Author Topic: JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins  (Read 1854 times)

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Offline dishdutyfugitive

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« on: December 31, 2007, 01:19:23 PM »
CEDU wasn't religious in the traditional biblical / church-going sense.

However, I find it fascinating that the original cult is Religion. CEDU and christianity (and most every organized religon) have much in common in that they employ very similiar behaviour/thought control methods.

I saw "jesus camp" on A&E last night and almost shit my pants.
It's scary. It reminds you of CEDU. It makes you wonder why people who run cult programs are so fucked in the head.  Does 2+2 = 4 ???? Do we get to pick and choose which science we like? (The earth is 4.5 billion years old but 'christian creationists' qoute the bible and tell us the earth is ~10,000 years old

The film makers could have torn these evangelicals apart.

It took me 30 minutes to figure out the documentary was a completely unbiased documentary.

Watch out for the little kid, Levi, with the power mullet. He's either going to make one hell of a Navy Seal or become the next Jim Jones.

Trailer  (The trailer doesn't do the film justice.)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_EKHK1C2IE

Website
http://www.jesuscampthemovie.com/

It's on today. Tivo it
http://www.aetv.com/listings/episode_de ... gid=260639


Directors Heidi Ewing and Rachel Grady take their cameras to pastor Becky Fischer's "Kids on Fire" camp where children as young as six are taught to become dedicated Christian soldiers in "God's army."  We follow Levi, Rachael, Tory, and other children as they hone their "prophetic skills" and learn how to "take back America for Christ." This Academy Award-nominated film is a first-ever look at how born-again Christian children are being recruited and trained to become take part in American politics. (2006)
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Offline Anonymous

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2007, 01:21:37 PM »
I thought the shithole shut down during filming due to protests and hard negative publicity?
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Offline dishdutyfugitive

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2007, 02:08:24 PM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_Camp

In October 2006, Fischer announced that she would be shutting down the camp indefinitely due to negative reaction to the film.[9] According to Fischer's website, the owners of the property used for the camp shown in the film were concerned about vandalism to the premises following the film's release and thus will not allow it to be used for any future camps. Fischer has said that the camp will be indefinitely postponed until other suitable premises can be found, but it will be back
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Offline Anonymous

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2007, 02:15:05 PM »
here's the clip where they pray to the cardboard cutout of Dubya:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=5CgvgjfwyPs
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Offline GregFL

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2007, 03:03:46 PM »
Religious cults are the grandaddy of all cults.  the particular religion matters not..what matters is the intensity of the indoctrination, the methodology of the indoctrination, and of course the underlying message that the poor recipients are encoded with.

Here is one of my favorite videos that clarifies the issue.  Please note, those watching who were forced as children to "motivate" in their own teen torture camp, that the more disturbing cults (jesus camp, the islamic 'schools') force the kids to do their own version of motivating...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kn9u8MgH ... 16&index=1
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Offline dishdutyfugitive

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2007, 04:10:53 PM »
Doesn't it trip you the fuck out that no one calls religon out for the crock of shit it is?

My bottom line
If there is a god, it's unfortunate because man's handcrafted religious instituitions and his selfish nature have completely obscured god. It's these selfish, egomaniacal motherfuckers who start cults (from religons right on down the line to TBSs, ) that tell you to send in all your money, make up crazy stories and crazy rules and if you don't follow their rules you will perish and rot in hell because they have seen the light and it is prophecy.

I recently read where the bible says black people come from....it's so crazy. When god caused the flood, Noah built his ark and brought his 3 sons. 1 son was named Hamm. After the flood, Noah got good and liqoured up passed out naked. When he woke up he realized his sons knew about his debauchery and was embarrassed and livid. To make things right he raped Hamm and cast Hamm forth to Africa as a punishment. Black people descended from the 'Tribe of Hamm'.


Gee, that's plausible.... (well, the naked closet drinking & sodomy comitted by a religous man is). Gee, that's not racist.....I could take 10 hits of acid and still not come up with shit like that......
« Last Edit: December 31, 2007, 08:04:58 PM by Guest »

Offline Nihilanthic

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2007, 07:26:43 PM »
Quote from: ""GregFL""
Religious cults are the grandaddy of all cults.  the particular religion matters not..what matters is the intensity of the indoctrination, the methodology of the indoctrination, and of course the underlying message that the poor recipients are encoded with.

Here is one of my favorite videos that clarifies the issue.  Please note, those watching who were forced as children to "motivate" in their own teen torture camp, that the more disturbing cults (jesus camp, the islamic 'schools') force the kids to do their own version of motivating...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kn9u8MgH ... 16&index=1


Oh look whose back.

We got work to do. PM me!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Oz girl

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #7 on: December 31, 2007, 07:32:05 PM »
I finally saw this Jesus Camp in full a few weeks ago on DVD. One one level it disturbed me but on another I would say to compare it to a program down plays what programs are. It seems that while those kids were certainly being indoctrinated into a disturbingly fanatical faith, they were there because they wanted to be. It was not a from of incarceration as such or a long term place. Just a really crazy religious camp. It also seems that while the services that had kids crying etc were possibly less than healthy the camp was not a punishment so the kids spent most of the time just doing normal summer camp things that they enjoyed.

 It did not exactly make me wild about home schooling though. It seems levi's mum wanted him educated at home because she feared the world. It made me wonder if the cult is this one church or the conservative christian mind set which believes that we are best protected from a frightening and immoral world. The irony as I watched these suburban kids was that far from bring "a sick old world" their world was surprisingly mundane and comfortable.

I agree Becky Fisher was a compelling and disturbing character. But Like the filmmakers i found her hard to dislike. It seemed she really did care about those kids but her fanaticism and ignorance was so frustrating and saddening. To me the true villian was Ted Haggard. In contast to Fisher who was ultimately a disturbing true believer, everything about him oozed cynicism and arrogance. His patronising dismissal of levi was hard to watch. It is hardly surprising that he ended up being outed as a charlatan and a fraud.
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n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline Froderik

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #8 on: December 31, 2007, 07:53:53 PM »
What kind of games do they play at Jesus camp?

Pin the tail on the Savior?

Bobbing for loaves and fishes?

Crucifiction?

What? lolz.,
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Offline dishdutyfugitive

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #9 on: December 31, 2007, 08:24:53 PM »
Quote from: Oz girl
I finally saw this Jesus Camp in full a few weeks ago on DVD. One one level it disturbed me but on another I would say to compare it to a program down plays what programs are. It seems that while those kids were certainly being indoctrinated into a disturbingly fanatical faith, they were there because they wanted to be. It was not a from of incarceration as such or a long term place. Just a really crazy religious camp. It also seems that while the services that had kids crying etc were possibly less than healthy the camp was not a punishment so the kids spent most of the time just doing normal summer camp things that they enjoyed.
Quote



There are many similarities from a graduate's view.

1. After a year, year and a half of being at CEDU - you motherfucking wanted to stay and graduate. You thought that if you didn't graduate you were going to be a failure. We were those 'eager' kids fully participating in their raps, propheets and workshops.

2. Mind control, mind control, mind control.

- By Instilling fear


- By Inciting emotional group psychofests.


- By Working themselves into a lather over imaginary shit.

That fat bitch talks about "declaring War" ????    She couldn't take on one blind 80 lb jihadist.
That fat bitch is the definition of "mono-faceted".
Every fucking word out of her mouth is god this, the devil that, redemption my child. You want to better the world you fat bitch???? How about normal people telling other people to be considerate of one another? How is that not a good plan? Why do you have to make up crazy stories and fictious characters to get your point across?

That big fat blonde woman bitch gave me the douche chills. The same douche chills that Caroline and Carmen gave me at CEDU.
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Offline dishdutyfugitive

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #10 on: December 31, 2007, 08:25:06 PM »
Quote from: Oz girl
I finally saw this Jesus Camp in full a few weeks ago on DVD. One one level it disturbed me but on another I would say to compare it to a program down plays what programs are. It seems that while those kids were certainly being indoctrinated into a disturbingly fanatical faith, they were there because they wanted to be. It was not a from of incarceration as such or a long term place. Just a really crazy religious camp. It also seems that while the services that had kids crying etc were possibly less than healthy the camp was not a punishment so the kids spent most of the time just doing normal summer camp things that they enjoyed.
Quote



There are many similarities from a graduate's view.

1. After a year, year and a half of being at CEDU - you motherfucking wanted to stay and graduate. You thought that if you didn't graduate you were going to be a failure. We were those 'eager' kids fully participating in their raps, propheets and workshops.

2. Mind control, mind control, mind control.

- By Instilling fear


- By Inciting emotional group psychofests.


- By Working themselves into a lather over imaginary shit.

That fat bitch talks about "declaring War" ????    She couldn't take on one blind 80 lb jihadist.
That fat bitch is the definition of "mono-faceted".
Every fucking word out of her mouth is god this, the devil that, redemption my child. You want to better the world you fat bitch???? How about normal people telling other people to be considerate of one another? How is that not a good plan? Why do you have to make up crazy stories and fictious characters to get your point across?

That big fat blonde bitch gave me the douche chills. The same douche chills that Caroline and Carmen gave me at CEDU.
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Offline Oz girl

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2007, 10:18:02 PM »
While i freely admit I am in this discussion without having been in a program, I think that there is a danger in writing off any faith system that is unpopular or strange as being just like a program. Fishers ideas are alarming, the paramilitary shit was bizarre and the crazy masses went to far. But there is a difference between indoctrination and brainwashing. i would say that my own parents liked the idea of religious indoctrination ( not into anything that extreme) and at the end of the day I rejected it. So did at least half of my classmates. This was always a bonafide choice.

In programs (at least from what I have been told) there are no real choices, the kids do not seem happy, even those claiming some benefit. There are few leisure activities or any freedoms. The primary philosophy is cruelty. I dont think fisher was about a philosophy of cruelty to these kids. When they were not at nutbar mass they seemed to have relatively normal childhoods. if anything that was what was alarming. These people were normal suburbanites  with some of the most absurd ideas i have ever heard. But if this is child abuse and should be banned then where do you draw the line? Because in any democracy there needs to be freedom of ideas and faith no matter how mad.
The idea of putting this woman out of business or vandalizing the camp disturbs me
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n case you\'re worried about what\'s going to become of the younger generation, it\'s going to grow up and start worrying about the younger generation.-Roger Allen

Offline try another castle

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2008, 09:20:05 AM »
Quote
What kind of games do they play at Jesus camp?

Pin the tail on the Savior?



Spear... pin the spear on the savior. Then he does some freaky shit like bleed water or something.
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Offline GregFL

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2008, 10:42:29 AM »
Quote from: ""Oz girl""
While i freely admit I am in this discussion without having been in a program, I think that there is a danger in writing off any faith system that is unpopular or strange as being just like a program. Fishers ideas are alarming, the paramilitary shit was bizarre and the crazy masses went to far. But there is a difference between indoctrination and brainwashing. i would say that my own parents liked the idea of religious indoctrination ( not into anything that extreme) and at the end of the day I rejected it. So did at least half of my classmates. This was always a bonafide choice.

In programs (at least from what I have been told) there are no real choices, the kids do not seem happy, even those claiming some benefit. There are few leisure activities or any freedoms. The primary philosophy is cruelty. I dont think fisher was about a philosophy of cruelty to these kids. When they were not at nutbar mass they seemed to have relatively normal childhoods. if anything that was what was alarming. These people were normal suburbanites  with some of the most absurd ideas i have ever heard. But if this is child abuse and should be banned then where do you draw the line? Because in any democracy there needs to be freedom of ideas and faith no matter how mad.
The idea of putting this woman out of business or vandalizing the camp disturbs me


I think you are missing several important paralells. First, these camps are seldom "voluntary" as you say but rather kids are put in there by their parents,'for their own good'.    It is indoctrination, pure and simple.  Second, they are forced into certain behaviors that embarrass them and make them ripe for the indoctrination.  In the program, we call this 'motivating'.  And third, they are forced to accept a certain set of beliefs or be ostracized by the group.  religion by Peer pressure, as it were.

There are more similarities.  this is the short list, and it is interesting that you give religious 'faith' a free pass when it hasn't earned it. Where else in society do we do this?

Your perception of how program kids appear isn't accurate.  program kids, by all outward appearances, once they get off of the early phases appear happy.  If they don't, they will answer as to why.  They also do activities and socialize with other kids who have accepted the program indoctrination. How is this different?  The philosophy isn't cruelty, as you say, but rather "saving" the kids from the culture of drugs which is seen as evil by modifying their belief system. Do I have to point out this is the same goal as the religious camps but around a different philosophy?

Finally, brainwashing is indocrination of an idea or set of ideals using specific techniques designed to break people down and rebuild their beliefs around the group leaders' set of goals for the group.   While the techniques used in these relgious camps aren't as harsh as the rehabs most of us were forced into in either duration or intensity, they don't have to be because they are used on very very young children and the children for the most part are already exposed to this ideas at home and at church.  These religious summer camps definately use brainwashing techniques in various degrees of harshness.  Just because Jesus or Mohammed is supposedly floating around in some etheral background doesn't legitimize this travesty.
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Offline Anonymous

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JESUS CAMP - Mind Control - TBS meets bible juice origins
« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2008, 11:56:09 AM »
Quote from: ""GregFL""
Quote from: ""Oz girl""
While i freely admit I am in this discussion without having been in a program, I think that there is a danger in writing off any faith system that is unpopular or strange as being just like a program. Fishers ideas are alarming, the paramilitary shit was bizarre and the crazy masses went to far. But there is a difference between indoctrination and brainwashing. i would say that my own parents liked the idea of religious indoctrination ( not into anything that extreme) and at the end of the day I rejected it. So did at least half of my classmates. This was always a bonafide choice.

In programs (at least from what I have been told) there are no real choices, the kids do not seem happy, even those claiming some benefit. There are few leisure activities or any freedoms. The primary philosophy is cruelty. I dont think fisher was about a philosophy of cruelty to these kids. When they were not at nutbar mass they seemed to have relatively normal childhoods. if anything that was what was alarming. These people were normal suburbanites  with some of the most absurd ideas i have ever heard. But if this is child abuse and should be banned then where do you draw the line? Because in any democracy there needs to be freedom of ideas and faith no matter how mad.
The idea of putting this woman out of business or vandalizing the camp disturbs me

I think you are missing several important paralells. First, these camps are seldom "voluntary" as you say but rather kids are put in there by their parents,'for their own good'.    It is indoctrination, pure and simple.  Second, they are forced into certain behaviors that embarrass them and make them ripe for the indoctrination.  In the program, we call this 'motivating'.  And third, they are forced to accept a certain set of beliefs or be ostracized by the group.  religion by Peer pressure, as it were.

There are more similarities.  this is the short list, and it is interesting that you give religious 'faith' a free pass when it hasn't earned it. Where else in society do we do this?

Your perception of how program kids appear isn't accurate.  program kids, by all outward appearances, once they get off of the early phases appear happy.  If they don't, they will answer as to why.  They also do activities and socialize with other kids who have accepted the program indoctrination. How is this different?  The philosophy isn't cruelty, as you say, but rather "saving" the kids from the culture of drugs which is seen as evil by modifying their belief system. Do I have to point out this is the same goal as the religious camps but around a different philosophy?

Finally, brainwashing is indocrination of an idea or set of ideals using specific techniques designed to break people down and rebuild their beliefs around the group leaders' set of goals for the group.   While the techniques used in these relgious camps aren't as harsh as the rehabs most of us were forced into in either duration or intensity, they don't have to be because they are used on very very young children and the children for the most part are already exposed to this ideas at home and at church.  These religious summer camps definately use brainwashing techniques in various degrees of harshness.  Just because Jesus or Mohammed is supposedly floating around in some etheral background doesn't legitimize this travesty.


I've read about "jesus camp" extensively, so I'm somewhat informed, but I haven'T seen the movie, so my conception of the place might be a bit off.Still,  From what i see ,there is NO WAY this place can be equated with a program. Sure, there are similaritiesm but, honestly, there are simialrities in everything.

"jesus camp" is not a "program" because it is not an environment of totalism. There are not clinicial brainwashing modalities effected. It's unhealthy and weird to be sure ,though
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