Magnolia Christian Center... OWNED..

[Anonymous]

If Kevin August made it through his confinement at the WWASP facility "with no problems" then what's his problem with WWASP? ?

There's a lot of reasons for his ANTI-WWASP stance.

And there should be A REASON that Kevin August would never want another child sent to a program!

ONE REASON: is no child should be hit with a wooden paddle!

[jayson]

I attended a school where use of a paddle was a regular event. Most boys got paddled at some point in Jr. High and again at some point in High School... not all, but most. Actually, I can't imagine anyone made it though two years of PE without getting paddled. (The Coaches paddled more than any one else and they usually did it publicly, which even at the time we knew was a violation of the letter of the rules -- but everyone knew it happened and no one objected.)

"Licks" as we called them usually consisted of 3 swats. Sometimes you'd get just one. Really get in trouble and you could, in theory, I think, get as many as 10. I never heard, however, of anyone getting 10... or at least not that I believed.

I remember getting 3 licks on at least a couple of occasions. I was far from a "bad" kid, but I also got bored easily and it got me into trouble. It hurt like hell and left light bruises on my butt that lasted two to three days. When I got five licks once (for "fighting" -- which consisted of me getting punched in the gut by another guy who was angry at me for some reason I now can't remember), my butt had a dark black bruise right across the sit spot that took almost a week to fade. When I sat down for the next day or so, it was painful. Which, actually, I remember the Vice Principal promising me. I quote: "I intend to make sure you remember not to fight in my school every time you sit down for the rest of the week." Promise made. Promise kept -- more or less.

I also witnessed guys getting paddled in gym. Most guys would have eyes filled with tears after being paddled. Sometimes, they would yell out loud. Most tried to tough it out. Occasionally, someone would stand up  and grab his butt or run away from the paddle and the Coach would have some of the bigger, more athletic kids drag the kid back for the rest of his punishment plus one or two for running.

I know girls sometimes got paddled... but not nearly as much as boys. And the public paddling was in gym, which was gender-segregated. (Which was, evidently, a somewhat  old fashioned custom my school kept after others gave it up.)

Now, having said all that... and acknowledging that hitting kids as a way of teaching them something is, in my opinion, ineffective at best and abusive at worst....

My school was a high performing public high school. My Middle School (or Jr. High, whatever) was somewhat less high performing, but still catered primarily to a middle-class, regular student body. This was not a "program" school. And, yes, this still goes on, to a greater or lesser degree, in many public schools in this country.

I'm not in any way trying to say that what is happening is okay. I'm just trying to point out that this practice is far more widespread than you seem to think. 22 states still permit corporal punishment in schools.

I guess I'm just saying that you can't expect everyone to be on the same page as you with regard to corporal punishment (ie. hitting kids). Which is shame, but is the real context in which you are trying to persuade others as to the abusive nature of these schools.

I hope this post is taken in the spirit in which it is offered. I've seen what you all can do when you don't like a post.

 :beat:

[Oscar]

Thank you for your reply.

I believe that the use of corporal punishment is reduced, but there is long way to go. The most important shift came when parents began so sue the schools. If my boy was assaulted and just defended himself I would sue if the police so to say acted as police and judge, but fortunately it is forbidden to use corporal punishment in my country. (Even me as parent will land in jail if I hit my children, which I also find OK).

Project Nospank has been fighting the use of corporal punishment everywhere. A source we also have used when to find articles among the area we target is World Corporal Punishment Research. The last one includes a number of student handbooks from various schools which have not updated their policies to this millennium.

[Eliscu2]

:timeout:

[Oz girl]

I attended a school where use of a paddle was a regular event. Most boys got paddled at some point in Jr. High and again at some point in High School... not all, but most. Actually, I can't imagine anyone made it though two years of PE without getting paddled. (The Coaches paddled more than any one else and they usually did it publicly, which even at the time we knew was a violation of the letter of the rules -- but everyone knew it happened and no one objected.)

"Licks" as we called them usually consisted of 3 swats. Sometimes you'd get just one. Really get in trouble and you could, in theory, I think, get as many as 10. I never heard, however, of anyone getting 10... or at least not that I believed.

I remember getting 3 licks on at least a couple of occasions. I was far from a "bad" kid, but I also got bored easily and it got me into trouble. It hurt like hell and left light bruises on my butt that lasted two to three days. When I got five licks once (for "fighting" -- which consisted of me getting punched in the gut by another guy who was angry at me for some reason I now can't remember), my butt had a dark black bruise right across the sit spot that took almost a week to fade. When I sat down for the next day or so, it was painful. Which, actually, I remember the Vice Principal promising me. I quote: "I intend to make sure you remember not to fight in my school every time you sit down for the rest of the week." Promise made. Promise kept -- more or less.

I also witnessed guys getting paddled in gym. Most guys would have eyes filled with tears after being paddled. Sometimes, they would yell out loud. Most tried to tough it out. Occasionally, someone would stand up  and grab his butt or run away from the paddle and the Coach would have some of the bigger, more athletic kids drag the kid back for the rest of his punishment plus one or two for running.

I know girls sometimes got paddled... but not nearly as much as boys. And the public paddling was in gym, which was gender-segregated. (Which was, evidently, a somewhat  old fashioned custom my school kept after others gave it up.)

Now, having said all that... and acknowledging that hitting kids as a way of teaching them something is, in my opinion, ineffective at best and abusive at worst....

My school was a high performing public high school. My Middle School (or Jr. High, whatever) was somewhat less high performing, but still catered primarily to a middle-class, regular student body. This was not a "program" school. And, yes, this still goes on, to a greater or lesser degree, in many public schools in this country.

I'm not in any way trying to say that what is happening is okay. I'm just trying to point out that this practice is far more widespread than you seem to think. 22 states still permit corporal punishment in schools.

I guess I'm just saying that you can't expect everyone to be on the same page as you with regard to corporal punishment (ie. hitting kids). Which is shame, but is the real context in which you are trying to persuade others as to the abusive nature of these schools.

I hope this post is taken in the spirit in which it is offered. I've seen what you all can do when you don't like a post.

 :beat:

That sounds pretty horrible. The reason why "program" schools that paddle concern me is that in many cases, particularly this one, so many other practices are questionable at best that adding corporal punishment to the mix and being open about makes me question what else the boys may be subjected to. There is a guy called Jordan Ryak who opposes corporal punishment as well as this industry. You might be interested in his sight. He acknowledges that corporal punishment is still an issue in many American public schools. He also taught in australia in the late 70s when some schools still used the "cane" (we never had paddles) and was pretty instrumental in the move to outlaw it. This was in the day when a smack across the hand or knuckles for misbehavior was considered a normal part of school life. As far as i know it was considered a bit pervy for teachers to smack kids asses, though im sure a belting across the hands with a cane was hardly a day at the beach either.
http://www.nospank.net/