head in just about everything. I am an advocate of WWASP but not for everyone. Only those who like me wouldn't listen to anyone. Private schools were a joke to me. I had fun (back then) corrupting them, pushing the limits, and running away. They also are not for everyone.

[Carey]

Karen you said:

but it is clear that PURE does mean well

It might be clear to you Karen, but it is not clear to me.  She herself sends kids to unregulated programs.  Why is it ok for her to do so?  What makes her uneducated decisions more precious than that of her adversaries?  Does she know everyone who works with the kids in these programs?  Has she done criminal background checks on their employees. Does she spend quality time at each institution to make sure that the proper education is being provided and that each employee is qualified to teach these at risk teens? How does she know whether or not kids are being abused in the programs she refers to?  What guarantee can she give to parents, and more specifically to the teens, that makes her so much better in your eyes.

[Anonymous]

this topic went to hell in a hand basket?  i was impressed with the show though.

who watched the show and got a P.U.R.E. vs WWASPS feeling?

i could have sworn; it was Montel, straight survivors and wwasps surviors, along with their parents?

how, why and who; continues to drag up the "P' vs. "W" scnereo?  if one facility or program is closed via this airing.  or heaven forbid it changed a parents mind about sending little johnnie/susie to a "school" of this nature.

just be content that these things are NOW reaching the public forums; such as fornits, isac's and even day time talk shows and many others who continue to support regulation, closure or non-exsitance of these teen hell holes.

quit the inner back biting and drama.

what if each and everyone of us did something for the cause in one entire day...that's right, put all of this knowledge along with the will power to do something PRODUCTIVE and stop this form of "child abuse"!

Just try it one day...one day only and see what is accomplished?

[Antigen]

On 2005-01-19 09:59:00, Anonymous wrote:

who watched the show and got a P.U.R.E. vs WWASPS feeling?

Anyone who saw the info. screen saying "Contact P.U.R.E. for more info..." Just when you think you see the light at the end of the tunnel, look out for an oncoming train. I'm just looking out, that's all. As far as my hammering Jeff, well if he's going to use words like hero (I suppose cause so many people might misunderstand the term heroine) then he ought to know something about this person and her actions that he defends.

If you guys honestly don't know even the names of the programs to which Sue refers people, Ok. So then we know that you don't know what the hell you're talking about. Thanks for clearing that up.

And yes, there was a promo screen for WWASP too. I'm sure it was all about covering liability. And I agree that Montel is a lot more credible than most other talk shows. But that's not saying much. I'm glad the show was done. I'm glad the topic is being addressed for the daytime talk adience. They are, after all, probably the big purchasers in this industry.

But I didn't enjoy the show. Frankly, it brought back a lot of bad memories. I fucking hate seeing Sammie cry again publicly over these very private issues. I had to keep reminding myself that she's a grown woman and knows what she's doing and I shouldn't worry about her. But, in a big way, watching that was just a whole lot like being back in group. I half expected Montel to start calling on audience members to tear her down. Yeah, I know that wasn't going to happen because it was taped prior and I think Sammie would have called me up and yelled at me or something.

I'm profoundly grateful to everybody who made this happen, even Sue and Mr. Pollack. But, again, what's that i hear? Sounds like it might be a train whistle. Please understand that I have to check and make sure, ok?

It's our goddamn duty to get these people back on drugs so they can think for themselves again!!!
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=4728&forum=7&start=20#40163' target='_new'>RTP2003

[chi3]

I can get on the bbs, but just for my school, i believe. I can try to log onto others, but don't think I can.

[chi3]

Ginger,

I am new to all of this, as you know, but I was wondering, what is the deal with Sue Scheff? What does she do, good or bad? All I've seen is her web site. Please explain.

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

i don't think i mentioned being affiliated with either side?

just made a few remarks about the "P" vs. "W" issue and this show not having anything to do with either.

i did mention this topic and how glad i was to see it on a daytime talk show exposing people who abuse children as far as i was concerned.  grant it, i didn't enjoy anyone crying or having to inform everyone in a public forum that they had been abused.  like i said before i did enjoy that this topic was finally making it's ways to the public airwaves and informing those who may not have experienced what most of us on here have.  whether it be from an incarcerated child's POV or a parent who made a bad decision, IMHO.

noth'in bout a train, whistle or watching for one.  i just thought it was great that the american public witnessed first hand what these unfortunate people were subjected to.  and that it should stop, regardless of who, when or what got the media involved.

jeff's a big boy and can argue his own opinion's?

i don't know who P.U.R.E. refers to nor do i care who they are affiliated with.

seems to me everyone got their fair share of advertising in during the breaks.  no one more than any other.  I, like you, am very glad that the audience wasn't involved nor allowed to question the guests.  then it probablly could have turned into an event?

i don't care who made this show happen, just thankful that it did and will now be content.  thanks to who ever contributed to this event;  isac's, fornits, sammie and sisters, jeff, sue, carey, p.u.r.e., mr. pollack, mr. france and son, shannon and daughter, maia, and so forth.

gotta go, i hear something...

[BuzzKill]

It was hard for me to watch Samantha and I don't even know her. I didn't enjoy the show either, but I am glad it got made and I hope they do more.

'Bout this:
If you guys honestly don't know even the names of the programs to which Sue refers people, Ok. So then we know that you don't know what the hell you're talking about. Thanks for clearing that up.

OK -
If I were to talk about what Programs PURE refers to, I would not know what I was talking about. Thats why I don't talk about it.

This does not mean I don't know what I'm talking about, but rather, that if I am talking about something, it is likely with some actual knowledge. When speculating, I try and make that clear as well.


'Bout this:
As far as my hammering Jeff, well if he's going to use words like hero (I suppose cause so many people might misunderstand the term heroine) then he ought to know something about this person and her actions that he defends.


I don't want to speak for Jeff, but I know there is a general feeling amoung many, that Sue is some what heroic for seeing the wwasp vs pure thing through. She could easily have agreed to settle and saved herself lots of stress and grief but she hung in for the long haul; and as a result, we have finely got a public record of the abuse and neglect that takes place in WWASPS' programs. This is no small thing. Lots of people apreciate that fact and are greatful; and some might use the word hero as a result. It does have a sort of David against Goliath air about it.


[ This Message was edited by: BuzzKill on 2005-01-19 13:21 ][ This Message was edited by: BuzzKill on 2005-01-19 13:22 ]