Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Helena Handbasket on September 21, 2005, 10:54:00 AM
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Just... Damn.
http://www.sun-herald.com/NewsArchive2/ ... tp2ch7.htm (http://www.sun-herald.com/NewsArchive2/092105/tp2ch7.htm?date=092105&story=tp2ch7.htm)
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Where are we going, and what are we doing in this handbasket?? [ This Message was edited by: Helena Handbasket on 2005-09-21 08:00 ]
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These parents don't get it ... they lost control of their child's attitude and behavior ... but instead of incarcerating him in a program, they turned their (and his) home into a prison.
Hope they get the book thrown at 'em.
THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR ABUSE.
:smokin:
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"Aggravated child abuse is a first-degree felony that can result in a maximum sentence of 30 years in prison."
But apparently it's okay if you pay someone else to do it. :flame:
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Wow... that lady is so, so sick. "Well, he was immature and rebellious, so I chain him to a wall". I hope the authorities there lock her up for a long time. She obviously also needs counseling to realize that you just don't abuse kids, no matter how "bad" they get.
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Chain Mom and Pop up and see whether they agree this is appropriate behavior modification.
Damn fools. Jail is too good for them. Send them to a boot camp for defiant parents. Make em' sweat in triple digit temps and restrict them to no showers until they write 5000 times .. I AM A STUPID ASS PARENT. CHILD ABUSE IS A CRIME.
:smokin:
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What's completely galling is that this kid was chained following AVOIDING a fight. Apparently that was the last straw. I wonder what they would have done if he'd stuck around and fought?
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The mother's statements about her fear of losing her job and her husbands business were also mind boggling. Can you say....extremely selfish!!!!!!!! Just shows how out of touch these parents are, to say the least....the mother is more concerned about losing face than about thinking serioiusly about the harm they inflicted upon their son.
And her comments to the effect how out of control the kid was so what were they supposed to do?....I have a suggestion...try being PARENTS! Of course these two probably gave up on the child long ago which probably had a lot to do with why he was "out of control" in the first place. I hope both parents spend the rest of their lives in prison if that's possible...30 years doesn't seen long enough for these two.
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It reminds me of a program I attended in Oregon where they would shackle kids to their bed posts.
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On 2005-09-21 19:03:00, Anonymous wrote:
"It reminds me of a program I attended in Oregon where they would shackle kids to their bed posts."
Care to tell us which one?
And isn't it interesting that when it's done in the home, it's child abuse (which it is - don't get me wrong), but when it's done under the guise of a "Program", it's "Treatment"?
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On 2005-09-21 17:45:00, Nonconformistlaw wrote:
"The mother's statements about her fear of losing her job and her husbands business were also mind boggling. Can you say....extremely selfish!!!!!!!! Just shows how out of touch these parents are, to say the least
And her comments to the effect how out of control the kid was so what were they supposed to do?....I have a suggestion...try being PARENTS! Of course these two probably gave up on the child long ago which probably had a lot to do with why he was "out of control" in the first place. I hope both parents spend the rest of their lives in prison if that's possible...30 years doesn't seen long enough for these two.
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This is just one of many reasons why some kids need to be removed from their Environment, sometimes the parents cant deal with it and are driven to do really stupid things, just like kids do, they react badly. The only option for adults is prison. Kids have intervention programs left and right, TBS etc to help them change their behavior. Adults dont so off to prison they go
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On 2005-09-28 11:56:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-09-21 17:45:00, Nonconformistlaw wrote:
"The mother's statements about her fear of losing her job and her husbands business were also mind boggling. Can you say....extremely selfish!!!!!!!! Just shows how out of touch these parents are, to say the least
And her comments to the effect how out of control the kid was so what were they supposed to do?....I have a suggestion...try being PARENTS! Of course these two probably gave up on the child long ago which probably had a lot to do with why he was "out of control" in the first place. I hope both parents spend the rest of their lives in prison if that's possible...30 years doesn't seen long enough for these two.
"
This is just one of many reasons why some kids need to be removed from their Environment, sometimes the parents cant deal with it and are driven to do really stupid things, just like kids do, they react badly. The only option for adults is prison. Kids have intervention programs left and right, TBS etc to help them change their behavior. Adults dont so off to prison they go"
I can't believe you're blaming this on the child. What these people did wasn't simply "stupid". It wasn't just a "bad reaction" to the kid's supposed problems. It was a criminal, abusive act.
No matter how bad kids behave, no matter what trouble they get themselves into, no child deserves this. Whether it's done within the family or as part of a "therapeutic" program (yes, hogtying and shackling children are all too common occurances in TBS's, RTC's, and similar hellholes), it's abuse and shouldn't be allowed.
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No matter how bad kids behave, no matter what trouble they get themselves into, no child deserves this. Whether it's done within the family or as part of a "therapeutic" program (yes, hogtying and shackling children are all too common occurances in TBS's, RTC's, and similar hellholes), it's abuse and shouldn't be allowed. "
I dont agree with what they have done at all, But look how far people are driven !!! Kids abusing and hitting parents, parents locking up their kids or tieing them to their beds etc. its really out of control. The mounting frustration on both parts need an outlet. Parents cant be removed from their home because kids need an adult around by law, so kids are removed to SS, TBS etc. to protect them, kids are struggling, parents are struggling
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You've got more excuses than our government right now. The parents job is to be a fucking parent and making a guilt-reducing term of 'struggling' to cover the parents ass doesnt change anything. Being tied up all day or put in a behavior modification program is horrific and making the parent out to be the victim besmirks of someone covering their ass.
If youre a shit parent, youre a shit parent. If the kid has an ACTUAL problem, treating it is better than sending them off so they're simply brainwashed into behaving good but leaving the underlying problem to fester and come back out when the emotional wounds of the "therapeutic" experience of a program scabs and flakes off.
Hell, youre coming accross in concilatory terms as if this is all just a great big time out for everyone to 'cool off'. ITS NOT. The children are in GULAGS and its anything but a time out, its constant fear, anxiety and sadness and being villified while the parents are first terrified into sending the kid off and then later made to be the 'victim' and given plenty of 'the punch' themselves.
You might as well call rape a 'warm hello'.
I believe that human beings arrive on this Earth wanting to know absolutely everything, and the best thing we can do as parents is to get out of the way -- just be there to let them know what opportunities are there
-- Dorothy Werner, media liaison for the National Homeschool Association
[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2005-09-28 14:08 ]
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On 2005-09-28 14:02:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"You've got more excuses than our government right now. The parents job is to be a fucking parent and making a guilt-reducing term of 'struggling' to cover the parents ass doesnt change anything. Being tied up all day or put in a behavior modification program is horrific and making the parent out to be the victim besmirks of someone covering their ass.
If youre a shit parent, youre a shit parent. If the kid has an ACTUAL problem, treating it is better than sending them off so they're simply brainwashed into behaving good but leaving the underlying problem to fester and come back out when the emotional wounds of the "therapeutic" experience of a program scabs and flakes off.
Hell, youre coming accross in concilatory terms as if this is all just a great big time out for everyone to 'cool off'. ITS NOT. The children are in GULAGS and its anything but a time out, its constant fear, anxiety and sadness and being villified while the parents are first terrified into sending the kid off and then later made to be the 'victim' and given plenty of 'the punch' themselves.
You might as well call rape a 'warm hello'.
I believe that human beings arrive on this Earth wanting to know absolutely everything, and the best thing we can do as parents is to get out of the way -- just be there to let them know what opportunities are there
-- Dorothy Werner, media liaison for the National Homeschool Association
[ This Message was edited by: Nihilanthic on 2005-09-28 14:08 ]"
Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent.
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It reminds me of what Charlott County Sheriffs Depudys did to me when I was in their custody as a minor and demanding medical attention because I was being denied my doctor perscribed medicines.
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Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent."
Blah, blah, fucking blah.
That has what to do with the fact that when a kid is kidnapped off to a TBS/RTS/Program/Camp/WHATEVER, that its not HELP for the kid, its not "working on issues", it not room to breathe or time out, its a PROGRAM.
Theyre anything but pleasant or time to work on issues, but apparently the only thing that you read are brochures as glossy as the look in your eyes. I mean fuck, a lot of programmies are PROUD of how "tough" all it is. Does that sound like time to work through a god damn thing except survival?
Programs dont give a child space, freedom, love, support, time out, a break, breathing room, any of that crap. Theyre drug in terrified, put through intake, and made to conform, do as told, and go through the fucking LGAs, while mommy and daddy are at home lamenting themselves and being the sole victim as hard as they can.
Ive yet to see a program address issues, baghead. All Ive seen is comformity and submission and obedience. That doesnt help with anything except survival skills for a malevolent dictatorship. I do see the damage from the austere, almost ascetic environment a program has with severe punishment for anything but total obedience and the shit the LGAs do - which is basically just like painting over rust. The real damage (and issue) is still there, but all the parent sees when the kid comes out is obedience... being "just like the little kid I wanted back", and the seminar's bullshit making the kid act happy and obedient to please the parent.
Hey, jackass, why not go talk to Ashley or Perrigaud? Oh, or Helena Handbasket? They've been in programs. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
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On 2005-10-03 02:22:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent."
Blah, blah, fucking blah.
That has what to do with the fact that when a kid is kidnapped off to a TBS/RTS/Program/Camp/WHATEVER, that its not HELP for the kid, its not "working on issues", it not room to breathe or time out, its a PROGRAM.
Theyre anything but pleasant or time to work on issues, but apparently the only thing that you read are brochures as glossy as the look in your eyes. I mean fuck, a lot of programmies are PROUD of how "tough" all it is. Does that sound like time to work through a god damn thing except survival?
Programs dont give a child space, freedom, love, support, time out, a break, breathing room, any of that crap. Theyre drug in terrified, put through intake, and made to conform, do as told, and go through the fucking LGAs, while mommy and daddy are at home lamenting themselves and being the sole victim as hard as they can.
Ive yet to see a program address issues, baghead. All Ive seen is comformity and submission and obedience. That doesnt help with anything except survival skills for a malevolent dictatorship. I do see the damage from the austere, almost ascetic environment a program has with severe punishment for anything but total obedience and the shit the LGAs do - which is basically just like painting over rust. The real damage (and issue) is still there, but all the parent sees when the kid comes out is obedience... being "just like the little kid I wanted back", and the seminar's bullshit making the kid act happy and obedient to please the parent.
Hey, jackass, why not go talk to Ashley or Perrigaud? Oh, or Helena Handbasket? They've been in programs. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
"
Seems the "jackass" here is you. You want everyone to only listen to and believe those whose stories match up with what you believe. And anyone whose has a different story, anyone who claims to have been helped - well they are ridiculed, sworn at, and called names.
You didn't experience any of this - so why exactly are you only able to believe the people that say they had bad experiences? Why is it so impossible that SOME people may have been helped like they say?
And before you start in on your yelling, swearing, and name-calling, please note I NEVER said that the people who claimed to be abused were lying or that they weren't abused.
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On 2005-10-03 04:23:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-10-03 02:22:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent."
Blah, blah, fucking blah.
That has what to do with the fact that when a kid is kidnapped off to a TBS/RTS/Program/Camp/WHATEVER, that its not HELP for the kid, its not "working on issues", it not room to breathe or time out, its a PROGRAM.
Theyre anything but pleasant or time to work on issues, but apparently the only thing that you read are brochures as glossy as the look in your eyes. I mean fuck, a lot of programmies are PROUD of how "tough" all it is. Does that sound like time to work through a god damn thing except survival?
Programs dont give a child space, freedom, love, support, time out, a break, breathing room, any of that crap. Theyre drug in terrified, put through intake, and made to conform, do as told, and go through the fucking LGAs, while mommy and daddy are at home lamenting themselves and being the sole victim as hard as they can.
Ive yet to see a program address issues, baghead. All Ive seen is comformity and submission and obedience. That doesnt help with anything except survival skills for a malevolent dictatorship. I do see the damage from the austere, almost ascetic environment a program has with severe punishment for anything but total obedience and the shit the LGAs do - which is basically just like painting over rust. The real damage (and issue) is still there, but all the parent sees when the kid comes out is obedience... being "just like the little kid I wanted back", and the seminar's bullshit making the kid act happy and obedient to please the parent.
Hey, jackass, why not go talk to Ashley or Perrigaud? Oh, or Helena Handbasket? They've been in programs. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
"
Seems the "jackass" here is you. You want everyone to only listen to and believe those whose stories match up with what you believe. And anyone whose has a different story, anyone who claims to have been helped - well they are ridiculed, sworn at, and called names.
You didn't experience any of this - so why exactly are you only able to believe the people that say they had bad experiences? Why is it so impossible that SOME people may have been helped like they say?
And before you start in on your yelling, swearing, and name-calling, please note I NEVER said that the people who claimed to be abused were lying or that they weren't abused.
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WEAK women as the head of the household.
When my dad left,my mother and two sisters were only concerned with thier new found vaginal freedom and grandmother looking on with aproval.
OF COURSE the only boy in the family got the shit end of the stick.
One sister married a drunk and he promptly moved in to the small house and took over the master bedroom (of out cracker box house) and left me and my mom sleeping in the living room,the other sister shacked up with a 100LB per week pot dealer and he would drop by once a week to kick me around with my sisters drunk husband and empty the refridgerater of MY food (dad making loads of money and paying $20 per week in support.
I kind of got in the way so the Straightlike program was where they sent me.
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On 2005-10-03 04:31:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-10-03 04:23:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-10-03 02:22:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent."
Blah, blah, fucking blah.
That has what to do with the fact that when a kid is kidnapped off to a TBS/RTS/Program/Camp/WHATEVER, that its not HELP for the kid, its not "working on issues", it not room to breathe or time out, its a PROGRAM.
Theyre anything but pleasant or time to work on issues, but apparently the only thing that you read are brochures as glossy as the look in your eyes. I mean fuck, a lot of programmies are PROUD of how "tough" all it is. Does that sound like time to work through a god damn thing except survival?
Programs dont give a child space, freedom, love, support, time out, a break, breathing room, any of that crap. Theyre drug in terrified, put through intake, and made to conform, do as told, and go through the fucking LGAs, while mommy and daddy are at home lamenting themselves and being the sole victim as hard as they can.
Ive yet to see a program address issues, baghead. All Ive seen is comformity and submission and obedience. That doesnt help with anything except survival skills for a malevolent dictatorship. I do see the damage from the austere, almost ascetic environment a program has with severe punishment for anything but total obedience and the shit the LGAs do - which is basically just like painting over rust. The real damage (and issue) is still there, but all the parent sees when the kid comes out is obedience... being "just like the little kid I wanted back", and the seminar's bullshit making the kid act happy and obedient to please the parent.
Hey, jackass, why not go talk to Ashley or Perrigaud? Oh, or Helena Handbasket? They've been in programs. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
"
Seems the "jackass" here is you. You want everyone to only listen to and believe those whose stories match up with what you believe. And anyone whose has a different story, anyone who claims to have been helped - well they are ridiculed, sworn at, and called names.
You didn't experience any of this - so why exactly are you only able to believe the people that say they had bad experiences? Why is it so impossible that SOME people may have been helped like they say?
And before you start in on your yelling, swearing, and name-calling, please note I NEVER said that the people who claimed to be abused were lying or that they weren't abused.
"
WEAK women as the head of the household.
When my dad left,my mother and two sisters were only concerned with thier new found vaginal freedom and grandmother looking on with aproval.
OF COURSE the only boy in the family got the shit end of the stick.
One sister married a drunk and he promptly moved in to the small house and took over the master bedroom (of out cracker box house) and left me and my mom sleeping in the living room,the other sister shacked up with a 100LB per week pot dealer and he would drop by once a week to kick me around with my sisters drunk husband and empty the refridgerater of MY food (dad making loads of money and paying $20 per week in support.
I kind of got in the way so the Straightlike program was where they sent me.
"
Why does it have to be women? Couldn't it simply be a weak, single parent home? I could easily see it happening with a weak-willed single father as well. Women get the blame simply because they are normally the ones left with the kids.
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On 2005-10-03 02:22:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent."
Blah, blah, fucking blah.
That has what to do with the fact that when a kid is kidnapped off to a TBS/RTS/Program/Camp/WHATEVER, that its not HELP for the kid, its not "working on issues", it not room to breathe or time out, its a PROGRAM.
Theyre anything but pleasant or time to work on issues, but apparently the only thing that you read are brochures as glossy as the look in your eyes. I mean fuck, a lot of programmies are PROUD of how "tough" all it is. Does that sound like time to work through a god damn thing except survival?
Programs dont give a child space, freedom, love, support, time out, a break, breathing room, any of that crap. Theyre drug in terrified, put through intake, and made to conform, do as told, and go through the fucking LGAs, while mommy and daddy are at home lamenting themselves and being the sole victim as hard as they can.
Ive yet to see a program address issues, baghead. All Ive seen is comformity and submission and obedience. That doesnt help with anything except survival skills for a malevolent dictatorship. I do see the damage from the austere, almost ascetic environment a program has with severe punishment for anything but total obedience and the shit the LGAs do - which is basically just like painting over rust. The real damage (and issue) is still there, but all the parent sees when the kid comes out is obedience... being "just like the little kid I wanted back", and the seminar's bullshit making the kid act happy and obedient to please the parent.
Hey, jackass, why not go talk to Ashley or Perrigaud? Oh, or Helena Handbasket? They've been in programs. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
"
Niles -- your assumtions are what is killing you. You know nothing about the family or their situation, nor who or how badly they were at risk.
The assumptions you made about me are way off. I know plenty of people who have been in programs. I can tell you are passionate about what you believe in, but you seem to get blinded by it sometimes and overlook the facts or fail to understand a post before reponding.
Sorry old fellow, just the way I see them.
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On 2005-10-03 18:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-10-03 04:31:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-10-03 04:23:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-10-03 02:22:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"Wow how do you know all that? You must live next door to those people, the article never stated any of that.
Households get in trouble. sometimes the parents are in trouble and sometimes its the kids or a combination. Typically They all need help, its a family problem, sometimes family members need to be removed to work on their own issues independently, sometimes they need to seek counseling as a group or both. But you cant just read a story and pretend to know and just blame the kid or blame the parent."
Blah, blah, fucking blah.
That has what to do with the fact that when a kid is kidnapped off to a TBS/RTS/Program/Camp/WHATEVER, that its not HELP for the kid, its not "working on issues", it not room to breathe or time out, its a PROGRAM.
Theyre anything but pleasant or time to work on issues, but apparently the only thing that you read are brochures as glossy as the look in your eyes. I mean fuck, a lot of programmies are PROUD of how "tough" all it is. Does that sound like time to work through a god damn thing except survival?
Programs dont give a child space, freedom, love, support, time out, a break, breathing room, any of that crap. Theyre drug in terrified, put through intake, and made to conform, do as told, and go through the fucking LGAs, while mommy and daddy are at home lamenting themselves and being the sole victim as hard as they can.
Ive yet to see a program address issues, baghead. All Ive seen is comformity and submission and obedience. That doesnt help with anything except survival skills for a malevolent dictatorship. I do see the damage from the austere, almost ascetic environment a program has with severe punishment for anything but total obedience and the shit the LGAs do - which is basically just like painting over rust. The real damage (and issue) is still there, but all the parent sees when the kid comes out is obedience... being "just like the little kid I wanted back", and the seminar's bullshit making the kid act happy and obedient to please the parent.
Hey, jackass, why not go talk to Ashley or Perrigaud? Oh, or Helena Handbasket? They've been in programs. Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich.
--Napoleon Bonaparte, French emperor
"
Seems the "jackass" here is you. You want everyone to only listen to and believe those whose stories match up with what you believe. And anyone whose has a different story, anyone who claims to have been helped - well they are ridiculed, sworn at, and called names.
You didn't experience any of this - so why exactly are you only able to believe the people that say they had bad experiences? Why is it so impossible that SOME people may have been helped like they say?
And before you start in on your yelling, swearing, and name-calling, please note I NEVER said that the people who claimed to be abused were lying or that they weren't abused.
"
WEAK women as the head of the household.
When my dad left,my mother and two sisters were only concerned with thier new found vaginal freedom and grandmother looking on with aproval.
OF COURSE the only boy in the family got the shit end of the stick.
One sister married a drunk and he promptly moved in to the small house and took over the master bedroom (of out cracker box house) and left me and my mom sleeping in the living room,the other sister shacked up with a 100LB per week pot dealer and he would drop by once a week to kick me around with my sisters drunk husband and empty the refridgerater of MY food (dad making loads of money and paying $20 per week in support.
I kind of got in the way so the Straightlike program was where they sent me.
"
Why does it have to be women? Couldn't it simply be a weak, single parent home? I could easily see it happening with a weak-willed single father as well. Women get the blame simply because they are normally the ones left with the kids."
Sure.
In my case it was 4 abusing women with new found vaginal freedom.
I am sure there are weak men ruining a family.
I would tend to believe that a young girl in an all male household would be overwhelmed by protection.
Im glad my dad left,but he left me with 4 whores.