Author Topic: If 6 Was 9  (Read 3407 times)

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Offline ajax13

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If 6 Was 9
« on: February 14, 2008, 02:32:36 PM »
"The totalist milieu maintains an aura of sacredness around its basic doctrine or ideology, holding it as an ultimate moral vision for the ordering of human existence."
http://www.icsahome.com/infoserv_articl ... reform.htm

"A Calgary program boasts an 85% success rate in getting teens off drugs and booze"
"The program...boasts a successful rate (total abstinence from alcohol and drugs) of 85%."
http://www.aarc.ab.ca/images/media/befo ... efroma.pdf

This claim is a complete fabrication.  It is a lie that has been told over and over again, dating back to Miller Newton's claims for Kids.  It is the second most popular method used to beg money, after testimonials from members:
"Over 85% of it's graduates are clean and sober, in school or working, and are reunited with their families."
This claim was made by MLA Ron Stevens in the Alberta Legislature.
http://www.aarc.ab.ca/endorsement.html

There is no scientific basis for this claim whatsoever.  Here is what AARC says about the results obtained from a poll they conducted:

"100 sequential graduates who graduated from 1998 to 2003 were selected for interview in 2003, and 85 agreed to participate.  In addition, 30 randomly selected parents, and 11 parents of the 15 clients not interviewed agreed to be interviewed.  Using information from these interviews, data regarding the recovery status of 96 clients was obtained."

This statement raises many issues.  Firstly, in a five year span AARC graduated only one hundred clients.
This with operating costs of six and a half million dollars.  AARC propaganda repeatedly states that the program opened to meet a desperate need for the service in Alberta.  Yet even with clients being brought in from Saskatchewan, British Columbia, and apparently as far away as Pennsylvnia, they managed to produce an average of twenty graduates per year in the period beginning six years (or eight?) years after it's inception.

Second, 85% of the clients agreed to be interviewed, yet AARC still includes data taken from eleven parents of the fifteen non-compliant grads.  There is no reason to give any validity to the claims made by these parents, and the inclusion of their statements in the data renders the entire process meaningless. 

Consider what DavidPablo Escobar-Grant said about parents in AARC:
"Parents could also be really interesting, and sometimes a parent benefited from being in AARC more than their kid."
"Clients who were old enough to sign out were allowed to do so, but the parents were encouraged to stay..."

AARC exists to sell parents peace of mind.  It does not exist to serve the young people who are admitted there.

Back to the study.  The polling was done in 2003, taking in the cohort of grads from '98 to '03.  So some grads had been out over four years, and some less than a year.  The inclusion of such a broad range of grad dates renders it absolutely impossible to derive any meaningful conclusion about long-term abstinence. 

Here is the salient point that establishes beyond a shadow of a doubt that the 85% claim is a lie:
"Of the sample 100 graduates, 85 reported being sober and 48 of the 100 were continuously sober since graduation."
52% have relapsed by AARC's own admission.

"For those graduated for over 4 years, 86% had maintained more than 12 months of sobriety." 
So in the span of four years 86% had been sober more than 25% of the time. 

In the study the average number of grads per year is 20.  If all of the grads were sober for two years straight after AARC, that constitutes 40% of the total number of grads in the poll.  That leaves only 8%, or 8 other grads in the poll who have maintained abstinence since leaving AARC, or 13% of the grads out longer than two years.
The spontaneous remission rate for alcohol abuse is 5%.  So AARC's long-term rate of success could be a low as 8%.  If we take into account that 11% of the data came from AARC parents, and not grads, AARC's long-term success rate may be as low as zero.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2008, 03:12:08 PM by ajax13 »
"AARC will go on serving youth and families as long as it will be needed, if it keeps open to God for inspiration" Dr. F. Dean Vause Executive Director


MR. NELSON: Mr. Speaker, AADAC has been involved with
assistance in developing the program of the Alberta Adolescent
Recovery Centre since its inception originally as Kids of the
Canadian West."
Alberta Hansard, March 24, 1992

Offline sicktomystomach

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2008, 11:11:21 PM »
Makes sense. But all people "see" is the stated 85% success rate.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #2 on: July 05, 2008, 12:07:13 PM »
ajax hasn't got a real job yet . . . . .  :'(
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline TheWho

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #3 on: July 05, 2008, 07:07:29 PM »
You picked the low end of each population.  The firm who developed and reported the study results would have taken this into account so 85% is the more reasonable conclusion based on the results.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline ajax13

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2008, 11:26:18 PM »
52% relapsing within five years of graduation is the same as an 85% success rate.  Thanks for clearing that up.  If only we could all be as mercifully free from the constraints of truth as are those of you who follow the Wizard.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2008, 11:40:25 PM by ajax13 »
"AARC will go on serving youth and families as long as it will be needed, if it keeps open to God for inspiration" Dr. F. Dean Vause Executive Director


MR. NELSON: Mr. Speaker, AADAC has been involved with
assistance in developing the program of the Alberta Adolescent
Recovery Centre since its inception originally as Kids of the
Canadian West."
Alberta Hansard, March 24, 1992

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2008, 05:20:01 PM »
once again the scrambled brains of ajax strikes  . .  demonstrating total lack of knowledge in this area. Since when does ANY form of treatment for anything have a shelf life ad infinitum!!  go look at the literature in the addiction area at the least so you can read up on what constitutes outcome research and timelines. Most centres look at 3 mos or 6 month timelines and report on those with huge attrition . . .  ya little moron  BUT thanks for the laugh!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline ajax13

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2008, 11:02:08 PM »
AARC's 2005 study does not give any figure for attrition, although in five years a centre with 30 to 36 inmates who serve terms of approximately one year should produce 150 to 180 graduates in five years, not 100.  The study, in typical amateur AARC fashion, lumps former inmates who have been out less than one year in with those who have been out for up to five years.  This widely varied population is treated as a single entity in the study, thus making any conclusions highly problematic.  As the number of those in the population who relapse can only grow, it cannot decrease over time, 52% relapse is the minimum.   The 48% who have abstained since leaving AARC includes former prisoners who have been out less than one year.  Thus it would seem likely that more of these people would join the ranks of the relapsed, further reducing the 48% figure.  As AARC is purported to be a treatment centre and not a behaviour modification program nor reform school, the sole criteria to assess it's effectiveness is whether or not people with chemical dependence continue to be chemically dependent.  As these inmates have all been diagnosed by AARC as stage 4 addicts, according to the AARC dogma any drug or alcohol use is highly destructive and thus indicative of the disease.  52% suffering the symptoms of the disease after treatment is not an 85% success rate.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"AARC will go on serving youth and families as long as it will be needed, if it keeps open to God for inspiration" Dr. F. Dean Vause Executive Director


MR. NELSON: Mr. Speaker, AADAC has been involved with
assistance in developing the program of the Alberta Adolescent
Recovery Centre since its inception originally as Kids of the
Canadian West."
Alberta Hansard, March 24, 1992

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2008, 12:17:48 PM »
i stand by my last comments, ajax - you try hard to sound like ya know what you are talking about . . .but sadly you miss the target board everytime, forget about the bullseye!  amusing and sad at the same time though
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline ajax13

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2008, 11:15:04 PM »
By all means, stand by your comments.  The more you AARColytes talk, the easier it is to demonstrate the total lack of factual basis behind AARC's claims.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"AARC will go on serving youth and families as long as it will be needed, if it keeps open to God for inspiration" Dr. F. Dean Vause Executive Director


MR. NELSON: Mr. Speaker, AADAC has been involved with
assistance in developing the program of the Alberta Adolescent
Recovery Centre since its inception originally as Kids of the
Canadian West."
Alberta Hansard, March 24, 1992

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #9 on: July 09, 2008, 06:35:14 PM »
well, been through all your replies to my comments ajax and I am not surprised - you had nothing to say back when I pointed out the analogy to the cancer clinic when talking about treatment populations. when you have run out of faulty arguments and misinformation you just resot to ad hominen attacks alone (wow - he is a sociopath and I am am arrcolyte - how mature). You lack facts, training and logic but I am sure your obsession with a treatment centre you haven't been to and  a person you haven't even met will keep you typing in this forum and elsewhere until you get yourself into a bit of trouble. What does your wife do for you while you rant and rave as a result of things she says happened to her?

Adios i have seen enough on this interesting little site
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline ajax13

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2008, 01:34:48 PM »
Here is friendly's first post in this thread: "ajax hasn't got a real job yet ."

Here is an excerpt from the next:"once again the scrambled brains of ajax strikes ...ya little moron"

Yet friendly then claims I have resorted to ad hominem attacks.

Here is the only empirical statement friendly made about AARC in this thread.  It is completely incoherent:"Most centres look at 3 mos or 6 month timelines and report on those with huge attrition"

Bye bye friendly.

 
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"AARC will go on serving youth and families as long as it will be needed, if it keeps open to God for inspiration" Dr. F. Dean Vause Executive Director


MR. NELSON: Mr. Speaker, AADAC has been involved with
assistance in developing the program of the Alberta Adolescent
Recovery Centre since its inception originally as Kids of the
Canadian West."
Alberta Hansard, March 24, 1992

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2008, 12:28:26 AM »
Very interesting site.

Why are most of the posts on AARc from AJAX 13? it seems this person wasn't an ex-client?

I thought this was for survivors?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline ajax13

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2008, 10:24:04 AM »
Wasn't an ex-client but is now?  You're not sure if you thought this was for survivors? 
Your complete inability to express yourself in the English language is a dead giveaway that you're an AARColyte. 
My posts in this forum have been made with the intent to provide former AARC prisoners and anybody else with an interest in this phenomenon with factual information about the history of AARC, the background of those involved in AARC, AARC's standing vis-a-vis the bodies that should regulate and oversee facilities providing drug treatment, and to point out the false claims made by AARC with regard to it's practises.  Additionally, I have posted as a counter to the ignorant but highly aggressive AARColyte posters who have demeaned anyone who spoke out against their church in the past. 
If you don't like it Phat, tough shit.  You've had months to come up with something significant to say since your last post, and as per your pattern for years, you have shit the bed.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
"AARC will go on serving youth and families as long as it will be needed, if it keeps open to God for inspiration" Dr. F. Dean Vause Executive Director


MR. NELSON: Mr. Speaker, AADAC has been involved with
assistance in developing the program of the Alberta Adolescent
Recovery Centre since its inception originally as Kids of the
Canadian West."
Alberta Hansard, March 24, 1992

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2008, 12:51:50 PM »
They also had a former graduate work with clients who had a history of sexual harassment/assault so maybe they should consider investing in a physc.

The number of people who come to a breakfast doesn't really say anything except that a high number of graduates and their families live close enough that they can attend and that individuals from the public life came for the typical we support helping our lost children and nothing more.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Re: If 6 Was 9
« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2008, 09:35:14 PM »
Quote from: "friendly"
well, been through all your replies to my comments ajax and I am not surprised - you had nothing to say back when I pointed out the analogy to the cancer clinic when talking about treatment populations. when you have run out of faulty arguments and misinformation you just resot to ad hominen attacks alone (wow - he is a sociopath and I am am arrcolyte - how mature). You lack facts, training and logic but I am sure your obsession with a treatment centre you haven't been to and  a person you haven't even met will keep you typing in this forum and elsewhere until you get yourself into a bit of trouble. What does your wife do for you while you rant and rave as a result of things she says happened to her?

Adios i have seen enough on this interesting little site
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »