Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones => Topic started by: BCA PG 1 Survivor on September 12, 2005, 03:48:00 AM
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You know what's worst than being bitter about not graduating and pissing and moaning about whatever?...and what I'm about to say is so true...It's leaving the school and having the misconception that the world that Cedu and the time spent "in the system" is what can truly guide you through life as is.
I, like many of the folks that I know graduated, left the school with a sense of completion and a cloud of euphoria. We went home and tried to be friends with everybody and tried to coach "friends" through hard times and expect to use the tools to make a difference.(Well some folks fell off the wagon and got back in their old routine) But shit...that only works until the real world comes crashing down on you! I was 15 when I graduated and I was so damn lost and the last thing that people look for in "the outside world" from then until at least the late teens is someone trying to preach to them the way we were preached to and even preached to each other.
"Summit Gives" i don't know when you graduated because it sounds like you just did...if not than you must live a quiet or strict religous life because alot of the day to day fundamentals are null and void once you drive away and mesh back into real life.
The biggest gift of CEDU is the gift of PSYCHOLOGY! If used right, the art of manipulation, candy coating: saying the right thing at the right time to soothe unfortunate possibilities, and expressing yourself through writing can take you a long way (hell I'm a marketing management major and I use those ploys in my research).
You can't run your anger with a group of friends, if you're a guy you can't "smoosh" with them, and finally I dare you to throw on some good ol' Cedu jams like - Tell It all or I am a rock or He Ain't heavy - with some friends around and there will not be a single tear shed or a friendly hug (unless you guys are hippies)
Yeah you may have made some good friends...how many do you talk to? Yeah you probably have less baggage now or maybe more BUT YOU CAN'T PREACH TO PEOPLE ABOUT KEEPING SOMETHING SACRED THAT MOST OF THE STAFF AND MAYBE EVEN MEL HIMSELF DID NOT!
Have your memories, and your scrapbook, and whatever other momento you may have in your shrine but you need to wake up and realize the reality of CEDU was not loving and caring for all of us...for many, it was a bastian of abuse, confusion, and pain; even for some of us that went through everything from Truth to Summit. So please...quite being blind!
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Why would you even waste your time writing all that? You actually take him seriously? Seriously man, he called someone a "butterfly". He's definitely just trying to get inside the heads of suckers like you.
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[ This Message was edited by: BCA PG 1 Survivor on 2005-09-12 13:26 ]
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get inside the heads of suckers like you...that's rich it's so great when people are still fucked up and have to use their jargon from cedu, or whatever hospital or half way house they're in now...but whatever the case it wasn't the worst way to spend 5 minutes...btw can't you tell this whole thing is a damn joke? [ This Message was edited by: BCA PG 1 Survivor on 2005-09-12 13:32 ]
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Get inside your head? You think that's a 'cedu' term? I think the first time I heard that one was when my farm league baseball coach told me not to let the fans get inside my head. You need to relax buddy. I was PG 24 and I'm over that place...you're PG 1 and you're still stuck on it?
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By the way, farm league = about 6 years old.
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Guess you missed this thread:
http://www.fornits.baremetal.com/wwf/vi ... forum=11&8 (http://www.fornits.baremetal.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=11626&forum=11&8)
Do you have any concept of irony? I mean, goddamn, even if the guy wasn't being sarcastic, what he/she is saying is still fucking hilarious. I laugh my ass off every time Summit posts.
Of course, people getting all bent out of shape over what he/she says makes it even funnier.
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Oh I know, he is straight up comedy.
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if you can't laugh at yourself and your experience at cedu, you're gonna lead a pretty dark life. you don't find it absolutely hilarious that you had to stand on a deck in the middle of the night and say 'potty please?' just so you could take a piss. or that people who didn't want to put on the 'potty boots' and all their clothes would piss in your water bottle? or that la tresa would hold general meetings and absolutely lay into 60 kids because a few of them were tying their shoes like 'gangsters?'. the list goes on forever. that place was hilarious, and I enjoy quite a few laughs from time to time thinking about it.
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On 2005-09-13 11:13:00, Anonymous wrote:
"if you can't laugh at yourself and your experience at cedu, you're gonna lead a pretty dark life. you don't find it absolutely hilarious that you had to stand on a deck in the middle of the night and say 'potty please?' just so you could take a piss. or that people who didn't want to put on the 'potty boots' and all their clothes would piss in your water bottle? or that la tresa would hold general meetings and absolutely lay into 60 kids because a few of them were tying their shoes like 'gangsters?'. the list goes on forever. that place was hilarious, and I enjoy quite a few laughs from time to time thinking about it. "
Holy crap, when the hell did all of this happen? Was the potty please a CEDU-only thing? (I went to RMA.) How funny and bizarre! We could take a piss whenever we wanted. The bathrooms were right inside the dorms.
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Haha no, I forgot to mention that it was at Ascent when we had to do that. Same with people pissing in your water bottles. The La Tresa part was at BCA, and I wonder if anyone actually remembers that general meeting...it was at the beginning of the summer of '02.
But seriously, I was at Ascent in the winter, and they would make you chug an entire water bottle between your nightly 'activities' and your 7:30 'bedtime'. So the lighter sleepers had to get up and piss about 3 times every night. And each time, you had to put on your poly pro underwear, wool pants, fleece, parka, hat, and those thigh-high rainboots (aka potty boots), just to go stand on the deck, raise your hand, and say 'potty please'. Half the time, the night watch was so enthralled with whatever it was they did while making $2.00 an hour that they would just ignore you for a few minutes. Finally, they would begrudgingly (what else did their job really entail?) come and escort you to the outhouse.
Gay.
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wasn't nightwatch the minor league of cedu? some of those guys would work nightwatch for years at a time with only a dream of maybe one day getting to see some real action in the cedu schools to keep them going.
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On 2005-09-13 20:15:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Haha no, I forgot to mention that it was at Ascent when we had to do that. Same with people pissing in your water bottles. The La Tresa part was at BCA, and I wonder if anyone actually remembers that general meeting...it was at the beginning of the summer of '02.
But seriously, I was at Ascent in the winter, and they would make you chug an entire water bottle between your nightly 'activities' and your 7:30 'bedtime'. So the lighter sleepers had to get up and piss about 3 times every night. And each time, you had to put on your poly pro underwear, wool pants, fleece, parka, hat, and those thigh-high rainboots (aka potty boots), just to go stand on the deck, raise your hand, and say 'potty please'. Half the time, the night watch was so enthralled with whatever it was they did while making $2.00 an hour that they would just ignore you for a few minutes. Finally, they would begrudgingly (what else did their job really entail?) come and escort you to the outhouse.
Gay. "
Oh, how weird. I guess they were afriad you were going to split, otherwise? I guess all the clothing was to keep you warm, and for liability's sake. Same with the hydration. I bet another reason for the hydration was to make sure you got up at a decent hour in the morning. That's a tactic GIs use when they are in combat. They drink a whole shitload of water before they go to sleep, if they know they are only going to get a few hours. Well, look at it this way. Better this than the crazy boot camp wilderness programs where the kids are dehydrated, starving and dying, right? (Although drinking too much water can actually dehydrate you, so hopefully they made you eat something salty with all that water.)
I heard that Stacy Wasserman moved over to Ascent. Was she still there when you were there?
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Didn't know any Stacy Wasserman. I don't think they were very concerned about us sleeping in. We were in the teepee by 7:30 and they didn't wake us up until 8:30. I don't know about you, but I really can't sleep for 13 hours. And of course, they woke you up with that (shudder) 5 minutes call. Then we had 5 minutes to pack all our shit up and get out into a circle on the deck. Much harder than it sounds. Most of the time there would be at least 3 or 4 kids who couldn't get it done in time, and we'd all get to do it again. Ascent fucking blew.
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On 2005-09-13 21:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Didn't know any Stacy Wasserman. I don't think they were very concerned about us sleeping in. We were in the teepee by 7:30 and they didn't wake us up until 8:30. I don't know about you, but I really can't sleep for 13 hours. And of course, they woke you up with that (shudder) 5 minutes call. Then we had 5 minutes to pack all our shit up and get out into a circle on the deck. Much harder than it sounds. Most of the time there would be at least 3 or 4 kids who couldn't get it done in time, and we'd all get to do it again. Ascent fucking blew. "
I think she was in charge in the early 90s. She used to be staff at RMA. I think she was staff at CEDU before that, too. One of Mel's daughters, in case you didn't recognize the name. I was surprised that she went to Ascent, because I don't remember her going on many wilderness trips back when I was at RMA.
That 5 minute thing sounds exactly like Sagewalk. I wonder where these programs get their ideas from? Like, who thought of them first?
Ascent also sounds extremely different than wilderness expeditions at RMA. Ours were actually more laid back in terms of structure, and it was nice to have a break from the rigid day to day life of school. Sure, hiking with a heavy pack sucked and all, and I sure bitched about it, but it was nothing like school was. I think maybe we had like, one rap on our wilderness challenge, and that was it. (I don't think we even had that.) Mostly we just had discussions and problem solving groups that dealt directly with the expedition. And Dan Krump was always kind of this laid back kinda guy in my eyes. He was a cool staff to have on an expedition. He was basically the "wilderness guy." The wilderness trips were like, mini vacations, even though they were hard, wheras ascent sounds like it totally sucked. Especially because they were for much longer periods of time. (41 days.) The wilderness challenge was only 15.
I guess they had that militant structure because ascent was designed for kids "right off the streets" weren't they? Wheras the wilderness expeditions at RMA were for kids who had already been at the school for a while and had already been indoctrinated. I mean, the wilderness challenge was the last expedition (unless you decided to be a support student on one) and you were in middle school.
Although I guess you know all of this already. I'm assuming you had wilderness expeditions at BCA.
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La Teresa was still standing up and yelling at the school for some stupid crap in '02. I remember when I was there, she was on a kick about the farm animals. Although, there was a lot of mistreatment towards those animals, it was always hilarious to hear her yell at the top of her lungs "It is not OK". She just had a way of saying it! Anyway, never got sent to Ascent, so I don't know a lot about that program, but I do remember a staff from there named Justine came to BCA for a couple of weeks. She tried coming in like a hard ass and thought she was gonna get away with drilling kids she barely knew simply because she was from Ascent. She got her eyes opened when we all got sick of it and let HER have it! Hee Hee! Pretty funny!
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"It's not ok!" La Tresa's favorite words. Oh man was she emotional when she busted out with that one. And people just couldn't help but laugh because she'd string together about 8 of them at once. Only made her angrier. Making La mad was one of my favorite pastimes at BCA. Right up there with brewing wine and smoking yarro haha.
Yeah we had that wilderness challenge at BCA. Not sure about before my time, but we called it the 'Brother's Quest'. You did it with your PG right before (maybe after?) the Brothers propheet. If there's one thing I'll give it up to BCA for, it's how well it got kids in shape. But the BQ was only after about 4-6 months, so half the kids were still whining about a little hiking. I personally had a ton of fun on that trip...despite the occasional raps (hell, we even had raps when I went on the Salmon River white water rafting trip), it was pretty cool to get off campus for a few days and out into the outdoors. But seriously, we all looked forward to doctor's trips to Couer d' Alene or Spokane just to get off campus and eat a little Jack in the Crack. BQ wasn't nearly as long as your wilderness challenge though. We left on a Friday and I'm pretty sure we were back Monday morning.
Staff members would always come over from Ascent between '00 and '02, but most of the time they'd just become activity staff. They were pretty cool for the most part. But we did get one or two who tried to start ripping everyone a new one, and none of the kids would stand for it. Even Mike D'Amico came down at one point looking for a job. For whatever reason, he didn't get it, but I remember 2 guys getting light restrictions for getting in his face and warning him not to show his face around BCA.
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Ha! Ha! "It's not ok!" I think pretty much every staff said that at one point when I was there. Actually, it was more of "That's not ok!" and yeah, we looked forward to doctor's trips, too, and we whined when we had to hike. More like we bitched at each other. It was the terrain that was challenging, not the distance. Steep skree fields in canyons. Or hiking through streams, rocky banks, canyon walls, and picking up burrs everywhere we went. (Our challenge was in the high desert.) I think the longest distance we hiked was 12 miles in one day, not too far. We had the hard-frame packs, too, cause the soft packs were new then. If you were lucky, you got to carry the food, cause it was heavy when you started the expedition, when you were at top form, and light towards the end when you were tired. (Although during the Challenge we picked up a cache towards the middle of the trip.) Still, carrying the food rocked, because you had access to whatever you wanted. And god forbid you got separated from the group, you wouldn't starve, you know? (And your group sure had an investment in finding you.) Needless to say, I always opted to carry the food. The winter expeditions were especially cool cause you got to wear skis.
We had four wilderness expeditions at RMA, but I think our program was longer than BCA's. (RMA was two and a half years.) We had an overnight in Voyagers. We had a four day one called the Final Discovery, a six day one called the Final Quest, and a 15 day one called the Wilderness Challenge. (That was the one with the four day solo, and the four day finals groups.)
There were solos on the final discovery and quest, too, but I can't remember how long they were. They were either an hour and four hours, or four hours and overnight. I think it's the first one.
I agree with you. It was such a nice break from having to be at school. Granted, I would totally bitch and piss and moan about hiking, because I was a total wimp, and always at the back of the group trailing behind, but I still loved it.
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Oh yeah, and the wilderness challenge was a while after your I Want To Live, I believe. The Quest was after your brothers, the discovery was after the childrens, and the overnight was after the truth. (Or sometimes before.)
I honestly can't remember offhand how long you had been at the school by the time you go on your challenge. I think voyageurs is 3 months. Discovery is 3. quest is 6 Challenge is 6 New horizons is 6 and summit is around 4-5. So, You'd probably have been at school around a year and 3 months by the time you went on the challenge. 9 months for the quest, and maybe about 4 or 5 for the discovery.
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Sounds like the shit we did at Ascent. It sounds like you didn't go there, so I apologize if you did and none of this is new to you, but after 2 weeks of getting yelled at and sawing wood and 'growing emotionally' in base camp, we went on a 2 week hike. Those packs weren't too bad (they were the soft one), but for some reason my group was only 4 kids, so our packs were really heavy. It really sucked...I had spent the last 2 years smoking blunts and I was completely out of shape...it was the middle of the winter like I said, so we were snowshoeing through fresh tracks.
In 2001, they started this trip at BCA to Mt. Rainier. It was an 11 day trip around the 119 mile Wonderland Trail (I think we only did about 97 miles though because of back country camping permits and such). It wasn't something that was part of the program, so only the guys who could really handle it went on that one. Tons of fun, but absolutely brutal. In the beginning we'd do about 6-7 miles a day, but eventually we were up to about 12-14. It would be straight up switchbacks for 5 miles at a time, and then right back down again, which honestly was even worse than the uphill just because of what those packs did to your knees. Fortunately, Ron Mae up at RMA hooked us up with some really nice packs so we hit that shit up in style.
That was the best part about being stuck up there in North Idaho. The trips we got to go on were awesome. Even the Brothers Quest, with everyone bitching at each other for 3 days, was a good time.
Halfway through my stay at BCA, they cut the program. It had been 2 1/2 years when I first got there, but because enrollment was dropping, they cut it to an average of 2 years. The people that opened their peer groups were fucked, and usually ended up staying over 24 months, but people that were the last in before their Truth could sometimes graduate the program in 18 months. I would've graduated in 22 months, but I got pulled after 21.
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Oh and during those 2 weeks on 'course' at Ascent, we'd do a 4 day solo. I felt bad for the kids who had to do that solo during the summer, because they must've gotten bored out of their minds. I was right on the side of a hill, so I ghetto rigged a snowboard and spent all 4 days carving up powder.
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Nope. Didn't do Ascent. Ascent didn't exist when I was at RMA. Only CEDU and RMA existed. (Maybe some of the CEDU middle and high schools existed, I don't know.)
Yeah, most hiking days were 5-6 miles except for that one day we did 12 miles, because it was mostly flat and on top of the canyon, as opposed to down inside it, on tougher terrain.
My four day solo was indeed in the summer, but I didn't mind. I got some wicked real estate. Inside the canyon right by the stream, and I was allowed to have both banks, and I had a rock bridge across it, so I didn't have to get wet every time. So all I did was just lounge in the sun all day and chill. There were these big rocks you could just lay down on.
Yeah, Mt. Rainier was a particularly grueling expedition. I remember one peer group doing that as their wilderness challenge. I heard that one of the nicest was the Olympic peninsula. I remember another group doing that one.
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I split after my first 3 day wilderness, so I was always curious about the Challenge Wildernes trip. When you did a three or four day solo, did anyone check up on you to make sure you were safe? What did you do for food? Wasn't it scary to sleep alone at night?
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They checked on you daily but you usually didn't know it. I wasn't scared to be out there. It was actually kind of nice- no one was in my face for those few days. I wouldn't ever choose to do a solo again though.
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Those solo's definitely were a pretty refreshing break. Having staff in your face all the time was pretty stressful on so many levels, so just being able to get out clear your head, and deal with absolutely no drama was good for the soul you know?
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On 2005-09-15 08:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I split after my first 3 day wilderness, so I was always curious about the Challenge Wildernes trip. When you did a three or four day solo, did anyone check up on you to make sure you were safe? What did you do for food? Wasn't it scary to sleep alone at night? "
Yep, they check on you daily, are within earshot, and you also get a whistle. And of course, they reassure you that the chief concern among students is that a staff member is going to walk in on you when you are taking a shit, but they assure you that the odds of that are pretty small. So guess who gets walked in on while they are taking a shit? Yours truly! :rofl:
As for food, you get one big bag of gorp. I wasn't all that hungry, though. I actually burned through my bag the first two days.
I agree with the other two posters. The nicest thing about solo was that I didn't have to deal with other people being in my face. The staff, the peer group, the school, etc.
There was really only one night that was scary for me. I heard something walking around outside my tarp, some sort of animal. I had no idea what it was. I heard it walking around on the rocks. I was so terrified I was too scared to breathe, because it sounded pretty heavy. (We really hadn't encountered any big animals on the expedition.) I have no idea what it was. It didn't sound big enough to be a cow, (they had cattle in that area) or the staff, and it was too big to be a rodent like a raccoon. I'm sure it was harmless, probably a goat, but it sure scared the hell out of me.
Not nearly as scary as the solo of a friend of mine. She woke up with a huge animal's nose sniffing her face! She screamed her lungs out and it ran away.