When did the Seed close on SR84?

[wtaylorg]

I remember being on the gate(door) from 82-85, and every once in a while a car would pull up and someone would get out of the car and take pictures of the Seed. While this was happening I would get Bob W. as I was told to do in a situation like this. I was almost always told by Bob to run out to the gate and find out what they wanted. It seemed like this person was always from Florida Dept of Trans.? Something like that.
Anyways, I guess the idea of the pictures was that DOT or some agency was wanting to run I95 where SR84 existed. Did this ever happen? And if so When? And if so, where did the Seed go after that? I have heard refeernces to Andrews Ave. Isn't that the place where the Seed originated.
Considering that Art has the ""gift" of instant awareness. shouldn't he have known that they were going to be kicked out of SR84?

[Antigen]

A few years back I did an archive search on Art and The Seed. I found something to do w/ the DOT and eminent domain. Didn't want to spend the money (buck a page, I think) to print out the whole thing. But I think it was just as you say. They did widen SR-84 and made it a limited access part of the interstate system. It's I-75, though, not 95.

And they did move back to the S. Andrews building. I've driven by there before and seen the sign.

The notion that a radical is one who hates his country is naive and usually idiotic. He is, more likely, one who likes his country more than the rest of us, and is thus more disturbed than the rest of us when he sees it debauched. He is not a bad citizen turning to crime; he is a good citizen driven to despair.


--H.L. Mencken

[Ft. Lauderdale]

88 or 89 I think. I wasn't around either. They were on Broward Blvd. for a year or two.  
Before moving back to Andrews Avenue.

[Stripe]

The old four lane divided SR 84 that ran next to the canal is gone.  What's there now is a 8 lane east/west freeway called I-595 (Alligator Alley connecting Ft. Lauderdale with Naples, FL).  

The canal and homes are still there, but the Seed building and property on the south side of the highway is gone - it's just pavement now. I was down there yesterday on some business.   That large, gold pyramid is still there, and the small lake (rock pit) that was near the turnpike exit is now huge (several acres in size)SR 84 still on the south side of the highway, its just a parallel access road on the south side of the highway.

[Anonymous]

Somewhere after '87 we moved from the St. Road. 84 building. I will never forget helping to fill up all those trucks late at night. We moved from that big, cold feeling warehouse to a small clinic-like office building that looked like a duplex. It use to be a dentist's offce right on Broward Blvd. There was hardly a parking lot, and if you can imagine the rap room was so small that if you were on the front row staff was literally in your face. Also, there was only one bathroom, unisex style. It was really like sitting in someone's apartment living room, where everyone sat in the group except the one staff member leading the rap in front. Even before the move, they stopped having staff members sit on the side of the group, they all sat in the group with the oldcommers (I guess to make the group look bigger). They would sit up front only when they led a rap. Then after about 2 years, we finally moved out of the samll clinic back to the Andrews Ave. house. Art and staff seemed to love it there since I guess that was the beginning of everything, but honestly the place was scary 'cause when you were in there you really got a good close look at people's faces and could tell that they were just a bunch of kid looking adults that had gotten a lot older as time passed. This was not normal. The building was a classical art deco architecture, but a hauntingly creepy old house.

[90's Guy]

By the way Wtaylorg, I was the one that walked what seemed like an eternity with you, passing out the Sound Mort. flyers. Remember how we got chased by dogs? Also, you and I were secretly in love wiith Madonna, but couldn't talk about her since she was so taboo in the group in the early 80's (so we would sing her songs all day, Borderline, Like a Virgin, Material Girl. . .)You would talk about how sexy she was, and so would I. I always remember one of the staffmembers tearing  her apart going on about what a "Whor.. that Madonna is." By the way I saw her recently with my boyfriend in Miami. She is still the Diva she always was in the 80's. She has slowed down a little but still has it in her. Anyway, you were always a super nice guy, enjoyed spending time with you. Hope all is well.

[wtaylorg]

On 2005-02-11 08:55:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Art and staff seemed to love it there since I guess that was the beginning of everything, but honestly the place was scary 'cause when you were in there you really got a good close look at people's faces and could tell that they were just a bunch of kid looking adults that had gotten a lot older as time passed. This was not normal. The building was a classical art deco architecture, but a hauntingly creepy old house."

By kid looking adults, do you mean they (staff) tried to look young, but were just a bunch of middle aged people trying to seem cool and hip? Was there ever the idea that maybe they (group) needed to end this thing (Seed), which after reading many of these posts seemed to have really lost it's steam a long time ago? It seems long before I was even there. It must have seemed  pathetic to watch these people try to indentify with newcomers, when the world had passed Art & Co by many yrs ago.

[Anonymous]

I remember when I first came into the Seed we were at the STRD 84. I remember being on gate duty and running out to the gate every time a car would show up. I used to enjoy when Bob W would tap me on my shoulder and would ask me to go outside and weed the front flower beds or paint something cause after a while I would get very freaked out in the raps.
 
  I can remember working and preparing the building on broward Blvd so we could move in but I have no recollection of the actual move itself. I cut alot of lawns while I was at the Seed and I got to say I had a good time with the guys I worked with. I still remember them all even after all these years. At night I worked at the insurance company entering data for a while. I still.
 
  I got chewed out by Staff once for getting into a fight with some asshole that started giving me a hard time. Bob W told me this had  not happened in years and I had to learn to control my Latin TEMPER.

 Hey Wtaylor I still have a Cal Ripken drawing you made for me packed away in a box in my closet with some other things I kept from my days at the Seed. Every once in a while I'll drive by on I-595 and without failure as I get to the area where the old Seed was I seem to go back in time and remember my times at the Seed.
 The STRD84 Seed I believe was where the Signature Gardens is at now because I can remember during the afternoon rap when I was a newcomer looking out past the rap leader past the truckers shed, past the trees into the power station.

[cleveland]

These posts bring back so many memories. Here's where we spent our youth, sitting at the gate or door on SR84, weeding the flower beds, painting the awnings, doing night duty. Remember staying the night, doing rounds around the building every 20 minutes, eating some take out sub that gave you rank morning breath, watching the sun go down? Sometimes Dave R. would play the old piano in the back room and we would sing. Sometimes Jeff P. would have a guitar and we'd sing Teach Your Children well. We thought we were saving the world. I can't say it was a waste, because of what I learned about friendship, but what I learned about the world was all false. The only thing the seed taught was obedience to authority, and that is fine in the military but not so good in the real world, unless you have the willingness to challenge that authority when you find it to be wrong. Anyway, I can't believe that building is gone now I am sad to have my youth disappear...



_________________
Wally Gator[ This Message was edited by: cleveland on 2005-02-14 09:18 ]

[Anonymous]

I hold those memories to be very special. I got to say being one who did get to live my youth open and free and did more than my fair share of fucking off.
 I remember what I learned and how I learned very fondly. I had some good times with some good friends and even though it seems like all this happened another life time ago the lessons I learned there is what I use to this very day. I don't hold any resentment toward the Seed or anyone from the Seed on the contrary that is where I really grew up.
 The Seed was'ent perfect which became very apparent in my later years there but, it sure tried to be.

  Sometimes I wish I could go back to a better and simpler time.

[GregFL]

You can.


Go sign yourself in
one of these seed copycat programs....they can all be traced back to the seed and use substantially similar techniques, updated to include all the necessary bells and whistles in order to get insurance to pay the way...



http://www.growingtogether.com/

http://www.kidshelpingkids.com/

http://www.safeorlando.com/index.html

http://www.aarc.ab.ca/

http://www.pathwayfamilycenter.org/





Luv Ya!

 :grin:

[Anonymous]

Or a facsimile there of ?

[GregFL]

I don't really think the seed strived for "perfection" per se anon, but instead strived for a perfect closed society;  practicing perfect idolization of Art Barker. It strove to protect him and themselves from the reality of the world. It strove to support the very transparent lies they were telling themselves about the definition of honesty, commitment, and friendship, and strove to remain glaringly naively idealistic even as the reality of Art's imperfection, mortality and weaknesses were slipping in.

 very different things.

Someone had to figure somehow Art couldn't beat everyone at softball at 70 years old. people had to realize "awareness" really meant closing your eyes to reality and telling yourself a myth based in mysticism. And people had to see other's profiting off of the devotees' dedication to idealistic perfection, sipping iced tea in their air conditioned paid for houses as these poor saps mowed lawns, washed cars and cleaned other people's houses in order to gain status in the group.

The whole thing was a sham, and I feel for those of you that fell for it for so long.

[echothis]

I agree with you Greg!!!!
 ::bigsmilebounce::  ::bigsmilebounce::

[wtaylorg]

"Someone had to figure somehow Art couldn't beat everyone at softball at 70 years old. people had to realize "awareness" really meant closing your eyes to reality and telling yourself a myth based in mysticism. And people had to see other's profiting off of the devotees' dedication to idealistic perfection, sipping iced tea in their air conditioned paid for houses as these poor saps mowed lawns, washed cars and cleaned other people's houses in order to gain status in the group.

The whole thing was a sham, and I feel for those of you that fell for it for so long."

I agree very much with what you're saying Greg. I have read here where it seems some people are getting misty eyed with their recollections of staying the night at the Seed, gardening that kind of stuff. They are failing to remember the place as it was. The Seed was a place where you couldn't take a crap without asking for permission. Is this right?
I was there from 82-85, and during that time my grandmother passed away. I asked them permission to go the funeral, as I had to ask them permission to do anything( take a piss, buy a sandwhich). They said they would get back to me. "get back to me?" To them my Grandmothers funeral was not as important as Art & staff going to the Bagel Nosch for lunch, or one of those meaning less softball games ou tin the back field, where Bob W. instructed you to "pitch it so Art could hit it".
I am glad that they decided I could go to the funeral after the 3 days that I kept my family waiting for the answer so they could make their plans.
All that ever mattered to them was their own stuff!
I would rather deal with life's trials and tribulations, the up's and down's, then to be hanging out at some mostly abandoned building not getting in on the richness that life offers. We traded our souls to be at the Seed. That is not an OK thing for me today as I can love and am loved.