Direct Action Campaign

[Anonymous]

Yeah, sigs.  :smokin:  :smokin:  :smokin:

[Nonconformistlaw]

On 2006-03-22 15:59:00, researcher1 wrote:

That's ok. You articulated it just fine. I understand what you are trying to say and I have gathered that conclusion. I am not at any point in doubt to what these kids are going through. It can seem to be somewhat confusing to the mixed stories that I have seen. Obviously, some of these kids after "successfully" graduating some of these organizations are literally brainwashed into believing that it actually helped and that they really did have a problem, etc. in reaction to the mental breakdown of these already feable children. So, I guess my next question, without condoning the actions of mistreatment to these children, how is society, once informed of this situation, that may not be as easily "convinced", if you will, differentiate from those that needed help, those that didnt and by viewing both sides of the spectrum really see the problem?

I personally believe that good, one on one therapy is the key to sort out who really needs drug treatment versus a kid who is merely experiencing issues unrelated to drugs.  But this is not a quick process...society and parents want a quick fix. So along with a different approach, I believe that expectations should change as well. Assuming a child does need to change behaviour, it takes time, and does not happen overnight, and should never be coerced. A real therapist will take the time to dig into a childs history to determine if 'acting out' and or drug use is symptomatic of being abused as a child, difficulty in coping with divorce, grieving the loss of a parent, etc. Obviously I think getting at the root of the problem is much more important than "transforming a child into the model of obedience." Therapy can not only root out underlying causes of rebellion, drinking, etc, but a good therapist will also able to determine if drug use (if any) has reached an addiction level, if "drug treatment is even necessary, and if so, the proper environment for treatment....I think most responsible therapists will be much more reluctant to label a kid an addict....and be more likly to deal with each childs unique issues in a non-condeming, non threatening way....

Of course, assuming treatment is deemed necessary after a proper evaluation process, tough love, coercive thought reform tactics, and group therapy etc should be banned from existance...outlaw it! All need to be thrown out altogether....treatment should never treat kids as if they are criminals. Kids in treatment should have freedom to have unsupervised contact with parents, should always be treated with respect and dignity, have the right to express their true feelings, be in an environment in which it is perfectly fine to express disagreement, where its ok to express anger, etc. Treatment should never be overly rigid or deprive kids of their childhood. I could go on and on....I think mentoring might also be an excellent supplement to therapy.  

"Let's face it, this has been going on for quite some time now, 1970's? Granted, time has given us the opportunity to shut down those centers and expose those accused along with stories of those poor children (Richard Bradbury, Aaron Bacon) and I'm sure thousands more. But, it still goes on. So, what has actually been accomplished? I'm not asking that in a "read between the lines" kind of way to say that it's effortless or nothing has come of people's efforts. Why haven't these people been indicted? "these people" being those listed at Anonymity Anonymous: Florida Chapter http://fornits.com/anonanon/#discussion

Is the government not spending it's tax dollars wisely enough to where more attention is focused on these programs to ensure the safety of our youth? Oh, but I guess then it would require another government association which hires people not really qualified for the job and could care less about what they are investigating and controlling except how much overtime they work and how many 0's are at the end of their pay check. Uhh. This just proves why I never found interest in politics or following it."

Lately, it seems like protests are getting a lot accomplished by generating bad publicity for KHK  in Cincinnati. And the publicity of many survivors persistantly speaking out against this particular program seems to be gaining some momentum as well.  Most noteably, there has been ongoing publicity on the Cincinnati Beacon for over a month now. But the efforts of many survivors in exposing KHK is limited by the reluctance (fear) of most survivors to speak out against KHK, and is limited by few financial resources, etc. So progress is slow, but steady...but I can only attest to the efforts geared toward KHK. As you may have noticed, KHK is only one of countless programs in dire need of negative publicity, opponents, etc.

Programs are not being held accountable for numerous reasons....I think an uninformed public, lack of a sustained widespread public outcry, lack of oversight and regulations, political reasons, etc are all contributing factors. The fact Straight and its predecessors have never been criminally held accountable baffles me as there is plenty of evidence of criminal wrongdoing. But then again, there probably will never be criminal accountability due to the expiration of the statute of limitations and the fact that Straight's founder has been appointed US ambassodor twice, by Bush I and II (he has friends in all the right places). The political aspects of this is really nauseating....that alone makes me wonder how much will ever change.

[linchpin]

Straights gonna seem like a vacation when the new world order global elite round us up and enslave us in fema concentration camps

[Anonymous]

well, what should we do inchpin?

[Antigen]

On 2006-03-22 09:13:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Thanks for the info. and the response. My next question, Why aren't more people aware of this problem and the history? One would think with most of this starting in Akron, Ohio at the site of the origination of AA, the state would be "tattooed" with information available simply to the naked eye. I am personally not from Ohio, but am briefly here for work. I can't believe I have never heard of this and simply stumbled upon it. I have a close friend that is nearly twice my age who has always kept up on issues regarding politics, etc. He too, had never heard of Straight Inc or The Seed or even Mel Sembler. I am amazed. My local news (IL) has never reported anything like this that I have been aware of. It should be headlining the news everyday! Do you think KHK is really being monitored by the State and behavior treatments are not as bizarre and morbidly abusive as they were years ago? I just can't understand why this isn't nationally known. I mean in a way that EVERYONE has heard something about it."

In a nutshell, because America is a tad brainwashed. Extraordinary claims always require extraordinary evidence. It's hard to meet the level of evidence most people would need to be convinced that our most powerful political leaders have been doing these things to their own children for a number of decades. The only eyewitnesses are us program vets who's own parents deemed us so utterly fucked up as to require some very unconventional treatment.

A couple of years ago, someone posted anon somewhere around here saying they saw Mel Sembler at an open meeting at Pathway to see his grandson who was in the Program at that time. I tend to believe it. I wish that person had given their name and 2 or 3 others to corroborate. But I take it as more likely than not that it's true. It's just exactly what I would expect the Semblers to do. But who would believe me and some anon poster to a public forum?

That's why Maia is so damned cool. She's earned her degrees and done her research very well. And you are too, darlin'! This should be headline news. These crazy bastards have just upped the anti in Clinton's "Plan Colombia". They actually believe that, somehow, we can win this prohibition war if we can just kill off a few hundred thousand more of those recalcitrant Amazon and Andean trouble makers. They really are out of control and need to be stopped!

Lighthouses are more helpful then churches.
--Benjamin Franklin, American Founding Father, author, and inventor

[Anonymous]

On 2006-03-22 18:25:00, Nonconformistlaw wrote:

"

On 2006-03-22 15:59:00, researcher1 wrote:


That's ok. You articulated it just fine. I understand what you are trying to say and I have gathered that conclusion. I am not at any point in doubt to what these kids are going through. It can seem to be somewhat confusing to the mixed stories that I have seen. Obviously, some of these kids after "successfully" graduating some of these organizations are literally brainwashed into believing that it actually helped and that they really did have a problem, etc. in reaction to the mental breakdown of these already feable children. So, I guess my next question, without condoning the actions of mistreatment to these children, how is society, once informed of this situation, that may not be as easily "convinced", if you will, differentiate from those that needed help, those that didnt and by viewing both sides of the spectrum really see the problem?

I personally believe that good, one on one therapy is the key to sort out who really needs drug treatment versus a kid who is merely experiencing issues unrelated to drugs.  But this is not a quick process...society and parents want a quick fix. So along with a different approach, I believe that expectations should change as well. Assuming a child does need to change behaviour, it takes time, and does not happen overnight, and should never be coerced. A real therapist will take the time to dig into a childs history to determine if 'acting out' and or drug use is symptomatic of being abused as a child, difficulty in coping with divorce, grieving the loss of a parent, etc. Obviously I think getting at the root of the problem is much more important than "transforming a child into the model of obedience." Therapy can not only root out underlying causes of rebellion, drinking, etc, but a good therapist will also able to determine if drug use (if any) has reached an addiction level, if "drug treatment is even necessary, and if so, the proper environment for treatment....I think most responsible therapists will be much more reluctant to label a kid an addict....and be more likly to deal with each childs unique issues in a non-condeming, non threatening way....



Of course, assuming treatment is deemed necessary after a proper evaluation process, tough love, coercive thought reform tactics, and group therapy etc should be banned from existance...outlaw it! All need to be thrown out altogether....treatment should never treat kids as if they are criminals. Kids in treatment should have freedom to have unsupervised contact with parents, should always be treated with respect and dignity, have the right to express their true feelings, be in an environment in which it is perfectly fine to express disagreement, where its ok to express anger, etc. Treatment should never be overly rigid or deprive kids of their childhood. I could go on and on....I think mentoring might also be an excellent supplement to therapy.  

"Let's face it, this has been going on for quite some time now, 1970's? Granted, time has given us the opportunity to shut down those centers and expose those accused along with stories of those poor children (Richard Bradbury, Aaron Bacon) and I'm sure thousands more. But, it still goes on. So, what has actually been accomplished? I'm not asking that in a "read between the lines" kind of way to say that it's effortless or nothing has come of people's efforts. Why haven't these people been indicted? "these people" being those listed at Anonymity Anonymous: Florida Chapter http://fornits.com/anonanon/#discussion


Is the government not spending it's tax dollars wisely enough to where more attention is focused on these programs to ensure the safety of our youth? Oh, but I guess then it would require another government association which hires people not really qualified for the job and could care less about what they are investigating and controlling except how much overtime they work and how many 0's are at the end of their pay check. Uhh. This just proves why I never found interest in politics or following it."

Lately, it seems like protests are getting a lot accomplished by generating bad publicity for KHK  in Cincinnati. And the publicity of many survivors persistantly speaking out against this particular program seems to be gaining some momentum as well.  Most noteably, there has been ongoing publicity on the Cincinnati Beacon for over a month now. But the efforts of many survivors in exposing KHK is limited by the reluctance (fear) of most survivors to speak out against KHK, and is limited by few financial resources, etc. So progress is slow, but steady...but I can only attest to the efforts geared toward KHK. As you may have noticed, KHK is only one of countless programs in dire need of negative publicity, opponents, etc.



Programs are not being held accountable for numerous reasons....I think an uninformed public, lack of a sustained widespread public outcry, lack of oversight and regulations, political reasons, etc are all contributing factors. The fact Straight and its predecessors have never been criminally held accountable baffles me as there is plenty of evidence of criminal wrongdoing. But then again, there probably will never be criminal accountability due to the expiration of the statute of limitations and the fact that Straight's founder has been appointed US ambassodor twice, by Bush I and II (he has friends in all the right places). The political aspects of this is really nauseating....that alone makes me wonder how much will ever change.
"

Kindly fuck off with your treatment agenda, church boy impostor.

[Antigen]

On 2006-03-22 15:59:00, researcher1 wrote:

Is the government not spending it's tax dollars wisely enough to where more attention is focused on these programs to ensure the safety of our youth? Oh, but I guess then it would require another government association which hires people not really qualified for the job and could care less about what they are investigating and controlling except how much overtime they work and how many 0's are at the end of their pay check. Uhh. This just proves why I never found interest in politics or following it.

"Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you."--Pericles (430 BC)

Yes, the government has always been intensely interested in these programs. At the very beginning of the Seed, Robert DuPont as head of NIDA granted Art Barker over a million dollars for expansion. Nixon had tasked him to go out and find the silver bullet for the expected wave of heroin addicted Vietnam vets. That epidemic never materialized, so they started hawking Anslinger's reefer madness propaganda all over the place.

Up until `98, the only political issue I really kept up on was drug policy. In `98, Brother Jeb! took office as the Governor of Florida and, right out of the chute, promised $100 million in publicly funded juvenile drug rehab. So then I started looking into the backrounds of the most lunatic of drug warriors and found most of them directly tied to Mel and Betty's little cult. Un-fucking-believable! And, in fact, even drug policy reformers have tended to litterally not believe it. Sounds too much like a conspiracy theory, right?

Well it is a conspiracy. I didn't invent it, though, I'm only reporting what I've learned.

These people are rank fanatics. They're easily as delusional as any Taliban cleric or abortion clinic bomber. Here's a stunning example at the depth of delusion on both sides of this issue. After the WTC attack of 9/11, drug policy reformers reached near consensus on putting aside their very important domestic issues in order to show real solidarity and patriotism. They assumed that, surely, the opposition would react the same way. After all, who could concience a continued domestic war while our nation is under attack by real outside enemies?

Zealots, that's who! And so I switched my tag line to "Drug Free America Foundation = an American Taliban" for awhile.

Neeless to say, I thought they were making a big mistake. They just didn't really understand how deeply fanatic these people are. So I wrote my own damned letter to the Miami Herald:
http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v01/n171 ... tml?305637 Never thought they'd publish it, but they did.

Next thing ya' know, "In a record single-event advertising buy for the federal government, the White House drug czar's office is paying $1.7 million each for 30-second spots that will air Sunday on Fox during the Super Bowl, said a network source."
http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n169/a05.html?305642

I don't know if you remember those ads or not. But they essentially had 13yo kids making statements like "I helped kill a peasant family in Bolivia!" and "I helped buy guns for terrorists in Bosnia!"

Now, if you want to see what it takes to almost make a dent in the public unconcious, just look at my martin lee anderson. The man who started that boot camp holds a seat on the board of Drug Free America Foundation. The man who took over as sherrif is a close affiliate through Florida Department of Law Enforcement and is a dyed in the wool drug warrior, appointed to that office by Brother Jeb! Büsh in the wake of a sex scandal involving the former sheriff.

Now, I don't doubt that sometimes people in positions of power over vulnerable female inmates sometimes take advantage of the situation. But it just looks damned fishy when you consider who promoted that story into a career buster and who benefited from it. Honest to God, just because the Büsh people and their creepy cult friends are involved, I tend to not believe the charges.

May your days be joyously challenging and your words artfully true.
--Ginger Warbis

[Antigen]

On 2006-03-22 17:00:00, starry-eyed pirate wrote:

"like the sigs."

Yeah! Especially this one:
"The eye sees only
what the mind is prepared to comprehend. "
- Henri L. Bergson

That's pretty much what I was trying to say. LOL

Babylon in all its desolation is a sight not so awful as that of the human mind in ruins.
-- Scrope Davies: Letter to Thomas Raikes, May 25, 1835.

[Antigen]

Well, looks like sombody's busy, busy bumping old threads. So I'll just stick this at the top for a little while.

Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0807059099/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'>Mahatma Gandhi, My Autobigraphy, p. 446

[researcher1]

Non- I definitely agree with you regarding the one on one therapy and the subject of outlawing all of these institutions using behavioral modification. Seems like no matter what the government does to try to "pasify" those that are in dispute with these agencies, they (agencies) seem to find just another way to get around it. Shutting these places down altogether, obviously will take so much time. Needless to say those parents that want the "quick fix" those parents that just don't have the patience, the love and compassion for their kids or are just too busy in their 6 figure income jobs or are too worried about keeping up with the jones' and more worried about how many designer labels hang in their closets, that they "shoo" their kids off to the first place that tells them what they want to hear. So easy it is to just step over a homeless person or turn a blind eye to our veterans, so easy it is to give away our hard earned money to people who dont need welfare and only take advantage of it because some women like keeping their legs open just for the purpose of making money and some guys arent smart enought to keep it in their pants, so easy it is to talk about an issue over a cup of tea and have much passion for it and still do nothing about it. So easy it is to go on with our lives and take the easy route. So easy it is for people with money to get what they want. So sad it is...people with good hearts can be bought with the color green, and made to stay quiet or whatever. So sad it is, that because so many people are just plain fucking WEAK!, our youth suffers. And so sad it is that there are actually people out there that think not even twice about molestation and abuse and locking kids up in 3'x3' boxes and making kids lie flat on their stomachs for 18 months straight in the same room. So sad it is that those of us that see right from wrong and can't be bought and truely have the best intentions for our children and society for those that deserve it can't jut be the leaders of our Nation. Being president cant be that hard! Really. Just do what's fucking right no matter how many votes you get. (SORRY FOR THE LANGUAGE)

Talk about a tangent. Anyway, an uninformed public as you put it, Non, lack of a substained widespread public outcry, lack of oversight and regulations etc. I couldnt agree more. And of course the political aspects, ambassadorships being thrown around for less that 20K or whatever the figure was. It is nauseating. To say the least. Unfortunately, as far as the local news in Cincinnati, it doesnt go so far to reach IL. Maybe I can do something about that. I did at one time work for our local newspaper. :grin:

[researcher1]

Why arent my quotes showing up?

[researcher1]

On 2006-03-24 07:56:00, Eudora wrote:

"

On 2006-03-22 15:59:00, researcher1 wrote:


Is the government not spending it's tax dollars wisely enough to where more attention is focused on these programs to ensure the safety of our youth? Oh, but I guess then it would require another government association which hires people not really qualified for the job and could care less about what they are investigating and controlling except how much overtime they work and how many 0's are at the end of their pay check. Uhh. This just proves why I never found interest in politics or following it.

"Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you."--Pericles (430 BC)



Yes, the government has always been intensely interested in these programs. At the very beginning of the Seed, Robert DuPont as head of NIDA granted Art Barker over a million dollars for expansion. Nixon had tasked him to go out and find the silver bullet for the expected wave of heroin addicted Vietnam vets. That epidemic never materialized, so they started hawking Anslinger's reefer madness propaganda all over the place.



Up until `98, the only political issue I really kept up on was drug policy. In `98, Brother Jeb! took office as the Governor of Florida and, right out of the chute, promised $100 million in publicly funded juvenile drug rehab. So then I started looking into the backrounds of the most lunatic of drug warriors and found most of them directly tied to Mel and Betty's little cult. Un-fucking-believable! And, in fact, even drug policy reformers have tended to litterally not believe it. Sounds too much like a conspiracy theory, right?



Well it is a conspiracy. I didn't invent it, though, I'm only reporting what I've learned.



These people are rank fanatics. They're easily as delusional as any Taliban cleric or abortion clinic bomber. Here's a stunning example at the depth of delusion on both sides of this issue. After the WTC attack of 9/11, drug policy reformers reached near consensus on putting aside their very important domestic issues in order to show real solidarity and patriotism. They assumed that, surely, the opposition would react the same way. After all, who could concience a continued domestic war while our nation is under attack by real outside enemies?



Zealots, that's who! And so I switched my tag line to "Drug Free America Foundation = an American Taliban" for awhile.



Neeless to say, I thought they were making a big mistake. They just didn't really understand how deeply fanatic these people are. So I wrote my own damned letter to the Miami Herald:

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v01/n171 ... tml?305637 Never thought they'd publish it, but they did.



Next thing ya' know, "In a record single-event advertising buy for the federal government, the White House drug czar's office is paying $1.7 million each for 30-second spots that will air Sunday on Fox during the Super Bowl, said a network source."

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v02/n169/a05.html?305642



I don't know if you remember those ads or not. But they essentially had 13yo kids making statements like "I helped kill a peasant family in Bolivia!" and "I helped buy guns for terrorists in Bosnia!"



Now, if you want to see what it takes to almost make a dent in the public unconcious, just look at my martin lee anderson. The man who started that boot camp holds a seat on the board of Drug Free America Foundation. The man who took over as sherrif is a close affiliate through Florida Department of Law Enforcement and is a dyed in the wool drug warrior, appointed to that office by Brother Jeb! Büsh in the wake of a sex scandal involving the former sheriff.



Now, I don't doubt that sometimes people in positions of power over vulnerable female inmates sometimes take advantage of the situation. But it just looks damned fishy when you consider who promoted that story into a career buster and who benefited from it. Honest to God, just because the Büsh people and their creepy cult friends are involved, I tend to not believe the charges.

May your days be joyously challenging and your words artfully true.
--Ginger Warbis

"

Like the quote regarding politics. And thanks for the compliment Eudora. You are the one that started this website/forum, correct? Well, kudo's to you my dear. And, I do remember those ad campaigns. The message I got from those campaigns were just that-if you buy drugs you are donating to terrorists, etc. How does this tie in with the subject at hand? And please forgive me for sounding "Stupid" I need to do quite alot more research. And, I'm not so sure I agree with you that people have heard of this in one way or another. Maybe they have and like you said, just couldnt put 2 & 2 together. But why should people have to connect the dots? We should have pictures of abused children from these places on billboards that read "This is what happend when my parents sent me away?" Just throw it in people's faces. Ya know?
I have been forwarding websites on to all the people in my address book without even a subject line. Maybe I can create a snowball effect. Unfortunately, no one has emailed me back asking, "What is all this you keep sending me?" Even my closest friend that follows politics etc. that I have mentioned before. I just dont get it.

You talked about looking into the backgrounds of "the most lunatic of drug warriors" and found most of the directly tied to Mel and Betty's cult. So, that means that these drug lords are funding Mel and Betty Sembler. So, what do the terrorists have to do with it? Zealots? When I said I didnt follow politics, I meant it. As i said earlier, Please forgive me for sounding stupid. You'll have to allow me a little more time to respond to you. I have to research most of what you talk about before I can respond. lol. I will continue to discuss this issue as long as I have people to discuss it with. I'm sure I will need the opinions and the "education".

Thanks.

By the way, I did notice that Maia mentions this website in her book. :nworthy:

[Antigen]

On 2006-03-24 10:25:00, researcher1 wrote:


Like the quote regarding politics. And thanks for the compliment Eudora. You are the one that started this website/forum, correct? Well, kudo's to you my dear.

Thanks very much!

And, I do remember those ad campaigns. The message I got from those campaigns were just that-if you buy drugs you are donating to terrorists, etc. How does this tie in with the subject at hand? And please forgive me for sounding "Stupid" I need to do quite alot more research. And, I'm not so sure I agree with you that people have heard of this in one way or another. Maybe they have and like you said, just couldnt put 2 & 2 together. But why should people have to connect the dots?

Ok, how can I answer this? Well first, I reject the idea that currently illegal drugs, by their nature, are anywhere near as dangerous or destructive as the drug warriors insist. "Narco-terrorists" don't kill people over the drugs. It's the money. And these drugs, when they were all available legally w/o a prescription in this country, cost about the same at retail as aspirin.

It's not the 13yo smoking a joint (most likely grown domestically anyway) who are throwing guns into these bloody wars all over the planet. It's the law-n-order drug warriors. Remember Iran Contra? CIA coke dealing and drug running? Where are the principles in that saga now? Still in the highest realms of US government and influence.

And some of the most powerful ones particularly involved in drug policy and lobbying are, I shit you not, the very same individuals who, 30 years ago, sat on the the parents' side at Open Meetings hosted by Art Barker or Miller Newton.

Here's a quick run-down of some of the ties between Straight, Inc. and the current inner circle in the Büsh admin.
http://thestraights.com/gop.htm

Basically, if your kid has been exposed to the DARE program in school, your life has been touched by the creepy, sadistic appendages of DFAF.

In Ohio, especially (though not to be outdone by Florida, Michigan or Virginia) these people are firmly entrenched. This article by Dan Forbes, http://fornits.com/anonanon/docs/Forbes/ohio/ , places Betty and Calvina in Governor Taft's office plotting and schemeing to illegally influence an upcoming election.

We should have pictures of abused children from these places on billboards that read "This is what happend when my parents sent me away?" Just throw it in people's faces. Ya know?

I have been forwarding websites on to all the people in my address book without even a subject line. Maybe I can create a snowball effect. Unfortunately, no one has emailed me back asking, "What is all this you keep sending me?" Even my closest friend that follows politics etc. that I have mentioned before. I just dont get it.

Well, let me explain this if I can. No, maybe NCL can explain it better. NCL, please tell this person how many passers by came to your aid when your rents had you kidnapped back into Straight for holding hands with a boy.

You talked about looking into the backgrounds of "the most lunatic of drug warriors" and found most of the directly tied to Mel and Betty's cult. So, that means that these drug lords are funding Mel and Betty Sembler. So, what do the terrorists have to do with it? Zealots? When I said I didnt follow politics, I meant it. As i said earlier, Please forgive me for sounding stupid. You'll have to allow me a little more time to respond to you. I have to research most of what you talk about before I can respond. lol. I will continue to discuss this issue as long as I have people to discuss it with. I'm sure I will need the opinions and the "education".



Thanks.

Darlin, you don't sound stupid at all! These are, as I say, extraordinary claims. Take your time.

Much of what you "know" simply isn't true, especially as regards drugs and drug policy. The people who have controled the dialog on this issue nearly worldwide since the daze of Anslinger are stark raving lunatics. They also share an authoritarian bent. If we let them, they will destroy the world in their effort to erradicate about five types of plants which they deem as God's little mistakes and their cross to bear. They're that crazy.

By the way, I did notice that Maia mentions this website in her book. :nworthy:



"

Oh my, yes! And she called this brave!  :rofl: I told her no, this is reckless, foolhearty and maybe Quijotian. Listing it in a respectable, mainstream book w/ her name on it, now that was brave!

Happy hunting. Oh, and Welcome, friend!  :wave:

Ministers say that they teach charity. That is natural. They live on hand-outs. All beggars teach that others should give.
--Robert G. Ingersoll, American politician and lecturer

[Antigen]

On 2006-03-24 10:05:00, researcher1 wrote:

"Why arent my quotes showing up?"

Because you had the option to include signatures unchecked. I took the liberty of reversing that since I was in there poking around anyway.

It (the Bible) is full of interest. It has noble poetry in it; and some clever fables; and some blood-drenched history; and some good morals; and a wealth of obscenity; and upwards of a thousand lies.
--Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist

[Dr Fucktard]

By the way, I did notice that Maia mentions this website in her book. :nworthy:

  :silly: :rofl:  :wave: