Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on December 19, 2007, 03:44:25 PM
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Other than making the participants feel empowered and have some fun, what impact does a small one or two person protest make?
Are there more effective ways to get the media's attention, because I am saving up to protest but this is a one shot deal, if I can spend my money in a better way, I will.
IS it even worth it to protest? I don't have a need to 'get back at programs' because I am angry, I just want to inform parents who are the ones who don't want to hurt their kid. The parents who want to hurt their kid through ignorance or hate, well, you can't really help them.
I was thinking. There has got to be a better way to spend my time and money, both of which I have very little of, to get some people's attention, other than standing in a snow packed gutter somewhere with a sign that no one will see , maybe than a few staff taking the road into program.
It also makes me really question how passionately I am "against programs", since I just don't really care that much anymore about people I don't know which I guess happens as you get older.
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I would think that protesting does make a difference no matter how many are doing the protesting. As long as the kids that are inside the building know that you are there and that you are fighting for their rights, you will make a difference.
I also would think that if you call all of the media outlets that you can think of as well as all of the talk shows (ie: Dr. Phil, Oprah, etc...) and gain their interest, you may well make a hell of an impact if it actually goes national.
Just my $.02
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as well as all of the talk shows (ie: Dr. Phil, Oprah, etc...) and gain their interest, you may well make a hell of an impact if it actually goes national.
Just my $.02
Dr. Phil and Oprah send kids to programs.
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Has Oprah sent a kid to a program?
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as well as all of the talk shows (ie: Dr. Phil, Oprah, etc...) and gain their interest, you may well make a hell of an impact if it actually goes national.
Just my $.02
Dr. Phil and Oprah send kids to programs.
Exactly why you should contact them and let them know what it's like "on the other side". They need to hear our voices and know that we were not helped by their programs. ALSO, it would help other parents hear us as well.
Like I said, just a thought.
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As long as the kids that are inside the building know that you are there and that you are fighting for their rights, you will make a difference.
Maybe so.
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as well as all of the talk shows (ie: Dr. Phil, Oprah, etc...) and gain their interest, you may well make a hell of an impact if it actually goes national.
Just my $.02
Dr. Phil and Oprah send kids to programs.
Exactly why you should contact them and let them know what it's like "on the other side". They need to hear our voices and know that we were not helped by their programs. ALSO, it would help other parents hear us as well.
Like I said, just a thought.
I hear ya, but they just don't give a shit. Hell, there's a thread right now about Dr. Phil and Pathways
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=24516 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=24516)
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as well as all of the talk shows (ie: Dr. Phil, Oprah, etc...) and gain their interest, you may well make a hell of an impact if it actually goes national.
Just my $.02
Dr. Phil and Oprah send kids to programs.
Exactly why you should contact them and let them know what it's like "on the other side". They need to hear our voices and know that we were not helped by their programs. ALSO, it would help other parents hear us as well.
Like I said, just a thought.
I hear ya, but they just don't give a shit. Hell, there's a thread right now about Dr. Phil and Pathways
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=24516 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=24516)
Yeah, I read that, sad sack of shit that he is. Anyway, I digress...
like I said, even if they are for programs, have they actually taken the time (like Montel) to sit down and talk to people 10, 20, even 30 years after they were in the program to see how it impacted their lives, good or bad? I think that they may be interested in the protests, could be good for ratings ya know?
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Yeah see that is kind of my point, maybe it would be more beneficial use of time and money to protest Oprah or Dr Phil studios or protest in a studio audience that is a program on troubled teens?
The programs I was in had secluded windows and they would tell us constantly not to look at things they didn't want us to see and hand out severe consequence if anyone did look, and then put them on silence so they couldn't tell their friends.
Should I spend my time looking into protesting Oprah, maybe that would get more attention than a rural program ? What do you guys think, does a small protest help much or is there better things to do that get way more attention?
I promise if I choose to kill myself in my life, I will do it in a protest, like lighting myself on fire with gasoline in front of the white house or something, at least that would get attention.
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Yeah, I read that, sad sack of shit that he is. Anyway, I digress...
like I said, even if they are for programs, have they actually taken the time (like Montel) to sit down and talk to people 10, 20, even 30 years after they were in the program to see how it impacted their lives, good or bad? I think that they may be interested in the protests, could be good for ratings ya know?
I hope you're right, I really do. I just haven't seen it yet. But then again, more light is being shed on them so there's always the possibility the tide will turn.
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Yeah, I read that, sad sack of shit that he is. Anyway, I digress...
like I said, even if they are for programs, have they actually taken the time (like Montel) to sit down and talk to people 10, 20, even 30 years after they were in the program to see how it impacted their lives, good or bad? I think that they may be interested in the protests, could be good for ratings ya know?
I hope you're right, I really do. I just haven't seen it yet. But then again, more light is being shed on them so there's always the possibility the tide will turn.
When pigs fly. Their M.O. is more geared toward program thinking (to put it succinctly).
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Might want to consider hitting up the news studios. National news and the Today show, etc, have areas set up where regular people can make signs that get shown behind the hosts. Make a few signs, head up to NYC and stand behind the news studios with a website address or something.
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Now there is a great idea!
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OR maybe if enough people contact him about these programs, it may open a door. Never know....
http://http://www.drphil.com/plugger/respond/?plugID=9164
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There are a few good reasons to protest. One is to bring program abuse & abusers into the limelight. Another is to remind the prisoners that they are not forgotten. Remind the staff that they are accountable, and do not have free reign to harm others.
There's an old story about a little girl picking up starfish off the shore that have washed up in a storm. A man sees her picking them up and tossing them back in the ocean. He asks her why she's even bothering...she can't possibly make a difference...silently she picks another starfish up & tosses it into the ocean and says, "I made a difference to that one."
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Yeah see that is kind of my point, maybe it would be more beneficial use of time and money to protest Oprah or Dr Phil studios or protest in a studio audience that is a program on troubled teens?
The programs I was in had secluded windows and they would tell us constantly not to look at things they didn't want us to see and hand out severe consequence if anyone did look, and then put them on silence so they couldn't tell their friends.
Should I spend my time looking into protesting Oprah, maybe that would get more attention than a rural program ? What do you guys think, does a small protest help much or is there better things to do that get way more attention?
I promise if I choose to kill myself in my life, I will do it in a protest, like lighting myself on fire with gasoline in front of the white house or something, at least that would get attention.
That's a good point. The programs I was in were cut off from the public street. There was a huge stone wall, or else, a long driveway, from where you couldn't see the road.
If you can only do one protest and you are planning on protesting a program where the survivors can't see you, you might to do something that will get you more attention
I've actually considered chaining myself to Bloomberg, naked, or something.
In terms of going after Dr. Phillistine or Op-rat, email someone likfe Perez Hilton, who LIVES for dirt on celebrities. Oh, and, Tyranical Banks sends kids to Aspen. These people, esepcially tyranical, are those that gossip mongers like tearing up in their motor, like especially deserving chum.
Send him some emails about your protest on their facility, along with others like....page 6? is it? from the post?.....and you are asured coverage, which the mainstream propaganda machine, er, I mean media will then pick up on
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Please Please Please, if you are going to protest on behalf of these kids or on behalf of those of us who have survived the programs, Do Not Do Anything That Makes Survivors Look Stupid or Crazy!!!!! Be well informed about the program you are protesting, be well informed about the local laws regarding peaceful protests, stay within the law and carry yourself with dignity. Otherwise you are proving their point that survivors are a bunch of crazy, drugged out, uneducated oafs. I want to save kids, that is why I am in this, one bad protest will kill the influence of 10 good ones. People WANT to think we are crazy because it obsolves them of guilt.
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I think every act helps. Protest alone is not going to close this industry down nor are tight enforced regulations or going on talk shows but they all help.
But raising awareness through protest makes some parents think twice. Over time it leads to cultural change. I think of the fact that corporal punishment used to be ok here. Now it is considered to be barbaric.
Regulations potentially reduce the damage done to the kids whose parents will send them but cant create a good tbs regardless of what anyone says or does.
Doing nothing is the worst thing anyone can do
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australia is ahead of us in many ways. No capital punishment. National health care. No ss #s, (clandestine national identity cards,) life in prison allows for parole after 15 years, people who commit crimes under the age of 21 only can go to prison for a max of 20 years...the list goes on.
It's a nicer place than here
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Please Please Please, if you are going to protest on behalf of these kids or on behalf of those of us who have survived the programs, Do Not Do Anything That Makes Survivors Look Stupid or Crazy!!!!! Be well informed about the program you are protesting, be well informed about the local laws regarding peaceful protests, stay within the law and carry yourself with dignity. Otherwise you are proving their point that survivors are a bunch of crazy, drugged out, uneducated oafs. I want to save kids, that is why I am in this, one bad protest will kill the influence of 10 good ones. People WANT to think we are crazy because it obsolves them of guilt.
This is precisely why a lot of people have done nothing. No one wants to be associated with flamboyant, over-zealous, hyper-advocates that seem to be a shaved head away from their next stint in rehab.
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australia is ahead of us in many ways. No capital punishment. National health care. No ss #s, (clandestine national identity cards,) life in prison allows for parole after 15 years, people who commit crimes under the age of 21 only can go to prison for a max of 20 years...the list goes on.
It's a nicer place than here
It is funny you should mention national ID cards. The Howard Govt (who just got thrashed in a Nov fed election) wanted to introduce them as part of this hysterical war on terror. People did not like it. While what you have siad is true Oz has much to be critical of.
We IMO are actually behind you guys and waaay behind canada when it comes to indigenous affairs and it is amazing that while we are referred to as the lucky country our Aboriginal people have an appaulingly low literacy and health rate. Many remote indigenous communities suffer from the worst kind of poverty while most of us white city folk are enjoying record lows in unemployment and a general feeling of prosperity.
We have also until last week been able to match America's stubborn refusal to sign the Kyoto Protocol or acknowldge the effect that climate change has had on out primary industries. Hopefully things will change on that score going forward.
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Please Please Please, if you are going to protest on behalf of these kids or on behalf of those of us who have survived the programs, Do Not Do Anything That Makes Survivors Look Stupid or Crazy!!!!! Be well informed about the program you are protesting, be well informed about the local laws regarding peaceful protests, stay within the law and carry yourself with dignity. Otherwise you are proving their point that survivors are a bunch of crazy, drugged out, uneducated oafs. I want to save kids, that is why I am in this, one bad protest will kill the influence of 10 good ones. People WANT to think we are crazy because it obsolves them of guilt.
This is precisely why a lot of people have done nothing. No one wants to be associated with flamboyant, over-zealous, hyper-advocates that seem to be a shaved head away from their next stint in rehab.
What situations are you referring to specifically, or are you just talking OUT YOUR ASS?? :rofl:
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protests are what helped get SAFE shut down sooner than later. Just a few folks handing out flyers at their fundraisers, :rofl: :rofl: Gotta love that eh? Well, when unable to make it cross country to protest programs, I put website addys on my truck tailgate, portable posterboards for my rear window in the car, envelopes for snail mail, shipping boxes at work, things like that that people will see. Out of 75,000 commuters I pass and follow each day, I would imagine at least 5 or 6 go to the sites when they get home. Use a sign that would double as a sun screen for your car, you know, like them things you see in parking lots... There's lots of ways to protest and educate. The program folks are way more afraid of us than we are of them. You should have seen the reaction the protestors got up there in Milford OH on Nov. 30th, :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Programmies are the crazy ones, not us, :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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I wish there were some ready-made flyers for people to hand out to the D.A.R.E. people..(I'm probably not the best at making flyers, so please no one suggest that I make one myself.) :rofl: I'd like to hand out something to those people (and to anyone in the vicinity) that gives an accurate info as to just exactly what DARE does and the people (like Betty Sembler) who are affiliated with them...that would be pretty cool... hell, maybe I'll have to make one myself if no one else does.. lol.
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This is precisely why a lot of people have done nothing. No one wants to be associated with flamboyant, over-zealous, hyper-advocates that seem to be a shaved head away from their next stint in rehab.
What situations are you referring to specifically, or are you just talking OUT YOUR ASS?? :rofl:
I (couldn't find my password, so I didn't log in) was more referring to way ppl behave in the forums.
So, if I'm talking out my arse, just let me go - it's one of my many talents.
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was more referring to way ppl behave in the forums.
So, if I'm talking out my arse, just let me go - it's one of my many talents.
Can it blow trumpet blasts? That would be cool...
Smelly, but cool....
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I can't speak for everyone, and I don't know what listed reasons people have for such protests. I've never had a chance to go to one. I'm sure it's fun to spit in their faces and know there's nothing they can do about it, but that's (I hope) just a perk.
I can, however, say pretty surely, and i'm sure most survivors will agree with me here... that in the courses of all the places I was shuffled through, if i'd seen just once that there was even one person who understood and wanted to help... it might have made staying relatively sane a lot easier.
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was more referring to way ppl behave in the forums.
So, if I'm talking out my arse, just let me go - it's one of my many talents.
Can it blow trumpet blasts? That would be cool...
Smelly, but cool....
Oh sure... but my shit don't stink. :lol:
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I hope noone thought I was requesting people not to protest! Not the case at all. I just think that you need to be very organized, informed, and respectable. If people can relate to you as an intelligent human being, they are more likely to empathize and stand with you. We just have to come acrossed as reasonable and others will join the fight.
I have people who are involved in any way with the industry asking everyday what they can do to help. I have volunteers for protesting and making and handing out flyers that had never even noticed this issue until the last month or so. People are willing to side with the underdog as long as the underdog isn't a lunatic.
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I hope noone thought I was requesting people not to protest! Not the case at all. I just think that you need to be very organized, informed, and respectable. If people can relate to you as an intelligent human being, they are more likely to empathize and stand with you. We just have to come acrossed (sic) as reasonable and others will join the fight.
I'd say a sawed-off shotgun can be pretty damned reasonable under some circumstances. I don't have a problem with someone killing off programmies as a means of protest.
AND- sometimes negative attention is better than NO ATTENTION AT ALL.
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I hope noone thought I was requesting people not to protest! Not the case at all. I just think that you need to be very organized, informed, and respectable. If people can relate to you as an intelligent human being, they are more likely to empathize and stand with you. We just have to come acrossed (sic) as reasonable and others will join the fight.
I'd say a sawed-off shotgun can be pretty damned reasonable under some circumstances. I don't have a problem with someone killing off programmies as a means of protest.
AND- sometimes negative attention is better than NO ATTENTION AT ALL.
Not sure - but I think it was this kinda bullshit they were talking about. :roll:
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I'd say a sawed-off shotgun can be pretty damned reasonable under some circumstances. I don't have a problem with someone killing off programmies as a means of protest.
AND- sometimes negative attention is better than NO ATTENTION AT ALL.
Allright, Sonny, you aren't allowed to protest anywhere north of the Mason Dixon line. You'll frighten the Yankees.
When protesting in the South, do try to remain calm lest the locals shoot YOU first & ask questions later. THAT would seem pretty damn reasonable to them, I daresay.