Author Topic: Who Does the Program Accept?  (Read 3896 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Nihilanthic

  • Posts: 3931
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Who Does the Program Accept?
« Reply #15 on: January 17, 2005, 03:04:00 PM »
Hmm... how I trianed (havent been able to in a while, school and $$$ issues :sad:) was a emphasis on learning the technique and application. You can train with contact and not beat eachother up. I didnt really do forms. I guess the closest thing would be combos

Also, grappling arts let you go 100% from day one without injury. Nothing 'sells' BJJ like having some waifish woman choke me out rather helplessly.

We, too, care a lot about respect, but we just dont give any qualification fo ability to defend yourself (aka fight) unless you can actually spar with some level of chaos and contact. "drills" dont really cut it when the other person wont stand there with his arm stuck out while you make your move.  

I'm not discreding what youre trying to do, I just dont like teachers saying they can defend themself... when they cant even fight. Either you can fight, or you cant. If you enjoy the exercise and use it as a tool to walk away without feeling ashamed, thats great. And, all of us would rather avoid a fight ourselves. We find actually doing that taught us better than doing tap-sparring and just being TOLD so.

Guess its natual consequences vs accepting whats told. Again, I'm not putting you down, just stating my philosophy. Frankly, not everyone is able to handle real sparring anyway. I just want honesty from the part of instructors - and good ones are anyway.

Impiety: Your irreverence toward my deity.
--Ambrose Bierce

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline chi3

  • Posts: 102
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Who Does the Program Accept?
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2005, 09:30:00 AM »
Timoclea,

I found your post about how you handle your daughter very interesting. I have had to adopt a lot of pick your battles strategies, also. I had a hard time when she was very small with her complete opposition, but now, I just stand on the important ones.  The goth issue is dead. That was just an example of poor choices she had made in the past. The "gay" thing wouldn't be such an issue with me, but at her high school it is common for the kids to all be "Bi" so they basically have orgies and sleep w/ everyone. Often unprotected. That I cannot let go. They specialize in having sex in very public places in order to get the high that comes with the fear of discovery. (macy's dressing room). It can be boy/girl, or boy/boy or boy/boy/girl, etc. I know we all did things we eventually got common sense about as we got older, but this is an unqualified no go for us. I believe her mental issues lead her to make very bad decisions, and she doesn't seem to find them wrong. Legally, morally, etc. I do fear for her safety. I think it's great when parents are able to reason with their children, and give them the power to make their own decisions. I have done that with her as far as I have been able to. Unfortunately, her behavior is too irrational to allow me to do that full time, as I'm sure you can see.

Thanks for the info,
Chi
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 164653
  • Karma: +3/-4
    • View Profile
Who Does the Program Accept?
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2005, 11:57:00 AM »
I don't know what your daughter has, but I can sympathize with the sex issues.  70% of bipolars are hypersexual, so it is more likely to be an issue than not at/after puberty.

At some point, the best you can do is to provide lots of condoms and the reasons to use them---and lots of low-key information on why rampant promiscuity is not in one's own best interests.

We did have a case in our metro area of kids having orgies at each others' houses after school and before parents got home.

It's a "no go" but unfortunately the only even partial cure for it is lots of supervision.

And, of course, you need to find out if there's an underlying brain problem causing the promiscuity.

In bipolars (for example) you can at least improve impulse control by getting our moods stabilized.  And improving impulse control may not decrease sex drive, but it at least interposes some rational thought between drive and decision.

*If* there's some kind of organic brain problem contributing to her bad judgement and bad impulse control, you need to treat that problem before you're going to get improved behavior.

A portion of it, and there's no telling what portion, is that teens are *all* a bit rash---poor impulse control---compared to what they were as kids and will be as adults.

Part of it, a large part, is that teens frontal lobes are still developing.  Organically, they don't have adult brains yet, and all that will really help is time---and time *will* help.  Guess where impulse control lives?  The frontal lobes.

I know rampant promiscuity is dangerous, and I'd be scared as hell, too.  My husband and I have thought about this quite a bit based on what I was like as a teen and based upon the range of possibilities we're likely to face when our daughter is a teen.

Adding PTSD on top of whatever your kid's other problems are won't help.  If I were you I'd seriously consider moving her to a same-sex traditional boarding school that is *not* a boot camp but limits contact with the opposite sex.

I hate to be this blunt, but if some of the girls decide to do each other, while there's *morally* a problem, she'll grow out of it, and she isn't going to get HIV from another girl.

What you really need is to keep her alive and uninfected until she grows up a bit---and *possibly* to take care of any underlying psychiatric problem, if there is one.  But the kicker is without doing further damage.

Or, you could bring her home, maybe move towns to get her away from that crowd (or move across town)---which is a hell of a hassle, but considering the alternatives, worth it.  Then you could make sure she doesn't leave the house without condoms in her purse---not to go *anywhere*---and supervise her as closely as possible whenever you could.

The goal here wouldn't be to *stop* her having sex, but to reduce her opportunities for sex and make it as easy as possible, when she slips the leash and gives in to the impulse for sex, to happen to think, "what the hell, I've got a condom...." and actually use the thing.

Reduce the risk, and try to provide fun that doesn't include sex on the menu---swimming, running, hiking, biking, skating (ice or roller), sports, music and dance.  Again, martial arts is good *if* she takes to it because it's a good "fix" for an adrenaline junkie---if she's getting off on the thrill, and you can get her to get some of that thrill from sparring, you've got a *healthy* outlet.  The other thing you might think about is other adrenaline-generating kinds of sports or recreation---roller coasters, hang gliding, bungee jumping, rappelling, competitive diving.  If you can get her into running and hooked on "runner's high" it's safer than rampant promiscuity.  Scuba diving, maybe.  Rock climbing.

If you can get any organic brain problem stabilized, and divert her into a less self-destructive "kick," you might be able to at least reduce the risk.

If you end up with a psychiatrist helping you, and a therapist, maybe the therapist can persuade her to at least *try* different adventure sports, one after another.  You may want to try them with her, or somehow arrange for a girlfriend to go along.

If you pick the sports that are higher in the number of boys that participate, you might get her to go along, thinking she's fooling you, in the hope of meeting cute boys with great bods----but then if she ends up into the sport to impress the guy, she's getting a less self-destructive high even if she does end up having a sexual relationship with a boyfriend.  I get the impression that at this point *one* boyfriend and *safe* sex would be a relief.

I know this sounds like rewarding her for bad behavior, but if you're doing these things as a family, you can present them as rebuilding family time---and bring a girlfriend and let them flirt with the guys (because it lets her feel like she's getting around you a bit, you're more likely to get her buy-in--while reducing risk).

With a difficult kid, sometimes it's not so much about reward or punishment---that's a cycle you can get locked into that can get destructive.  A lot of times it's about "distract and divert."  You see what the kid's drives are, and you subtly (okay, even sneakily) divert her into ways of expressing those drives that are less self-destructive and healthier.

I think that's why the *original* Outward Bound actually worked/works for some kids---its orientation wasn't punitive, it was diversionary---divert the kid's drives and adrenaline-seeking into a constructive pursuit.

Hell, get the family roller-blading and hire a cute roller-blade instructor, or go on ski trips and get a ski instructor with the body of a pagan god.  Get her places where there's a non-sex adrenaline fix on the "table."  Get her places where the cutest guys around are getting *their* adrenaline fix from the sport and won't be impressed by promiscuity.  Give her proximity to cute guys with healthy self-respect that she'll want to impress.

And then, of course, when you find an adrenaline sport she loves, stick with it.  And stick with it with you and her dad going out and doing it, too--just not smothering her with your closeness while doing it.

That's what I'd do if my own daughter, as a teen, was behaving like you describe.

You could even be sneakier---I don't know if this would be a plus or a minus---and go into family therapy with the therapist primed beforehand where the therapist talks the seemingly-reluctant parents into taking their daughter on these family sport-adventure trips.  It's sneaky, and it's underhanded, and if you get caught you're screwed---and I don't know if you can act worth beans.  But if your kid is seriously oppositional, being talked into it by the family therapist who's "on your daughter's side" might make her more open to going and doing.

You can't get a teen to *not* seek thrills.  Not without severely damaging her.

What you *can* do is channel her towards thrills with some real risk, and some risk that's just apparent, but a *much lower* real risk than her current bad behavior.

Timoclea
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »