Author Topic: The Truth about Mary Jane, read it and weep  (Read 7774 times)

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Offline Froderik

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The Truth about Mary Jane, read it and weep
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2004, 10:16:00 PM »
What is? Bickering about dumb shit on a message board? :lol:
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Offline ehm

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« Reply #31 on: November 07, 2004, 01:05:00 AM »
Quote
On 2004-11-06 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:

"NEWSFLASH!!!!



Alcohol causes alcoholism... film at 11.



 :rofl: "


hahaha...
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Offline groovy1634

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« Reply #32 on: November 07, 2004, 03:35:00 AM »
would much rather be a pothead than an alcoholic...alcohol is evil if you are a lousy drunk like me....pot has kept me sane for years....blah blah blah


peace
lisa

 :silly:
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EOW  


Offline Woof-a-Doof

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« Reply #33 on: November 07, 2004, 08:04:00 AM »
In my experience, working in pshyc hospitals for over 15 years ranging from Crisis Stabilization Units to Acute Care Units and seeing thousands of schitzos go thru the doors, I respectfully disagree.

Overwhemingly my experience in working with these individuals shows that the drug of choice for silencing the syptoms of Schizophrenia is, ETOH3 or Alcohol.

Did some smoke pot? Sure. Was it the smoking gun that pushed them "over the edge"---Highly unlikely. If there is a predisposition for shcizophrenia and it is to manafest into a full blown form of shcizophrenia...it will happen with or without the use of weed.

I don't so much mind peoples varying opinions, or even those voicing thier opinions on the topic of smoking weed, but it is most annoying when statements are given as facts when indeed they are distorted at best. And then are used to condem those who disagree...which has a hint of fanaticism to it.

It does help to remember that this type of bullshit was taught in Straight. However, it is sad to see that after a period of time, the same distorted patterns are still being used against people...

I am of the opinion that, well, simply put, some people should not smoke pot...I am only to assume the author of the post that initiated this thread doesnt smoke pot...and for this I am thankfull[ This Message was edited by: Woof-a-Doof on 2004-11-07 05:07 ]
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #34 on: November 07, 2004, 01:34:00 PM »
Actually woof a doof you are wrong.  I too have worked in the Mental Health field.  I know of a college boy who smoked for the first time and it DID induce schizophrenia.  What was sad is that he KNEW it was not normal and he still could not change it.

The articles posted on this matter were legit and referenced.  Go do your homeowork THEN come back and argue a factual point.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #35 on: November 07, 2004, 01:45:00 PM »
Whether or not pot is good or bad for some people or all people is not the question. Lots of things are dangerous. Hell, even raw potatos can kill people. You can catch a buzz from many things and you can trip on common plants like morning glories, belladonas, fly agaric mushrooms and other very common weeds.

The big difference between these other weeds and cannabis is that cannabis is extremely popular. Now, why is that? I think it's because cannabis is useful, pleasurable and causes few unwanted side effects. Very few people try belladonna or morning glories as a recreational drug twice. Fly agarics are somewhat popular, but very few people really enjoy the experience enough to make it worth the side effects and risks.

The prohibitionists simply cannot accept people using their own experience and observation to make their own choices as regards cannabis because, as it turns out, they were wrong about this one. Yes, it makes most people euphoric, giddy, temporarily impaired and hungry. We know that. For some, those are the benefits. For others, those are acceptable side effects that one must deal with in order to gain other benefits.

The important question is not whether or not cannabis is 100% safe and always effective. Those of us who live in dystopia understand that no such drug exists. The question is whether or not cannabis is so banefully harmful as to justify the trillions of dollars, military action, millions imprisoned and all the rest of the effort we put forth to prevent anyone from making that choice for themselves. I think that it clearly is not.

The other question is why? Why are the prohibitionists so hung up on this one herb that, for thousands of years, has been used for pleasure and medicine w/o serious problems? I have a theory. I think they're just plain simple minded. We have complex and difficult problems to deal with these days. It would be nice to think that there's one root of all evil and that dedicating ourselves to erradicating that source of all of our problems will actually solve all of our problems. Unfortunately, here in dystopia, it doesn't work that way. Worse yet, the prohibitionists are so blinded by their jihad that they can't even see the problems they're causing.

Religion is just mind control.
--George Carlin, comedian



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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #36 on: November 07, 2004, 04:14:00 PM »
Sorry Charlie, but I think the only thing simple minded is to compare a drug that has been proven in some to induce psychosis to a raw potato.  How many raw potato incidents are there exactly VS marijuana induced psychosis?  EXACTLY.
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Offline Antigen

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« Reply #37 on: November 07, 2004, 06:06:00 PM »
Well, the potato part is relatively easy.

Quote

http://www.safespectrum.com/applications-produce.php

"When potato tubers are exposed to light, the solanine content in the peel may increase as much as ten times. Toxic levels for people are about one-hundredth of an ounce for a 200-lb person. But, with UV light-exposed whole tubers in which solanine had increased ten-fold, only two pounds could cause a reaction." "Potatoes containing more than 0.1 percent solanine (.01 oz/10 oz potato) are considered unfit for eating."


That's all of about 2 min worth of 'reasearch'.

The other part of your question is more difficult. Apparently, it has taken modern science some number of decades to discover even the minor correlation between cannabis use and psychosis. And they can't even tell us, at this point, which came first. It's still a chicken and egg story, or a Chicken Little story.

I mean, come on now! Since we started keeping track in the `70's, roughly half of all highschool kids will admit,  when asked, to having smoked pot. That means that at least half of everyone you know has smoked pot. And that's a very, very conservative estimate. It leaves out all those who's first toke came in college or sometime after and all those who toked but didn't invest full faith in the anonymity of the questionair.

How many psychotic people do you know?

My point is, as stated already, that everything is dangerous. Everything. Litterally. Nothing is without risk.

Is pot so horrendously dangerous as to justify criminal prohibition? If it is, then how come it takes government funded scientists to even detect this danger? It's not asif this is some exotic substance that no one knows anything about. We all know many people who have used this stuff for years and years. If it had any significant effect, we'd all know about it.

science is the record of dead religions.
--Oscar Wilde

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Offline mental torture made me li

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« Reply #38 on: November 07, 2004, 06:50:00 PM »
[ This Message was edited by: Pietra on 2004-12-12 11:41 ]
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Offline Froderik

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« Reply #39 on: November 07, 2004, 11:39:00 PM »
Quote
Is pot so horrendously dangerous as to justify criminal prohibition? If it is, then how come it takes government funded scientists to even detect this danger? It's not as if this is some exotic substance that no one knows anything about. We all know many people who have used this stuff for years and years. If it had any significant effect, we'd all know about it.

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Offline Woof-a-Doof

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« Reply #40 on: November 08, 2004, 07:22:00 AM »
Quote
On 2004-11-07 10:34:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Actually woof a doof you are wrong.  I too have worked in the Mental Health field.  I know of a college boy who smoked for the first time and it DID induce schizophrenia.  What was sad is that he KNEW it was not normal and he still could not change it.



The articles posted on this matter were legit and referenced.  Go do your homeowork THEN come back and argue a factual point."


Ok, you know of one individual where this was the case. And there are studies and reports supporting this inane arqument. Perhaps I wasnt clear....Is it "possible" that smoking pot can percipitate an individuals first episode...certainly. Is it an absolute fact that smoking pot will induce a psychotic episode...Far from it.

As far as hunting and searching down references to support my opinion, I will leave that to those who have more free time than I. It really isn't something I wish to engage my time with.

My post was my opinion based on my experience. My opinion and my experience are not wrong, they are simply my opinions, based on my experience. Challenging that will be an exercise in futility.
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Offline Froderik

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« Reply #41 on: November 08, 2004, 09:58:00 AM »
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #42 on: November 08, 2004, 10:13:00 AM »
Quote
On 2004-11-06 18:53:00, Anonymous wrote:

"IT IS BAD BAD BAD FOR YOU AND IT WILL CAUSE YOU TO BE CRAZYYYYYYYYYYYY"


Ah....now there's[/b] an intelligent arguement. :roll:  :roll:  :roll:
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #43 on: November 08, 2004, 10:43:00 AM »
I don't give a flying fuck if weed causes induces schizophrenia in a few unfortunates---maybe that's nature's way of taking non-pot smokers out of the gene pool.  I'm with Trekker---death to all who refuse to inhale sensimilla smoke.  We've been persecuted for using grass for far too long, now the bowl is on the other bong.....DEATH to you unless you smoke weed....WITH US OR BY US YOU WILL GET WASTED.......
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #44 on: November 08, 2004, 11:58:00 AM »
Researchers Buzzing About Marijuana-derived Medicines
Cannabinoids May Help Against Many Diseases
2004-11-05    >> news category      >> general
Source: SFGate.com

David Kohn, Baltimore Sun

Friday, November 5, 2004

San Diego -- A decade ago, when Daniele Piomelli went to scientific conferences, he was often the only researcher studying cannabinoids, the class of chemicals that give marijuana users a high.

His work often drew snickers and jokes -- but no more. At the annual Society for Neuroscience conference last week, scientists delivered almost 200 papers on the subject.

Why the attention? Many scientists believe marijuana-like drugs may be able to treat a wide range of diseases, far beyond the nausea and chronic pain typically treated with medical marijuana.

Researchers presented tantalizing evidence that cannabinoid drugs can help treat amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, known as ALS or Lou Gehrig's disease, Parkinson's disease and obesity. Other researchers are studying whether the compounds can help victims of stroke and multiple sclerosis.

Although the chemicals work on the same area of the nervous system, the new drugs are much more refined and targeted than marijuana, with few of its side effects.

"Cannabinoids have a lot of pharmaceutical potential," said Piomelli, a neuroscientist at UC Irvine. "A lot of people are very excited."

Although the federal government opposes the use of medical marijuana, it generally doesn't restrict cannabinoid research, most of which doesn't involve the cannabis plant itself. Scientists who use Marinol, a legal but tightly regulated marijuana-like drug, do need government permission.

Because the cannabinoid system wasn't discovered until the late 1980s -- decades after serotonin, dopamine and other neurotransmitters -- researchers still know relatively little about how it works.

Like all neurotransmitter networks, the cannabinoid system consists of a series of chemical pathways through the brain and nervous system. Marijuana produces its effects by activating this pathway, primarily through the effects of tetrahydrocannabinol, or THC, the drug's main active ingredient.

Over the past decade, researchers have been following these abundant trails to determine their real purpose. "You don't have them there to get stoned. So there must be internal reasons," said Andrea Giuffrida, a neuroscientist at the University of Texas Health Sciences Center in San Antonio.

Researchers have learned that endogenous cannabinoids -- internal brain chemicals that activate the system -- play a role in tissue protection, immunity and inflammation, among other functions. The cannabinoid system also appears to exert wide influence, modulating the release of dopamine, serotonin and other neurotransmitters.

Giuffrida and others believe cannabinoids can treat degenerative disorders such as Parkinson's disease and ALS.

At the conference, Giuffrida announced that a cannabinoid drug wards off Parkinson's-like effects in mice.

The disorder, which afflicts more than 1 million Americans, destroys neurons in a key part of the brain, causing patients to lose control over movement.

Giuffrida, with colleagues David Price and James Roberts, injected mice with a chemical called MPTP, which mimics Parkinson's damage. When some of the animals subsequently received a drug that blocks cannabinoid receptors, their nerve cells suffered much less damage than did the cells of the other mice. This was the first demonstration that a cannabinoid drug can have this effect.

While he is not sure how the anti-cannabinoid compound works, Giuffrida suspects it protects neurons by reducing inflammation, a key component in Parkinson's.

Cannabinoids might also slow down ALS, which destroys neurons that control muscles until victims become paralyzed, unable to breathe on their own.

Neuroscientist Mary Abood became interested in cannabinoids after hearing about ALS patients who got some relief from smoking marijuana. So she began animal experiments at the California Pacific Medical Center in San Francisco.

In her study, mice with a variant of ALS were given a combination of THC and cannabidiol, another compound found in marijuana. Both substances are cannabinoid agonists, chemicals that activate the cannabinoid system.

Abood measured the course of the ailment by testing how long the mice could stand on a slowly rotating rod.

The treatment delayed disease progression by more than seven days and extended survival by six days. In human terms, this would amount to about three years. That's a significant improvement over the only existing ALS drug, riluzole, which extends life by two months. "I was very excited when I got my initial results," Abood said.

Also at the conference, researchers at the Institute of Neurology in London announced results that corroborated her findings. Cannabinoids have also helped some human ALS patients in one small trial, and Abood is trying to get funding for a larger one.

If cannabinoids can shield human neurons from harm, researchers say, they might prove useful against other neurological diseases, including mental illness. Scientists are looking at whether cannabinoids can treat multiple sclerosis, epilepsy and Huntington's disease, while Giuffrida is beginning a study of their effect on schizophrenia.

Some schizophrenics say marijuana lessens their psychotic symptoms, and studies have shown that schizophrenic patients have abnormal brain levels of cannabinoids.

Marijuana-like drugs might also help treat stroke. Soon after a stroke, the injured brain region is flooded with a neurotransmitter called glutamate, which at high levels is lethal to neurons.

Cannabinoids seem to protect against this destruction, and Israeli scientists are studying whether increasing cannabinoid levels soon after stroke can minimize harm.

Advocates of medical marijuana have long argued that the drug can be useful for treating many conditions, particularly chronic pain, nausea and glaucoma. In the latter, marijuana works by temporarily decreasing pressure around the eye.

Although they don't dispute this view, most researchers believe there are better, more precise ways to stimulate the cannabinoid system. They believe marijuana has too many negatives to be a truly effective drug, with side effects that include memory problems, decreased immunity and possibly addiction. Some researchers dispute this.

Marijuana has another drawback. From a scientific standpoint, Giuffrida says, it's "a very dirty drug."

It contains more than 300 compounds, 60 of which affect the cannabinoid system. Scientists don't understand what most of these substances do or how they work together. This complexity makes it hard for researchers to pinpoint marijuana's effects.

One cannabinoid, Marinol, is available legally. The compound, which contains THC in a pill form, is usually prescribed for nausea and for appetite loss among AIDS patients.

But Marinol has the same psychoactive effects as marijuana. So the key, Piomelli says, is "getting the effects without the side effects."

To that end, Piomelli has developed a compound called URB597, which doesn't flood the body with cannabinoids, as Marinol and marijuana do. Instead, it slows the breakdown of the cannabinoids in the system. He thinks the drug may help treat pain, anxiety and even depression without making patients stoned and forgetful. He and others are testing it on animals.

Another cannabinoid compound, Rimonabant, will probably be available much sooner, as a diet drug. It lowers cannabinoid levels and seems to reduce appetite -- the opposite effect of the intense "munchies" that marijuana users experience.

For Piomelli, this explosion of research has an added bonus. A few years ago, when he told people what he did for a living, they'd often giggle and ask him if getting high was part of his job. These days, he doesn't hear as many snickers.

"The work is so exciting that it is eliminating the stigma of being associated with marijuana," he said. "People realize that it's not just 'Let's take some marijuana and give it to people.' "
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