Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: dbucfan on January 18, 2005, 07:22:00 PM
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There it was...Straight as well as a few programs that were out of the country...the abuse that happened etc.
discuss.
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On 2005-01-18 16:22:00, dbucfan wrote:
"There it was...Straight as well as a few programs that were out of the country...the abuse that happened etc.
discuss."
What? Hijack your thread? Wouldn't dream of it! :rofl:
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I saw it. Found most of it laughable. That Samantha girl at the beginning was not exactly a credible looking individual. WAY over dramatic. That girl needs some help NOW.
I found the show rather unimpactful.
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On 2005-01-20 05:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
" I saw it. Found most of it laughable. That Samantha girl at the beginning was not exactly a credible looking individual. WAY over dramatic. That girl needs some help NOW.
I found the show rather unimpactful. "
Well, that's your opinion. I think it took a lot of guts on her part.
But I have to ask how you find rape, broken jaws and extended isolation laughable. Assault is criminal. What if it were you? How long do you think it would affect you? How emotional would you be?
Are you a parent? Would you send your kid(s) off to one of these programs and just hope they don't get violated or otherwise assaulted?
That's the impact of shows like this, and forums such as these. Like this: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... =310#75462 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7573&forum=9&start=310#75462)
Parents are listening. I hope more start.
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On 2005-01-18 22:54:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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On 2005-01-18 16:22:00, dbucfan wrote:
"There it was...Straight as well as a few programs that were out of the country...the abuse that happened etc.
discuss."
What? Hijack your thread? Wouldn't dream of it! :rofl:"
Darren here...you really hold on to things too long...relax. :wave:
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What? Hijack your thread? Wouldn't dream of it! :rofl:"
[/quote]Darren here...you really hold on to things too long...relax. :wave: "
[/quote]
ROFL. Ain't THAT the truth! Good call.
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On 2005-01-22 19:24:00, Anonymous wrote:
What? Hijack your thread? Wouldn't dream of it! :rofl:"
Darren here...you really hold on to things too long...relax. :wave: "
ROFL. Ain't THAT the truth! Good call."
Yeah, don't you wish I had a shitty memory?
You know, the signal to noise ratio here is ridiculously small. You guys don't debate or disuss the program -- you attack people personally.
Anonomouse didn't say anything of Samantha's story - you only commented on how credible she looked and that she was dramatic.
Why didn't you or anyone else respond to the questions I asked here:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=13#76844 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7856&forum=13#76844)
Another anonomouse (Or the same...who can tell?) despised Aaronson's article because he didn't give him or her ink. Darren only had to say "well it wasn't like that when I was there".
Well that's nice, Darren - I'm glad you had great time, and it helped you to lead a spiffy life. But neither you, nor the anonomouses answered these questions:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=13#74984 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7746&forum=13#74984)
Why not?
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On 2005-01-22 21:35:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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On 2005-01-22 19:24:00, Anonymous wrote:
What? Hijack your thread? Wouldn't dream of it! :rofl:"
Darren here...you really hold on to things too long...relax. :wave: "
ROFL. Ain't THAT the truth! Good call."
Yeah, don't you wish I had a shitty memory?
You know, the signal to noise ratio here is ridiculously small. You guys don't debate or disuss the program -- you attack people personally.
Anonomouse didn't say anything of Samantha's story - you only commented on how credible she looked and that she was dramatic.
Why didn't you or anyone else respond to the questions I asked here:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=13#76844 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7856&forum=13#76844)
Another anonomouse (Or the same...who can tell?) despised Aaronson's article because he didn't give him or her ink. Darren only had to say "well it wasn't like that when I was there".
Well that's nice, Darren - I'm glad you had great time, and it helped you to lead a spiffy life. But neither you, nor the anonomouses answered these questions:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=13#74984 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7746&forum=13#74984)
Why not?
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I believe that their have been a bunch of horrific experiences, and i have never diminished that...i believe it to be fact in most cases...all i have ever commented on was my experiences and it seems like YOU hate the fact that i didnt have a horrible life altering experience...so sorry to let you down. :grin:
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On 2005-01-22 21:35:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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On 2005-01-22 19:24:00, Anonymous wrote:
What? Hijack your thread? Wouldn't dream of it! :rofl:"
Darren here...you really hold on to things too long...relax. :wave: "
ROFL. Ain't THAT the truth! Good call."
Yeah, don't you wish I had a shitty memory?
You know, the signal to noise ratio here is ridiculously small. You guys don't debate or disuss the program -- you attack people personally.
Anonomouse didn't say anything of Samantha's story - you only commented on how credible she looked and that she was dramatic.
Why didn't you or anyone else respond to the questions I asked here:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=13#76844 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7856&forum=13#76844)
Another anonomouse (Or the same...who can tell?) despised Aaronson's article because he didn't give him or her ink. Darren only had to say "well it wasn't like that when I was there".
Well that's nice, Darren - I'm glad you had great time, and it helped you to lead a spiffy life. But neither you, nor the anonomouses answered these questions:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=13#74984 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7746&forum=13#74984)
Why not?
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Darren here.
I believe that their have been a bunch of horrific experiences, and i have never diminished that...i believe it to be fact in most cases...all i have ever commented on was my experiences and it seems like YOU hate the fact that i didnt have a horrible life altering experience...so sorry to let you down. :grin:
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sheesh...how many more times could i say the word experience? :rofl:
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Darren here.
I believe that their have been a bunch of horrific experiences, and i have never diminished that...i believe it to be fact in most cases...all i have ever commented on was my experiences and it seems like YOU hate the fact that i didnt have a horrible life altering experience...so sorry to let you down. :grin: "
My point was that you're so wrapped up in your experience that you haven't bothered until now to say that you even believed there were "horrific experiences". Your whole tone has been "Thank God it wasn't ME".
The point is - these programs have been abusive, have disrupted many people's lives and continue to do so. The whole sickness perpetuates because of the widely held attitudes of:
1. Oh, that never happened when I was there
2. It didn't happen to me
3. It's all exaggeration
4. It was supposed to be tough.
(Tough? It's illegal treat POWs with the "treatment" these programs provide!)
5. Rotten kids deserve it.
Let me down? I wasn't recruiting you, pal. Hell, if that was my job, I'd be working for a program someplace! :roll: What I find hard to believe is that you didn't see one ounce of abuse in the entire time you were in either LIFE or STEP.
Another question for you - why did you start this off with "Discuss" and not say a word about the show?
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On 2005-01-23 13:56:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"Darren here.
I believe that their have been a bunch of horrific experiences, and i have never diminished that...i believe it to be fact in most cases...all i have ever commented on was my experiences and it seems like YOU hate the fact that i didnt have a horrible life altering experience...so sorry to let you down. :grin: "
My point was that you're so wrapped up in your experience that you haven't bothered until now to say that you even believed there were "horrific experiences". Your whole tone has been "Thank God it wasn't ME".
The point is - these programs have been abusive, have disrupted many people's lives and continue to do so. The whole sickness perpetuates because of the widely held attitudes of:
1. Oh, that never happened when I was there
2. It didn't happen to me
3. It's all exaggeration
4. It was supposed to be tough.
(Tough? It's illegal treat POWs with the "treatment" these programs provide!)
5. Rotten kids deserve it.
Let me down? I wasn't recruiting you, pal. Hell, if that was my job, I'd be working for a program someplace! :roll: What I find hard to believe is that you didn't see one ounce of abuse in the entire time you were in either LIFE or STEP.
Another question for you - why did you start this off with "Discuss" and not say a word about the show? "
Believe it or not...i never saw one ounce of what i would consider abuse(rape, beatings, mental torture etc.). yes i do feel lucky that it didnt happen to me but at the same time i wish all the best for the abused. To clarify i said i believed most of the horror stories...i do not believe all the hype by any means. i started the topic, o-topic inspector, to see how others felt about what was said. next time i will run the topic by you first. :roll:
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i started the topic, o-topic inspector, to see how others felt about what was said. next time i will run the topic by you first. :idea:
You are an ASSHOLE!
Have a nice day. [ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-23 14:26 ]
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Sure, I'll respond to your questions.
As for the "Abuse" that happened at GT - and the reports. Yep, that happened and was reported and hopefully the INDIVIDUAL who was admittedly guilty of that childish act was TREATED.
Was that a PRACTICE of GT?? NO.
Was he TOLD or TAUGHT to do that, BY GT?? NO.
Did GT deny it, or avoid it or fight against it ?? NO. The Director handled it very appropriatley.
Is this a fairly isolated incident? MOST LIKELY.
GT has been around for 15 plus years??!! HOW many reports like this have been made and confirmed in ALL those years?!?! Probably only this ONE.
When you work with disfunctional families and teens, do you expect things like this to NEVER happen in treatment?? Would be NICE... but we don't live in a perfect world.
Point is this. If you DON'T have a BETTER SOLUTION for troubled teens, using drugs, stealing, involved in breaking the law, being unruley... then PLEASE use your efforts to CREATE one! Tearing down programs that DO help and have MANY, MANY successes (much to your dismay) should NOT be shut down for isolated incidents.
This SAMMIE on MONTEL was a real drama queen. I DO NOT buy MOST of her story! I don't BUY that she sat in her feces and blood for days, or that she was SAT ON for 12 hours at a time, or in a room by herself for days, OR that she was RAPED by a "staff" person! DO NOT BUY IT!!
I personally think most the ABUSED on this site are out for the $$$! You want to SUE and get whatever you can get out of any of the founders, directors, etc.! MONEY motivated! I don't BUY that you're out there to SAVE our poor kids!
So, there's your answers. You won't like them, you are SO predictable in what you POST. You think you are SO much smarter or more well informed than ANYONE else. I'm sure that's what you NEED to do, in order to mask your insecurities, but it REALLY gets old and sickening.
And I'm sure you'll go off on the "oh, and you post anonymously". Well... is your name REALLY "Sara"?? I don't think so. Why don't you post your true FULL name!?? If you're not willing, then SHUT up about those who post anonymously! I choose NOT to post mine as I TRULEY feel like there are MANY "loose cannons" on this site (unbalanced, filled with hate and rage) and I do not choose to put my name out there, for them to then track down and harass. Like it or not.
I WON'T resort to calling you names, as you have calling Darren an "asshole". THAT says a LOT about you and your character right there.
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On 2005-01-23 16:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
" Sure, I'll respond to your questions.
As for the "Abuse" that happened at GT - and the reports. Yep, that happened and was reported and hopefully the INDIVIDUAL who was admittedly guilty of that childish act was TREATED.
Was that a PRACTICE of GT?? NO.
Was he TOLD or TAUGHT to do that, BY GT?? NO.
Did GT deny it, or avoid it or fight against it ?? NO. The Director handled it very appropriatley.
Is this a fairly isolated incident? MOST LIKELY.
GT has been around for 15 plus years??!! HOW many reports like this have been made and confirmed in ALL those years?!?! Probably only this ONE.
Granted, one incident. But like other sexual assaults, how many others have gone unreported? I just wonder why wouldn't you hope the "Individual" was CONVICTED of a CRIMINAL act, and dealt with accordingly?
Also, are you the same "Anonomous" who said the entire article was nothing but exaggeration?
When you work with disfunctional families and teens, do you expect things like this to NEVER happen in treatment?? Would be NICE... but we don't live in a perfect world.
So, what you're saying is these types of "incidents" are to be expected? Sexual Assualt is to be EXPECTED???? Unbelievable.
Point is this. If you DON'T have a BETTER SOLUTION for troubled teens, using drugs, stealing, involved in breaking the law, being unruley... then PLEASE use your efforts to CREATE one! Tearing down programs that DO help and have MANY, MANY successes (much to your dismay) should NOT be shut down for isolated incidents.
How about this: Maybe it would be best if "dysfunctional families" didn't TREAT dysfunctional families?!
Professionals have been dealing with real problems long before GT oozed out of The Seed... or The Seed oozed out of Synanon for that matter.
This SAMMIE on MONTEL was a real drama queen. I DO NOT buy MOST of her story! I don't BUY that she sat in her feces and blood for days, or that she was SAT ON for 12 hours at a time, or in a room by herself for days, OR that she was RAPED by a "staff" person! DO NOT BUY IT!!
I personally think most the ABUSED on this site are out for the $$$! You want to SUE and get whatever you can get out of any of the founders, directors, etc.! MONEY motivated! I don't BUY that you're out there to SAVE our poor kids!
Did you not hear Sammie herself say that the statute of limitations from that period has long since passed?
As for the other kids - series of surgeries get really expensive. Specialized psychotherapy to undo "programming" gets pretty expensive too. If someone knocks your teeth out tomorrow (which just could happen if you said this shit out loud in public!), you would expect them to pay for your dental work, wouldn't you?
No one said you had to "buy" anything. The facts are out there... all you have to do is look for them.
I am actually a little stunned at your diatribe against Sammie. Hope you have some good Karma in the bank.
So, there's your answers. You won't like them, you are SO predictable in what you POST. You think you are SO much smarter or more well informed than ANYONE else. I'm sure that's what you NEED to do, in order to mask your insecurities, but it REALLY gets old and sickening.
You're psychic too, huh? Good luck with that.
Actually I deal with facts, No hype, no witchcraft, stepcraft, pseudo-psychology or psychic intuition.
And I'm sure you'll go off on the "oh, and you post anonymously". Well... is your name REALLY "Sara"?? I don't think so. Why don't you post your true FULL name!?? If you're not willing, then SHUT up about those who post anonymously! I choose NOT to post mine as I TRULEY feel like there are MANY "loose cannons" on this site (unbalanced, filled with hate and rage) and I do not choose to put my name out there, for them to then track down and harass. Like it or not.
Who cares what your real name is? Did I ever ask you for it? You can register your name on this board as "Sigmund Freud" for all the admins and I care.
What if my name isn't Sara? So what? You know that every post with "Sara" beside it was written by me - the same person, every time. Yep, I'm Sara! :wave:
I made that "Anonomous" comment because "Anonomous" is simply anyone who logs in and posts. "Anonomous" on this thread could be 1 person, or it could be 20 different people. This has come up before. Now I can ASSUME, you're a different "Anonomous", or I can ASSUME that you're the same one, and that you're just dense, and ask, "Why is that so hard to understand?" I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. Or was that the other "Anonomous"?
I WON'T resort to calling you names, as you have calling Darren an "asshole". THAT says a LOT about you and your character right there."
Hey, I've been trying for months now to deal with Darren (and others) intelligently. Almost every time, I get an insult hurled in my direction, and yes, I have also been called names by yet another "Anonymous". Or was that you too? Again, I'll give the benefit of the doubt, as I always have.
I'm sick of the insults, so I'm hurling them back. I hope that speaks volumes for my character! :grin:
(Edited for spelling and clarity)[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-24 06:14 ]
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On 2005-01-23 14:26:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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i started the topic, o-topic inspector, to see how others felt about what was said. next time i will run the topic by you first. :rofl: :rofl: :wave:
you get what you give...maybe if you werent so bitcy and nasty and venomous...you would'nt get sarcastic remarks made to you.
you get just as good as you give. :grin:
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On 2005-01-23 14:26:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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i started the topic, o-topic inspector, to see how others felt about what was said. next time i will run the topic by you first. :rofl: :rofl: :wave:
you get what you give...maybe if you werent so bitchy and nasty and venomous...you would'nt get sarcastic remarks made to you.
you get just as good as you give. :grin:
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On 2005-01-23 14:26:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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i started the topic, o-topic inspector, to see how others felt about what was said. next time i will run the topic by you first. :rofl: :rofl: :wave:
maybe if you werent so bitchy and nasty and venomous...you would'nt get sarcastic remarks made to you.
you get just as good as you give. :grin:
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sorry bout the multiple posts...OOPS!! :lol:
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Hey sugarplum...Darren here... :rofl: :rofl: :wave:
maybe if you werent so bitchy and nasty and venomous...you would'nt get sarcastic remarks made to you.
you get just as good as you give. :grin: "
I tend to get bitchy and venomous when I deal with condescending people.
When did I become the topic anyway? The topic is the Montel show. Why don't you stick to it?
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On 2005-01-24 11:11:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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Hey sugarplum...Darren here... :rofl: :rofl: :wave:
maybe if you werent so bitchy and nasty and venomous...you would'nt get sarcastic remarks made to you.
you get just as good as you give. :wave: :lol:
D.
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I tend to get bitchy and venomous when I deal with condescending people.
When did I become the topic anyway? The topic is the Montel show. Why don't you stick to it?
:wave: :roll:
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On 2005-01-24 13:46:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
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I tend to get bitchy and venomous when I deal with condescending people.
When did I become the topic anyway? The topic is the Montel show. Why don't you stick to it?
:rofl:
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And Sara ... you just seem to be DRAWN to the "intelligence" here. Hello?!?! rofl :lol:
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On 2005-01-24 16:27:00, Anonymous wrote:
" And Sara ... you just seem to be DRAWN to the "intelligence" here. Hello?!?! rofl :lol: "
Touche'.
I thought about it too when I realized where this was going. I concede. I'll send a message to Ginger now to rename this to the "We Love LIFE/Growing Together" forum.
Enjoy.[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-24 18:05 ]
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On 2005-01-23 16:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
" Sure, I'll respond to your questions.
As for the "Abuse" that happened at GT - and the reports. Yep, that happened and was reported and hopefully the INDIVIDUAL who was admittedly guilty of that childish act was TREATED.
Was that a PRACTICE of GT?? NO.
Was he TOLD or TAUGHT to do that, BY GT?? NO.
Did GT deny it, or avoid it or fight against it ?? NO. The Director handled it very appropriatley.
Is this a fairly isolated incident? MOST LIKELY.
GT has been around for 15 plus years??!! HOW many reports like this have been made and confirmed in ALL those years?!?! Probably only this ONE.
When you work with disfunctional families and teens, do you expect things like this to NEVER happen in treatment?? Would be NICE... but we don't live in a perfect world.
Point is this. If you DON'T have a BETTER SOLUTION for troubled teens, using drugs, stealing, involved in breaking the law, being unruley... then PLEASE use your efforts to CREATE one! Tearing down programs that DO help and have MANY, MANY successes (much to your dismay) should NOT be shut down for isolated incidents.
This SAMMIE on MONTEL was a real drama queen. I DO NOT buy MOST of her story! I don't BUY that she sat in her feces and blood for days, or that she was SAT ON for 12 hours at a time, or in a room by herself for days, OR that she was RAPED by a "staff" person! DO NOT BUY IT!!
I personally think most the ABUSED on this site are out for the $$$! You want to SUE and get whatever you can get out of any of the founders, directors, etc.! MONEY motivated! I don't BUY that you're out there to SAVE our poor kids!
So, there's your answers. You won't like them, you are SO predictable in what you POST. You think you are SO much smarter or more well informed than ANYONE else. I'm sure that's what you NEED to do, in order to mask your insecurities, but it REALLY gets old and sickening.
And I'm sure you'll go off on the "oh, and you post anonymously". Well... is your name REALLY "Sara"?? I don't think so. Why don't you post your true FULL name!?? If you're not willing, then SHUT up about those who post anonymously! I choose NOT to post mine as I TRULEY feel like there are MANY "loose cannons" on this site (unbalanced, filled with hate and rage) and I do not choose to put my name out there, for them to then track down and harass. Like it or not.
I WON'T resort to calling you names, as you have calling Darren an "asshole". THAT says a LOT about you and your character right there."
I cant sue. Its too late for that.
What I can do is stop the future victims.
as far as what happened to me.. There are people out there who remember bits and pieces so why should I lie. And also dont you think Montel would do his home work before setting himself up for a suit.
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On 2005-01-23 16:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
This SAMMIE on MONTEL was a real drama queen. I DO NOT buy MOST of her story! I don't BUY that she sat in her feces and blood for days, or that she was SAT ON for 12 hours at a time, or in a room by herself for days, OR that she was RAPED by a "staff" person! DO NOT BUY IT!!
I personally think most the ABUSED on this site are out for the $$$! You want to SUE and get whatever you can get out of any of the founders, directors, etc.! MONEY motivated! I don't BUY that you're out there to SAVE our poor kids!
Well I was there and I do believe her. I didn't get sat on very much while I was in. I ALWAYS complied, except for the one time I flat out refused to break the first and most impotent rule by telling Group I was sorry for leaving and glad to have been dragged back in.
I have seen kids sat on for hours upon hours. Of course, I was complying, so that meant that I didn't pay any attention, even when they screamed out in pain. I was paying attention to the person talking and telling myself that they had done the necessary things to land up on the floor, etc.
I've seen kids refused permission to use the toilet till they peed, shit and/or had menstrual blood soaking their clothes. I've seen kids (hell, been one) who had one set of ugly, illfitting clothing to wear for a week or more and, due to the "no lending or borrowing" rule, just had to keep on sweating and freezing in those same rank clothes till their belongings were either replaced by their parents on open meeting night or caught up w/ them through the clothes room.
I know Sammie got marathoned. I remember that much. I remember the routine. Of course I can't swear to her having been in an intake room for two weeks alone becase she was alone so I wasn't in the room. And Staff certainly never came out and told us "oh, btw, Sammie's back but we're keeping her in an intake room for awhile." If one of them had been closed and not available to stuff like a sardine can w/ newcomers dropped off at 6 to wait for group at 9, no one would have dared question it.
And that's the real rub, kid. No one would dare question! So here's Rob. Rob's a Jr staffer or a trainee. For the uninitiated, that means he came in as a newcomer, went through all the riggors and mindfuck of the program, took to it like a fish to water and is now in a position of unquestioned authority over other kids.
No doubt, he could get away with it. No doubt there was the oportunity. No doubt the hormones were there. Do I know it happened? Of course not. Would I personally swear under oath that it did? That would be purjory cause I didn't see it. Would I allow my daughter to be placed in a similar situation knowing what I know? Fuck No!
I just want other parents who are now receiving a slick sales pitch from some edcon or intake coordinator or toughlove hategroup guru to stop and consider all of the circumstances. If they do, I'm pretty confident that they would never place their daughters and sons in those types of situations either.
I think animal testing is a terrible idea; they get all nervous and give the wrong answers.
-- A Bit of Fry and Laurie
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I know who this loser is that wrote the post.
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:nworthy:
And I never did send that note to Ginger! :smile:
Sammie, you've got a lot of people who believe in you. Never give up the fight.
Ginger, you putting together this board has resulted in a lot of positive changes - here's one:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... t=50#77579 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=7824&forum=9&start=50#77579)
Thank you for standing up for Sammie. :smile:
Anon - who knows who posted the shit about Sammie: I don't give one eighth of a shit who it was. I have some ideas about it being from one the ex-staff of LIFE/GT whose one big accomplishment in their life is that of being a former staffer.
And they tell us to "let it go"
:rofl:
There seem to be very few that acknowlege LIFE/KHK/GT as a metastasis of the Straight Inc. chain... but we're out here. :wave:[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-26 13:45 ]
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I had a foot injury at LIFE,and the blood and pus was soaking through to the outside of my shoe for about 2 weeks.A "nurse"(from Venice Hospital with thick eyeglasses and bug-eyed,with 2 daughters on staff)looked at my foot,during group session,and then had me put the shoe on again.I was "terminated" 2 days later for "misbehaving".I still have problem with that foot injury more than 20 yrs later.
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On 2005-01-27 20:59:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I had a foot injury at LIFE,and the blood and pus was soaking through to the outside of my shoe for about 2 weeks.A "nurse"(from Venice Hospital with thick eyeglasses and bug-eyed,with 2 daughters on staff)looked at my foot,during group session,and then had me put the shoe on again.I was "terminated" 2 days later for "misbehaving".I still have problem with that foot injury more than 20 yrs later."
How did your foot get injured? I keep hearing there was no abuse at LIFE. :roll:
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Much of the abuse in the programs occoured because of no professional supervision.There were people from 11 to 21 in LIFE.If you got some stronger 19 year old guy beating up on a weaker 15 year old guy then people will get injured.My bare foot was squeezed so hard and for so long by a (laughing) guy that was much older and bigger than me that my toenails cut in to my toes.There was not much access to soap and water or nail clippers so my foot became badly infected.My "old commer family" did nothing to help me even though the blood and infection soaked through my canvass shoes.Today I could probably correct this with minor surgery.
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Also,Petermann was slamming people in to the concrete walls with no warning and the intake rooms were used to soften up misbehavors.There were intake rooms in a row(Osprey Building),with small hole cut in the wall so a long thick telephone cable was passed through all of the rooms.This thick brown telephone cable would be twisted around various body parts by phaserscum to persuade you to relent.I will pay money for the opportunity to run a similar thick telephone cable up Petermann's ass and out her eye socket then hang her from tall mast on her sailing yacht for all of her neighbors and grandchildren to see.Ill do it.
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On 2005-01-28 08:15:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Much of the abuse in the programs occoured because of no professional supervision.There were people from 11 to 21 in LIFE.If you got some stronger 19 year old guy beating up on a weaker 15 year old guy then people will get injured.My bare foot was squeezed so hard and for so long by a (laughing) guy that was much older and bigger than me that my toenails cut in to my toes.There was not much access to soap and water or nail clippers so my foot became badly infected.My "old commer family" did nothing to help me even though the blood and infection soaked through my canvass shoes.Today I could probably correct this with minor surgery."
When I was there, the range was 11 to 24. Splitting hairs is pointless though. I too suffered bumps and bruises because I just happened to be sitting too close to a takedown.
It's funny - before college, I worked for the state prison system doing computer stuff. Had an inmate cut his finger on a wire stripper, and was immediately sent by the CO to the infirmary for some Neosporin and a band-aid.
Maybe you can look into a good foot and ankle surgeon and get some relief.
-
On 2005-01-28 08:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Also,Petermann was slamming people in to the concrete walls with no warning and the intake rooms were used to soften up misbehavors.There were intake rooms in a row(Osprey Building),with small hole cut in the wall so a long thick telephone cable was passed through all of the rooms.This thick brown telephone cable would be twisted around various body parts by phaserscum to persuade you to relent.I will pay money for the opportunity to run a similar thick telephone cable up Petermann's ass and out her eye socket then hang her from tall mast on her sailing yacht for all of her neighbors and grandchildren to see.Ill do it."
Threats don't work - in fact they really take away from any credibility.
-
On 2005-01-28 08:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Also,Petermann was slamming people in to the concrete walls with no warning and the intake rooms were used to soften up misbehavors.There were intake rooms in a row(Osprey Building),with small hole cut in the wall so a long thick telephone cable was passed through all of the rooms.This thick brown telephone cable would be twisted around various body parts by phaserscum to persuade you to relent.I will pay money for the opportunity to run a similar thick telephone cable up Petermann's ass and out her eye socket then hang her from tall mast on her sailing yacht for all of her neighbors and grandchildren to see.Ill do it."
I hate to imagine what happened to you to say such nasty shit...and threaten a someone on a public forum...sheesh man...sorta reminds me of mike tyson saying he wanted to eat lennox lewis' children. i sure am glad that the hole with the wire wasnt there when i went! :scared:
-
Still the cunt Sara?Thats the last time I offer to engage in regular conversation with you.I would like to see you next to Petermann dangling from that bloody cable.
-
On 2005-01-28 08:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Also,Petermann was slamming people in to the concrete walls with no warning and the intake rooms were used to soften up misbehavors.There were intake rooms in a row(Osprey Building),with small hole cut in the wall so a long thick telephone cable was passed through all of the rooms.This thick brown telephone cable would be twisted around various body parts by phaserscum to persuade you to relent.I will pay money for the opportunity to run a similar thick telephone cable up Petermann's ass and out her eye socket then hang her from tall mast on her sailing yacht for all of her neighbors and grandchildren to see.Ill do it."
First of all, you are SO SO full of it. There was ONE "intake room", and no cable anywhere near by.
Second - wow, are you a SICK MIND. I'll pray for you. May what you wish on others come back to YOU, 2 fold. sick sick sick
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On 2005-01-28 17:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Still the cunt Sara?Thats the last time I offer to engage in regular conversation with you.I would like to see you next to Petermann dangling from that bloody cable."
i'm wit sara and anon on this one...your making shit up just to try and fit in...freak! :wave:
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On 2005-01-28 17:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Still the cunt Sara?Thats the last time I offer to engage in regular conversation with you.I would like to see you next to Petermann dangling from that bloody cable."
Engaged me in regular conversation? When? You wanna go? Let's fucking GO then!
You have my email address, set up a meeting, coward!
-
::troll::
Our nada who art in nada, nada be thy name. Thy kingdom nada, thy will be nada as it is in nada. Give us this nada our daily nada and nada us our nada as we nada our nadas and nada us into nada but deliver us from nada; pues nada. Hail nothing full of nothing, nothing is with thee.
--Ernest Hemingway, American author
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"So So full of it"?
There were more than one room and there was in fact that beige/light brown thick telephone cable running between the rooms through a hole in the wall.That cable was put around my neck my "Mike Waters" and pulled tight.Did you arrive after possible renovations?Maybe I was being tortured in an ordinary office and not a designated "intake room".Go pray for yourself.
-
Mike
What year were you there?
-
I don't know about all that. The only contact I had w/ LIFE was going to school with a couple of girls from there and a 2 hour intake interview, which I walked away from.
In school, we weren't allowed to talk to them but they were allowed to talk to us. They were also allowed to wear makeup.
The intake was pretty much the same as a Straight intake, except that I was 18 and HRS and the local DA were hot on abusive practices in these programs at the time. I didn't know all that. I knew I was 18, though, and that I wasn't having any more of this shit.
I did get the feeling that they were a lot less brutal. More love bombing, less physical pain. But that doesn't mean that it wasn't a total mindfuck for those who did sign in. I have a hard time believing that Helen Peterman and George Ross somehow learned to treat substance abuse, quit accepting non addicted kids and quit being the berzerkers they were so prone to be when they worked at The Seed and/or Straight. They certainly took it on faith that I was an addict.
Never let your sense of
morals get in the way of
doing what's right
--Isaac Asimov
-
Helen Peterman was anything but the benevolent mother figure at the seed, this I can tell you. I have also heard stories but have no firsthand knowledge of what occured at Straight.
I have a very hard time believing LIFE was much different.
-
On 2005-01-29 19:30:00, GregFL wrote:
"Helen Peterman was anything but the benevolent mother figure at the seed, this I can tell you. I have also heard stories but have no firsthand knowledge of what occured at Straight.
I have a very hard time believing LIFE was much different.
"
I can atest to the fact that for most of 1989 the only time ms pete said BOO! was when someone acted out and attacked another phaser or caused such a horrible disturbance that staff couldnt handle it. i think maybe twice i saw her after my intake unless it was open meeting. so from the horrors most of you speak of LIfe(when i attended) was much different. and STEP was even farther away from the stories i have heard about GT and the seed etc. heck at step there was no such thing as a misbehaver! :grin:
Darren
-
Nothing sicker than four guys renching your arms behind a church pew (LIFE PROGRAM style chairs)while whispering in your ear "we love you".
-
On 2005-01-29 09:53:00, Antigen wrote:
"I don't know about all that. The only contact I had w/ LIFE was going to school with a couple of girls from there and a 2 hour intake interview, which I walked away from.
In school, we weren't allowed to talk to them but they were allowed to talk to us. They were also allowed to wear makeup.
The intake was pretty much the same as a Straight intake, except that I was 18 and HRS and the local DA were hot on abusive practices in these programs at the time. I didn't know all that. I knew I was 18, though, and that I wasn't having any more of this shit.
I did get the feeling that they were a lot less brutal. More love bombing, less physical pain. But that doesn't mean that it wasn't a total mindfuck for those who did sign in. I have a hard time believing that Helen Peterman and George Ross somehow learned to treat substance abuse, quit accepting non addicted kids and quit being the berzerkers they were so prone to be when they worked at The Seed and/or Straight. They certainly took it on faith that I was an addict.
I'm guessing the girls you saw at school were 6th phasers or 7th steppers. I can't remember at which phase you were allowed to wear makeup, or even put lotion on for that matter.
LIFE Definitely took it on faith that everyone was a druggie. I certainly wasn't on drugs, and as I've said before, I spent more times trying to cover up my mother's habits.
There's is another post about Helen Peterman not saying "boo" unless you were misbehaving. Well, I guess I was misbehaving by keeping my mouth shut, and hiding behind my hair - usually crying. Petermann would actually interrupt raps in progress to stand me up.
She storms in one day. SARA _______ - STAND UP!
I was bewildered... I didn't do a damned thing outside of the ordinary. Hell, I didn't do shit to wind up there in the first place, so I was a little bit afraid that someone was actually going to produce of few kilos of drugs by this time.
I stood there while she said things like "you think you're so smart / you think we don't know what you're doing / we know just what you're doing, and if you think you're going to get away with it, you'll go straight to Palms (Psych hospital we were all threatened with)"
For the life of me - I have no idea what I did. She ended the "mini rap" by addressing the group "It's people like Sara that you have to look out for - they look like librarians, but they're up to something"
I never did find out what brought that on. At the time I was shocked that she would even find out I was singing a folk tune - "I Shall Be Released" in my head. That didn't even constitute "rocking out"!
I also watched her pull hair on other kids. This was not a nice woman.[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-30 03:59 ][ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-30 04:01 ]
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Lots of kids CAME from "Palms" because their parents insurance money ran out.The first time I ever haloucinated was from drugs forced in me in Palms.In the Palms they would hold Kangaroo Court downstairs in a little room to "temporary court order" kids involuntarily in to LIFE.My HRS counciler (truency) told my parents about LIFE and the judge went along with it.
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On 2005-01-29 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Nothing sicker than four guys renching your arms behind a church pew (LIFE PROGRAM style chairs)while whispering in your ear "we love you"."
:rofl: The "I love you " part got me! :lol:
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On 2005-01-29 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Nothing sicker than four guys renching your arms behind a church pew (LIFE PROGRAM style chairs)while whispering in your ear "we love you"."
why were your arms wrenched while they professed there love to you?
-
Part of the mindfuck of 'we're doing this for your own good because we love you'. :roll: Pretty fucking sick!!!!!!!!!!!
Nothing can be more contrary to religion and the clergy than reason and common sense.
--Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright
-
On 2005-01-30 09:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-29 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Nothing sicker than four guys renching your arms behind a church pew (LIFE PROGRAM style chairs)while whispering in your ear "we love you"."
why were your arms wrenched while they professed there love to you?"
Damn, I really wish I could remember some names! There was a guy who was always hanging on this one newcomer - I mean in a really suspect way... kinda like the way a guy would cuddle his significant other. This was right in group - and no one questioned it. It was creepy. Poor newcomer kid was creeped out too, he always had this "someone help me" look on his face.
Good ol' program love...whether you want it or not! :roll:
-
On 2005-01-30 09:34:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 09:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-29 23:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Nothing sicker than four guys renching your arms behind a church pew (LIFE PROGRAM style chairs)while whispering in your ear "we love you"."
why were your arms wrenched while they professed there love to you?"
Damn, I really wish I could remember some names! There was a guy who was always hanging on this one newcomer - I mean in a really suspect way... kinda like the way a guy would cuddle his significant other. This was right in group - and no one questioned it. It was creepy. Poor newcomer kid was creeped out too, he always had this "someone help me" look on his face.
Good ol' program love...whether you want it or not! :roll:
"
ewww! that means the program made every guy gay...just dont tell my wife! :roll:
-
ewww! that means the program made every guy gay...just dont tell my wife! :roll: "
Jumping to conclusions again?
I just said it was creepy that this guys arms were all around the poor kid, when the kid didn't want them there. Where did I say "gay"?
_________________
"I was a long time coming
I'll be a long time gone
you've got your whole life to do something
and that's not very long"
- Ani DiFranco[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-30 09:42 ]
-
On 2005-01-30 09:31:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"Part of the mindfuck of 'we're doing this for your own good because we love you'. :roll: Pretty fucking sick!!!!!!!!!!!Nothing can be more contrary to religion and the clergy than reason and common sense.
--Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright
"
I sat next to a couple of restaints and i never heard them wisper"I love you"...it was more like...when are you gonna stop punching people for no reason you freak!
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On 2005-01-30 09:31:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"Part of the mindfuck of 'we're doing this for your own good because we love you'. :roll: Pretty fucking sick!!!!!!!!!!!Nothing can be more contrary to religion and the clergy than reason and common sense.
--Francois Marie Arouet "Voltaire", French author and playwright
"
I sat next to a couple of restraints and i never heard them wisper"I love you"...it was more like...when are you gonna stop punching people for no reason you freak!
-
On 2005-01-30 09:41:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
ewww! that means the program made every guy gay...just dont tell my wife! :grin:
-
you implied it with your creepy statement...your gaydar was on! :grin: "
What's creepy is being hung on and touched when you don't want to be. Believe me, I'm quite heterosexual, but if some guy (aside from my beloved) started hanging on me, I'd feel compelled to deck him.
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On 2005-01-30 09:43:00, Anonymous wrote:
I sat next to a couple of restraints and i never heard them wisper"I love you"...it was more like...when are you gonna stop punching people for no reason you freak! "
I heard that said to kids being restrained more than a few times. And even the ones to whom that wasn't directly said, they got the message. After they finally conformed they were bombarded with all the I love you's. Dissension and critical thinking was met with humiliation and punishment, conformity was met with "love".I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the dictator.
--GW Büsh, CNN.com, December 18, 2000
-
I heard that said to kids being restrained more than a few times. And even the ones to whom that wasn't directly said, they got the message. After they finally conformed they were bombarded with all the I love you's. Dissension and critical thinking was met with humiliation and punishment, conformity was met with "love".
Maybe. In LIFE, I recall one instance when a person was being restrained on the floor between the guys and the girls, and everone was chanting "We love you John".
Hey, I remembered a name! I just can't see his face! :roll:
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On 2005-01-30 09:43:00, Anonymous wrote:
I sat next to a couple of restraints and i never heard them wisper"I love you
Clarification....THIS is what I heard on more than a few occasions. The restrainer telling the restrainee that it was for their own good and it was because they were loved. Wasn't sure if that was clear or not.
I also remember group yelling "Love ya so and so" to the person on the floor. A free man must be able to endure it when his fellow men act and live otherwise than he considers proper. He must free himself from the habit, just as soon as something does not please him, of calling for the police.
Ludwig Von Mises
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On 2005-01-30 10:23:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 09:43:00, Anonymous wrote:
I sat next to a couple of restraints and i never heard them wisper"I love you
Clarification....THIS is what I heard on more than a few occasions. The restrainer telling the restrainee that it was for their own good and it was because they were loved. Wasn't sure if that was clear or not.
I also remember group yelling "Love ya so and so" to the person on the floor. A free man must be able to endure it when his fellow men act and live otherwise than he considers proper. He must free himself from the habit, just as soon as something does not please him, of calling for the police.
Ludwig Von Mises
"
i do remember the "i love ya so and so" to the jerk on the floor! :rofl:
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On 2005-01-30 09:51:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 09:43:00, Anonymous wrote:
I sat next to a couple of restraints and i never heard them wisper"I love you"...it was more like...when are you gonna stop punching people for no reason you freak! "
I heard that said to kids being restrained more than a few times. And even the ones to whom that wasn't directly said, they got the message. After they finally conformed they were bombarded with all the I love you's. Dissension and critical thinking was met with humiliation and punishment, conformity was met with "love".I told all four that there are going to be some times where we don't
agree with each other, but that's OK. If this were a dictatorship, it
would be a heck of a lot easier, just so long as I'm the dictator.
--GW Büsh, CNN.com, December 18, 2000
"
what were these innocent people restrained for?...you bet that if some jerk whispered in my ear that he was gonna hit me cuz he wanted out of there...he hit me and was restrained...i'd fold his arm like a pretzel and make him say UNCLE!!! fuck the love ya crap...you hit...you get put down...you run to the door and fight when they bring ya back...your going down...a fist flys...your going down...i never saw anyone restrained for anything but violence.conform to a non violent life!
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On 2005-01-30 13:54:00, Anonymous wrote
I also remember group yelling "Love ya so and so" to the person on the floor.
i do remember the "i love ya so and so" to the jerk on the floor! :rofl: "
Yeah, I remember this one "jerk" 12 year old girl that was slammed to the floor because she started crying when the director called her a fucking whore while spitting in her face. Sheeeesh, what a "jerk" she was. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: Perhaps the sentiments contained in the following
pages, are not yet sufficiently fashionable to procure them
general favor; a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong,
gives it a superficial appearance of being right, and raises
at first a formidable outcry in defence of custom. But the
tumult soon subsides. Time makes more converts than reason.
Thomas Paine, Common Sense
-
On 2005-01-30 14:00:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 13:54:00, Anonymous wrote
I also remember group yelling "Love ya so and so" to the person on the floor.
i do remember the "i love ya so and so" to the jerk on the floor! :rofl: "
Yeah, I remember this one "jerk" 12 year old girl that was slammed to the floor because she started crying when the director called her a fucking whore while spitting in her face. Sheeeesh, what a "jerk" she was. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: Perhaps the sentiments contained in the following
pages, are not yet sufficiently fashionable to procure them
general favor; a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong,
gives it a superficial appearance of being right, and raises
at first a formidable outcry in defence of custom. But the
tumult soon subsides. Time makes more converts than reason.
Thomas Paine, Common Sense
"
wow...thats so freakin hard to believe...not that it's not true...i dont know...but i never saw that before! whoa! was this at life? when?
-
what were these innocent people restrained for?...
These are some of the things I can think of off the top of my head...
1. Not having feet flat on the floor
2. Slouching in your chair
3. Crying when called a whore/slut/bitch etc.
4. Crying when told "you probably couldn't even fuck a coke bottle"
5. Refusing to eat spoiled food
6. Pissing in your pants after being denied permission to use the bathroom for 10 hours
7. Not "paying attention" to the person speaking
8. Putting through COC that you wanted to leave
9. Asking to call HRS
10. Not motivating
The list is endlessBureaucracy defends the status quo long past the time when the quo has lost its status
--Laurence J. Peter
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spit?? fucking whore? holy hell! can a human do that to a twelve year old? like i have said a ton of times...im glad i NEVER saw that before.
D.
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On 2005-01-30 14:05:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
what were these innocent people restrained for?...
These are some of the things I can think of off the top of my head...
1. Not having feet flat on the floor
2. Slouching in your chair
3. Crying when called a whore/slut/bitch etc.
4. Crying when told "you probably couldn't even fuck a coke bottle"
5. Refusing to eat spoiled food
6. Pissing in your pants after being denied permission to use the bathroom for 10 hours
7. Not "paying attention" to the person speaking
8. Putting through COC that you wanted to leave
9. Asking to call HRS
10. Not motivating
The list is endlessBureaucracy defends the status quo long past the time when the quo has lost its status
--Laurence J. Peter
"
Just unreal dude! i missed the worst of it i guess.
i remember a guy...a kid really...maybe 14 or so...anyway he would sit there...would never motivate...sing anything...would talk out to 5th phasers...they only ignored him...in fact it was only until he started pulling 1 or two hairs at a time out of the top of his head till he had a smooth bald spot did they finally terminate him...just one day he left and never came back.
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On 2005-01-30 14:06:00, Anonymous wrote:
"spit?? fucking whore? holy hell! can a human do that to a twelve year old? like i have said a ton of times...im glad i NEVER saw that before.
D."
Yeah, Darren, we know. You saw no evil.
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On 2005-01-30 14:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
Just unreal dude! i missed the worst of it i guess.
i remember a guy...a kid really...maybe 14 or so...anyway he would sit there...would never motivate...sing anything...would talk out to 5th phasers...they only ignored him...in fact it was only until he started pulling 1 or two hairs at a time out of the top of his head till he had a smooth bald spot did they finally terminate him...just one day he left and never came back."
And you don't see anything fucked up about that? :eek: If it is believed that... elementary schools will be better managed by the governor and council, the commissioners of the literary fund or any other general authority of the government than by the parents within each ward, it is a belief against all experience.
Thomas Jefferson
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On 2005-01-30 14:15:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 14:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
Just unreal dude! i missed the worst of it i guess.
i remember a guy...a kid really...maybe 14 or so...anyway he would sit there...would never motivate...sing anything...would talk out to 5th phasers...they only ignored him...in fact it was only until he started pulling 1 or two hairs at a time out of the top of his head till he had a smooth bald spot did they finally terminate him...just one day he left and never came back."
And you don't see anything fucked up about that? :eek: If it is believed that... elementary schools will be better managed by the governor and council, the commissioners of the literary fund or any other general authority of the government than by the parents within each ward, it is a belief against all experience.
Thomas Jefferson
"
yeah...that kid needed mental help.
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On 2005-01-30 14:14:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 14:06:00, Anonymous wrote:
"spit?? fucking whore? holy hell! can a human do that to a twelve year old? like i have said a ton of times...im glad i NEVER saw that before.
D."
Yeah, Darren, we know. You saw no evil."
picturing a monkey with hands over the eyes arent you? :lol:
nothing that would compare to the horrors you have spoken of sara.
D.
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yeah...that kid needed mental help."
Well, by your own posting he didn't start pulling his hair out until after he was in there. You don't see anything fucked up about that?And suffering is not a badge of honor. Experiencing tyranny does not deserve a bow or a kiss. The honor is in removing the stumbling stone. The honor is in the impolite destruction of tyranny through honest, powerful dialogue - not etiquette. Not political correctness.
Maximus
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On 2005-01-30 15:24:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"yeah...that kid needed mental help."
Well, by your own posting he didn't start pulling his hair out until after he was in there. You don't see anything fucked up about that?And suffering is not a badge of honor. Experiencing tyranny does not deserve a bow or a kiss. The honor is in removing the stumbling stone. The honor is in the impolite destruction of tyranny through honest, powerful dialogue - not etiquette. Not political correctness.
Maximus
"
his parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!
-
And suffering is not a badge of honor. Experiencing tyranny does not deserve a bow or a kiss. The honor is in removing the stumbling stone. The honor is in the impolite destruction of tyranny through honest, powerful dialogue - not etiquette. Not political correctness.
'nuff said!
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On 2005-01-30 15:49:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
And suffering is not a badge of honor. Experiencing tyranny does not deserve a bow or a kiss. The honor is in removing the stumbling stone. The honor is in the impolite destruction of tyranny through honest, powerful dialogue - not etiquette. Not political correctness.
'nuff said!"
ooops! That was me... Cayo, you're rubbing off on me!
-
On 2005-01-30 15:34:00, Anonymous wrotehis parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!"
He didn't start pulling his hair out until AFTER he was in there a while. Doesn't take a professional to see that there's something really fucking wrong with that.If we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them but to inform their discretion by education
--Thomas Jefferson
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On 2005-01-30 16:02:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 15:34:00, Anonymous wrotehis parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!"
He didn't start pulling his hair out until AFTER he was in there a while. Doesn't take a professional to see that there's something really fucking wrong with that.If we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them but to inform their discretion by education
--Thomas Jefferson
"
about a week...yeah...his probs came before the program.
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On 2005-01-30 14:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
you run to the door and fight when they bring ya back...your going down...a fist flys...your going down...
Wait a second. Since when is trying to run away an act of violence. Don't get me wrong, there was a day when I thought that it was perfectly reasonable to violently tackle someone for trying to get away from the all loving Group. But then I snapped out of it.
Oh, btw, I was sat on for refusing to apologize to Group for running away. I didn't even raise my voice, let alone cuss them out. Every time they asked, I just said the same thing, like name rank and serial number; "I can't apologize because it wouldn't be honest. I'm not sorry I left." or "I don't understand what you're upset about. Joe (or whoever) just stood up and told me what a worthless piece of shit I am, everyone seems to agree. All I did was deprive you of my company for awhile." of "If I were you, I'd kick me out immediately!"
It really seemed to piss Chris Casselor off to NO end that I wouldn't get mad. It was worth getting sat on for awhile, it really was! :wink:
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On 2005-01-30 14:06:00, Anonymous wrote:
"spit?? fucking whore? holy hell! can a human do that to a twelve year old? like i have said a ton of times...im glad i NEVER saw that before.
D."
No, but it's said that Newt and Mrs. Peterman never had any real problem with it.
And you just described, not only seeing it before, but participating. Just that you thought it was justified.
-
On 2005-01-30 16:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
about a week...yeah...his probs came before the program."
And exactly how do you know this? Because staff said? Just like they said it was OK to gang up on a kid for a violent takedown if they tried to get away? Jesus Christ! This is rare, though. Usually people either remember the details or they support the program. Rarely does anyone do both.
Wes dug up the most astounding interview. I'm sure it's still somewhere on his site; the man's a total packrat. It's an interview w/, I think, Bobby DuPont or Virgil Newton (can't remember offhand) The reporter asked him about observing newcomers on the toilet and he explained that the Program causes many kids to become suicidal because of withdrawal from marijuana. I shit you not!
But they knew. That's the bottom line. They knew kids became suicidal after intake. Whether or not they believed that it was attributable to withdrawal from MJ (especially in kids who'd never even seen the shit!) is anybody's guess. As you've demonstrated, there's virtually no limit to human capacity for self desception.
-
On 2005-01-30 16:55:00, Antigen wrote:
Because staff said?
OMG Ginger. I did a spit-take on that one!! Staff said. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Hands that help are far better then lips that pray.
--Robert G. Ingersoll, American politician and lecturer
-
"Since when is trying to run away an act of violence"
i actually said run then fight...you try to go get someone who is yanking on the door and they take a swing at you cuz they dont want to go back to the pews...hey i didnt want to be there either but if i tried to hit someone i was expecting to be restrained!
-
On 2005-01-30 17:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Since when is trying to run away an act of violence"
i actually said run then fight...you try to go get someone who is yanking on the door and they take a swing at you cuz they dont want to go back to the pews...hey i didnt want to be there either but if i tried to hit someone i was expecting to be restrained!"
Why not just let them walk thru the door? No laws were being broken, and you can't truly say they are a danger to themselves by walking thru a door. You probably walk thru a door every morning to go to work, don't you? Should your wife call in the posse?
-
The reporter asked him about observing newcomers on the toilet and he explained that the Program causes many kids to become suicidal because of withdrawal from marijuana. I shit you not!
now thats the biggest bunch of crap i ever read...the staff memeber actually SAID THAT? :rofl:
-
On 2005-01-30 17:07:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Since when is trying to run away an act of violence"
i actually said run then fight...you try to go get someone who is yanking on the door and they take a swing at you cuz they dont want to go back to the pews...hey i didnt want to be there either but if i tried to hit someone i was expecting to be restrained!"
Why not just let them walk thru the door? No laws were being broken, and you can't truly say they are a danger to themselves by walking thru a door. You probably walk thru a door every morning to go to work, don't you? Should your wife call in the posse?"
:rofl: my wife cant wait for me to leave! J/K :wink:
-
And exactly how do you know this? Because staff said? Just like they said it was OK to gang up on a kid for a violent takedown if they tried to get away? Jesus Christ! This is rare, though. Usually people either remember the details or they support the program. Rarely does anyone do both.
because he came in while i was there...i just figured that he REALLY didnt want to be there!
-
On 2005-01-30 17:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
"The reporter asked him about observing newcomers on the toilet and he explained that the Program causes many kids to become suicidal because of withdrawal from marijuana. I shit you not!
now thats the biggest bunch of crap i ever read...the staff memeber actually SAID THAT? :rofl: "
Really, now? I heard from a program parent that the toilet thing was no different that that of the toileting procedures in the military. :???:
-
On 2005-01-30 17:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:07:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Since when is trying to run away an act of violence"
i actually said run then fight...you try to go get someone who is yanking on the door and they take a swing at you cuz they dont want to go back to the pews...hey i didnt want to be there either but if i tried to hit someone i was expecting to be restrained!"
Why not just let them walk thru the door? No laws were being broken, and you can't truly say they are a danger to themselves by walking thru a door. You probably walk thru a door every morning to go to work, don't you? Should your wife call in the posse?"
:rofl: my wife cant wait for me to leave! J/K :rofl:
_________________
"I was a long time coming
I'll be a long time gone
you've got your whole life to do something
and that's not very long"
- Ani DiFranco[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-30 17:16 ]
-
On 2005-01-30 17:15:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:07:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Since when is trying to run away an act of violence"
i actually said run then fight...you try to go get someone who is yanking on the door and they take a swing at you cuz they dont want to go back to the pews...hey i didnt want to be there either but if i tried to hit someone i was expecting to be restrained!"
Why not just let them walk thru the door? No laws were being broken, and you can't truly say they are a danger to themselves by walking thru a door. You probably walk thru a door every morning to go to work, don't you? Should your wife call in the posse?"
:rofl: my wife cant wait for me to leave! J/K :rofl:
_________________
"I was a long time coming
I'll be a long time gone
you've got your whole life to do something
and that's not very long"
- Ani DiFranco[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-30 17:16 ]"
bite me bitch...just trying to lighten up the mood a bit.
D.
-
On 2005-01-30 17:19:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:15:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:07:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Since when is trying to run away an act of violence"
i actually said run then fight...you try to go get someone who is yanking on the door and they take a swing at you cuz they dont want to go back to the pews...hey i didnt want to be there either but if i tried to hit someone i was expecting to be restrained!"
Why not just let them walk thru the door? No laws were being broken, and you can't truly say they are a danger to themselves by walking thru a door. You probably walk thru a door every morning to go to work, don't you? Should your wife call in the posse?"
:rofl: my wife cant wait for me to leave! J/K :rofl:
_________________
"I was a long time coming
I'll be a long time gone
you've got your whole life to do something
and that's not very long"
- Ani DiFranco[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-01-30 17:16 ]"
bite me bitch...just trying to lighten up the mood a bit.
D."
Oh yeah, and you're not vindictive - not in the least! :roll:
-
Mommy please make it stop. I'm getting dizzy again. :lol:
-
i was trying to make a funny to make ya laugh not get nasty but as usual...a rude comment. get a sense of humor. :grin:
D.
-
On 2005-01-30 17:30:00, Anonymous wrote:
"i was trying to make a funny to make ya laugh not get nasty but as usual...a rude comment. get a sense of humor. :grin:
D."
I'm laughing my ass of over here. There you go with your assumptions again!
-
On 2005-01-30 14:05:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
what were these innocent people restrained for?...
These are some of the things I can think of off the top of my head...
1. Not having feet flat on the floor
2. Slouching in your chair
3. Crying when called a whore/slut/bitch etc.
4. Crying when told "you probably couldn't even fuck a coke bottle"
5. Refusing to eat spoiled food
6. Pissing in your pants after being denied permission to use the bathroom for 10 hours
7. Not "paying attention" to the person speaking
8. Putting through COC that you wanted to leave
9. Asking to call HRS
10. Not motivating
The list is endlessBureaucracy defends the status quo long past the time when the quo has lost its status
--Laurence J. Peter
"
From what I understand, STRAIGHT was MUCH more "military" than LIFE. I heard they had to sit up straight, edge of bench and feet on floor, hands on knees. This was never the case at LIFE.
I even attended an Open Meeting at STRAIGHT in '90 (St. Pete), ad yes, they were all sitting that way- which was bizarre to me.
-
And your point?
-
On 2005-01-30 18:48:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 14:05:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
what were these innocent people restrained for?...
These are some of the things I can think of off the top of my head...
1. Not having feet flat on the floor
2. Slouching in your chair
3. Crying when called a whore/slut/bitch etc.
4. Crying when told "you probably couldn't even fuck a coke bottle"
5. Refusing to eat spoiled food
6. Pissing in your pants after being denied permission to use the bathroom for 10 hours
7. Not "paying attention" to the person speaking
8. Putting through COC that you wanted to leave
9. Asking to call HRS
10. Not motivating
The list is endlessBureaucracy defends the status quo long past the time when the quo has lost its status
--Laurence J. Peter
"
From what I understand, STRAIGHT was MUCH more "military" than LIFE. I heard they had to sit up straight, edge of bench and feet on floor, hands on knees. This was never the case at LIFE.
I even attended an Open Meeting at STRAIGHT in '90 (St. Pete), ad yes, they were all sitting that way- which was bizarre to me."
I had a grad from LIFE in the early 80s that lived with us for a while. Funny, she remembers all of the shit I listed above at LIFE.I hold it to be the inalienable right of anybody to go to hell in his own way.
--Robert Frost, American poet
-
On 2005-01-30 16:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:02:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 15:34:00, Anonymous wrotehis parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!"
He didn't start pulling his hair out until AFTER he was in there a while. Doesn't take a professional to see that there's something really fucking wrong with that
about a week...yeah...his probs came before the program."
How in the HELL do you know anything about his "problems" before coming in there? You also said that they didn't terminate him until he had a smooth bald spot on his head from pulling the hairs out one by one. Did someone NOT notice BEFORE it got to the point where it was smooth and bald??? If not, WHY THE FUCK NOT??? At the very least[/b] that is neglect. But in my book it's abuse. The attitude of "he's just doing it for attention" or "he just wants out of the program" is abhorent.Come in the evening, or come in the morning; Come when you 're looked for, or come without warning.
-- Thomas O. Davis (1814-1845): The Welcome.
-
On 2005-01-30 17:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
"The reporter asked him about observing newcomers on the toilet and he explained that the Program causes many kids to become suicidal because of withdrawal from marijuana. I shit you not!
now thats the biggest bunch of crap i ever read...the staff memeber actually SAID THAT? :rofl: "
Well, actually it's not the biggest load of crap I ever heard from a staffer. Probably not even in the top ten.
But here's the quote
These kids, board from months or years of doing nothing but sitting in straight-back chairs, contemplated or attempted suicide to escape being spat upon, sexually abused, beaten, starved, ridiculed, denied sleep. So many kids attempted suicide that in 1983, defending Straight's position on accompanying kids into bathrooms, Straight's national executive director Bill Oliver acknowledged that:
A fair number of [Straight] kids have attempted suicide or contemplated suicide. We cannot leave them alone . . . We had one instance where a young lady tried to hang herself with a towel in the bathroom.(32)
Here's the link: http://www.thestraights.com/theprogram/suicides.htm (http://www.thestraights.com/theprogram/suicides.htm)
Now, I know the above quote refers to Straight, not LIFE. And I take it that you probably still think there's a significant difference between the two programs. Well, just hunker and watch. May your days be joyously challenging and your words artfully true.
--Ginger Warbis
-
On 2005-01-31 10:19:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:02:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 15:34:00, Anonymous wrotehis parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!"
He didn't start pulling his hair out until AFTER he was in there a while. Doesn't take a professional to see that there's something really fucking wrong with that
about a week...yeah...his probs came before the program."
How in the HELL do you know anything about his "problems" before coming in there? You also said that they didn't terminate him until he had a smooth bald spot on his head from pulling the hairs out one by one. Did someone NOT notice BEFORE it got to the point where it was smooth and bald??? If not, WHY THE FUCK NOT??? At the very least[/b] that is neglect. But in my book it's abuse. The attitude of "he's just doing it for attention" or "he just wants out of the program" is abhorent.Come in the evening, or come in the morning; Come when you 're looked for, or come without warning.
-- Thomas O. Davis (1814-1845): The Welcome.
"
abhorent maybe...but it might also be true! :grin:
-
On 2005-01-31 10:22:00, Antigen wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 17:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
"The reporter asked him about observing newcomers on the toilet and he explained that the Program causes many kids to become suicidal because of withdrawal from marijuana. I shit you not!
now thats the biggest bunch of crap i ever read...the staff memeber actually SAID THAT? :rofl: "
Well, actually it's not the biggest load of crap I ever heard from a staffer. Probably not even in the top ten.
But here's the quote
These kids, board from months or years of doing nothing but sitting in straight-back chairs, contemplated or attempted suicide to escape being spat upon, sexually abused, beaten, starved, ridiculed, denied sleep. So many kids attempted suicide that in 1983, defending Straight's position on accompanying kids into bathrooms, Straight's national executive director Bill Oliver acknowledged that:
A fair number of [Straight] kids have attempted suicide or contemplated suicide. We cannot leave them alone . . . We had one instance where a young lady tried to hang herself with a towel in the bathroom.(32)
Here's the link: http://www.thestraights.com/theprogram/suicides.htm (http://www.thestraights.com/theprogram/suicides.htm)
Now, I know the above quote refers to Straight, not LIFE. And I take it that you probably still think there's a significant difference between the two programs. Well, just hunker and watch. May your days be joyously challenging and your words artfully true.
--Ginger Warbis
"
maybe it was the time period that i went to LIFE/STEP? very heinous stuff went on at straight thats for sure!
-
On 2005-01-31 18:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 10:19:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:02:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 15:34:00, Anonymous wrotehis parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!"
He didn't start pulling his hair out until AFTER he was in there a while. Doesn't take a professional to see that there's something really fucking wrong with that
about a week...yeah...his probs came before the program."
How in the HELL do you know anything about his "problems" before coming in there? You also said that they didn't terminate him until he had a smooth bald spot on his head from pulling the hairs out one by one. Did someone NOT notice BEFORE it got to the point where it was smooth and bald??? If not, WHY THE FUCK NOT??? At the very least[/b] that is neglect. But in my book it's abuse. The attitude of "he's just doing it for attention" or "he just wants out of the program" is abhorent.Come in the evening, or come in the morning; Come when you 're looked for, or come without warning.
-- Thomas O. Davis (1814-1845): The Welcome.
"
abhorent maybe...but it might also be true! :grin: "
That's not what you said. You said he had problems before he came in. I'm asking you HOW do you know that???I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotism.
--Albert Einstein, German-born American physicist
-
On 2005-01-31 18:24:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 10:19:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 16:02:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-30 15:34:00, Anonymous wrotehis parents and the program did not do a psych eval. on him. the kid needed to be admitted to the psych ward!"
He didn't start pulling his hair out until AFTER he was in there a while. Doesn't take a professional to see that there's something really fucking wrong with that
about a week...yeah...his probs came before the program."
How in the HELL do you know anything about his "problems" before coming in there? You also said that they didn't terminate him until he had a smooth bald spot on his head from pulling the hairs out one by one. Did someone NOT notice BEFORE it got to the point where it was smooth and bald??? If not, WHY THE FUCK NOT??? At the very least[/b] that is neglect. But in my book it's abuse. The attitude of "he's just doing it for attention" or "he just wants out of the program" is abhorent.Come in the evening, or come in the morning; Come when you 're looked for, or come without warning.
-- Thomas O. Davis (1814-1845): The Welcome.
"
abhorent maybe...but it might also be true! :grin: "
That's not what you said. You said he had problems before he came in. I'm asking you HOW do you know that???I cannot imagine a God who rewards and punishes the objects of his creation, whose purposes are modeled after our own -- a God, in short, who is but a reflection of human frailty. Neither can I believe that the individual survives the death of his body, although feeble souls harbor such thoughts through fear or ridiculous egotism.
--Albert Einstein, German-born American physicist
"
i dont believe that sitting on a bench for a week causes someone to pull the hair out of there head...i assume you will retort that one week in LIFE could do that to a person...i say thats a load of bullshit.
-
On 2005-01-31 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
i dont believe that sitting on a bench for a week causes someone to pull the hair out of there head...i assume you will retort that one week in LIFE could do that to a person...i say thats a load of bullshit."
No, sitting on a bench for a week does not cause someone to pull their hair out. What happens to that person WHILE they are sitting on that bench has very much to do with it.
What about my other question? Did NO ONE notice that he was doing this to an obvious degree of excess???? Do you really believe that it's OK to ignore something like that?
BTW...PLEASE learn how to use the quote feature properly. You're staring to make me dizzy! :grin: Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis.
--Sigmund Freud, Austrian-born psychologist
-
On 2005-01-31 18:18:00, Anonymous
How in the HELL do you know anything about his "problems" before coming in there? You also said that they didn't terminate him until he had a smooth bald spot on his head from pulling the hairs out one by one. Did someone NOT notice BEFORE it got to the point where it was smooth and bald??? If not, WHY THE FUCK NOT??? At the very least[/b] that is neglect. But in my book it's abuse. The attitude of "he's just doing it for attention" or "he just wants out of the program" is abhorent
abhorent maybe...but it might also be true! :grin: "
By your own statement it WASN'T true. He was taken to a mental hospital correct?? Yeah, that's real fucking funny. More program compassion there huh?The drug war places Leo in a round room and instructs him to piss in a corner.
--Antigen
-
On 2005-01-31 18:36:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
i dont believe that sitting on a bench for a week causes someone to pull the hair out of there head...i assume you will retort that one week in LIFE could do that to a person...i say thats a load of bullshit."
No, sitting on a bench for a week does not cause someone to pull their hair out. What happens to that person WHILE they are sitting on that bench has very much to do with it.
What about my other question? Did NO ONE notice that he was doing this to an obvious degree of excess???? Do you really believe that it's OK to ignore something like that?
BTW...PLEASE learn how to use the quote feature properly. You're staring to make me dizzy! :grin: Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis.
--Sigmund Freud, Austrian-born psychologist
"
i hate quoting so sorry for the dizziness i caused you...hey...did you know that wanting to get dizzy as a child means that you will use drugs as a teen?
that was what my mom steo mom told my wife and i when she put my step brother and sister in the program...now thats a load of shit!
anyway...it was very hard to tell at first what he was doing...it was like on hair at a time and by the time they checked him out it was the size of a half dollar. im sure someone said something to staff but havent they seen it all before...why would this display make them freak out?
-
On 2005-01-31 18:36:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
i dont believe that sitting on a bench for a week causes someone to pull the hair out of there head...i assume you will retort that one week in LIFE could do that to a person...i say thats a load of bullshit."
No, sitting on a bench for a week does not cause someone to pull their hair out. What happens to that person WHILE they are sitting on that bench has very much to do with it.
What about my other question? Did NO ONE notice that he was doing this to an obvious degree of excess???? Do you really believe that it's OK to ignore something like that?
BTW...PLEASE learn how to use the quote feature properly. You're staring to make me dizzy! :grin: Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis.
--Sigmund Freud, Austrian-born psychologist
"
i hate quoting so sorry for the dizziness i caused you...hey...did you know that wanting to get dizzy as a child means that you will use drugs as a teen?
that was what my step mom told my wife and i when she put my step brother and sister in the program...now thats a load of shit!
anyway...it was very hard to tell at first what he was doing...it was like on hair at a time and by the time they checked him out it was the size of a half dollar. im sure someone said something to staff but havent they seen it all before...why would this display make them freak out?
-
On 2005-01-31 18:41:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:36:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
i dont believe that sitting on a bench for a week causes someone to pull the hair out of there head...i assume you will retort that one week in LIFE could do that to a person...i say thats a load of bullshit."
No, sitting on a bench for a week does not cause someone to pull their hair out. What happens to that person WHILE they are sitting on that bench has very much to do with it.
What about my other question? Did NO ONE notice that he was doing this to an obvious degree of excess???? Do you really believe that it's OK to ignore something like that?
BTW...PLEASE learn how to use the quote feature properly. You're staring to make me dizzy! :grin: Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis.
--Sigmund Freud, Austrian-born psychologist
"
i hate quoting so sorry for the dizziness i caused you...hey...did you know that wanting to get dizzy as a child means that you will use drugs as a teen?
that was what my mom steo mom told my wife and i when she put my step brother and sister in the program...now thats a load of shit!
anyway...it was very hard to tell at first what he was doing...it was like on hair at a time and by the time they checked him out it was the size of a half dollar. im sure someone said something to staff but havent they seen it all before...why would this display make them freak out?"
Why would this "display" make them freak??? :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: The lust for power, for dominating others, inflames the heart more than any other passion
Tacitus
-
On 2005-01-31 18:46:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:41:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:36:00, Cayo Hueso wrote:
"
On 2005-01-31 18:29:00, Anonymous wrote:
i dont believe that sitting on a bench for a week causes someone to pull the hair out of there head...i assume you will retort that one week in LIFE could do that to a person...i say thats a load of bullshit."
No, sitting on a bench for a week does not cause someone to pull their hair out. What happens to that person WHILE they are sitting on that bench has very much to do with it.
What about my other question? Did NO ONE notice that he was doing this to an obvious degree of excess???? Do you really believe that it's OK to ignore something like that?
BTW...PLEASE learn how to use the quote feature properly. You're staring to make me dizzy! :grin: Religion is comparable to a childhood neurosis.
--Sigmund Freud, Austrian-born psychologist
"
i hate quoting so sorry for the dizziness i caused you...hey...did you know that wanting to get dizzy as a child means that you will use drugs as a teen?
that was what my mom steo mom told my wife and i when she put my step brother and sister in the program...now thats a load of shit!
anyway...it was very hard to tell at first what he was doing...it was like on hair at a time and by the time they checked him out it was the size of a half dollar. im sure someone said something to staff but havent they seen it all before...why would this display make them freak out?"
Why would this "display" make them freak??? :grin: my kids think so...all three of em! but maybe i just brainwashed them into believeing that....hmmm :roll:
-
thanks :grin: my kids think so...all three of em! but maybe i just brainwashed them into believeing that....hmmm :roll: "
Well, you almost got that quote thing down. Keep working on it.
As far as your kids go, I do believe parents should provide guidance, and kids should learn from their parents. But what happens when parents are misinformed, and kids believe them?
Do you think there are any times when a kid should disobey their parents? Do you think there are times when kids actually do know more than their parents?
_________________
"I was a long time coming
I'll be a long time gone
you've got your whole life to do something
and that's not very long"
- Ani DiFranco[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-02-01 10:54 ]
-
On 2005-02-01 10:52:00, ~-=Sara=-~ wrote:
"
thanks :grin: my kids think so...all three of em! but maybe i just brainwashed them into believeing that....hmmm :roll: "
Well, you almost got that quote thing down. Keep working on it.
As far as your kids go, I do believe parents should provide guidance, and kids should learn from their parents. But what happens when parents are misinformed, and kids believe them?
Do you think there are any times when a kid should disobey their parents? Do you think there are times when kids actually do know more than their parents?
_________________
"I was a long time coming
I'll be a long time gone
you've got your whole life to do something
and that's not very long"
- Ani DiFranco[ This Message was edited by: ~-=Sara=-~ on 2005-02-01 10:54 ]"
If i was to tell one of my children that doing something that will harm them like drugs...breaking the law etc. yes they should not do what i say. I hope my children will grow up to know much more than me.
-
And they should also run from "the program" whatever its recent incarnation, no matter what you think.
my 2 cents.
-
On 2005-02-01 17:42:00, GregFL wrote:
"And they should also run from "the program" whatever its recent incarnation, no matter what you think.
my 2 cents.
"
i sure hope they dont need a program...hard to tell at 10, 7, and 4 years old.
D.=Darren
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i sure hope they dont need a program...hard to tell at 10, 7, and 4 years old.
D.=Darren"
So what would constitute "need" when they're 11-17?
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we had some 9 year olds with "druggie attitudes" in the seed.
Hey, start em young pappa. Go beltloop those little mini steppers into submission now, before they start!
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On 2005-02-02 06:52:00, GregFL wrote:
"we had some 9 year olds with "druggie attitudes" in the seed.
Hey, start em young pappa. Go beltloop those little mini steppers into submission now, before they start!
"
And I still have yet to find a piece of literature on the propensity to abuse drugs - aside from psycho-social factors. Wonder why we never saw any inner-city kids in these programs?
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was it john nahouse?
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i dont think darren was in life..i remeber the beatings and giving them.
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On 2005-05-30 01:37:00, rez1990 wrote:
"i dont think darren was in life..i remeber the beatings and giving them. "
Uhh...stop trying to "think" I was in life before you were...intake was in late 88...I 7th stepped in 1990 from STEP in Tampa.
Noone was beat in my presence while i was there unless they misbehaved by attacking someone in group...then they were taken down by the 5th phasers which always made me smile. just seeing the attackers get taken down made my day!
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YA STEP IN TAMPA, NOT LIFE IN OSPREY, FLORIDA. THAT IS WHERE ALOT OF THE ABUSE TOOK PLACE. HRS CAME AND INVESTIGATED AND BEFORE THEY GOT THERE THE REZ DAD TOLD US NOT TO SAY ANYTHING OR IT WOULD BE "NO PHASE STATIS". WE CAN NEVER GET BACK THE YEAR OR TWO YEARS OR EVE MORE FOR SOME PEOPLE THAT WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN WITH FRIENDS BEING KIDS. SOME OF US DID NOT HAVE DRUG PROBLEMS BUT PARENT PROBLEM WHO JUST WANTED OUT OF THE RESPONSIBILITY OF RAISING CHILDREN. MRS. PETERMANN BELIEVES ME ABOUT HOW IT IS NOT ME BUT MY LYING MOTHER, DUE TO THE FACT SHE COULD NOT HIDE HER DEMONS FOR EVER. NOW SHE IS IN AND OUT OF JAIL.
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On 2005-05-30 18:15:00, rez1990 wrote:
"YA STEP IN TAMPA, NOT LIFE IN OSPREY, FLORIDA. THAT IS WHERE ALOT OF THE ABUSE TOOK PLACE. HRS CAME AND INVESTIGATED AND BEFORE THEY GOT THERE THE REZ DAD TOLD US NOT TO SAY ANYTHING OR IT WOULD BE "NO PHASE STATIS". WE CAN NEVER GET BACK THE YEAR OR TWO YEARS OR EVE MORE FOR SOME PEOPLE THAT WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN WITH FRIENDS BEING KIDS. SOME OF US DID NOT HAVE DRUG PROBLEMS BUT PARENT PROBLEM WHO JUST WANTED OUT OF THE RESPONSIBILITY OF RAISING CHILDREN. MRS. PETERMANN BELIEVES ME ABOUT HOW IT IS NOT ME BUT MY LYING MOTHER, DUE TO THE FACT SHE COULD NOT HIDE HER DEMONS FOR EVER. NOW SHE IS IN AND OUT OF JAIL.
"
Just to clarify...I was in life for about three months...maybe more before we moved to STEP.
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On 2005-05-30 14:44:00, dbucfan wrote:
"
On 2005-05-30 01:37:00, rez1990 wrote:
"i dont think darren was in life..i remeber the beatings and giving them. "
Uhh...stop trying to "think" I was in life before you were...intake was in late 88...I 7th stepped in 1990 from STEP in Tampa.
Noone was beat in my presence while i was there unless they misbehaved by attacking someone in group...then they were taken down by the 5th phasers which always made me smile. just seeing the attackers get taken down made my day!"
You are twisted. There were very few people who acted up so badly that they needed to be "taken down". What is wrong with you that you would find that funny? Furthermore it shouldn't be up to a bunch of 15 and 16 year olds to take anyone down. Did you ever have to really restrain anyone? It made me feel horrible. I hated it. The only reason why I did it was so I wouldn't get in trouble.
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I AGREE, HE IS TWISTED, AND YOUR CORRECT IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN UP TO 13, 14, 15, 16 YEAR OLD KIDS. ANYONE OUT THERE STAY AT THE LIFE PROGRAM IN OSPREY FL FROM 90 TO 91....TRYING TO GET A REUNION GOING. PLZ REPLY UNLESS YOU HAVE NOT MADE IT TO, "TALK" OR "TALK AND RESPONSIBILITY" THEN I GUESS THE GROUP WILL HAVE TO VOTE ON IT.....
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On 2005-05-31 07:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-30 14:44:00, dbucfan wrote:
"
On 2005-05-30 01:37:00, rez1990 wrote:
"i dont think darren was in life..i remeber the beatings and giving them. "
Uhh...stop trying to "think" I was in life before you were...intake was in late 88...I 7th stepped in 1990 from STEP in Tampa.
Noone was beat in my presence while i was there unless they misbehaved by attacking someone in group...then they were taken down by the 5th phasers which always made me smile. just seeing the attackers get taken down made my day!"
You are twisted. There were very few people who acted up so badly that they needed to be "taken down". What is wrong with you that you would find that funny? Furthermore it shouldn't be up to a bunch of 15 and 16 year olds to take anyone down. Did you ever have to really restrain anyone? It made me feel horrible. I hated it. The only reason why I did it was so I wouldn't get in trouble. "
Your right...there werent many but the ones i saw being "handled" were usually the bullies that picked on people or strted fights...i never witnessed a person just sitting in group be beaten for nothing...i AM glad i never saw that or maybe i would feel a bit more venomous about the program .
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On 2005-05-31 12:28:00, dbucfan wrote:
...i never witnessed a person just sitting in group be beaten for nothing...
That's because you were paying attention to the person talking, not cliquing, not making eye contact w/ others in Group. So, by the time the ruckus started and staff started shouting about the pretense for the beating... well, who ya' gonna believe; staff or your own lyin' eyes?
i AM glad i never saw that or maybe i would feel a bit more venomous about the program .
Ignorance is bliss, I guess.
No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the sources of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power.
P. J. O'Rourke
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br>That's because you were paying attention to the person talking, not cliquing, not making eye contact w/ others in Group. So, by the time the ruckus started and staff started shouting about the pretense for the beating... well, who ya' gonna believe; staff or your own lyin' eyes?
<
Ignorance is bliss, I guess.
<
yes ginger you would know, being that you were at ALL these programs.
as far as ignorance is bliss, well, I guess YOU WOULD know that.
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On 2005-05-31 11:17:00, rez1990 wrote:
"I AGREE, HE IS TWISTED, AND YOUR CORRECT IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN UP TO 13, 14, 15, 16 YEAR OLD KIDS. ANYONE OUT THERE STAY AT THE LIFE PROGRAM IN OSPREY FL FROM 90 TO 91....TRYING TO GET A REUNION GOING. PLZ REPLY UNLESS YOU HAVE NOT MADE IT TO, "TALK" OR "TALK AND RESPONSIBILITY" THEN I GUESS THE GROUP WILL HAVE TO VOTE ON IT.....
"
Were you at the other LIFE reunions? there was one last summer.
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On 2005-05-31 15:24:00, Anonymous wrote:
yes ginger you would know, being that you were at ALL these programs.
as far as ignorance is bliss, well, I guess YOU WOULD know that."
I believe the people who were there and I know something of the people who ran the place and a bit about their spin off, Growing Together. I know how they operate in just the same way I know that, somewhere, a kid is getting beat into a gang and a politician is screwing some hooker, compliments of some lobbiest.
As for your ignorance, well you said it! You're happy you didn't see what was going on. Ok, I believe you. But why hang out here if you don't want to know?
There never was a good war or a bad peace.
--Benjamin Franklin, (1773)
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On 2005-05-31 17:38:00, Antigen wrote:
"
On 2005-05-31 15:24:00, Anonymous wrote:
yes ginger you would know, being that you were at ALL these programs.
as far as ignorance is bliss, well, I guess YOU WOULD know that."
I believe the people who were there and I know something of the people who ran the place and a bit about their spin off, Growing Together. I know how they operate in just the same way I know that, somewhere, a kid is getting beat into a gang and a politician is screwing some hooker, compliments of some lobbiest.
As for your ignorance, well you said it! You're happy you didn't see what was going on. Ok, I believe you. But why hang out here if you don't want to know?
There never was a good war or a bad peace.
--Benjamin Franklin, (1773)
"
why hang out here? it's kind of like watching a train wreck - sad, but hard to turn away
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NO, I JUST DISCOVERED THIS WEB SITE THREE DAYS AGO. I LOST CONTACT WITH THE FRIENDS I HAD FROM THE PROGRAM. THE ONLY THING I KNOW IS MRS. PETE IS ST PETE, FL. I KNOW SOME LEFT AND WENT ON TO GOOD THINGS, OTHERS EITHER ENDED UP IN JAIL OR DEAD. THE ARMY TURNED ME AROUND. BUT NOW THAT I KNOW THIS IS HERE I CHECK IT EVER HOUR. WOULD REALLY LIKE TO MAKE CONTACT WITH THE PEOPLE I TURNED TO IN THAT HELL HOLE. LIFE IS FUNNY TO ME, IT WAS A LOVE HATE RELATIONSHIP. HAD THE BEST FRIENDS OF MY LIFE BUT ALSO LOST A YEAR AND HALF OF MY LIFE, HAVING TO MAKE UP STORIES JUST TO MAKE PHASE. PEACE "J"
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On 2005-05-30 22:14:00, Anonymous wrote:
Just to clarify...I was in life for about three months...maybe more before we moved to STEP."
Who is this anon that was in LIFE and then went to STEP?
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On 2005-06-06 16:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-30 22:14:00, Anonymous wrote:
Just to clarify...I was in life for about three months...maybe more before we moved to STEP."
Who is this anon that was in LIFE and then went to STEP?"
sorry forgot to login...it was me.
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On 2005-05-31 17:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-31 17:38:00, Antigen wrote:
"
On 2005-05-31 15:24:00, Anonymous wrote:
yes ginger you would know, being that you were at ALL these programs.
as far as ignorance is bliss, well, I guess YOU WOULD know that."
I believe the people who were there and I know something of the people who ran the place and a bit about their spin off, Growing Together. I know how they operate in just the same way I know that, somewhere, a kid is getting beat into a gang and a politician is screwing some hooker, compliments of some lobbiest.
As for your ignorance, well you said it! You're happy you didn't see what was going on. Ok, I believe you. But why hang out here if you don't want to know?
There never was a good war or a bad peace.
--Benjamin Franklin, (1773)
"
why hang out here? it's kind of like watching a train wreck - sad, but hard to turn away"
:rofl: :rofl:
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On 2005-06-07 16:02:00, dbucfan wrote:
"
On 2005-06-06 16:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-30 22:14:00, Anonymous wrote:
Just to clarify...I was in life for about three months...maybe more before we moved to STEP."
Who is this anon that was in LIFE and then went to STEP?"
sorry forgot to login...it was me."
Do you remember many of the staff that was at STEP? I always wondered what happened to Tracey Perez and Lisa Weinfurter?
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On 2005-06-07 19:10:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-06-07 16:02:00, dbucfan wrote:
"
On 2005-06-06 16:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-30 22:14:00, Anonymous wrote:
Just to clarify...I was in life for about three months...maybe more before we moved to STEP."
Who is this anon that was in LIFE and then went to STEP?"
sorry forgot to login...it was me."
Do you remember many of the staff that was at STEP? I always wondered what happened to Tracey Perez and Lisa Weinfurter?"
Tracy-no i really have no idea where she went to. Lisa- i had heard that she got married and had a child but nothing more than that...this info was told to me by Chandra Beatty a few years ago.
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On 2005-01-20 05:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
" I saw it. Found most of it laughable. That Samantha girl at the beginning was not exactly a credible looking individual. WAY over dramatic. That girl needs some help NOW.
I found the show rather unimpactful. "
But she is a millionare and so is her lawyer husband.
Rolling in money with Sammie the scab hole.
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On 2005-10-02 04:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-01-20 05:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
" I saw it. Found most of it laughable. That Samantha girl at the beginning was not exactly a credible looking individual. WAY over dramatic. That girl needs some help NOW.
I found the show rather unimpactful. "
But she is a millionare and so is her lawyer husband.
Rolling in money with Sammie the scab hole."
:roll: Ding! Round three :roll: