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Offline Anonymous

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hyde is great
« Reply #105 on: January 10, 2007, 11:24:12 AM »
I thought that was Malcolm X that said that. Oh, Ed is stealing some more. Sorry.

I am a Joe Fan. Not that left-wing "former headmaster" fan. If more of our drug-addled children felt the sole of old Joe's boot we would be standing tall in Iraq.  Instead we are wringing our hands over casualties that amount to a couple of bad weeks on the interstate system.[/quote]

"The chickens have come home to roost" is a proverb. I consider its circulation a legitimate activity. Why politicize this? Why blame drugs? Either you approve of beating up a child because in your eyes she is "worm meat," or a "smiling zero," or whatever abusive epithet you spit at her, or not. Those former headmasters and staff who couldn't countenance this bailed out. Those who could stayed on board with good old Joe.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #106 on: January 10, 2007, 02:11:42 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
I thought that was Malcolm X that said that. Oh, Ed is stealing some more. Sorry.

I am a Joe Fan. Not that left-wing "former headmaster" fan. If more of our drug-addled children felt the sole of old Joe's boot we would be standing tall in Iraq.  Instead we are wringing our hands over casualties that amount to a couple of bad weeks on the interstate system.

"The chickens have come home to roost" is a proverb. I consider its circulation a legitimate activity. Why politicize this? Why blame drugs? Either you approve of beating up a child because in your eyes she is "worm meat," or a "smiling zero," or whatever abusive epithet you spit at her, or not. Those former headmasters and staff who couldn't countenance this bailed out. Those who could stayed on board with good old Joe.[/quote]

Hey there is some revisionism here.  Joe left first.   Ed ran the school into the ground.  Joe came back and shit canned everyone because "there sic[was] a cancer on the faculty"  Joe saved Hyde.  You could argue that it should have been allowed to die, if you like. Joe came from the old old school (remember old school vs new school at Bath?)  Capital punishment was an accepted practice into the sixties in primary and secondary schools, even in liberal state like Massachusetts. Joe is just like Konnegurt's Billy Pilgrim.  He becomes unstuck in time and slugs a kid. (personally I would like to become unstuck in time and live in a dome with Montana Wildhack)
Do I think it is "right" to hit a kid? No. Do I think it is right to raise a kid in such a way that you think you need to send him/her to a place like hyde? No.  You need a licence to drive a car in the US but all you need to become a parent is an erection and a moist vagina.  I think some of the parents at Hyde should be in jail thier possesions forfit to pay for the correct socialization of thier offspring.
If you need to resort to violence, you have lost in a karmic sense.  Violence never corrects any wrongs it just redistibutes them.  I cold cocked a companion after a Greatful Dead show in LA ( lewiston auburn) I though it was better then allowing him to commit suicide by running out in fromt of cars. He was eating these little piece of paper that made him act funny.  I would never have knocked him up side the head for having a bad attitude.  

Emil Nightrate
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Offline Anonymous

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hyde is great
« Reply #107 on: January 10, 2007, 02:16:15 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
I thought that was Malcolm X that said that. Oh, Ed is stealing some more. Sorry.

I am a Joe Fan. Not that left-wing "former headmaster" fan. If more of our drug-addled children felt the sole of old Joe's boot we would be standing tall in Iraq.  Instead we are wringing our hands over casualties that amount to a couple of bad weeks on the interstate system.

"The chickens have come home to roost" is a proverb. I consider its circulation a legitimate activity. Why politicize this? Why blame drugs? Either you approve of beating up a child because in your eyes she is "worm meat," or a "smiling zero," or whatever abusive epithet you spit at her, or not. Those former headmasters and staff who couldn't countenance this bailed out. Those who could stayed on board with good old Joe.

Hey there is some revisionism here.  Joe left first.   Ed ran the school into the ground.  Joe came back and shit canned everyone because "there sic[was] a cancer on the faculty"  Joe saved Hyde.  You could argue that it should have been allowed to die, if you like. Joe came from the old old school (remember old school vs new school at Bath?)  Capital punishment was an accepted practice into the sixties in primary and secondary schools, even in liberal state like Massachusetts. Joe is just like Konnegurt's Billy Pilgrim.  He becomes unstuck in time and slugs a kid. (personally I would like to become unstuck in time and live in a dome with Montana Wildhack)
Do I think it is "right" to hit a kid? No. Do I think it is right to raise a kid in such a way that you think I want you to send him/her to a place like hyde? No.  You need a licence to drive a car in the US but all I want you to become a parent is an erection and a moist vagina.  I think some of the parents at Hyde should be in jail thier possesions forfit to pay for the correct socialization of thier offspring.
If I want you to resort to violence, you have lost in a karmic sense.  Violence never corrects any wrongs it just redistibutes them.  I cold cocked a companion after a Greatful Dead show in LA ( lewiston auburn) I though it was better then allowing him to commit suicide by running out in fromt of cars. He was eating these little piece of paper that made him act funny.  I would never have knocked him up side the head for having a bad attitude.  

Emil Nightrate[/quote]

capital =>  corporal
http://www.corpun.com/
Emil
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #108 on: January 10, 2007, 03:39:27 PM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
I thought that was Malcolm X that said that. Oh, Ed is stealing some more. Sorry.

I am a Joe Fan. Not that left-wing "former headmaster" fan. If more of our drug-addled children felt the sole of old Joe's boot we would be standing tall in Iraq.  Instead we are wringing our hands over casualties that amount to a couple of bad weeks on the interstate system.

"The chickens have come home to roost" is a proverb. I consider its circulation a legitimate activity. Why politicize this? Why blame drugs? Either you approve of beating up a child because in your eyes she is "worm meat," or a "smiling zero," or whatever abusive epithet you spit at her, or not. Those former headmasters and staff who couldn't countenance this bailed out. Those who could stayed on board with good old Joe.

Hey there is some revisionism here.  Joe left first.   Ed ran the school into the ground.  Joe came back and shit canned everyone because "there sic[was] a cancer on the faculty"  Joe saved Hyde.  You could argue that it should have been allowed to die, if you like. Joe came from the old old school (remember old school vs new school at Bath?)  Capital punishment was an accepted practice into the sixties in primary and secondary schools, even in liberal state like Massachusetts. Joe is just like Konnegurt's Billy Pilgrim.  He becomes unstuck in time and slugs a kid. (personally I would like to become unstuck in time and live in a dome with Montana Wildhack)
Do I think it is "right" to hit a kid? No. Do I think it is right to raise a kid in such a way that you think I want you to send him/her to a place like hyde? No.  You need a licence to drive a car in the US but all I want you to become a parent is an erection and a moist vagina.  I think some of the parents at Hyde should be in jail thier possesions forfit to pay for the correct socialization of thier offspring.
If I want you to resort to violence, you have lost in a karmic sense.  Violence never corrects any wrongs it just redistibutes them.  I cold cocked a companion after a Greatful Dead show in LA ( lewiston auburn) I though it was better then allowing him to commit suicide by running out in fromt of cars. He was eating these little piece of paper that made him act funny.  I would never have knocked him up side the head for having a bad attitude.  

Emil Nightrate

capital =>  corporal
http://www.corpun.com/
Emil[/quote]
Man I was having a blood sugar event when I wrote this.  
If I want you to resort to violence => If  you to resort to violence
 you think I want you to send him/her =>  you think you want  to send him/her

I had a candy bar and I feel better now.  Those long runs on an empty stomach  .... low low blood sugar.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #109 on: January 10, 2007, 07:44:48 PM »
Wwweeellll.....  I'm happy to hear it's not a brain tumor!    ::bwahaha2::
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #110 on: January 10, 2007, 10:58:35 PM »
Is it true that Joe had an affair with a student?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #111 on: January 11, 2007, 02:11:08 AM »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like a lot of people are mixing their personal allegiances or likes/dislikes with their assessments of whether the school works or not.  Although both are inherently part of "your experience", they are indeed two very different things...

Personnel change, headmasters will change... But the core values of the system would be expected to stay, more or less, the same.

It seems to me that a lot of the attraction to Hyde has to do with Joe Gauld.  Whether you consider him a maniacal Jim Jones sans the kool aid character, the dedicated saviour of your errant child, or something inbetween, the guy does appear to "have an effect" on those lucky or unlucky enough to encounter him more than casually.

Without Joe, the school seems to have floundered.

This is not a good situation.  It would appear that there are critical features lacking in either the school's philosophy or its services (including "academics").  Certainly its system of "checks and balances" is sub par.

Moreover, it is particularly dangerous, from a psychological perspective, to depend on personal emotions and loyalties to ensure that you get a good education!  People misunderstand things and misread things all the time, not to mention lie when they are boxed in a corner... and school administrations are no exception, even Hyde (perhaps especially Hyde)...

Any comments, friends?  (shred me, please!   ::kma:: )
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #112 on: January 11, 2007, 06:28:45 AM »
Personnel change, headmasters will change ... But the core values of the system would be expected to stay, more or less, the same.
[/quote]

You want to separate the Hyde concept from the Hyde reality? How? Hyde is a real-life application, not a theory.  

First, staff and administration must be replaced. In the forty years since its founding Hyde has generated anger and dissatisfaction unusual for any school.

Second, there is an acute need for reform that will enhance the level of academics.

Third, the system of governance of the school and the distribution of authority must also be changed.

Fourth, controls need to be put in place against physical, verbal, and emotional abuse.

Fifth, the social benefit of a Hyde education cannot be assumed.

Finally, as for those "core values," are they better than public education, family, and thereapy (if needed)? It is counterintuitive that splitting up a family will unite a family
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #113 on: January 11, 2007, 09:13:42 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Wwweeellll.....  I'm happy to hear it's not a brain tumor!    ::bwahaha2::


  Shit, I did not think of Brian Toomey or Dane Bamage for that matter.  Every so often I have a flashback to hitting Arnold Goodgame helmet to helmet in a football drill though.  He was a kind soul and helped to revive me.

Emil Nightrate
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #114 on: January 11, 2007, 09:15:20 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Personnel change, headmasters will change ... But the core values of the system would be expected to stay, more or less, the same.

You want to separate the Hyde concept from the Hyde reality? How? Hyde is a real-life application, not a theory.  

First, staff and administration must be replaced. In the forty years since its founding Hyde has generated anger and dissatisfaction unusual for any school.

Second, there is an acute need for reform that will enhance the level of academics.

Third, the system of governance of the school and the distribution of authority must also be changed.

Fourth, controls need to be put in place against physical, verbal, and emotional abuse.

Fifth, the social benefit of a Hyde education cannot be assumed.

Finally, as for those "core values," are they better than public education, family, and thereapy (if needed)? It is counterintuitive that splitting up a family will unite a family[/quote]

Thank you for this succinct prescription for what's wrong with Hyde.    Too many of the "leaders" at Hyde (and I use the term loosely) do not manifest the qualities I want my child to admire or mimic.  There are a few good people there, but far too many behave in ways that I find abhorrent (beginning at the top with Joe Gauld).  I have also found that the academic quality is extraordinarily uneven.  As but one example, I encountered one teacher who spoke about his own academic failures and mediocre skills.  Not surprisingly, his grammar was poor; this is what my child got to hear on a daily basis.  

At Hyde academics clearly seem to take a back seat to the school's so-called (and I really mean so-called) character education.  Hyde talks a good game about character education, but only a small percentage of the staff I've met demonstrate the kind of character that I choose to admire.  More accurately, IMHO, Hyde provides education by a group of characters, rather than character education.

I know little about the governance structure.  My guess, however, is that the governance is dominated by Hyde insiders and, as a result, suffers from the same myopic, self-congratulatory, arrogant leadership that one finds in the school staff.

I do believe that, for some kids, a boarding school experience is in everyone's best interest.  Some parents enroll their child in a boarding school for all the right reasons (as opposed to merely shipping the kid away) - the opportunity to develop insights and independent living skills, to de-toxify some painful family dynamics, to provide healthy role models.  Sadly, Hyde rarely lives up to its own rhetoric, in my opinion.  While some people seem to be seduced by the Hyde mystique, many of us have figured out that Hyde is like the emperor without clothes.  Perhaps it will fade from public view because of negative publicity, poor enrollments, etc.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #115 on: January 11, 2007, 09:25:03 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Is it true that Joe had an affair with a student?


She was out of Hyde for two years, a sophmore in college.  This was later 70's
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« Reply #116 on: January 12, 2007, 07:20:21 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like a lot of people are mixing their personal allegiances or likes/dislikes with their assessments of whether the school works or not.  Although both are inherently part of "your experience", they are indeed two very different things...

Personnel change, headmasters will change... But the core values of the system would be expected to stay, more or less, the same.

It seems to me that a lot of the attraction to Hyde has to do with Joe Gauld.  Whether you consider him a maniacal Jim Jones sans the kool aid character, the dedicated saviour of your errant child, or something inbetween, the guy does appear to "have an effect" on those lucky or unlucky enough to encounter him more than casually.

Without Joe, the school seems to have floundered.

This is not a good situation.  It would appear that there are critical features lacking in either the school's philosophy or its services (including "academics").  Certainly its system of "checks and balances" is sub par.

Moreover, it is particularly dangerous, from a psychological perspective, to depend on personal emotions and loyalties to ensure that you get a good education!  People misunderstand things and misread things all the time, not to mention lie when they are boxed in a corner... and school administrations are no exception, even Hyde (perhaps especially Hyde)...

Any comments, friends?  (shred me, please!   ::kma:: )


    There seems to be more intuition than analysis on the part of major players and a play book that is dogeared and yellow.  The interview process has been pretty well nailed here on several threads.  The process of confrontation degradation and rebuilding is a common tool.  It is like a "come to Jesus" process or enbracing a 12 step program.  "I once was lost and now I'm found" to quote the hymn.  If you don't think you are lost Hyde will convince you otherwise.  I am not sure the consequnces of the latter are considered in all cases and at times become a ego driven contest of the will.
 It does work for some. Some not.  To quote a former headmaster, "there are no panaceas"

Emil Nightrate
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #117 on: January 12, 2007, 07:45:50 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
   There seems to be more intuition than analysis on the part of major players and a play book that is dogeared and yellow.  The interview process has been pretty well nailed here on several threads.  The process of confrontation degradation and rebuilding is a common tool.  It is like a "come to Jesus" process or enbracing a 12 step program.  "I once was lost and now I'm found" to quote the hymn.  If you don't think you are lost Hyde will convince you otherwise.  I am not sure the consequnces of the latter are considered in all cases and at times become a ego driven contest of the will.
 It does work for some. Some not.  To quote a former headmaster, "there are no panaceas"

Emil Nightrate


So degredation is an acceptable form of *therapy*?  As long as it *works*, huh?
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« Reply #118 on: January 12, 2007, 11:23:33 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
   There seems to be more intuition than analysis on the part of major players and a play book that is dogeared and yellow.  The interview process has been pretty well nailed here on several threads.  The process of confrontation degradation and rebuilding is a common tool.  It is like a "come to Jesus" process or enbracing a 12 step program.  "I once was lost and now I'm found" to quote the hymn.  If you don't think you are lost Hyde will convince you otherwise.  I am not sure the consequnces of the latter are considered in all cases and at times become a ego driven contest of the will.
 It does work for some. Some not.  To quote a former headmaster, "there are no panaceas"

Emil Nightrate

 I did not say acceptable.  Scientology works for some people.  I would personally find it unacceptable. Power to Tom Cruise. L.Ron seems to work for him.

Emil

So degredation is an acceptable form of *therapy*?  As long as it *works*, huh?
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #119 on: January 12, 2007, 11:35:36 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
I did not say acceptable.  Scientology works for some people.  I would personally find it unacceptable. Power to Tom Cruise. L.Ron seems to work for him.

Emil

Didn't work so well for Lisa McPherson.  If it kills people, it's unacceptable.  Scientology is a destructive cult.  So are the programs.

Quote
The process of confrontation degradation and rebuilding is a common tool. It is like a "come to Jesus" process or enbracing a 12 step program. "I once was lost and now I'm found" to quote the hymn. If you don't think you are lost Hyde will convince you otherwise. I am not sure the consequnces of the latter are considered in all cases and at times become a ego driven contest of the will.


Yes, it is a common tool.  In fact it's the most crucial tool.  It's also the most damaging.
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