Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: Anonymous on November 16, 2009, 01:03:02 PM
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EDMONTON — Rahim Jaffer, the former Conservative MP for Edmonton-Strathcona, has been charged with drunk driving and possession of cocaine.
Mr. Jaffer, who is married to Simcoe-Grey Tory MP Helena Guergis, was stopped by police shortly before 1 a.m. on Sept. 11 in Palgrave, a suburban community in the town of Caledon northeast of Toronto.
The former MP was allegedly speeding through the village when he was stopped by the Ontario Provincial Police, who smelled alcohol on his breath and conducted an investigation, Const. Jonathan Beckett said in a news release.
Mr. Jaffer is scheduled to appear in court on Oct. 19. His driver’s licence was suspended for 90 days.
Mr. Jaffer lost his seat last fall to Linda Duncan of the NDP.
In the run-up to the election, Mr. Jaffer’s campaign took out an advertisement on and Edmonton’s 630 CHED radio that made reference to remarks NDP leader Jack Layton made in 2003 about his appreciation of marijuana.
“Edmontonians understand how difficult it is to make sure our children make the right choices, especially on serious issues like drug use,” the advertisement said.
“The Conservative party supports drug-free schools and getting tough on drug dealers who sell illegal drugs to children. Don’t let our schools go up in smoke.”
Edmonton Journal
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I am not aware of Radio Rahim supporting AARC. In fact, I have my doubts that Rahim even knows where Calgary is. One doesn't have to go fishing to find hypocritical politicians who support AARC. Here's a good one:
"Ms. Forsyth: — No, I can’t. But I can tell you we have two recourses we can go with drug and alcohol. We have AADAC (Alberta Alcohol & Drug Abuse Commission) which is our sort of Alberta alcohol and drug centre. We also have AARC which is the Alberta Adolescent Recovery Centre.
If a child is at stage 1 or 2 drug and alcohol addiction, we could put them into AADAC. If they’re at 3 or 4, which is a higher drug and alcohol addiction, 4 being the highest, then they will go into AARC which will then be covered by the government and long-term.
That again depends on how long the child is involved on the street. Those repeats that I’ve told you — 55 — I’ve got kids that are shooting cocaine into their feet, they’re so drug and alcohol addicted. So obviously they would have to go into AARC which deals with a higher level of addiction. Some of them are just starting to experiment with drugs and alcohol so we can get them the training and the help through AADAC."
http://www.legassembly.sk.ca/Committees ... ildren.htm (http://www.legassembly.sk.ca/Committees/Archive/aecc/Docs/000306Children.htm)
"I understand you have been in contact with Cindy Ady's office regarding
your concerns on the AARC program. As you live in the Calgary Fish
Creek riding they have forwarded your comments to our office. I
understand you have also been in contact with the Minister of Justice
and Minister of Health and Wellness. I have forwarded your concerns to
Heather and she recommends that if you are aware of a situation of abuse
happening in this facility that you, or the person directly affected,
contact the police or the Child Abuse Hotline at 1-800-387-5437.
Sincerely,
Jaime
Assistant to
Heather Forsyth, MLA
Calgary Fish Creek"
I would encourage interested readers to contact Heather and ask how it came to be that Rachel O'Neill was held in AARC for months, in light of the fact that AARC's go-to hack, Peter Choda, reported that it was "not clear that she has an advanced substance dependency disorder that is appropriate to admission to AARC." So much for the "higher level of addiction".
Heather might also explain where she came up with those classifications for addiction. Can't seem to find them anywhere in the DSM IV.
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For what it's worth ... Link for the article in the OP:
National Post
Former Alberta MP Rahim Jaffer charged with drunk driving, drug possession (http://http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/posted/archive/2009/09/16/former-alberta-mp-rahim-jaffer-charged-with-drunk-driving-drug-possession.aspx)
Posted: September 16, 2009, 6:34 PM by Chris Boutet
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Heather might also explain where she came up with those classifications for addiction. Can't seem to find them anywhere in the DSM IV.
One approach is to contact a few drug counselors and most will tell you that there are 4 stages to drug addiction
Here’s a closer look at the four main stages of drug addiction.
Stage 1: Experimentation
Experimentation is defined as the voluntary use of drugs without experiencing any negative social or legal consequences. For many, experimenting may occur once or several times as a way to “have fun” or even to help the individual cope with a problem. For many, experimentation can occur without any desire to continue using the drug. For others, it can start to become a problem when it moves into the next stage of addiction: regular use.
Stage 2: Regular Use
Some people will be able to enter the stage of regular use without developing a dependence or addiction. These people will be able to stop the drug use on their own. The problem with regular use is that the risk for substance abuse greatly increases during this stage. It also increases risky behaviors such as driving under the influence, unexplained violence, and symptoms of depression and anxiety.
Stage 3: Risky Use/Abuse
The line between regular use and risky use/abuse is a very thin one, but is usually defined as continued use of drugs in spite of severe social and legal consequences. What might have begun as a temporary form of escape can quickly lead to more serious problems. This is the stage where the warning signs of addiction will begin to appear: craving, preoccupation with the drug, and symptoms of depression, irritability and fatigue if the drug is not used.
Stage 4: Drug Addiction and Dependency
Physical dependence on a drug is often intertwined with addiction. Characteristics of dependence and drug addiction include withdrawal symptoms and compulsive use of the drug despite severe negative consequences to his or her relationships, physical and mental health, personal finances, job security and criminal record.
I would encourage interested readers to contact Heather and ask how it came to be that Rachel O'Neill was held in AARC for months, in light of the fact that AARC's go-to hack, Peter Choda, reported that it was "not clear that she has an advanced substance dependency disorder that is appropriate to admission to AARC." So much for the "higher level of addiction".
Although I dont want to answer for Heather. Rehabs which are set-up to handle people in the midst of Stage III and Stage IV addiction can also handle people struggling with Stage I and Stage II addiction. But this doesn’t work the other way around. So in special cases people in Stage I and II can be sent to a facility specializing in Stage III and IV and can be treated adequately.
Look at it like utilizing a small hammer to drive in a push pin. It is not really needed but it still does the job. I believe the treatment was effective and Rachael is able to hold down a job and is off addictive substances.
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Great reponse, totally unencumbered by facts or relevance. Those stages aren't found in the DSM IV. Whatever amateur quack resource you choose to turn to is your business, but I am referring specifically to a program that claims to treat a brain disease using a non-medical classification system in diagnosis of this disease. Why you chose to answer for Heather Forsyth when you're way down there in Massachusetts and ought to be worried about the lawsuits that are likely to come your way due to your ongoing involvement in the Aspen scam, is beyond me. I can't say for sure whether or not Rachael is able to hold down a job. From what I have heard, she suffers from PTSD brought on by being subjected to the illegal behaviour modification techniques used in AARC, so if she continues to carry on while carrying that terrible burden, I salute her.
Is holding someone against their will for 5 months with no legal right to do so, and subjecting them to psycho-surgery performed by unqualified amateurs just like using a hammer to push a pin? I would have said it was more like kidnapping and torture, but then I'm not trying to rip off anxious parents like you are.
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Those stages aren't found in the DSM IV.
I looked back at my post and I never mentioned that they were. ADHD is though lol. Your bible not mine. If you dont agree with the stages or think they should be broken down differently you should speak up instead of getting mad.... this is an open forum. For example Bipolar was being broken down by professionals into BipolarI and Bipolar II (for treatment purposes) long before it was broken down in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (DSM). The DSM reflecs real life and real life unfolds on a daily basis. No one waits for the DSM to come out with a new up date and then changes what they do, the DSM changes to reflect what the real world is doing. So you can choose to wait for updates to be voted in if you like that is your privilege. But you asked the question and that is the answer.
Look Ajax13, the information for the DSM IV was researched in the late 1980’s early 1990’s and was published in 1994. Should we all stand still until the new version comes out? No one does... Autism was a small piece then and is now diagnosed under several pieces and codes, but the version IV doesn’t reflect that we need to wait for DSM V.
Why you chose to answer for Heather Forsyth when you're way down there in Massachusetts
The internet knows no boundaries, Ajax13. Of all people you know that. The Union institute is in the US remember?
I can't say for sure whether or not Rachael is able to hold down a job.
Rachael is actually is doing quite well since leaving AARC at least the last time she checked in she was holding down a steady job, was clean and sober and seemed quite articulate when she spoke and well educated.
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Drivel again. The DSM IV provides the standard by which mental health professionals assess and diagnose disorders. I suggested that anyone reading this thread ask Heather Forsyth from whence she acquired her particular categories of addiction. You, for whatever reason, took it upon yourself to make a totally unsubstantiated claim about the source of her nomenclature. The only question I asked was in regard to your hammer on a pin metaphor for unlawful confinement and torture. While Rachael has accomplished a great deal in spite of having been wrongfully imprisoned and tortured in AARC, she has had a very arduous experience since fleeing AARC. Being a TTI shill in Massachusetts who has never met nor spoken to Rachael, you would know nothing about that. Rachael has never "checked in" with you, so again, one is left to be mildly repulsed by the bizarre nonsense you spew here. Your claim with regard to the DSM IV is specious. While there is currently debate as to the difference between the disorders of substance abuse and dependence and how they will be classified and diagnosed in the new DSM, both the nonsense you posted, and Heather Forsyth's four categories, are unscientific reisms and are not part of legitimate medical practise.
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Drivel again. The DSM IV provides the standard by which mental health professionals assess and diagnose disorders. I suggested that anyone reading this thread ask Heather Forsyth from whence she acquired her particular categories of addiction. You, for whatever reason, took it upon yourself to make a totally unsubstantiated claim about the source of her nomenclature.
I never spoke of the source. But what we do know is that the DSM IV was developed in the late 1980's and we are aprroaching 2010. You do the math. If you would like to stay on the side lines and disregard all the work and advancements which have been done since the publishing of DSM IV be my guest. If you would like to call Heather that is an option too, or you could take a minute to understand the 4 stages of addiction:
Here’s a closer look at the four main stages of drug addiction.
Stage 1: Experimentation
Experimentation is defined as the voluntary use of drugs without experiencing any negative social or legal consequences. For many, experimenting may occur once or several times as a way to “have fun” or even to help the individual cope with a problem. For many, experimentation can occur without any desire to continue using the drug. For others, it can start to become a problem when it moves into the next stage of addiction: regular use.
Stage 2: Regular Use
Some people will be able to enter the stage of regular use without developing a dependence or addiction. These people will be able to stop the drug use on their own. The problem with regular use is that the risk for substance abuse greatly increases during this stage. It also increases risky behaviors such as driving under the influence, unexplained violence, and symptoms of depression and anxiety.
Stage 3: Risky Use/Abuse
The line between regular use and risky use/abuse is a very thin one, but is usually defined as continued use of drugs in spite of severe social and legal consequences. What might have begun as a temporary form of escape can quickly lead to more serious problems. This is the stage where the warning signs of addiction will begin to appear: craving, preoccupation with the drug, and symptoms of depression, irritability and fatigue if the drug is not used.
Stage 4: Drug Addiction and Dependency
Physical dependence on a drug is often intertwined with addiction. Characteristics of dependence and drug addiction include withdrawal symptoms and compulsive use of the drug despite severe negative consequences to his or her relationships, physical and mental health, personal finances, job security and criminal record.
The only question I asked was in regard to your hammer on a pin metaphor for unlawful confinement and torture. While Rachael has accomplished a great deal in spite of having been wrongfully imprisoned and tortured in AARC, she has had a very arduous experience since fleeing AARC.
She has a good job, is also doing well and has been drug free since leaving AARC.
Being a TTI shill in Massachusetts who has never met nor spoken to Rachael, you would know nothing about that. Rachael has never "checked in" with you, so again, one is left to be mildly repulsed by the bizarre nonsense you spew here.
I sense a higher than normal level of frustration in that you resort to name calling when facts are brought to the table or someone disagrees with you. I checked back on my post and confirmed that I never stated that Rachael checked in with me. You seem to always confuse the facts Ajax13.
Your claim with regard to the DSM IV is specious. While there is currently debate as to the difference between the disorders of substance abuse and dependence and how they will be classified and diagnosed in the new DSM, both the nonsense you posted, and Heather Forsyth's four categories, are unscientific reisms and are not part of legitimate medical practise.
No one said they were, Ajax13. If you want to break them down differently yourself you are free to do so, this is an open forum. If you disagree with the way the four stages have been broken out then you should address them instead of ridiculing everyone else’s work. They may or may not be adopted for the next printing of the DSM. But change occurs over 20 years and the professionals are not going to forgo treatment awaiting the printing of the latest version of the DSM IV. But be my guest if that suits you.
You had the same MO when talking about AARC, lots of criticism but very little input or value added. You seem to have some experience with addiction… how would you break out the Stages? I have heard that some people like to categorize them into 3 stages.
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I suggested that readers ask Heather Forsyth as to the source of her four stages of addiction. Rather than finding out the answer to that question, you claimed one approach to getting an explanation as to where Heather Forsyth came up with her stages of addiction was to ask a drug counselor and then you posted what you claimed were four stages of drug addiction. These descriptions are not part of any scientific system for assessment and diagnosis of a brain disease. The four stages that you posted are, as I said, reisms. Why would you suggest asking a drug counselor rather than asking Heather Forsyth, as I had suggested? You have no idea whether or nor Rachael has been drug-free since leaving AARC. When you said "the last time she checked in" who were you claiming she had checked in with? You have no idea what goes on in that woman's life beyond what she has posted here, and what you saw, if you even bothered to watch, the Fifth Estate program.
You're a psychopath and you got enraged when I inadvertently described your real situation through dumb luck. I didn't know that you actually had put your kid in a wilderness program where he was subjected to abuse and quackery and then he killed himself. It was just a guess based on your deviant behavior evident in your posts on Fornits. As a psychopath, you're used to manipulating folks to accomplish your ends, so you're lazy. Because you're lazy, you don't do much work to ensure that you can use facts and logic when you try to play your game here. And like any psychopath, once people are onto you, your scope of action is constantly diminishing. Metaphorically speaking, you're reduced to whacking off while you sniff your victim's panties as the cops surround your house.
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Great reponse, totally unencumbered by facts or relevance. Those stages aren't found in the DSM IV.
No, Druggie, they took them from my magnum opus Gone Way Down--Teenage Drug Use Is A Disease. They are obviously applying the program that Dr. Vause provided them after I so graciously taught them to that ol' Canuck.
I sense a bit of an "enabler" attitude in you Ajax---perhaps you should drop by Christ Of The Sea Church some time......I understand you Canadians are awfully fond of vacationing in Florida, and I can help you with a little counseling for your latent substance abuse problem. I can refer you to some wonderful programs where you can get the help you so desperately need.
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Dr. Newton, I can hardly see my monitor through my tears. Although I don't "use" drugs per se, I have seen and enjoyed several movies starring Robert Mitchum. And while I have not fornicated with animals as a means to acquire drugs, I did have a pet corgi as a boy. I realize that the halcion days of PRIDE shipping my fellow Calgarians off to New Jersey are only a fond memory, if you could do anything to help me find some teenagers to watch me defecate so that I can come to terms with my disease, I would be eternally grateful.
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I suggested that readers ask Heather Forsyth as to the source of her four stages of addiction. Rather than finding out the answer to that question, you claimed one approach to getting an explanation as to where Heather Forsyth came up with her stages of addiction was to ask a drug counselor and then you posted what you claimed were four stages of drug addiction. These descriptions are not part of any scientific system for assessment and diagnosis of a brain disease. The four stages that you posted are, as I said, reisms. Why would you suggest asking a drug counselor rather than asking Heather Forsyth, as I had suggested?
I always think it is a good idea to collect as much information as possible so that people can choose for themselves. Some people may not want to take the time to locate Heathers phone number and try to get her on the phone. I am not sure if she is reading here so she may not post the 4 Stages herself. Instead of waiting why not post information we have available and let people kick it around and choose for themselves.
I am not suggesting to take these 4 Stages used by Drug counsellors over what Heather says, but we can take a look at these while waiting for Heather to respond or for people to call her. Then we can post Her 4 Stages and then compare them. I think it would make for an interesting discussion. Why would an open discussion frighten you so much?
You have no idea whether or nor Rachael has been drug-free since leaving AARC. When you said "the last time she checked in" who were you claiming she had checked in with? You have no idea what goes on in that woman's life beyond what she has posted here, and what you saw, if you even bothered to watch, the Fifth Estate program.
Actually I do, Ajax13. I was referring to the last time she checked in here at fornits.
You're a psychopath and you got enraged when I inadvertently described your real situation through dumb luck. I didn't know that you actually had put your kid in a wilderness program where he was subjected to abuse and quackery and then he killed himself. It was just a guess based on your deviant behavior evident in your posts on Fornits. As a psychopath, you're used to manipulating folks to accomplish your ends, so you're lazy. Because you're lazy, you don't do much work to ensure that you can use facts and logic when you try to play your game here. And like any psychopath, once people are onto you, your scope of action is constantly diminishing. Metaphorically speaking, you're reduced to whacking off while you sniff your victim's panties as the cops surround your house.
Oh boy, here we go with the personal attacks again. I remember this approach when you were faced with facts about AARC you started calling board members fat and making fun of Vauses son for playing Hockey. You even made fun of the college where this guy went to school until I pointed out that it was an accredited University and then you turned on me. By making fun of me do you think it will somehow diminish the 4 Stages that have been posted? Were you hoping that they didn’t exist so you could ridicule this Heather person? Your a strange dude, Ajax13. You ask questions and when someone answers instead of discussing you attack the people personally.
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I agree with you guest, I think the personal attacks are out of line and detract from the discussion. I dont think we are sure if this Heather person is even reading this thread so waiting for a response is probably not the best direction right now. But getting back to the stages again I think we need to keep in mind that they are not there as an exact barometer so to speak. The stages should be used as a point of reference not as a labelling device. Each case needs to be looked at separately. If a child is at the high end of Stage II (for example) and counsellors or therapists feel that this person is quickly headed for Stage III or has a family History then placement into AARC may be considered proactive (See Reference below). Stage II placement at AADAC may be ineffective for this child. So in my opinion these Stages should used as a tool for placement and communication between professionals not as a set of laws or labels which will supercede a therapists' experience or individual needs.
Stage 2: Regular Use
Some people will be able to enter the stage of regular use without developing a dependence or addiction. These people will be able to stop the drug use on their own. The problem with regular use is that the risk for substance abuse greatly increases during this stage. It also increases risky behaviors such as driving under the influence, unexplained violence, and symptoms of depression and anxiety.
Stage 3: Risky Use/Abuse
The line between regular use and risky use/abuse is a very thin one, but is usually defined as continued use of drugs in spite of severe social and legal consequences. What might have begun as a temporary form of escape can quickly lead to more serious problems. This is the stage where the warning signs of addiction will begin to appear: craving, preoccupation with the drug, and symptoms of depression, irritability and fatigue if the drug is not used.
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By making fun of me do you think it will somehow diminish the 4 Stages that have been posted?
The "four stages" hypothesis of which you are so enamored don't need Ajax, or anyone else, to diminish them----they are quackery, pseudoscience, and downright fraudulent, particularly when they are passed off as some sort of diagnostic tool in the field of addictionology. As was mentioned earlier, they are lifted directly from a completely discredited (actually, never credible in the first place) source---"Dr." Miller Newton's book, "Gone Way Down". Your acceptance of the "four stages" model indicates that you are an idiot, and also illustrates that AARC and Vause, despite AARColyte claims to the contrary, are direct descendants of Newton's Straight/KIDS program. No credible treatment facility would base their philosophy of treatment on such outright bullshit, but, brainwashed zombie that you are, you take them as gospel truth because "Miller Newton/Vause says so". You may as well start making claims for astrology, phrenology, or any other pseudoscience, because they are about as valid as the four stages model that you are heralding as some sort of scientifically valid notion. By doing so, you prove that AARC = Straight, inc. or KIDS with a Canadian address.
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The "four stages" hypothesis of which you are so enamored don't need I, or anyone else, to diminish them----they are quackery, pseudoscience, and downright fraudulent, particularly when they are passed off as some sort of diagnostic tool in the field of addictionology. As was mentioned earlier, they are lifted directly from a completely discredited (actually, never credible in the first place) source---"Dr." Miller Newton's book, "Gone Way Down". Your acceptance of the "four stages" model indicates that you are an idiot, and also illustrates that AARC and Vause, despite AARColyte claims to the contrary, are direct descendants of Newton's Straight/KIDS program. No credible treatment facility would base their philosophy of treatment on such outright bullshit, but, brainwashed zombie that you are, you take them as gospel truth because "Miller Newton/Vause says so". You may as well start making claims for astrology, phrenology, or any other pseudoscience, because they are about as valid as the four stages model that you are heralding as some sort of scientifically valid notion. By doing so, you prove that AARC = Straight, inc. or KIDS with a Canadian address.
You are confusing this with “life stages” in Dr. Miller Newtons book. I know you probably feel a little foolish after that outburst but I cant believe how much anger you have in you. This is just a discussion, Ajax13. Nothing is being formalized here or written in stone. You were looking for information on the 4 Stages of Addiction ( See your original post (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?p=351139&sid=16350731eadd952c4723e53c79cb22b7&sid=16350731eadd952c4723e53c79cb22b7#p351139))and requested that the readers ask Heather for her reference and I offered up the 4 stages which are typically used within the addiction treatment community. If these are different than the ones you sited in your original post then that makes for a better discussion because the definition of stage II and Stage III defines whether a person is better suited for AADAC or AARC. If the stages that Heather works to are different than the ones I posted than this would be interesting to look at from a viewpoint of the different communities and how they define treatment needs.
Have you had any luck contacting Heather Forsyth? I think you would have better luck than the rest of us in contacting her since you seem to know more about this. In the mean time lets stick with the 4 Stages we presently have on the table and we will defer reference to Heathers 4 Stages until we receive them. But either way I am sure they are going to be similar.
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You are confusing this with “life stages” in Dr. Miller Newtons book. I know you probably feel a little foolish after that outburst but I cant believe how much anger you have in you.
No, asshole, those "stages of addiction" come directly from Newton's book. I know, I have read it, and was subjected to the quackery. The Newton book I referenced doesn't have anything in it about "four life stages", it does, however, mention the thouroughly ludicrous "four stages of chemical dependency".
Also, I'm not Ajax.......but I do sympathize with him, and share his anger at idiots like yourself, who continue to herald discredited pseudoscience. Idiots like you help people die from addictions. You and your ilk are the equivalent of sending someone to a faith healer rather than a hospital.
You are confusing quackery and fraud with real addiction treatment, but you don't feel foolish (though you should) because you are completely attached to your delusions that AARC (and by extension, Newton and Str8/KIDS) is a legitimate treatment facility rather than the brainwashing cult that it is.
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Here is the way “Join Together” defines the stages from the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse at Columbia University. They take a similar approach but break it out into 5 Stages. They add a “Risky stage” as a separation between “Regular use” and “dependence”. This would allow for more latitude in treatment options from the therapists point of view in choosing AARC or AADAC.
Take a look:
Stages of Substance Use
Stages of Substance Use include experimentation, regular use, risky use, dependence, and addiction.
Substance use can be addressed and treated at any stage – despite popular myths,
people do not need to “hit bottom” before they can benefit from help.
Stage One: Experimentation
The first stage, experimentation, is the voluntary use of alcohol or other drugs. Quite
frequently, the person experimenting is trying to erase another problem. An older person
may start drinking to cope with depression after losing a spouse. A teenager, angry about
his parents’ divorce, could start smoking marijuana or huffing inhalants. Experimentation
may even include a husband taking his wife’s prescription painkillers to cope with a back
problem. The substance seems solve the problem. So the person takes more, and moves
from experimentation to regular use, the next stage.
Stage Two: Regular Use
Some people stay in the regular use stage indefinitely. They will not develop a problem,
and stop by themselves. Others start using substances in a manner that is risky or
hazardous to themselves or to others. Risky behaviors include: smoking marijuana and
driving; binge drinking (consuming more than the recommended amount of alcohol at one
occasion); and unexplained violence, to one’s self or another.
Stage Three: Risky Use
When and how the transition from regular to risky use happens differs for every individual.
So, what constitutes “risky behavior” by another person can be difficult to gauge. Just
the same, if someone’s behavior concerns you, say so. People can pass quickly from risky
use to dependence.
Stage Four: Dependence
Characteristics of dependence include: Repeated use of alcohol or other drugs that leads
to failure to fulfill major responsibilities related to work, family, school or other roles. Or,
repeatedly drinking or using drugs in situations that are physically hazardous, such as
driving while intoxicated or using heavy machinery when intoxicated. Or repeated legal
problems. Or any combination of these.
Many dependent people are able to work, maintain family relationships and friendships,
and limit their use of alcohol or other drugs to certain time periods, such as evenings
or weekends.
Stage Five: Addiction
The last phase of the spectrum of substance use problems is addiction. Addiction is a
medical condition involving serious psychological and physical changes from repeated
heavy use of alcohol, other drugs, or both.
• Symptoms include uncontrollable alcohol or other drug craving, seeking, and use,
that persists even in the face of negative consequences.
• Addiction is a progressive illness. If left untreated, it gets worse. It is also chronic,
or long-standing (versus acute, or short-term).
• Addiction is a treatable illness. Recovery rates for people who go through treatment are very similar to those who get treatment for other chronic diseases such as diabetes and asthma. There are a number of treatment methods and community resources, including outpatient or residential treatment programs and twelve-step groups These approaches can be customized to fit the needs of the individual and family.
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I am not sure if Heather was referncing the 4 Stages of addiction or the 5 Stages as defined by (NCASA) National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse at Columbia University. But either one would serve as a great reference in my opinion. We can wait to see how Ajax13 makes out contacting her.
I havent seen a reference to Miller Newtons Stages but would be interested to view them. Anyone have a link to that one?
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The model that you are using has been thouroughly discredited.
Addiction is NOT a disease, though it may qualify as a "condition".
By calling it a disease, you are trying to legitimize AARCism (Newtonism) as a form of medicine, or at least, psychology.
It is not a disease, and AARC/Straight/KIDS/other Synanon-derived "treatments" are not medicine. You begin with a false premise and end up with an erroneous conclusion.
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I could never diminish those four unscientific stages. They are, by their very nature, so totally diminished in terms of their relationship to actual medical science that I could do nothing further to make them more ridiculous. I don't know what the addiction community is. I will assume that is a reism that you have coined to refer to all non-medical TTI quackery practised in the name of treating addiction, as opposed to mental health professionals, who use the DSM IV to assess and diagnose disorders involving addiction. But again, the pertinent question was where Heather Forsyth obtained her particular nomenclature. Even though you had no idea as to the answer, you took it upon yourself to propose a preposterous method for obtaining the answer, and then posited an equally ridiculous answer.
If one accepts the disease model of addiction, medical literature postulates structural and functional changes in the brain that occur as a result of prolonged substance abuse. Experimentation can hardly be seen to constitute a stage of addiction, which in terms of the disease model refers to the brain state after these structrual and functional changes occur. Experimentation precedes these purported changes. If the brain state hasn't changed, the person does not have the disease. Your post is just more quackery from a TTI shill.
Not sure why you added my username to the above quote, but if it makes you happy, good for you.
The fact that I find your laziness repugnant hardly indicates anger. You're repulsive, but your total lack of acumen and facts to counter what I say is greatly reassuring. When I refer to you as a psychopath, it's not name-calling. You have clearly demonstrated that you have a disorder, quite likely psychopathy. It was your deviant behaviour that led me to make the shot-in-the dark about you putting your kid in a wilderness program after which he killed himself. As I said, it was just dumb luck that I turned out to be right, although the world would be a better place had it been you rather than your son that ended up on the slab. Although there is the old saying that you have to be good to be lucky.
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Dear Guest
You miss the point about the dangers associated with subjecting an adolescent to aarc.
At aarc the patients, if they want to progress, are required to acknowledge that they have an illness- addiction- that they can't control and that they will have to deal with it every day for the rest of their lives. They are also told that the first step to recovery is acknowledging that they have the illness and that they are powerless over it. Without the acknowledgement the patient is stuck in phase 1.
You said the following in one of your posts in this thread
"Although I dont want to answer for Heather. Rehabs which are set-up to handle people in the midst of Stage III and Stage IV addiction can also handle people struggling with Stage I and Stage II addiction. But this doesn’t work the other way around. So in special cases people in Stage I and II can be sent to a facility specializing in Stage III and IV and can be treated adequately.
Look at it like utilizing a small hammer to drive in a push pin. It is not really needed but it still does the job. I believe the treatment was effective and Rachael is able to hold down a job and is off addictive substances."
Now look at the profile of a stage one or stage 2 person as defined in the non aarc definitions you provided. People in those phases are not addicted at all.
Accepting that there are stages don't you see that placing a person who you describe as phase one or two into aarc can do them far more harm than good. A person in what you call phase one or phase two is not addicted to anything. They are not a phase one or phase two addict and placing such a person into a facility with recovering addicts who believe everyone is just like them is irrational, cruel and harmful.
The problem with facilities like aarc is that that those who believed they were helped by it also believe that everyone that takes a drink or smokes a joint has started down a path that leads to addiction. That is just nonsense and it happens here because the aarc advocates tend to become missionaries to the rest of the world.
One of the points of the phases as presented in the non arrc version is that the words addict and addiction are limited in their use. Everyone who experiments with drugs is not destined to be an addict and has no particular disease at all. They may be just experimenting.
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The problem with facilities like aarc is that that those who believed they were helped by it also believe that everyone that takes a drink or smokes a joint has started down a path that leads to addiction. That is just nonsense and it happens here because the aarc advocates tend to become missionaries to the rest of the world
No, Druggie-sympathizer, you miss the point......drug addiction happens long before the first drink or joint. What is known as the "dry druggie attitude" causes addiction even if the druggie in question has never used drugs of any sort. I have demostrated this truth several times in my career. Preventive intervention, such as Straight , KIDS, or AARC is the only way to save even those druggies who have never actually "gotten high"---otherwise, they wiill certainly wind up DEAD, INSANE, or IN JAIL. I've seen druggies go right to mainlining smack, without bothering to drink or toke down a bonghit.......they do this because they are driven by what is known in medical circles as theri "druggie will". Only my proven, time-tested techniques will save them.
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Thank goodness you've come back Dr. Newton. While I admire Reuben's willingness to embrace the metaphysical concepts that you were so successful in using to formulate your highly-regarded treatment program, I find his refusal to acknowledge your Christ-like hand in chanelling said concepts unto the unworthy but needy to be indicative of his druggie dishonesty.
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Now look at the profile of a stage one or stage 2 person as defined in the non aarc definitions you provided. People in those phases are not addicted at all.
Accepting that there are stages don't you see that placing a person who you describe as phase one or two into aarc can do them far more harm than good. A person in what you call phase one or phase two is not addicted to anything. They are not a phase one or phase two addict and placing such a person into a facility with recovering addicts who believe everyone is just like them is irrational, cruel and harmful.
The problem with facilities like aarc is that that those who believed they were helped by it also believe that everyone that takes a drink or smokes a joint has started down a path that leads to addiction. That is just nonsense and it happens here because the aarc advocates tend to become missionaries to the rest of the world.
One of the points of the phases as presented in the non arrc version is that the words addict and addiction are limited in their use. Everyone who experiments with drugs is not destined to be an addict and has no particular disease at all. They may be just experimenting.
You have a valid point. It would be unnecessary and even damaging to place a person who was not addicted into a treatment center. My intention in that discussion was to show that the 4 Stages or 5 Stages as defined by the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse at Columbia University can give mental health professionals “talking points”(or benchmarks) so when consulting each other they can be on the same page the same as doctors do when discussing “Stages” of Cancer development for example. But back to my point. The advantages of defining Stages allows a mental health professional to make a determination that a particular client may be advancing thru Stage II very quickly and has a family history of addiction and therefore would benefit from AARC vs AADAC. So by defining Stages of addiction mental health professional can better treat the patients more consistently and this also lends itself to better results when studies are performed.
As far as believers go I hear you loud and clear. My Aunt had heart by-pass surgery and now over night believes anyone who eats red meat is destined to follow in her path. She is a true Vegetarian overnight. I can see how this would apply to addiction also when recovered addicts think everyone who drinks or smokes is an addict or headed down that path. Personally I believe it has a lot to do with family history and risk of addiction runs in the family.
As the Stages become more main stream and better defined the risk of a person being placed in rehab unnecessarily will be eliminated or as a minimum greatly reduced.
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So AARC is guilty of medical malpractice (at least) by admitting kids who aren't addicts?
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Reuben, those stages you posted are reisms. They do not refer to stages of a brain disease. Now run it by us again who Rachael checked in with, how you know this, and why you claimed that readers could find out the origins of Heather Forsyth's four stages of addiction by asking a drug counselor? Are you this lazy at work? I realize that you're a salesman, but how do you slide your laziness and ineptitude past your co-workers? Those IT cats are usually pretty sharp. Is that when you change jobs, once they find out you're just a scammer with no real abilities? How long until Correlsense sends you kicking your lunchpail down the road? Playing with you on Fornits reminds me of whack-a-mole, although those plastic moles are generally a little brighter and less predictible than you. No matter how far down the garden path you go Johnny, I always know the way back.
So interested readers, are Heather Forsyth's categories of addiction taken from AARC, who unquestionably took them from the good Doctor Newton?
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Actually it was me who posted the Stages of addiction so I will answer that portion. The previous poster was right about your anger towards other posters who disagree with you Ajax. You should try to discuss more and allow those people with differing opinions to post without being ridiculed. An open discussion is healthy and can be informative.
So interested readers, are Heather Forsyth's categories of addiction taken from AARC, who unquestionably took them from the good Doctor Newton?
The stages may have also been taken from the National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse who have broken the Stages down into 5 categories. They added a “Risky” Stage to separate Stage II and III. The original 4 Stages have been used by Mental health professionals in the US for some time now and apparently are being refined.
I am not sure if Heather is posting or reading here but when she does it will be interesting to see how her Stages compare or if they are the same ones adopted here in the US.
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So lazy, Reuben! Are you pretending to be cold-calling while you're on Fornits? How long do you think it'll be until they catch on and fire you Johnny? You've almost made it a year. Will you get sued for your TTI shill work before you get fired from Correlsense? Only time will tell.
Back to the issue at hand. Was Heather Forsyth using the pseudo-scientific classifications that AARC took from Kids? How did Forsyth come to determine that those most seriously affected by the disease would be sent, at tax-payer's expense, to the unlicensed quack compound known as AARC, while the less seriously affected would be treated by AADAC?
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Was Heather Forsyth using the pseudo-scientific classifications that AARC took from Kids? How did Forsyth come to determine that those most seriously affected by the disease would be sent, at tax-payer's expense, to the unlicensed quack compound known as AARC, while the less seriously affected would be treated by AADAC?
So,Ajax, you got tired of giving me a hard time and are back to dumping your anger on this Reuben guy. Have fun with that.
To answer your question lets look at the quote from Heather:
If a child is at stage 1 or 2 drug and alcohol addiction, we could put them into AADAC. If they’re at 3 or 4, which is a higher drug and alcohol addiction, 4 being the highest, then they will go into AARC which will then be covered by the government and long-term.
These stages apply to either the 4 Stage process used by Mental Health Professionals in the US or She was referring to the Stages outlined by the National Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse. Here see below:
Stages of Substance Use
Stages of Substance Use include experimentation, regular use, risky use, dependence, and addiction.
Substance use can be addressed and treated at any stage – despite popular myths,
people do not need to “hit bottom” before they can benefit from help.
Stage One: Experimentation
The first stage, experimentation, is the voluntary use of alcohol or other drugs. Quite
frequently, the person experimenting is trying to erase another problem. An older person
may start drinking to cope with depression after losing a spouse. A teenager, angry about
his parents’ divorce, could start smoking marijuana or huffing inhalants. Experimentation
may even include a husband taking his wife’s prescription painkillers to cope with a back
problem. The substance seems solve the problem. So the person takes more, and moves
from experimentation to regular use, the next stage.
Stage Two: Regular Use
Some people stay in the regular use stage indefinitely. They will not develop a problem,
and stop by themselves. Others start using substances in a manner that is risky or
hazardous to themselves or to others. Risky behaviors include: smoking marijuana and
driving; binge drinking (consuming more than the recommended amount of alcohol at one
occasion); and unexplained violence, to one’s self or another.
Stage Three: Risky Use
When and how the transition from regular to risky use happens differs for every individual.
So, what constitutes “risky behavior” by another person can be difficult to gauge. Just
the same, if someone’s behavior concerns you, say so. People can pass quickly from risky
use to dependence.
Stage Four: Dependence
Characteristics of dependence include: Repeated use of alcohol or other drugs that leads
to failure to fulfill major responsibilities related to work, family, school or other roles. Or,
repeatedly drinking or using drugs in situations that are physically hazardous, such as
driving while intoxicated or using heavy machinery when intoxicated. Or repeated legal
problems. Or any combination of these.
Many dependent people are able to work, maintain family relationships and friendships,
and limit their use of alcohol or other drugs to certain time periods, such as evenings
or weekends.
Stage Five: Addiction
The last phase of the spectrum of substance use problems is addiction. Addiction is a
medical condition involving serious psychological and physical changes from repeated
heavy use of alcohol, other drugs, or both.
• Symptoms include uncontrollable alcohol or other drug craving, seeking, and use,
that persists even in the face of negative consequences.
• Addiction is a progressive illness. If left untreated, it gets worse. It is also chronic,
or long-standing (versus acute, or short-term).
• Addiction is a treatable illness. Recovery rates for people who go through treatment are very similar to those who get treatment for other chronic diseases such as diabetes and asthma. There are a number of treatment methods and community resources, including outpatient or residential treatment programs and twelve-step groups These approaches can be customized to fit the needs of the individual and family.
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Guest, dont let Ajax13 get to you. I have seen him like this before on another thread. He posts the same question over and over again and then when someone answers him he gets angry and frustrated and starts calling everyone names. I think he likes his questions to go unanswered for some reason. He wont engage in any conversation or debate that I have seen. Just a repetitive question followed by lots of anger and name calling.
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I am curious to know how you go through an average work day, Reuben. Do you have to be in an office for much of the day? I know it doesn't take much time to make up these posts for you since they're devoid of any research or evidence, but the frequency with which you post is what arouses my curiosity. I get a mental image of you checking your lap-top every few minutes while people think you're conducting work related to your job. With your wife mercifully free of this mortal coil you've got all the time in the world at home, but what exactly do your co-workers think you're doing all day?
While Johnny copies and pastes his five stages of substance use that he claimed were stages of addiction again, let's get back to AARC.
At the time Forsyth claimed that the Province would pay to send kids into AARC, she was not even a cabinet minister. So who was deciding that the most severly addicted children would be sent to AARC, a facility with no operating license, no regulation of services, and a counselling staff composed of unlicensed amateurs? And again, where did she come up with the four stages of addiction that she claimed are used to categorize people in order to determine treatment?
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I am curious to know how you go through an average work day, Reuben. Do you have to be in an office for much of the day? I know it doesn't take much time to make up these posts for you since they're devoid of any research or evidence, but the frequency with which you post is what arouses my curiosity. I get a mental image of you checking your lap-top every few minutes while people think you're conducting work related to your job. With your wife mercifully free of this mortal coil you've got all the time in the world at home, but what exactly do your co-workers think you're doing all day?
While Johnny copies and pastes his five stages of substance use that he claimed were stages of addiction again, let's get back to AARC.
At the time Forsyth claimed that the Province would pay to send kids into AARC, she was not even a cabinet minister. So who was deciding that the most severly addicted children would be sent to AARC, a facility with no operating license, no regulation of services, and a counselling staff composed of unlicensed amateurs? And again, where did she come up with the four stages of addiction that she claimed are used to categorize people in order to determine treatment?
Sam you were right. Same question just re phrased slightly and still hammering on this Reuben guy. Let me take the last part
And again, where did she come up with the four stages of addiction that she claimed are used to categorize people in order to determine treatment?
These Stages were taken from mental health professionals primarily in the United States. Stages I and II were determined to be early Stages of drug use and Stages III and IV were determined to be stages of addiction and warranted acceptance into the AARC program. A determination scale like this is needed to elliminate or help reduce the number of kids who are not addicted to being placed into the program.
Hope this helps
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Johnny, when you type in a name in order to respond to yourself after you've attempted to assert that you're someone other than who you really are, do you think people fall for that, or is it a nihilstic attempt to frustrate people? Your behavior is so bizarre it's hard to tell. You're still listed on the Correlsense website, so I assume that they haven't fired you yet.
Again, you're answering a question even though it's impossible for you to know the answer, and you're spouting nonsense to do it. Your 5 reisms are not observable stages of a brain disease. Forsyth very specifically referred to stages 1 and 2 as addiction, not levels of drug use. Lazy Reuben.
So back to AARC. Where did Heather Forsyth come up with the four stages of addiction to which she referred, who was referring these kids into AARC, and why were the most severely addicted kids being sent to an unlicensed religious sect using unlicensed amateurs as counselling staff?
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It's really funny to watch TheWho post as multiple people with the same opinion (even though it's not based on any science, but rather pseudoscience) and both of his "personalities" get thoroughly shredded by Ajax13 who calmly and logically destroys each of Whooter's spurious statements while Whooter's multiple personalities say Ajax13 is "hostile and angry."
Whooter, if you think you're swaying even the most inexperienced of neophytes here you are sadly mistaken, as usual. I know you won't stop though, because of your compulsion to get the last word. It's a sickness and you must have the last word to feed your tiny, fractured and fragile ego. Ajax has you pegged dead on and it makes you very upset. It shows. It's like watching a checkers palyer (Whooter) play a chess player (Ajax13). Whooter's intellect is sevreal orders of magnitude weaker than Ajax13's and it's plainly obvious to anyone with a brain of their own.
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Okay let me take a stab at this one:
So back to AARC. Where did Heather Forsyth come up with the four stages of addiction to which she referred, who was referring these kids into AARC, and why were the most severely addicted kids being sent to an unlicensed religious sect using unlicensed amateurs as counselling staff?
They came out with a list of stages in the 1990’s which categorized the stages of addiction. If Heather were referring to these (which it appears she is) then they would be the following:
Stage One: Experimentation
Stage Two: Regular Use
Stage Three: Risky Use
Stage Four: Dependence
Stage Five: Addiction
(These were increased from 4 stages to 5 stages when they added “Risky Use”)
The kids who were in Stages I and II were going to AADAC and kids who were more severely affected with dependence and addiction Stages were sent to AARC for treatment.
It will be interesting to see how closely the Stages that Heather posts are to the ones we use in the US. It appears they had not added the “Risky Use” stage at that time.
The above info is from the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse.
I hope this helps to clear up some of the confusion.
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It's really funny to watch TheWho post as multiple people with the same opinion (even though it's not based on any science, but rather pseudoscience) and both of his "personalities" get thoroughly shredded by Ajax13 who calmly and logically destroys each of Whooter's spurious statements while Whooter's multiple personalities say Ajax13 is "hostile and angry."
Whooter, if you think you're swaying even the most inexperienced of neophytes here you are sadly mistaken, as usual. I know you won't stop though, because of your compulsion to get the last word. It's a sickness and you must have the last word to feed your tiny, fractured and fragile ego. Ajax has you pegged dead on and it makes you very upset. It shows. It's like watching a checkers palyer (Whooter) play a chess player (Ajax13). Whooter's intellect is sevreal orders of magnitude weaker than Ajax13's and it's plainly obvious to anyone with a brain of their own.
This is true. I'm pretty new here and I have seen this poster --the guy everyone calls The Who-- doing the same things in a few other threads too. Most people call him out right away so I guess he's not fooling anyone. But anyway his arguments don't make any sense anyway. They are always off topic to start with and then you read thru it and it doesn't even hold up at all. It's like he's not even in the same conversation, he's just trying to distract. But yeah, this post above is right. I'm new and I see it already.
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Does it state anywhere why they added the Risky use category? I am curious as to why they didnt leave this under "regular use". Is there different treatment for this?
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Lazy ol' Reuben. You could have taken a few minutes and rustled up some sort of clap-trap that actually referred to four or five stages of addiction, but you couldn't be bothered so you're still posting these pseudo-scientific levels of drug use and trying to say they're levels of addiction.
I am curious to know how you go through a work day. Are you furtively using your lap-top for this, or do you sit in an office where nobody can see what you're up to?
I'm also curious to know if you've ever had a run-in with the law before related to fraud. It seems unlikely to me that someone as deviant as you made it to forty without any previous scams coming to light.
Here's a question only you culd answer, Johnny. How long do you think you''ll last before Correlsense fires you?
Here's another. Do you have sales people under you who actually do some work, or will you have to answer for your failings on your own?
Back to AARC. It would be interesting to find out to whom Forsyth was referring in this decision-making process to determine treatment. Who provided her with this set of categories and who determined that people should be sent at tax-payer's expense to the unlicensed, unregulated religious sect for treatment of a purported brain disease.
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Does it state anywhere why they added the Risky use category? I am curious as to why they didnt leave this under "regular use". Is there different treatment for this?
Stages allow for treatment options and expand over time as more options become available. Take Breast cancer for example. The Stages were initially
Stage I,II and III
Now we have:
Stages I, II, IIIA, and operable IIIC
Stages IIIB and inoperable IIIC
Stage IV
They have broken them out a little finer as more treatment options came to the table. This also allows medical professionals to better communicate to one another and to the patient.
so I expect as more treatment options become available then the Stages will change along with it.
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It's really funny to watch TheWho post as multiple people with the same opinion (even though it's not based on any science, but rather pseudoscience) and both of his "personalities" get thoroughly shredded by Ajax13 who calmly and logically destroys each of Whooter's spurious statements while Whooter's multiple personalities say Ajax13 is "hostile and angry."
Whooter, if you think you're swaying even the most inexperienced of neophytes here you are sadly mistaken, as usual. I know you won't stop though, because of your compulsion to get the last word. It's a sickness and you must have the last word to feed your tiny, fractured and fragile ego. Ajax has you pegged dead on and it makes you very upset. It shows. It's like watching a checkers palyer (Whooter) play a chess player (Ajax13). Whooter's intellect is sevreal orders of magnitude weaker than Ajax13's and it's plainly obvious to anyone with a brain of their own.
This is true. I'm pretty new here and I have seen this poster --the guy everyone calls The Who-- doing the same things in a few other threads too. Most people call him out right away so I guess he's not fooling anyone. But anyway his arguments don't make any sense anyway. They are always off topic to start with and then you read thru it and it doesn't even hold up at all. It's like he's not even in the same conversation, he's just trying to distract. But yeah, this post above is right. I'm new and I see it already.
That's funny, Bob. I'm also pretty new here and I've already seen this more than a few times. This guy The Who or Whooter or whatever he calls himself just loses arguments constantly and then keeps changing the subject after it's clear he lost the argument. He either just says the same thing over and over or he changes the subject entirely becaus he loses about every argument on this board. Is that guy for real or does he make all these statements kind of as a parody of an idiot?
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Johnny, I don't have to make up sock puppets to support what I say. I hope the readers take what I say and ask themselves and others questions. You're not a parody of an idiot, you're a psychopath. You are not nearly clever enough to parody anything, and parody is a manifestation of a sense of humor which, as an impulse-driven reptile, you ain't got.
In all seriousness though, I am curious to see how long it will take for your Fornits activities to catch up with you at work and you have to add Correlsense to your ever-growing list of failures.
So have you ever been busted for fraud before, Reuben?
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Just a repetitive question followed by lots of anger and name calling.
Reminds me of Straight, KIDS, and AARC. Just add physical abuse, such as malnourishment, denial of bathroom use, denial of education, stress positions, beatings, and sleep deprivation and you've got a program..........
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Just a repetitive question followed by lots of anger and name calling.
Reminds me of Straight, KIDS, and AARC. Just add physical abuse, such as malnourishment, denial of bathroom use, denial of education, stress positions, beatings, and sleep deprivation and you've got a program..........
Oh No! So Ajax has become AARC! They say thats what happens over time, you become what you hate most.
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Johnny, tell us again who Rachael checked in with, and how you know this? And once more, why did you try to provide an answer to a very specific question as to the origin of Heather Forsyth's alleged categories of addiction, when you cannot possibly know that answer?
I still want to know how you slide your Fornits time past the folks at Correlsense, Reuben. What do you suppose will happen when you finally get sued and your TTI scam is linked to your workplace?
And I still want to know if you have previously been caught by the police in the United States for fraud.
Back to where we were before TTI shill John Reuben, temporarily of Correlsense, attempted to derail this thread.
Where did Heather Forsyth come up with her addiction stages, who was making the determination that children would be sent to AARC, and why was anyone sending those determined to be the most addicted to an unlicensed religious sect employing a counselling staff of unlicensed, unregulated amateurs?
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Let me jump in here and take this part. The rest you can wait for this John guy to answer.
Where did Heather Forsyth come up with her addiction stages, who was making the determination that children would be sent to AARC, and why was anyone sending those determined to be the most addicted to an unlicensed religious sect employing a counselling staff of unlicensed, unregulated amateurs?
I think that you are closer than anyone to Heather (as far as distance goes). Not sure why you dont try to get her on the phone and ask her. That is typically what we do here in the states. But until she shows I can speak a little to the 4 Stages that she is refering to, Ajax.
They came out with a list of stages in the 1990’s which categorized the stages of addiction. If Heather were referring to these (which it appears she is) then they would be the following:
Stage One: Experimentation
Stage Two: Regular Use
Stage Three: Risky Use
Stage Four: Dependence
Stage Five: Addiction
(These were increased from 4 stages to 5 stages when they added “Risky Use”)
The kids who were in Stages I and II were going to AADAC and kids who were more severely affected with dependence and addiction Stages were sent to AARC for treatment.
It will be interesting to see how closely the Stages that Heather posts are to the ones we use in the US. It appears they had not added the “Risky Use” stage at that time.
The above info is from the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse.
I hope this helps to clear up some of the confusion.
If you do get a hold of her list you should toss it up here and we can compare to see if there is any differences with the Canadian version.
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Lazy Reuben. I've always wondered how that ridiculous turn of phrase, "speaking to" a concept or idea ever came into use. When you post your five pseudoscientific levels of substance use and falsely allege them to be four stages of addiction as quoted by Heather Forsyth, you aren't speaking to the five abstract concepts, you're trying to "speak to" the readers here. Did it appear in the seventies as new age crap replaced intellectual rigor? Who could say. So have you ever been busted for fraud before Johnny? Did you have to provide a criminal background check to Correlsense?
What kind of line did you spin to your colleagues to get them to include your TTI scam on their website? But more importantly, how pissed are they going to be at you when they find out you used them to promote your scam?
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When you post your five pseudoscientific levels of substance use and falsely allege them to be four stages of addiction as quoted by Heather Forsyth, you aren't speaking to the five abstract concepts, you're trying to "speak to" the readers here.
That post was actually mine and yes I was speaking to the readers. ( You seem to really have it bad for this Reuben &Johnny guy). I think what we can agree on is that Heather was speaking about the 4 Stages of addiction. If you speak to her directly or to her assistant you may be able to get the answer you want. If you are asking the question out here on the forum then I think I can help you out. I am not trying to answer for someone else.
This is what some mental health professionals use in the States, developed by the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse.
They came out with a list of stages in the 1990’s which categorized the stages of addiction. If Heather were referring to these (which it appears she is) then they would be the following:
Stage One: Experimentation
Stage Two: Regular Use
Stage Three: Risky Use
Stage Four: Dependence
Stage Five: Addiction
(These were increased from 4 stages to 5 stages when they added “Risky Use”)
The kids who were in Stages I and II were going to AADAC and kids who were more severely affected with dependence and addiction Stages were sent to AARC for treatment.
It will be interesting to see how closely the Stages that Heather posts are to the ones we use in the US. It appears they had not added the “Risky Use” stage at that time.
The above info is from the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse.
I hope this helps to clear up some of the confusion.
If you do get a hold of her list you should toss it up here and we can compare to see if there is any differences with the Canadian version.[/quote]
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Johnny, it's amusing to watch you flail. While AARC shipped the b-mod scam and it's freak-show phony science up here from the States, you dead-enders would do well to import a little Canuckism south. The medium is the message, Reuben. Marshall McLuhan was correct. You see Johnny, you had a thin veneer of legitimacy insofar as the entity of which Aspen is a component is diverse enough that it's not completely discredited yet. But you freaked out when I called you, again, accidentally, on destroying your kid. So you started posting in the Straight forum every time you thought I was here. Bad move Johnny. There is no argument as to the unscientific and illegal nature of Straight and it's subsequent spin-offs. Can you find a program still operating under the Straight moniker Johnny? No, you can't. How about Kids? Nope. How about Kids Helping Kids or Pathways Family Centre? No again. SAFE? Growing together? Of course not. But you couldn't control yourself, and you directly tied your Aspen scam to Straight. Not too smart. While it's unlikely that Straight's crimes will ever be accounted for, think Agent Orange for the paradigm, nobody is going to try to purposely link themselves to it. Nissley herself falsely tried to distance herself from Straight. But not you Reuben. That's the fundamental weakness in you psychopaths. You are driven, and in your primitive egocentrism, you cannot fathom that folks observe you and can see right through you. You can only manipulate those upon whom your attentions are directly focussed. Observors are not being subjected to your con, so they see it. You're a psychopath, Johnny, but a third-rate psychopath because you aren't smart enough.
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Wow, thewho really knows how to get Ajaxs' goat.
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Wow, thewho really knows how to get Ajaxs' goat.
Nah....it's just irritating as all hell that TheWho comes here shilling for his business of selling kids into abusive and ineffectual programs. That's all.
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Wow, thewho really knows how to get Ajaxs' goat.
Nah....it's just irritating as all hell that TheWho comes here shilling for his business of selling kids into abusive and ineffectual programs. That's all.
I think it is that Ajax likes to post lots of questions but doesnt like anyone to answer them, not sure why. Check out some of his other threads he does the same thing in those too.
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You're freaking out again, Reuben. Posts all over Fornits. If I were you, I'd be figuring out what to do once the big boys get wind of how you're spending your day. They are going to fire you, and they might even sue you for tying your fraudulent activities to Correlsense.
As I said before, it seems highly likely that you've had a run-in with the law in the past related to fraudulent criminal activity, Johnny. How about drugs? You seem like a guy who might have bumped a few rails in his time. I was talking to an investigating officer years ago in the case of a compulsive repeat violent offender. The detective considered the case an anomaly because in his experience chronic offenders often used drugs and this particular fellow appeared to abstain. Cocaine removes the emotional component from psychological experience. In the case of a psychopath like you Johnny, it helps dampen the effects of fear. It's easier to indulge your impulses without the impediment of fear to hold you back. So how about it Reuben? Do you have a criminal history involving fraud, and were you using marching powder to steady the nerves?
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Thewho, I wouldn’t answer him if I were you. Ajax gets even more enraged when someone answers his questions. If you keep at it Ajax is libel to burst a vein. Let this Reuben guy and Heather whats her name answer their own questions and layoff poor Ajax for awhile.
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Is that a yes then Johnny? If a person paid to have a comprehensive background check on you, is it going to turn up criminal charges or even convictions related to fraud? I know you're mad Reuben, but it would be awfully sporting of you to let us know if my hunch about you and cocaine is correct.
I'm pretty sure you've got a rap sheet. But that leads me to wonder how extensively Correlsense looked into your background, Johnny. If such an inquiry were to turn up a shady past, as I think it would, that would mean that your bosses didn't do a thorough check on you. Which in turn means that this information is going to be a surprise. And Johnnny, a lot of people don't like surprises.
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Thewho, I wouldn’t answer him if I were you. Ajax gets even more enraged when someone answers his questions. If you keep at it Ajax is libel to burst a vein. Let this Reuben guy and Heather whats her name answer their own questions and layoff poor Ajax for awhile.
Nah, I am not going to incite anyone. He will burn himself out sooner or later. This purging may actually be good for him. There are plenty of other threads until then. Maybe this Reuben guy will show up and make his day.......
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So yes to a criminal record involving fraud, Reuben, and yes to a history of cocaine use? When the boys at Correlsense do cotton on to you, will you go into work and try to doubletalk your way out of this Johnny, or will you just pull up stakes and blow town? What happens when they check into your expenses? I can't imagine you're able to exert any more self control when it comes to access to company funds than you are in any other aspect of your life. Forensic audit of everything you touched since January, Johnny?
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Thewho, I wouldn’t answer him if I were you. Ajax gets even more enraged when someone answers his questions. If you keep at it Ajax is libel to burst a vein. Let this Reuben guy and Heather whats her name answer their own questions and layoff poor Ajax for awhile.
Nah, I am not going to incite anyone. He will burn himself out sooner or later. This purging may actually be good for him. There are plenty of other threads until then. Maybe this Reuben guy will show up and make his day.......
lol, I think Ajax would shat himself and run for the hills if this guy actually showed up. This is his safety zone. He has conversations with Vause, this Heather woman and now Reuben. But none of them post here so he feels safe asking them questions knowing no one can answer. But I think if they confronted him in real life... holy moly that would be fun to watch.
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Way out of your league, Johnny. Here's a couple of fellows I have gone up against:
http://knowtheplayers.com/search.php?id=368 (http://knowtheplayers.com/search.php?id=368)
http://www.sporting-heroes.net/rugby-he ... eroID=6574 (http://www.sporting-heroes.net/rugby-heroes/displayhero.asp?HeroID=6574)
And here's you:
http://www.linkedin.com/in/johnreuben (http://www.linkedin.com/in/johnreuben)
That little bit of pointless machismo out of the way, let's get back to you and the question of whether or not a criminal background check was conducted on you prior to your hiring, and what would be the result were such a check to be conducted.
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John Reuben, of STICC, posted here under the username "TheWho" for many years and then later under the username "Whooter." But over 90% of the "anonymous" pro-program posts are also him just not logged in. You must be new here or something. :roflmao:
@Ajax - Whooter has already admitted to having been arrested for vandalism. I ran a cheapo $9.99 background check on John Reuben, and guess what? Arrested for destruction of public property and public intoxication. Whooter denying he is Reuben doesn't float anymore because he's already been definitively identified.
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Way out of your league, Johnny. Here's a couple of fellows I have gone up against:
http://knowtheplayers.com/search.php?id=368 (http://knowtheplayers.com/search.php?id=368)
http://www.sporting-heroes.net/rugby-he ... eroID=6574 (http://www.sporting-heroes.net/rugby-heroes/displayhero.asp?HeroID=6574)
And here's you:
http://www.linkedin.com/in/johnreuben (http://www.linkedin.com/in/johnreuben)
That little bit of pointless machismo out of the way, let's get back to you and the question of whether or not a criminal background check was conducted on you prior to your hiring, and what would be the result were such a check to be conducted.
lol, are they from farmville? You and DJ should get together and talk, he started flexing his muscles and wanted to punch out my lights after I exposed one of his many lies. Why is it all you little guys want to fight on the internet? Trying to compensate for something? Because you know we are 1,000's of miles apart? The same reason you ask questions but get mad when someone answers you? Your a strange dude. I hope you do finally meet up with this Reuben guy, did you ever get up the balls to call him or email him?
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If you weren't so lazy, you could read where they're from, Reuben.
So, vandalism and public intoxication according to the above poster. I'm still dubious. I think you've got some fraud in the closet, Johnny. I'm not sure about a history of cocaine use, but I do think it likely that you've got that in your background too, Johnny. Did Correlsense run an extensive background check on you when you were hired or not? If they do look at your expenses once this blows up in your face, are they going to find severe enough irregularities that you might end up in jail? Are you a card player, Johnny? You'll get lots of time for that if they put you away.
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John Reuben, of STICC, posted here under the username "TheWho" for many years and then later under the username "Whooter." But over 90% of the "anonymous" pro-program posts are also him just not logged in. You must be new here or something. :roflmao:
@Ajax - Whooter has already admitted to having been arrested for vandalism. I ran a cheapo $9.99 background check on John Reuben, and guess what? Arrested for destruction of public property and public intoxication. Whooter denying he is Reuben doesn't float anymore because he's already been definitively identified.
Notice how Whooter didn't want to talk about this. Too bad he posted that he was arrested for vandalism and then gave up his username so now he can't go back and change it. What are the chances that both Whooter and John Reuben were arrested at the same time in the same place for the same crime? Nil. Sorry, Reuben, but you've been exposed and everyone knows you and Whooter and TheWho are all one in the same. He also talks a lot about how he loves to smoke pot. I wonder if the good people at Correlsense know Whooter is toking up? I think it's time to place a call to the management there and let them know that they have a criminal and pothead working there and that he glorifies his drug use and criminality on the internet.
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Here you go:
Of course you did not find anything. As stated previously the entire thread is gone. This has happened to a lot of data in the 2 moved which have just occured. The who deleted his post claiming that he repaid his debt to society but the entire thread has been removed.
Th Anne bonney, unfortunately you are wrong. I wish that you were not. I am not the who. I genuinely recall seeing this post. it is extremely frustrating that it appears to no longer exist as it is information that any parent should be aware of when reading this bastard's posts.
Hey, I'm not saying it did or didn't happen and that is damned frustrating. He's the only one who can do that. I was just presenting a theory. I wish there was some way to retrieve it. Have you contacted Ginger or anyone else through PMs to see if there is any chance? There must at least be a Google 'cached' page?? I have no idea what I'm talking about so someone tell me if that's not possible.
Hey. Let's try this.
The Who.....have you ever been charged with lewd and lascivious behavior or child molestation or anything similar? Anything in that realm? This is your chance to state, unequivocally one way or the other what your side of the story is. Or do you not want to 'go on record' so to speak, denying it in case you're proven wrong later? I really have no fucking clue.
Hi Anne, seems I am on the hot seat:
Actually I do have a record. The last time I was arrested was in college. I was arrested several times in Boston (for various protests and acts of civil disobedience) and once in Ann Arbor Michigan (when a protest got out of hand). I was underage, skipped school and scored a plane ticket from my sisters boyfriend when my parents were in Europe and went to the campus of Univ of Michigan in Ann arbor, myself and several people were arrested for digging these huge craters on the Diag which were meant to simulate bomb holes left by the US in Vietnam, by far my best arrest (like 40 or 50 of us were arrested). Thought I was going to be sent away when my folks cut their trip short to come home to get me, anyway, that one is probably sealed because I was underaged. I will never forget they separated me from the others for some reason and I ended up in a cell with 5 other people. This one hue black guy who was obviously drunk out of his mind kept falling asleep and then falling off his bench...he would then wake up and look right at me and say something like : if you push me again white boy I will "F" you up so much even your mother will not love you..... I was so scared that after a couple of times I waited for him to fall asleep and then I took my shoes off and wedged them underneath him so he wouldnt roll off the bench again. Definitely good memories, but I have not been arrested since the age of 22.
What were you arrested for at the age of 22?
I parked my car in front of the main entrance to the cafeteria blocking the doors and started handing out flyers showing workers salaries and how the school was underpaying their cafeteria workers and not providing health benefits for only this group of workers. I lasted almost an hour, distributed 500 fliers and they did a story about it in the “Boston Phoenixâ€
Interesting how John Reuben and TheWho have the same arrest record, huh? Run a criminal background check on John D. Reuben and you'll see the same results I did. He's just upset at Ajax13 for pointing out that he is John Reuben, but it has already been pointed out and proven before.
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That's not what got his dander up. Before I knew who he was, I noticed that he was posting in the TTI forum. At that time I knew virtually nothing about Aspen, and I just thought he was a jerk, so I posted in the thread about the best ways to kill theWho. Although I knew nothing about Reuben, what I described was actually very close to the reality of his situation, and he flipped out. Since then he's attempted, in his impotent fashion, to shut down any discussion of AARC. I'm still convinced he's got a history of cocaine use, but he's being coy.
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That's not what got his dander up. Before I knew who he was, I noticed that he was posting in the TTI forum. At that time I knew virtually nothing about Aspen, and I just thought he was a jerk, so I posted in the thread about the best ways to kill theWho. Although I knew nothing about Reuben, what I described was actually very close to the reality of his situation, and he flipped out. Since then he's attempted, in his impotent fashion, to shut down any discussion of AARC. I'm still convinced he's got a history of cocaine use, but he's being coy.
He is failing miserably. We can all tell that he doesnt get to you at all,Ajax. You handled the Heather and the 4 stages great. You were able to keep your cool and get your point across very well. We could tell he was losing the argument when he started resorting to name calling and trying to switch the topic over to personal issues. It seems to be his MO. Keep up the posting we are enjoying it.
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Johnny, like I said, I don't need sock-puppets to bolster me. Did Correlsense do a criminal background check on you? If not, is a thorough search going to turn up criminal activity related to fraud? There are a number of possible scenarios that can play out: Correlsense gets wind of what you're doing here, and you're fired; STICC gets sued , Correlsense figures out you used them to promote your end of the Aspen fraud, and you're fired; STICC gets sued, Correlsense fires you and sues you for involving them in the promotion of your scam; Correlsense finds out what you're doing here, you're fired, they sue you, they look into what you've done while you were employed there, and charges are laid against you and you go to jail.
The world is your oyster, Reuben.
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When you post your five pseudoscientific levels of substance use and falsely allege them to be four stages of addiction as quoted by Heather Forsyth, you aren't speaking to the five abstract concepts, you're trying to "speak to" the readers here.
That post was actually mine and yes I was speaking to the readers. ( You seem to really have it bad for this Reuben &Johnny guy). I think what we can agree on is that Heather was speaking about the 4 Stages of addiction. If you speak to her directly or to her assistant you may be able to get the answer you want. If you are asking the question out here on the forum then I think I can help you out. I am not trying to answer for someone else.
This is what some mental health professionals use in the States, developed by the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse.
They came out with a list of stages in the 1990’s which categorized the stages of addiction. If Heather were referring to these (which it appears she is) then they would be the following:
Stage One: Experimentation
Stage Two: Regular Use
Stage Three: Risky Use
Stage Four: Dependence
Stage Five: Addiction
(These were increased from 4 stages to 5 stages when they added “Risky Use”)
The kids who were in Stages I and II were going to AADAC and kids who were more severely affected with dependence and addiction Stages were sent to AARC for treatment.
It will be interesting to see how closely the Stages that Heather posts are to the ones we use in the US. It appears they had not added the “Risky Use” stage at that time.
The above info is from the National Center on Addiction and Substance abuse.
I hope this helps to clear up some of the confusion.
If you do get a hold of her list you should toss it up here and we can compare to see if there is any differences with the Canadian version.
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Characteristics of dependence include: Repeated use of alcohol or other drugs that leads
to failure to fulfill major responsibilities related to work, family, school or other roles. Or,
repeatedly drinking or using drugs in situations that are physically hazardous, such as
driving while intoxicated or using heavy machinery when intoxicated. Or repeated legal
problems. Or any combination of these.
Many dependent people are able to work, maintain family relationships and friendships,
and limit their use of alcohol or other drugs to certain time periods, such as evenings
or weekends.
So this is the stage just prior to addiction if I am reading them correctly. Dropping out of school or failure at school would be a "red flag". These are the kids who would be attending AARC. If they were exhibiting "Risky" Behavior they would be recommended to go to AADAC for a milder form of treatment.
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Here you go:
Hi Anne, seems I am on the hot seat:
Actually I do have a record. The last time I was arrested was in college. I was arrested several times in Boston (for various protests and acts of civil disobedience) and once in Ann Arbor Michigan (when a protest got out of hand). I was underage, skipped school and scored a plane ticket from my sisters boyfriend when my parents were in Europe and went to the campus of Univ of Michigan in Ann arbor, myself and several people were arrested for digging these huge craters on the Diag which were meant to simulate bomb holes left by the US in Vietnam, by far my best arrest (like 40 or 50 of us were arrested). Thought I was going to be sent away when my folks cut their trip short to come home to get me, anyway, that one is probably sealed because I was underaged. I will never forget they separated me from the others for some reason and I ended up in a cell with 5 other people. This one hue black guy who was obviously drunk out of his mind kept falling asleep and then falling off his bench...he would then wake up and look right at me and say something like : if you push me again white boy I will "F" you up so much even your mother will not love you..... I was so scared that after a couple of times I waited for him to fall asleep and then I took my shoes off and wedged them underneath him so he wouldnt roll off the bench again. Definitely good memories, but I have not been arrested since the age of 22.
What were you arrested for at the age of 22?
I parked my car in front of the main entrance to the cafeteria blocking the doors and started handing out flyers showing workers salaries and how the school was underpaying their cafeteria workers and not providing health benefits for only this group of workers. I lasted almost an hour, distributed 500 fliers and they did a story about it in the “Boston Phoenixâ€[/quote]
Interesting how John Reuben and TheWho have the same arrest record, huh? Run a criminal background check on John D. Reuben and you'll see the same results I did. He's just upset at Ajax13 for pointing out that he is John Reuben, but it has already been pointed out and proven before.[/quote]
Yes, it has. People here need to know that Reuben, aka TheWho, is a bonafide criminal. He has a fairly extensive arrest record which means he's not trustworthy and that laws don't stand in the way of his behavior. Why trust a proven criminal's advice on what to do with your kid? Makes no sense at all. Just another example of how Aspen relies on criminals and employs them to work with kids. It's disgusting.
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Again, thanks to John D. Reuben of STICC and temporarily of Correlsense for demonstrating that many of the vocal supporters of TTI, particularly those who are benefitting financially from the illegal practises of the TTI, are desperate to quash any critical observations of the processes that result in children being placed in unregulated, unlicensed facilities like AARC. The inherent appeal of these institutions to psychopaths is amply demonstrated by the bizarre behaviour of folks like Reuben.
So, one is left to examine and question these processes. In the case of Heather Forsyth, we have an elected official from Alberta describing a completely unscientific method of assessing addiction, and alleging that it is an official policy to send the most severly addicted children in Calgary to an unlicensed, unregulated religious sect (at tax-payer's expense according to Forsyth) to a committee representing the province of Saskatchewan. How did this practise arise, who had the authority to do this, and where did Forsyth and whomever else was making these decisions arrive at any official policy involving AARC?
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The inherent appeal of these institutions to psychopaths is amply demonstrated by the bizarre behaviour of folks like Reuben.
That pretty much says it.
Parents, would you trust your children's well-being to people like John Reuben? Or how about serial child abusers like Miller Newton/Father Cassian Newton? Or one of Newton's proteges, such as AARC's "Dr" Vause? If you answered 'yes', then you are an unfit parent and complicit in child abuse.
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I parked my car in front of the main entrance to the cafeteria blocking the doors and started handing out flyers showing workers salaries and how the school was underpaying their cafeteria workers and not providing health benefits for only this group of workers. I lasted almost an hour, distributed 500 fliers and they did a story about it in the “Boston Phoenixâ€
Hey, cant be such a bad guy trying to get health benefits and higher salaries for the cafeteria workers.
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On the contrary Johnny, you're a psychopath who devotes countless hours trying to taunt people who would like to put an end to the harmful and illegal practices of the TTI. In addition to your efforts on Fornits, you operate STICC, which refers people into Aspen programs of the sort which subjected your own son to abuse and quackery before he took his own life.
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Cant believe thewho has got Ajax trolling and derailing his own thread. Hey GTFO "who" go back to the TTI forum!!!
This thread is a mess.
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I was arrested several times in Boston...
Funny, so was John Reuben. He was arrested several times in Boston as well. On the same dates TheWho was arrested. Coincidence? Hardly.
Anyway, why would any parent entrust their child's welfare to John Reuben, an admitted criminal with an extensive arrest record including public intoxication and destruction of property, who openly refers to the most abusive family of programs, Aspen Education, who had half of their programs in Oregon forcibly shut down by state investigators for murdering, abusing and neglecting children in their care, including sexualized humiliation by forcing little girls to give lap dances to and perform simulated felatio on their unlicensed, uneducated couselors?
Think about this, parents, before you make the biggest mistake of your and your kid's life.
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Characteristics of dependence include: Repeated use of alcohol or other drugs that leads
to failure to fulfill major responsibilities related to work, family, school or other roles. Or,
repeatedly drinking or using drugs in situations that are physically hazardous, such as
driving while intoxicated or using heavy machinery when intoxicated. Or repeated legal
problems. Or any combination of these.
Many dependent people are able to work, maintain family relationships and friendships,
and limit their use of alcohol or other drugs to certain time periods, such as evenings
or weekends.
So this is the stage just prior to addiction if I am reading them correctly. Dropping out of school or failure at school would be a "red flag". These are the kids who would be attending AARC. If they were exhibiting "Risky" Behavior they would be recommended to go to AADAC for a milder form of treatment.
what is AADAC? Is this the same as AARC?
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Characteristics of dependence include: Repeated use of alcohol or other drugs that leads
to failure to fulfill major responsibilities related to work, family, school or other roles. Or,
repeatedly drinking or using drugs in situations that are physically hazardous, such as
driving while intoxicated or using heavy machinery when intoxicated. Or repeated legal
problems. Or any combination of these.
Many dependent people are able to work, maintain family relationships and friendships,
and limit their use of alcohol or other drugs to certain time periods, such as evenings
or weekends.
So this is the stage just prior to addiction if I am reading them correctly. Dropping out of school or failure at school would be a "red flag". These are the kids who would be attending AARC. If they were exhibiting "Risky" Behavior they would be recommended to go to AADAC for a milder form of treatment.
what is AADAC? Is this the same as AARC?
Not the same, but another abusive facility where teens are brainwahed by child abusers.
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Not the same, but another abusive facility where teens are brainwahed by child abusers.
I guess these places are not as bad as people say. Out of the thousands who have gone through the program I dont see even one complaint against AADAC. Is there a forum for them here on fornits?
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Not the same, but another abusive facility where teens are brainwahed by child abusers.
I guess these places are not as bad as people say. Out of the thousands who have gone through the program I dont see even one complaint against AADAC. Is there a forum for them here on fornits?
There's nothing wrong with the AADAC. That comment was posted (and answered) by The Who to disingenuously promote his agenda of pro imprisonment without due process, then thought reform,
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Not the same, but another abusive facility where teens are brainwahed by child abusers.
I guess these places are not as bad as people say. Out of the thousands who have gone through the program I dont see even one complaint against AADAC. Is there a forum for them here on fornits?
There's nothing wrong with the AADAC. That comment was posted (and answered) by The Who to disingenuously promote his agenda of pro imprisonment without due process, then thought reform,
So since I caught you trying to make AADAC seem abusive you had to do some back peddling (damage controland try to blame it on thewho. There is no forum because the place isnt abusive.
Again, the reason I post here.
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Lazy ol' Reuben, just killing time until you get fired, sued and possibly jailed. AADAC isn't a place, it was an organization, that in fact no longer exists. This one is almost as funny as when you pretended to be a knowledgeable source about AARC even though you mistakenly claimed that AARC ran two separate facilities in what you thought were two different locations because you didn't know that Calgary is a city within the province of Alberta.
What I can see happening is someone taking the time to compose a well-thought out letter detailing all confirmed investigations and lawsuits against Aspen, all confirmed deaths of children in Aspen programs, as well as pertinent information such as the status of the youths in the book you kept linking to, and sending this to each one of your bosses at Correlsense. This letter would of course detail your role through STICC in promoting Aspen. From there, any enthusiastic individuals could certainly forward any alleged examples of your repugnant behaviour here, to those same folks at Correlsense. It would of course be up to those folks to determine the veracity of the claims about your involvement with Fornits, but wise folks would wait until the big boys had time to mull over Aspen and your undeniable role in providing meat for them before raising the issue of your demented behaviour here.
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what is AADAC? Is this the same as AARC?
Not the same, but another abusive facility where teens are brainwahed by child abusers.
Caught again Ajax13. You tried to insinuate AADAC was a facility to discredit Heathers 4 Stages. Nice try but you stepped in it yourself, I cant take any credit for this one..
Nice try though.
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I was arrested several times in Boston...
Funny, so was John Reuben. He was arrested several times in Boston as well. On the same dates TheWho was arrested. Coincidence? Hardly.
Anyway, why would any parent entrust their child's welfare to John Reuben, an admitted criminal with an extensive arrest record including public intoxication and destruction of property, who openly refers to the most abusive family of programs, Aspen Education, who had half of their programs in Oregon forcibly shut down by state investigators for murdering, abusing and neglecting children in their care, including sexualized humiliation by forcing little girls to give lap dances to and perform simulated felatio on their unlicensed, uneducated couselors?
Think about this, parents, before you make the biggest mistake of your and your kid's life.
Who has been caught again, Whooter? You've been exposed as a fraud. You sit up on a moral high-horse, but in reality, you're nothing more than a criminal with an extensive arrest record. Why do you try to cover up your history?
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what is AADAC? Is this the same as AARC?
Not the same, but another abusive facility where teens are brainwahed by child abusers.
Caught again Ajax13. You tried to insinuate AADAC was a facility to discredit Heathers 4 Stages. Nice try but you stepped in it yourself, I cant take any credit for this one..
Nice try though.
I just went back and looked at the original post. It was made by a guest and you changed the name to Ajax13 even though it's clear it wasn't his post. This is just another example of your fraudulent behavior.
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Thewho has everyone derailing Ajaxs thread for him, even Ajax! lol Thewho you can take the night off we can handle it from here.
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It's all about you, Johnny. If that stuff about you and young boys is for real, and it's now on my to-do list to find out if it is, it's going straight to your boss. This is an exciting race, Reuben. Which horse will win? Termination, a lawsuit, or jail for you?
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I bet on "termination." Whooter hasn't held any job for more than two years for his whole life. I wonder of that's because when he has problems at work they run his background check and find out about his extensive arrest record?
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Betting on termination isn't that risky. He's never had a job more than two years in over twenty. He dropped out of business school, too. He's never finished anythuing he has started, even raising his kids. The odds on termination should be set to 3 to 5 minimum.