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Messages - sabro

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1
CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / Action to take now that the beast is dead.
« on: August 06, 2005, 02:47:00 PM »
I never reported anything specific about those you mentioned because I never saw or had specific knowledge about abuse. But I did file two reports and spoke to the DA about a third case- in all three, I was told that there was insufficient evidence. I never contacted the CCTC about anyone's credentials either. People with firsthand information need to do the reporting or nothing will happen.

Where powers are assumed which have not been delegated, a nullification of the act is the rightful remedy.
http://lfb.com/?stocknumber=FF7485&code=10247' target='_new'>Thomas Jefferson: Kentucky Resolutions, 1798


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / Action to take now that the beast is dead.
« on: July 31, 2005, 01:59:00 AM »
I only found this site after Geoff posted on the other site.
 I really don't think about the school much- unless someone brings it up- which is the case here. Twelve years ago, I left the place- Another disgruntled staff member had called the DA and gave him my name- I didn't even think to do that at that time.I haven't spent much time or energy on it at all. (I've worked at several schools...)

I am a firm believer in doing the right thing, and trying to make thins as right as they can get. (I'm thinking that might be impractical here.)

I don't hold any grudges. I run into those people- that's all I said. I don't date them, see them socially, hang out and talk old times...nothing like that. We live in a community of a few thousand. I see ex-cedu people around. That's all.

I noticed how evrey thread on this site degenerates into name calling and threats- there's a heck of a lot of anger here. I thought it should be directed in some kind of productive way.

This has definietly changed the way I view the school.

This year will go down in history! For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration! Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!
         
http://www.aidoann.com/guncontrol.html' target='_new'>Adolph Hitler


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 30, 2005, 02:06:00 PM »
It was a whole lot easier to believe that the extremes were warranted at Cedu because you kids needed it. The fact that it failed so misserably renders this hogwash. I never, ever thought it was that bad. I thought there were problems that needed to be fixed and some staff that were off the wall. We were always trying to figure out how to make the program better and more effective. But the core was rotten.

I kinda believe that most of the staff- even the most abusive, came there for the right reasons and tried to do good for kids- but for most, they had no experience, education, or training, and under the Mel system- they accepted what was going on as therapy. (I have no background in therapy either- so a lot of time i just sat there incredulously thinking "what is this?") They must have started out as decent caring humans. But I guess if they tried to maintain that they would have been forced to quit or have been fired. But a fewm they stayed on thinking they might help a kid through this...

Power, control, and manipulation became the goals of any employee who aspired to succeed at Cedu. They were rank amatuers- with no business dispensing this funky brand of "healing." If you didn't toe the line as staff, you were subjected to many of the same kind of games the kids faced- along with punitive employer practices like messing with your work duties, hours and even pay. Like the kids we were often told who we could talk to and what we should say. You had to go through whomever was running a kid's "table" or work assignment. (Tim was great at smiling and acting shocked.)

I took a paycut to work there and was strung along with promise after promise. I enjoyed working with the kids- got no problem with the physical labor thing, or the cleanliness thing, not with the classes, the outdoor ed program, or sports- all that was fun. (And I got out of most raps when we were working on the accreditation and all raps and propheets during my last few months.)

I remember my first rap with Jill. Afterwards she tried to debrief it in some gentle manner: "Do you have a problem yelling?" I told her, no- if I have something to yell about. "what about cussing?" I told her in general I don't cuss. "You really can't work here if you don't cuss." Okay, I said. "Well..." she looked at me. Long pause- "Okay, Fuck you."I told her. She smiled and gave me a hug.

Early on, I came in early and found a chair and a book to read. Rudy pulled me into his office and hit the roof. Screaming, red-faced...and I'm thinking I might need to use some martial arts on him... and then he calms and acts loving and caring.

Luke had it much worse than I did. Originally, Rudy had challenge and then Bill- both were a lot easier to work with than Guy. He made Luke's life hell for not being a "believer." I think the day after I gave notice, they fired him. No warning, no probation, no reason. (You're not a team player.)

These schools prey upon the desperation of parents that are at the end of whatever rope they have. Although Cedu is gone- the nightmare lives on in dozens of copycats because the market is there.

The car: My son Justin drives it when it runs. A Tweed Enterprise Hum-lite hummer replica. Fiberglass and aluminum body on a welded steel frame- Rear engine. I just pulled the Rx7 engine out and dropped a VW engine in so the smog referee will exempt it. Google "humlite" and I think the Knott's Berry Farm pics will come up.

...the people have a right to keep and bear arms.
-- Patrick Henry and George Mason Debates


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / Action to take now that the beast is dead.
« on: July 30, 2005, 11:58:00 AM »
I stayed up until 2 am reading threads.

Even though CEDU is closed, I would suggest letting all that anger and hurt do something positive. Get the word out about these programs that just keep cropping up. Get the word out about individual staff, and confront them about the reality of the therapy. Lots of them- especially the Wassermanites- are still out there working with kids. (Like Patrick Stambusky who changed his name and now runs Monarch.)

Someone was making a documentary- what happened with that. Is there another way of contacting the media- getting the word out?

Contact all the ex-staff and students you know and get their stories.

California is a madatory reporting state. Any adult involved in the care, education, or treatment of children needs to report any abuse that they know of or suspect. Penalties for not reporting range from loss of certification and licenses to fines and jail time. Report, report, report. I know I have to do this again- just to make sure. I told everything I know of firsthand to the DA way back in '92. It was nothing like what I read on these threads, though.

Report the staff. All of us. Anything you know specifically or firsthand, and any of the staff that knew also. Child protective services or the local DA will know about statutes of limitations and can sort out what's what.

I'm the last person that should give you guys advice, but if you want to accomplish something positive you "survivors" need to stop barking at each other. The accusing, cussing, threatening stuff...every other thread descends into after three posts doesn't seem all that constructive. I've got no problem with angry people expressing anger on a forum that is perfectly designed for that, but choose your targets.

Unless you are Tom Cruise and "know the history of psychology," there is nothing wrong with getting real, professional help. One reason to sue the Brown School Carcass and the ex-Staff is to get them to pay for this.

Someone should write a book. If none of you want to do it, I am willing to look for an author to collect all of your stories and print them up. (I don't know how successful this would be since I have never done this before.) Someone must know an author (and a publisher.)

How do we repair the damage? How do we keep other parents from sending their kids and money to these fraudulent travesties? You guys probably have better ideas than I do. I don't know what kind of resources are out there- survivors networks, support groups, but there has to be some people like you guys that would be willing to let their anger be constructive.

All religions bear traces of the fact that they arose during the intellectual immaturity of the human race - before it had learned the obligations to speak the truth. Not one of them makes it the duty of its God to be truthful and understandable in his communications.
--Freidrich Nietzsche, German philosopher


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 30, 2005, 04:15:00 AM »
Until I found this board I could always entertain the illusion that we did good things- that the kids turned out okay...I spent an hour reading exchanges between Ottowa 5 and 2 and you and Shanlea and the big Serbian guy (who was there with you and I cant for the life of me remember or figure out who that is.) It tears me up. The worst of our fears as newbie staff members was actually true. It's one in the morning and I can't drop this thing. We thought: As long as the program was effective- the rest of the crap didn't matter. (How wrong I was.)

I was always thinking until the day I heard the school closed of how it could be fixed- of what kind of improvements needed to be made. (Carl Kent was in contact with me- I have an administrative credential and he was thinking of retiring soon.) I thought I could turn it into a real school- with real academics, and people more interested in helping than controlling.

It was always easy for me to simply dismiss the "true believers" on staff. The whole CEDU things means more to them than god. Guy is still a jerk- and I mean that in a NICE way. He's always getting himself in trouble for just doing whatever he wants. But he is an effective principal and runs a pretty good school. You have to remember too, I didn't work with Guy much, but Luke did and he can't even say the guy's name without a visceral response. (Remeber when Luke broke his foot and had to spend all his time supervising work assignments in the snow?)

I read the other thread about Russ and I am serious about the statute of limitations thing. A lot of people think he made stuff like that up, but who knows?

I still have the spoon and chopsticks I carved on our Wilderness Challenge. I remember following Kevin's finals group up and over some god-aweful snowed in pass and down through the bushes.

10 years after leaving Cedu I had to come in for a deposition on something.

And as for being proud- there were a lot of people, including you that I was proud to know- proud to see stand up to bullying and humiliation. Survival sometimes is the ultimate victory-- I think that's why I want to find out what happened to people. Just remember that the program was designed for heroine addicts, not kids with behavior problems on the fringes of the normal range. Even the "look goods" I respected- for finding something that worked.

Until now, the only Cedu kids that I ran into were in that sheep category- the guys that came up here to visit- the ones that stayed past their 18th birthday- that ask you ten years after the fact how you are doing with your "brothers." They did a lot to help preserve my illusions... but give me a bit more time to read more of these posts.

I called Luke to give him the web site, but no answer. (My version of "Finding Nemo")

I didn't want you to just leave pissed off like that for a couple of reasons: 1.Now I want to find out more and 2. I have this custom built car that I need your input on.

Like I said earlier- don't let them steal any more of your life.

1:15 am!

"The FARC is part of the history of Colombia and a historical phenomenon", (President Pastrana) says, "and they must be treated as Colombians". ... They come and ask for bread [aid from Washington], and you give them stones.

Robert White is a former American ambassador to Paraguay and El Salvador, and former No. 2 man with the U.S. Embassy in Bogota, is president of the Centre for International Policy in Washington D.C.
http://narconews.com/' target='_new'>Robert White


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 30, 2005, 12:40:00 AM »
So much for "doing well now." Your post pisses me off, especially the hit and run "My last words to you." approach.

I came to Cedu as a teacher and I did my job well. I wrote curriculum, I helped them earn accreditation. On most days I had a good time, whether cleaning, teaching or playing basketball. At the time I saw students who's lives had been spiraling out of control seem to be getting the help they needed. At least they weren't on the streets or on drugs or participating in some bizarre high risk behavior. Extereme measures for extreme circumstances. So I thought...

No, I never heard Russ cop to either setting a homeless man on fire or to gang rapes. And you have no idea of what conversations I had with the deputy DA, child protective services, or what I did do about the stuff I saw or what I did not do. Do you know for a fact that none of us, including Beth, Jack, Mariana and Luke blew the whistle, or has Cedu taught you to just stick your head as far up your ass as you can and spout off with some kind of adolescent self rightousness? Rudy has taught you well.

You of all people know how much time I spent in Brace's office, and how I was pulled from raps and propheets. (Such a punishment...) You have never heard me say or do anything abusive, or inappropriate or even cuss. Save your "fuck you's" for the people that really deserve them.

By the way you seem to know that a gang rapist- murderer is on the loose. What kind of balls do you have? What have you done about it? There is no statute of limitations on murder. Where and when was this supposed to have happened? I have no problems alerting the authorities to a crime like that. What is your problem? Tell me which police department to call and I'll be on the phone immediately.

Of all the stuff I saw, according to the district attorney, none of it was his opinion illegal. Not my decision, but the deputy DA's name was Connelly and his number is published.

Guy Bonnano is the principal of my son's high school, (909) 336-2038. You can google the school and get his e-mail also. I don't know if I give him a friendly smile or a socialble nod, but if I felt the pain, injustice and anger you're pissing out here, I might vent it at the real target and not some peripheral character of your nightmares. What I needed to say to him I said to him years ago- and never did I ever feel like being anything but cordial to him- especially since I do have to work with him- as if not carrying some bitter grudge for decades is some kind of character flaw. What do you suggest, a weekly kick in the ankle? Get real. I'm not the one who wants or need to confront him.

I certainly never had the dog conversation with him.

I won't speak ill of the dead, nor will I blame those lost souls for the pain they must have endured. But I feel confident that I did not fail them, and bear no guilt for actions of kids I may have barely or possibly never met for actions that occurred years later. People with problems sometimes kill themselves. You can blame it on a lot of things, Cedu if it is convenient, you can blame yourself for not being there when they needed you, but blaming it on me seems irrational.

Until Geoff alerted me to this board, I really had no idea what kind of deep injury CEDU caused in so many people. Your manic posts speak volumes to this. I had hoped that some good was coming out of all of this.

Go in peace. I hope you can put the pain anger and bitterness behind you. Cedu has stolen enough of your life already.

The problem with the "teen help" industry is that it's a bad "solution" in search of a problem.

http://fornits.com/wwf/bb_profile.php?mode=view&user=943' target='_new'>Julie C.

[ This Message was edited by: sabro on 2005-07-29 22:33 ]

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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 29, 2005, 03:11:00 PM »
I've been in education now for over 18 years, and I have always been proud of the kind of work I have done. I spent two hours looking over old posts on this forum and on the cedualumni site to read of the suffering Cedu caused. It was a small part of my career, and now I feel the need to find out more about what happened- what were the consequences and long term effects of the program.

Anony- Thanks for the kind words. I'm more curious now than ever before about what is going on with those young people I knew. Was it a Cult? It certainly had the hallmarks of one. I remember when Mel visited and how revered he was. Never "got" that part. It's gone now. Dead. (Although you know many of these people are still working with kids in capacities that they really don't understand.)

You don't know how stupid I feel when I find out what kind of pain and damage I helped to inflict. I sincerely tried to accomplish good things- and I think the bulk of the staff there really cared. Although it doesn't compensate for the pain and anger that it caused, I do think the program did some kids some good. (Buying a guy an ice cream cone after you torture and kill his dog doesn't make it right.) I always hoped the program could be "fixed" and never knew how sick and twisted it really was.

I am a professional, and as long as I stick to what I know- teaching, I am fine. But therapy, counseling? No degree or training in the area- I don't consider myself a therapist and I never have. Don't give amatuers, however well intentioned, such control though- it's like giving dynamite to a toddler.

Also, I used to run into Jack and Matt a lot. Both were there far longer than I was and Jack regrets the whole experience. Carla Malewicz is a counselor at Bloomington Middle school. (I was at Bloomington HS, so we corresponded a little.)

Dan Tarabek, I think the IRS is looking for you again. God bless you bro, but pay your taxes!

There was an investigation back in the early 90's. A staff member named Beth contacted the SB county DA, and they interviewed a bunch of us. Cedu lawyers contacted us about 6 months after the DA's group and individual interviews. About ten years ago I had to give a deposition about the disappearance of a kid named Blake from the middle school. I was named in the wrongful death suit ahead of the school, but I didn't have much to say. I think the suit was dismissed.

I see Beth Hallmark fairly often. She has fibriomyalgia and is having a bit of a problem working full days.

I ran into Tyler Mars once- he was rushing off to go snowboarding- must have been 12 years ago...

I am not a great believer in school. School is primarily an institution for the perpetuation of adolescence...The thought that school educates is not one I have accepted yet...Thank God I am not young. I could not survive this horror.
--Peter F. Drucker

[ This Message was edited by: sabro on 2005-07-29 15:23 ]

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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / russ decker
« on: July 29, 2005, 12:57:00 PM »
Hey, there's no statute of limitations on murder.

Not a place upon earth might be so happy as America. Her situation is remote from all the wrangling world, and she has nothing to do but to trade with them.
--Thomas Paine


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 29, 2005, 12:49:00 PM »
I got rid of my Savage-- I guess about 4 years ago. The guy took off the rear seat, re-did the fender and the exhaust and painted it a really deep green. It looks great... I'm looking for a new bike now.

Sorry you feel that I am spinless and complacent. (I admit to being quite common.) I worked at CEDU for about 14 months when I was 27 years old. (Younger than you are now.) I really had hopes that that school could do some good for kids, and guys like me and Luke and Ron Davis fought hard to make positive changes. When I saw something I didn't like I brought it up with Bill Valentine, Rudy and Tim Brace. It didn't make me popular among the staff- and I was continually accused of being not a "team player" and "running an underground." I have no regrets.

I worked with Guy at the high school for one term after that, and I see him, Russ and Donna at community events. It's not like I hang out with them- although I don't hate them at all. (It's just not the way I am.)

I try to get together with Luke as often as possible, but he has this habbit of disappearing for months or years at a time.

I get Christmas cards from Mariana with pictures of her two boys.

I see that you have heard from Jackson... Are there other people you are in touch with? (Jackson still has the record for "The Ten Commandments" over at Alpine.)

Totalitarianism is like a specter which drinks the blood of the living and so achieves reality, while the victims go on existing as a mass of living corpses.

http://www.whitecloud.com/fight_vs_totalitarianism.htm' target='_new'>Karl Jaspers, The Fight Against Totalitarianism (1963)


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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 28, 2005, 02:04:00 PM »
My name is Sabro Foster. I worked there for about a year, mostly in Challenge- I taught History, Math and English, and then later I helped out part time at the middle school. I hung out with Luke Nemo.

I almost forgot- I see Guy Bonnano all the time. He's the Principal at Rim High School.

BTW, I'm not great at names. After 18 years of teaching, I've had literally thousands of students.

I would also be interested in hearing from Robert, Sean, Dave, Jen, Heather, Marie or Jade...

I did correspond with Bryan Felscher briefly on a motorcycle website, and then he just disappeared.

Also if you remember any of the Quiroz family- Robert, Laura, Abbot, Linda... I see some of them around Running Springs[ This Message was edited by: sabro on 2005-07-28 14:28 ]

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CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones / New to Forum- Looking to hear from old staff and students.
« on: July 28, 2005, 11:22:00 AM »
Geoff posted on rimoftheworld.net. Everyone he knows from Cedu had pretty hard lives after leaving. That got me thinking of all the kids that I hung out with 12 years ago and what came of them.

I read the other threads...Boy, lots of hostility...

I was just wondering what became of the kids I knew from 1991-2 or so.

I was on staff for about a year, and came in to fill gaps for about four more. I was part of a crowd that tried to change things- brought in austensibly to help with accreditation and strengthen the academics.

I still run into Russ Decker from time to time, although I haven't seen him lately. He married Kim, the receptionist. I see Donna Dillman- now married- at school functions. Dennis Docksteader lives up the street at Music Camp. I haven't heard from Luke Nemo all summer- but he tends to disappear for long periods of time. I also see Carl Kent- but not since the closure.

I went back to public school after I left. I still do some outdoor education, but I just took a job as an assistant Principal, and I am a little busy.

Justin, Tom (x2), Rachael (x2), Mary, Tyler, John, ... and so many others... where are you?

Of all the enemies to public liberty, war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other.
--James Madison


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