Losers!

[Anotherscaredmom]

Antigen, I totally agree with you on many many levels.  In fact, and I may have mentioned this before, but my focus in my studies is evolutionary psychology and looking at how many things that are labeled as "disorders" are not disorders at all when looked at from another angle.  And I also feel that we are a culture of fear right now.  If our child doesn't make it into Harvard, we're bad parents.   And god forbid that they shoudl smoke a little pot or have a temper tantrum past the age of two.  We live in an age where elementary school children are sometimes taken out of the school in handcuffs.  We live post-Columbine and post 9/11.  It's a shame that the whole society can't just take a step back and look at what we are doing to kids who just need a little more space or a little more encouragement (and I would definitely err on the side of encouragement).  

That said, while homeschooling offers a temporary respite from my child's stress and being suspended every other week, it is not a long term solution for multiple reasons.  One, I am a single mother and once I graduate in the spring, I will have much less flexibility because I will have to work full time.  Ideally I would like to find something flexible or that I can do from home, but realistically that may not happen.  Another reason is that my gut has been telling me for a long time there is something going wrong with this kid that is beyond the norm.  That is based on a long history of anxiety, OCD behavior, night terrors, trouble sleeping since he was very small.  He has certainly had events in his life that might cause this, but therapy has done little to help, and I've always been understanding.  Even as a baby, he was very different from other kids.  

Let me go off track for a sec.  When he was little I didn't mind one little bit that he wasn't like other boys.  Just so someone coming in without having my other posts doesn't jump to the conclusion that I'm trying to make a round peg out of a square one.  

The fact is, his differences make him suffer in many arenas.  But because he's bright, it is assumed by everyone it is just behavior problems.  I see now that most of the programs we are talking about here would do little to help with that.  But they DO prey on desparate parents.  I'm also trying to help him head off problems as an adult.  Many of the males on his father's side and my mother's side have had difficulty maintaining jobs and families due to their "behavior".  I think a lot of them were in need of earlier  intervention.  

Whew.

[Deborah]

Ginger, thanks for the reminder of how similar RTCs actually are to PSs.
Comparing RTCs to PSs is like comparing Abu Garib to jail.
PSs don?t house kids 24/7 and are not in the business of ?treating? so-called ?mental disorders? (yet, anyway).
Wouldn?t it be more accurate to compare them to other lock-down institutions, say like juvie or jail or other out-patient interventions?
What percentage of kids are dx?d with PTSD or have recurrent nightmares or require therapy upon graduation from public school, juvie, or RTCs?
RTCs are considered and sold as intervention- providing ?therapy? and a controlled environment to keep kids safe.
Where you might see take-downs on a very rare occasion in PSs, it is standard practice in RTCs and probably in juvie/jail (not sure about the latter).

How will you determine
1)the total number of kids who have been through programs
2)the total number of preventable injuries
3)the total number of deaths- some don?t make the papers
4)the total number of cases of abuse

Without that data, you can?t compare them to anything. You obviously know the reality-- ?The data on RTC is hard to come by, I tried to gather some up (# graduated,# abused,# died, # doing well, # doing poorly etc) but no studies have been done.?
So how do you propose to collect the data? That?s the primary reason I see this as a moot issue. A waste of time.

Are you aware of this Risk Assessment of Wilderness Programs?
http://www.strugglingteens.com/opinion/ ... ident.html
Excerpts:
The Hartford Courant, in an excellent series on deaths from restraints, was able to locate only two states that kept figures on fatalities in state-licensed and state-operated programs.  [And we know that many (most?) RTCs and Wilderness programs are not licensed.] I had trouble believing this, so checked it out in my own small, responsible and fairly well organized state, Oregon. Sure enough, no one could tell me; the data simply are not centrally reported anywhere in Oregon, nor even tracked by particular agencies for their own clients. Based on the two states (one was New York) that do track fatalities, a statistician hired by the Courant extrapolated an estimate of 50 to 250 residential treatment deaths nationally per year from restraints alone.

For parents and referral sources, perhaps the best risk comparison is with the risks a child runs while living at home. Comparable injury data are hard to come by, but there are good national statistics on fatality rates by age and cause. The overall injury fatality rate for white 15 to 19 year olds is 54.4 per 100,000 population per year, which translates to 0.0015 per 1,000 days, or 1.5 deaths in 1 million days (National Center for Injury Prevention and Control, 1999.) This means that if you have an average adolescent living in your home, their risk of having a fatal accident is about 80 percent what it would be if they were in a NOLS program or, as well as we can estimate, an OBHIC wilderness treatment program.
Based on OBHIC's 1998 data, if one child were to spend 1,000 days in the field with an OBHIC program, a little less than three years, he or she could expect to be injured a little more than once, be ill enough to have to skip daily activities for a full day a little less than once, and would be taken to a doctor's office or hospital for treatment of an injury or illness a little more than once.  [And deaths???] As a parent who has so far survived three adolescents (one to go!), this rate feels to me like about what we've dealt with given healthy, very active kids. From a program perspective, a 50-day program with 7 adolescents in a group could expect a group to have about one injury, one illness, and one evacuation every third 50-day outing.  

Here?s a bit of irony. Cooley had three deaths at his facility after this assessment was released, May 2002- Mar 2003.  
?One injury, one illness, one evacuation every third 50-day outing?, but 3 deaths in less than twelve months?

There?s also the 2001 ST survey  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#56579 that shows they are best at what any lock-down would be successful at.  
And this one on PCS  http://www.strugglingteens.com/archives ... een01.html  that basically states the same.
One big question? if these places are largely 'successful' due to a controlled, structured environment, why can?t parents provide that at home and save their kid the abuses inherent to life in a program?

Here?s one that compares kids who were placed with those who stayed home. http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=903&forum=9  Almost two-thirds (63%) of the children who stayed with their families showed a reduction of clinical symptoms for AD/HD, general anxiety and depression. Only 11% of the children who participated in the residential program showed similar improvement.  One year later, children who stayed at home were less anxious, less depressed and showed fewer symptoms of AD/HD than those who had been enrolled in the 5 day a week residential program.

I think the pertinent questions are: What methods are being employed and are they ethical and desirable. Does the ends justify the means? And here are a few articles on the ills of BM.
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=9&0    http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#46691   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=2745&forum=9
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#79171  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=9&1   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=20#49825   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=10#63727
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#53071    http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#56606  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#53849  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#63964  

It?s no secret that they need more oversight and monitoring, for what good that might provide. The GAO and Office of Inspector General are in your corner. The issue, why isn?t it being done? And would it actually keep kids safe from potential abuse, injury, death, brainwashing?
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#84826   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=0#120163  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#84989

[Deborah]

And while we're comparing...
I like to imagine what our country would be like if all children could have this kind of 'education'
http://www.houstonsudbury.org/about.php#adayinthelife

For those near south Tx, John Taylor Gatto will be giving a lecture there on 14 Jan
Topic: "The Trapped Flea Principle and Other Weapons of Mass Instruction"
Soooo Gatto

[TheWho]

On 2005-12-08 19:47:00, Deborah wrote:

"Ginger, thanks for the reminder of how similar RTCs actually are to PSs.

Comparing RTCs to PSs is like comparing Abu Garib to jail.

PSs don?t house kids 24/7 and are not in the business of ?treating? so-called ?mental disorders? (yet, anyway).

Wouldn?t it be more accurate to compare them to other lock-down institutions, say like juvie or jail or other out-patient interventions?

What percentage of kids are dx?d with PTSD or have recurrent nightmares or require therapy upon graduation from public school, juvie, or RTCs?

RTCs are considered and sold as intervention- providing ?therapy? and a controlled environment to keep kids safe.

Where you might see take-downs on a very rare occasion in PSs, it is standard practice in RTCs and probably in juvie/jail (not sure about the latter).



How will you determine

1)the total number of kids who have been through programs

2)the total number of preventable injuries

3)the total number of deaths- some don?t make the papers

4)the total number of cases of abuse



Without that data, you can?t compare them to anything. You obviously know the reality-- ?The data on RTC is hard to come by, I tried to gather some up (# graduated,# abused,# died, # doing well, # doing poorly etc) but no studies have been done.?

So how do you propose to collect the data? That?s the primary reason I see this as a moot issue. A waste of time.



Are you aware of this Risk Assessment of Wilderness Programs?

http://www.strugglingteens.com/opinion/ ... ident.html

Excerpts:

The Hartford Courant, in an excellent series on deaths from restraints, was able to locate only two states that kept figures on fatalities in state-licensed and state-operated programs.  [And we know that many (most?) RTCs and Wilderness programs are not licensed.] I had trouble believing this, so checked it out in my own small, responsible and fairly well organized state, Oregon. Sure enough, no one could tell me; the data simply are not centrally reported anywhere in Oregon, nor even tracked by particular agencies for their own clients. Based on the two states (one was New York) that do track fatalities, a statistician hired by the Courant extrapolated an estimate of 50 to 250 residential treatment deaths nationally per year from restraints alone.



For parents and referral sources, perhaps the best risk comparison is with the risks a child runs while living at home. Comparable injury data are hard to come by, but there are good national statistics on fatality rates by age and cause. The overall injury fatality rate for white 15 to 19 year olds is 54.4 per 100,000 population per year, which translates to 0.0015 per 1,000 days, or 1.5 deaths in 1 million days (National Center for Injury Prevention and Control, 1999.) This means that if you have an average adolescent living in your home, their risk of having a fatal accident is about 80 percent what it would be if they were in a NOLS program or, as well as we can estimate, an OBHIC wilderness treatment program.

Based on OBHIC's 1998 data, if one child were to spend 1,000 days in the field with an OBHIC program, a little less than three years, he or she could expect to be injured a little more than once, be ill enough to have to skip daily activities for a full day a little less than once, and would be taken to a doctor's office or hospital for treatment of an injury or illness a little more than once.  [And deaths???] As a parent who has so far survived three adolescents (one to go!), this rate feels to me like about what we've dealt with given healthy, very active kids. From a program perspective, a 50-day program with 7 adolescents in a group could expect a group to have about one injury, one illness, and one evacuation every third 50-day outing.  



Here?s a bit of irony. Cooley had three deaths at his facility after this assessment was released, May 2002- Mar 2003.  

?One injury, one illness, one evacuation every third 50-day outing?, but 3 deaths in less than twelve months?



There?s also the 2001 ST survey  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#56579 that shows they are best at what any lock-down would be successful at.  

And this one on PCS  http://www.strugglingteens.com/archives ... een01.html  that basically states the same.

One big question? if these places are largely 'successful' due to a controlled, structured environment, why can?t parents provide that at home and save their kid the abuses inherent to life in a program?



Here?s one that compares kids who were placed with those who stayed home. http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=903&forum=9  Almost two-thirds (63%) of the children who stayed with their families showed a reduction of clinical symptoms for AD/HD, general anxiety and depression. Only 11% of the children who participated in the residential program showed similar improvement.  One year later, children who stayed at home were less anxious, less depressed and showed fewer symptoms of AD/HD than those who had been enrolled in the 5 day a week residential program.



I think the pertinent questions are: What methods are being employed and are they ethical and desirable. Does the ends justify the means? And here are a few articles on the ills of BM.

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=9&0    http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#46691   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=2745&forum=9

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#79171  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... &forum=9&1   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=20#49825   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=10#63727

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#53071    http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#56606  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#53849  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#63964  



It?s no secret that they need more oversight and monitoring, for what good that might provide. The GAO and Office of Inspector General are in your corner. The issue, why isn?t it being done? And would it actually keep kids safe from potential abuse, injury, death, brainwashing?

http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#84826   http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=0#120163  http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... rt=0#84989

"

Wow - great data research -- So it looks like the kids are no more or less safe in a wilderness program than if they stayed home (as far as injury or death).  The RTC do a less effective job at treating disorders AD/HD etc.

So if I had a kid that had a Diagnosed disorder of some type One probably wouldnt want to send them to a RTC.

I think the 3 deaths in 1 year is a bit odd for one facility and if that continued it certainly should be looked at.

Thanks, Deborah, for the links, I will like spending some time going thru them.

[Antigen]

Famjaztique,
  This is just a hunch, but what do you think of these folks? http://www.sudval.org/

  All I know about them is that John Taylor Gatto, with whom I'm quite impressed, has been impressed by them and what they say about themselves in their website. So I don't have any basis to say yes, this is good and safe and just right for your kid (who, of course, I've never met either). But I would be interested in your take on the concept and, if you visit or actually send your son there, how it all turns out.
 

If triangles had a God, He'd have three sides.
--Old Yiddish proverb

_________________
Drug war POW
Straight, Sarasota
`80 - `82

[Anotherscaredmom]

Antigen,

I did look it up last night actually and it looked pretty decent.  And I'm a huge fan of John Taylor Gatto.  I was introduced to him years ago.  

I don't know if it would work for my son or not.  I am honestly mystified about what is going on with him and am anxiously awaiting the neuropsych.  It's like he can't control any impulse whatsoever.  It is very hard to explain here, you would have to spend time with him to get a sense of it.  He is an incredibly unique kid and draws a lot of attention from adults who either love him right away or despise him right away.  

Early this morning he took off again!  I know that he was seen this morning with the same kid who has run from foster care.  His friend tried covering for them but didn't do a very good job.  I am waiting for my daughter to get picked up then I'm going over there.  It's a very weird situation.  I don't think he intends to run away...he didn't take anything with him, we didn't have a fight, he was telling me what he wanted for Christmas....yet at the same time, he keeps sneaking out and taking off with this kid.  I don't get it.  He even gives me information that always leads me to where they are.  He comes home willingly every time, and then as soon as I turn my back he sneaks out again!  

This has been going on for about a week now!  Very strange behavior.  He's been refusing to go to school, has walked out of school.   I've been missing work, and have gotten extensions in all of my classes in order to offer more intensified supervision.  Where I felt "at my wits end" a week ago, I now feel completely stumped!  I get that teens rebel etc, but most know how much they can get away with, or still stay within some range of norm.  I.E. they know they still have to go to school.  My son doesn't seem to care about any aspect of authority or normality, yet at the same time, like I said,  when I find him, he comes home willingly, talks to me (and he could be feeding me a line of BS for all I know), I make clear the consequences for sneaking out and he agrees and then the next second that I'm not looking he takes off.  ??

I should probably be on a different forum, but I think the reason I prefer this one is because many of you were that same teen.  I rebelled too, but when I got caught, I would give it a rest for a while, you know?

[TheWho]

On 2005-12-09 09:31:00, Antigen wrote:

"Famjaztique,

  This is just a hunch, but what do you think of these folks? http://www.sudval.org/



  All I know about them is that John Taylor Gatto, with whom I'm quite impressed, has been impressed by them and what they say about themselves in their website. So I don't have any basis to say yes, this is good and safe and just right for your kid (who, of course, I've never met either). But I would be interested in your take on the concept and, if you visit or actually send your son there, how it all turns out.

 

If triangles had a God, He'd have three sides.

--Old Yiddish proverb

_________________

Drug war POW

Straight, Sarasota

`80 - `82"

Great school and a good concept.  I toured Sudbury Valley a few years ago and it seems to be a good fit for kids who dont do well (for whatever reason) in a class room environment.  There is tons of freedom, you can sign up for classes and work at your own pace towards college prep or G,E.D. first.  You can just hang out and play guitar if you want to some days, but you must stay on campus.  Lots to do, books everywhere,plenty of people to talk to etc.

[Anonymous]

Famjaztique,
Is there a compromise that could be worked out? Teens are very social typically. He also may feel some empathy or need to be with the boy, to provide some companionship, if he feels bad about the boy's situation. If that's the case, you wouldn't want to punish his demonstration of caring.
The way I'd approach it is to tell him that I didn't want the role of policing his activities but needed to have some mutual agreements with him. Then ask if we could work out a schedule which included some social time with the boy (preferably at our house) along with some self-study, personal chores, etc.
You know what he doesn't want. Do you know or does he know what he wants? What excites him.
How about asking him to do a report which would require some research and thought about his future. He could explore what kind of lifestyle he desires and how much income he'll need to support it. The cost of housing, utilities, food, etc. Check internet and local newpaper. What work would he enjoy doing. This in itself could take weeks if you take him to the career counseling center at the college. Thousands of jobs to look through. What level of education is required, etc, etc.
I'm guessing that he's just trying to get his 'needs' met which appear to be in conflict with your's. And could benefit from discovering his passions.

[Anotherscaredmom]

I had had such a conversation with him and thought we had come to a mutual agreement.  It wasn't a few hours later when he took off and he is still missing.  There is a whole group of kids that are covering for this one kid.  He has now been gone (my son) since last night with no contact.  I've notified police, all other parents that I know of, and have toured the town, made visits to his friends houses, and went to the local mall and all other hangouts.  He was last seen this morning with the kid.  I have given him every choice to make decisions with me.  And I know he does feel empathy towards this kid who has run away, but he isn't going about it even remotely responsibly.  

And don't forget that we live in an age where parents are held responsible for their kids behavior.  Even on this forum!  So I could very well be looking at DSS invading our home because of his actions.  And because I think he might have an emotional disorder that has not yet been uncovered, I am extremely worried what he would do in a foster care or juvenile situation.  

When I started looking into RTC's, which is how I landed here, I was hoping to find something that would provide very tight structure with a therapeutic element.  He's refusing to see his therapist, who he LIKES, refusing to try medications, and refusing to enter into compromises with me.  He is rapidly removing all of our choices.  I could take the stance that he just needs to outgrow the phase...well that didn't happen with his father.  I could try more freedom....already done it.  I could try policing him...doesn't work.  He waits for the first moment he knows that I'm busy, i.e. HAVE to go to work or class eventually, and need to care for his sister as well.  Grounding doesn't work.  I've offered alternative schools of his choosing, including homeschooling, which he is clearly blowing off by taking off.

This is where parents get desparate.  And I am.

[BuzzKill]

I want to try and give you a word of encouragement.
Both my kids were frequent run aways.
I know the fear - the overwhelming anxiety involved with a run away situation. And yes, its true there are real reasons for anxiety. However - these kids are usually fine.

Like your son, my daughter has some emotional issues. I had many of the same concerns you have with your son. When my girl took off - she really took off. She once left school and took off with the rainbow people (a cross between gypsies and hippies) and lived for a couple months in the national forest in Illinois - I think it was.

Another time, she actually ran off with the circus.
Turned up in Mississippi.

Another time, she left for a "job" painting murals in New York, and instead ended up in Arizona. Lived for awhile in a abandoned buss.

All of these episodes where heart stopping for me. I have spent entire months crying - just not able to stop.

But she is fine. Never came to any real harm at all. Once she got to a point where no one was chasing her to bring her home - she quite running off.

My son was a little different. He never left the neighborhood. I knew exactly were he was. But the people there lied to me and the cops were useless.
It made me angry, but I wasn't as worried. Not that there weren't reasons for worry - there were - but it helped knowing, more or less, were he was.

Nothing made much difference with my daughter.

With my son, there were some things that might have helped.

I got good results on one occasion, by making a wanted poster  - I took his school picture and scanned it and printed out a bunch of "posters" - If seen, call JCPD - listed the case number the cops gave me, and the cops phone number. I put them up in all his hang outs spots. The pizza hutt, the KFC, and so on. He was home before I was. Ran home in the pouring rain, just as soon as the first one was posted. The "network" gave him a heads up, I guess.

Another time, at the holidays, I used a present he wanted badly to manipulate him. Told the girl whose house he was at, if he didn't get his ass home, it was going back to the store. On that occasion, I had it set up with YMCA's shelter house for him to go there. And That might be an option to consider. They really do have a good sort of situation set up. They provide food and shelter free of charge to the kid; but the kid has to attend school or take GED classes - and they have to attend counseling with therapist provided by the Y - also free of charge. If its an older kid who doesn't want to return home, they work on independent living skills. If a younger teen, or one who wants to go home, they work on helping the family figure out ways to get along - family counseling.
If this sounds like something that might help, just call your local YMCA and ask about their shelter house program. If they are in your area - your son can access them by going into any designated "safe place" and calling them. They will go get him. This can help if you have a kid who will not go near the parents.

If you decide you really need to look into an RTC, then look at ISAC's site, and read over their warning signs  - so you'll have a better idea how to evaluate the various choices.
http://www.ISACcorp.org

[Anonymous]

Desperate MOM,

Ive been where you are .We went the RTC route and it was the biggest mistake. If I could do it over and difeerntly I would tell the kid to go if he wants to.

The moment he knows you are not going tobe worrying yourself over his decision ,he may get it. Some times it takes maturing . i know this is a scary concept to detach and allow the kid to do as he wants(not in your house)hell be back.Sooner than you realize. Stop worrying and hell be ok.

I wish more than I can say I had just let my son do as he thought he wanted to do.He would have been fine. He was seriously hurt in the "school" went sent him to for "HELP."

Try Alonon they help you learn to detach with love. I've seen it work with parnets whose kids were using substances and they were worried to desperation.  Dont do any thing really, really dumb.

[Anonymous]

Can't legally let the kid go unless he is 17.  Before that parents are liable for any and all criminal activity and can be charged for the crimes or abandonment.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-12-10 06:30:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Can't legally let the kid go unless he is 17.  Before that parents are liable for any and all criminal activity and can be charged for the crimes or abandonment."

Well you better lock them up fast, before YOU get in trouble!  :roll:

[AtomicAnt]

On 2005-12-09 13:44:00, famjaztique wrote:

"I had had such a conversation with him and thought we had come to a mutual agreement.  It wasn't a few hours later when he took off and he is still missing.  There is a whole group of kids that are covering for this one kid.  He has now been gone (my son) since last night with no contact.  I've notified police, all other parents that I know of, and have toured the town, made visits to his friends houses, and went to the local mall and all other hangouts.  He was last seen this morning with the kid.  I have given him every choice to make decisions with me.  And I know he does feel empathy towards this kid who has run away, but he isn't going about it even remotely responsibly.  



And don't forget that we live in an age where parents are held responsible for their kids behavior.  Even on this forum!  So I could very well be looking at DSS invading our home because of his actions.  And because I think he might have an emotional disorder that has not yet been uncovered, I am extremely worried what he would do in a foster care or juvenile situation.  



When I started looking into RTC's, which is how I landed here, I was hoping to find something that would provide very tight structure with a therapeutic element.  He's refusing to see his therapist, who he LIKES, refusing to try medications, and refusing to enter into compromises with me.  He is rapidly removing all of our choices.  I could take the stance that he just needs to outgrow the phase...well that didn't happen with his father.  I could try more freedom....already done it.  I could try policing him...doesn't work.  He waits for the first moment he knows that I'm busy, i.e. HAVE to go to work or class eventually, and need to care for his sister as well.  Grounding doesn't work.  I've offered alternative schools of his choosing, including homeschooling, which he is clearly blowing off by taking off.



This is where parents get desparate.  And I am."

Based on all of your posts in this topic, one thing is obvious. In spite of your son's behavior, you are still very much a valued part of his life. You are providing his anchor and safety net through all of this. In fact, you are apparently the only anchor and safety net he has. His father is not present and you have not mentioned any extended family involvement.

Keep in mind that if you send him to a facility that limits or prevents his contact with you, you be removing the only solid adult in his life and the only solid thing he has left to stand on. Such an act would be traumatic and could damage his ability to trust and relate to other people for the rest of his life. I would imagine he is not happy to have one parent absence himself. I cannot imagine how removing the other one (even temporarily) could possibly help.

[BuzzKill]

Your so right Atomic Ant - but from my experience, I can suggest what a parent with a run away is most concerned with is keeping them safe - keeping them alive. When you are living in fear of what might happen to your kid who is out in the "wilderness" you just feel desperate to get them in a situation where they can't run off. Home isn't it. But still, you are right, and your advice is sound, and if this mom does decide she needs an RTC - I hope it will be one close to home and that she will be visiting very frequently.