Fornits

Fornits Home for Wayward Web Fora
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry

ya,  I'm looking for contact info.  thanks for your help though.  if you ever hear of any damn canadians,  send um my way.  if the private message me I'll give sout my info.


I used to have a bunch of info,  but lost it when this board and others went down.  damnit ,   thanks for your help

I am looking for fellow canadians that were in kids of bergen county like I was.  if there are any on this board, or if you know  any,  could you contact me via boardmail.  thanks in advance

the Republicab Party is the most notable chicken.  their polcies resulted in the war on drugs. 
It's interesting that Mitt Romney's fund raising campaign were headed by mel semblar and robert litchfeild.


mel founded straight, and bob founded wwasps

both were chickens that produced alot of eggs.   eventhough these eggs were infected with a virus.

it's also interesting that the only egg that was incubated in canada was in the ultra consevative province of alberta. 

I am going to repost in a miute, till then. 
the way,   you can't buy shreddies in us.    it's a Canadian product.


Scott s; could not have receieved one rationof shreddie in  new   jersey , because tthe they dont exist

I hate to intentionally double post,  but I put a couple of hours of work on this,  and do not want it burried  at the bottom of a  stupid  thread.  I also think it is of value,  and want all who peruse this forum a chance to read it.   These are the facts that I have researched and personally witnessed.

  in the early 70's  the US federal gov'n sponsored a program called the seed.   It was based loosely on the synanon church.

the basic idea of the seed was that behaviour modification could be obtained through group confrontation.  several years later,  a congressional hearing determined that the place was being run like a north korean brainwashing camp.  congress yanked it's funding.  however,  it continued to operate independantly until the mid 90's

there was a rich and powerful man, named Mel Semblar, who had a son  that was in the seed.  He thought it was such a great place that he decided to start his own program.  in 1976,  Mel founded straight.

there were five phases;

PHASE 1:  client works on himself,  admitting his powerlessness over drugs.
PHASE 2:  client returns to his own family to start working on family relationships,  also,  he takes home people of phase 1 to start giving back what help he has recieved.
PHASE 3:  client returns to work or school.
PHASE 4:  client works on peer relationships including the opposite sex
PHASE 5:  client takes on leadership role and begins to prepare for graduation.

It was also expected that the graduates would be become peer counsellors.

the day at straight consisted of marathon rap sessions.   In these raps,  clients  were verbally and physically assaulted for months on end ,  until they played along and were able to move up in the program.  set backs were inevitable, and resulted from even minor infractions.  

At night clients on first phase went home to "host homes" and were supervised by people on higher phases. these people were known as newcomers and oldcomers.  they slept in locked rooms with the windows screwed shut.  the oldcomers placed a matress in front of the door,  and the door was set with an alarm.  additionally the newcomers clothes were kept in another room and they were forced to lie on the floor with only a sheet and no pillow.

in 1980,  a certain Miller Newton, placed his 14 year old son in straight st. petersburgh.  He soon rose to the position of national clinical director.  However,  by 1983,  he was asked to leave.   the allegations of abuse and the resulting settled lawsuits were too much to take.

for instance,  Leah Bright,  was awarded 900,000 dollars for having Miller throw her across the room by her hair into a wall.  he then screamed,"  I want this girl the fuck out of my group".  when Leah confided in her oldcomer that she felt suicidal,  she was put on 72 hours no sleep,  and forced to wear a shirt that said Pshychotic on it.

in 1984, a wealthy benefactor provided the money for Miller Newton to open Kids of Bergen County.   he found a crappy wharehouse,  and some blue chairs and he was almost set.  What he really needed were staff members for his soon to be cllients.  So ,  he recruited four staff members from the straight program to start up kids.  He also needed legitimacy,  so he got a doctorate in urban anthropology from a mail order correspondance school in Cincinatti, called the Union Institute.   the institute billed itself as a school without walls.  there were no classes to attend and no tests to be taken.  he did have to provide a dissertation.
this cheesy dissertaation became the book  "Gone Way Down" .   I've read it,  and is certainly not anyway equivalent to a doctoral dissertation.

I interrupt the history lesson here to point out that aarc was formed in exactly the same way.   degree from the union institute,   transplanting of kids staff to become the first aarc staff.  and the finding of a wealthy benefactor,  the rotary club,  and the alberta government.  Oh,  and the whole wharehouse thing,  and the phases,  and host homes with locked bedroooms ,and oldcomers and newcomers,  etc.

soon Miller had clients to sit in the blue chairs,  in1986 some kids from el paso were enrolled,  soon he had enough to recruit a clinical staff trainee.
when they had enough kids from elpaso,  they chartered a plane,  took some staff from bergen county,  and opened up kids of el paso.  

This process was repeated in 1988 in yourba linda calilfornia,  and in 1989 in slc.   There were also plans for a kids of the canadian west to be launched in 1990,  but the bergen county prosecuters office kind of derailed that plan

In 1988,  the first calgarians arrived in bergen county .  their names were
Brian and Kevin Neal.  

on october 28th of 1988,  the illustrious COUGAR_SEAN was duped into walking into an intake room at kids of bergen county.  for the next eighteen hours,  Cougar Sean was verbally and physically abused until he agreed to sign himself in.   well,  I don't think coercion is the same as agreeing, but whatever.   oh,  I forgot to say,  I am Cougar Sean,  and I was 21 years old at the time of my intake.

The list of abuses that I suffered, and watched other people suffer included,  but are not lilmited to:  sleep deprivation,  food deprivation,  verbal and physical abuse,  rap sessions that lasted  eighteen hours a day, except on monday and friday's.  that was open meeting night those were at least 20 hour days.  but at least you had the oppurtunity to earn a five minute talk with your parents.  this talk was supervised by and oldcomer,  and all you could talk about was what a peice of shit you were in your past.   if you didn't earn talk,  my parents confronted me from acrross the room over the microphone.  other abuses were violent restraints at the hands of fellow vindictive newcomers.  and of course being treated like  a person with no rights.   The abuses continued at night in the host home,  where untrained and unliscenced parents and their druggie kids "cared" for me

all day long I was forced to sit upright, not leaning on the back of my chair , with my hands on my knees.  I was also forced to pay attention to the person talking,  which meant looking directly at them.   breaking any of these rules would result in being restrained on the floor.

the day was made up of basics rap , morning rap, guys/girls rap , afternoon rap, and evening rap.  on monday and friday there was a homes rap where I tried to earn the right to talk to my family.

the raps consisisted of people flailing their arms wildly in the air, motivating,  in an attempt to get called on by the untrained former client staff.  If I was called on I was expected to relate a past incident,  and more importan,  how I FELT about that incident.  Not being a very good fake crier,  I was frequently yelled at, spit on ,  sat down , and restrained for not having the proper FEELINGS  about my past

in short,  Kids of bergen county was insane,  and no person with an ounce of decency could walk in off the street and think that this is a good way to treat adults and children.

soon more calgarians arrived.  one of interest to this board was Jan Holmgren.   She was diagnosed by the amateurs as having an eating disorder, and frankly, she looked like she did.   she was also treated llike total crap.  she was soft spoken and shy,  thus making her perfect prey for staff and clients.  she was tortured without mercy every day in group.  after a while she developed severre swelling around here mouth eyes and nose,  also scabs and sores all over.  she looked like she had leprosy or something.  due to her condition,  she got to get out of group and spend her day in the infirmary.   after several months,  she got honest,  and admitted that she was allergic to shampoo, and had been intentionally rubbing it in her eyes to cause her condition.  

Imagine being in such a abusive place that she would resort to self mutilation to escape.   I don't have to imagine,  I know.

by febuary 1990,  there were probalby thirty calgarians in kids of bergen county,  enough to start plans to open a kids of the canadian west.

now,  they would need a clinical director.   Thats when a guy from saskatchen showed up by the name of Dean Vause.   his title according to the chain of command was "clinical staff trainee".   He was there to learn how to run kids of the canadian west,  then he was going to take us all back to calgary so he could continue abusing us there.

I might add that about three quarters , at least, of the canadians were legal adults.  All coerced into treatment like I had been.  I know that,  because they would talk about it in group.  Dean was there listening.  we were held physically against our will  we were denied contact with family and friends, no phone, television, or even reading.   In fact we had to ask for toilet paper.  at the host home,  we had to ask for everything.   can I take my shoes off?,  can I take my coat off? can I have one more sheet of toilet paper. in group,  we sat ramrod on plastic chairs for eighteen hours a day, often without a bathroom break.  we also motivated and sang childrens songs.  we could only speak if we were called on by the untrained former client staff.  speaking out in group would result  in a restraint.  the place was just absolutely bizarre.

Dean Vause witnessed all of this abuse and human rights violations every day for the year and a half he was in new jersey.  He saw Cougar Sean,  Brian Neal, and Jan Holmgren abused everyday.  in fact he witnessed all 150 children in group being abused every day

At least our parents didn't see the extent of the abuse,  and were physcologically manipulated as well.  

but  DEAN VAUSE  had no attachment to the program,  and he sat and watched what was happening to his fellow canadians in that hell hole in New Jersey with impunity.   you would have to be a sociopath.

anyhow, in july of 1989,  Cougar Sean went with the utah kids to form kids of salt lake.  It's clinical director was Kim  De  La Mare.  He had previously been a clinical staff trainee in new jersey. the staff members were all staff members from new jersey.

Cougar Sean eventually signed himself out on jan 25th 1990.   KIds of salt lake was closed down about six months later amid a slew of lawsuits and allegations of false imprisonment and mental and physical abuse.

in mid 1990,  bergen county prosecuters went into kids and asked anyone over eighteen if they wanted out.  alot of canadians did.  thus,  the Kids of the canadian west experiment folded.

back in calgary,  Dean Vause started holding raps in the basements of parents homes for the kids that were displaced.   when he got enough money,  he openened aarc.   He staffed it with former Kids clients like Brian Neal,  and Jan holmgren.

He also has followed the kids/straight/the seed/synanon church formula to the T.

it seems that the abuses aren't as blatant,  and some of the more outrageous things have been removed.  but the physche damaging core has remained in tact.

specificallly,  we're going to make you act talk, and think like we do or your not going to move along in the phases.  we are going to coerce and verbally abuse you into thinking like us.  we're going to isolate you from the world,  and break you down,  and then build you back up in our image.

Oh,  and we're going to use raps,  phases , oldcomers, newcomers, host homes untrained and uneducated peer staff, unqualified clinical staff, the five phases and of course the twelve steps of aa to do it

in conclusion,  The Seed, Straight,  Kids of Bergen county were all eventually shut down as they were exposed as the fraudulant abusive cults that they were.   all lasted at least fifteen years.

I was never in aarc,  but to me the similarities to my experience are undeniable.   Oh ya, and I know for a fact that your guru, Dean Vause, was an abusive sociopath while I knew him personally in New Jersey.
seeing as he stole his whole program from his training in New jersey,  It doesn't seem to me as if He has changed.

kids spawned aarc, just like straight spawned kids, just like the seed spawned straight.

this stupid little cult is nothing more than a fourth generation the seed.  it will, sooner or later, go the way of the wind just like it's parent programs have.   hopefullly sooner,   the thought that calgarian kids are still being abused the way I was eats me up inside
god help all you aarc supporter when the ptsd kicks in.
god help all you aarc survivors and current victims when the pstd kicks in.

oh, I've thrown around alot of names,  so I don't want to post anonymously.  I'm Sean Wilcox,  and I'm a kids and Dean Vause survivor.

you are correct about deductive arguments.   if you want to argue about what is already known,  then this is the argument for you.  

by definition,  nothing can be contained in the conclusions that was not in the premise.   hence,  no new knowledge can be obtained.  

I suspect that you do not desire new knowledge,  that is why you insist on deductive arguments.

I might point out that all of our scientific "knowledge"  is based on abductive and inductive arguments.  to claim that only deductive arguments are rationally justified is rationallly unjustifiable.

for instance , you believe that the earth rotates around the sun don't you?
if you do,  you have no rational justification for doing so because you believe that only deductive arguments are valid.   the theory that the earth revolves around the sun is based on abductive and inductive arguments.   it's not a fact.  it's a well supported theory based on abductive and inductive reasoning.

you are correct the theory that the earth revolves around the sun falls short of deductive validity.  

you said:
"Thus, even the most reliable instances of inductive reasoning fall short of deductive validity."

no shit batman.  I said that in my previous post.   Just because it falls short of deductive validity,  doesn't mean it's not a rationally justified argument.   to claim otherwise is nonsense,  and shows you really don't know what your talking about.  

here's proof you don't know what your talking about.  you said,


"The most crucial distinction among deductive arguments and the INFERENCES upon which they rely. "

an inference is an inductive argument you knuckelhead.   Let me paraphrase what you said.   "The most crucial distintion among deductive arguments and the inductive arguments upon which they rely".

you clearly don't know the difference between the two or you could'nt have possibly written that sentence.  


back on topic.  describe which of Mr. Elberg's inductive arguments are not rationally justified.  remember, though,  if you play the deduction is the only route to knowledge card,  your claiming skepticism,  and thus,  can't claim knowledge about anything

so refute any of his points,  or quit pretending you know what you are talking about.   I suggest you re read the books you cited that are gathering dust in your library shelf

I only ask because one day,  Milller Newton happened to walk through the back of a rap.  he said"  you can't feel like"    and from that day foward ,  nobody could use that term.   it ws the cause of endless setbacks, and lonely  monday and friday nights for the newcomers,

there are exactly 38 feelings, and nobody disagreed with him.

how could they,  this is the same bullshit he submitted to the union institute as his doctorral thesis.  

all bow to the great doctor of feelings,   miller newton.

dean vause was there at that time, so i assumed that he'd copied that part of the program,  like he did so very  many others.