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Messages - Evil WWASP

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1
Quote from: "Whooter, John David Reuben?"
I agree for the most part. But if a kid screws up and is on restriction or whatever then maybe he doesnt join the pizza party or ice cream social.

Quote from: "Maximillian/Suck it WWASPie staff/parent whose name was leaked by Well proxied"
But when I think of all the people around the world starving right now, they would consider the punishment diet a great feast, so it's all relative. It's all relative, since we are all used to getting great food in any quantity we want. So for me to complain about the diet makes me feel spoiled , out of touch with the real world, so I don't think it was an issue really. I'd rather be in a program getting a bean burrito, than in Africa starvinv to death wishing for anything to eat.

Here are two sample, off topic, derailing posts made by trolls in this thread. John David Reuben(whooter's real life identity, it's said) derails by changing the topic to that of whether its wrong to refuse youth opprotunity to attend "ice cream socials on restriction" instead of ongoing degradation through being given disgusting, poor quality, innutritious or hard to digest foods. This was deliberate as Reuben was corrected regarding the topics' nature multiple times. WWASP parent/staff, maximillian/suck it, derails this thread by turning the topic into that of whether youth have the right to complain about being fed poorly when there are people dying from starvation in africa, invalidating abuse.

So, the topic of punishment diets is turned into how kids don't have the right to complain about being fed poorly, and whether its wrong to deny them the right to participate in"pizza night."(which is infantalizing and abusive anyway, considering the context) Whooter and WWASP mom repeat their message for two pages, derailing the original topic.

Their posts are the relentless, play-book, insulting, techniques of derailment and trolling that drive off survivors, and the sort of posts that moderation should be used to stop.

I alerted a moderator to these posts. They will not be deleted. Sadly, it seems that fornits is the "same' ol", plus new unnescessary cencorship. I had hoped for better, though understand the mods, dealing with a lot of stress, do their best as they see fit.

2
Open Free for All / Re: New Fornits Rules/Constitution [Ratified]
« on: September 14, 2010, 10:02:12 PM »
Quote from: "Whooter"
Quote from: "Anne Bonney"


So?  You say this a lot too.  We hear you each time.  The abuse there isn't systemic, as it is in LGAT using programs such as HLA and ASR.

We hear each other each time.  It is repeated because we both disagree with each other and reiterate our points for clarification purposes.  I dont think abuse in programs are systemic.  I know that you do.


Quote
Problem is, as I said...HLA was shut down amidst abuse and lawsuits and ASR has no place "treating" anyone who truly has problems since they admit that they provide no treatment at all.

I have never read where ASR stated they dont provide treatment.  If you read the argument the lawyer stated that a specific school did not provide treatment to a specific child.  At some schools (ASR was one) the parents had an option of having their child see and independent therapist.  If the parents opted out of this then Aspen would not be providing this child treatment in this area.
But we can go back and forth with the wording.  But getting back to the boys suicide, in my opinion it is very unlikely that his time at ASR had anything to do with this.  It occurred years after-wards and may have been caused by many other variables.  I think many like yourself would like to tie it back to the school but I don't see how that could be done.  The boys mother was dying at the time, I believe, I am sure this could be a bigger factor.


Quote
Again, you don't have a problem with someone making their living off the death of their child, even going to extent of using the obituary for the poor kid to do it.....I do.

He started a non profit, Anne.  Some people run for cancer if their mother or loved one dies and help raise money for treatment.  Some start non profits to raise money to get others help when they cant afford it.  You are reading things into this person motive in my opinion.



...

All that has to be proved to show John D Reuben mudered his son is that did the following to him:
have him kidnapped (http://www.nospank.net/labi.htm) held prisoner,
held prisoner (http://www.cafety.org/privately-funded- ... april-2005)
held prisoner withou without due process (http://www.teenadvocatesusa.org/FrontPage.html)
held prisoner incommunicado (http://www.insidecostarica.com/specialr ... h_love.htm)
and/ or Mike Reuben was abused post imprisonment (google abuse, cult, torture, academy swift river and/or mount bachelor academy, aspen education group, Synanon, CEDU and you'll find he was, and see the patterns...)

The level of torture and abuse hinted at above causes brain damage, social marginilization and alientation, and despair..the sort of thing that causes youth (Mike was barely olf enough to drink) to kill themselves. An enterprizing prosecutor would make a case against John D. Reuben.  Maybe Max could be contacted for help?

3
Open Free for All / Re: New Fornits Rules/Constitution [Ratified]
« on: September 12, 2010, 05:58:42 PM »
I say the following without insult intended. I feel the new rules are not being well applied. I saw Ajax was banned, though he is one of the few posters who contributes anything other than troll threads, flame wars, aa spew, etc. and general stupidity. His posts were in the appropriate forum, and, as such, not really misleading. If he's banned, why not John Reuben (aka whooter, it is said) for bringing up CEDU in a non CEDU thread? Why not that poster who threatened to decapitate Ajax?

 Perhaps fornits will maintain the status quo of being a troll overrun site, plus unnecessary censorship, now?

4
Open Free for All / Re: New Fornits Constitution
« on: September 08, 2010, 11:55:00 PM »
Hello again. Im gonna repost what I wrote on another thread, In view of that youre solidifying rules and that I feel there is a necessity to perserve the right to "name names" in some regards, even while ending the right to "name names" in other frameworks . What che's referencing illustrates the kind of posting of personal info that should not be tolerated (i dont know the whole background, but obviously it's done for reasons that are not related to teen abuse but for unreasonable "flame war" concerns)


Quote from: "Che Gookin"
Since we are all up in arms about making this place a better place could you start here:

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=29840&start=1515

You'll notice mr. babble tits posted Felice's personal records on an open forum. I'd like them deleted and him warned. Do so quickly please or this entire thing is going to end up a sham.

On the other hand there are times we should have the right to "name names"...
Quote from: "evil wwasp"
I see your points. The problem I see there is then we couldn't link to "free so and so campaigns" and such. We couldn't even post names of teens who commit suicide post incarceration or in program. Should fornits administrators really demand posters be "secret keepers," not able to even link to identities’ intricate in this abomination and bury their terrible secret knowledge? I appreciate that it is embarrassing to be exposed as a child abuser for former staff(Joel), I appreciate it is embarrassing for program parents to be exposed as criminals, I appreciate that, in the pile case, that maybe everyone involved wanted what was transpiring to be done secretly. But I don't see why that's fornits posters' burden of secrets to carry...at least not to the point they can't even link to another site about it


5
Open Free for All / Re: Considering full moderation
« on: September 08, 2010, 08:56:11 PM »
Thanks for responding.

Quote from: "psy"
Quote from: "Evil WWASP"
I'm glad for moderation. Even its not perfect, it's an improvement.
But it would be a bad move to ban people for "outing" victims and predators. There are clearly some cases where peoples' names have been posted for no good reason, that shouldnt be allowed, but there are other times where people are merely recounting thier time in program and naming thier fellow prisoners, of starting "free so and so" style campains and movements. It's not fair to ask victims or anyone to "keep secrets."

I totally agree.  See my last post.

Quote
In the morgan case, regarding banning pile, you'd be banning him for what he did on other forums. Is that really you guys' place? Youre going to moderate and punish people for what they do in their private time? Not good.

Oh. He won't be punished retroactively for that or be banned.  If he does it again after the rules are put in place, that's a different story.  We're not going to punish people for what they post off the forum but if they link to personal identifying information from this forum i'll consider that the same as posting it on the forum itself.


 I see your points. The problem I see there is then we couldn't link to "free so and so campaigns" and such. We couldn't even post names of teens who commit suicide post incarceration or in program. Should fornits administrators really demand posters to be "secret keepers," not able to even link to identities’ intricate in this abomination and bury their terrible secret knowledge? I appreciate that it is embarrassing to be exposed as a child abuser for former staff(Joel), I appreciate it is embarrassing for program parents to be exposed as criminals, I appreciate that, in the pile case, that maybe everyone involved wanted what was transpiring to be done secretly. But I don't see why that's fornits posters' burden of secrets to carry...at least not to the point they can't even link to another site about it

Yes, there is no place for outing people when it is done because one fornits participant or a cult member is annoyed by purely by the speech of another or a "heretic," (the most obvious example of that being what goes on in the Elan forum. )Sure, to a certain extent the difference subjective call but to make things objective, don't throw out the baby with bathwater. Am I making sense?

Quote from: "guest"
Speaking of "seeming sane," please don't put up a forum solely dedicated to AA. Reading your (you and Antigen's) thoughts on AA, it's clear you have some "far out" opinions on the matter..and if you put up a forum, that would move your thoughts on AA from your opinion realm to official fornits position-(one that the majority of cult victim/program survivors /fornits goers don;t appear to share.)

Quote
I was considering a "drug treatment philosophies" forum instead of one naming AA specifically.  It could be a forum for AA, RR, SOS, SMART and discussion of the relative benefits and downsides.  It would also be opt-in.

Quote
And how do you think that will make the claims on this forum appear regarding brainwashing and cults? Its also insulting to victims to equate wwasp or CEDU with AA, which is what you'd be doing, kinda, if you set up its own forum.

Right, but even defenders of AA such as Danny argue that AA and the 12 step philosophy has influenced this industry.  It's going to be discussed no matter what and it would be great to have a dedicated place for it.


Well, to digress, I dont think AA has been much of an influence on the industry, I think that's just the outwardly acceptable veneer some cult prisons use to hide behind, or the particular "pet ideas" they use to abuse or force on captive teens. (Kinda like WWASP and Mormonism. Do you follow me?) It's more about what they do then what they call it. But, yes, you are right, obviously people are going to talk about it.

Your idea about a general non-committal "drug treatment philosophies" would be a great way to partition A.A. from the rendition cults, or majority age oriented "treatment cults" aimed at coercing young vulnerable people into institutionalization (Benchmark), and treatment cults in general. Perfect. No one would write fornits of as a conspiracy kook forum that way, which is my fear, because, without taking a position here, not titling the forum carefully could be like having a Mormonism forum..the implication being Mormonism is a cult or a "teen program."


Quote from: "guest"
Really, there are only two prolific trolls Suckit and Whooter, just ban them and get it over it. And when they reappear, ban them again. Other moderation will just be iciing on the cake

Quote from: "psy"
Only if they break the rules, and it's impossible to define trolling.  Neither will be banned if they stay within the rules.

I see. Sure thing.

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Open Free for All / Re: Considering full moderation
« on: September 08, 2010, 05:03:11 PM »
Quote from: "psy"
Quote from: "Pile of Dead Kids"
Hahahahahaha... oh fuck, babies and bathwater. You're shitting us, right, Psy? You've got to be shitting us. Please tell me you are shitting us.

No.  I'm not.  Ginger and I made the final decision last night.  I'll be drafting up a new constitution for the forum tonight.  I'll post it publicly for comment, and then ratify it once it meets the group's majority approval.  Outing parents in the way you did before, resulting in a kid being sent to a program, is not going to happen again.  You think parents are likely to listen to anybody on the anti-program side after you out them?  You made us all look like lunatics.  It's unpleasant sometimes but parents ultimately hold the kid's fate in their hands and if it's necessary to hold your tongue and be diplomatic to prevent the kids being sent to programs, it's worth it.  In this one case, Whooter is absolutely right.  You have a good deal of responsibility to bear for Morgan being sent to a program.  Driving off parents for kicks won't be tolerated anymore on this forum.  You weren't even in a program.  What do you care, other than for the drama you feed off of.  As far as I can tell you're pretty much the only person objecting to this.

I'm glad for moderation. Even its not perfect, it's an improvement.
But it would be a bad move to ban people for "outing" victims and predators. There are clearly some cases where peoples' names have been posted for no good reason, that shouldnt be allowed, but there are other times where people are merely recounting thier time in program and naming thier fellow prisoners, of starting "free so and so" style campains and movements. It's not fair to ask victims or anyone to "keep secrets."  
 
In the morgan case, regarding banning pile, you'd be banning him for what he did on other forums. Is that really you guys' place? Youre going to moderate and punish people for what they do in their private time? Not good.

Speaking of "seeming sane," please don't put up a forum solely dedicated to AA. Reading your (you and Antigen's) thoughts on AA, it's clear you have some "far out" opinions on the matter..and if you put up a forum, that would move your thoughts on AA from your opinion realm to official fornits position-(one that the majority of cult victim/program survivors /fornits goers don;t appear to share.) And how do you think that will make the claims on this forum appear regarding brainwashing and cults? Its also insulting to victims to equate wwasp or CEDU with AA, which is what you'd be doing, kinda, if you set up its own forum. That's hardly fair.
Why not just ask the people who post non stop about AA to contain it to one thread? Maybe in an "opt in" way so that it doesn't appear on the new post list...maybe make all general forums "opt in"

Really, there are only two prolific trolls Suckit and Whooter, just ban them and get it over it. And when they reappear, ban them again. Other moderation will just be iciing on the cake

7
The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: How a program saved my life
« on: August 25, 2010, 11:22:10 PM »
And why'd you erase that your life was saved by WWASP, SUCK IT?

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The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: How a program saved my life
« on: August 25, 2010, 10:50:51 PM »
Quote from: "Suck It"
Hello there, thank you for taking an interest in this topic. I am going to talk about in this thread how a program managed to save my life, and why it was absolutely necessary. Let me first say, I don't claim every teen should be sent to a program. I was a particularly troubled teen, and my family tried all the local options first. Being sent to a program for myself, was truly the end of the line, the absolute and final option. The program saved my life, pulling along myself as an unwilling participant, kicking and screaming, desperate to end their own life, through extensive drug use and extremely suicidal behaviors.

Fornits has a lot of threads recently about drama between members here, satire and claims and counter claims. To a new poster here, these threads are gibberish and mean nothing to them. So in this thread, I am going to focus on my experience, how things really were in my experience, and working hard to be honest with myself even if it causes self incrimination and repudiation. I am willing to be open, in the name of honesty, because I don't post here with an agenda. I'm sure some people will read what I write, and my experiences, and conclude I was held captive against my will, even abused, and ultimately brainwashed into the current damaged and/or mentally ill person I am today. But other people will read it, and understand and empathize with the honest accounts of my own experiences, and come to their own conclusion that I am trying my best to be accurate in both my presentation and representation of all my various experiences, and ultimate conclusions based on them.

I deserved, and desperately needed to be sent to a program. That statement would of made me uncomfortable to say a few years ago. It was more comfortable to think of myself as a victim of outside forces, my parents, the program, and society. I worked hard to fill my mind with information to corroborate this blame, and it works, for a while. But my deep desire to find the truth in my own experiences ultimately led to another realization, and that is that if I had been left to my own devices, I would have killed myself with drugs or my behaviors. My parents tried therapy and I would sit their quietly, happy in the thought of wasting their money and making the therapist angry. When I was caught with drugs and alcohol I was sent to a residential state run program, but manipulated my way out, by running away. Because they didn't have a policy for that, run, and you're free. So I was my parents problem again. I kept using, kept stealing, kept doing whatever I felt like and finally my parents had enough. They sent me where I could not manipulate my way out, or run away, or sit there and be silent and waste their money. They sent me to a program.

I was angry, and tried my best to get out through any means necessary. I used some disgusting tactics, that I am not proud of, but I am willing to be honest at the lengths I was willing to go in order to get what I want. The program stood firm, the first people to ever do this to me. I fought more, and they continued to stand firm. Eventually I realized it wasn't going to work, and changed my tactics of self destruction and opened my ears a bit to what they had to say. But I was never brainwashed as described on this forum, I was not ready then to admit that they had in fact just saved my life. It took some time of careful deliberation and thinking, and the most painful thing, to admit I was wrong. I was not a victim of anybody, only a victim of my extremely detrimental and self destructive choices. This was a hard pill to swallow, but accepting something like this is easy, because it feels completely true with everything I am. So here I am today, alive, and well, all because my parents had the fortitude to stick with the program, through all my manipulative communications and threats I sent them, they stood firm and told me no. No, you can not have the freedom to destroy yourself while you are still my child.

What can I say? I am more grateful than anyone can possibly imagine. I never thanked anybody at the program, for putting up with my constant bullshit and manipulations. But I did get a chance to thank my parents for saving my life, years after the fact, when I realized this truth after maturing and developing the ability to be honest with myself. I am not saying this is the experience of everybody who posts here. I can only speak for myself. I was a very troubled teen, on a unstoppable path of self destruction. It took a secured and tightly controlled program to keep me from accomplishing this fatal goal. This is my experience, and this is my truth. Perhaps I am the only person that has had this experience, I really can't speak for others. But I want to share my experience on this forum, and with other people who experienced, because I can and because it's true. Thank you for reading this. Remember, my intent in posting this is not to offend anyone. It is only to share my own opinions on my own experience. Let's show new fornits users what this forum can be like, and keep this thread civil. I promise to act civil, if you do. It's time to move fornits, to a more mature conversation. Join me, and let's get to work.

What I find fascinating is how effortlessly SuckIt streams from lie to lie.

First, she earnestly begged posterX not to post her info because “people depend on her.”

Quote from: "Suck It"
I never went to a program, I made it all up. I am program parent who is brainwashed, trying to convince parents on fornits to send their kids to programs, like I did. Please disregard everything I have ever said on fornits, because it's not true. Every program is abusive and program parents like me should kill themselves.


Explanation: I am taking an indefinite break from fornits starting from this point. It has been made clear to me via email and text message that somebody here is not happy with my opinions and is threatening to fax my posts about drug use and suicide to my boss, which they confirmed they know who it is. I am a new employee and this drama would likely end in me being fired, and unfortunately I cannot take this chance at this point in my life. I have stated my opinions, and you know how I truly feel. I was instructed to post this thread titled "I am a bitch" and to confirm that I am really a program parent pretending to be a troubled teen because I'm brainwashed. Well I did it, but I will not leave without an explanation. I know you are reading this. I did what you asked, if you have any semblance of a soul you will let this end now. If I get fired it's not just my life that will be ruined, people depend on me. I'd ask that all my posts are deleted but I know they have already been copied. So long, fornits..


 Then she sanctimoniously decries “blackmail” in subsequent posts (many of which she has since deleted).
Then she quite convincingly impersonated a not so sophisticated blackmailer, going so far as to steal photos and post them, and write a very convincing back story about “his” dependant cats. Then, she sanctimoniously, self righteously, passionately gives the reasons why she won’t allow Psy to prove that she and posterX have different IP types
Then she continually insists she is a victim of extremist “cult member” “conspiracy theories” when psy and co suggest she’s posterX and continually insists that  she’s being blackmailed, until psy proves, yes, she’s posterX

Quote from: "Suck It"
 I usually ignore conspiracy theories but I'll humor you for a moment. I have dial up internet. That means my IP address changes every time I sign in here. So even if I was another poster, it would be from a different IP address. You are asking for proof of something you really dont' want the answer to. But, let me make clear, I refuse to have this information made public, as a matter of principle.

I will not cede my personal information to an angry mob of cult extremists demanding proof to negate their outlandish theories of the moment. .

(she deleted most of her posts on this subject)

Then she responds to psy’s proving that you and posterX have the same IP by insisting everything she previously wrote (and mostly, erased) was some kind of “tongue in cheek” satire exercise.

She even has the nerve to attack psy as unethical for stopping her from continuing her fraud. It amazes me that she feels entitled to engage in fraud and that the administrators have to keep her secrets. I am amazed by her shamelessness. But then she’s a program parent…so why should I be surprised?

So, what are the names of her other spckpuppets? Is Nazi2 one of them?
How about you give permission fo psy to post all the names of all your sockpuppets? It would be interesting to see how many other "satires" (fraudulent deceits) you've pulled. Tricking and lying isn't "satire." That's  just the behavior of the people dedicated to the WWASP cult.

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The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: .
« on: August 24, 2010, 06:44:30 PM »
Quote from: "shaggys"
I hope that every bit of SUCK ITs elaborate lie of yesterday will be forever remembered and referred to when addressing him. It will remain as a monument to his pathological fascination with lying. Fucking A KUDOS to Psy for spotting that shit right out the door although Che seemed to be on top of it as well so kudos both. See SUCK IT is the kind of person who has thrived by lying and manipulating others for his entire parasytical existence. Whether or not he is currently using drugs has now become irrelevant because his anti-social behavioral issues are still the dominant factor in his life. He probably honed these malignant skills while in the WWASP. Yes parents who are considering a program, please look at SUCK IT and decide if you want your child to turn out like this.

Its a program parent.

And since John David Reuben "whooter" was banned, please enforce that ban.

Edit:

Suck it deleted it's post in where it confirmed it made an intricate cartoon of DJ. Why would she do that?
Didn't they teach you to be honest in those EST seminars?

10
The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: .
« on: August 24, 2010, 06:23:40 PM »
Quote from: "Dysfunction Junction"
I already have.  But you'll never live it down.  People know what type of scum you are.  You are the worst of the worst here.  Bottom of the cesspool.

Did you see the cartoon it made of you. It was really intricate. It must have taken 3 hours to create. She deleted it after she posted it. I should have Q it FT. Insane.

Why'd you take down your DJ cartoon Suckit?

11
The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: .
« on: August 24, 2010, 06:21:31 PM »
Quote from: "Samara"
Again, Whooter we can agree or disagree with who belongs. I am simply nostalgic for another time here that passed. There were programmies at that time as well, so you can't tell me it's all about one sidedness.

But once again, you have purposely aligned me with an act that I protested and had nothing. You have flooded other threads with your KNOWN lies. This is indicative of your bad character. You are a liar and a defamer. I feel sorry  for your family and your newborn son. Have you selected the program you intend to send him to yet?

Newborn son? He only has two sons; both with over 18 years of life behind them, one is living and there's one he murdered. John D Reuben's his name, murdering his own sons is his game. Or do you know soemthing I don't? Please share.

12
The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: psy, suck it = expose cedu
« on: August 24, 2010, 06:14:10 PM »
Quote from: "psy"
Quote from: "Pile of Dead Kids"
Aww. Yeah, it's probably fake, posterX hasn't been back with the goods.

Good point.  If PosterX was real he'd be back here publicly outing SUCK IT, not just (supposedly) calling his boss.


Suck it is definitely not a survivor. It plays the same games as and writes like Expose Cedu.

Can you check if its Expose Cedu? If it is, she's banned. Please enforce the ban?

13
The Troubled Teen Industry / Re: Post your positive program experiences
« on: August 18, 2010, 10:54:41 PM »
Quote from: "9403390"
Whooter i was at a place as staff for 3 months. Month 1 I had just started and wanted to give it a chance. Month 2 I began having doubts. Month three was when I resigned because i realised i was a part of something abusive. that is why i stayed.Not every single aspect was negative. Thanksgiving was celebrated and they even bussed in real food that we cooked in foil on an open fire. The day was spent just kicking a football around and relaxing and talking and eating. it was far more therapeutic than most of the nonsense that constituted any given day.
I am glad suck it you had a good experience.  i am not just saying this to be an asshole to you but why the defensiveness? Ok it is great that this worked for you but you call yourself suck it and in some instances seem eager to dismiss or even get angry at anyone who claims their experience was negative. It does seem at times you really want to provoke those who had a negative experience. I get that you feel there is group think on this forum and maybe there is in that most are opposed to this system but why present your case in such a provocative manner? Surely if this experience was as healing as you say it would not matter to you whether others are critical.


By writing style, Suck it is "exposeCEDU," a troll whose been kicking around awhile.

Why have the administrators let this troll they banned back onto the forum to play its same provoke and distract game?

Why do people respond to its trolling? A happy WWASP graduate with vague, poorly written fictions... it's ridiculous.

(FWIW, I peg it as a cult  "parent," though it  relayed that there are no properly accredited WWASP staff who spend time counseling the prisoners, something cult "parents" often refuse to acknowledge. It erased that post, probably thinking better of admitting that fact. Then reposted it after being called on its deleting.)

 I wish the VERY smart and good people on this thread would do something more productive than waste their time responding to this roach
 and that the administrators exterminate the thing for good this time

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