Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Hyde Schools => Topic started by: Ursus on April 05, 2007, 08:48:19 PM
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It's getting to be that time of year again, when Hyde "takes stock," and purges all ye of insufficient character and bad attitude... Of course, this can be devastating for some, if not all, so thusly judged. I've always wondered just how Hyde picks the unfortunates, as sometimes the choice appears not to comport with reality. It would appear that there are personal reasons involved, that have nothing to do with either so-called character development or academics. I was discussing this with another member of Fornits, who has researched the Industry for years, and who posts regularly on Hidden Lake Academy. This is what that member had to add:
Same MO at HLA and others. HLA dumps kids right before graduation. It's a scam. They don't want to tarnish their 'success' stats. Many kids are there on scholarships and if they don't grad, their parents have to repay that 'gift'. Other's it's just a slap in the parents face. HLA has as much disdain for the parents as they do for the kids. Several parents are fighting legal battles to get refunds. Talked to many over the years in the same position.
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Here's an interesting tidbit of information re. Hyde DC's 100% college acceptance rate:
...and as for the hyde d.c. school, seniors can't graduate there until they are accepted into a college. that might change, but they have a 100% acceptance rate, obviously due to that criteria for graduation.
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=21096&start=5 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=21096&start=5)
Is this even legal? And what happens to the student who wants to defer college for a few years?
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when we met with studetns and faculty last week, the students didn't like that. they are thinking about changing it. they can differ, but they have to apply. a lot of kids there are so convinced they can't get into college, so they have to go through that college process. same at the boarding schools .i don't approve that they shoudl HAVE to get accepted. that's kind of out of their control. i ho;pe they change it, cuz it's not fair and is a lot of pressure on those kids.
- bill procida '07
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Well, this is some cheesy fucking way to artificially boost your numbers! Think a REAL school would have to resort to such underhanded tactics?
I think it is pretty borderline illegal at the very best!
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If a student makes it known, purposefully or inadvertently, that they wish to pursue goals other than college immediately upon graduating, does this set them up to join the ranks of those purged in the weeks prior?
How about some statistics, Hyde!? I have never known a place to be less competent about supplying statistics. Most schools would have such information at the drop of a hat. Perhaps Hyde realizes that their numbers compare less than favorably, and deliberately obfuscates such information!
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If a student makes it known, purposefully or inadvertently, that they wish to pursue goals other than college immediately upon graduating, does this set them up to join the ranks of those purged in the weeks prior?
How about some statistics, Hyde!? I have never known a place to be less competent about supplying statistics. Most schools would have such information at the drop of a hat. Perhaps Hyde realizes that their numbers compare less than favorably, and deliberately obfuscates such information!
Why would "college" equal "character" College does not equal success or character, so what is actually being accomplished at Hyde DC? Isn't this simply pressure on the kids which is something Joey G was always against? Talk about hypocritical!!!
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If a student makes it known, purposefully or inadvertently, that they wish to pursue goals other than college immediately upon graduating, does this set them up to join the ranks of those purged in the weeks prior?
How about some statistics, Hyde!? I have never known a place to be less competent about supplying statistics. Most schools would have such information at the drop of a hat. Perhaps Hyde realizes that their numbers compare less than favorably, and deliberately obfuscates such information!
Why would "college" equal "character" College does not equal success or character, so what is actually being accomplished at Hyde DC? Isn't this simply pressure on the kids which is something Joey G was always against? Talk about hypocritical!!!
Why would "college" equal "character?" Good point! This is clearly a move to seduce parents, i.e., source of mo money!
The best things in life are free,
But you can keep it to the birds and bees;
I want money,
That's what i want,
That's what i want, yeah,
That's what i want.
Money don't get ev'rything it's true,
What it don't get i can't use;
Now give me money,
That's what i want,
That's what i want, yeah,
That's what i want.
Ow!
from: http://www.lyricsfreak.com/y/yoko+ono/m ... 95972.html (http://www.lyricsfreak.com/y/yoko+ono/money_10195972.html)
Recorded live at the varsity stadium, toronto, 13 september 1969
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Does anyone know the size of this year's graduating classes in Maine and Conn.? How do they compare with recent years in terms of people staying at Hyde and graduating?
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Does anyone know the size of this year's graduating classes in Maine and Conn.? How do they compare with recent years in terms of people staying at Hyde and graduating?
Let's also hear about those stats as percentage of starting players, eh? I'm guessing 30-40%? Anyone care to take me on? :lol:
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I honestly dount it will be 30-40%. Although i am one of those people who started the year and did not finish. My mother is now out 40,000. They also refused to give me money/clothing/cellphone back to me unless i removed what i wrote about hyde on this website. All i did was say the dean is a dick its not like i broke the lying ethic i mean hey come on I TOLD THE TRUTH!
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I honestly dount it will be 30-40%. Although i am one of those people who started the year and did not finish. My mother is now out 40,000. They also refused to give me money/clothing/cellphone back to me unless i removed what i wrote about hyde on this website. All i did was say the dean is a dick its not like i broke the lying ethic i mean hey come on I TOLD THE TRUTH!
Tell me, friend, how would they even know?! They claim they never even look at our drivel! :rofl: And, although we assuredly know to the contrary, how would they then surmise that it was you? How, indeed, even if knowing that it was you, could they prove it?
Seems to me you have a potential lawsuit re. your belongings being held hostage to your compliance with their wishes. Your belongings should not enter into the issue of whatever beef they have with you at all! This totally sucks!
Which dean?
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They must have a log of all web traffic off and on campus. They matched the sending ip address to the poster and matched the http request to this web site at it's former IP address, then matched the time of the post to time in the log. Voila mon' ami. There is no privacy
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They must have a log of all web traffic off and on campus. They matched the sending ip address to the poster and matched the http request to this web site at it's former IP address, then matched the time of the post to time in the log. Voila mon' ami. There is no privacy
We don't know from where the "dean is a dick" posting was sent. Could have been sent from an internet cafe' while on vacation? Or, from home? Was this before or after student's exit from the shitpit? Plus, would they still have been able to trace it if guest used an anonymizing proxy to access fornits?
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They must have a log of all web traffic off and on campus. They matched the sending ip address to the poster and matched the http request to this web site at it's former IP address, then matched the time of the post to time in the log. Voila mon' ami. There is no privacy
We don't know from where the "dean is a dick" posting was sent. Could have been sent from an internet cafe' while on vacation? Or, from home? Was this before or after student's exit from the shitpit? Plus, would they still have been able to trace it if guest used an anonymizing proxy to access fornits?
I was assuming it was from campus. The other possibility is human engineering. The prose style was recognized and a game was played. I am thinking of a game like "we know you did it so tell us or else it will be worse for you." If it was the post I am thinking of, there was some piquant language.
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They must have a log of all web traffic off and on campus. They matched the sending ip address to the poster and matched the http request to this web site at it's former IP address, then matched the time of the post to time in the log. Voila mon' ami. There is no privacy
We don't know from where the "dean is a dick" posting was sent. Could have been sent from an internet cafe' while on vacation? Or, from home? Was this before or after student's exit from the shitpit? Plus, would they still have been able to trace it if guest used an anonymizing proxy to access fornits?
I was assuming it was from campus. The other possibility is human engineering. The prose style was recognized and a game was played. I am thinking of a game like "we know you did it so tell us or else it will be worse for you." If it was the post I am thinking of, there was some piquant language.
That does sound so very much like Hyde! Or there could have been some particularly odious Brother's Keeper elements re. roommates or friends, etc. Would the original "dean is a dick" Guest poster care to chime in and set us all straight re. said speculation?
And my curiosity is roused... which post was it?
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I honestly dount it will be 30-40%. Although i am one of those people who started the year and did not finish. My mother is now out 40,000. They also refused to give me money/clothing/cellphone back to me unless i removed what i wrote about hyde on this website. All i did was say the dean is a dick its not like i broke the lying ethic i mean hey come on I TOLD THE TRUTH!
Can you tell us exactly what happened when Hyde found out that you posted on this website? Who talked to you about it? What did they say? Who told you that you had to remove what you posted?
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PRNewswire LINK (http://http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/stories.pl?ACCT=104&STORY=/www/story/06-15-2007/0004609056&EDATE=)
http://www.hydedc.org[/url].
About HYDE Leadership Public Charter School
Founded in 1999, HYDE Leadership Public Charter School offers a quality
private school education at a public school price (tuition-free) to
students throughout the District of Columbia. The school serves Pre-K (ages
3 and 4) through grade 12 and is located at 101 T St., NE, Washington, DC.
It is affiliated with the HYDE Boarding School in Bath, Maine, which
pioneered character-driven education more than 40 years ago. The HYDE
program combines character education and family renewal with an
extended-day and year-round academic program, complemented by performing
arts, athletics and community service curricula. Admission is on a
first-come, first-served basis. For additional information, please visit
http://www.hydedc.org (http://www.hydedc.org) or call the school at (202) 529-4400.
===================================
HYDE
JACQUELINE L. FRIERSON, Ed. D, HEAD OF SCHOOL
HYDE LEADERSHIP PUBLIC CHARTER SCHOOL
The following colleges and universities offered acceptance to one or more members of the 2007 graduating class of HYDE Leadership Public Charter School:
Alaska Pacific Univ.; American Univ.; Auburn Univ.; Barton College; Bethune Cookman College; Bowie State Univ., Carson Newman College; Central Pennsylvania College; College of Eastern Utah; College of St. Elizabeth; The College of New Rochelle; Columbia Union College; Davis & Elkins College; Delaware State University; Florida A&M Univ.; Furman Univ.; Iona College; Jacksonville Univ.; Kansas State Univ.; Langston Univ.; LeMoyne College; Lincoln Univ.; Lock Haven Univ.; Lynchburg College; Mansfield Univ., Middle Georgia College; Montgomery College; Morris Brown; Norfolk State Univ.; North Carolina State Univ.; Penn State Univ.; Saint Augustine Univ.; Slippery Rock Univ.; Snow College; Temple Univ.; Trinity Washington Univ., Tuskegee Univ., Univ. of Connecticut; Univ. of the District of Columbia; Univ. of Maine; Univ. of Maryland Eastern Shore; Univ. of Maryland College Park; Univ. of Michigan Flint; Univ. of South Carolina Aiken; Univ. of Vermont; Ursinus College; Virginia Commonwealth Univ.; Virginia State Univ.; Virginia Tech Univ.; Virginia Union Univ.; and, West Virginia Weslyan.
101 T STREET NE WASHINGTON, DC 20002 TEL: 202-529-4400 FAX: 202-529-4500
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WASHINGTON, June 15 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- On Saturday, June 16,
2007, HYDE Leadership Public Charter School in Washington, DC (HYDE-DC)
will celebrate the graduation of the Class of 2007, of which every senior
has been accepted and plans to attend a four-year college or university.
____________________________________________________________
This is a lie just like all the lies at the boarding school re the stats. Why don't YOU "bet on the truth" Hyde? I went to Hyde and there is no way that 98% of the students landed in college. First of all, many in my graduating class never graduated. Hyde did their typical purging of the senior population towards the end of the school year. The sucker parents had to either keep us at Hyde one more year at $40,000 or Johnny gets shipped home and ends up with a GED because Hyde's accredidation is not accepted by many public schools.
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It is a self fulfilling definition to graduate you must be accepted bya four year college. Job done. 100% of our graduating class is accepted because you must be accepted to graduate.
When I was there they washed kid out that were accepted to good four year colleges. Why? Enrollment management. That was the year that they changed the definition of high school into a five year ordeal:
Freshman
Sophomore
Junior
Senior prep
Senior
Even some of the kids that made the cut into the senior class did not graduate. Thanks to Al Gore for inventing the internet. We who were screwed by this system can now reach out through the ages via cyber space and bite back.
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Thanks to Al Gore for inventing the Internet.
Ed Legg, if he had only lived up to his unique potential, had all the makings of an Al Gore.
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WASHINGTON, June 15 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- On Saturday, June 16, 2007, HYDE Leadership Public Charter School in Washington, DC (HYDE-DC) will celebrate the graduation of the Class of 2007, of which every senior has been accepted and plans to attend a four-year college or university.
This is a lie just like all the lies at the boarding school re the stats. Why don't YOU "bet on the truth" Hyde? I went to Hyde and there is no way that 98% of the students landed in college. First of all, many in my graduating class never graduated. Hyde did their typical purging of the senior population towards the end of the school year. The sucker parents had to either keep us at Hyde one more year at $40,000 or Johnny gets shipped home and ends up with a GED because Hyde's accredidation is not accepted by many public schools.
The inner quote describes Hyde-DC, the public charter school, so this may not be a fair comparison. From what I've been told, a prerequisite for graduation from the charter school is acceptance into some college. Which means that if you don't succeed in getting in, you don't graduate, and don't screw up their precious statistics. And if you don't graduate, what do you do? You're stuck trying to get your GED, which looks potentially worse on your transcript than graduation from any high school.
I imagine there is a hell of a lot more "prep work" on the part of Hyde with readying students at the charter school for getting into college. And that work probably entails making students apply to places like the Univ. of the District of Columbia, whether they like it or not. UDC has open enrollment, meaning anyone can go; just as long as you graduated from high school or have a GED. That is one of the primary reasons for its existence in the first place.
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=10760&start=16 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=10760&start=16)
University of the District of Columbia
Admissions Information:
The University of the District of Columbia exercises an open
admissions policy. Proof of high school graduation or satisfactory
completion of the General Educational Development (GED) test
is required for admission.
Scholastic Aptitude Test (SAT): While the SAT is not required
for admission to the University, it is strongly recommended that
all undergraduates applicants for admission take the test.
Achieving a 100% college acceptance for graduating seniors
when the criteria for acceptance is being a graduating senior
may help explain the remarkable results of the Hyde experience.
Note also that Hyde Leadership Public Charter School stats do NOT differ from the other public charter schools in DC!
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=10760&start=18 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=10760&start=18)
State of the District of Columbia Charter School Sector: 2006 - A Ten Year Review
"According to the PCSB (D.C. Public Charter School Board) four high schools had a
100% college-acceptance rate, two had a rate of 98-99% . . . overall college
acceptance rate is 88.5%" pg 31
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Thanks to Al Gore for inventing the Internet.
Ed Legg, if he had only lived up to his unique potential, had all the makings of an Al Gore.
Hey,
What kinda trash you talkin'? Sure ol' Al invented the internet and got the Oscar and the Noble Peace prize, but does he have fish named after his wife? Has he ever started a bus from Saco and Bidderford to bring kids to a fine fine school like ... damn whats the name of that school I work fer?
Hug
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Thanks to Al Gore for inventing the Internet.
Ed Legg, if he had only lived up to his unique potential, had all the makings of an Al Gore.
Hey,
What kinda trash you talkin'? Sure ol' Al invented the internet and got the Oscar and the Noble Peace prize, but does he have fish named after his wife? Has he ever started a bus from Saco and Bidderford to bring kids to a fine fine school like ... damn whats the name of that school I work fer?
Hug
Oh, yeah, almost forgot. Ann of the flying bazoombas.
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This is a lie just like all the lies at the boarding school re the stats. Why don't YOU "bet on the truth" Hyde? I went to Hyde and there is no way that 98% of the students landed in college. First of all, many in my graduating class never graduated. Hyde did their typical purging of the senior population towards the end of the school year. The sucker parents had to either keep us at Hyde one more year at $40,000 or Johnny gets shipped home and ends up with a GED because Hyde's accredidation is not accepted by many public schools.
Now... as far as the boarding school stats go, this makes my blood boil. 'Cuz they've been pulling this bullshit for over 35 fucking years. When they started doing this crap, you tucked your tail between your legs and slunk off in the shadows in shame. You were ostracized from the community and you had no one to compared notes with. Because they made it absolutely and utterly clear that you were one of the very very very few that "failed" to complete your mission, due to your inherently deficient and flawed character.
Of course, THIS WAS COMPLETELY FALSE, but how were we to know back then? Thanks to the Internet, people are now comparing notes. People are realizing just how phony and full of shit those lying gutterdogs really are.
We who were screwed by this system can now reach out through the ages via cyber space and bite back.
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inherently deficient and flawed character.
Joe was the one that made me do it. There were some fine kids where, we knew that mom and dad had pretty deep pockets they deserved to get grad gee ate ted but ol' Joe said "get the money" and we tried to hold 'em back. Now to the credit of many yall that we tried to do that to, you said "screw that" and booked. I always liked that word usage "booked" Do youngins still use that? Any way that why I wrote recommendations for some of you. You guys know I did not care about the money. Hell I almost ran the school bankrupt before old Joe run me out. Please don't hate me. I was young and under the influence of Joe.
Hugs[/code]
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Now... as far as the boarding school stats go, this makes my blood boil. 'Cuz they've been pulling this bullshit for over 35 fucking years. When they started doing this crap, you tucked your tail between your legs and slunk off in the shadows in shame. You were ostracized from the community and you had no one to compared notes with. Because they made it absolutely and utterly clear that you were one of the very very very few that "failed" to complete your mission, due to your inherently deficient and flawed character.
Of course, THIS WAS COMPLETELY FALSE, but how were we to know back then? Thanks to the Internet, people are now comparing notes. People are realizing just how phony and full of shit those lying gutterdogs really are.
I don't understand your post at all.
1) Were you refused the coveted Hyde character diploma?
2) Were you additionally refused the standard high school diploma necessary for college matriculation?
3) Were you refused the opportunity of returning for a fifth year, to earn these?
4) Were you sent home before graduation day?
5) Was it necessary to make up your senior year at another school?
6) Did this happen to other seniors?
7) How many others do you know of?
8) How did you find out about them?
These are purely informative questions. I was completely unaware of such goings-on.
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4) Were you sent home before graduation day?
I know I did that to at least one girl I am trin' to remember her name. She was a pretty girl and she could run like a rabbit. I figured with mom and dad comin' up for the weekend I could get them to wait a year and cough up another 7k. No dice on that one. That girl had spunk. It is amazing how many of those kids that stuff worked on.
Hugs
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4) Were you sent home before graduation day?
I know I did that to at least one girl I am trin' to remember her name. She was a pretty girl and she could run like a rabbit. I figured with mom and dad comin' up for the weekend I could get them to wait a year and cough up another 7k. No dice on that one. That girl had spunk. It is amazing how many of those kids that stuff worked on.
Hugs
Let's be clear. Are you saying she had to choose between returning for a fifth year and being expelled?
Are you saying many kids faced this choice?
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Now... as far as the boarding school stats go, this makes my blood boil. 'Cuz they've been pulling this bullshit for over 35 fucking years. When they started doing this crap, you tucked your tail between your legs and slunk off in the shadows in shame. You were ostracized from the community and you had no one to compared notes with. Because they made it absolutely and utterly clear that you were one of the very very very few that "failed" to complete your mission, due to your inherently deficient and flawed character.
Of course, THIS WAS COMPLETELY FALSE, but how were we to know back then? Thanks to the Internet, people are now comparing notes. People are realizing just how phony and full of shit those lying gutterdogs really are.
I don't understand your post at all.
1) Were you refused the coveted Hyde character diploma?
2) Were you additionally refused the standard high school diploma necessary for college matriculation?
3) Were you refused the opportunity of returning for a fifth year, to earn these?
4) Were you sent home before graduation day?
5) Was it necessary to make up your senior year at another school?
6) Did this happen to other seniors?
7) How many others do you know of?
8) How did you find out about them?
These are purely informative questions. I was completely unaware of such goings-on.
Hyde has a very long and established history of "purging" undesirables from their midst, usually 1-3 times per year, and yes, I was a casualty of one of those. There was a list made up by the headmaster, I was told it contained roughly 60-70 names (all grades); I would imagine that not all exited though. It was not necessary for me to make up lost classes at another school, as I was already in my "extra year" (I had returned in the hopes of that elusive Diploma, denied me the previous year).
I would venture that a substantial number of students, actually the majority, have to choose between coming back for an extra year or not receiving a Hyde Diploma.
Hyde does not offer a "standard high school diploma;" in lieu of a Hyde Diploma, you can earn a "certificate." And nope, I didn't get that either.
I prepped myself and retook my SATs (Hyde at that time did not in the least bit prepare you for these, perhaps they still don't) and scored in the top 0.5 or 0.1 percentiles for both Verbal and Math. However, Hyde would not release my transcripts, despite being given ample notice and follow up phone calls and letters, for at least half a year. At the time, I thought it was just me, but other people have noted just this kind of behavior elsewhere on this forum several times, in several different threads, so apparently this is standard fare from them.
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The facts as I know them are that this young woman was told not to appear at the baccalaureate if she did not accept a fifth year. How many case like that do you need? I think it was Mike that said Hyde lacked rigorous intellectual coherence. That is absolutely the truth. When there are no real standards, nothing you can quantify, you can just pull excuses out of your ass to meet enrollment management goals. You go back and look at the kids that were asked back from that graduation class for a fifth year and tell me how many were on scholarship? It was about the money. Get some character and suck it up. The process was venal. It was about money. I know that hurts your feelings. "Hyde fosters psychological dependence."
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Funny, we have very different memories: I don't recall the periodic "lists," "purges," and dishonorable discharges. Sabina left early, but for altogether different reasons. What I remember is a vote among seniors and faculty on whether each of us would be graduating with a diploma or with a certificate and the option of coming back for another try at the diploma. It is with great pride that I am able to say that I received an overwhelming vote of no confidence. I took the certificate, which sufficed for college matriculation, and booked. I knew intuitively that Hyde was all wrong, just as I know it intellectually now.
Gentlemen, I doubt I've anything more of substance to add. I've sorted Hyde out to my own satisfaction, and my Dylanesque flight the other day was the death blow, as far as I'm concerned. I've written in anger, and now I write in tranquillity. Emil, I plan one day to ask you to sneak into Hyde with me, assuming our status as personae non gratae is by now assured, and then go pay a visit to Ed. If you need time off from being a rural gentleman, you are most welcome to visit me in this crazy Holy City of mine.
Shalom.
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I was told there was a list. I did not actually see this list myself. Perhaps I was told this by someone on the faculty who wished to intimidate me. Perhaps there were actually far fewer people involved and I was lied to. Certainly this would not be a first for Hyde. It seems to be their preferred modus operandi.
There were however, many purges at Hyde overall, usually comprising of far fewer people than that particular time. I did not even come up with that term. Someone else on the forum here used it. And they often occurred not long before graduation. Whoever posted that first post today was right on the money.
And there were other times when there were many many students under "question." Joe himself actually details one of these times in which, according to him, "of the 117 students at Hyde, 102 were at least indirectly involved." These were offenses against Hyde's "no smoking, drinking, or drugs" rules. I am guessing that the "indirect involvement" could be construed to mean that you knew someone who did one of these venal acts, but were not guilty of it yourself. This was back in 1970, and it happened sometime after Spring Break but at least a month before the end of the school year.
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One more thing, Mike: You were not one of the kids who "left early." How would you know what their circumstances were and what they or their parents were told? What happened to those kids and what the school actually told us about their leaving were, more often than not, stories barely recognizable as describing the same events.
The "official word" from Hyde was always whatever made Hyde look the best, whether or not it was the truth was but accidental in some cases. The Hyde spin was always just another opportunity for more propaganda. "See what will happen to you if you don't suck it up... So and so has chosen the easy way out and is not dealing with his/her issues with courage and integrity." Which would always be followed by the usual "If you can't make it at Hyde, you can't make it anywhere."
How many times have you come across something in your life that Hyde taught you to interpret a certain way, and the reality differs egregiously? And it's not even in the same ballpark. Think about it.
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I know of two kid that were asked to leave in '77. Both kid were asked to leave by Henry Milton. This is according to their own word.
In Hyde's defense I would have to say they were correct in not offering me a diploma. With that said, at the end of the experience I was no where I needed to be. The ink blot test of how much that was me not being willing to change and how much of that was Hyde's inept formulaic approach to every kid I will not take. (Honestly it looks like a woman with a bong with really large breasts but I would rather not say that.)
Mike,
The kids are out of the house .... mostly , we have a guest suite and you are welcome. I have house rules: no drinking, no drugs ( a rule which my kids discreetly violate) and you can only smoke hand rolled cigars on the porch if you brink enough to share.
I would love to go to Israel some time but I am afraid I will be dead before I pay off my kids college loans.
Peace back at you man
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I think a lot gets made out of that process being a vote. The thing you have to ask your self: how hard is that to fix? How hard do you think it was for Joe and Ed to dial the number of graduates? A few special talks. A straw list. These guys are/were masters with adults. They were manipulating brain washed kids.
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What were some of the "official reasons" given for students leaving? Not just graduation, but earlier in the school year as well?
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What were some of the "official reasons" given for students leaving? Not just graduation, but earlier in the school year as well?
One was a guy named Randy. He was officially a run away. He was a Mainah. I ran into him he told me a story about not wanting to go to college and refusing to sign up for the military. I guess at that point in 77 you had to go into the military or college. Henry told him he had to do one of the three: sign up, get excepted to a college or leave. This was close to grduation. The other was a guy named Peter. this is the peter you probably think of when you think of a guy name Peter at hyde in 77. The story was a little different. I would have to say that I am pretty sure he was high at the time. He asked me if I wanted to snort some crushed percocets. I declined his gracious offer. The bottom line was the same: Henry told him to get his ass out of Dodge. So it is believable that people were asked to go. They were kids that in the current hyde parlance were "offtrack" so it would look like they were running away. I have also been in contact with a guy that was gone before I got to Hyde named Walter who spun a similar tale. I found his story to be believable.
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It was the talk about plagiarisms.
I will explain. I was in Springfield the day after a dead concert. I was hitchhiking with my girl friend. It was an election year. Silvio Conte was running for re election. This was '80 I think. So I saw this Silvio sign and started singing:
"Silvio, silver and gold." over and over. It got on my girl friend nerve. she said "Silvio what!"
I sang: "Silvio, Silver and gold won't by back the beat of a heart grown cold. " I eventually worked out the rest of the chorus that is in the Hunter/Dylan version and a couple of the verses. The Hunter Dylan version has added verses that I did not write. The one I did write that they used verbatum it:
One of these days and it won't be long I going down to the valley and sing my song,
I gonna sing out loud
I gonna sing out strong
Let the echo decide if I was right or wrong.
I used to sing it around harvard square.
I had a couple of other odds and ends borrowed from me. I remember have some guy ask me if he could use my stuff. I quoted the woodie Guthrie copy write.
It was just really a shock when after I left that life behind and was straight and had two kids to hear it on the radio sung by Bob Dylan backed by the GD. It was a rush.
So the notion of Paul stealing from Malcolm ... please.
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It was the talk about plagiarisms.
I will explain. I was in Springfield the day after a dead concert. I was hitchhiking with my girl friend. It was an election year. Silvio Conte was running for re election. This was '80 I think. So I saw this Silvio sign and started singing:
"Silvio, silver and gold." over and over. It got on my girl friend nerve. she said "Silvio what!"
I sang: "Silvio, Silver and gold won't by back the beat of a heart grown cold. " I eventually worked out the rest of the chorus that is in the Hunter/Dylan version and a couple of the verses. The Hunter Dylan version has added verses that I did not write. The one I did write that they used verbatum it:
One of these days and it won't be long I going down to the valley and sing my song,
I gonna sing out loud
I gonna sing out strong
Let the echo decide if I was right or wrong.
I used to sing it around harvard square.
I had a couple of other odds and ends borrowed from me. I remember have some guy ask me if he could use my stuff. I quoted the woodie Guthrie copy write.
It was just really a shock when after I left that life behind and was straight and had two kids to hear it on the radio sung by Bob Dylan backed by the GD. It was a rush.
So the notion of Paul stealing from Malcolm ... please.
In case this post makes absolutely no sense to anyone, I do believe "Guest" meant to insert it in the thread he was active in yesterday, namely here:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=23309&start=151 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=23309&start=151)
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What were some of the "official reasons" given for students leaving? Not just graduation, but earlier in the school year as well?
One was a guy named Randy. He was officially a run away. He was a Mainah. I ran into him he told me a story about not wanting to go to college and refusing to sign up for the military. I guess at that point in 77 you had to go into the military or college. Henry told him he had to do one of the three: sign up, get excepted to a college or leave. This was close to grduation. The other was a guy named Peter. this is the peter you probably think of when you think of a guy name Peter at hyde in 77. The story was a little different. I would have to say that I am pretty sure he was high at the time. He asked me if I wanted to snort some crushed percocets. I declined his gracious offer. The bottom line was the same: Henry told him to get his ass out of Dodge. So it is believable that people were asked to go. They were kids that in the current hyde parlance were "offtrack" so it would look like they were running away. I have also been in contact with a guy that was gone before I got to Hyde named Walter who spun a similar tale. I found his story to be believable.
If you are talking about Peter T, he absolutely hated Hyde and was pretty cynical about any adult hypocrisy, but was basically a decent kid. I also have to wonder about Henry's interest in him.
Somehow I cannot picture Peter M with the crushed percocets and he may have been there earlier; Peter M also had a sister who went, Heidi. Never heard what happened to either one of them, they were kind of quiet and kept to themselves. Maybe they even graduated and I just don't remember! lol
Did Walter usually go by a different name? Never heard what actually happened to him, if we're talking about the same person. I thought he took the credits accrued and just never came back.
I remember a girl named Donna A, who I had always assumed was one of Hyde's darlings since she was pretty gung-ho about Hyde and Sumner really liked her (she played Blanche in the school play A Streetcar Named Desire, amongst other leads in other plays), but one day she disappeared and the official word was she "ran away." Not long afterwards, I ran into her on the road between the New Dorms and the Outhouse; tears were streaming down her face as she had just talked to some faculty member about her returning/staying. She said that she couldn't talk to me about it. I had always assumed that she really wanted to be there. But it seemed as if there were some "difficulties." And then she was gone.
Yeah, I do remember a lot of people officially designated as "runaways" and ones who never came back from a period of time at home, be that the end of the year or mid-term such as Christmas or Spring Break, etc. It was always portrayed as "their decision," like they made that choice on their own sans Hyde's stipulations. But this is what Hyde told us. I don't remember many of these kids telling me themselves what the reason was, at least not while they were there.
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I think a lot gets made out of that process being a vote. The thing you have to ask your self: how hard is that to fix? How hard do you think it was for Joe and Ed to dial the number of graduates? A few special talks. A straw list. These guys are/were masters with adults. They were manipulating brain washed kids.
The vote was rigged in two ways I noticed at the time of voting. First, Joe or Ed commented on each kid. I can't remember anymore whether these comments preceded or followed the vote. In the former case, it would have vitiated the vote. In the latter case, there may have been other cues to vote one way or the other. Second, it was a public vote; a secret ballot would have made it harder for us to base our vote on how others and in particular the leadership were voting. In short, a dictatorial vote, with a bogus appearance of democracy.
Courage, integrity, leadership, curiosity, and concern!
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I think a lot gets made out of that process being a vote. The thing you have to ask your self: how hard is that to fix? How hard do you think it was for Joe and Ed to dial the number of graduates? A few special talks. A straw list. These guys are/were masters with adults. They were manipulating brain washed kids.
The vote was rigged in two ways I noticed at the time of voting. First, Joe or Ed commented on each kid. I can't remember anymore whether these comments preceded or followed the vote. In the former case, it would have vitiated the vote. In the latter case, there may have been other cues to vote one way or the other. Second, it was a public vote; a secret ballot would have made it harder for us to base our vote on how others and in particular the leadership were voting. In short, a dictatorial vote, with a bogus appearance of democracy.
Courage, integrity, leadership, curiosity, and concern!
To elaborate on the second point, there was common knowledge. That is, I know that Joe votes against Sally. Joe knows that I know that Joe votes against Sally. I know that Joe knows that I know that Joe knows that Joe votes against Sally. Joe knows that I know that, and so on ad infinitum. Joe votes on me next. I better vote against Sally too.
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I think a lot gets made out of that process being a vote. The thing you have to ask your self: how hard is that to fix? How hard do you think it was for Joe and Ed to dial the number of graduates? A few special talks. A straw list. These guys are/were masters with adults. They were manipulating brain washed kids.
The vote was rigged in two ways I noticed at the time of voting. First, Joe or Ed commented on each kid. I can't remember anymore whether these comments preceded or followed the vote. In the former case, it would have vitiated the vote. In the latter case, there may have been other cues to vote one way or the other. Second, it was a public vote; a secret ballot would have made it harder for us to base our vote on how others and in particular the leadership were voting. In short, a dictatorial vote, with a bogus appearance of democracy.
Courage, integrity, leadership, curiosity, and concern!
To elaborate on the second point, there was common knowledge. That is, I know that Joe votes against Sally. Joe knows that I know that Joe votes against Sally. I know that Joe knows that I know that Joe knows that Joe votes against Sally. Joe knows that I know that, and so on ad infinitum. Joe votes on me next. I better vote against Sally too.
Common knowledge and a credible threat of punishment for deviation. Conformity guaranteed. The same setup was applied to all aspects of Hyde life.
Courage, integrity, leadership, curiosity, concern!
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You guys are talking in small numbers about Hyde not graduating us. This is from long ago. Now the numbers are very large.
Hyde now gets rid of lots of kids during the school year for many bogus reasons. Parents not participating, kids not bowing down, yada yada. Then of course towards the end of the year Hyde goes over in their minds how many of the sucker parents would pay another $40,000 to get their kid a diploma. They make up the usual, "joe blow has not lived up to the character part of the program." They have ruined many a family and many a kid by this.
Hyde's leaders can pull the wool over our parents for the rest of their lives, but I take great enjoyment out of knowing that the majority of Hydes leaders are nothing but loosers themselves. Doesn't matter how many years they are there, they are still talkin bout the same shit that happened in their lives 30 years ago. LOOSERS!!!
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You guys are talking in small numbers about Hyde not graduating us. This is from long ago. Now the numbers are very large.
Hyde now gets rid of lots of kids during the school year for many bogus reasons. Parents not participating, kids not bowing down, yada yada. Then of course towards the end of the year Hyde goes over in their minds how many of the sucker parents would pay another $40,000 to get their kid a diploma. They make up the usual, "joe blow has not lived up to the character part of the program." They have ruined many a family and many a kid by this.
Hyde's leaders can pull the wool over our parents for the rest of their lives, but I take great enjoyment out of knowing that the majority of Hydes leaders are nothing but loosers themselves. Doesn't matter how many years they are there, they are still talkin bout the same shit that happened in their lives 30 years ago. LOOSERS!!!
Hey, I suppose you think I'm a loser (note the spelling) for talking about what happened to me thirty years ago. Well, until I discovered this site a few months ago and got started on the topic of Hyde I was living in the present tense, and I still am. I've got a respectable life to show for it too. But talking about Hyde has been educational. It's larger than Hyde: I would even elevate Hyde to a metaphor of life.
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Yes, but you are not at Hyde, (I assume) teaching character and making life decisions for kids!
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Yes, but you are not at Hyde, (I assume) teaching character and making life decisions for kids!
I said I had a respectable life to show for it.
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What were some of the "official reasons" given for students leaving? Not just graduation, but earlier in the school year as well?
One was a guy named Randy. He was officially a run away. He was a Mainah. I ran into him he told me a story about not wanting to go to college and refusing to sign up for the military. I guess at that point in 77 you had to go into the military or college. Henry told him he had to do one of the three: sign up, get excepted to a college or leave. This was close to grduation. The other was a guy named Peter. this is the peter you probably think of when you think of a guy name Peter at hyde in 77. The story was a little different. I would have to say that I am pretty sure he was high at the time. He asked me if I wanted to snort some crushed percocets. I declined his gracious offer. The bottom line was the same: Henry told him to get his ass out of Dodge. So it is believable that people were asked to go. They were kids that in the current hyde parlance were "offtrack" so it would look like they were running away. I have also been in contact with a guy that was gone before I got to Hyde named Walter who spun a similar tale. I found his story to be believable.
If you are talking about Peter T, he absolutely hated Hyde and was pretty cynical about any adult hypocrisy, but was basically a decent kid. I also have to wonder about Henry's interest in him.
Somehow I cannot picture Peter M with the crushed percocets and he may have been there earlier; Peter M also had a sister who went, Heidi. Never heard what happened to either one of them, they were kind of quiet and kept to themselves. Maybe they even graduated and I just don't remember! lol
Did Walter usually go by a different name? Never heard what actually happened to him, if we're talking about the same person. I thought he took the credits accrued and just never came back.
I remember a girl named Donna A, who I had always assumed was one of Hyde's darlings since she was pretty gung-ho about Hyde and Sumner really liked her (she played Blanche in the school play A Streetcar Named Desire, amongst other leads in other plays), but one day she disappeared and the official word was she "ran away." Not long afterwards, I ran into her on the road between the New Dorms and the Outhouse; tears were streaming down her face as she had just talked to some faculty member about her returning/staying. She said that she couldn't talk to me about it. I had always assumed that she really wanted to be there. But it seemed as if there were some "difficulties." And then she was gone.
Yeah, I do remember a lot of people officially designated as "runaways" and ones who never came back from a period of time at home, be that the end of the year or mid-term such as Christmas or Spring Break, etc. It was always portrayed as "their decision," like they made that choice on their own sans Hyde's stipulations. But this is what Hyde told us. I don't remember many of these kids telling me themselves what the reason was, at least not while they were there.
"L" as in Lennon
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You guys are talking in small numbers about Hyde not graduating us. This is from long ago. Now the numbers are very large.
Hyde now gets rid of lots of kids during the school year for many bogus reasons. Parents not participating, kids not bowing down, yada yada. Then of course towards the end of the year Hyde goes over in their minds how many of the sucker parents would pay another $40,000 to get their kid a diploma. They make up the usual, "joe blow has not lived up to the character part of the program." They have ruined many a family and many a kid by this.
Hyde's leaders can pull the wool over our parents for the rest of their lives, but I take great enjoyment out of knowing that the majority of Hydes leaders are nothing but loosers themselves. Doesn't matter how many years they are there, they are still talkin bout the same shit that happened in their lives 30 years ago. LOOSERS!!!
30 years ago the place was really for want of a better phrase "a real mind fuck" So many of the kids were down with the program it was like living in east Germany with the stazi.
Judging from the bits and pieces from more recent years and from talking to people from the late seventies it was never that intense again. I think that is why so many people from that era, that were with the program, are still involved: it was the most compelling experiences of their lives. That is why thirty years on people like me are willing to spend time commenting on it. The nearest thing in fiction I can compare it to was a British TV show called "The Prisoner"
One of the things that was used a the razor to cleave the good from the not worthy was belief in a thing called "National Commitment" which was nothing less that the over throw of the US educational system. If you did not believe in it you were not worthy. In retrospect the folks that were willing to say it was a bunch of crap were the ones with character.
The whole thing is like a dirty family secret. No one I have ever run into from back then was willing to talk about it because it was so preposterous that they sat there and bought into it. It would be like going to a family reunion and talking about the time Uncle Billy was caught in the barn standing in a wheelbarrow outtin' the wood to a cow.
I am not sure how wide a net you are throwing when you use the term "Loser" Some of those folk are basically good people. For example Rob is a good guy. I am glad he got a job at a normal school.
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You guys are talking in small numbers about Hyde not graduating us. This is from long ago. Now the numbers are very large.
Hyde now gets rid of lots of kids during the school year for many bogus reasons. Parents not participating, kids not bowing down, yada yada. Then of course towards the end of the year Hyde goes over in their minds how many of the sucker parents would pay another $40,000 to get their kid a diploma. They make up the usual, "joe blow has not lived up to the character part of the program." They have ruined many a family and many a kid by this.
Hyde got rid of lots of kids 30 years ago the same way. @Emil: you just don't remember them. They disappeared and it was not talked about.
Hyde's leaders can pull the wool over our parents for the rest of their lives, but I take great enjoyment out of knowing that the majority of Hydes leaders are nothing but loosers themselves. Doesn't matter how many years they are there, they are still talkin bout the same shit that happened in their lives 30 years ago. LOOSERS!!!
Yeah, they are. And I am, too. I guess that's because I'm a loser. I mean that with all seriousness and sincerity. I AM a loser. I went to Hyde with some problems, probably little more than the average teenager, maybe even less, but I was seriously depressed. Hyde knew this. They put the screws to me and exploited that. I left a million times more fucked up and shattered to boot. Hyde fucked me up for life. I'm finally realizing it. Thirty years came and went and so many things were just too painful for me to get out from under them.
Back then Hyde really was an incredible mind fuck. And there was no internet, where you could anonymously explore and compare notes with others. You were completely alone for the most part. Lucky were the few who had some real friendships that could transcend the Brother's Keeper bullshit, where you could actually get some honest feedback and support.
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One of the things that was used a the razor to cleave the good from the not worthy was belief in a thing called "National Commitment" which was nothing less that the over throw of the US educational system. If you did not believe in it you were not worthy. In retrospect the folks that were willing to say it was a bunch of crap were the ones with character.
The whole thing is like a dirty family secret. No one I have ever run into from back then was willing to talk about it because it was so preposterous that they sat there and bought into it. It would be like going to a family reunion and talking about the time Uncle Billy was caught in the barn standing in a wheelbarrow outtin' the wood to a cow.
"National Commitment" is still alive and kicking. They could not get other schools to change over to Hyde methods on their own accord, so Gauld started focusing on the public charter school system and putting his own people in key positions.