Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 25, 2004, 09:20:00 PM
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 25, 2004, 09:20:00 PM
more will be added maybe if we get some more information.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Don Smith on May 26, 2004, 12:36:00 AM
Don't forget
http://melsembler.com (http://melsembler.com)
Don
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 26, 2004, 02:43:00 AM
Although best known as a leading shopping center developer, Sembler is also renowned for his activism in the anti-drug movement. In 1976, Sembler and his wife Betty founded STRAIGHT, an adolescent drug treatment program. During its 17 years of existence, STRAIGHT successfully graduated more than 12,000 young people nationwide from its remarkable program.
Sembler served as Finance Chairman for .....
************************************************* Holy shit he actually puts it on his resume?!
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 26, 2004, 02:44:00 AM
Oh and your name sucks...its too long and makes the entire page lopsided
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 26, 2004, 11:38:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-25 23:43:00, Triumvirate wrote:
"
Although best known as a leading shopping center developer, Sembler is also renowned for his activism in the anti-drug movement. In 1976, Sembler and his wife Betty founded STRAIGHT, an adolescent drug treatment program. During its 17 years of existence, STRAIGHT successfully graduated more than 12,000 young people nationwide from its remarkable program.
Sembler served as Finance Chairman for .....
*************************************************
Holy shit he actually puts it on his resume?!
"
Is this news new to you Therion?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: kpickle39 on May 26, 2004, 12:35:00 PM
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Antigen on May 26, 2004, 01:44:00 PM
Ya' know, FU, if you want to you can edit your handle by putting spaces between words. Long as you log in the same way it should work. Personally, I like the name.
The right to do something does not mean that doing it is right. --William Safire
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: RTP2003 on May 26, 2004, 01:45:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-26 09:35:00, kpickle39 wrote:
"HaHa - this is beautiful. The more sembler sites, the better. Keep it up folks. This is wonderful. Let's ruin the mofo."
I concur.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 26, 2004, 02:07:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-26 08:38:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
Quote
On 2004-05-25 23:43:00, Triumvirate wrote:
"
Although best known as a leading shopping center developer, Sembler is also renowned for his activism in the anti-drug movement. In 1976, Sembler and his wife Betty founded STRAIGHT, an adolescent drug treatment program. During its 17 years of existence, STRAIGHT successfully graduated more than 12,000 young people nationwide from its remarkable program.
Sembler served as Finance Chairman for .....
*************************************************
Holy shit he actually puts it on his resume?!
"
Is this news new to you Therion?"
Yes it is..I have never cared about Melvin enough to read his resume..
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 26, 2004, 03:23:00 PM
?MOLESTATIONS AND RAPISTS??"
What is with the bolded Ms, and the ALL CAPS?
How is this helping? It's completely misleading, and obviously written from a strong biased perspective. We were not all molested and raped! When will someone just report the abuse instead of stretch the truth for dramatic purposes? It just makes it all read like propaganda.
Wes?s site, http://www.thestraights.com (http://www.thestraights.com) is the same way. Written with an incredibly biased tone. I?ve had more people comment on the poor quality of the website?s impression on them, and the chaotic structure of information given, then say anything about the reason for giving the information to them in the first place.
Are we ever going to be able to shed light on this subject in a credible way? Report the facts, or nothing at all! Opinions don?t belong in this war against Sembler and Co. The truth does.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 26, 2004, 05:23:00 PM
[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-27 17:33 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 26, 2004, 10:09:00 PM
"Bad names have played a tremendously powerful role in the history of the world and in our own individual development. They have ruined reputations, stirred men and women to outstanding accomplishments, sent others to prison cells, and made men mad enough to enter battle and slaughter their fellowmen. They have been and are applied to other people, groups, gangs, tribes, colleges, political parties, neighborhoods, states, sections of the country, nations, and races." (Institute for Propaganda Analysis, 1938)
The name-calling technique links a person, or idea, to a negative symbol. The propagandist who uses this technique hopes that the audience will reject the person or the idea on the basis of the negative symbol, instead of looking at the available evidence.
The most obvious type of name-calling involves bad names. For example, consider the following:
Commie Fascist Pig Yuppie Bum Queer Terrorist Or in this case, Rapist-Molester
A more subtle form of name-calling involves words or phrases that are selected because they possess a negative emotional charge. Those who oppose budget cuts may characterize fiscally conservative politicians as "stingy." Supporters might prefer to describe them as "thrifty." Both words refer to the same behavior, but they have very different connotations. Other examples of negatively charged words include:
social engineering radical cowardly counter-culture
The Institute first identified the name-calling technique for Propaganda Analysis (IPA) in 1938. According to the IPA, we should ask ourselves the following questions when we spot an example of name-calling.
What does the name mean?
Does the idea in question have a legitimate connection with the real meaning of the name? Is an idea that serves my best interests being dismissed through giving it a name I don't like? Leaving the name out of consideration, what are the merits of the idea itself?
(In this case it looks like the manipulation of a metaphor.)
Logic is the process of drawing a conclusion from one or more premises. A statement of fact, by itself, is neither logical nor illogical (although it can be true or false).
As an example of how logic can be abused, consider the following argument, which has been widely propagated on the Internet.
Premise 1: Hillary Clinton supports gun-control legislation. Premise 2: All fascist regimes of the twentieth century have passed gun-control legislation. Conclusion: Hillary Clinton is a fascist.
One way of testing the logic of an argument like this is to translate the basic terms and see if the conclusion still makes sense. As you can see, the premises may be correct, but the conclusion does not necessarily follow.
Premise 1: All Christians believe in God. Premise 2: All Muslims believe in God. Conclusion: All Christians are Muslims.
This is a rather extreme example of how logic can be abused. It should be noted that a message can be illogical without being propagandistic -- we all make logical mistakes. The difference is that propagandists deliberately manipulate logic in order to promote their cause, and this harms their credibility.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 26, 2004, 11:01:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-25 21:09:00, GregFL wrote:
"Well, thanks for the post, whoever you are. I have a couple issues with your post even tho they are off topic in this forum.
while your underlying sentiment may be pure, your are loose with the facts. First, 500,000 kids did not go thru Straight, Inc...more like 30,000, maybe less. Second, you are OVERSTATING the abuse endured by Straight Kids, which weakens your credibility. Third, you are calling these people child rapists when in fact, this is hardly true in the literal sense of the word which is the implication of your website. Fourth, you proclaim kids were molested every day in straight which suggests massive sexual abuse when in fact only isolated incidences of this were alleged. Fifth, calling straight a "holocaust" causes others to view you as a wacko. It was not. I suggest you look the term up in the dictionary.
If you mean to suggest Straight was an abusive institution, you have instead come across as a person with an axe to grind that isn't grounded in reality.
I suggest you rework your website taking into carefull consideration accuracy and integrity, then understate your position instead of claiming things that no one will believe and that are lacking in any credibility.
Huh, looks like Greg and I agree.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 26, 2004, 11:47:00 PM
it is not the intent of the website that I have a problem with, it is the reactionary tone and inacuracy of the statements made in the website.
Prisoner of war reparations? Child Rapists? Daily molestations of 500,000 kids?
Mel Sembler is not the Devil and he was not invented by Straight Inc. In fact he was a very wealthy highly respected local businessman prior to his involvement with Straight. His involvement also was on a business level; expansion, funding, etc. He did his job well.. too well in fact, much more so than the predecessor ever did. However, He DID NOT invent the techniques used in The Straight. Fuck, he didn't even know what was going on; instead the techniques were lifted by a handfull of Seedlings and Mrs. Peterman from the Seed. News Flash... Straight, inc. wasn't even his idea and he didn't even form the initial board of directors. It was done by a local dentist that had a kid in the Seed.
I understand feeling fucked over by Straight. I understand trying to call attention to those that still boast about their involvement. I further understand that Mel Sembler is still involved heavily in the government and the drug war at large. For these reasons, attention should be shined in his direction and the truth should be known.
THE TRUTH should be known not a fabricated version of same. Straight was NOT a Holocaust for goodness sake, it was a drug rehab that used mind control and intimidation techniques. It was abusive, not molestive.It was wrong and it caused many people harm, mostly mental anquish.
Mel Sembler is not a child rapist and it is unfair to call him one. Mel Sembler is not a child Molester, Mel Sembler is not "Wanted" and a miriad of other inacurracies posted on that website.
What harm do these inacurracies cause one may ask? One might even argue that any attention in his direction is good. I respectfully disagree.
Those that fight a uphill battle for public recognition of a wrong that is deeply entrenched in our culture must do so from a position of impeccable integrity. When one spews inacurracies and accusations that are easily dismissed as lies and fabrications the entire subject matter loses crediblity and it causes irrepable harm to the credibility of the cause and reverses progress made.
That website, while perhaps well intended, is poisonous to the cause of educating the public on the wrongs of Straight, Inc. and of Mel Sembler. And whoever you are, and I suspect you are a friend of mine, please accept this as constructive criticism and not lashing out.
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-27 12:09 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 27, 2004, 01:15:00 AM
Lies and fabrications discredit each and every one of your stories and experiences. They destroy opportunities to illuminate the truth and cause each of us harm in the future. The do not assist in preventing this abuse from reoccuring over and over again.
Why we all continue to find something to fight about is beyond me. If each of us put as much effort toward putting the truth out there each and every day, maybe others wouldn't feel so desperate to bash Sembler and others with such great rage. This is exactly what they are banking on. That we will all fight against ourselves rather than banding together against them. That we will lash out in rage with false accusations strewn across the web about rape and child molestation. What about the few cases that did occur. This does nothing but discredit those true abuses.
Stop fighting and do something constructive.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: smack on May 27, 2004, 04:34:00 AM
clown face is a righteous wanna be.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 09:31:00 AM
Anon, please send me an email or instant message. I want to discuss something with you in private.
Smack, ah..nevermind.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 09:36:00 AM
And I just saw that Jack Eckerd was a nobody before Straight? COM'N!
Shit, Eckerd College existed even before the Seed and Eckerd Drugs was founded years and years before. Jack Eckerd was a multimillionaire long before Art Barker ever led his first rap and long before Mel Sembler ever first stepped foot in the Seed. In fact, Eckerd Youth camps predate the beginning of the seed.
Lets get some facts, please.[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-27 12:10 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 11:16:00 AM
Hey, I just read http://melsembler.com/ (http://melsembler.com/)
MUCH MUCH BETTER. Thanks for the link Don.
Whoever compiled that from Wes's research, KUDOS. It is done in a factual way and allegations and claims are backed up with documents.
As it should be.....
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-27 08:17 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 27, 2004, 11:26:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-27 08:16:00, GregFL wrote:
"Hey, I just read http://melsembler.com/ (http://melsembler.com/)
MUCH MUCH BETTER. Thanks for the link Don.
Whoever compiled that from Wes's research, KUDOS. It is done in a factual way and allegations and claims are backed up with documents.
As it should be.....
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-27 08:17 ]"
I agree. Easy to follow, sticks to the facts, no biased tone in the writing. Nice work.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Antigen on May 27, 2004, 02:25:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-26 19:09:00, Anonymous wrote:
The difference is that propagandists deliberately manipulate logic in order to promote their cause, and this harms their credibility.
I don't think this is this guy's intent. I think he's just really, really pissed off. I've taken the liberty of making the suggested change to his username (cause so many ppl seem bothered by the layout problems, and that falls under tech admin functions) and I will now go and delete these threads from other forums where they're not germain to the topics. But here, where just about everyone knows the names Sembler, Loenberg and Eckerd, this has sparked an interesting and, imo, worthwhile discussion so I welcome it.
Please print clearly and legiby any and all complaints in the box provided below.
Thanks, The Management
...to disarm the people (is) the best and most effective way to enslave them... -- George Mason
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 27, 2004, 05:19:00 PM
Check. Check. and Check.
[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-27 17:26 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 27, 2004, 06:02:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-27 11:25:00, Antigen wrote:
"
Quote
On 2004-05-26 19:09:00, Anonymous wrote:
The difference is that propagandists deliberately manipulate logic in order to promote their cause, and this harms their credibility.
I don't think this is this guy's intent."
Well if that's the way you feel, why don't you change his website (and his diaper) for him too? He needs your help Ginger, because right now it's all fallacy and lies. Right now, every bit of it is a really bad joke, INCLUDING THE FACT THAT HE CHOOSES TO USE ALL CAPS. So he's pissed?! It's still pollution to the subject at hand. Not to mention, his charming disposition.
Quote
But here, where just about everyone knows the names Sembler, Loenberg and Eckerd
Making that assumption is such a pitiful inaccuracy. What about the rest of the people on the internet?
Quote
But it makes for worthwhile discussion though.
Enjoy your popcorn. :roll:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 07:11:00 PM
Fuck me?
Tell you what big shot..you obviously know who I am..tell me your name, post it here for all to see..just your first name please if you have the guts.
I told you what I thought and kept the personal attacks out. You apparently have no balls to sling insults behind your fake name. Better still, tell me to fuck off to my face. Further, your website is nothing but a pack of lies.
In addition,my website is called the Seed discussion forum. Heard of it? You should, you just posted on it YESTERDAY.
Other than that, I Don't need anotherone, thank you very much, especially one that is nothing but a fabrication of the truth. It might as well be on the UFO thread with the scarcity of facts and painfully obvious lack of rational thought.
Grow up, stop playing adult victim and get some facts.
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-27 16:18 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 27, 2004, 07:54:00 PM
[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-27 17:32 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 08:28:00 PM
Just so you don't misquote me, I never said 30,000 kids were abused in the Straight. I said approx 30,000 kids went thru the program.
You would be hard pressed to find 30,000 people claim they were abused there.
MMMkay?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 08:36:00 PM
Your response changed so fast I barely had time to post before it was entirely different, but...
War time reparations for people placed in straight?
Man, It doesn't get much deeper than that. Good luck. Dude, Okay, lets get on the same page. Your experience in straight sucked. It may have emotionally harmed you, I don't know, I am not you. However, you were not
1) In a war therefore entitled to "war reparations"
2) we not part of a holocoust. You were in a bad place. the Straight was ONE OF MANY BAD PLACES, not the encarnate of Satan's lair on earth.
3) not "raped" or "molested" daily along with 499,000 other people. Overstating this only reduces the tradegy of those few that were Raped or molested during their stays. It was no way embedded in the culture of Straight, to rape and molest people, but occured rather as an incidental causation of an idiotic practice of placing teenagers in bedrooms with other teenagers every night. Those that this happened to don't deserve to have their experience diminished by statements that are lies, like half a million kids were "molested".
Don't take my words as personal attacks. I will always tell you my opinion whether you like it or not. Posting that site anonomously on the seed discussion forum was opening it up to criticism. '
If you cant handle it, don't do it.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 08:38:00 PM
And now your posts have disappeared.
Good.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 27, 2004, 09:03:00 PM
G. writes:
"While your underlying sentiment may be pure, your are loose with the facts. First, 500,000 kids did not go thru Straight, Inc...more like 30,000, maybe less..."
Where is your evidence that only 30,000 children went through all Straights nationally ? I say the number is way higher, and I can back it up from years in 70 to when it shut down all around - there was more than that amount. MMMkay.
"Second, you are OVERSTATING the abuse endured by Straight Kids, which weakens your credibility..."
I am understating alot of the evidence. Look at thestraights.com alone and see the testimonies not only of the harm done to survivors while in the program, but what its done to anybody who doesn't want to remember and hasn't come out of the woodwork yet and can't face what happened to them. Marti Heath said it best: The social and economic strain this puts on the government in the long and short run today is overwhelming. If a person is taught to confront people and spit on them daily, what does this do that person when they get back in society ? What kind of counseling or jail time do you give to that many people who think its right to hurt others in the name of wellbeing ? Every child in Straight was abused. This makes my point clear and clears my point accurately on that website, G. If every child was intaken, held against there will, deceived at intake, and if all were stripped and searched either by an unlicensed staff member or by one who is licensed and some nonlicensed patients - at intake you have every child being abused. If you have at any given time a child being treated as a patient by a patient, then you have every child being abused and molested when it comes down to spit therapy and assault methods. Why did Straight shut down ? Cos of child molesting and child abuse. You stated this without OVERSTATING it. Can you name one child in Straight who was not given therapy by another patient or was not at one point held against their will by a patient without the training to do so ? Its all of it chock full of abuse, G. Perhaps I am overstating my points here.
"Third, you are calling these people child rapists when in fact, this is hardly true in the literal sense of the word which is the implication of your website..."
It has appealed to the part of you at least that I wanted it to. A dictionary might be useful again. You read what you wanted to read and schlepped off the rest of it.
"Fourth, you proclaim kids were molested every day in straight which suggests massive sexual abuse when in fact only isolated incidences of this were alleged. Fifth, calling straight a "holocaust" causes others to view you as a wacko. It was not. I suggest you look the term up in the dictionary."
Weren't you at the protest in Tampa and did you say anything about Betty's credibility and the credibility of the protestors alluding to the Straight Holocaust ? If any child was ever denied privacy to piss or take a dump - its sexually wrong. Taking a shower while others are watching is sexually deviant. Privacy is at least half about sexuality and the rest is probly about respect and the remaining part of privacy is privacy itself. You derived pleasure from picking on others when you were in there, wherever it is that you did time. Just like everyone who tried to play at the Straight game. You never derived pleasure from being an oldcomer and 'knowing more' than the noobcomer ?
I appreciate the constructive criticism. I will look into it and I might be so bold later on to ask more specific questions.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 10:14:00 PM
No, I was not at the protest in tampa. I have retired, at least temporarily, from protests at straight functions, largely due in fact to credibility issues with certain posters. case in point, holding up signs proclaiming "The Straight Holocaust".
I won't be part of that shenanigans. Sorry.
Writing a desertation to me to prove Straight was abusive is singing to the choir. You still have not justified calling these people "child rapists" and using that concurrent with the term "molesters". It is just plain uncredible in my opinion.
Thank you for adjusting your tone. Discussion over disagreements is what makes a forum constructive. This is a lesson that many here don't seem to understand. Disagreeing is very different than personal attacks.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 10:17:00 PM
As far as the numbers that went thru straight, do the math. How many places were open? For how long? the average number in group per year? Now, underestimate that number, not inflate it.
30,000 is an awfull lot. I have estimated the total thru the seed at 10,000 and we had kids in groups as large as 700 and 5 locations. 500,000 is not possible.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 27, 2004, 10:28:00 PM
Speaking of abuse, I did a small stint in Pinellas juvenile. I was stripped searched, had an adult guard make me spread my balls and look up my ass, douced with insecticide and placed in a group cell with dangerous criminals.I had to endure the sounds of masterbating teenagers into the night and sexual inuendo bantered around as threats. The place was dirty and scary. the charge was dropped later...
Do you think I can get some "War reparations" for that humiliation?
Goddamit people, what exactly is it you are fighting here? I have heard some of the most amazing bullshit coming from this group of people that I couldn't even imagine on my own.
There are legitimate fights to be had for sure. Bradbury's is great, an outrageous act to call attention to real abuses. Wes's research has been spread thruout the entire web. Ginger's participation in this cause is rarely spoken of and also UNEQUALED anywhere else. I don't even have the time to tell you how many people she has won over to the side of the truth and she is directly responsible for the terms Mel Sembler, The Seed, Straight, Inc., and many other phrases having negative connotations attached to them on the WWW. THis is real activism, this is real heroism, not fabrication of events and calling your time in rehab a "holocaust".
And this is the side I am on, the truth. To me, people who fabricate and distort what happened are more destructive to this cause than people who are program supporters. I won't be lumped in a group of grown people who act like children and cannot seperate reality from fantasy and fact from fiction.
Grow up, move past your childhood demons, and look at this thing with some clarity and realism for god's sake. If you can't, do everyone a favor and take up a new hobby because you aren't helping this cause with your wild claims and unbelievable tripe.
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-28 06:56 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on May 28, 2004, 12:37:00 AM
Hey GregFL!!
::cheers:: :wave:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 28, 2004, 02:35:00 AM
May 28, 1:57 AM (ET)
RALEIGH, N.C. (AP) - In North Carolina, freedom is worth about $55 a day. Under that formula, the state figures it owes Darryl Hunt nearly $360,000 for the 18 years he spent in prison for a murder he didn't commit.
Hunt, 39, of Winston-Salem was officially exonerated in February of the 1984 murder of newspaper copy editor Deborah Sykes, who was stabbed to death on her way to work. He was granted a pardon in April by Gov. Mike Easley. Hunt was twice convicted of the murder before DNA evidence last year pointed to another suspect, Willard Brown.
"It's an incredible situation he has been put in," Deputy Industrial Commissioner Brad Donovan said Thursday after ordering Hunt's award of $358,545. "This is a minor effort to make it right."
Hunt, who is married, said he'll use the money for his family.
"It's nothing, really," he said. "There is no amount of money that could ever make up for the time I lost in prison. The money don't change the mental torture I went through for 19 years." ::bangin:: > STRAIGHT! :wstupid:
War Reparations? PUH-LEEEZE!!! :rofl:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 28, 2004, 02:39:00 AM
I don't care for what you think nor does your 'truth' mixed with your apathy and synicism and subtle slander matter at all to me. Stay in retirement.
Someone was posting earlier that the creator of Straight was a dentist. I haven't put up Art Barker's pic yet, or the creator of the other joints.
No, I couldn't say you legally deserve wartime reparations or ammendments for displacement and etc. for what you did or didn't do in criminal life. The president didn't get on television with the seal of the presidency waving behind him and back the jail you were in, and you were searched by one trained professional. Perhaps if you suffered undue abuse and hardship from your stay in jail, you can investigate a suit or at least protest the juvi jailhouse cos you know yourself them joints stay packed with curfew breakers and the like.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 28, 2004, 07:58:00 AM
But Greg, didnt you commit a crime to land in the youth facility? See thats different...
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 28, 2004, 09:42:00 AM
Well, the general public thinks you did something wrong by using drugs. This is what I speak of when I say we are trying to change somthing that is deeply embedded in our culture, and we need to do it with integrity or people will dismiss what we are saying and say we are a group of unstable ex addicts.
And No I didn't do anything wrong to end up in Juvy. It is a long story and tied to my stint in the program. It was an attempt to have me thrown back in the program by my father and his friend, Seed parent and co-Straight founder xxx xxxx, chief of police.The charges were summarily dropped before ever going to trial because I refused to go along with their ploy, that is, they wanted to scare me into choosing between Juvy and the program. I stayed at juvy until they had no choice but to drop the charges because they had nothing then I left the St Pete area for good, never to return again until I was 20 years old and safe from that insanity.
You guys, carry on and do whatever you want. Just please understand that not everyone agrees with your methodology or your recovered memories, and many people are scared to speak out because of your history of personal attacks. You need to learn the difference between disagreements and personal attacks.
And I am not retired, I am just retired from doing protests.. I tend to try to do things in a much different manner than your group. So be it.[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-28 06:46 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 28, 2004, 09:55:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-27 23:39:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
"I don't care for what you think nor does your 'truth' mixed with your apathy and synicism and subtle slander matter at all to me. Stay in retirement.
Someone was posting earlier that the creator of Straight was a dentist. I haven't put up Art Barker's pic yet, or the creator of the other joints.
No, I couldn't say you legally deserve wartime reparations or ammendments for displacement and etc. for what you did or didn't do in criminal life. The president didn't get on television with the seal of the presidency waving behind him and back the jail you were in, and you were searched by one trained professional. Perhaps if you suffered undue abuse and hardship from your stay in jail, you can investigate a suit or at least protest the juvi jailhouse cos you know yourself them joints stay packed with curfew breakers and the like."
Are you kidding? Slander? Because I disagree with your methodology? This is the only arrow in your quiver, attack and at the same time claim victim status from those that don't agree with you. Grow up.
"someone" posted earlier that the "Creator" of straight was a dentist...No, someone (me) quoted earlier that it was his idea. Straight was created by a panel of Seed parents including Mel Sembler and, well, you have the list of the rest of the people. All well intended parents very similar to the people that post today on the "teen help industry board". Hell is paved with good intentions....
And as far as the abuses endured in Juvy, the goddamn place is run by the state, what do you mean there was no government endorsement...
Go ahead and push for war reparations and claim Mel Sembler Is a child rapists and a half million kids were molested, but please don't affiliate that effort with anything I am doing.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Antigen on May 28, 2004, 09:55:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-27 15:02:00, Anonymous wrote:
Well if that's the way you feel, why don't you change his website (and his diaper) for him too?
I couldn't even if I wanted to. I don't host it. Don't even know where it's hosted. Didn't even know it existed till dude posted these messages.
No citizen of a liberal and democratic nation profits from a victorious war. --Ludwig von Mises
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 28, 2004, 10:25:00 AM
Timrunvirate, you have adopted this as your new signature:
1977 - "A young man left Straight, went to authorities and reported being beaten at the St. Petersburg warehouse. He hasn't been seen or heard from since."
Now I saw that as well on the Melsembler.com website. It is a very inflammatory statement and if true a horrendous indictement of the actions of straight, Inc. NEVER BEEN SEEN OR HEARD FROM SINCE? Sounds like he was murdered or stored away in a dungeon somewhere, eh?
A great bit of evidence if true, and a very easy way to discredit this effort if not. So lets explore this a bit.
What was his name? Is there documentation? Was he really "never heard from again? in the manner suggested by that sentence, or did he just not complain anymore? What really happened? Can this statement be impeached easily? Is it taken out of context?
You see where I am headed with this? Credibility is hard to get and easy to lose...
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 28, 2004, 12:35:00 PM
I agree with you that its no longer a debate when resorted to slander. 'Grow up' is not a piece of advice, its a piece of shit in a bag waiting to be stomped. One that you put out there.
A debate is plausible and ameable. These type of broad statements leave no room to hear the other things you are trying to say.
On top of that you put in the word 'credibility' and have detracted from what is trying to be done. Then you say you're tired of 'this'.
((And to the Anonymous poster from earlier: that boy who did a stint of 19 years; hasn't he gotten his money yet for false imprisonment and all the other shit that goes with it ? Did the president in office at the time declare a state of emergency and also declare an official War on Murderers ? Warttime Reparations, PUHHleaze ?!? Dude. You get your ::bangin:: Straight first before you step.))
Then you further it by saying you don't want to be a part of it and that you don't understand what is being done here but you keep debating and refuse to stop posting even though you are done with it.
And again, NO your time in Juvee for warttime reparations. The government did not declare a WAR. The president must at least
D E C L A R E
a war for you to receive war pay in incidents like Straight Incorporated.
More: you keep claiming us as victims. I say what we're doing here makes us accountable for others and their responsibilities.
How many others are not on that website just yet ? How many parents should have their pics on there ? Not because they are murderers or full on rapists, but now they have at least some kind of idea that they were near some and approved that kind of behavior by turning their heads to the things they heard on Friday nights in AfterOpenMeeting Raps.[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-28 09:38 ][ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-28 09:39 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 28, 2004, 12:53:00 PM
I told you to "Grow up" after you posted "fuck you GregFL you big fat lazy ass" and then deleted it, and after you posted "suck my dick" to someone on the Seed discusion forum that asked you to correct your name that was interfering with the format on the entire board (and which Ginger had to do on her own because you refused), and after you insulted just about everyone that didn't take up your cause then went back and deleted your words.
My advice still stands...grow up. Stomp on that.
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-28 09:56 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 28, 2004, 12:54:00 PM
?We were not all molested and raped!?
It all depends on the definition that you associate with those words. Legally speaking, we were not all raped in the program, though I think there is a case for molestation (or other related charges). As a society, we generally view rape as, ?force to have sexual intercourse.? (Webster). This definition can cause legal uncertainty. For example, prison inmates that engage in forceful sexual activity are not charged with rape, they are charged with sodomy. You will rarely hear someone say, ?People get sodomized in prison.? You could hear someone say, ?People get raped in prison.? Here are the remaining definitions of rape: ?1, Forcible seizing and violation. 2, carrying off by force. 3, a plant grown for fodder and oil? 2, carry off violently.? (Webster) By these definitions of the word, many were raped in Straight. Molestation comes from the root word molest, which is defined as follows: ?1, trouble; interfere with injuriously. 2, to make improper sexual advances to.? (Webster) I believe you would be hard pressed to find anyone who could claim they were not troubled by Straight.
?When will someone just report the abuse instead of stretch the truth for dramatic purposes? It just makes it all read like propaganda.?
Several media sources have covered the abuse. Many feel they were not as revealing as they should have been. Covering the abuse of Straight with a completely objective eye sounds like something that you have an acute interest in. Perhaps you should begin work on a book. Be forewarned that your involvement with Straight will point toward bias itself. Overcoming bias is one of the most difficult, if not unattainable, goals of the scientific method. After all, if one does not have bias how can one have interest? Much of the information is written in overly strong language; however, that is expected. I don?t mind the strong descriptors, but I am turned off by some of the cruel and outright slander that has taken place on this board. I do realize that these are just certain individuals that take place in such retaliation and that it is not common practice among survivors.
?Wes?s site, http://www.thestraights.com (http://www.thestraights.com) is the same way. Written with an incredibly biased tone. I?ve had more people comment on the poor quality of the website?s impression on them, and the chaotic structure of information given, then say anything about the reason for giving the information to them in the first place.?
Wes is bias. I have never heard anyone claim he wasn?t bias. I also think that Wes and others have good reason to be bias.
I assume that you are trying to get your thoughts across to the educated community. Wes has done some great research, and I?m sure that you have gleaned plenty from it. It is written in strong tone, but his sources are reliable. He has posted his reference material so that you can check it out if you don?t believe him. The book is not even completed and in its final form may have any structural problems corrected. You shouldn?t criticize an unfinished work unless you are doing so to help assist Wes in correcting the problems. Wes has created one of the most informative and credible internet sites on the subject. If you can do a better job, please do. Wes? sight can be used as a great reference. Nothing is a great reference by itself. If you truly want to impress the educational community about this issue, use many references that all say the same thing. Wes? sight is just a good place to start from, not the end all and be all of Straight. Don?t complain that other people have not done what you are supposed to do. If you want less biased information, you need to build interest in someone that was not affiliated with Straight or the drug war in any way. Good luck. As you have already seen, some people just have a problem with this issue. They could use one of many excuses as to why they did not like the information. Some people will never accept what happened at Straight as wrong in any way. You will not convince those people of anything contrary, even if you use top scholarly journals.
?Opinions don?t belong in this war against Sembler and Co. The truth does.?
Don?t you have an opinion?
?Mel Sembler is not the Devil and he was not invented by Straight Inc. In fact he was a very wealthy highly respected local businessman prior to his involvement with Straight. His involvement also was on a business level; expansion, funding, etc. He did his job well.. too well in fact, much more so than the predecessor ever did. However, He DID NOT invent the techniques used in The Straight. Fuck, he didn't even know what was going on; instead the techniques were lifted by a handfull of Seedlings and Mrs. Peterman from the Seed. News Flash... Straight, inc. wasn't even his idea and he didn't even form the initial board of directors. It was done by a local dentist that had a kid in the Seed.?
I would like to know more about this. Where is the information that I can confirm this at? Do you have copies of documents that state and prove this?
?Straight was NOT a Holocaust for goodness sake?
The definitions of holocaust are, ?1, great destruction of life, esp. by fire. 2, (usu. Cap., with the) the systematic killing of Jews in Nazi concentration camps during World War II.? (Webster). Only in the broadest sense could this apply to Straight, and if it is capitalized does not apply at all. I would like to see the usage of this word in correlation with Straight ceased as well.
?Mel Sembler is not a child rapist and it is unfair to call him one. Mel Sembler is not a child Molester, Mel Sembler is not "Wanted" and a miriad of other inacurracies posted on that website.?
These words may cause an inaccurate image of Sembler to come to mind. I do not think that Sembler ever forced a child into sexual intercourse with him. To my knowledge, Sembler never hung out in the cloak room coaxing the children to massage his penis. Sembler is also not on the top wanted list for the FBI or any state investigation agency. According to the definitions I posted earlier these definitions can apply, though they are not the definitions that immediately come to mind. The use of words is accurate, though they are inflammatory.
?Lies and fabrications discredit each and every one of your stories and experiences. They destroy opportunities to illuminate the truth and cause each of us harm in the future. The do not assist in preventing this abuse from reoccuring over and over again.?
Lies and fabrications do harm us. Using strong descriptors does little harm, and is a common practice in persuasion. We just have to be careful not to say things that are false. That has been a problem on this board, especially concerning posts in the Elan forum. If you want to bitch about something bitch about that, not some pissed off survivors using strong descriptors to get their message across. Some of that is needed to gain awareness.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 28, 2004, 01:05:00 PM
Well, you have taken quotes from at least three different people and responded to them..
You obviously were not the author of the website by your writings. If you are comfortable with some of the justifications for using the term Rapists and Molester, than fine. I am not. It is unfair and inaccurate and makes the author look way less than credible.
Do not associate me in any way with the people behind this irresponsible website and counterproductive endeavor.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: ehm on May 28, 2004, 01:07:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-28 10:05:00, GregFL wrote:
"Well, you have taken quotes from at least three different people and responded to them..
You obviously were not the author of the website by your writings. If you are comfortable with some of the justifications for using the term Rapists and Molester, than fine. I am not. It is unfair and inaccurate and makes the author look way less than credible.
Do not associate me in any way with the people behind this irresponsible website and counterproductive endeavor.
"
I second that. :smile:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 28, 2004, 01:17:00 PM
Anon above, you asked some questions about the initial forming of the Straight board. I have inside knowledge of this and there exists an interview that was attended online with Ginger, Wes, Ken, and a handfull of other people with one of the founders. If you want to know more, email me.
Suffice to say that I am very close to that situation.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on May 28, 2004, 10:46:00 PM
Quote
((And to the Anonymous poster from earlier: that boy who did a stint of 19 years; hasn't he gotten his money yet for false imprisonment and all the other shit that goes with it ? Did the president in office at the time declare a state of emergency and also declare an official War on Murderers ? Warttime Reparations, PUHHleaze ?!?
Dude. You get your ::bangin:: Straight first before you step.))
That was me - connectivity probs kept logging me off I suppose. I don't post anonomously on purpose.
And yeah - as far as I know, murder is the top crime in this country next to treason. I don't know if there's been an official declaration of war on murderers - so? I don't get your point.
The point I was trying to make is that WE as a collective Society of Seed/Straight/Legacy program Survivors were not physically or geographically imprisoned for 20+ years. The memories are horrible. There are people suffering with a post traumatic stress disorder to this day - but can we liken our experience with those of the soldiers in WWII (when it was called 'Shell Shock') or VietNam (when PTSD was coined)? I think not. I think it's an entirely different species.
I say that because I know there have been deaths within these programs. I know there have been moments when some of us thought we were going to die - serious stuff. It DOES in some ways parallel that of wrongly convicted felons in penitentiaries and soldiers who witnessed horrible acts of war. But we have it a little better, I think.
Unlike the soldiers, the majority of us did not live in fear of being killed. Unlike the prisoners held on a bogus murder charge - we knew it was only a matter of time til that magic birthday rolled around.
But the memories and the nightmares and the exaggerated startle reflexes continued on into our late 20's and 30's.... somewhat akin to the soldiers and the the falsely accused.
Yes - I can see where we have some commonalities. But leave "War Time Reparations" to those who went to war. Don't equate the few years you were made to live in false confinement to that of someone who lived in false confinement three times as long.
Give credit where credit is due. Respect our soldiers. Respect our people who have lost a lifetime on the inside. And still respect yourself.
::cheers::
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 29, 2004, 02:27:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-28 06:42:00, GregFL wrote:
"Well, the general public thinks you did something wrong by using drugs. This is what I speak of when I say we are trying to change somthing that is deeply embedded in our culture, and we need to do it with integrity or people will dismiss what we are saying and say we are a group of unstable ex addicts.
And No I didn't do anything wrong to end up in Juvy. It is a long story and tied to my stint in the program. It was an attempt to have me thrown back in the program by my father and his friend, Seed parent and co-Straight founder xxx xxxx, chief of police.The charges were summarily dropped before ever going to trial because I refused to go along with their ploy, that is, they wanted to scare me into choosing between Juvy and the program. I stayed at juvy until they had no choice but to drop the charges because they had nothing then I left the St Pete area for good, never to return again until I was 20 years old and safe from that insanity.
You guys, carry on and do whatever you want. Just please understand that not everyone agrees with your methodology or your recovered memories, and many people are scared to speak out because of your history of personal attacks. You need to learn the difference between disagreements and personal attacks.
And Chris, I am not retired, I am just retired from doing protests.. I tend to try to do things in a much different manner than your group. So be it.[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-28 06:46 ]"
Nono I wasnt accusing you man..I did get busted and I did serve time for it and I deserved it..
But I was sent by the state of texas..Convicted in court..
In straight we were not criminals...just kids.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 29, 2004, 03:52:00 AM
GregFL, stop heckling me like you did to start this whole thing off, and I'll grow up or stop acting like some victim or survior or w/e. dig ?
I took back the fuck you's and the lazy retired heckler sincerity, arite, because we'd met. I even took back the suck my dick from the other person, which you sneakily forgot to mention that they deserved it.
Its not my business what you do in your spare time. I just don't care for your sidehanded advice, laced conveniently with your failures. Consider it Constructive Criticism. [ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-29 03:09 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 29, 2004, 08:32:00 AM
Shouldnt your interest be in the seed section anyway Greg?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on May 29, 2004, 08:35:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-28 06:42:00, GregFL wrote:
"Well, the general public thinks you did something wrong by using drugs. This is what I speak of when I say we are trying to change somthing that is deeply embedded in our culture, and we need to do it with integrity or people will dismiss what we are saying and say we are a group of unstable ex addicts.
And No I didn't do anything wrong to end up in Juvy. It is a long story and tied to my stint in the program. It was an attempt to have me thrown back in the program by my father and his friend, Seed parent and co-Straight founder xxx xxxx, chief of police.The charges were summarily dropped before ever going to trial because I refused to go along with their ploy, that is, they wanted to scare me into choosing between Juvy and the program. I stayed at juvy until they had no choice but to drop the charges because they had nothing then I left the St Pete area for good, never to return again until I was 20 years old and safe from that insanity.
You guys, carry on and do whatever you want. Just please understand that not everyone agrees with your methodology or your recovered memories, and many people are scared to speak out because of your history of personal attacks. You need to learn the difference between disagreements and personal attacks.
And Chris, I am not retired, I am just retired from doing protests.. I tend to try to do things in a much different manner than your group. So be it.[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-28 06:46 ]"
Dont you get it? Noones goiing to listen no matter HOW you say what you say.. Because exactly noone gives a fuck except survivors.. I have shown countless people Fagers site etc.. and they dont give a fuck and arent going to give a fuck.
And I dont need you to dictate to me the difference between a personal attack and disagreement. Need I remind you that this is the internet? Not everyone sees things from your righteous perspective. And I am an unstable drug addict :lol: And dont say people are scared to speak out from my personal attacks...the only people around here I have laid into are still here.. Ill say again ..you see things your way, and you arent neccesarily right.. And I dont have "recovered" memories..I saw things the way they happened and the rest I do not remember.. Another thing you werent even in straight at all period. Although the seed may have been its predecessor...it isnt the same.. I dont post on the seed forum blasting peoples memories etc...
_________________
Close your eyes and forget your name Step outside yoruself and let your thoughts drain As you go insane, go insane[ This Message was edited by: Triumvirate on 2004-05-29 05:38 ][ This Message was edited by: Triumvirate on 2004-05-29 05:44 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on May 29, 2004, 03:43:00 PM
You got my comments about someone else confused with you. I was speaking of fuck you Mel & so & so when I said people are scared of attacks. The only part of that post meant for you was the first part.
Other than that, Tirumvirate, you just really don't understand my connection to Straight. I know way more than you understand even tho I personally wasn't there. If you want to know more, Email me and I will explain, but as for now...
This is getting way tiresome. I am moving of this thread for good.
[ This Message was edited by: GregFL on 2004-05-29 12:52 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: animals all of us on May 29, 2004, 09:49:00 PM
good. I was getting tired of your bullshit too Greg. That FuckyouS&E&L was right, you can't type worth a fuck and your nonbiased constructive criticism is full of twisted hypocracies.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 29, 2004, 10:03:00 PM
first you criticise someone for their typing then type "hypocracies". Talk about ironic.
You people are all the same nothing to say but bullshit and attacks. I suppose you were raped as well?
You guys only know how to communicate like you are in a group come down on session.
Greg is right I don't want my name affiliated with you wackos either.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 12:07:00 PM
" Psychologists have a term: "group polarization," which describes the tendency for like-minded people, talking only with one another, to end up believing a more extreme version of what they thought before they started to talk."
:idea:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 01:52:00 PM
On 2004-05-30 09:07:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Psychologists have a term: "group polarization," which describes the tendency for like-minded people, talking only with one another, to end up believing a more extreme version of what they thought before they started to talk."[/i]
Exactly! Here's a perfect example:
Quote
Ill say again ..you see things your way, and you arent neccesarily right..
Well, actually he is right, because he's only explaining that LIES hurt the truth.
Quote
And I dont have "recovered" memories..I saw things the way they happened and the rest I do not remember..
Well then why are you defending a website full of propaganda?
Quote
Another thing you werent even in straight at all period. Although the seed may have been its predecessor...it isnt the same..
Therion... Do your homework. :roll:
Quote
I dont post on the seed forum blasting peoples memories etc...
"Blasting?" That's a program term, speak english! They aren't his memories, they are his exaggerations and aren't true!
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 30, 2004, 02:16:00 PM
Those last two posts ARE whacko. I wouldn't waste time associating you with a group that does good things for the community.
Call it a twelfth step of giving back.
You're not part of this, so stop posting. You're just another silly small pixel heckler like GregFL.
I was physically raped in Straight. What about it motherfucker ?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 02:35:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-30 11:16:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
Call it a twelfth step of giving back.
Had you pegged all along for a twelve stepper...
Quote
I was physically raped in Straight. What about it motherfucker ?"
Real sad if true. Unfortunately, like the boy who cried wolf, I doubt anyone believes anything you fucking say at this point except for your close nit group of wacko buddies.
"Psychologists have a term: "group polarization," which describes the tendency for like-minded people, talking only with one another, to end up believing a more extreme version of what they thought before they started to talk."
You are living proof of the accuracy of this statement.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 03:44:00 PM
what the hell????
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 03:45:00 PM
Next...
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 03:45:00 PM
how many posts is it gonna take to fix this?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 30, 2004, 03:52:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-30 11:16:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
"Those last two posts ARE whacko. I wouldn't waste time associating you with a group that does good things for the community.
Call it a twelfth step of giving back.
You're not part of this, so stop posting. You're just another silly small pixel heckler like GregFL.
I was physically raped in Straight. What about it motherfucker ?"
Yes, I know that went on. Confessions of rape went on also, and no one was held accountable. It's terrible, but not accurate to make generalizations. You should write your own personal story, and have it published, and not waste your time creating propagandist appearing websites.
Quote
You're not part of this
Oh, yes I am. :wave:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on May 30, 2004, 05:46:00 PM
What's happened to this thread? It's a mess!
... and I ain't just talkin' 'bout the conversation if ya know what I mean! ::noway:: Bad news.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 31, 2004, 09:02:00 PM
I guess you weren't raped in Straight.
Would you like us to put your picture up there ? Send any pics of yourself to http://www.boycottsembler.com (http://www.boycottsembler.com)
So, I welcome the case. You and I both know that if Sembler's or anyone else's attorney's come looking for forgiveness in a court of law that you, I hope, would testify as to whatever was done to you while at Straight or any other institution. This is because even though you may not agree with some of the things on that site that people put there - at least you personally are aware of the things that happened in Straight if not more than what you allude to.
Actually, I haven't gotten around to putting Reagan's and the Bush's family portraits in there yet. Good intuition, though.[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-31 18:09 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on May 31, 2004, 09:12:00 PM
"Keep quiet before you get us in trouble !"
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 31, 2004, 09:32:00 PM
you have asinine misunderstanding of the law. If someone sues you for libel and can demonstrate you made a statement that is potentially libelous, the burden swithes to you to defend your statemnt in a court of law.
All other statements are irrevelant and inadmissable including "survivors" complaints about abuse and cultic mind control.It just isn't germain to the issue of Rape and molestation. You are then burdened with prooving he MOLESTED 500,000 children and is a child rapist. The judge will determine the meaning of rapist and will likely use the term in its most common usage.
You are fucked, and rightly so, and this time for real not in your imagination.
Threatening to put Sarah's picture up on your website (the threat made to two people in this thread that disagreed with you) only further indicates your lack of character. I have just now for the first time reviewed this thread and looked up your other posts. You have an emotional problem or worse. Seek help with a competent therapist before you hurt yourself or someone.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on May 31, 2004, 09:36:00 PM
And Sembler won't be in Court Seeking forgiveness, he will be seeking your ass on a platter, and I think this one he will win.
And you not only lose, you hurt everyone who actually has worked hard on this issue. You come dancing in only you are way off the beat and are cronically tone deaf.
"pardon me sir, but your an asshole"
From Ferris bullers day off.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on May 31, 2004, 11:05:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-31 18:02:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
"I guess you weren't raped in Straight.
This is true - but this is not about me. I said if this is truly your situation, then I sympathize.
Quote
Would you like us to put your picture up there ? Send any pics of yourself to http://www.boycottsembler.com (http://www.boycottsembler.com)
My "pattering" is about exactly what you just said - a libel case would score points if the author had ABSOLUTELY NO GROUNDS - you have absolutely no grounds that the Semblers and Lobenburg are child rapists. Unless you have evidence that these three carried out a sexual assault on a child - THEY are not the rapists.
My profession is irrelvant - any literate person can read the law.
Quote
So, I welcome the case. You and I both know that if Sembler's or anyone else's attorney's come looking for forgiveness in a court of law that you, I hope, would testify as to whatever was done to you while at Straight or any other institution. This is because even though you may not agree with some of the things on that site that people put there - at least you personally are aware of the things that happened in Straight if not more than what you allude to.
I would testify to what I witnessed in LIFE, since I was not at STRAIGHT. And yes, I would concur that abuses at both programs were horrible. But when you, me or a collection of all of us start "Witch Hunting" and accusing everyone in sight of crimes they haven't committed, we all look like a bunch of idiots.
Finally, I will say you are obviously extremely angry - which is understandable. You're letting this consume you, though - and that isn't healthy. Yes, fight for what's right - but fabricating wrongs isn't the way to do it.
_________________ "If you always do what you've always done, you always get what you always got"
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on May 31, 2004, 11:10:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-31 18:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
"you have asinine misunderstanding of the law. If someone sues you for libel and can demonstrate you made a statement that is potentially libelous, the burden swithes to you to defend your statemnt in a court of law.
All other statements are irrevelant and inadmissable including "survivors" complaints about abuse and cultic mind control.It just isn't germain to the issue of Rape and molestation. You are then burdened with prooving he MOLESTED 500,000 children and is a child rapist. The judge will determine the meaning of rapist and will likely use the term in its most common usage.
You are fucked, and rightly so, and this time for real not in your imagination.
Threatening to put Sarah's picture up on your website (the threat made to two people in this thread that disagreed with you) only further indicates your lack of character. I have just now for the first time reviewed this thread and looked up your other posts. You have an emotional problem or worse. Seek help with a competent therapist before you hurt yourself or someone.
"
Or maybe I should have just said what you said! :wave:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 01:12:00 AM
Its truly funny how humans like yourself project your needs onto others. That you have yet to seek professional counseling for your issues, you know I wish I could help. Our causes here are not about finding or raising monies for people like yourself to finally get the counseling and help they need, its about bringing Melvin and his kind to justice.
The reason Melvin and his kind will never press a suit is simply because, and I repeat myself here, nowhere in that sight does it legally call Sembler or anyone there are Child Rapist. Also, it does not say anywhere that Sembler or anyone Raped 500,000 children.
I made the flyer, but I did not make the website. We will not take it down. It is factual and makes truth on several long awaited issues.
The only part you have been right about is that I'm angry. And this type of anger is good. Letting it become me and consume me only makes me bigger. I use it to think about how to bring down criminals.
That I have no control over your projections of lack of mental fortitude and psychiatric aid is not good. I wish that I could help you with that.
As far as projecting your ignorance of composition you can refer back to the factual and honest website which is what all this is about:
"These three, unregistered, federal criminals are wanted in connection with the daily molestations of more than 500,000 children."
IN CONNECTION. And if you look up your most common meaning of this term, you will find what is available to any judge and what was already available to you before you forgot to do your research and check yourself into a clinic recently.
Child Rapists. Hell, I ain't done. They did alot more than take money to have children raped and siphoned off. Where will we stop. I don't think we will.[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-05-31 22:23 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: smack on June 01, 2004, 01:49:00 AM
I think the website is great. A "survivor" of straight who said this shit is enough, I'm holding the people who are responsible to be made known. I'm sure everyone has their own story but to say melvin sembler created straight, got others to join as "officers" and "directors" got the president to endorse it, got grant money from the taxpayers to start it up, pay himself and his people.. well the asshole deserves to be on a website with his picture and co-conspirators. He is a monster of our society. boycotting his efforts to get more money from the people sounds like a great idea. Why support such a poor example of a leader? let the truth be known and the stories be told.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 01, 2004, 08:11:00 AM
Who is supporting Mel Sembler? He is on websites, for example..Mel Sembler.com. you hear anyone complaining about that? There are just many people who don't think lies hurt the effort. What is so hard about understanding that? Amazing how your close nit Tampabay group of whackos support each other Smack regardless of how outlandish the tales are.
If you think bullshit lies are helping you by all means endorse this crap.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 01, 2004, 08:12:00 AM
and know FYMS is saying "we" when he refers to the site. Tell me, what group is behind this thing...ISAC? Safety? Please identify yourself and take pride in your work.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 02:54:00 PM
To this last ANONYMOUS post:
Please identify yourself fully and take pride in your posts. Leave an address and a phone number as well, so that we may contact you personally and reward you for your most excellent posts.
There are no lies that anyone has told on the website. Your training at Straight Inc. and life in general are working. The sarcasm entangled with sharp confrontation is really showing. Wow. All that time I thought you were 'moving on' and 'letting it go'. At least, that's what I see you keep telling everyone in all your other posts while you minimize the abuses down to chalking it up to yesterdays' fun.
I know you wish you were back there, because all these 'lies' about Straight and Melvin are just outrageous and it wouldn't hurt you one bit to be back in there where you got the only love you will ever really know cos your family disowned you cos they were to busy with other more important things.
In the meantime; thanks smack for seeing the site in that it is intended to rouse emotion. There are several, or a few who claim to be several, who don't like it because it puts the true perspective about what happened in Straight.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Antigen on June 01, 2004, 03:10:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-31 18:02:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
So, I welcome the case. You and I both know that if Sembler's or anyone else's attorney's come looking for forgiveness in a court of law that you, I hope, would testify as to whatever was done to you while at Straight or any other institution. This is because even though you may not agree with some of the things on that site that people put there - at least you personally are aware of the things that happened in Straight if not more than what you allude to.
Ok then! Will you please put your name to this? It would simplify things greatly, I think.
Instead of giving money to fund colleges to promote learning, why don't they pass a Constitutional Amendment prohibiting anybody from learning anything? If it works as good as the Prohibition one did, why, in five years we would have the smartest race of people on earth. --Will Rogers
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Antigen on June 01, 2004, 03:28:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-30 09:07:00, Anonymous wrote:
"" Psychologists have a term: "group polarization," which describes the tendency for like-minded people, talking only with one another, to end up believing a more extreme version of what they thought before they started to talk."
::cheers::
I think this is the absolute core issue here on the part of both extremes. Let's take the rape allegation, for example since that's the one that ppl seem to key on the most in this thread. When I see that sort of statement, I parse it this way.
I have heard numerous times and I do believe that some clients were raped in the Program; either by other clients or by staff or even, possibly, staff parents.
We all know that the Semblers and other ppl in charge of the Program(s) must have heard the same things, we even have documentation of their having been informed formally by way of the press and/or the justice system.
We all know that Sembler and at least some of his affiliates continue to brag, even to this day, about what they did wrt the Program all those years ago.
The person or people who published that website obviously hold the ppl they name personaly responsible for these rapes and other abuses; moreso because the sadistic SOBs (in my opinion, of course) have the audacity to brag about what they've done. (am I misquoting or misrepresenting? Leme know, I don't mean to)
The Semblers, Eckerds, Loenbergs (et al, ad nauseum) simply do not believe that any rapes or other abuses ever took place. How do they manage to not know that their programs, of which they are so proud, were and are horribly abusive? Just exactly the same way that the other group remains sincerely convinced that they are and were very much aware of the abuses.
Group polarization is, I believe, the best explanation for it that I've seen to date. The Semblers & Assc. simply surround themselves w/ people who will not challenge their self serving image of what they have done. Same w/ the other group.
The trouble is that the Semblers' lawyers don't give a flyin' run at a rollin doughnut what anyone means by these assignations. They're going to hold the authors accountable for the legal definitions of precisely what they have said.
Ya'll are right, I think, that these inflamatory statements tend to hurt the truth and our credibility as a group. But I hope you'll agree that beating the questions around openly like this has probably clarified the issue just a little, at least for some ppl.
When he [Califano] claims that the voters of Arizona and California did not know what they were voting for when they supported the two initiatives, he reminds me of the way Serbia's President Slobodan Milosevic reacted to recent election results in that country. -- George Soros -- Sunday, February 2 1997; Page C01 The Washington Post
_________________ Ginger Warbis ~ Antigen Seed sibling `71 - `80 Straight South (Sarasota, FL) 10/80 - 10/82 Anonymity Anonymous It is wrong to leave a stumbling block in the road once it has tripped you.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 03:55:00 PM
guess this means we can all go to baywalk and watch a movie on the backs of children. Lets buy some land from Sembler Corp., they have great deals. Say, lets go to the Holocaust Museum and make donations in the name of Sembler & Loebenberg. Hell, for that matter - I think I know some people who have first hand training in the arts of opening up child camps for commerce. They've been posting here like Sembler would if him and his attorney's knew or cared anything about the efforts of survivors. We should just go and fucking re-open Straight Incorporated w/ ol' Sembler's blessings. Jeez, the guy is a bloody god around here.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 03:56:00 PM
"Keep quiet, we don't want any trouble!"
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on June 01, 2004, 04:35:00 PM
First off as bad as Straight was Baywalk has nothing to do with it. Jesus Christ, Mel Sembler has made 10s of millions of dollars as a land developer, one of the premier developers in the nation independent of his involvement with Straight Inc and DFAF. You got some evidence Baywalk was built "off the backs of kids" or is this just more fantasy of yours?
Better stay out of every strip shopping mall in Florida because he has developed most all of them. Oh yeah, Home Depot too, because he has built them as well.
Fuck while you are at it, stop shopping at eckerd drugs, or even for that matter stop doing any business with any republican because it is all just a big giant conspiracy along with the aliens to make money off kids backs. Every dime ever made by a republican was due to straight.
Maybe we can settle all your problems once and for all....STRAIGHT DID IT!!!
Got mental illness today....Straight did it. Got no job.....straight did it. Got no life......straight did it. Got a drug habit.......straight again. Can't talk without arguing....ITS THAT GODDAMN STRAIGHTS FAULT AND FUCK YOU AND SUCK MY DICK.
(note: this is sarcasm)
ps, Ginger, you nailed it baby!!!
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 04:53:00 PM
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on June 01, 2004, 05:00:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-06-01 11:54:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
"To this last ANONYMOUS post:
Please identify yourself fully and take pride in your posts. Leave an address and a phone number as well, so that we may contact you personally and reward you for your most excellent posts.
And once again you are threatening this anon because he/she doesn't agree with your actions. If I was moderating this forum, I would ban your IP for life for your behavior, and not just with this handle with all of them coming from your IP.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 07:20:00 PM
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: smack on June 01, 2004, 07:50:00 PM
Greg, you are a dumb ass. First of all how did Sembler get the start up money for Straight? By grants from the government that let it slide that he was experimenting with children without their consent. Secondly, Mel made a shitload of money off of your parents and others who contributed to some "great cause" to help kids. Mel Sembler used money from abusing children and from a growing familiarity in the public eye to buy land, make deals and build these places like Baywalk. people have supported him, whether they knew the evil truth about his methods or not. Hell yeah boycott the bitch's strip malls and Baywalk, those stores who rent from him will get the idea. People won't support him. People won't allow him in their community.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on June 01, 2004, 08:49:00 PM
Really, you guys claim Sembler used Straight money for baywalk, eh. Interesting theory.
Show me or stop spewing nonsense. You have yet to show Sembler personally made a dime off Straight. Go ahead, show us or admit your ideas are mere theories and stop stating as fact things you have little or no evidence of.
Some of your claims 500,000 kids in the Straight all molested. Baywalk built by Straight Money. Sembler is a child rapist Eckerd was a nobody before Straight.
and on and on and on with nothing to back it up. Your fact book is crap and your arguments consist of personal attacks. What a bore your guys are and you don't intimidate me at all. In fact, call me and tell me what you really think. You guys got my number.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 09:40:00 PM
Who is Greg Sembler ?
While you figure this out and figure out who GregFL is, too, go to:
In the meantime, what are you doing besides monitoring a boring forum for lackies of the drug war, and sitting on your ass taking up space making claims on your jealousy while everyone else is doing something about your enemy ?
All these pixels are boring. Greg, did your dad, Melvin, find out you're gay yet ? I want to hear you bark some more. I love having meat and making sleeping dogs bark.
I hope more people hop on the bandwagon. All that talk about this site is actually enjoyable. Keep em coming yall.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on June 01, 2004, 09:43:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-06-01 16:50:00, smack wrote:
"Greg, you are a dumb ass. First of all how did Sembler get the start up money for Straight? By grants from the government that let it slide that he was experimenting with children without their consent. Secondly, Mel made a shitload of money off of your parents and others who contributed to some "great cause" to help kids. Mel Sembler used money from abusing children and from a growing familiarity in the public eye to buy land, make deals and build these places like Baywalk. people have supported him, whether they knew the evil truth about his methods or not. Hell yeah boycott the bitch's strip malls and Baywalk, those stores who rent from him will get the idea. People won't support him. People won't allow him in their community.
Really, Straight was STARTED with government grants? Really? Please link me to evidence of this.
Mel made money off my parents? You know this also? Really? Please tell me how you know this is true.
And Sembler "used money off abusing kids to buy land?
Show me your evidence of this also.
Or, are you just spewing conjecture and suppositions again at the same time insulting people?
I won't stoop to your level and state the obvious...
Activism isn't using a shotgun blindfolded, it is using a sniper rifle with a scope....
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 01, 2004, 10:08:00 PM
Quote
Ok then! Will you please put your name to this? It would simplify things greatly, I think.
Go to http://411.org/ (http://411.org/) type in boycottsembler.com and the name of the webmaster comes up there.
Name, address the whole kit n kabotle.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 01, 2004, 10:34:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-06-01 18:40:00, Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg wrote:
In the meantime, what are you doing besides monitoring a boring forum for lackies of the drug war, and sitting on your ass taking up space making claims on your jealousy while everyone else is doing something about your enemy ?
All these pixels are boring. Greg, did your dad, Melvin, find out you're gay yet ? I want to hear you bark some more. I love having meat and making sleeping dogs bark.
I hope more people hop on the bandwagon. All that talk about this site is actually enjoyable. Keep em coming yall."
:wstupid:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 01, 2004, 11:46:00 PM
Awe, the little survivors got their diapers soggy again.
So, Greg Sembler, what are we to do with you ?
You continually advocate and heckle that you are tired of everything and wouldn't want to have Anything to do with it, and you are retired.
And yet you keep mumbling and posting.
There was some posting early on about the psychology of a group of people that are closed with one another and the effect is that their take on any situation is so far gone and limited that it begins to have no baring on reality or fact.
I agree with this truthful statement. It seems that all the anonymous postors, and GregFL have been so long up in this thing and become so tired of themselves - that you have forgotten what happened to you and how crazy it made you. 'Let's move and keep quiet before we get in trouble'.
Greg, the website that you are getting all pussy about makes no claims for what you are talking about. It was intended to bring you out of your retirement. You are more than scared because you are afraid there is nothing more you can do. The 'time to be silent' cos you are tired, is the time for fresh ideas man. Not time to tell people you are tired. Suck it up dude, I feel your pain and fear as much as anyone.
You who want nothing to do with activism for its own sake, and for survivors, can slander those who want to do it all you want. It brings serious doubts up who you are working for and what your causes are. That you have heckled and abused the abused is very odd indeed. "we want nothing to do with this". That's your prerogative. I know you would call what Richard Bradbury did a crime and say its over the top and what he did was wrong. I guess Fager must be wrong in his ways too. For that matter, by your own posts, why the hell even bother protesting or getting out of the chair next to the computer at all ?!?
Thank you for changing the margins back to the way I had them. I like it like that.
Bark some more people. [ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-06-01 20:47 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on June 02, 2004, 12:34:00 AM
Richard is also a personal friend of mine. You guys are just stupid. I am totally done with you and this thread. I hope you get your asses sued off, you deserve it.
DONE.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 02, 2004, 02:29:00 AM
Are you sure
that
you're
DONE ?!?
'you guys are just stupid.'
At least that's the first time your bark is not masked with crap and lace. Its just a good old fashioned bark not deceived as 'constructive criticism' or an 'I knowbetter than you'.
Stupid I may be, but what does that make you ?
Ooops. Almost forgot....go to http://www.boycottsembler.com (http://www.boycottsembler.com) and stop shopping @ places involved w/ Sembler.
[ This Message was edited by: Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg on 2004-06-01 23:33 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 02, 2004, 10:57:00 AM
Fuck You Sembler & Eckerd & Loebenberg,
Greg is a friend of mine! Your completely wrong about him! He has helped many people become whole again, including me. He is very level headed and very successful in business too.
Now I understand your feelings about Sembler and company. I feel the same, however what you said in your website is incorrect. They may be facilitators of abuse but nothing more. You called them child rapist? I tend to agree with Greg, get ready to be sued. I hope you have a few extra bucks lying about because you will need them, just ask Richard. The Semblers won?t play games with you, they have plenty of money to deal with slander, so get ready or make your site accurate.
And again, I understand you?re pissed, and I agree we all should be paid, and the Semblers should be in jail, but not this way. Your site just makes you seem crazy.
Greg keep up your great post. Your usually correct and it?s always interesting.
VSP
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on June 02, 2004, 11:16:00 AM
Thank you, VSP - I was beginning to question my sanity! ::ftard::
Well, no - not really! :wave:
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Fuck You Sembler & Ec on June 02, 2004, 12:57:00 PM
I'm with GregFL. I'm tired of this bullshit.
The site stays. When it gets sued, you can say 'I told you so'.
But until then; visit http://www.boycottsembler.com (http://www.boycottsembler.com)
In the meantime while you are buying properties from Sembler, and going to centro Ybor to have a coffee on the backs of children...
try to think of other places that should be boycotted that Sembler owns, boycottsembler wants to put it on its site.
peace.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 02, 2004, 03:08:00 PM
sorry, I can't boycott Eckerd's. They have the best deals on u-100's.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 02, 2004, 04:12:00 PM
no to mention discounted Viagra! Those program fuckers got viagra, penis pumps, edible condoms and all sorts of goodies.
Party, party..
::birthday::
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 03, 2004, 10:13:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-05-30 10:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
" On 2004-05-30 09:07:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Psychologists have a term: "group polarization," which describes the tendency for like-minded people, talking only with one another, to end up believing a more extreme version of what they thought before they started to talk."[/i]
Exactly! Here's a perfect example:
Quote
Ill say again ..you see things your way, and you arent neccesarily right..
Morli why must you always do this from an anon standpoint
Well, actually he is right, because he's only explaining that LIES hurt the truth.
Quote
And I dont have "recovered" memories..I saw things the way they happened and the rest I do not remember..
Well then why are you defending a website full of propaganda?
Quote
Another thing you werent even in straight at all period. Although the seed may have been its predecessor...it isnt the same..
Therion... Do your homework. :roll:
Quote
I dont post on the seed forum blasting peoples memories etc...
"Blasting?" That's a program term, speak english! They aren't his memories, they are his exaggerations and aren't true!
"
Why must you always criticize me anon, Morli? You are the only person with the flagrant rolly eye e mote..
That website is not mine and I dont know why you are associating me with it. I could give a shit about the web site.
Do my homework? On GregFl? Why the fuck would I do that ? I dont know him...and dont really want to. I just thought I had read a post that he was from the seed.
I wasnt defending anyone but peoples right to say what they want...
And you are a liar yourself, you know it and I know it.
And once again thats not my web site...I dont know the people that posted it here nor the creators of it..and furthermore I dont give a shit..
Its their business if they wanna put that shit up on the net let them do it and let them deal with the consequences of their actions.
Spare us the whole "Destructive Rehab Child Crusader" act, Morli. You dont do jack shit for any cause. :roll: Save that crap for someone that doesnt know better. Your credibility is shit and thats why you confront me as anon. Grow the fuck up with your internet drama queen bullshit..It got old a loooong fucking time ago..
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Triumvirate on June 03, 2004, 10:14:00 AM
Why must you always criticize me anon, Morli? You are the only person with the flagrant rolly eye e mote..
That website is not mine and I dont know why you are associating me with it. I could give a shit about the web site.
Do my homework? On GregFl? Why the fuck would I do that ? I dont know him...and dont really want to. I just thought I had read a post that he was from the seed.
I wasnt defending anyone but peoples right to say what they want...
And you are a liar yourself, you know it and I know it.
And once again thats not my web site...I dont know the people that posted it here nor the creators of it..and furthermore I dont give a shit..
Its their business if they wanna put that shit up on the net let them do it and let them deal with the consequences of their actions.
Spare us the whole "Destructive Rehab Child Crusader" act, Morli. You dont do jack shit for any cause. :roll: Save that crap for someone that doesnt know better. Your credibility is shit and thats why you confront me as anon. Grow the fuck up with your internet drama queen bullshit..It got old a loooong fucking time ago..
****************
Me
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 03, 2004, 12:25:00 PM
Quote
On 2004-05-30 10:52:00, Anonymous wrote:
" On 2004-05-30 09:07:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Psychologists have a term: "group polarization," which describes the tendency for like-minded people, talking only with one another, to end up believing a more extreme version of what they thought before they started to talk."[/i]
Exactly! Here's a perfect example:
Quote
Ill say again ..you see things your way, and you arent neccesarily right..
Well, actually he is right, because he's only explaining that LIES hurt the truth.
Quote
And I dont have "recovered" memories..I saw things the way they happened and the rest I do not remember..
Well then why are you defending a website full of propaganda?
Quote
Another thing you werent even in straight at all period. Although the seed may have been its predecessor...it isnt the same..
Therion... Do your homework. :roll:
Quote
I dont post on the seed forum blasting peoples memories etc...
"Blasting?" That's a program term, speak english! They aren't his memories, they are his exaggerations and aren't true!
"
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 03, 2004, 09:22:00 PM
Morli this, Morli that, how about get a life???
Jesus fucking Christ?
What the Fuck?
The focus here is SEMBLER????
Are you stupid or brain dead? Or both????
Why don't you take your med's now and beer and nod off for awhile?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 04, 2004, 12:20:00 AM
because its always about him in case you haven't noticed. He is a narcissistic little shit that can't control his urges or his potty mouth.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 04, 2004, 03:39:00 AM
Eckerds expensive!!!Stocks falling fast. Wallgreens much better price and selection.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Anonymous on June 04, 2004, 10:41:00 PM
Do they sell ziz-zags?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Antigen on June 05, 2004, 06:48:00 PM
One of Eckerd's other business interests: http://teenadvocatesusa.homestead.com/MikeyW.html (http://teenadvocatesusa.homestead.com/MikeyW.html)
I avoid Eckerd drug stores if at all possible because I don't want their competition to fail, leaving me w/ no alternative but to depend on this corporation for the products they sell.
Water what you want to grow.
None of Nature's landscapes are ugly so long as they are wild. -- John Muir
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: B.A.D. on June 05, 2004, 07:33:00 PM
I'm a happy camper today. First Eckerd, and now Reagan. I would be indebted to any man if they had planned this. I would follow that person unquestionably probably.
In the meantime, I have a business aquaintance who is webmaster for Eckerd Drugs. Puts me in a strange position somehow.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on June 06, 2004, 07:47:00 AM
I've heard a bunch of people say that Eckerd's is going under. Any definite word about this?
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Scarstruck on June 06, 2004, 08:08:00 AM
Who gives a fuck about eckerd? They dont even sell clean needles..they deserve to go out of business.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Scarstruck on June 06, 2004, 08:09:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-06-03 21:20:00, Anonymous wrote:
"because its always about him in case you haven't noticed. He is a narcissistic little shit that can't control his urges or his potty mouth.
"
Time to bite the bullet, coward...Your ridicuous little opinion has been noted. :lol: How about you get a name...then I may listen to you although thats gonna be a long shot. Still nice to know I have the power to make you angry...at least for now Im alive inside of you, and I grow faster than a tapeworm.
_________________ This is what you see Deep inside of me Agony is life Lechery is life Godlessness is life Purgatory magnified In fire baptized :: [ This Message was edited by: Scarstruck on 2004-06-06 05:12 ] :lol: [ This Message was edited by: Scarstruck on 2004-06-06 05:18 ][ This Message was edited by: Scarstruck on 2004-06-06 05:19 ]
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Scarstruck on June 06, 2004, 08:11:00 AM
Quote
On 2004-06-04 19:41:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Do they sell ziz-zags?"
Thats a negatory boss.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Scarstruck on June 06, 2004, 08:16:00 AM
Narcissus Narcosis
Am I sorry your sky went black, put your knives in babies backs? Am I sorry you killed the Kennedy's and Huxley too?
But I'm sorry Shakespeare was your scapegoat and your apples sticking into my throat Sorry your Sunday smiles are rusty nails and your crucifixion commercials failed but I'm just a pitiful anonymous
And I see all the young believers Your target audience I see all the old deceivers we all just sing their song
Am I sorry to be alive putting my face in the beehive? Am I sorry for Booth and Oswald, pinks and cocaine too?
I'm sorry you never check the bag in my head for a bomb and my halo was a needle hole I'm sorry I saw a priest being beaten and I made a wish but I'm just a pitiful anonymous
And I see all the young believers Your target audience I see all the old deceivers we all just sing their song we all just sing their song
"the valley of death we are free your father's your prison you see"
And I see all the young believers Your target audience I see all the old deceivers we all just sing their song
you're just a copy of an imitation
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: GregFL on June 07, 2004, 09:06:00 PM
Eckerd drugs was recently sold to CVS drugs.
Shop with impunity.
Title: 66.49.156.32 new website.
Post by: Helena Handbasket on June 08, 2004, 01:01:00 AM