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526
I have a video tape in my possession of Randall Hinton (former staff at WWASPS's Tranquility Bay in Jamaica) admitting to hog-tying and pepper-spraying a boy whose name I won't mention in the public viewing area.

The tape is a British documentary film, and is very real.

The question before the human race is, whether the God of nature shall govern the world by his own laws, or whether priests and kings shall rule it by fictitious miracles.
--John Adams, U.S. President



_________________
EST (Lifespring) '83
Salesmanship Club '84-'86
Straight, Inc. '86-'88

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. ~ Edmund Burke

527
The ones who are the most vulnerable are the ones who think they can buy their way through anything.

There's euphoria to shopping for a school to send your kid away to, I?m sure. Most parents are sold on the idea that 'program' is the safest most secure thing they could ever decide to do for their child - like buying insurance, a new home or an investment for their future! Most parents admit to feeling relieved once the kid is gone. Like they took care of business for the better of their family and their child. Little do they know what's truly in store for all of them.

These powerful business consultations with "concerned referral agencies" (recruiters) are the type of people who make them sit up and listen. All along thinking they're talking to/or about actual professionals, not quacks and con men selling hocus-pocus for a pretty penny.

Redemption: Deliverance of sinners from the penalty of their sins through the murder of their deity against whom they sinned.
--Ambrose Bierce



_________________
EST (Lifespring) '83
Salesmanship Club '84-'86
Straight, Inc. '86-'88

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. ~ Edmund Burke

528
The Troubled Teen Industry / I'm one of the kids who made the riot
« on: June 16, 2005, 10:06:00 AM »
Many kids in the programs are very behind in school because of the program.

It (the Bible) is full of interest. It has noble poetry in it; and some clever fables; and some blood-drenched history; and some good morals; and a wealth of obscenity; and upwards of a thousand lies.
--Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist


529
Quote
On 2005-06-16 05:24:00, leleNtom wrote:

"what about those kids who are still in csa and arent doing n e thing to get out. like the le vel one refusers. will they be programized when they leave or are they the ones who remain straight. it seems like the more they refuse the more they put on the seminars and stuff. but then again the more they refuse the less anyone pays attention to them.

I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
--Thomas Jefferson, U.S. President, author, scientist, architect, educator, and diplomat

"

Of course what happens around them soaks in inevitably. Just like children growing up watching a father abuse a mother or sibling.  What's harmful is that these are the kids that usually get come down on the hardest for non-conformity to the program. In some of the harder overseas WWASPS programs, those kids are put in solitary confinement, pepper-sprayed, hog-tied, or made to stay in OP for days at a time. The emotional torture of social isolation-punishment, or separation from the group (the feeling of being completely alone) is very damaging to a child's psyche. Will they be programmed? Programmed to hate themselves and feel deep-rooted guilt for not being a part of the group - which lays the ground work for self-destructive or violent behavior. So yes, they will be. There are many different facets to the psychological and physical abuses that occur in the program environment.

So, both types are broken, just in different ways. Their survival instincts kick in, and some kids conform, while others fight it tooth and nail.  That depends on all kinds of things, like age, emotional stability, personality, adaptability?etc.

In the end I think understanding what happened to us is the most valuable thing we can learn. You're very lucky to be able to learn this so soon after it happened to you, leleNtom. I have two friends that were in the program at the same time that I was. Both went through exit counseling afterward. I always remind them how fortunate they were to have been given that opportunity.


Take care, leleNtom.

Drug War tells us everyone's body is common property
to be managed by the central government for our own
good, even if it kills us.  This is Communism!
Drug Policy Foundation of Texas

--Bob Ramsey



_________________
EST (Lifespring) '83
Salesmanship Club '84-'86
Straight, Inc. '86-'88

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. ~ Edmund Burke

530
Quote
On 2005-06-15 11:26:00, leleNtom wrote:

"so0o00o true. i stil feel like for everyone else time moved on and so did they, but even though im 17. since  time stopped when i was sent there and i was 14 and still feel like im 14 in a way. damn... trippy

The mystery of the beginning of all things is insoluble by us, and I for one must be content to remain an agnostic.
--Charles Robert Darwin, English naturalist


"


I definitely know the feeling.

Take care, leleNtom.

Power concedes nothing without a demand. The limit of oppression is determined by the extent of the endurance of the oppressed.
--Frederick Douglas


531
Quote
On 2005-06-15 11:15:00, leleNtom wrote:

"one girl told me im lucky she didnt have long nails cuz  if she did she would have mutalated my pretty face. sick.. im glad im out. im visisting the school in august.. maybe.. but it seems like all the people i liked who were str8 wont be there, so i might not go

Of all the enemies to public liberty, war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other.
--James Madison


"


  :exclaim: "Vacillation between speaking very negatively and very positively about the cultic group [program] or individual."

http://wellspringretreat.org/pro/signs.html

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of it's victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busy-bodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those that torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0802808689/circleofmianithem' target='_new'> C.S. Lewis, God In The Dock


532
Quote
On 2005-06-15 10:18:00, leleNtom wrote:

"o0o0o0o so i guess i should be brainwashed and all cult like now.. worshipping the program and calling it my savior. theres too much time between seminars to get brainwashed... plus most of the kids dont even get through it... so its hard to get brainwashed or whatever it is that people think happen to them.

Legalizing drugs is far from a panacea for all the distress caused by drugs, but it will eliminate most of the profit and corruption from the drug trade.

--Nobel laureate, Gary S. Becker


"


Says the person who started a thread titled: CSA RULES and continues to blindly defend said program.  

for it is a truth, which the experience of all ages has attested, that the people are commonly most in danger when the means of insuring their rights are in the possession of those of whom they entertain the least suspicion.    
--Alexander Hamilton


533
Cults have been defined as "groups that often exploit members psychologically and/or financially, typically by making members comply with leadership?s demands through certain types of psychological manipulation, popularly called mind control, and through the inculcation of deep-seated anxious dependency on the group and its leaders." (Chambers, Langone, Dole, Grice, "The Group Psychological Abuse Scale: A Measure of the Varieties of Cultic Abuse," Cultic Studies Journal, Vol. 11, No.1, 1994, page 105)

The term "mind control," as used above, is very important in understanding what a cult is. Psychologist Robert Lifton identified eight characteristics of mind control, and these are helpful in determining whether or not a group fits the mold of a cult. They are explained below.

Milieu Control - Cults seek control over the members' flow of information and social interaction.

Examples: Sandy is ordered or strongly urged to read only those materials that are produced or sanctioned by the group. Or Steven is urged not to go home for Christmas because there's too much work to do for God at the group's facility, and because his family isn't part of the "true way" and could taint him.

Mystical Manipulation - This involves attributing supernatural influences where they are not present or arranging things to appear miraculous. This is enhanced by the milieu control because other ideas -- ideas that could call into question what seems supernatural -- are absent. Not only that, but because the member is talking only to others in the cult, the supposed miraculous is not only unquestioned, but even praised.

Example: Angela leaves a group and has an auto accident. At the next service Pastor Thomas announces to the congregation that this was God's punishment for Angela's leaving.
Demand for Purity - Unreasonable rules and unreachable standards are imposed upon the member. The world is depicted as black and white with little room for personal decisions based on trained conscience. The individual is more willing to submit to this because outsiders that might question such standards are absent due to the milieu control, and the mystical manipulation makes the group seem to have proof for the validity of its guidelines. Example: Janet is awakened at 3 a.m. to meditate, and when she protests, she is asked, "What's more important; God or sleep?"

Cult of Confession - Sins or wrongdoings, as defined by the group, are to be confessed immediately and thoroughly even though they may be, in reality, quite trivial. An environment of confession is set up by the unreasonable demand for purity.

Example: After several hours of intense guilt, James confesses to his pastor that he had angry feelings toward his group leader and is required to ask forgiveness before the entire congregation.

The Sacred Science - The teachings of the group are viewed as the ultimate, unwavering truth. It is too sacred to be called into question, and those who do are branded as "heretics," "reprobates," "worldly," etc. Mystical manipulation is often an important step in deceiving the member into seeing the doctrine as sacred.

Example: Dan?s guru claims his methods are the fastest (sometimes he says the only) way to achieve enlightenment.

Loading the Language - Lifton calls these "thought-terminating clichés." They are catch phrases loaded with connotation used to stop critical thinking. If an argument is made against the teachings of the group, it and the person who said it may be labeled so that the group members don't consider the merit of the argument.

Example: Everyone who leaves Jerry's group is referred to as a "fall-away," and their criticisms against the group are never addressed.
 
Doctrine Over Person - This characteristic might also be called "Sacred Science" Over Person because that is the doctrine to which it refers. The group's doctrine is always preferred even if it contradicts personal experience or factual history. The individual is only valued in so far as they conform to the doctrine of the group.

Examples: Jim is in a church that teaches that anyone who isn't a member of their congregation is not a true Christian. At work he meets Amanda who is a very devout Christian and seems to be well-founded in her theology, and she seems to live out what she speaks. Still, he doesn't date her because he knows she can't be a true believer if she doesn't attend his church. Or, Karen's group teaches its members that pain is only an illusion so even though she feels as if she has a headache, she knows that she really doesn't.
 
Dispensing of Existence - The cult decides who has the right to exist. This can be literal, but it is generally figurative. Outsiders are considered unenlightened or evil and so they can and should be ignored and, sometimes, even mistreated. The sacred science viewpoint helps make it more acceptable to treat people in this manner because the sacred teachings of the group advocate this view.

Examples: Ronald refuses to spend time with any of his old friends because they are evil. When he does talk to them he will only talk about the group and is quick to remind them that they will be judged. Or, Brandy tells her family not to contact her anymore, claiming they have been cruel and now refuse to own up to that mistreatment. She didn't believe them to be cruel until the group influenced her to cut them off.
In short, a cult is an organization that uses these methods to recruit, control, manipulate, and abuse individuals.

It is important to note that not every cult uses all of these techniques; sometimes only a few are masterfully executed to manipulate and unduly influence members. An understanding of these processes can help protect you and your family from its influence. For a more detailed study of this subject, see "Thought Reform in Cults and Abusive Relationships."

http://wellspringretreat.org/families/define.html

Why should we take advice on sex from the Pope? If he knows anything about it, he shouldn't.
--George Bernard Shaw, Irish-born English playwright



_________________
EST (Lifespring) '83
Salesmanship Club '84-'86
Straight, Inc. '86-'88

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. ~ Edmund Burke

534
Quote
On 2005-06-15 10:04:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2005-06-15 09:55:00, leleNtom wrote:


"is that what the seminars used to be called? lifespring? just wondering.... well there not called that if thats what it is, its  called premier now.

I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.  
-- Hunter S. Thompson

"




The name doesn't matter. Lifespring, Resource Realizations, Premier Education-- it's all the same thing. WWASP is a cult based on the Lifespring cult. "


Actually Lifespring is a cult based on the est cult.  :wink:

I have never seen the slightest scientific proof of the religious theories of heaven and hell, of future life for individuals, or of a personal God.
--Thomas Edison, American inventor


535
TASKS/Resource Realizations/Discovery/Focus/Premier Education, other programs based on such things are all administered by people with a background in est/Lifespring, a labeled cult. Does the name David Gilcrease mean anything to you?

Do some research.  :idea:

The Church says that the earth is flat, but I know that it is round, for I have seen the shadow on the moon, and I have more faith in a shadow than in the Church.
--Ferdinand Magellan, Portuguese and Spanish explorer



_________________
EST (Lifespring) '83
Salesmanship Club '84-'86
Straight, Inc. '86-'88

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. ~ Edmund Burke

536
So, you didn't attend Lifespring via WWASPS seminars?

He who will not reason is a bigot; he who cannot is a fool; and he who dares not is a slave.
--Author: Sir William Drummond


537
Sue Scheff is just as guilty as WWASPS/Robert Lichfield & company are.

Her daughter was in CSA, and she sued WWASPS for abuse after getting a virtually free tuition because of all the referrals she did for Teen Help and WWASPS.

Now she refers to her own abusive neglectful behavior modification, positive peer culture, and thought reform "specialty schools."

Behavior modification/positive peer culture/thought reform programs don't work. They are actually more damaging than anything else. There have been psychological studies done by professionals. (not quacks) The program didn't save anyone and being locked up and re-wired is NOT help. It?s physical and emotional prison.
Perhaps this website might help you see some real light ? there have been program survivors who have gone there to gain recovery from their damaging experiences:
http://wellspringretreat.org/pro/signs.html

When I told the people of Northern Ireland that I was an atheist, a woman in the audience stood up and said, "Yes, but is it the God of the Catholics or the God of the Protestants in whom you don't believe?"  
-- Quentin Crisp



_________________
EST (Lifespring) '83
Salesmanship Club '84-'86
Straight, Inc. '86-'88

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. ~ Edmund Burke

538
Straight, Inc. and Derivatives / Manipulation
« on: June 15, 2005, 10:39:00 AM »
Quote
On 2005-05-27 16:53:00, Antigen wrote:

"
Quote

On 2005-05-27 15:16:00, linchpin wrote:


My mom still calls me druggie..told me to get some fresh air and sun because I "look like a druggie" and this was just 2 weeks ago...yet she hasnt seen me in over a year.




Sorry to hear it. Ever think actual orphans have it easier cause they can bury their dead and move on?

Hands that help are far better then lips that pray.
--Robert G. Ingersoll, American politician and lecturer


"


I feel like an orphan, my dad is dead, and sometimes I wish my mom was just dead, does that count?

Life is like a bird, at any given moment it is droping a load. It is only a matter of time before one eventually find you.

http://fornits.com/about_us.htm' target='_new'>SysAdmin


539
Straight, Inc. and Derivatives / Study Shows Many Alcoholics Recover
« on: June 14, 2005, 05:08:00 PM »
Quote

On 2005-01-28 20:09:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:

"Another reason to keep drinking.  You never know when a runaway avalanche will attack!!!  We have a real problem with that down here. ::bwahaha::  ::hehehmm::

"The FARC is part of the history of Colombia and a historical phenomenon", (President Pastrana) says, "and they must be treated as Colombians". ... They come and ask for bread [aid from Washington], and you give them stones.

Robert White is a former American ambassador to Paraguay and El Salvador, and former No. 2 man with the U.S. Embassy in Bogota, is president of the Centre for International Policy in Washington D.C.
http://narconews.com/' target='_new'>Robert White


540
Straight, Inc. and Derivatives / How to Live & Let Live
« on: June 09, 2005, 01:58:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-06-08 11:57:00, linchpin wrote:

"You people are driving me to drink! Fuck! :skull:
"


hahahah...

I love Cat Stevens.  :grin:

Trouble, oh trouble move from me
I have paid my debt now
Won't you leave me in my misery
Trouble oh trouble please be kind
Don't wan't no fight
And I haven't got a lot of time

None of Nature's landscapes are ugly so long as they are wild.
-- John Muir


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