Are your parents "program lifers"?

[Anonymous]

My parents are what I call "program lifers". Which means they have accepted the program philosophy, or what I call "tough love extremists", as fact in their sad pathetic world they live in. I have never met such unhappy and control freak people as them, so at this point I can only feel sorry for them. They wasted their lives and now both live in misery, you reap what you sow?

My point is, or question, is there any reason to argue with a "program lifer?"

I used to have conversations trying to convince them that torture does not = therapy, but they seem to hold onto that idea. Not out of some twisted idea of guilt, but they actually truly believe it.  Even though all evidence, including me, suggests otherwise. They are not "dumb" in the academic sense, but they sure are "stupid" in the common sense department. The guy who cleared your breakfast plate has more sense than they do.

So what to do with a program lifer? This goes for anyone, not just parents, do you just ignore them? Spend time trying to convince them they are wrong and their belief hurts other people?

Right now all I can stand is to ignore people like this, because they are wrong. I know they are wrong, but they don't, so what's the point?

[Froderik]

You can only beat the horse so many times, I guess...

After a point, best let them figure it out on their own.

[Anonymous]

People like this need to believe that the program "worked" or "is good" because if they re-examined their beliefs, they would be overcome by guilt and shame and regret.  It is a defense.

The only way to get through this is to make it safe for them to "have been wrong"-- and even then, this depends on their willingness to be vulnerable.

Just as you cannot force kids to change their beliefs by coercion and confrontation, similarly, you cannot force people who believe in these methods to change either.

[Froderik]

People like this need to believe that the program "worked" or "is good" because if they re-examined their beliefs, they would be overcome by guilt and shame and regret.  It is a defense.

The only way to get through this is to make it safe for them to "have been wrong"-- and even then, this depends on their willingness to be vulnerable.

Yup...very true...well said.

[dishdutyfugitive]

It's not that odd.


Considering that millions of people think that a dude with a beard parted seas, turned water into wine and his homeboy  talked to burning bushes.

[Anonymous]

My parents are what I call "program lifers". Which means they have accepted the program philosophy, or what I call "tough love extremists", as fact in their sad pathetic world they live in. I have never met such unhappy and control freak people as them, so at this point I can only feel sorry for them. They wasted their lives and now both live in misery, you reap what you sow?

My point is, or question, is there any reason to argue with a "program lifer?"

I used to have conversations trying to convince them that torture does not = therapy, but they seem to hold onto that idea. Not out of some twisted idea of guilt, but they actually truly believe it.  Even though all evidence, including me, suggests otherwise. They are not "dumb" in the academic sense, but they sure are "stupid" in the common sense department. The guy who cleared your breakfast plate has more sense than they do.

So what to do with a program lifer? This goes for anyone, not just parents, do you just ignore them? Spend time trying to convince them they are wrong and their belief hurts other people?

Right now all I can stand is to ignore people like this, because they are wrong. I know they are wrong, but they don't, so what's the point?

My parents are pretty miserable, too. They aren't "lifers" they're just mentally ill, abusive people who damaged their kids. But the same issues that made them hurt us, make them hurt themselves. It's some sort of psychological, naturally occuring karma.

I vacillate between hate and pity, coming down on the side of hate. There's a point past where you can't forgive.

[dishdutyfugitive]

Roll with the pity.


Hating people for being incapable is a waste of your time.

[Anonymous]

Roll with the pity.


Hating people for being incapable is a waste of your time.

Without sounding weird, I have alot of respect for you. You've been through alot but are always generous- even to the ones who damaged you, even with your attempy to engage the who.

You're right about choosing pity over hate...I'm not to that point yet. If i filled you in on the particulars, you'd understand. There's been death because of their actions.

[dishdutyfugitive]

Thanks.

I tried hate for a long time. I realized you can't change people. And most people you want to change are irretrievably far gone or irretrievebly stupid - mostly both.  So hate got olds eventually.

Don't get me wrong I still work myself into an occasional lather.

And there are a few I hate. The one's with the dark frosty innards. The ones who need to be erradicated.

The caroline wolfes

http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... sc&start=0

The mel wassermans
The ones who kick kind people when they are down.

[Anonymous]

My parents are what I call "program lifers". Which means they have accepted the program philosophy, or what I call "tough love extremists", as fact in their sad pathetic world they live in. I have never met such unhappy and control freak people as them, so at this point I can only feel sorry for them. They wasted their lives and now both live in misery, you reap what you sow?

My point is, or question, is there any reason to argue with a "program lifer?"

I used to have conversations trying to convince them that torture does not = therapy, but they seem to hold onto that idea. Not out of some twisted idea of guilt, but they actually truly believe it.  Even though all evidence, including me, suggests otherwise. They are not "dumb" in the academic sense, but they sure are "stupid" in the common sense department. The guy who cleared your breakfast plate has more sense than they do.

So what to do with a program lifer? This goes for anyone, not just parents, do you just ignore them? Spend time trying to convince them they are wrong and their belief hurts other people?

Right now all I can stand is to ignore people like this, because they are wrong. I know they are wrong, but they don't, so what's the point?

maybey you should cut them off?

[Nihilanthic]

 :roll:



 :rofl:

[psy]

bump