Fornits

Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Aspen Education Group => Brat Camp => Topic started by: Anonymous on June 21, 2005, 09:49:00 AM

Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on June 21, 2005, 09:49:00 AM
From the ABC Family Brat Camp Forum on RedCliff Ascent:

Quote
Chisuzanne

Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?

Posted: Mar 24, 2005 08:30 AM reply

1 Posts
Registered: Mar 24, 2005 08:28 AM


Please respond if you or anyone that you are close to has been through Redcliff Ascent and whether it ended up being the "life changing" experience in a positive or negative way. I have a family member who is going into it tomorrow and am concerned. Thank you.

Quote
KYSunny

Re: Re: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?

Posted: Mar 24, 2005 08:43 AM reply

1 Posts
Registered: Mar 24, 2005 08:41 AM


I have worked with several kids who have been through this program. This program has helped them in more ways than I could ever tell you. The program works, it's success is dependant on the follow thru of the parents.

Quote
Jmaxwheel

Re: Re: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?

Posted: Mar 30, 2005 11:36 AM reply

3 Posts
Registered: Mar 30, 2005 10:47 AM


A few of my friends have. I have been through Second Nature and ASR Base Camp (shut down now I believe) and from what I've heard RedCliff might be somewhere in between those two. This is an extremely emotionally charged topic for me. I am currently researching and investigating these kind of places as well as RTCs and "therapeutic" boarding schools for an on-road expose tour this summer, invovling demonstrations in the towns hosting the programs. If you've ever read 1984 you have a toned down version of it already.Where I was, Through humiliation(One girl had to crawl every where she went and cry out loud-a councelor continued to throw a water bottle into the woods and make her crawl and cry to retrieve it while saying things like "If your gonna cry and compain like f***in baby I'm gonna treat you like a baby. this is how you f*** up everyones lives around you Im here to unf*** your life do you f***in understand me?" another kid had to sit in a circle of peers and have human feces be wiped on his face) , forced labor ("You don't have to do this but if you don't your going to RTC lockdown) disorientation, and poor physical conditions(inadequate shelter, frostbite, malnutrition, jardia[did I spell that right?] Reality is completely controled by staff. If they tell you 2and2 is 4 you better not just say it is but you need to believe it, they'll know. When inspectors came they whould tell us we would never get out basically if we told them anything and everything would be changed. At the top of this pyramid of evil the directors sit on they're plush thrones rolling in hundreds of thousands (programs often can cost up to ten thousand a MONTH. I cam out of those and the 14month program competely delusional, affraid of everying and very heart. It took a lot of wonderful people and majical experiences to come out of that, experiences of freedom and love, not hate and oppresion. Now my life is PERFECT and incredulous as that may sound. I work in carpentry and microbiology and live on an intentional community in GA. Above all what helped me is my deep love for nature backpacking and all and the strength I draw from that, and many mystical experience. I found God Or the Universal cosmic mind and he she is with us. Plus my beautiful and wonderful girlfriend who I was seperated from through the experience and now live with. This all happened about 5 years ago. The "therapeutic program" community has hid behind deciet and legal loopholes for many years but they can't hide from God and we will bring them down with love! We the human race are one divine family and we need to come togather to overwhelm this evil. with love sincere -Max
PS post any questions about my history or intent or whatever if you wish.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Couture on July 08, 2005, 03:23:00 PM
I have been through redcliff ascent.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 09, 2005, 03:23:00 AM
Quote
On 2005-07-08 12:23:00, Couture wrote:

"I have been through redcliff ascent."

What was it like?  Did they refer you to Whitmore?
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 09, 2005, 05:40:00 PM
Most wilderness therapy programs are feeder programs for therapeutic boarding schools and behavior modification facilities.  

Don't be fooled.  There is big money in the "call of the wild".

Just ask the referral agents and admissions reps who are laughing their asses all the way to the bank.

 ::bigsmilebounce::
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Couture on July 11, 2005, 05:09:00 PM
No, they did not refer me to whitmore.  I had an ed consultant do that.  It was actualy not a bad place.  I mean, I don't think I would choose to go out there on my own, however, it kept me out of trouble for the time being, and it really made me appreciate all the little things that I take for granted every day.  I don't know if it really helped me in the long run, but I would recommend it to someone who's child has lots of difficulty with athority.  I think this program would help that out a lot.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 11, 2005, 08:55:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-07-11 14:09:00, Couture wrote:

"No, they did not refer me to whitmore.  I had an ed consultant do that.  It was actualy not a bad place.  I mean, I don't think I would choose to go out there on my own, however, it kept me out of trouble for the time being, and it really made me appreciate all the little things that I take for granted every day.  I don't know if it really helped me in the long run, but I would recommend it to someone who's child has lots of difficulty with athority.  I think this program would help that out a lot."


Huh? You actually believe programs are good for kids who have issues with "authority"?

Perhaps you failed to notice that when you were in this program, you were expected to obey rules or face the consequences.

You don't think your own parents could teach you something this fundamental without spending thousands of dollars?

Wake up kid.  That's a sales pitch not an explanation for how and why you ended up in a program.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 12, 2005, 02:05:00 AM
Well I went through ascent and I think this show is a fucking tragedy. These places don't work, maybe for a month or so afterwards the kids are doing good, but then they realize, they don't have such deep love for their parents. Its the fact that they are in the middle of bootcamp that makes them miss them. Once they come home and realize what assholes there parents are, they realize that they just wanted what they couldn't have. This show uses kids for the entertainment of America, beautiful.... retarded...
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 12, 2005, 04:23:00 AM
Quote
On 2005-07-11 14:09:00, Couture wrote:

"No, they did not refer me to whitmore.  I had an ed consultant do that.  It was actualy not a bad place.  I mean, I don't think I would choose to go out there on my own, however, it kept me out of trouble for the time being, and it really made me appreciate all the little things that I take for granted every day.  I don't know if it really helped me in the long run, but I would recommend it to someone who's child has lots of difficulty with athority.  I think this program would help that out a lot."

I don't wish to seem sarcastic but I am a little puzzled.  You say the program helped you but then you went to Auldern Academy and Whitmore.  You really seem to have done the rounds.  If these programs are so helpful why did you keep going back?
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Couture on July 15, 2005, 01:51:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-07-12 01:23:00, Anonymous wrote:

"
Quote

On 2005-07-11 14:09:00, Couture wrote:


"No, they did not refer me to whitmore.  I had an ed consultant do that.  It was actualy not a bad place.  I mean, I don't think I would choose to go out there on my own, however, it kept me out of trouble for the time being, and it really made me appreciate all the little things that I take for granted every day.  I don't know if it really helped me in the long run, but I would recommend it to someone who's child has lots of difficulty with athority.  I think this program would help that out a lot."


I don't wish to seem sarcastic but I am a little puzzled.  You say the program helped you but then you went to Auldern Academy and Whitmore.  You really seem to have done the rounds.  If these programs are so helpful why did you keep going back?"

Well..... I am not saying I agree with sending kids to programs.  My parents did what they thought was best at the time.  I screwed up plenty of times with them.  I did go to those three places, because I was allowed to go home, and I DID fall right back into the same routine, which is quite easy to do.  I did not have a problem with authority, so it was easy for me to do very well at every place that i attended.  People who do have a problem with authority, however, will learn probably more than somone who does not.  That is all I was trying to say.  And don't call me 'kid'.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 18, 2005, 10:55:00 PM
Yes. I have been to Redcliff Ascent. My names Brett.  I graduated in Janauary of 2005.  Was there for 75 days, and let me tell you, Brat Camp on television doesnt show you everything that goes on there.  When I was going through, they were actually filming a group from Europe, that later became "Brat Camp".  I have not seen the film yet myself, but I was in the end of the film, during graduation.  If you have questions about Redcliff ascent, or if you graduated from Redcliff, I would enjoy talking to you. [email protected]   I will tell you; dont judge your opinions of Redcliff, based on television.  After a strenous 75 days of living in the wilderness/mountains, I feel like I can accomplish about anything today.  This program helped with many things.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Antigen on July 19, 2005, 01:33:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-07-11 14:09:00, Couture wrote:

I had an ed consultant do that.


I wonder if Sue got paid for each referal? So, given a gullible enough parent, someone like her could reasonably expect a couple of thousand dollars/yr/head. What a racket!

The overwhelming majority of people have more than the average (mean) number of legs.  
-- E. Grebenik

Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on July 20, 2005, 06:47:00 AM
Quote
On 2005-07-18 19:55:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Yes. I have been to Redcliff Ascent. My names Brett.  I graduated in Janauary of 2005.  Was there for 75 days, and let me tell you, Brat Camp on television doesnt show you everything that goes on there.  When I was going through, they were actually filming a group from Europe, that later became "Brat Camp".  I have not seen the film yet myself, but I was in the end of the film, during graduation.  If you have questions about Redcliff ascent, or if you graduated from Redcliff, I would enjoy talking to you. [email protected]   I will tell you; dont judge your opinions of Redcliff, based on television.  After a strenous 75 days of living in the wilderness/mountains, I feel like I can accomplish about anything today.  This program helped with many things.  "

Can I just check those dates?  You were at RedCliff Ascent for 75 days and left in January 2005?  So you went there at the end of 2004. The first Brat Camp at RedCliff Ascent was filmed in late 2003.  Have you got your dates wrong or are they filming ANOTHER Brat Camp there?
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: envydraggin on October 06, 2005, 06:29:00 PM
I am actually brand new to this forum.  I registered specifically for this topic.
I would like to start with the fact that I went to Redcliff Ascent Outdoor Therapy program over 5 years ago.  I was fifteen years old.  
I woke up one morning, actually to be exact January 10, 2000, to the sound of my dad, and a police officer saying that I was going to Utah for a program that was to be only 6 to 8 weeks long.  
Well, I did the typical young kid in a new environment thing and was very angry at my parents.  It took me all of five minutes to realize the severity of the situation that I was in though to turn that anger into sadness.  It took me a bit of time to adapt to my new surroundings, but it did happen eventually.  The were problem children, I was not one of them, but there were a few that never really adapted too well.  While they did things such as refusing to hike, and cooperate with the team, which later led to us having to push our stuff in a heavy pull wagon,  they most certainly were never were degraded in the manner in which JMAXWHEEL said.  Besides that, Im pretty sure that he never could have remembered what he says he does as well as he does, especially if these events were supposedly common place out there.  Its is painfully obvious that someone couldnt just accept the situation that they were in, and decided to blame all of their problems on others, because denying responsibility for your own actions, and blaming it on others is so much easier.
I graduated Redcliff within about 69 days, and had little issues.  Though I was not there by choice it is an experience that I tell others about today, and they are in disbelief that a young teen could go through so much.

After graduation, I went to The Oakley School.  In my opinion, this place was sucha greater attempt to brainwash you than Redcliff.  It was in a beautiful loactaion, and was extremely good schooling, but I was extremely unhappy there.  

Now, I am 22 years old, and in the US Army, as an infantryman.  I will be leaving the service in less than a year, and going to law school.  So, you tell me if you think that the results of these programs are based upon the individual or the institution.  Personally, some people are just really messed up,and there is no real hope for them.

 :wstupid:
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on October 06, 2005, 11:01:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-07-11 14:09:00, Couture wrote:

"No, they did not refer me to whitmore.  I had an ed consultant do that.  It was actualy not a bad place.  I mean, I don't think I would choose to go out there on my own, however, it kept me out of trouble for the time being, and it really made me appreciate all the little things that I take for granted every day.  I don't know if it really helped me in the long run, but I would recommend it to someone who's child has lots of difficulty with athority.  I think this program would help that out a lot."


How does Whitmore compare to other programs of it's kind (educational boarding school with a component for teaching respect for authority) and what was the name of the educational consultant who referred you?
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on October 06, 2005, 11:34:00 PM
Whitmore: The owner Cheryl Sudweeks has been charged with child abuse against four children, and the criminal trial is underway. The criminal investigation is still active.
Several parents have filed a civil suit against the owners.
Most of the kids were referred by Sue Scheff at PURE, who still supports these abusive owners, and Scheff continued to refer children to this facility, even while the criminal investigation was ongoing.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Joyce Harris on October 06, 2005, 11:53:00 PM
Sue Scheff is not an educational consultant. She is paid by the program. BIG DIFFERENCE there.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on October 07, 2005, 09:26:00 AM
****While they did things such as refusing to hike, and cooperate with the team, which later led to us having to push our stuff in a heavy pull wagon, they most certainly were never were degraded in the manner in which JMAXWHEEL said. Besides that, Im pretty sure that he never could have remembered what he says he does as well as he does, especially if these events were supposedly common place out there. Its is painfully obvious that someone couldnt just accept the situation that they were in, and decided to blame all of their problems on others, because denying responsibility for your own actions, and blaming it on others is so much easier.***

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Listen up. The degree of abuse is frequently directly related to the psychies of the current staff members. Some more sadistic than others. And for most programs, there is a high turn over.

Also, time has made a few changes. Some programs 'appear' to have pulled the reins in 'slightly' over the years, due to 50 some deaths and undesirable public/state scrutiny. Does that ensure that no abuse is ocurring? Nope, again it depends on the staff and what they can get away with.

People who 'get with the program' appear to endure less blatant abuse. It's been reported that kids are made to leave the area or turn their heads when a staff is about to 'discipline' a participant. Why's that?

Certainly makes sense that they'd want the other kids to watch.. might keep them in line to observe the 'consequence' being delivered. That seems rational.

Instead they are not allowed to observe. Could that be because the staff want NO WITNESSES???

The industry is incapable of teaching kids how to 'take responsibility for their actions and to not blame others' because they haven't mastered it themselves. They kill a kid due to over exertion or neglect and blame the kid for their own death.  :rofl:

You have a lot to learn, if you are so inclined.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: envydraggin on October 07, 2005, 04:44:00 PM
In reference to your statement regarding the fact that students that "Get with the program, receive less abuse,"  CAn you not understand how that may be.  If you sit there, and resist all efforts to change yourself, and ultimatly your life, of course you will be ridiculed in a situation that encourages change.  
The fact that some people are content with being angry at their parents, authority, and the world in general, is something of great concern.  Do you really think that the same people who behave this way will in the end say that they were always treated fairly????  Come on now, you appear to be more knowledgable than to truly believe this.
It is unfortunate when a person abuses a child whether it is physically, or emotionally.  The fact is that there may be places that there sole purpose is to be truly sadistic.  Another fact is that while 50 teens may have died in these impact programs due to neglect, or even possible abuse, many more die than that every single year in the US military (non combat relatred injuries).  So now are you going to start a forum saying that because when a soldier gets "smoked" and the NCO asks others to leave when he does this, that he just doesnt want any witnesses?  Perhaps you should look at the possibility that the, conversation, or actions happening are intended for the person it is directed to and not the entire group.  
You have got to be kidding me to think that the basis of the problems for most of these kids is enhanced by their exposure to these programs.  As I stated earlier, most of these teens are bound to be in a penal institution, and be violent their entire lives.  Most of these people need something like this to make them realize that there actions will not go unpenalized throughout their entire lives.
Dont forget the fact that while I may not have a PhD, nor am I any type of aspiring psychologist, I have been there, and I am talking from personal experience.  Which I might add goes much further than some theory you might have, or somthing you might have read in a book.

 :wstupid:  :lol:
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on November 21, 2005, 02:26:00 PM
I went through the program back in 2001, I was there for a total of maybe 5-6 months. I can give a little info of what happened, but any specific questions you have, send them to [email protected] (http://mailto:[email protected]) and I'll try and answer you as soon as I can
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on November 21, 2005, 02:40:00 PM
Ok, just skimmed throuhg the posts and had to post again, as I forgot to get to this in my rant.

As for the abuse at redcliff, it WAS there. while there was no real physical abuse that I saw (of course, when you are there, you are in a group of about 7-15 with 3 counslers, so who knows about the other groups) there was still abuse. If someone didn't do exaclty as they were told, they could be punished with lack of food, loss of "needed" gear, like tarps to cover with in rain, jackets or the "privilage" of getting warmer clothes from your "stash". I say privilage, because you had a certain ammount of clothes, you didn't want to carry them all, so you could swap out from your bag every 2 weeks. You had to guess what was coming, cuase you could be in shorts hikeing in the snow or  in a sweater in the valley, very hot. There'd be times when you just weren't allowed to get warmer clothes. Other punishments where the "cart", though I only heard about that, the "red suite" (an bright red, and very thick and hot jump suite you'd be forced to wear...no matter what temp. it was. Emotional and psychilogical abuse from yelling and degrading, to not allowing letters and just being down right cruel, even eploiting a childs past to degrade them, to physically restraining in a painfull, though "not harfull" manner.
   And yes, if you "got with the program" it did not happen to you. So if you just went along with everything, you probobly didn't see the abuse. The reason, and I'm guessing here, is to give good testimonials. Bad child goes to camp, comes back with a positive experince and outlook. Or, bad child goes to camp, can't "hack it", is abused and mistreated, comes out, no one belives because this child was just "beyond help".
  Sad isn't it. I could just imagine what CPS hell I'd be in if I took a child out into the desert, fed him rice twice a day, didn't allow him access to a bathroom, or even allow him to bathe, pushed him to the point of physical exhasution every day, then topped it all off by telling him how terrible he is, and how with the power of attorny I now have, I can do what every I want and he couldn't even tell anyone of the abuse.  No wonder places like this get shut down, investigated and sued often
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: AtomicAnt on November 21, 2005, 08:14:00 PM
Quote
The fact that some people are content with being angry at their parents, authority, and the world in general, is something of great concern.


Yes indeed. The great concern is that they are often justified in being angry at their parents and the authority figures in their lives. That is probably the root cause of their behavior difficulties in the first place. No one disputes that, not even the programs. So why blame and punish the teen? Kids can be helped without the tough part of tough love. Positive support works much quicker, much cheaper, and much better.

I say that not from a book, but from personal experience as both a son and a father.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: AtomicAnt on November 21, 2005, 08:56:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-10-07 13:44:00, envydraggin wrote:

"In reference to your statement regarding the fact that students that "Get with the program, receive less abuse,"  CAn you not understand how that may be.  If you sit there, and resist all efforts to change yourself, and ultimatly your life, of course you will be ridiculed in a situation that encourages change.  

The fact that some people are content with being angry at their parents, authority, and the world in general, is something of great concern.  Do you really think that the same people who behave this way will in the end say that they were always treated fairly????  Come on now, you appear to be more knowledgable than to truly believe this.

It is unfortunate when a person abuses a child whether it is physically, or emotionally.  The fact is that there may be places that there sole purpose is to be truly sadistic.  Another fact is that while 50 teens may have died in these impact programs due to neglect, or even possible abuse, many more die than that every single year in the US military (non combat relatred injuries).  So now are you going to start a forum saying that because when a soldier gets "smoked" and the NCO asks others to leave when he does this, that he just doesnt want any witnesses?  Perhaps you should look at the possibility that the, conversation, or actions happening are intended for the person it is directed to and not the entire group.  

You have got to be kidding me to think that the basis of the problems for most of these kids is enhanced by their exposure to these programs.  As I stated earlier, most of these teens are bound to be in a penal institution, and be violent their entire lives.  Most of these people need something like this to make them realize that there actions will not go unpenalized throughout their entire lives.

Dont forget the fact that while I may not have a PhD, nor am I any type of aspiring psychologist, I have been there, and I am talking from personal experience.  Which I might add goes much further than some theory you might have, or somthing you might have read in a book.



 :wstupid:  :lol:
"


As a manager at a large corporation I was trained in taking employees aside and reprimanding them in private. This is done so as to not embarass or humiliate the employee in front of his or her peers.

While I can very well accept this same arguement for clients in a program, there is another side.

If any abuse occurs in the corporate setting, the employee can file a complaint with human resources, my boss, or even the police. They can print, publish, sue, and inform all their co-workers about what may have happened. They can also leave the office and even quit the job.

The clients of these programs have no such safeguards. They are not permitted any of these protective actions. In many cases, they cannot tell their own parents, or if they can, the program can simply perform well practiced damage control by convincing the parents that the client is lying. Because the client is likely to have a checkered past, their credibility might be reduced. This reduced credibility provides another reason that more protection is needed, not less, because it makes the client even more vulnerable to abuse.

One must also consider the age and history of the client. They might not have an understanding of what constitutes abuse and may have been past victims of abuse.

If these programs are really designed to protect the clients' rights and well being, they would have safeguards in place to avoid potential abuse and protect themselves from lawsuits. Anything less is simply unprofessional.

It is clear to me and others who post here, that these programs prefer to operate in the shadows because they are fully aware that their techniques would be condemned by the public at large, and probably law enforcement, if they operated in a more tranparent manner.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: AtomicAnt on November 21, 2005, 09:03:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-11-21 11:40:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Ok, just skimmed throuhg the posts and had to post again, as I forgot to get to this in my rant.



As for the abuse at redcliff, it WAS there. while there was no real physical abuse that I saw (of course, when you are there, you are in a group of about 7-15 with 3 counslers, so who knows about the other groups) there was still abuse. If someone didn't do exaclty as they were told, they could be punished with lack of food, loss of "needed" gear, like tarps to cover with in rain, jackets or the "privilage" of getting warmer clothes from your "stash". I say privilage, because you had a certain ammount of clothes, you didn't want to carry them all, so you could swap out from your bag every 2 weeks. You had to guess what was coming, cuase you could be in shorts hikeing in the snow or  in a sweater in the valley, very hot. There'd be times when you just weren't allowed to get warmer clothes. Other punishments where the "cart", though I only heard about that, the "red suite" (an bright red, and very thick and hot jump suite you'd be forced to wear...no matter what temp. it was. Emotional and psychilogical abuse from yelling and degrading, to not allowing letters and just being down right cruel, even eploiting a childs past to degrade them, to physically restraining in a painfull, though "not harfull" manner.

   And yes, if you "got with the program" it did not happen to you. So if you just went along with everything, you probobly didn't see the abuse. The reason, and I'm guessing here, is to give good testimonials. Bad child goes to camp, comes back with a positive experince and outlook. Or, bad child goes to camp, can't "hack it", is abused and mistreated, comes out, no one belives because this child was just "beyond help".

  Sad isn't it. I could just imagine what CPS hell I'd be in if I took a child out into the desert, fed him rice twice a day, didn't allow him access to a bathroom, or even allow him to bathe, pushed him to the point of physical exhasution every day, then topped it all off by telling him how terrible he is, and how with the power of attorny I now have, I can do what every I want and he couldn't even tell anyone of the abuse.  No wonder places like this get shut down, investigated and sued often"


You say "...no real physical abuse..." Then you describe inadequate clothing, witholding of food, and painful physical restraint. I hope you understand that these are forms of physical abuse. You even point out that these acts are illegal when committed by someone outside the context of a program. That means they are likely illegal inside a program as well.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2005, 11:44:00 PM
Does this say anything about the efficacy rates of these places??   I understand they interview families within weeks to a few months afther they've been out and are still drinking the Kool Aid.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2005, 11:48:00 PM
Quote
On 2005-07-20 03:47:00, Anonymous
Can I just check those dates?  You were at RedCliff Ascent for 75 days and left in January 2005?  So you went there at the end of 2004. The first Brat Camp at RedCliff Ascent was filmed in late 2003.  Have you got your dates wrong or are they filming ANOTHER Brat Camp there?"



GAWWWWWWWWWWWD.  Is there really a fuckign DIFFERENCE??????????????????
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on December 05, 2005, 01:01:00 AM
Yes. check your fucking sources, before you try to prove someone wrong. They had another "brat camp" show, with Dan, and Tom, etc.  dont try an show me up.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on February 08, 2006, 12:05:00 PM
Ive also been through Redcliff, graduated in december '03 was there 90 days. They were filming some brits or whatever and i remember that one kid from brooklyn that was in our group (aah shit it wasnt bullfrogs it was lions something like) left and joined the filmed group. It did help me considerably, i was a whinely little bitch and needed a good slap of reality. It helped me with depression but say 4 months afterwards i feel into a more anti-social 'conduct disorder' ruitine, and 6 months after i was arrested and am still on probation for my crimes.

I respect RCA more than juvies/psych hospitals/residentials blah blah and any other institution ive been to since they didnt just try to shove fucking pills down my throat and attempt to diagnose me with ODD or this and that. It was an emotional experience to say the least.

I was taken from Horsham Clinic (behavioral health hospital in PA) and escorted by a pig and my mother to the airport and flew into vegas. From there i meet the intake people, a chick and a man both huge and tall, mouthed off to them a bit and was driven to Utah. I got to base round 1:30 Am and then preceded with intake. After i was stripped and given those 'battle tested' fatigues, i was blindfolded and was off to the wilderness. 3 hours latter i arived at my camp Bullfrogs and became acutely aware how damn heavy those packs are and that i was seriously in the middle of nowhere--contrary to what i was told and assumed, that it was some haughty taughty cliche "lets go camping and learn about nature!" bullshit.

After pissing and moaning about hiking in my first letter i wrote home, i got depressed. Even to my dismay i couldnt make fire. I continued this little ruitine of mine for nearly two months till i got my first fire, rushed through all my phases, got named "White Falcon" and graduated. We had to take a shower, but at grad camp they just built it and it had no heat--i remember it was colder than just using a pot and soap, but i really didnt care. Cold meant shit to me then, after 'gut-bomb', 3 peak, fires, my hair freezing (always wash your body first then your hair kiddies), blisters etc. i was just happy i was going home. They make you run like a mile down to your parents, and that first month home is really the most thankful. I remember i had trouble trying to explain my experience to kids in my school and they all backed away from me cause i was 'bad'. So eventually i gave in started to chill with punk/skin crews more and eventually got myself into some run-ins with the law.

I meet some interesting people that id seriously like to meet again Mike "Red Badger" or that hobo chick Ericka.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on February 15, 2006, 05:28:00 PM
^^^ Oh yea and i read the discussion. ^^^

Abuse was there if you cared to notice (staff dismissing the group to another area to piss off on some kid, degrading remarks, instigating etc) but most of the time 'consequences' involved carrying rocks if you swear, having a looooong day of hiking, camp drills/pack drills, no peanut butter, cheese or meat rations (replaced by the nastiest greenish brown shit ever) and the 'cart'. My group got the cart just "to see if we can handle it". All in all though it did just depend on the staff and thier mood.

Getting sick is just horrible. They dont give you conventional medicine but make you drink sage tea which id imagine tastes exactly like shit laced with pesticide i remember i could hardly get it down and vomited but they insisted to drink up because of how sick i was (and for two weekafter i was discharged i still was taking medicine for it). It was the worse ive ever been i was freezing cold couldnt eat coughing up green phlegm, couldnt walk 100 yards without huffing and puffing and all i would do was stare off drooling by the campfire haha i spilt my honey and when someone finally noticed it was all gone and i didnt even care which to an RCA kid is fucking extreme. When we hiked (only 6 miles or so) i barely made it and got about a dozen or so faint spells where honestly i had no clue what the hell was going on. Fortunatly i graduated that weekend right befor the 15 miler we were going to pull off (dont know how i wouldve fared with being sick and all)

RCA doesnt change shit let alone profoundly, it just grows you some hair on your chest and leaves your suburbanite mommies and daddies 30 grand poorer (and for a poor family like mine, well lets just say your going to be eating lots of canned patatoes and ramen)

RCA dont work. Nuff said.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on March 08, 2006, 12:08:00 PM
all of you idiots are just a bunch of pusseys who couldnt handle rca. i graded in 45 days and all you have to do is not be a pussy
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on March 08, 2006, 12:10:00 PM
Quote
On 2006-03-08 09:08:00, Anonymous wrote:

"all of you idiots are just a bunch of pusseys who couldnt handle rca. i graded in 45 days and all you have to do is not be a pussy"


You have that almost exactly backwards.  It takes much more courage to fight against an injust system than it does to succumb and conform.

The pussies are the ones who gave into conformity.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on March 14, 2006, 01:45:00 PM
Quote
On 2006-03-08 09:08:00, Anonymous wrote:

"all of you idiots are just a bunch of pusseys who couldnt handle rca. i graded in 45 days and all you have to do is not be a pussy"


no shit. its not like juvie where they break your nose for talking outta turn.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on March 14, 2006, 02:37:00 PM
Quote

On 2006-03-08 09:08:00, Anonymous wrote:


"The pussies are the ones who gave into conformity."


 ::nod::
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on March 24, 2006, 07:52:00 PM
i went through redcliff, it was tough, and i was there for 108 days, ultimetly i went to a theraputic boarding school and than i ran away
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on April 22, 2006, 10:35:00 PM
Man I loved RCA it was the best thing that ever had happened to me I was out of there in 105 days.
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: tommyfromhyde1 on April 29, 2006, 04:10:00 PM
Quote
On 2006-03-24 16:52:00, Anonymous wrote:

"i went through redcliff, it was tough, and i was there for 108 days, ultimetly i went to a theraputic boarding school and than i ran away"

Was that boarding school Hyde?

He, who has nothing, and who himself belongs to another, must be defended by him, whose property he is, and needs no arms. But he, who thinks he is his own master, and has what he can call his own, ought to have arms to defend himself, and what he possesses; else he lives precariously, and at discretion.
James Burgh 1774

Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on May 09, 2006, 11:50:00 PM
Hey there man---

e-mail me at [email protected]

Blake-- the kid that got moved from my group to the brits.  Thats weird man, we could of been in the same group at the same time.  What group did you go to after the bullfrogs?  Red Badger (Mike) with the long red beard was in our group as well.  My name's Brett (Teaching Hawk) man.. don't know if that rings a bell.. Whats your name bro? e-mail me
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on May 19, 2006, 03:46:00 PM
I was there from Augest of 98 through April of 99. It changed my life. Of cource I was staff, but back then the staff needed to graduate the program also. so we were right along side the students with the same gear and same food. oh and I went back in 2001 the food was alot better and the  staff I worked with were alot better. And there were some bad staff out there, but they didnt last long. most of them wouldnt make it past their first month or so. And if we herd about abuse by other staff we took care of it. well atleast I did, I cant speak for the other staff. I think while I was there I got a couple of people fired. But I know that the program only workes if the person in it wants or needs to change. Some of the students I worked with didnt belong there becuse the problem was with the parents, there was nothing wrong with their kids. I've ran into some of the students that I staffed in the program. And they all have had good and bad to say about their experience, They all got something diffrent out of the experience. I wish I could go back and go through as a student, but my wife wont let me.

I was Red Buffalo
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on May 22, 2006, 04:35:00 AM
its really NOT that bad. I'm a brit so im not at all used to the heat and everything, but i still managed to grad in 68 days! i was in the firehawks, does anyone remember the staff Crimson Moon? Wando? Cliff Raven? oh well...
Title: Has anyone been through Redcliff Ascent?
Post by: Anonymous on January 14, 2007, 09:57:22 AM
somebody had made a response on here that redcliff was easy and shit-  YAH well for me at 15 and a straight A student who was a major goody-goody i was just sent there because my parents didnt like my best friend and because i ran away for 2 days whenever my mom told me to get the fuck out of her house anyways--

point is it was fuckin hard as hell for me- and guess what i didnt miss my parents for one fuckin second out there- it made me hate them more than anybody could ever know

and i was told i was going to a camping school that only lasted a month- which might have been what they thought but i graduated after 62 days

whoever said they graduated 45 days i would have graduated that soon but after i finished my phases they kept me there 2 extra weeks- and they didnt even give my parents a reason why i was kept there longer (probably just so they'd have to pay extra)!

but i've already commented once on this website that RedCliff changed my life for the worse- it taught me A LOT about drugs which then made me want to do them- which i got into every and any drugs after RCA- mostly coke and crack and i skipped school so much when i got back that i was court ordered to a G.E.D.

my email is [email protected]- write if any questions or if u went to RCA w/ me fuckin email me- i was there in nov 2001 to jan 2002 ( i was there for thanksgiving, christmas, and my 16th birthday- fun!)
Title: Recent runway attempts from Redcliff Ascent
Post by: Oscar on June 24, 2016, 01:20:29 PM
The local police seems to have trouble with runaways from the Redcliff Ascent wilderness program:

The 3 boys from the latest escape attempt have all been captured and returned to the place of imprisonment.

Quote from: KU TV
Search underway for 3 teens missing from wilderness disciplinary program (http://kutv.com/news/local/search-underway-for-3-teens-missing-from-wilderness-disciplinary-program)
BY DANIEL WOODRUFF AND LARRY D. CURTIS , KU TV, June 21 - 2016

(KUTV) A search is underway in Beaver County for three runaway teens who left the RedCliff Ascent wilderness treatment program.

Beaver County Sheriff Cameron Noel said boys went missing from the camp around 3 a.m. Monday. A deputy was notified around 8 a.m. and the search started, continuing throughout the day, Noel said.

The boys were identified as Keyon Garbus, 15, Wyatt Grosvenor, 15, and Ajay Ruparelia, 14.

The sheriff said the boys likely have very little food or water, and he was concerned about their welfare as temperatures in the area reached 105 degrees. Searchers found some footprints that may indicate the boys are hiking south toward the Iron County border, Noel said.

He also said the boys were wearing flip flops and white t-shirts and were unprepared for the rocky, desolate terrain.

"They're out in an area that they're totally not used to and quite dangerous," said Noel.

A state helicopter was called in to assist Monday with plans to return. Searchers plan to resume their efforts early Tuesday morning, according to Noel.

According to Noel, the sheriff's office has had several problems with RedCliff Ascent. He said this same situation happened just last week.

"Had two of them escape," Noel said. "Broke into three or four of our local cabins out in that area, but we were able to capture them later in the daytime."

2News reached out to RedCliff Ascent, but an answering service representative said no one was in the office Monday evening.

This story will be updated as more information becomes available.