Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => World Wide Association of Specialty Programs and Schools (WWASPS) => Topic started by: Jeff_Berryman on July 09, 2005, 01:13:00 PM
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http://www.petitiononline.com/peth1/petition.html (http://www.petitiononline.com/peth1/petition.html)
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Hey Jeff ... you still supporting PURE or have you decided to be a REAL advocate for the rights of minors?
Which is it?
And please, save me the schtick about how some kids really do need treatment ... because while no one denies that ... that's a job for behavioral healthcare experts not some parent who thinks they can tell a good program from a bad program based on their poor choices.
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I wonder, did you know Jeff, that Susan was helping recrut kids for the Brat camp thing? Or at least, it was an outdoor rehab with a film crew tagging along. I assume it was Brat camp. Call Shannon and ask about it. Susan thought she might want to send her daughter.
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Parenting is a full time job ... no matter how much money Mom and/or Dad have to spend shipping their kid in and out of programs ... they are still paying someone else to PARENT their child.
Why?
What possible reason would a parent have to keep their own kid under lock and key for weeks, months even years?
These aren't good kids making bad choices .. they are bad parents who can afford to waste thousands of dollars paying somebody to babysit their child 24/7 until they turn 18.
What a crock ... wilderness therapy camps are nothing more than a precursor to locked boarding schools.
The least these disgusting parents and the programs they support could do is be honest about it.
Ooops, that would require having I.N.T.E.G.R.I.T.Y ... something these greedy, ignorant fools wouldn't know the first thing about.
:flame:
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Brat Camp is a show that is doomed for failure. It's reality tv at it's most inane. Seriously, who wants to watch a bunch of so-called bratty teens trekking around the wilderness? Teens themselves won't watch the show leaving the advertisers with no consumer audience.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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All the soccermommies are gonna gobble it up.
The religion of one age is the literary entertainment of the next.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson, American essayist, poet, philosopher
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On 2005-07-09 14:50:00, Nihilanthic wrote:
"All the soccermommies are gonna gobble it up.The religion of one age is the literary entertainment of the next.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson, American essayist, poet, philosopher
"
Uggh, soccer moms. Now there's a group of demented parents who need a reality check.
The good news is Brat Camp may actually work to keep kids out of these programs when teens get wind of their soccer mom's cult like affectation for the show.
Knowledge is power. Smart teens will just kiss ass a little better and tell their dear crazed mothers how they NEVER HAVE to worry about them b/c they are NOT like those stupid, bratty kids with LOW SELF-ESTEEM. They are WINNERS.
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On 2005-07-09 14:30:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Brat Camp is a show that is doomed for failure. It's reality tv at it's most inane. Seriously, who wants to watch a bunch of so-called bratty teens trekking around the wilderness? Teens themselves won't watch the show leaving the advertisers with no consumer audience.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
"
i agree, this crap they are putting out as tv will have no audience. its just too stupid.
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To the annon who said: "What a crock ... wilderness therapy camps are nothing more than a precursor to locked boarding schools."
THANK YOU! That is sooooo true. I was sent to a "30-day wilderness camp" which somehow turned into almost year in lockdown because I passed out in a field (from dehydration and over-exertion) and woke up in the van on the way to lockdown. Life is sweet, aint it?
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On 2005-07-09 15:17:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-07-09 14:30:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Brat Camp is a show that is doomed for failure. It's reality tv at it's most inane. Seriously, who wants to watch a bunch of so-called bratty teens trekking around the wilderness? Teens themselves won't watch the show leaving the advertisers with no consumer audience.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
"
i agree, this crap they are putting out as tv will have no audience. its just too stupid. "
I wish that were so. The original British show has already run for two series and has been shown in Australia and New Zealand too. It won an International Emmy. When it was shown on ABC Family it did so well that they decided to make one of their own.
The dispiriting thing is that it is the teenagers who lap it up. Look at the ABC Family Brat Camp message board. It is mostly kids arguing about which of the participants is most good looking. (A notable exception is a recent post by Barbe Stamps). One youngster was so anxious to get his 15 minutes of fame that he was asking how to sign up.
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Everyone is tricked or forced into thinking that suffering and hardship and other "tough" words are somehow "good for them".
Nevermind that the mentality itself is ridiculous, if everyone eles thinks it why stand out? (Per their logic, they should just put all the violent criminals to work beating everyone in middleschool and up so they get 'emotional growth') Besides, most of them are just watching it as a show - as something that is fiction, it doesnt click to them that its real. I tell someone about tranquility bay and it wont click. I read to them statement "E" from ISAC and they usually either just think its a lie or sit there in shock.
It took incessant nagging on my part to get my mom to watch montel williams when it had the show about WWASPS the second time (with the lovely editing out of PURE bullshit :grin:). And the thing is, she knew on an INTELLECTUAL level that this was real, but it never clicked with her REALITY until she saw this. Unfortuantely she didnt see Samanta Monroe talking - I think that a GROWN WOMAN talking about this might have gotten it across to another one. Ministers say that they teach charity. That is natural. They live on hand-outs. All beggars teach that others should give.
--Robert G. Ingersoll, American politician and lecturer
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I really do wonder, did you know that Susan was helping recruit kids for the Brat camp thing?
Call Shannon and ask about it. Susan thought she might want to send her daughter.
I also wonder - why haven't you ever sent out copies of the articles in the situation at Whitmore? If these things were taking place at SCL or IRA you'd be sending the articles out far and wide.
Not that I don't know why you haven't . . .
I guess its just that I am surprised you would let "that" stop you from doing what you do - advocating for kids placed in abusive and neglectful programs.
How is it you can accept ,on one referral agent's word, that the Whitmore families are lying manipulators with an agenda - but not accept that same argument in the case of all others?
Please don't misunderstand. I have always liked and respected you Jeff. I am not meaning to attack you - I guess I am just hoping to get you thinking.
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On 2005-07-10 07:54:00, BuzzKill wrote:
"I really do wonder, did you know that Susan was helping recruit kids for the Brat camp thing?
Call Shannon and ask about it. Susan thought she might want to send her daughter.
I also wonder - why haven't you ever sent out copies of the articles in the situation at Whitmore? If these things were taking place at SCL or IRA you'd be sending the articles out far and wide.
Not that I don't know why you haven't . . .
I guess its just that I am surprised you would let "that" stop you from doing what you do - advocating for kids placed in abusive and neglectful programs.
How is it you can accept ,on one referral agent's word, that the Whitmore families are lying manipulators with an agenda - but not accept that same argument in the case of all others?
Please don't misunderstand. I have always liked and respected you Jeff. I am not meaning to attack you - I guess I am just hoping to get you thinking.
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I agree Buzzkill, but I seriously doubt you will get an answer from Berryman that truthfully explains why he continues to ride WWASPS's ass all the while ignoring the elephant in the room (e.g. Whitmore).
It's really a shame the poor guy hasn't figured out he's been beating the wrong drum for the past 3 years or so.
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No, that is not what I mean -
He's banging on the right drum alright.
He just needs to bang on them all - there are many drums in a drum set - and bongos and all kinds of other things that one also bangs on.
I just think he needs to think about why this one drum isn't getting any play.
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On 2005-07-10 10:26:00, BuzzKill wrote:
"No, that is not what I mean -
He's banging on the right drum alright.
He just needs to bang on them all - there are many drums in a drum set - and bongos and all kinds of other things that one also bangs on.
I just think he needs to think about why this one drum isn't getting any play.
"
Unlike you Buzz, I lost any and all respect for Berryman after reading about his association with PURE in the court documents.
The guy is smart enough to know WWASPS ain't the only bad kid on the block and that this business of programs paying finder's fees stinks to high heaven.
He's a lost cause.
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Can I indulge myself by taking a guess at this point?
I think all these neo-edcons (hey now! there's a newly minted term!) fully support the basic Program. Emotional abuse, isolation and extreme austerity are all perfectly fine w/ them. As long as there's no pepper spray and they let a doctor patch the kid up whenever they injur them or make them sick, that's just fine w/ most of these people.
So the Whit is Great, as far as Sue and Jeff are concerned. They can suspend disbelief indefinitely, so long as they continue to not leave such obvious marks as chin scars and chemical burns on the kids.
At the end of the day, though, they just don't get it. And they probably never will.
Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived.
--Isaac Asimov, Russian-born American author
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I am a little mystified as to why the TV company would need Sue Scheff to recruit parents. After the first series on ABC Family there were parents on the ABC message board asking how to sign up. It was just one long advertisment for them. I don't know the details of the contract but I assume the TV company is paying the fees. This is a program parent's dream. Why pay an ed con to sell it? It sells itself.
On the other hand, it does seem a little odd that over half the kids are from California. Do they have a very energetic recruiter there is it just because that is where the production company is based?
If Sue is involved does this mean she gets an advertorial like she did on Montel?
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Sieg Heil! Hitler Jugend uber alles!
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ABC's Brat Camp is the biggest promoter for the teenage behavior modification industry since Columbine.
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I don't expect they did Need anyone to help recruit for Brat Camp - Nevertheless - they contacted Sue; and as a result, she had the producer call a mom I know, to see if she wanted to send her daughter. I do a little doubt she was the only one.
Ginger - I don't think what is going on at Whitmore (according to the allegations) would be just fine with Jeff. I think he is believing her b/c they have known one another so long. I think, most likely, he just can't believe she has less than "PURE" motives. So, he is believing what he's been told with out really considering the possibility he might not be getting the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
I think he and several others ought to be considering this possibility.
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On 2005-07-10 18:08:00, BuzzKill wrote:
So, he is believing what he's been told with out really considering the possibility he might not be getting the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
I think he and several others ought to be considering this possibility.
Which part do you think they don't believe, though; the brainwashing or the overt violence that results?
I'm saying these folks seem to approve of brainwashing, they just get queezy over the details. Sort of like seeing sausage made.... or Upton Sinclair's attempt at cleaning up the markets in Chicago. They're really alright w/ the petritude and corruption of the industry, so long as there's nothing going on that the union objects to.
Truth does not have to be accepted on faith. Scientists do not hold hands every Sunday, singing, "Yes gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! Amen.
--Dan Barker, former evangelist and author
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On 2005-07-10 18:08:00, BuzzKill wrote:
"I don't expect they did Need anyone to help recruit for Brat Camp - Nevertheless - they contacted Sue; and as a result, she had the producer call a mom I know, to see if she wanted to send her daughter. I do a little doubt she was the only one.
Ginger - I don't think what is going on at Whitmore (according to the allegations) would be just fine with Jeff. I think he is believing her b/c they have known one another so long. I think, most likely, he just can't believe she has less than "PURE" motives. So, he is believing what he's been told with out really considering the possibility he might not be getting the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
I think he and several others ought to be considering this possibility.
"
Isn't PURE listed on the ISAC watch list?
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Guess Berryman has no comment.
Can you blame him? He knows he has zero credibility with those who read the WWASPS v. PURE documents.
It's a shame, really. For awhile he was a strong voice against the teen help industry, at large, until he unwittingly got duped, himself.
Tsk, Tsk, Berryman. Really thought you were smarter than that.
:roll:
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Its entirely possible Jeff never reads these forums. I know he posts stuff - but that doesn't mean he reads here.
//I'm saying these folks seem to approve of brainwashing, they just get queezy over the details//
You might be right.
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WWASPS v. PURE DOCUMENTS
http://isaccorp.org/wwasps/wwaspsvpure.pdf (http://isaccorp.org/wwasps/wwaspsvpure.pdf)
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On 2005-07-11 11:53:00, BuzzKill wrote:
"Its entirely possible Jeff never reads these forums. I know he posts stuff - but that doesn't mean he reads here.
//I'm saying these folks seem to approve of brainwashing, they just get queezy over the details//
You might be right."
In other words ... these people are saying the ends justify the means.
Effing Hypocrites. They ought to be ashamed of themselves.
:flame:
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So what's Jeff's excuse? His bain was hijacked by another brand of teen helpers and washed in a tub of koolaid without his knowledge or consent?
That's pure bullshit and you know it.
:rofl:
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ISAC's Watchlist of Facilities and Referral Agencies ...
Facilities:
AARC (Alberta Adolescent Recovery Center) - Canada**
Academy at Ivy Ridge - New York*
Bethel Girls Academy - Mississippi* CLOSED but May Reopen
Browning Academy - Utah* - Does not physically exist
Carolina Springs Academy - South Carolina*
Casa By The Sea - Mexico* CLOSED but Still Trying to Reopen
Cross Creek Manor/Center/Academy - Utah*
Darrington Academy - Georgia*
Devereux Foundation - multiple centers nationwide
Eagle Point Christian Academy previously named Bethel Boys Academy - Mississippi*
Elan School - Maine
Escuela Caribe - Dominican Republic
Growing Together - Florida**
Kids Helping Kids - Ohio**
King George School - Vermont
Lighthouse of North West Florida - previously named Victory Christian Academy and Genesis Ministries - Jay, Florida
Majestic Ranch Academy - Utah*
Midwest Academy - Iowa*
New Beginnings Maternity Home - Utah*
New Beginnings Rebekah Academy - Pace, Florida
New Haven Residential Treatment Center - Utah
Oaks Treatment Center - Texas
Operation Par - Florida**
Pathway Family Center - Indiana and Michigan**
Phoenix Institute - Georgia**
Provo Canyon School - Utah
Refuge, Operated by Love In Action - Tennessee
SAFE (Substance Abuse and Family Education) - Florida**
Second Chance - Tennessee**
Spring Creek Lodge - Montana*
Thayer Learning Center/TLC Boot Camp - Missouri
Tranquility Bay - Jamaica*
Turn-About Ranch - Utah
Whitmore Academy - Utah
Referral Agencies:
P.U.R.E., Inc.
-----------------------------------------
http://isaccorp.org/watchlist.html (http://isaccorp.org/watchlist.html)
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Just an observation...
Is ISAC or the owner on the payroll of the Aspen Education Group?
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I would suggest Jeff didnt know about Pure /SS receiving referal fees.
It never came into the many converstaions I had with the Pure woman. If fact she stated clealy Pure made 13,000 dollars the year prior to wwasp's request for financials for discovery. The woman lies. Just like the rest of them.
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On 2005-07-11 18:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Just an observation...
Is ISAC or the owner on the payroll of the Aspen Education Group?
"
Look at the ISAC document library. There are some Aspen programs listed there that aren't listed on the watchlist, such as Excel Academy. Turn-About Ranch, which is on the list, is an Aspen program.
It's taking them time to get to Aspen, but they're getting there.
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Well, if I understand the process by which a program or business is added to the watch list - ISAC needs to have a complaint from a student or parent. Maybe also some other evidence that concern is warranted - such as Newspaper accounts or other documents.
And one should remember - its not like ISAC has a large staff on hand to update web pages. Things get done when there is time to do them.
If someone has a problem with Aspen, you should make sure ISAC knows about it; and if your willing to stand by your statement, I feel confident ISAC will pay attention.
About Jeff not know Sue was paid referrals by the programs - I can't think he didn't know. . . Really, it wasn't a secrete. How much, and the exact circumstances are unknown - but that she is paid by the programs is well known and oft debated.
My only gripe with Jeff is his not sending out the articles about the charges against the owners of Whitmore - as he would have, had it been any other program with Susan off the pay roll.
AND - I really do wonder if he is aware that she was recruiting for Brat Camp? He seems very upset by the idea of Brat Camp. So, its natural for anyone to wonder if he knew this. If not, maybe he'll ask himself what else does he not know. Maybe he should.
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On 2005-07-11 19:17:00, BuzzKill wrote:
"Well, if I understand the process by which a program or business is added to the watch list - ISAC needs to have a complaint from a student or parent. Maybe also some other evidence that concern is warranted - such as Newspaper accounts or other documents.
And one should remember - its not like ISAC has a large staff on hand to update web pages. Things get done when there is time to do them.
If someone has a problem with Aspen, you should make sure ISAC knows about it; and if your willing to stand by your statement, I feel confident ISAC will pay attention.
About Jeff not know Sue was paid referrals by the programs - I can't think he didn't know. . . Really, it wasn't a secrete. How much, and the exact circumstances are unknown - but that she is paid by the programs is well known and oft debated.
My only gripe with Jeff is his not sending out the articles about the charges against the owners of Whitmore - as he would have, had it been any other program with Susan off the pay roll.
AND - I really do wonder if he is aware that she was recruiting for Brat Camp? He seems very upset by the idea of Brat Camp. So, its natural for anyone to wonder if he knew this. If not, maybe he'll ask himself what else does he not know. Maybe he should. "
LOL ... Scheff is referring to Brat Camp and recruiting (or used to) kids for lawsuits against teen help programs?
Now that's an oxymoron if I ever heard one.
:rofl:
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On 2005-07-11 18:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Just an observation...
Is ISAC or the owner on the payroll of the Aspen Education Group?
"
OMG .. what the hell kind of question is that?
ISAC is a watchdog group. Right???
:???:
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Didn't you get the response to your question you had hoped for?
Oh well. . .
As for what kind of question it is - my off hand guess would be it is a deflection question; meant to inspire unwarranted suspicions an asked in the hope of shifting the attention of this thread.
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On 2005-07-11 18:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Just an observation...
Is ISAC or the owner on the payroll of the Aspen Education Group?
"
That is interesting. None of the Aspen Education Group schools are listed, yet have the same allegations of abuse. What's up?
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PURE and Other Programs Riding BRAT CAMP Wave?
Anonymous
Unregistered User Posted: 2005-07-14 22:09:00 Just out of curiousity, I did a YAHOO search for key words "Brat Camp" and these Sponsored *PAID* Advertisements came up:
Brat Camp Options
Parent's Universal Resources (PURE) offers parents safe and qualified schools and programs...
http://www.helpyourteens.com (http://www.helpyourteens.com)
MHYR - Brat Camp
Coed ages 12-17. Wilderness based therapy program for troubled teens is located on a...
http://www.mhyr.com (http://www.mhyr.com)
Struggling Teen Brat Camps
Information and resources available for parents with a struggling teen. 24 hour...
http://www.helpmyteen.com (http://www.helpmyteen.com)
Personally, I think these ads say it all, don't you?
Edit/Delete This Post Reply with quote
Post URL: http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... =37#116539 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=10841&forum=37#116539)
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On 2005-07-09 14:30:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Brat Camp is a show that is doomed for failure. It's reality tv at it's most inane. Seriously, who wants to watch a bunch of so-called bratty teens trekking around the wilderness? Teens themselves won't watch the show leaving the advertisers with no consumer audience.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
"
Unfortunately:
http://www.medialifemagazine.com/News20 ... rsday.html (http://www.medialifemagazine.com/News2005/jul05/jul11/4_thurs/news3thursday.html)
Surprising debut
for ABC's 'Brat Camp'
Reality show averages a 3.8 among adults 18-49
ABC could very well have another summer reality hit, and this one is a bigger surprise than "Dancing With the Stars."
Last night's two-hour debut of "Brat Camp," a show where troubled teens get bundled off to nature camp, averaged a 3.8 rating among viewers 18-49 and 10.28 million total viewers, according to Nielsen overnights.
During the first half hour the show posted a 2.7 rating among 18-49s. But that jumped to a 3.6 at 8:30, then to a 4.3 at 9 and finally to a 4.6 at 9:30, the night?s highest-rated half hour among 18-49s.
All told, the show grew 70 percent from start to finish among adults 18-49.
The final average was not quite as good as the 4.3 18-49 rating and 13.48 million viewers ABC earned for the debut of the surprise hit "Dancing with the Stars," but it's still one of the top premieres of the summer.