Author Topic: How to Manipulate your way out of a program  (Read 11495 times)

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Offline Maximilian

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How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« on: September 09, 2010, 03:31:09 PM »
I thought I'd start a topic on all the various ways troubled teens try to manipulate their way out of programs. I was successful at manipulating my way out of several treatment facilities, but I have to admit, the private program I was sent to did not budge to my many efforts to escape. In this thread I am going to describe the many techniques and insidious tactics I came up with in order to secure my release from the program. I was a very troubled teen and desperately wanted to get out and return to my own self destructive behaviors. But getting out of a program that knows you are willing to do anything to be released, can be a difficult process. This thread has been created to describe this process, and why or why not it was successful.

This is in the moderated section of fornits, so you are going to have to keep this civil. If you want to talk about the ways you tried to manipulate yourself out the program, feel free to post here.

I will get into more details later, but these are some of the tactics I used that I will later expand upon.

1. Claiming it was a mistake I was sent there
2. Saying I was innocent to everyone at the program
3. Claiming my parents were abusive to the program
4. Writing to my parents that the program was abusive.
5. Threatening my parents if they didn't release me I'd harm myself
6. Sending letters telling them I'd never forgive them
7. Running
8. Harming myself
9. Threatening to not take my medication that I needed
10. Refusing to participate in the program

These are just a small sample of the lengths I was willing to go, in order to secure my release and to re-engage myself into drug addiction, and the downward spiral that I had been removed from. The reason programs take kids against their will is because sometimes the will of a troubled teen is to destroy themselves, as it was in my case. Would it be ethical to allow me to kill myself as a minor? Or is it more ethical to keep me alive, even if against my will, for long as they were legally able to do so (until adulthood)? Society has declared people who are a danger to themselves should be kept from hurting themselves, and that freedom is less important than saving a life. As someone who was in that situation, and would have died if it were left up to me, I have to thank the people who will save another life even if they do not get gratitude. I was not grateful at the time and fought with the people trying to save my life, but now, as I have matured, and realized I was not a victim of them, but they were all victims of me, I am forever in gratitude for these wonderful people who sacrifice so much in the service of others.
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Offline psy

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2010, 03:37:01 PM »
What program were you in, Max?  See.  I don't believe you were actually in a program.  I don't believe anybody who was in a program would disrespect abuse survivors the way you do.
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Offline Shadyacres

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2010, 03:39:11 PM »
Max, reading your posts is horrifying me, you have a textbook case of Stockholm Syndrome.  I am truly sorry this happened to you and I hope you find the solace you are looking for here, apparently subconsciously.
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2010, 03:40:35 PM »
Quote from: "psy"
What program were you in, Max?  See.  I don't believe you were actually in a program.  I don't believe anybody who was in a program would disrespect abuse survivors the way you do.

Well you are free to not believe me. I choose to be honest about my experience, and not withhold self incriminating truths to further an anti treatment agenda. If people really want to know what programs are like, some of us are going to have to be honest, even if it means admitting that not everything that goes on in programs is evil, and that some of us are helped, and that we might even be responsible for ending up in the program in the first place. I will add more to this thread as it goes on, and explain the manipulations in more details. As far as disrespecting abuse survivors, I have been dealing with people attacking me since I started posting on fornits. If people are not ready to admit that people are helped by programs sometimes, they simply wish to live in a land of denial. I can't be worried about the feelings of people who refuse to accept reality, that's their issue not mine.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2010, 03:42:43 PM by Maximilian »

Offline Maximilian

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2010, 03:41:51 PM »
Quote from: "Shadyacres"
Max, reading your posts is horrifying me, you have a textbook case of Stockholm Syndrome.  I am truly sorry this happened to you and I hope you find the solace you are looking for here, apparently subconsciously.

I don't have Stockholm Syndrome, I have the ability to be honest with myself.
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Offline psy

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2010, 03:45:47 PM »
Max.  You lied about being blackmailed.  Why should I believe you were even in a program at all?  You make the most absurd of claims: that you weren't abused in a WWASP program.  There is hardly a WWASP program out there that hasn't been shut down for abuse.  It's my belief you either weren't in a program, or you don't view abuse by the same definition the courts do.

80% of the solid evidence of abuse out there is about WWASP programs.  Here's a video by Montana PBS documenting some that went on:
http://watch.montanapbs.org/video/1430387622/

Were you in Spring Creek Lodge, Max?  Were you ever in the Hobbit?  Please explain to me how that was not abuse.
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2010, 03:54:25 PM »
Froderik just lied about not posting the jerk insult. Should nobody believe him from this point on?

I choose to keep some information to myself, because I don't need to be shown the light, and have people following me around trying to convince me I was abused. I was not abused, and my life was saved, that's my truth.
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2010, 04:13:45 PM »
Quote from: "psy"
you don't view abuse by the same definition the courts do.

I missed this part and I wish to address it. If what happened in the program was abusive, then why didn't somebody call the police? As far as I know, the authorities knew full well what was going on at the program I was at, and supported it fully. I actually believe it's fornits that has a watered down definition of the term abuse, different from that of the law enforcement or child protective agencies. If I called up and described everything that I saw and/or went through in the program, I would be told it's all legal, sorry we can't do anything. If abuse, and I mean the legal definition of abuse, is going on in all programs right now, well then why waste your time on fornits? Start calling every local LEO within a few miles of a program, and then the problem will be solved once and for all. Nothing illegal happened to me in a program, and I was never abused. Perhaps other people are, I'll let them speak for themselves, I can only relate what I experienced and my own opinions based on that.
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Offline psy

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2010, 04:17:06 PM »
Quote from: "Maximilian"
Quote from: "psy"
you don't view abuse by the same definition the courts do.

I missed this part and I wish to address it. If what happened in the program was abusive, then why didn't somebody call the police? As far as I know, the authorities knew full well what was going on at the program I was at, and supported it fully. I actually believe it's fornits that has a watered down definition of the term abuse, different from that of the law enforcement or child protective agencies. If I called up and described everything that I saw and/or went through in the program, I would be told it's all legal, sorry we can't do anything. If abuse, and I mean the legal definition of abuse, is going on in all programs right now, well then why waste your time on fornits? Start calling every local LEO within a few miles of a program, and then the problem will be solved once and for all. Nothing illegal happened to me in a program, and I was never abused. Perhaps other people are, I'll let them speak for themselves, I can only relate what I experienced and my own opinions based on that.
qft.  i'll respond to this later before you edit it.
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Offline psy

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2010, 04:17:38 PM »
Were you in Spring Creek Lodge, Max? Were you ever in the Hobbit? Please explain to me how that was not abuse.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
Benchmark Young Adult School - bad place [archive.org link]
Sue Scheff Truth - Blog on Sue Scheff
"Our services are free; we do not make a profit. Parents of troubled teens ourselves, PURE strives to create a safe haven of truth and reality." - Sue Scheff - August 13th, 2007 (fukkin surreal)

Offline shaggys

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2010, 04:20:17 PM »
Quote from: "Maximilian"
Quote from: "psy"
you don't view abuse by the same definition the courts do.

. Nothing illegal happened to me in a program, and I was never abused. Perhaps other people are, I'll let them speak for themselves, I can only relate what I experienced and my own opinions based on that.

Then please tell us all the name of this utopia that you were in. It seems that you would want to shout its praises for all to hear.
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Offline Samara

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2010, 04:20:49 PM »
Interesting topic, regardless. At CEDU, they were well prepared. Whether a student was being sincere or manipulative in trying to escape a program, CEDU was more manipulative in making sure they were unsuccessful. Hence the locked up telephones and physical isolation.  Actually, CEDU manipulated my parents into lying that I would be sent to lock up if I tried to escape. Even though I  had never even shoplifted, let alone abused drugs or acted violently.  

The ONLY way to get out of CEDU was to split, try to commit homicide, slit your wrists, or conspire to or commit arson. I, of course, was unwilling to do any except split. Which I did. I never even gave my parents a reason. I think the only reason my Dad allowed me home (because my Mom wanted me gone) was because he was not comfortable with the fact that CEDU would never allow him to express skepticism.

So, to answer your questions:

1. Claiming it was a mistake I was sent there  

I only said this once because I learned quickly what happens when you question the program. And, I was mis-placed. But I also do not believe any one should be sent to a therapeutically and academically fraudulent facility

2. Saying I was innocent to everyone at the program.

I never claimed to be innocent of anything, but looking back, I was fairly innocent and certainly naive. I was honest about anything I did.   But really, I didn't do anything horrible.  I didn't go there because I did something horrible.  I wonder if CEDU can say it was innocent to me? Because I'll bet you a million bucks if I asked a staff member that question they could not look me in the eye and say yes.   In fact, I would love to meet any of them now, as an adult, when they have no power over me. No, not to threaten them, but just to meet on equal footing.

3. Claiming my parents were abusive to the program -

I never lied about my parents. I also never claimed they were abusive. I did not talk about them much because I discerned quite quickly that CEDU exploited all revelations and made no sincere effort to repair family dynamics.  In fact, CEDU introduced my parents to lying to me. At least before CEDU, they were direct.

4. Writing to my parents that the program was abusive.

Impossible. CEDU censored all letters going out. My letters were totally Pollyanna - the hills are alive with the sound of music.

5. Threatening my parents if they didn't release me I'd harm myself  

Nope - too melodramatic. And only undermines your own credibility.

6. Sending letters telling them I'd never forgive them

Nope. Although CEDU may have allowed this expression though...  familial division worked for them.

7. Running  

Yes, twice. Second time successful, thank God. This wasn't manipulative though. I just wanted to get the fuck out. Even my dad is glad I did that.

8. Harming myself  

No. Again, melodramatic and would only serve to undermine my own credibility. And why would I want to hurt myself?  

9. Threatening to not take my medication that I needed

During my time, CEDU did not espouse medications.   I also wasn't on any. I am still not on any.  In the '90s, CEDU figured out how medicating kids could work for them (CEDU)

10. Refusing to participate in the program

You did not refuse to participate unless you were begging for emotional terrorism. But I split when I realized that I would need to bully and terrorize others to level up.  I made the decision to split after a propheet (24/7 "experiential) where it became obvious I did not batter people enough. I knew it would not be tolerated much longer, and the thought made me sick.

I am not a splitter by nature. At that time, I was passive and scared. I never ran away from home before. I just couldn't stomach what was happening.
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Offline Maximilian

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2010, 04:22:32 PM »
Quote from: "psy"
Were you in Spring Creek Lodge, Max? Were you ever in the Hobbit? Please explain to me how that was not abuse.

It's long been known I choose to keep the name of the private program I went to, to myself. As far as I know this is not against the rules. But let's imagine for a moment I was placed in isolation in a treatment program. I could tell two version of the story. One version in which I am a victim of an evil program putting me in an isolation prison cell. The other a more honest, and accurate story of how a program decided to save me from myself. One event, two different interpretations. You've only read the first interpretation, in time I might share the latter if I feel comfortable enough. I had enough lying to suit an agenda, and censoring self incriminating details of my own experience to make myself appear as a victim. Perhaps other people are innocent victims of programs. I am not. My family,and everyone who worked at the program was a victim of my behaviors, not the other way around. Yes a program saved my life. Yes it took some extraordinary measures because I was willing to do whatever it took to destroy myself. Lucky for me they were willing to do whatever it took to save me as well, for that I will be eternally grateful.
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Offline Eliscu2

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2010, 04:46:33 PM »
Quote from: "Maximilian"
Quote from: "psy"
Were you in Spring Creek Lodge, Max? Were you ever in the Hobbit? Please explain to me how that was not abuse.

It's long been known I choose to keep the name of the private program I went to, to myself. As far as I know this is not against the rules. But let's imagine for a moment I was placed in isolation in a treatment program. I could tell two version of the story. One version in which I am a victim of an evil program putting me in an isolation prison cell. The other a more honest, and accurate story of how a program decided to save me from myself. One event, two different interpretations. You've only read the first interpretation, in time I might share the latter if I feel comfortable enough. I had enough lying to suit an agenda, and censoring self incriminating details of my own experience to make myself appear as a victim. Perhaps other people are innocent victims of programs. I am not. My family,and everyone who worked at the program was a victim of my behaviors, not the other way around. Yes a program saved my life. Yes it took some extraordinary measures because I was willing to do whatever it took to destroy myself. Lucky for me they were willing to do whatever it took to save me as well, for that I will be eternally grateful.

Hey dud come to WISCONHELL we have a SUPERMAX...you can live in a tiny cell and pretend you r free.
I will give you a razor blade to cope. :suicide:
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Offline grapeape30

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Re: How to Manipulate your way out of a program
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2010, 04:54:36 PM »
Quote from: "Maximilian"
Quote from: "psy"
Were you in Spring Creek Lodge, Max? Were you ever in the Hobbit? Please explain to me how that was not abuse.

It's long been known I choose to keep the name of the private program I went to, to myself. As far as I know this is not against the rules. But let's imagine for a moment I was placed in isolation in a treatment program. I could tell two version of the story. One version in which I am a victim of an evil program putting me in an isolation prison cell. The other a more honest, and accurate story of how a program decided to save me from myself. One event, two different interpretations. You've only read the first interpretation, in time I might share the latter if I feel comfortable enough. I had enough lying to suit an agenda, and censoring self incriminating details of my own experience to make myself appear as a victim. Perhaps other people are innocent victims of programs. I am not. My family,and everyone who worked at the program was a victim of my behaviors, not the other way around. Yes a program saved my life. Yes it took some extraordinary measures because I was willing to do whatever it took to destroy myself. Lucky for me they were willing to do whatever it took to save me as well, for that I will be eternally grateful.

I don't believe for a moment you were ever in a program.  You manner is too glib, heavy on the what ( "saved my life") but lacking in the "how".  If you had really been in a program you would not want to deprive the needy parents looking to place their kid.  I believe you just don't want to answer questions that would come up and expose your lies.  Of course, after your last little game you have no credibility anyway.  You sound like a late-night infomercial .
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