Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: dragonfly on September 05, 2011, 05:11:06 PM
-
-
This is a very important day and we need to unite as one . lol
-
Yep,it's time to unite,even with switchblade sticking,brass-knuckle swinging jackasses like Alexander B.Dodd,the stalker..........
-
Yep,it's time to unite,even with switchblade sticking,brass-knuckle swinging jackasses like Alexander B.Dodd,the stalker..........
Damn Sam, you really need to take a chill pill. lol
-
-
Yep,it's time to unite,even with switchblade sticking,brass-knuckle swinging jackasses like Alexander B.Dodd,the stalker..........
Sam, a little backround would be helpful. Who did this guy stalk? He's from right here in St. Pete. Does this stalking involve other straitgtlings?
-
Dear People,
All survivors of coercive thought reform and behavior modification programs are invited to share their stories on this three-hour, upcoming national radio program!
On Thursday, September 15th, 7-10PM EST, Mark Levine of "Inside Scoop" will be hosting a call-in radio show on the troubled-teen industry. He will be broadcasting as the guest host of the Leslie Marshall Show, a nationally syndicated program that airs on over 70 stations, coast to coast.
If there are enough survivors willing to share thier stories, he will consider doing another three hour show the next evening as well, focusing on the actions that are being taken to stop the systematic abuses in these programs.
On 11/10/05, Mark Levine aired a call-program with Jon Gorenfeld and some survivors of Straight Inc. http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=481 (http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=481) The public response was so strong that he did a follow-up program a few days later, http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=482 (http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=482)
Mark wants our stories heard and he wants to see an end to the systematic abuses that continue today. He is especially interested in hearing from survivors of currently-operating programs and from survivors of programs that are or were tied to today's politicians.
If you are willing to share your experience and knowledge of coercive thought reform and behavior modification, please let Mark know. His email is [email protected]
I would like to see us unify our voices and bring about a fundamental change in the way "brainwashing" and torture are used as "therapy" for teens. I am deeply concerned by the blind eye our Government, our psychologists and our state regulators have given to this industry.
There hasn't been any research into the long-term, negative side-effects of coercive thought reform and behavior modification upon teens. The APA has refused to acknowledge or define these potentially damaging behavioral technologies. This reluctance to define coercive thought reform has enabled the abuse of thousands and thousands of adolescents. There are now enough of us out there to effectively demand accountability from the enablers of this industry and from those who have profited as program executives.
Eventually America will see how insane some of these current adolescent "treatment programs" are. Let's go ahead and make it sooner rather than later. Many different programs utilize the same basic techniques. We are the ones who know this, and really it's up to us to stop it.
Please let Mark know you'll be calling him on September 15th to speak about your experience and what needs to be done. There are two numbers you can call on the 15th, they will both reach him, (888) 488-MARK or (888) 653-7543.
Thank you,
:tup: :tup:
-
Yep,it's time to unite,even with switchblade sticking,brass-knuckle swinging jackasses like Alexander B.Dodd,the stalker..........
Sam, a little backround would be helpful. Who did this guy stalk? He's from right here in St. Pete. Does this stalking involve other straitgtlings?
none-ya have "pursuing Danny" on a persistent basis. Yer shouldn't get to worked up about who you think are stalkers. lol
-
Yep,it's time to unite,even with switchblade sticking,brass-knuckle swinging jackasses like Alexander B.Dodd,the stalker..........
Sam, a little backround would be helpful. Who did this guy stalk? He's from right here in St. Pete. Does this stalking involve other straitgtlings?
none-ya have "pursuing Danny" on a persistent basis. Yer shouldn't get to worked up about who you think are stalkers. lol
Fuckin' drama queens and gossip mongers all.. maybe there is a more appropriate thread for this bullshit.
When you a-holes are done I'll bump the Original Post again.
-
Sorry Froderik, you're right This is not the thread for my question. Iv'e since moved it to the Brian Dodd thread
-
Dear People,
All survivors of coercive thought reform and behavior modification programs are invited to share their stories on this three-hour, upcoming national radio program!
On Thursday, September 15th, 7-10PM EST, Mark Levine of "Inside Scoop" will be hosting a call-in radio show on the troubled-teen industry. He will be broadcasting as the guest host of the Leslie Marshall Show, a nationally syndicated program that airs on over 70 stations, coast to coast.
If there are enough survivors willing to share thier stories, he will consider doing another three hour show the next evening as well, focusing on the actions that are being taken to stop the systematic abuses in these programs.
On 11/10/05, Mark Levine aired a call-program with Jon Gorenfeld and some survivors of Straight Inc. http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=481 (http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=481) The public response was so strong that he did a follow-up program a few days later, http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=482 (http://radioinsidescoop.com/?p=482)
Mark wants our stories heard and he wants to see an end to the systematic abuses that continue today. He is especially interested in hearing from survivors of currently-operating programs and from survivors of programs that are or were tied to today's politicians.
If you are willing to share your experience and knowledge of coercive thought reform and behavior modification, please let Mark know. His email is [email protected]
I would like to see us unify our voices and bring about a fundamental change in the way "brainwashing" and torture are used as "therapy" for teens. I am deeply concerned by the blind eye our Government, our psychologists and our state regulators have given to this industry.
There hasn't been any research into the long-term, negative side-effects of coercive thought reform and behavior modification upon teens. The APA has refused to acknowledge or define these potentially damaging behavioral technologies. This reluctance to define coercive thought reform has enabled the abuse of thousands and thousands of adolescents. There are now enough of us out there to effectively demand accountability from the enablers of this industry and from those who have profited as program executives.
Eventually America will see how insane some of these current adolescent "treatment programs" are. Let's go ahead and make it sooner rather than later. Many different programs utilize the same basic techniques. We are the ones who know this, and really it's up to us to stop it.
Please let Mark know you'll be calling him on September 15th to speak about your experience and what needs to be done. There are two numbers you can call on the 15th, they will both reach him, (888) 488-MARK or (888) 653-7543.
Thank you,
Looking forward to this!!
Could we have a concise reiteration / update on:
1. the number(s) to call
2. the dates / times it will air
3. a link to a list of the radio stations that the show will be airing on in various states??
Thanks!!
-
-
Excellent! Kpickle in the morning. :rofl:
I presume the shows will be archived somewhere for people who are unable to listen at those times?
-
-
The show seemed to be really good. Hoping tomorrow will be as good too.
I wanted to post a message left by Cliff Brownstein (NATSAP DIRECTOR). BTW, he was asked to call in and speak by Mark Levine personally on the program but declined citing not enough time to prepare. Say what?
He wrote:
I hope that in the course of your shows, you at least give a semblance of balance as you portray these programs that allegedly have abused teens. As in any industry or profession, there are some bad apples. Abuse, or what is termed abuse by some, has occurred. Our association, composed of private residential treatment centers, therapeutic boarding schools, and wilderness programs, does not knowingly accept these substandard programs, we have stringent admission standards, and we take measures when we hear about anything negative happening within these programs. There are overwhelmingly far more programs that help thousands of kids with myriad psychological and behavioral problems with no hint of abuse in any way. The problem is, the good programs don’t make good copy, don’t make headlines, and aren’t as entertaining. They simply do an outstanding job of helping kids through their issues, enabling them to continue their educations and lead productive lives. It would be great if you could build a show around that.
Clifford M. Brownstein
Executive Director
National Association of Therapeutic Schools and Programs (NATSAP)
Wasn't Jan Moss the NATSAP representative that congress tore up during the congressional hearings in '08? And then NATSAP fired her? I remember them asking her what NATSAP did specifically and she had no answer.....FRAUD. I wonder what Cliff has prepared for the public so he doesn't "pull a Moss".
-
Mark Levine's reply To Cliff:
I have formally invited Clifford Brownstein, Executive Director of the National Association of Therapeutic Schools and Programs (NATSAP) to speak on the show.
He told me that he declined to participate on the grounds that he did not have enough time to prepare (He had only known about the show as of Monday) and that the title of my show proved I was focusing on the negative aspects of these programs.
I told him I always encourage dissenting voices on my show, that I had no doubt that some people have had some positive experience with some of these programs, and I strongly encouraged him to ask some of those people to call in. In fact, I challenged him, saying that a man in his position should be able to easily find people who have had positive experiences in his organizations' programs.
As of this writing, he has declined to participate. I have strongly urged him to reconsider and I hope he does.
-
Jan Moss, lol... there is some epic footage for you.
"SO JUST WHAT DOES NATSAP DO????" or something like that.
Will have a listen later on and I hope it doesn't turn into a straight inc, straight inc, straight inc, elan, elan, straight inc, elan, wwasp, straight inc, straight inc.... call in sort of show.
Though its more of a backhanded compliment towards the Straight crowd as they seem to be a bit more organized than most other alumni groups, probably due to the time they've had to come together as a community.
I'd call in but I don't think I'm the best person to represent former-goons for hire. Plenty of other well spoken individuals who don't have pictures of their testicles on the internet who have the dubious distinction of being a former-goon/paid. That rich guy who said sorry for his crimes comes to mind. Maybe MBHB of the 3 springs goon for hire alumni crowd.
I know a guy from facebook who has like a PhD or something who worked at some program in Texas. Damn, he told me some fuuuucked up stories about that place, made me feel positively tame in comparison.
Prolly too late now, if he ever makes a request for former staff/thugs drop me a line. I'll send out a few messages.
-
I emailed Mark a link to http://wiki.fornits.com/index.php?title=NATSAP (http://wiki.fornits.com/index.php?title=NATSAP)
-
Seems to me the host could have better prepared. He didn't seem up to speed on the TTI.It's like he never even heard of Elan.He kept asking one woman if her program was in "Iran". Right after he just got through talking to somebody else from Elan. I know it's good to have an advocate in the media,but someone needs to smarten him up on the real history of the TTI.
Straight was not the first program. Remember Sembler basically inherited his program (clients and all) from the seed. And their roots go back to synanon and AA. We'll see how part 2 does. I'll still download and keep these shows archived.
-
-
Sometimes I think maybe this is just a way to get everybody's IP addresses and hack the survivor community...everybody all streaming in there. I'm getting weird email spam since last night.
Paranoid! :twofinger: :twofinger: :twofinger: :twofinger: :twofinger:
-
-
Small cleansing breathes dude...
and then relax...
I talked to Antigen on facefook last night. She said she tried calling in but the lines were jammed. Would not have minded hearing she got a little airtime.
If you think about it.. she should be in the "expert" category for tonight. Is anyone fascinating on the line up tonight or is it a redux of the GAO hearing where Cafety plus a few Bazeleon folks had the floor? I saw a few comments on facebook alluding to as much.
This would be a great opportunity for that SIA group I've been hearing about to get some air-time. Maybe even just as great for of the more lessor known programs to have their say.
Good that Levine gives a shit though, coz in the end the entire issue could use all the air-time it can get.
-
-
Dragonfly, Maybe you're not that paranoid. Sometimes when I search around the net and I go to different types of sites, the spam I get is alot of the times related to my searches. I'm sure it's automated,and nothing to worry about. Just spammers.
-
And a way to avoid the commercials is to wait until the show has been saved on his site,they cut out all of them for their archive. But then you can't call in live,which is just about impossible anyway. Notice, nobody plugged fornits?
-
-
I haven’t yet had a chance to listen to Thursday night’s show, but after tuning in for the second of the two part broadcast tonight, I think, (especially considering the scope of the TTI and the many far reaches of it ranging from so called therapeutic boarding schools, wilderness programs, religious academies and varieties of drug TCs, psych units etc.…so much ground to cover) Mark Levine has done a great job of bringing the voices of survivors of abusive programs and the reality of the plight of kids who are still in jeopardy of these abuses to his audience.
Kisses blown and tearful ovation to everyone who called in, got through and spoke out.
http://marklevinetv.com/?p=9046 (http://marklevinetv.com/?p=9046) <What’s Worse than Teen-Age Drug Abuse? Drug Programs Abusing Teenagers
-
I used to be very paranoid (overly cautious) and I think sometimes there are good reasons to be on the lookout. But then I realized that I wasn't that important and worrying about impending doom wouldn't help me anyway.
So I decided to not be so cautious. And now I am as mellow as a jelly bean.
I only carry 2 guns now.
:)
-
I used to be very paranoid (overly cautious) and I think sometimes there are good reasons to be on the lookout. But then I realized that I wasn't that important and worrying about impending doom wouldn't help me anyway.
So I decided to not be so cautious. And now I am as mellow as a jelly bean.
I only carry 2 guns now.
:)
I will vouch that this is a massive improvement for WDtony.
:seg:
And Antigen did try to get on the air, she got the busy signal every single time she tried. I think maybe next time he ought to consider scheduling his calls or something.
Not overjoyed about Miller. I think he's completely deluded on the impact that licensing will have on programs. I worked in two licensed programs and it didn't do jack squat for them. The entire tree is rotted from the roots on up.
I hear the SIA lady had a chance to speak. That's good they got a pretty happening new organization with a pretty nifty sounding conference scheduled for the future. Good on them.
-
I didn't get to hear the entire show due to a computer glitch so I had hoped that Anti- had gotten a chance to speak. I think she always does very well with "summing up" these issues.
Che, you worked in programs, I am trying to attack the point of no 3rd party complaints. If Law Enforcement/CPS could legally investigate allegations from 3rd parties about programs (like they do in in a private citizen's homes) that would be cheap and at least somewhat effective, right? You know, like a wedge to get things started.
but I know there must be huge legal issues to contend with etc. So when people have tried this avenue before what problems did they run into?
-
Tell me how you interview and compliment a filmaker when you havn't seen his work. Mark needs to do more research.
Again,not one mention of fornits.
-
Che, you worked in programs, I am trying to attack the point of no 3rd party complaints. If Law Enforcement/CPS could legally investigate allegations from 3rd parties about programs (like they do in in a private citizen's homes) that would be cheap and at least somewhat effective, right? You know, like a wedge to get things started.
but I know there must be huge legal issues to contend with etc. So when people have tried this avenue before what problems did they run into?
I've seen the police come a couple times. They rarely stayed long or seemed to care all that much. I do think 3rd party complaints can work though.
Remember the Boonseville incident with the WWASP program? A bunch of rabble rousers, if I recall were stirred up by a certain web forum called Fornits, ended up at a Boonesville City council meeting and got the license for a WWASP program denied.
So 3rd party complaints can work... it probably just is a matter of what your approach is and how swiftly you strike your targets of opportunity. I think with the police though.. They want to see a 1st hand witness, because most of the police and CPS do work fairly hard at whatever it is they do... eat donuts.. beat people up.. stuff kids into abusive foster homes etc.. and I don't think they are going to want to spend alot of time on a 3rd party complaint that isn't an actual witness to an abusive witness.
This is what I'd do if I had the time, money, and was in the same city as the program.
I'd find out where they all tend to drink. I'd sit quietly in a corner and wait for them to get half liquored up, and then I'd wait for the war stories to start before pushing play on my audio recorder.
You haven't heard fucked gossip like program staff flapping their jaws about who did what and so forth. It's a veritable cornucopia of human degeneracy being spewed out of drunken lips just begging to be posted on youtube and having the audio file emailed to every single member of the program and the city they live in.
-
Well Che, I see what you're sayin. I knew you'd have some insight into this kind of thing.
I guess I just don't have a lot of faith in expensive, no teeth legislation. And states haven't been takin care of business here. And let's face it, even if we did things the way you and I know we want to do them, the outcome wouldn't be that effective overall....probably just make a lot of noise and make things worse for the cause.
I am trying to think of a solution that is cheap and effective with some simple changes in law.
It seems like lately something is forming...media is more involved, way more people are coming together.... I don't know, it just seems like there are so many webpages against programs now compared to 4 years ago. So there's hope.
There was a time after I left KHK that if I would have had the information that is presented online today.....I mean, I was a crazy kid..... I am not sure I would have remained inactive. and with all the kids on psyche drugs shooting up schools and the like..... some very bad things could happen to those who abuse these kids.
I just hope something can be done by law before the street justice begins. Because nobody really wins when pushed to that point. And kids won't see that.
You got a good idea, which is basically sneaky evidence gathering. Now to find that watering hole.......
-
Well Che, I see what you're sayin. I knew you'd have some insight into this kind of thing.
You could always try.. I might be completely talking out of my ass. It only costs you a phone call or two.
I guess I just don't have a lot of faith in expensive, no teeth legislation. And states haven't been takin care of business here. And let's face it, even if we did things the way you and I know we want to do them, the outcome wouldn't be that effective overall....probably just make a lot of noise and make things worse for the cause.
Yeah.. both dumps I worked at were licensed.. Ginger will tell the story about the state of florida notices on the wall for Straight.. Elan was licensed in its weird ol' way by Maine.. so on and so forth..
Hell.. Not even the state of New Yawk or wherever it is the Rothenberg shock em till they drop Center is will shut down shock therapy right now let alone years ago when they should have.
Licensing is more bullshit, new wrapper, no way to put the boots to the places.
I am trying to think of a solution that is cheap and effective with some simple changes in law.
Qui Tam suits.. government will give you money for blowing the whistle on fraud. Several programs would be ripped a new one if staff started squealing about what really goes on there and what really the government is paying for.
It seems like lately something is forming...media is more involved, way more people are coming together.... I don't know, it just seems like there are so many webpages against programs now compared to 4 years ago. So there's hope.
Let's just hope this new wave of interest doesn't pass it over like the interest after the GAO hearings did.
There was a time after I left KHK that if I would have had the information that is presented online today.....I mean, I was a crazy kid..... I am not sure I would have remained inactive. and with all the kids on psyche drugs shooting up schools and the like..... some very bad things could happen to those who abuse these kids.
Punisher time...
I just hope something can be done by law before the street justice begins. Because nobody really wins when pushed to that point. And kids won't see that.
On the otherside though.. street justice would force people to examine the issues in a new light. It doesn't take too much to ask, "Well wtf.. why are they going after these poor ol' programmie kool-aid swillers.. maybe these kids don't like getting the fuck beat out of them??"
Could easily go the other way as well.. hard to say.
You got a good idea, which is basically sneaky evidence gathering. Now to find that watering hole.......
One thing I'm pretty sure will work is you claim you work for another program and are in the area visiting or something. Use some of your own war stories from KHK for your basis of reality and soon you'll be trading yarn for yarn.
Cell-phones have voice recorders.
-
Holy shit! I wanna roll with youuuuuu! LOL
Didn't get a chance to hear last night's show. Silly phone wouldn't play any of the streams that I tried and my internet access is limited as hell since some jack ass stole my computer. Hope it went well. I like your idea, Che. Wouldn't have thought of it cause Seed/Straight staff wouldn't be caught dead in a bar. Nother nifty idea I've tossed around. Call up the *other* kind of escort services, ask them to do to your 16yo daughter what teen escorts do. Play THAT on youtube.
And yes, no, I have just about 0 faith in regulation to do anything meaningful or useful. When they hung signs on the walls in Straigt saying "Call 1-800-xxx-xxxx to report abuse" it was demoralizing. The well intended bastards forgot to include regulations preventing us being slammed to the floor for reaching for a phone.
But the folks behind the legislation are going to go full bore with it anyway so we may as well take what we can get. The legislative process generates lots of documentation, statements, evidene.... publicity. Any publicity is good publicity, right? And at least it might actually cause *some* better access by CYS types to these programs. You dance right close to the nut of the prblem, Che. The real issue is not a lack of laws and regulations against torture. It's a broad conspiracy among cops et all to unsee it even when we shove it right in their faces. THAT has got to change if our society is to go down in history as anything other than monsters.
-
-
media attention is great, but it can distract from the source of the abuse
. . . brainwashing is the issue
:tup:
-
Brainwashing may be the issue, but the programs themselves are the source of the issue.
HENCE;
NO PROGRAMS = NO BRAINWASHING!
duh..........
-
No chicken, no egg.
-
No chicken, no egg.
Lizards lay eggs (:
-
Turtles lay eggs also.
Now if you are gonna try to roll like a paid goon/staff you have to have your shit organized. Do some research.. social engineering is the game we are trying to play.
Mind you.. take all this as you will.. I've never actually tried this.. but.. the foundation for it is well laid in the life and times of one Kevin Mitnick.
Seriously, download his book.
The little shit scammed everyone for years. He wasn't some genius level hacker.. he was an excellent bullshit artist.
If you are going to imitate a program you need the basics of it first. Call them up.. find out a few of the buzzwords.
3 springs.. restraints are called SAMA Satori Alternative to Managing aggression.. what staffer wouldn't know the full name of their restraint system?
Believe me they would.
Find out the key details.. like director names.. etc.
You don't need everything.. just enough to make your story sound believable.
This is what I'd do... I'd call as a parent first.. Act all scared.. ask some questions..
Get the program director's name. Ask for information on their restraint system.. tell them you heard about some kid dying in a restraint and you want to google their system's name to see how safe it is. Get every specific fact you can out of them.
And then go prowling for a bar...
In smaller towns it'll be easier... but larger towns.. dunno what to tell you.. maybe more social engineering? Pretend you are part of the all valley karaoke competition or something and invite their staff to it? Fook if I know..
Get creative.
What we are trying to do is to put them into the proper light that they really ought to be viewed. Booze loosens up their inhibitions. It gets them talking about all the dirty shit. We want them babbling away about that sort of thing. We want them bragging about their slammings and what not.
We want to put it on youtube, because we want people to see these staff/goons for the animals they are.
The more popularized we make this.. the more we hack away at the veneer of civility that surrounds them through their so called work..
The more we completely paint them in the worst possible light.
Now yall might wonder why I'd suggest such a thing. Because at some point you gotta give them an out. Their out is making the call. Their out is calling up the media. Either staff is willing to call in the media and police or the aren't.
There is no middle ground. There is no exceptions to be made for sick donkeys needing vet treatment.. no exceptions made because they have family.. It's a war.. it's us against them. Either they do the right thing or we go all out on them.
There is nothing other than either they make the fucking call or they get slammed over and over again.
Once they've come clean.. they are on the side of angels... well as close as you can get to that with the occasional survivor freakout, but you know what I mean. But hey, even I've come to accept that the occasional survivor meltdown is just part of the package, shit happens.
:deal: HEAL... :seg:
Now, I'm former staff.. and I'm saying that's what I'd do to me and my colleagues. Don't play nice coz I can assure you all that the people I used to work with would stop at nothing to defend their livelihoods. I was slandered on this forum several times by programmies.
Smeared all over Facebook and so on and so forth.
All because I wouldn't shut up about what happened at 3 turds.
So my friends.. GO FORTH and put foot to balls. I implore you to put these animals in the worst possible light possible. MAKE THEM out for the shitbirds they are.
/ends rant.
-
I think any number of us could done a more knowledgeable and infmormative interview on this subject. Hopefully he will stay on this.He seemed like he wasn't even hip the Anderson Cooper report on the christian girls school. And that was recent and on mainstream media to boot.
-
now we just need a button camera and a good audio device..... then target a program's peer staff.
-
Turtles lay eggs also.
Now if you are gonna try to roll like a paid goon/staff you have to have your shit organized. Do some research.. social engineering is the game we are trying to play.
Mind you.. take all this as you will.. I've never actually tried this.. but.. the foundation for it is well laid in the life and times of one Kevin Mitnick.
Seriously, download his book.
The little shit scammed everyone for years. He wasn't some genius level hacker.. he was an excellent bullshit artist.
If you are going to imitate a program you need the basics of it first. Call them up.. find out a few of the buzzwords.
3 springs.. restraints are called SAMA Satori Alternative to Managing aggression.. what staffer wouldn't know the full name of their restraint system?
Believe me they would.
Find out the key details.. like director names.. etc.
You don't need everything.. just enough to make your story sound believable.
This is what I'd do... I'd call as a parent first.. Act all scared.. ask some questions..
Get the program director's name. Ask for information on their restraint system.. tell them you heard about some kid dying in a restraint and you want to google their system's name to see how safe it is. Get every specific fact you can out of them.
And then go prowling for a bar...
In smaller towns it'll be easier... but larger towns.. dunno what to tell you.. maybe more social engineering? Pretend you are part of the all valley karaoke competition or something and invite their staff to it? Fook if I know..
Get creative.
What we are trying to do is to put them into the proper light that they really ought to be viewed. Booze loosens up their inhibitions. It gets them talking about all the dirty shit. We want them babbling away about that sort of thing. We want them bragging about their slammings and what not.
We want to put it on youtube, because we want people to see these staff/goons for the animals they are.
The more popularized we make this.. the more we hack away at the veneer of civility that surrounds them through their so called work..
The more we completely paint them in the worst possible light.
Now yall might wonder why I'd suggest such a thing. Because at some point you gotta give them an out. Their out is making the call. Their out is calling up the media. Either staff is willing to call in the media and police or the aren't.
There is no middle ground. There is no exceptions to be made for sick donkeys needing vet treatment.. no exceptions made because they have family.. It's a war.. it's us against them. Either they do the right thing or we go all out on them.
There is nothing other than either they make the fucking call or they get slammed over and over again.
Once they've come clean.. they are on the side of angels... well as close as you can get to that with the occasional survivor freakout, but you know what I mean. But hey, even I've come to accept that the occasional survivor meltdown is just part of the package, shit happens.
:deal: HEAL... :seg:
Now, I'm former staff.. and I'm saying that's what I'd do to me and my colleagues. Don't play nice coz I can assure you all that the people I used to work with would stop at nothing to defend their livelihoods. I was slandered on this forum several times by programmies.
Smeared all over Facebook and so on and so forth.
All because I wouldn't shut up about what happened at 3 turds.
So my friends.. GO FORTH and put foot to balls. I implore you to put these animals in the worst possible light possible. MAKE THEM out for the shitbirds they are.
/ends rant.
So why havn't you done any of these things yourself?
Oh that's right,you live in fucking China. What if somebody follows your advice and winds up going to jail for harrasment or stalking? "It's ok,an ex staffer in China told me what to do."
yeah,that should work.............
-
Yes.. as we all know drinking with staff is going to get you put into jail for stalking.
Where did I say follow them home and shit?
Where did I say start getting stupid and breaking laws?
Making a couple phone calls asking some questions isn't illegal. Hoisting beers with someone in public isn't illegal. Even claiming you are the tooth fairy isn't illegal let alone pretending to be a paid goon/staff.
So how is anyone going to get put into jail?
It's a public conversation, there aren't any laws about recording it.
Calm down girlfriend before you get your perm in a muss.
While you are at it stop whining about all the free air-time we are getting on the radio show. If you can do a better job then go do it.
I'm quite happy with the entire event and I think it went very well. I appreciate the man's effort on a subject he had very little knowledge of.
-
Che wrote:
"I appreciate the man's effort on a subject he had very little knowledge of."
Yes it's good to media coverage. But I hope he smartens up.
And following people around to find out where they drink or socialize? Like there's any other way to find out. That's stalking. And besides anything sombody cops to in a bar,will never hold any water.And if you're gonna' call them on the phone,you had better use a throw away cell phone. 'Cause caller id will lead them right to your house. Why not just find out where they live,ring their doorbell and then run away.Maybe leave a bag of burning dog shit on the door step. That will be just as effective.
-
I have no idea what will happen....but personally I don't care if something negative happens to me at this point. I honestly want child torturers to try and drag me into court for something ridiculous. I have very little to lose.
There are many great convergences happening within the survivor communities, and this is terrific. But programs aren't closing fast enough and I agree with Che's theme which is to actively collect evidence if possible.
I disagree about Mark Levine though... I mean what he has done and is doing for the survivor community is commendable. I can't list all of the good things that were said on the show and all of the content covered. I don't think he has time to "smarten up", I mean he has a lot to do in his own life I'm sure, why should we expect him to bend over backwards when he has already devoted so much air time to us?
It's time to reassess the situation.
-
wdtony wrote:
"why should we expect him to bend over backwards when he has already devoted so much air time to us?"
It's called show prep.A good interviewer is like a good lawyer.(which he said he was)"Never ask a question you don't already know the answer to". no surprises and less wasted time rehashing.He interviewed Nick Gaglia without even watching any of his work. You know he couldn't have read Mia 's book either.He is actually just a fill in for another host anyway.
-
wdtony wrote:
"why should we expect him to bend over backwards when he has already devoted so much air time to us?"
It's called show prep.A good interviewer is like a good lawyer.(which he said he was)"Never ask a question you don't already know the answer to". no surprises and less wasted time rehashing.He interviewed Nick Gaglia without even watching any of his work. You know he couldn't have read Mia 's book either.He is actually just a fill in for another host anyway.
I see your points about being a good interviewer but I think you are downplaying the positives of this. The mistakes he made are in my opinion dwarfed by the overwhelming support he gave to the survivor community. This was a talk show, not a documentary. And I am very happy with the result.
-
I think that good will come out of this if he can do more shows. Didn't he say that he was also on tv? Well I think if wants to pusue the TTI, he'll find an audience. I am greatfull for his enthusuiasm. I hope he follows up on this. Maybe if he were to get a flood of e-mails,he can cultivate an audience. I did send him a nice one thanking him for taking up this cause.(And no I didn't correct him on anything). I hope there is more to come.
-
I think that good will come out of this if he can do more shows. Didn't he say that he was also on tv? Well I think if wants to pusue the TTI, he'll find an audience. I am greatfull for his enthusuiasm. I hope he follows up on this. Maybe if he were to get a flood of e-mails,he can cultivate an audience. I did send him a nice one thanking him for taking up this cause.(And no I didn't correct him on anything). I hope there is more to come.
None Ya follow his facebook page, he is being overwhelmed with emails, call ins ect....it shut down his server twice on both nights of the show. This radio show was a huge success with survivors, parents of survivors ect....the inspiration this created and the ripple effect can not even be measured right now. Five new sites and groups sprung up right after the show that I know of, survivors are flocking to these places to be heard like never before.
Get out there be a part of it, there is a WWASP protest happening in Dallas this October, who cares if you went to a WWASP program or not be a part of.
-
-
Dragonfly,
You are so missing out on some great discussions on the facebook reddit wall. Seriously, join if only for that reason. I had to boot a bunch of folks off my friend's list recently coz their messages were blocking out all of my friend's messages. But I do find the reddit wall to have some decent conversations.
and of course you have the magic and wonder of farmsville.
I WILL KILL YOU IF YOU Send me a farmsville invite.
-
Facebook is a confusing pain in the ass.Iv'e wasted more time just trying to navagate the site,than I spent reading. Execpt for Waynes book.That was always in the same place. And I didn't have to ask to join somebodys clique to read it.
-
-
Facebook has the social nature of high school. Who hangs out with who. The cool kids,the jocks,the brains,the christians ect.. To friend or not to friend. If you only want to socialise with a few selected people, that's what e-mail is for. I told Mark Levine(via e-mail) that is was through fornits that a lot of us found his show. Let's see if he comes here.
-
Facebook has the social nature of high school. Who hangs out with who. The cool kids,the jocks,the brains,the christians ect.. To friend or not to friend. If you only want to socialise with a few selected people, that's what e-mail is for. I told Mark Levine(via e-mail) that is was through fornits that a lot of us found his show. Let's see if he comes here.
Ha,Ha,Ha. A burnt out old fake hippie guy sends you an email to go to a conspiracy site and you jump right to to it! Yeah right, none-ya. Keep dreaming that people want to read your crazy theories and hear all about how you were in straight for a week and split then spent the rest of your life on a conspiracy message board blaming all of your problems on a week's vacation in rehab. Too much lol
...
-
Facebook has the social nature of high school. Who hangs out with who. The cool kids,the jocks,the brains,the christians ect.. To friend or not to friend. If you only want to socialise with a few selected people, that's what e-mail is for. I told Mark Levine(via e-mail) that is was through fornits that a lot of us found his show. Let's see if he comes here.
Ha,Ha,Ha. A burnt out old fake hippie guy sends you an email to go to a conspiracy site and you jump right to to it! Yeah right, none-ya. Keep dreaming that people want to read your crazy theories and hear all about how you were in straight for a week and split then spent the rest of your life on a conspiracy message board blaming all of your problems on a week's vacation in rehab. Too much lol
...
I was never in straight . Anyone but a troll knows that. And besides we all know that you're not the real whooter anyway.We all know you are psy's idea. Except next to you the real whooter was Hemmingway. A real silver tounged professional. You are nothing more than a pain in the tukuss. But remember, the quality of your intelect shines through.
-
Dragon Fly most groups on Facebook allow you to read their walls so long as they are open groups. You can't post, in your case this would be perfect. Much information as Che said can be gleaned from this particular Reddit Group http://www.facebook.com/groups/185627381482928/ (http://www.facebook.com/groups/185627381482928/).
Good luck...
BTW I have appreciated your hard work for a while now on several blogs and sites. Thanks.
-
Facebook has the social nature of high school. Who hangs out with who. The cool kids,the jocks,the brains,the christians ect.. To friend or not to friend. If you only want to socialise with a few selected people, that's what e-mail is for. I told Mark Levine(via e-mail) that is was through fornits that a lot of us found his show. Let's see if he comes here.
Ha,Ha,Ha. A burnt out old fake hippie guy sends you an email to go to a conspiracy site and you jump right to to it! Yeah right, none-ya. Keep dreaming that people want to read your crazy theories and hear all about how you were in straight for a week and split then spent the rest of your life on a conspiracy message board blaming all of your problems on a week's vacation in rehab. Too much lol
...
I was never in straight . Anyone but a troll knows that. And besides we all know that you're not the real whooter anyway.We all know you are psy's idea. Except next to you the real whooter was Hemmingway. A real silver tounged professional. You are nothing more than a pain in the tukuss. But remember, the quality of your intelect shines through.
none-ya "Wh??ter" Was The gatekeeper's idea from the start. You still haven't figured it out, have you? lol