Author Topic: The ring  (Read 32482 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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The ring
« on: September 04, 2002, 04:56:00 AM »
I wonder... was it to teach other people a lesson...or was it more for staffs benefit....so they could see who the really strong people were...the people who would actually pose more of a threat... not the ones getting their ass kicked in the ring....but the ones doing the ass-kicking...
i went in the ring....i'll never forget it as long as i live.................
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Offline pennymck

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« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2002, 04:27:00 PM »
I hated the ring. I never went in it, nor volenteered. I don't understand how everyone could keep cheering on the line of people who would go against that one guy. It was totally wrong, and how it was ever allowed in the first place legally or any other way is totally beyond me.
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Offline davbetz

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« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2003, 07:08:00 AM »
In 1982, at Elan 7, I had a friend die after going into the ring. It was always a no win situation, putting new people in to "modify" the behavior of 1 individual. I think, like most things there, it was used as a deterrant. Another cheap ploy to get people to submit. Only in this case it wasn't cheap, a 16 year old died......

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing
--Edmund Burke

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Offline davbetz

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« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2003, 07:09:00 AM »
In 1982, at Elan 7, I had a friend die after going into the ring. It was always a no win situation, putting new people in to "modify" the behavior of 1 individual. I think, like most things there, it was used as a deterrant. Another cheap ploy to get people to submit. Only in this case it wasn't cheap, a 16 year old died......

Whoever kindles the flames of intolerance in America is lighting a fire underneath his own home.
--Harold E. Stassen, 1947

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Offline Matt C. Hoffman

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« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2003, 08:56:00 PM »
Dave

Could you tell this board a little more about this incident . Who was running the ring ,which director(s) were present ,etc,etc.

On a personal level I am appalled at this incident . A state investigation at that time was certaintly warranteed .Did ONE happen .What in the hell happened!?

elan has got some really dirty little secrets,obviously this is one of them

Shame on the state of Maine ,shame on elan .

Best wishes to you Dave .

Matt
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2003, 03:35:00 AM »
ya the ring ,, how many rounds did j. deegan go,, 23??and tell me honestly, how many women were givin chest protectors???it was a way to find out whose dangerous,, and also just another tool to break you...i  wasnt there when that guy died,, but i remember the house beat 1  person till he projectile vomited across the dining room,,,then 1 more round for that...alice dunn is a sick cunt :evil:  :evil:
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Offline GregFL

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« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2003, 11:50:00 AM »
So very interesting.

Are you Elan survivors aware that Art Barker instituted  the ring at The Seed Cincinatti and Ft Lauderdale but not at other locations?

If you don't know, Art Barker is the grandaddy of the entire Seed/straight/Kids/safe line of treatment centers.

No laws, however stringent, can make the idle industrious, the thriftless provident, or the drunken sober
--Samuel Stiles

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Offline GregFL

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« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2003, 11:50:00 AM »
So very interesting.

Are you Elan survivors aware that Art Barker instituted  the ring at The Seed Cincinatti and Ft Lauderdale but not at other locations?

If you don't know, Art Barker is the grandaddy of the entire Seed/straight/Kids/safe line of treatment centers.

Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its
best state is but a necessary evil ---in its worst state an
intolerable one; for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same
miseries by a government, which we might expect in a country without
government, our calamities is heightened by reflecting that we
furnish the means by which we suffer!


http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0679433147/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'>Thomas Paine, Common Sense

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Offline davbetz

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« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2003, 12:59:00 PM »
Sorry it's taken me awhile to reply, not online that much anymore.
The incident I'm reffering to happened during the Christmas holidays in 1982. The resident who died was Phil Williams, a 16 year old from the state of Maine. Unfortunatly, Phil was a ward of the state, because his father was in jail for killing his mother. Phil was a Coordinator Trainee, and started complaining of having headaches. The staff felt that he was malingering, and doin this just so he didn't have to deal with the book (ie. give haircuts). This esculated to the point where he was GM'd and put in the ring for reacting during GM.(for those that thought the ring was only used for people who were violent, think again)After going 3 rounds, I think, hard to remember after over 20 years, Phil went unconscious and started vomitting profusely. After laying on the floor for around an hour,The "Staff" decided he should be brought to hospital. As for who these staff were, I'm sorry, but I cannot remember. It was a weekend and the regular house staff were not there, that much I remember. For what Director, there 'prolly wasn't one there.It was common practice that GM and Rings to be held with just whatever staff was on duty, no director required.
The following Monday, that hack of a nurse they had, came in to tell the house that what Phil died from was an enbolism and that he 'prolly would have died anyways, regardless of the ring (pretty convienent for Elan, I imagine)
Myself, 2 other residents and a staff member did go to his funeral. I'm glad Elan showed this amount of respect.
As for an investigation, I doubt there even was one. Noone ever came to house in an official capacity and asked questions of the residents. This is most likely due to he had no family to push the issue.
I would like to think that if Phil had recieved proper madical treatment prior to being in the ring, maybe he would have been ok. But this is something I'll never know.

Guard with jealous attention the public Liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that Jewel. Unfortunately, Nothing will Preserve it but downright Force. Whenever you Give Up that Force, you are ruined.....The Great Object is that every man be armed.....Everyone who is able may have a gun.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1888952229/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'>- Patrick Henry

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Offline Matt C. Hoffman

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« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2003, 02:22:00 PM »
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2003, 01:02:00 AM »
give up Matt you will never be able to prove a thing................... is just how it is
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2003, 02:18:00 AM »
dont ever give up matt, one way or another "it all comes out in the wash" personally i cant wait til the spin cycle starts :wave:
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Offline jackie

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« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2003, 02:38:00 AM »
i still have nitemares and daymares no less about the ring..........1st time i was in it i was 13 years old against sally b, she said that i hit her when she was trying to put makeup on me for a costume, as i remember it, i tried to brush her hand away from my face, but oh well, i remember that i would fight back and when i was pushed or knocked outside the ring, people would push me back in and i heard people say quit fighting cause if you quit fighting it will end but if you fight it will keep going......
Another time i was in the ring wendy w broke my nose in the elan 3 dining room, it was a 3 or four house gm, i can't remember which, i cant remember if i went more rounds with somebody else or not but i know when the blood started coming out my nose she stopped fighting and started crying........
Another time, i was put in the ring with andrea r, she went on a visit with me with either my mom or my dad, im thinkin my dad tho, she came back and told them that i acted like a spoiled brat another 3 house gm, i dont remember specifics, but my dad and me talked about it like last year and he told me that as far as he remembered she was the one acting like the spoiled brat........
Another time i was in elan four, im not sure why i got put in the ring this time but i think it was because i was making people chase me around the compound outside (i was a corner person then) and i pissed some people off, so anyway i know i went like at least five rounds, robin w, karen q, dawn m,maryjane h,and judy h i think,sandy n,  i know i went rounds with a couple of them at least twice and when no more girls wanted to fight they threatened to put mark r in with me, i talked to him a couple years ago and he told me that he still remembers that and that he was like no way am i going in with a girl....i remember jeff g kept asking me why i was so mad and it was almost like he was getting a kick out of it.....

people say that the ring was for bullies and for people who physically hurt others there, i know i was in the ring more times than i can remember, but these instances here specifically, unless im wrong i dont think i was bullying anyone or hurting anyone physically......and i always thought it was particularly cruel how some people just curled up and they still got the crap beat out of them, or told that they were a piece of shit, no wonder so many people have comitted suicide, gotten into drugs or just plain wanted to stop living.......but what the hell its all in the name of treatment
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ackie

Offline Paul St. John

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« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2003, 02:54:00 PM »
Quote
i pissed some people off, so anyway i know i went like at least five rounds, robin w, karen q, dawn m,maryjane h,and judy h i think,sandy n, i know i went rounds with a couple of them at least twice and when no more girls wanted to fight


LOL!!, Jackie, you fought all those chicks in one straight run?


 :nworthy:

Paul
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2003, 03:32:00 PM »
I was in the corner for refusing to cooperate as a shotdown.I was determined not to accept being shotdown because someone admitted to some bogus guilt that they so da with me.Anyway Rosenberg was the director of our house and saw to it that my s.p.'s were people i did not get along with nor did i like.
After about a week of sitting in the corner i was fed up with having these people sit with me so i acted out like any other corner person, messing up the office and tearing down production.I was placed in restraints for my actions only to come out and do it all over again.
Finally a general meeting ring was called and I was chosen to be placed in the ring with another student that was sure to dominate me.At this point he was putting on the gloves and I was told to put on mine and if i refused they would force me to put them on.I know I had one shot and opportunity to express my hostility towards Rosenberg so without any thought or emtion I stood up and sung with everything I had and hit Marc right in the face, I cold clocked him and he went down and out.I was emmidiatly restained by several students and taken back to the coordinators office to sit in the corner.
I hit Marc so hard that they had to call the nurse over to revive him, they helped marc walk over to the nurses office and I laughed my ass off at him, calling him all sort of names.
Later that day a three house gm was called and they gave me this huge g.m., Joe Ricci also attended and said if i ever were to lay my hand on anyone again that I would be thrown out and sent to jeuvinal detetion.
Months later down the road I started to do what
I had to do so I could get ouit of there, Marc never fucked with me again and had said not more then 10 words to me for my last remaining time there.
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