Discipline? Why 'because I say so' may work best

[Anonymous]

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Discipline? Why 'because I say so' may work best Feb 23 2005

Gareth Morgan, Western Mail

PARENTS who send their misbehaving children to their room with no explanation may have had the right idea about discipline all along, a new book claims.

It may seem an unfashionable idea - pulling rank and simply saying "because I say so" - but old-fashioned parents may have more success in raising disciplined children, according to the book on modern social patterns.

It is an idea suggested by Nicholas Leonard in Brave New What? which asks why social problems are escalating in the modern world as we all seek to live "happier" lives.

Despite a glut of parenting programmes like Little Angels and Brat Camp, Leonard argues that parents are still struggling, and children are all too often growing into dysfunctional teenagers.

Leonard, a 65-year-old semi-retired journalist from Linlithgow in Scotland, said he was inspired to write the book after looking at his own grandchildren.

"Most parents want their children to like them and to be mature and talk to them as they might a person in a dinner party," he said.

"And that makes it even more difficult for children to interpret their parents."

Little Angels shows how, in the space of only a few weeks, the atmosphere and dynamics within a family can be transformed for the better.

Leonard said that the show's presenter, Dr Tanya Byron, agreed with his views on communication, and he spoke to her at length while writing the book.

Dr Byron said, "I do find that in the case of some parents, children are given too much credibility for their cognitive ability.

"Children are linguistically very sophisticated these days because they have such a lot of access to television.

"But cognitively, is there is a real understanding of the concept of 'I don't want you to do this because ' at the age of three?

"Clearly there is not, because in terms of brain development the structures of the brain that are needed for that kind of rational thought, and abstracting concepts like guilt and blame and responsibility, are way over a three-year-old's head."

Aaron Wagg, owner of Cardiff's Cafe Junior, said he did see parents struggling to reason with their children. The cafe even offers talks on parenting in conjunction with Cardiff University.

"I think we do attract the type of parents that want the best for their children, which is why they are interested in parenting," he said.

He has three young children of his own - Kian, six, Felix, three, and Daisy, two weeks - so he knows the problems first-hand.

"The furthest measures would be sitting alone somewhere or taking away a favourite toy," he said. But as a parent you have to understand that children do not think about responsibility the same way as adults do.

"We have to ask the boys to be quiet every single morning, but you cannot hold it against them."

In his book Leonard also encourages communication through touch - although he admits touching children has become taboo with high-profile abuse cases.

"But children can grow up without any physical contact and that is sad," he said.

Leonard's Brave New What? is a sideways looks at Aldous Huxley's 1932 novel Brave New World, which described a futuristic Utopia where everyone was "happy" on the surface.

Huxley had personal experience of family trauma since his mother died when he was 14, and his elder brother committed suicide.

Britain in the early 21st century is not, of course, an exact replica of the world envisaged by Huxley.

But, like the rulers of that Brave New World, political parties are committed to creating a society that generates the greatest amount of happiness for the largest number of people.

Leonard does not claim to offer answers to all of society's problems in his book. "I ask the questions but I am not laying down prescriptions, I just hope it sparks an interesting debate," he said.
 
So what shows might teach you how to be a good parent?

Brat Camp: The latest addition to the parenting stable takes kids out of their familiar home environment and dumps them in the American wilderness. Some of the punishments dished out can be more shocking than the children's bad behaviour.

Little Angels: The definitive parent show which challenges mums and dads to change their attitude towards their children - in an attempt to drastically improve behaviour.

Supernanny: Jo Frost, right, a highly experienced nanny, comes to the rescue of modern families struggling with unruly kids. These children won't eat or sleep, and take great delight in fighting, biting and driving their parents insane.

Young, Posh and Loaded: The Channel 4 show takes a sideways swipe at parents who spoil their children by revealing the majority of rich kids to be obnoxious and self-obsessed. Or does it just make for good television?

Wife Swap: While this show looks at marriage first and foremost, the kids are usually left most baffled by the dramatic swings in parental behaviour.

[Deborah]

It may seem an unfashionable idea - pulling rank and simply saying "because I say so" - but old-fashioned parents may have more success in raising disciplined children, according to the book on modern social patterns.

***?Because I say so? when overused, ?teaches? nothing. There is the danger of taking this to a fault (authoritarian) which only models that there is a higher authority over the child and discounts the child?s ability to think and learn. Ultimately a disrespectful approach, which teaches the child to act disrespectfully and perpetrate disrespect.
Who feels good about a spouse, friend, or boss who says, ?because I said so?.  It depends on the age of the child, but whether they ?understand? or not, at the very least they deserve to hear the rationale for the parents direction.  

It is an idea suggested by Nicholas Leonard in Brave New What? which asks why social problems are escalating in the modern world as we all seek to live "happier" lives.

***To relegate ?social problems?  to poor parenting is to ignore all the other social ills that contribute to the larger problem, like poverty and unrealistic economic demands, inadequate information, race/class/religious conflicts, inadequate nutrition, public education that is lacking, infringements and disregard of citizen?s rights, etc. it seems that it would be useful to evaluate ?happier lives?.  Some are chasing an unrealistic dream which renders them unable/willing to deal with everyday challenges. Talk about dysfunctional and irresponsible.

Despite a glut of parenting programmes like Little Angels and Brat Camp, Leonard argues that parents are still struggling, and children are all too often growing into dysfunctional teenagers.

***Well he got that right, regarding who?s ?struggling? and who suffers the brunt of it.

"Most parents want their children to like them and to be mature and talk to them as they might a person in a dinner party," he said.  "And that makes it even more difficult for children to interpret their parents."

***Except for the dinner party comment, which implies adult conversation, it is totally possible to have children who like you (doesn?t mean they don?t ever disagree or get angry), who are mature and able to talk to their parents. The child will be a product of what the parent has modelrf (taught). You model respect, you get respect. You model disrespect, you get disrespect. Too many parents want to act disrespectfully and expect respect, wanting little robots who respond to orders and ask no questions or challenge their authority.


Dr Byron said, "I do find that in the case of some parents, children are given too much credibility for their cognitive ability. "Children are linguistically very sophisticated these days because they have such a lot of access to television.
"But cognitively, is there is a real understanding of the concept of 'I don't want you to do this because ' at the age of three?  "Clearly there is not, because in terms of brain development the structures of the brain that are needed for that kind of rational thought, and abstracting concepts like guilt and blame and responsibility, are way over a three-year-old's head."

***Many do not give children credit for their ability to understand, whether it?s ?cognitive? or not. What a disservice. A two year old absolutely knows the difference between a respectful and disrespectful tone or action. If she is spanked or harshly scolded in the morning, it will color the rest of her day. She will mimic what her parent modeled that morning, often terrorizing her playmates, not out of malice, but out of distress. Wouldn?t that be ?cognitive?- to mimic what has been modeled? They learn that the behavior is ?normal?, 'acceptable', whether they have the cognitive ability to rationalize that or not. Alternately, if she has been touched and spoken to with respect, she will mimic that.
Cause and effect comes into play long before rational thought. A six month old only has to bang his head on the wood floor a couple of times before he concludes that it will serve him to be more cautious and to break his fall.
Guilt and blame are not respectful teaching tools for any age. But, a three year, a two year for that matter, can certainly be ?taught? disrespect.
Further, some argue on the one hand that young children don?t have cognitive ability, no rational thought, then how do they justify ?time out? or ?taking away a toy?? Punishments unrelated to the crime that, by their own interpretation, the child should not be able to grok.
In that sense, it?s easy to understand why so many resort to corporal punishment which for a short time can appear to be more ?effective? as a means to an end; but teaches (models) nothing about respect, caring (not guilt or blame),  or ?responsibility?.

In his book Leonard also encourages communication through touch - although he admits touching children has become taboo with high-profile abuse cases.
"But children can grow up without any physical contact and that is sad," he said.

***Good point, and it is sad. Just as, the sad reality of parents who spend 20 minutes a day with their children, and then expect them to act respectfully, talk to them, act ?responsibly?.

But, like the rulers of that Brave New World, political parties are committed to creating a society that generates the greatest amount of happiness for the largest number of people.

***Oh please. The government can?t legislate changes that would result in happier, less ?dysfundtional? kids. Laws DON?T TEACH.  They?d do well to stay out of that arena and focus on things, like more pro-life policies, that could have a positive impact on others happiness.

So what shows might teach you how to be a good parent?

Brat Camp:  
***Wrong. There is absolutely no useful benefit to this parental option. Program parents would be better off hiring Supernanny to come into their homes and show them where they are making mistakes.  Even the name of the program perpetuates the erroneous rhetoric that kids are solely responsible for the way they turn out; that they are malicious; that drastic, austere, and harsh methods are needed to turn the kid around.

Supernanny: Jo Frost, right, a highly experienced nanny, comes to the rescue of modern families struggling with unruly kids. These children won't eat or sleep, and take great delight in fighting, biting and driving their parents insane.

***While this program usually offers some very valuable tips on parenting, I resent how it has been worded here.
Unruly kids? How about distressed kids who have not been taught anything and who have clueless parents. Children don?t ?take great delight? in ?misbehaving?, although I realize some perceive it that way- poor victim parents. My perception of the program is that Jo teaches parents how to be more respectful and consistent, how to play with their children, how to schedule the day so they have more time to play, listen and interact. While ?unruly kids? gets parents to tune-in to the program, the kids are not the problem. The problem is ignorance on the part of the parent which has resulted in their children bouncing off the walls looking for some attention, stability and sanity. Jo pulls no punches in that regard, often bringing a parent to tears and/or anger.

Wife Swap: While this show looks at marriage first and foremost, the kids are usually left most baffled by the dramatic swings in parental behaviour.

***This is a good one too, occasionally. Many parents learn during the swap that their kids are indeed more important than their careers, and how to balance the two.