Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: SUCK IT on August 03, 2010, 05:18:29 PM
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Dear Mom and Dad,
This is your troubled teen, 10 years into the future. I know you are questioning whether you should send me to a treatment program or not. I know it's a difficult decision and you don't know what to do. I am here to tell you that you already made the right decision. You got me the help I desperately needed and you saved my life. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart.
You know that I am having some problems. But you don't know how bad. You think I might be slipping in school, but it's much worse than that. You think that I might have tried some soft drugs, but it's much worse than that. You think I drink at parties, but it's worse than that . You don't know how much trouble I am going through now, and that secretly inside I am begging for help. I am scared though, scared to ask for help because I dug myself so deep I don't know what to do. If I ask for help I will get in trouble and have to stop my behavior, but I am an addict now and can't willingly choose to end this on my own.
It's up to you, my loving parents. If you make the right decision right now my life will be saved, and 10 years from now my life will be wonderful and I will be harvesting the fruit of your fateful decision, a decision you are about to make. If you make the wrong decision I will follow a path of self destruction that only ends in incarceration or my premature death. If I could I would come to you and ask, I would beg for the help that I know I desperately need. But I can't ask you for help, Mom and Dad, the choice is left to you. It's time for you to make your decision. Please make the right decision, Mom and Dad, because my existence is dependent on you choosing to help me and not ignore the signs you know are there. I love you so much Mom & Dad, and I am so sorry for what I put you through. Thank you for saving my life, I will always be eternally grateful for your sacrifice and forethought.
Love,
Your teenage Child
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Why did you post that, you jackass?
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I am writing a letter to my Mom and Dad, 10 years from the future. I think it's all pretty self explanatory. Thank you for your contribution to this thread though, it's greatly appreciated.
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SUCK IT when did you turn your PM function off and why did you do it? Was it after 25 May 2010, 21:23 ? :roflmao: :roflmao:
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People are free to write their version of this letter to their parents.
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Dear Mom & Dad,
Enjoy the bullets in your head.
Sincerely,
Christopher Sutton (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=30767)
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People are free to write their version of this letter to their parents.
People are free to do a lot of things (when they're not in programs).
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People are free to write their version of this letter to their parents.
People are free to do a lot of things (when they're not in programs).
I was free to write my parents letters while in a program. I also had plenty of other freedoms. But they did keep me from getting high, and killing myself. Things I did regularly outside of a program. So in that sense, they truly saved my life. I am mature enough to admit this now, although when I was younger I wouldn't have admitted it. It takes a bit out of the ego to admit that you were a bad person, and in need of help. But it was the truth.
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SUCK IT isn't answering my question for a good reason. I saved a personal message I sent to him BEFORE he turned off his PM function. ::OMG:: ::OMG::
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SUCK IT isn't answering my question for a good reason. I saved a personal message I sent to him BEFORE he turned off his PM function. ::OMG:: ::OMG::
Do tell?
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People are free to write their version of this letter to their parents.
People are free to do a lot of things (when they're not in programs).
I was free to write my parents letters while in a program. I also had plenty of other freedoms. But they did keep me from getting high, and killing myself. Things I did regularly outside of a program. So in that sense, they truly saved my life. I am mature enough to admit this now, although when I was younger I wouldn't have admitted it. It takes a bit out of the ego to admit that you were a bad person, and in need of help. But it was the truth.
This is not the norm for programs though, you must understand...?
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SUCK IT isn't answering my question for a good reason. I saved a personal message I sent to him BEFORE he turned off his PM function. ::OMG:: ::OMG::
Enjoy this because it's going to be the only one. The reason I don't respond to you? It's because you are retarded, obviously mentally damaged or ill in some way, and just not able to a grown up conversation. You are obsessed with a PM? Great, post it. Because I never read it and deleted it, I certainly don't remember it. To you this is important, because you're crazy, to me it's meaningless. The reason I turned off my PM options? So I don't have to keep clicking the delete button from stalkers like you.
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No, he was free to write his parents program-approved letters while in a program.
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People are free to write their version of this letter to their parents.
People are free to do a lot of things (when they're not in programs).
I was free to write my parents letters while in a program. I also had plenty of other freedoms. But they did keep me from getting high, and killing myself. Things I did regularly outside of a program. So in that sense, they truly saved my life. I am mature enough to admit this now, although when I was younger I wouldn't have admitted it. It takes a bit out of the ego to admit that you were a bad person, and in need of help. But it was the truth.
This is not the norm for programs though, you must understand...?
It's my experience and this is where my point of view comes from. I choose to share my experience, people seem to want to find reasons to dismiss it, that's their right. I don't care what happens to my words after I share them, that's up to the reader.
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No, he was free to write his parents program-approved letters while in a program.
Incorrect
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Dear Mom and Dad,
This is your troubled teen, 10 years into the future. I know you are questioning whether you should send me to a treatment program or not. I know it's a difficult decision and you don't know what to do. I am here to tell you that you already made the right decision. You got me the help I desperately needed and you saved my life. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart.
You know that I am having some problems. But you don't know how bad. You think I might be slipping in school, but it's much worse than that. You think that I might have tried some soft drugs, but it's much worse than that. You think I drink at parties, but it's worse than that . You don't know how much trouble I am going through now, and that secretly inside I am begging for help. I am scared though, scared to ask for help because I dug myself so deep I don't know what to do. If I ask for help I will get in trouble and have to stop my behavior, but I am an addict now and can't willingly choose to end this on my own.
It's up to you, my loving parents. If you make the right decision right now my life will be saved, and 10 years from now my life will be wonderful and I will be harvesting the fruit of your fateful decision, a decision you are about to make. If you make the wrong decision I will follow a path of self destruction that only ends in incarceration or my premature death. If I could I would come to you and ask, I would beg for the help that I know I desperately need. But I can't ask you for help, Mom and Dad, the choice is left to you. It's time for you to make your decision. Please make the right decision, Mom and Dad, because my existence is dependent on you choosing to help me and not ignore the signs you know are there. I love you so much Mom & Dad, and I am so sorry for what I put you through. Thank you for saving my life, I will always be eternally grateful for your sacrifice and forethought.
Love,
Your teenage Child
Great post, Suck It....
There is a definite line in the sand here. Why I don't know anymore because none of this bitching makes any sense really.
You folks who had a rough horrible time while you were in a program seem to think that you have the moral right to demean, disrespect, demoralize, oppress, violate privacy and dismiss any post (Poster) that you want to.
All on the grounds, that I don't like what your saying and if I don't like what your saying, then you are a phony.
Folks your behavior is predictable.
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SUCK IT isn't answering my question for a good reason. I saved a personal message I sent to him BEFORE he turned off his PM function. ::OMG:: ::OMG::
Enjoy this because it's going to be the only one. The reason I don't respond to you? It's because you are retarded, obviously mentally damaged or ill in some way, and just not able to a grown up conversation. You are obsessed with a PM? Great, post it. Because I never read it and deleted it, I certainly don't remember it. To you this is important, because you're crazy, to me it's meaningless. The reason I turned off my PM options? So I don't have to keep clicking the delete button from stalkers like you.
Such hateful speech from an angry little person. I'm shocked. Shocked I tell you. Must have fallen off that high horse I suppose. :feedtrolls: :soapbox: :bs:
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So you come in my threads and tell people not to respond to them? Not exactly leading my example, huh. You are free to avoid my threads Dysfunction, I really wouldn't mind at all. If you have a letter you want to write, go ahead. Otherwise it's just noise.
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
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Edited: Wednesday, October 06, 2010
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
I understand that is your perspective. If my parents felt they had been ripped off, I'm sure they would be just as angry and post here as well. But I know they feel they got their moneys worth, because it saved my life. So parents should ask themselves, how much is my child's life worth? Then go from there. Thanks for your perspective Auntie Em.
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Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
Evolved? Sheeeeit, I doubt that....
And this CRAP coming from a guy who's proud of dragging some girl behind a van when he was staff at ELAN (what's the story with that, anyone?)
Who is "they"? History has a way of repeating itself, and I doubt much has changed behind the closed doors of programs in the past several years.
You're talking out of your ass bigtime, Danny.
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
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"educated yourself up"
:rofl: :beat: :rofl:
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Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
Evolved? Sheeeeit, I doubt that....
And this CRAP coming from a guy who's proud of dragging some girl behind a van when he was staff at ELAN (what's the story with that, anyone?)
Who is "they"? History has a way of repeating itself, and I doubt much has changed behind the closed doors of programs in the past several years.
You're talking out of your ass bigtime, Danny.
Jeesh that damn van, car, motorcycle, boat and I dragged who Mary Jones , Mary O'Brian or Mary Poppins.
Nice Frodie, join all the other ignorant fools here, Mr Sheeple.
The only thing you need to do Frodie is pull yourself from the herd (sheeplehead), become a wolf here and communicate with parents that post here, like a human being.
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
Ursus, why I have to continue to bring you up to speed on posts is beyond me. I could care less when her niece graduated, the post was asking Em, to educate herself.
Thanks anyway, how ya coming on those disputed posts.
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Ursus you mentioned education. Well that is not a high priority for me. if a kid has to miss his entire high school experience to get off drugs then not only am I good with that but Im great with that. Probably just a bunch of druggie influences at school anyway. Education is way overrated.
Peace and Powerlessness
Danny
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"educated yourself up"
:rofl: :beat: :rofl:
Frodie, grow up.
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"educated yourself up"
:rofl: :beat: :rofl:
Frodie, grow up.
You mean, "Grow yourself up"?
:D :seg: :D
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Danny telling everybody else to "grow up". Yeah thats funny coming from a self proclaimed drug addict, alcoholic and child abuser. Yeah I wanna "grow up" to be just like you Danny or am I now speaking to SUCK IT or DannyB11, who are you right now?
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
Come on Ursus, even you can admit that auntie ems' nieces' experience is a one-off. The average kid spends 12 to 16 months in a decent program today with a cost of about $100,000. 80% of these kids benefit greatly and move on with their lives. Anyone can point to Columbine high-school and say the families there had a bad experience back then, but it doesn't represent the normal high-school experience as we see it today.
...
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Danny telling everybody else to "grow up". Yeah thats funny coming from a self proclaimed drug addict, alcoholic and child abuser. Yeah I wanna "grow up" to be just like you Danny or am I now speaking to SUCK IT or DannyB11, who are you right now?
:eek: :bs: ::poke:: ::deadhorse:: :jerry:
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
Ursus, why I have to continue to bring you up to speed on posts is beyond me. I could care less when her niece graduated, the post was asking Em, to educate herself.
Thanks anyway, how ya coming on those disputed posts.
Gee, Danny, if ya couldn't care less, why'd ya make such a big deal about telling Auntie Em her "spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved."
I still say ya haven't edumacated yerself up enough.
And... as far as I know, you and Whooter are the only ones who seem to have problems with "disputed posts." Good luck with that! :D
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
Come on Ursus, even you can admit that auntie ems' nieces' experience is a one-off. The average kid spends 12 to 16 months in a decent program today with a cost of about $100,000. 80% of these kids benefit greatly and move on with their lives. Anyone can point to Columbine high-school and say the families there had a bad experience back then, but it doesn't represent the normal high-school experience as we see it today.
Noooope. Happens all the time. Programs often try to convince parents that their kids need "more treatment than expected," especially towards the end of the previously contracted time period.
It's pretty standard operating procedure at Hyde School. They call it a "Senior Leadership" year. Lol. Parents actually pay Hyde for the "privilege" of having their kids function effectively as a cut below unpaid junior staff. And Hyde even throws a carrot into the mix to make such serfdom a more attractive enterprise. That is, the possibility of being able to graduate from Hyde with a "Hyde Diploma" instead of just a certificate of having done the necessary coursework.
But not all parents are open to such manipulation. My guess is that ASR correctly gauged that you ... were not.
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
Ursus, why I have to continue to bring you up to speed on posts is beyond me. I could care less when her niece graduated, the post was asking Em, to educate herself.
Thanks anyway, how ya coming on those disputed posts.
Gee, Danny, if ya couldn't care less, why'd ya make such a big deal about telling Auntie Em her "spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved."
I still say ya haven't edumacated yerself up enough.
And... as far as I know, you and Whooter are the only ones who seem to have problems with "disputed posts." Good luck with that! :D
Ya, Whooter, Suck It, Tiger, TimScrivener, Myself and the countless others have had problems with you and others.
So as a collective we say, "please if you need help deciphering our posts" let us know, were here.
Use your noggin though and be a gentlemen.
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Suck It forgot to mention the part where it costs $90,000 a year and the child will be kept apart from his or her family for three years or more--in the name of "preserving the family." My niece's parents spent more than a quarter million dollars. The corporation that ran her boarding school laughed all the way to the bank. They pressure vulnerable parents, and then take them for every penny they've got.
Go ahead, Mom and Dad: get royally ripped off.
Auntie Em
Would you please educate yourself up, Em. Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
A quarter of a million, must have been a great school.
Miss Porters School in Farmington, CT. costs about that much.
Actually, Auntie Em's niece got out fairly recently, within the past year or so. I guess ya haven't "educated yourself up" enough, Danny...
Come on Ursus, even you can admit that auntie ems' nieces' experience is a one-off. The average kid spends 12 to 16 months in a decent program today with a cost of about $100,000. 80% of these kids benefit greatly and move on with their lives. Anyone can point to Columbine high-school and say the families there had a bad experience back then, but it doesn't represent the normal high-school experience as we see it today.
Noooope. Happens all the time. Programs often try to convince parents that their kids need "more treatment than expected," especially towards the end of the previously contracted time period.
It's pretty standard operating procedure at Hyde School. They call it a "Senior Leadership" year. Lol. Parents actually pay Hyde for the "privilege" of having their kids function effectively as a cut below unpaid junior staff. And Hyde even throws a carrot into the mix to make such serfdom a more attractive enterprise. That is, the possibility of being able to graduate from Hyde with a "Hyde Diploma" instead of just a certificate of having done the necessary coursework.
But not all parents are open to such manipulation. My guess is that ASR correctly gauged that you ... were not.
What Ursus is not saying is he doesn't even know if this is still happening and that the percentage of students doing this is so minuscule, it wasn't even worth mentioning.
Oh but Mr.Drama man just likes to squeeze every bit of torture out of Hyde Prep School.
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So you come in my threads
Your threads????
:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:
Read the description....right up there ^^^^^^^^
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry
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My comments in blue.
Would you please educate yourself up, Em (educate yourself up??? How does that work? Do you stand on a really tall building and read Curious George? And talk about ironic.....Danny telling someone to educate themselves (up :rofl: )????. :roflmao:
Your spiel is from years ago, parents have evolved.
They have tried to explain this here on fornits lately but you will not listen to them.
But then later in the same thread.....
I could care less when her niece graduated,
Can't you even make up your own mind? Oh....that's right. When you're still a true-blue believer, you can't. Your beliefs have been replaced by Elan/AA's beliefs. You go with whatever you've been programmed to believe. In your case, that means denying the abuse that is continuing inside these hellholes today even if it means that you contradict yourself in the same friggin thread. But, as we've seen....you're not the brightest crayon in the box, are you?
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Thank you for defending me, Ursus.
You and I know her experience was not a one-off. For example, the experience of the other youths in her boarding school was similar (though not all parents were as fear-stricken and gullible as hers). And I have personally spoken with at least a half dozen young people from various programs whose families were torn apart for a similar period of time and for a similar highway-robbery price tag.
As with so many of the cases, the parents were first persuaded to buy in to a short-term wilderness program--only a few weeks. Then that program referred her to a boarding school, which was only to be for a few months. Every few months we were told the program was working very well and she would be coming home soon--this spring, next fall, before her birthday, after this school year, very soon... In this manner, a few weeks' stay in a wilderness program grew into a 40-month marathon. No, she is not some horrible, defective person who would not work the program--she's a very perceptive girl who knew full well her ordeal was a sham.
My heart goes out to parents who are worried sick about the risk-taking behavior or poor academic performance of their teens. I understand the desire to stop the cycle of fear and find some peace, and I am deeply concerned and offended that programs take advantage of this vulnerability to stoke their fears and lift their wallets.
Auntie Em
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Thank you for defending me, Ursus.
You and I know her experience was not a one-off. For example, the experience of the other youths in her boarding school was similar (though not all parents were as fear-stricken and gullible as hers). And I have personally spoken with at least a half dozen young people from various programs whose families were torn apart for a similar period of time and for a similar highway-robbery price tag.
As with so many of the cases, the parents were first persuaded to buy in to a short-term wilderness program--only a few weeks. Then that program referred her to a boarding school, which was only to be for a few months. Every few months we were told the program was working very well and she would be coming home soon--this spring, next fall, before her birthday, after this school year, very soon... In this manner, a few weeks' stay in a wilderness program grew into a 40-month marathon. No, she is not some horrible, defective person who would not work the program--she's a very perceptive girl who knew full well her ordeal was a sham.
My heart goes out to parents who are worried sick about the risk-taking behavior or poor academic performance of their teens. I understand the desire to stop the cycle of fear and find some peace, and I am deeply concerned and offended that programs take advantage of this vulnerability to stoke their fears and lift their wallets. Auntie Em
40 months does seem a bit excessive, I must agree. My take on all of this is a little different and I feel instead of trying to convince parents to ignore their child's problems or dissuade them from any form of residential care it may be more helpful to guide them a bit and help them to become aware of the programs which are scamming people and their practices. Many programs have fixed lengths of stay and offer individual therapy with therapists who can communicate with the childs therapist at home ( This provides a conduit to the outside world and helps with the childs transition back home afterward) . We could make suggests to have the parents seek out other parents who have had children attend the program they are considering to see if it is a good fit for their child. These are just a couple of examples on how we can help.
I think fornits can do a better job in this area to help other families in need of information.
...
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I don't think "Fornits" needs any more program fiduciaries to rope in parents with false information and anecdotes like "My daughter was well ahead of her peers academically after the program" when in reality, as you already accidentally admitted, she took five years to graduate highschool because she got no credits from her unaccredited program "academics." Which peers was she ahead of, the special needs kids?
Whooter is a phony, folks. He makes his living off programs and is desperate to deflect criticisms that might interfere with that objective.
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Uh, yeah, like there's no industry types on Fornits. Wait a sec...one of them is you, Mr. Aspen Fiduciary!
Remember when you claimed to have access to RB's treatment records via an HLA staff member on this board? Or your true love, Ottawa5 whose stated goal was to open her "own program along the lines of CEDU"?
Your explanation is laughable, troll boy :rofl: .
….. do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
I was wondering if there were links to the original for this myself. I dont even know who Ottawa5 is, a link would be helpful.
Ottawa5 had 144 posts and not one of them was with me!! Hmmm. A little more fabrication there DJ?
...
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Sorry, Whooter, but that is pretty low.
For those unfamiliar with the situation, Whooter has started to yank material out of the Cataloging TheWho/John Reuben's Lies thread and is using it to spam up other threads.
For clarification:
Originally posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=29342&start=690#p372270) on 04 Aug 2010 07:11:
Uh, yeah, like there's no industry types on Fornits. Wait a sec...one of them is you, Mr. Aspen Fiduciary!
Remember when you claimed to have access to RB's treatment records via an HLA staff member on this board? Or your true love, Ottawa5 whose stated goal was to open her "own program along the lines of CEDU"?
Your explanation is laughable, troll boy :rofl: .
….. do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
Good Catch, Ursus. Links are not his strength it appears.
ouch!!! lol
Actually, Whooter, my post was in response to your posting of various falacious Dysfunction Junction posts which apparently are the sole creation of your imagination. Moreover, my original quote (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=29342&start=660#p372079), before you altered it, read as follows:
Whooter, do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
PLUS... Your original reply to my post, before you altered it, read as follows:
Whooter, do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
Sure, just like everyone else.
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Sorry, Whooter, but that is pretty low.
For those unfamiliar with the situation, Whooter has started to yank material out of the Cataloging TheWho/John Reuben's Lies thread and is using it to spam up other threads.
For clarification:
Originally posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=29342&start=690#p372270) on 04 Aug 2010 07:11:
Uh, yeah, like there's no industry types on Fornits. Wait a sec...one of them is you, Mr. Aspen Fiduciary!
Remember when you claimed to have access to RB's treatment records via an HLA staff member on this board? Or your true love, Ottawa5 whose stated goal was to open her "own program along the lines of CEDU"?
Your explanation is laughable, troll boy :rofl: .
….. do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
Good Catch, Ursus. Links are not his strength it appears.
ouch!!! lol
Actually, Whooter, my post was in response to your posting of various falacious Dysfunction Junction posts which apparently are the sole creation of your imagination. Moreover, my original quote (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=29342&start=660#p372079), before you altered it, read as follows:
Whooter, do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
PLUS... Your original reply to my post, before you altered it, read as follows:
Whooter, do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
Sure, just like everyone else.
I was responding to the post prior to that, I didnt bring the discussion to this thread and you know this, Ursus.
So you choose to police a thread but choose to question only certain posters and give others a free pass. The thread in question ( which I will post again) is clearly fabricated by DJ (with no links provided), but you choose not to respond... why?
If you want to interfere then do it equally. I will continue to respond as I do until you respond to that post. I will give you opportunity and when you respond I will correct my post.
Here is the original:
Original (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?p=372158#p372158)
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I talk to more than half a dozen people I went to treatment with, I belong to a few alumni groups. When I brought up the term "survivor" they laughed. When I asked if anybody was abused, nobody responded. I went to a program that has its own subforum on fornits, and its supposedly abusive and only in it for the money. Well all I can say is, it saved my life and if my parents had listened to the scare tactics that are posted on this forum I would be in jail or dead. This is a fact. I acknowledge some people have negative experiences in programs, but I believe them to be in a very slim minority. This is evidenced by the very small number of posters that fit in with the extreme views on fornits. People with reasonable views are quickly outed and shunned from this forum. I never experienced group think or cult like situation in treatment, only until I found fornits did I really learn what it meant to be a cult of extremists hostile to any outside viewpoints.
I also want to make a point that my parents thought my issues were relatively minor, but in reality I was doing far worse. It would of been easy for them to ignore the problem and let me do my thing, if they had been told programs were ineffective and dangerous. Lucky for me my parents decided to ask professionals and not random people on the internet on how to deal with their troubled teen. I am so very grateful, I literally owe the program my life.
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... I literally owe the program my life.
And one or two hundred thousand dollars--so like a nice house or a fabulous yacht or a villa in Italy.
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... I literally owe the program my life.
And one or two hundred thousand dollars--so like a nice house or a fabulous yacht or a villa in Italy.
My parent's didn't pay that much money, actually. But if you ask a parent would you trade the life of your child for a nice house, a yacht, or a villa in Italy, I would hope that they would be willing to make this trade off. It's sad to hear people complaining about the price when we are talking about lives being saved. It sounds kind of cold hearted to say I'd rather have a nice villa in Italy and let my kid continue down a path of self destruction.
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... I literally owe the program my life.
And one or two hundred thousand dollars--so like a nice house or a fabulous yacht or a villa in Italy.
It is expensive, our cost was close to $100,000 if you include the wilderness prior to ASR. But if a parent cares enough for their child then cost typically isnt an issue, besides the cost of programs is determined by the consumer not the programs themselves. The programs dont determine the cost, the parents do.
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LOL. I didn't suggest the parents were getting the nice cash bonus--that goes to the fat cats at the corporations who run the programs, cracking a nice bottle of bubbly and toasting the multi-billion dollar profits they rake in from this industry. The parents, sadly, are getting fleeced.
So what did your parents pay, Suck It?
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The programs dont determine the cost, the parents do.
Utterly absurd on the face of it.
And the pressure-sales argument that says, "If only you cared enough about your child, you would spend $100 large" is exactly what I mean when I say that profit-driven programs take advantage of vulnerable, scared parents. Thanks for making my point for me.
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LOL. I didn't suggest the parents were getting the nice cash bonus--that goes to the fat cats at the corporations who run the programs, cracking a nice bottle of bubbly and toasting the multi-billion dollar profits they rake in from this industry. The parents, sadly, are getting fleeced.
So what did your parents pay, Suck It?
I didnt think you felt the parents were getting a cash bonus but I will reply anyway (at the risk of appearing to repeat myself).
I think the only parents who feel they have been fleeced are those whose child didnt do well. Studies show that 80% of the kids improve and succeed. So I am sure those parents feel satisfied and feel they received a bonus. The programs and their owners should celebrate at the end of the fiscal year if profits exceeded expectations. The parents determine the price not the industry.
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The programs dont determine the cost, the parents do.
Utterly absurd on the face of it.
I know it sounds nuts to most people but that is the way prices are set. If less people started sending their kids tomorrow there would be empty beds to fill and the price would drop and as more beds sat idle the price would drop even further until they reached the point where the cost to do business out weighed the money coming in and at that point they would go out of business.
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Sorry, Whooter, but that is pretty low.
For those unfamiliar with the situation, Whooter has started to yank material out of the Cataloging TheWho/John Reuben's Lies thread and is using it to spam up other threads.
For clarification:
Originally posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=29342&start=690#p372270) on 04 Aug 2010 07:11:
Uh, yeah, like there's no industry types on Fornits. Wait a sec...one of them is you, Mr. Aspen Fiduciary!
Remember when you claimed to have access to RB's treatment records via an HLA staff member on this board? Or your true love, Ottawa5 whose stated goal was to open her "own program along the lines of CEDU"?
Your explanation is laughable, troll boy :rofl: .
….. do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
Good Catch, Ursus. Links are not his strength it appears.
ouch!!! lol
Actually, Whooter, my post was in response to your posting of various falacious Dysfunction Junction posts which apparently are the sole creation of your imagination. Moreover, my original quote (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=29342&start=660#p372079), before you altered it, read as follows:
Whooter, do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
PLUS... Your original reply to my post, before you altered it, read as follows:
Whooter, do you have LINKS to the original posts for all this material? Or are you just making this up as you go along?
Sure, just like everyone else.
Ursus, really who gives a crap, 5 people and your one of them. You spam all day long, I don't see anyone complaining. Please stick with copying and posting and save your verbal insults.
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The programs dont determine the cost, the parents do.
Utterly absurd on the face of it.
And the pressure-sales argument that says, "If only you cared enough about your child, you would spend $100 large" is exactly what I mean when I say that profit-driven programs take advantage of vulnerable, scared parents. Thanks for making my point for me.
Oh please, cry me a river. You assume that every parent are these, weak, imbecilic, naive, vulnerable, sheltered, uneducated goof offs that spend 100k on their kids, so they will not be like them.
Parents know exactly what there doing Em, whether you want to admit this or not.
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LOL. I didn't suggest the parents were getting the nice cash bonus--that goes to the fat cats at the corporations who run the programs, cracking a nice bottle of bubbly and toasting the multi-billion dollar profits they rake in from this industry. The parents, sadly, are getting fleeced.
So what did your parents pay, Suck It?
Well, like I said, I talked to my parents about the program and they never mentioned to me about feeling ripped off. One of them mentioned that it was the best money they ever spent. I don't know exactly how much they spent, but I know it wasn't 100-200k, because our family didn't have that much. They are pretty old fashioned though and don't talk to me about money, and exact figures.
I can address the fact, that one kid being sent to a program isn't going to buy anybody a new house or yacht. Most of the money spent at programs, I imagine goes towards the cost of running the place. When I was in drug rehab the cost was $1,000 a day (this is what they told me at least, I think it might of actually been more) but insurance payed for it. But that wasn't enough for me, and then insurance refused to pay. At the same time my parents realized that a long term solution was probably necessary and so they sought out private programs, and had to pay for it themselves.
At programs you have to pay for the facility itself, the employees, the therapists and other professionals, insurance, and who knows what else. I can't say for sure because I don't run a program, but I do know what it's like to run a business, and just because prices are high, it doesn't mean that is all going into the pocket of the owners. I would guess that the profit margin on running a treatment facility is very thin. I wholeheartedly believe, based on my own interactions with the higher up types, that they did it because they really felt good helping kids out. I think it would be their mission to do this, whether they made money or did not. To me, it struck me as the point of the whole thing was to keep it going, to keep the door open. We have seen a lot of programs going out of business recently due to the economy. I think this fact shows that these people are not popping the champagne cork on their new yacht, on the way to a villa in Italy. I think this could actually fall under my other thread about fornits mythology. From an anti treatment perspective, it helps to view them as greedy, rich and corrupt people. In my view they are just the opposite.
The narrative on fornits goes something like this. Poor widdle parents find a scary internet site telling them their child is troubled. These naive yet good hearted parents call the program, and the evil program salespeople convince these gullible, yet ironically well off financially, people, that their kid will die if they don't send him. These parents being the trusting, naive people that they are, do exactly as the evil program salesman says. The kid is then warehoused in an abusive jail cell, given minimum food requirements to stay alive and ignored while the rich owners are off sailing in their yacht, laughing all the way to the bank at the naive, gullible, and rich parents they fleeced. Kid gets severe PTSD, gets out and becomes a drug addict who hates their parents and posts on fornits.
When I believe reality is a little closer to something like this. Parents have been dealing with troubled teen for quite some time. They tried therapy, local hospitalization, and everything else. Nothing has worked. They don't know what to do and greatly fear for their teen who has been through several close calls involving the law and their life. They fear another weekend of partying and driving while drunk will result in the death of their kid, or another kid. They have been saving since their children's birth for college, and decide in order to save their life they will spend this money to get them treatment. Parents research and find many opinions on program options. They talk to their kid about it, and then after exhausting all options and doing a lot of research conclude on where to send their teen. Parents drive teen to program and say goodbye while trying unsuccessfully to hold back tears.
Of course to people acclimated to fornits extreme view of reality, this will read as absurd, and the first paragraph will seem much more accurate. I post on fornits because I experienced being in a supposed abusive treatment program, and most of the people who post here on behalf of those who experienced it, do so by distorting the reality of what really goes on, in order to push their anti treatment agenda. I have no agenda other than to offer my own opinions and viewpoints, which I feel represents a more reality based view into what it's really like. I am willing to be honest, about the bad, and also the good. This makes me an outsider to the cult view on this forum that only bad happens in programs. When in reality those that experienced conveniently leave out the good, or anything even close to taking personal accountability for what happened. I do agree parents are victims in all of this, however, victims of their own troubled teen. My parents were victim of my behavior, and they did their best to deal with it. I hated them at the time, but now I can honestly say if they didn't act decisively I would of ended up jail if lucky, more likely would be dead right now.
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Edited: Wednesday, October 06, 2010
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Why does this thing keep crediting the program with saving its life when it'd obviously be better off dead?
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Dear Mom and Dad: Thanks for sending me to the program when things got tough at home. I mean you could have done your job as parents and actually "raised" your child but instead I got to go learn about drugs and powerlessness at the facility. I thank them for teaching me how cults work. I gained much insight in how to control others through group-think. Now as I form my own cult and collect souls for the afterlife I have a solid foundation to build on. SUCK IT helps me recruit new addicts all the time and for that I am grateful. When I see SUCK IT i see myself. Yes that deep. Thats what us cult leaders do: we come up with cool cryptic sounding deep stuff to wow our new recruits. Its a pretty rockin lifestyle I have to admit. Thanks Mom and Dad, if I had stayed home I wouldve just grown out of my adolescent drug experimentation and probably been a doctor or lawyer but instead I am now a powerless addict and aspiring cult leader. Cult leaders have way more fun than those doctors and lawyers ever could.
Peace and Powerlessness
Danny
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You guys are ridiculous. I don't know why you're all wasting your time with a troll thread clearly created to provoke responses. It's entertaining drama and all, but I sure hope no one thinks this is actually getting anywhere besides making Fornits seem like its userbase consists of a bunch of people who resort to name-calling like a bunch of schoolchildren in a playground in order to make a point. I mean, honestly. Neither SUCK IT nor Whooter is very likely to change what they claim, and it is not as if you do manage to somehow make them confess how wrong they were, suddenly the program issue will magically lift away and the game is won. Devoting what, nine threads with 127 pages, to that just seems absurd. Maybe I'm wrong . . . can I please know what is trying to be accomplished through all this?
Maybe I'm ignorant, but I get the impression that everything is all about talk in these places with nothing actually getting done. I find myself less and less passionate and more and more confused about programs and their place in our society. I'm disgusted with them, but I feel so hopeless about anything happening with it that I almost want to just forget about all it together. Yet, at the same time, I can think about nothing but "program, program, program" on occasion. I barely even know if what I want through was 'abuse' or whatever because I feel like I can't even remember what it was like anymore besides having occasional fits of sadness or anger in regards to it.
Now, I haven't been on Fornits since the dawn of time, but I have to say that Danny's merely looking for acceptance from the pro-program crowd. Seriously, he'll post in response to Whooter/SUCK IT posts with "Thanks guys, great post! Very profound!" I don't see why it's worth it to waste time on him either. His motives seem to be less about having to do with programs and more to do with wanting to be appreciated.
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You guys are ridiculous. I don't know why you're all wasting your time with a troll thread clearly created to provoke responses. It's entertaining drama and all, but I sure hope no one thinks this is actually getting anywhere besides making Fornits seem like its userbase consists of a bunch of people who resort to name-calling like a bunch of schoolchildren in a playground in order to make a point. I mean, honestly. Neither SUCK IT nor Whooter is very likely to change what they claim, and it is not as if you do manage to somehow make them confess how wrong they were, suddenly the program issue will magically lift away and the game is won. Devoting what, nine threads with 127 pages, to that just seems absurd. Maybe I'm wrong . . . can I please know what is trying to be accomplished through all this?
Maybe I'm ignorant, but I get the impression that everything is all about talk in these places with nothing actually getting done. I find myself less and less passionate and more and more confused about programs and their place in our society. I'm disgusted with them, but I feel so hopeless about anything happening with it that I almost want to just forget about all it together. Yet, at the same time, I can think about nothing but "program, program, program" on occasion. I barely even know if what I want through was 'abuse' or whatever because I feel like I can't even remember what it was like anymore besides having occasional fits of sadness or anger in regards to it.
Now, I haven't been on Fornits since the dawn of time, but I have to say that Danny's merely looking for acceptance from the pro-program crowd. Seriously, he'll post in response to Whooter/SUCK IT posts with "Thanks guys, great post! Very profound!" I don't see why it's worth it to waste time on him either. His motives seem to be less about having to do with programs and more to do with wanting to be appreciated.
Hey, if all your going to do is whine, cry and throw a temper tantrum, then don't com on here and read. I know what I'm doing here and I don't need a committee to tell me. I'm sorry my posts fail to enlighten you but hey, they fail to enlighten me also.... :rofl:. At times.
I'm working on it.
Everyone wants to be appreciated, just read your post above, blabbering about how lost you are and "but I feel so hopeless about anything happening with it that I almost want to just forget about it all together".
"anythinganyone", just worry about what your doing and stop depending on everyone else here to make you feel worthy. Find your niche and write about it, as time goes on it will define itself more. I am still a work in progress.
Now I want to clarify something to you, I am already appreciated in my life. I come here for my reasons and post my experiences and opinions. I have a few here that seem to relate to what I am saying, most do not.
I appreciate many posts here and have mentioned it to many, not just whooter and suck it.
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Edited: Wednesday, October 06, 2010