Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: dragonfly on April 12, 2011, 08:00:44 PM
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Well Dragonfly, if you do the math, it NEVER adds up. Secondly, if there were 50,000 damn straightlings out there and only 400 of them cared enough to visit some sites over the last decade, well, that's 49,400 more that simply don't give enough of a shit to worry about it. Good luck with your search!! :rocker:
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To bring our stories into the public eye is to invite ridicule and scorn. I think most of us here believe that to be worthwhile if it can prevent this from happening to more children. Many of our fellow survivors may not think so, or they may have more to lose. Or they might be dead, insane or in jail, which can be a self fulfilling prophecy after the program has convinced your parents that you are a lost cause (speaking from experience). I only very recently got my shit together enough to have a computer and only then did I find this community of survivors. Of course, I was a "cop-out", I ran as soon as they moved me to phase 2, after 5 months on phase 1. I got all of the "breaking down" and none of the "building up". I will never believe that that was healthy for anyone. Motivating? Beltlooping? All those kids carving their arms? Those goddamned songs? Nope, we are not the crazy ones, even if it does sometimes seem that way. Incidentally, I am not even one of those 50,000, I was in LIFE.
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well, we all know only a couple straight locations had 300+ clients at any given time. From 1976 until 1993, let's say for argument's sake that there were 9 facilities and 300 kids per year. That's about 45,900 kids total. In reality though, several of the branches didn't even open till mid 80's and most branches didn't have 300 kids per year. It's probably closer to 20,000 TOTAL heads into the scrubbers, out of which about 25 percent are most likely dead. The rest are "out there" somewhere doing whatever...
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well, we all know only a couple straight locations had 300+ clients at any given time. From 1976 until 1993, let's say for argument's sake that there were 9 facilities and 300 kids per year. That's about 45,900 kids total. In reality though, several of the branches didn't even open till mid 80's and most branches didn't have 300 kids per year. It's probably closer to 20,000 TOTAL heads into the scrubbers, out of which about 25 percent are most likely dead. The rest are "out there" somewhere doing whatever...
Right except all facilities were not open during that time span and all facilities did not have 250-300 kids at every given time. I'd say it's a good bit less, like you are saying William probably closer to 20,000.
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I think you have a good point about the shame of bringing the story out, I feel attacks of that with the movie coming out...
I hear ya on this although my perspective is different. Do you mean shame of contributing to abuse or just being put in Straight? I hope I'm not being too personal, just curious. I'm hoping the good out weighs the bad. I've gotten a number of emails from people thanking us for making this film. That it gave them something they could send to their parents, opened up that door of communication. Not to mention the plethora of current parents it will enlighten so they don't do this to their children. The healing that seems to be starting. As well as finally being able to hold the criminals responsible for the abuse and the deaths.
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I agree, Ijust cant see 50,000......I always figured that not counting ,spin offs,and siblings that maybe the tolal of people who actually were on front row probably doesnt exceed 25,000. Now some of those people are going to be in sundry forms of denial , ranging from the people who were only exposed briefly,to those who were long term attendees.Most folks I figure would just like to forget it ever happened.I spent decades trying myself,only to get the ocasional "flash" of rage usually when some jackass or another would try to be controlling, or to presume to tell me how I SHOULD feel or think. Now I wish I could remember and try to purge it in some fashion. Id be willing to bet most are trying to forget or deny ,all to varying degrees that have some connection to how long they were there,and how fucked up they were to start with. It becomes hard to say after a point.....some folks flat out didnt need to be there to begin with,the involvement they had with drugs was minimal or non-existant, there were others of us who hit front row at a real shit point in our lives,only to be furthur beaten down by our supposed "saviors".
I also wonder how many folks went on to do what? Be the ceo of somthing? Join the military? Do time? Just live a life?
The options are fairly broad,and will vary from person to person. I know theres got to be a shitload of walking wounded out there,and lots who dont know why,and many more who wont admit why.
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I think you have a good point about the shame of bringing the story out, I feel attacks of that with the movie coming out...
I hear ya on this although my perspective is different. Do you mean shame of contributing to abuse or just being put in Straight? I hope I'm not being too personal, just curious. I'm hoping the good out weighs the bad. I've gotten a number of emails from people thanking us for making this film. That it gave them something they could send to their parents, opened up that door of communication. Not to mention the plethora of current parents it will enlighten so they don't do this to their children. The healing that seems to be starting. As well as finally being able to hold the criminals responsible for the abuse and the deaths.
I wonder also how many parents went to their graves ,full of regret for the roles they had in it.How many families who waddled thier asses into str8 on the last legs of hope only to run aground and be crushed on the programs bullshit? How many children just split and never spoke to family again? or died full of rage towards parents.Yeah there's a fair amount of shame that comes with the idea of " I was locked up in this bizzaro-monkeyfarm-from-hell place",and then if one would bravely tell of the experience,the agast looks and statements of disbelief,would be enough to remind you not to do that shit again. People in general never want to believe monsters sometimes are quite real,and do exist,and may live next door.
It's easier to deny, go back to watching dancing with the stars or football,and whining about some superficial thing or the other.
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Web Diva...I was saying that some folks might just not want to admit they were in there out of embarrassment and shame...
Like if your an upstanding citizen with a fancy career, you might want to keep Straight in the realm of secrets...
Of course the movie might put a whole new cultural perspective out there, or begin to call awareness to abuse as "treatment", which might help folks come out of the woodwork...
For some, the risk of prestige and reputation might be more pressing than the need to talk about it...
That's when I wonder if we are the minority, stuck in our own form of group and the vast majority just chose to live a busy life and bury the insanity in being functional and successful...
I'm just questioning out loud for the hell of it...
I know there is no way to answer these questions really, I'm just realizing some of my assumptions lately as I ponder how in the fuck I could have wasted 20 odd years trying to shake the brainwash out of my head...
sometimes I wonder if I'd a been better off just repressing the whole thing and living a lie rather than trying to sort through mental bleach...
...I keep remembering though..."It's different this time cause the Houston police are involved" and that helps a little, I mean thank god for that at least...
I can dig that although I would think if someone was worried about people finding out they just would not go public with the fact that they were in there? Just as some stayed anonymous in the film for that reason, understandably so.
See with me had no one come out and posted online about the truth, I never would have known what really happened to my brother, so personally I'm thankful for that but again I'm coming at it from a different angle. I do get where you're coming from.
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When I first came on the forum 9 or so years ago, it used to perplex me quite a bit that there were so few members. For what it's worth, in all practical terms, the whole Straight Experience was just a blink in time for the clients who came from families that are good at sweeping things under the rug. I mean, would any of you join an organization that worshiped the proud ownership of Yugos? You remember them don't you? About the biggest pieces of shit in automotive history? Would you even own one if it were given to you?? Over the years, I have run into people that I knew in the program and most times I am avoided after that glimmer of recognition is over. I don't let it bother me any more.
In 1977, I was at Tampa Stadium attending a Led Zeppelin concert that ended up in a riot. It was also a life changing event, yet no one felt the need for a Reunion. It was not even mentioned in the book "Hammer of the Gods," but has been mentioned in other music biographies of that time period. There were close to 75 thousand people at that event, and having lived in the Tampa Bay area all of my life, I can say that I've run into less than ten people in the past 25 years that were there and can talk about it. I can only hope that the documentary will help bring about a change in this situation and hopefully change this country's drug policy in the future
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I am interested in knowing if any of you plan to share this film with your family in hopes the better understand what Straight was all about? Have any of your families shown any validation at all of your experience? I don't know why that is so important to me, but it is. I know that ultimately, we know what we know. But validation and understanding can be so healing.
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Dad has already seen some trailers and he told me he is looking forward to seeing the complete film. Mom, well she is another story. I sure love my mom, but she is still trying to justify putting me in the place and that I needed an "intervention" of some type. I told her maybe, but I sure as hell didn't need straight.
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I am interested in knowing if any of you plan to share this film with your family in hopes the better understand what Straight was all about? Have any of your families shown any validation at all of your experience? I don't know why that is so important to me, but it is. I know that ultimately, we know what we know. But validation and understanding can be so healing.
Personally, no. My mom is in enough pain over her son dying, I do not want to bring her any more. My dad, yes. He's interested and wants to know. He even interviewed for the film. I have gotten emails from some folks who shared the trailer with their parents, and from that ended up getting an apology and validation, which is awesome! :)
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KPick: I hope your Mom will watch the film. I understand if she felt helpless but there is no excuse for what happened at Straight. Difficult children don't grow in toxic sludge.
K: I understand why it would be too painful for your Mom. Does she at least recognize that the program was not psychologically sound?
--So glad other people are being validated. It really does help heal old hurts.
Anyone else?
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KPick: I hope your Mom will watch the film. I understand if she felt helpless but there is no excuse for what happened at Straight. Difficult children don't grow in toxic sludge.
K: I understand why it would be too painful for your Mom. Does she at least recognize that the program was not psychologically sound?
--So glad other people are being validated. It really does help heal old hurts.
Anyone else?
Oh i think she recognizes it but at the same time doesn't want to believe it was as bad as it was. Doesn't believe she was ever brainwashed, even though she taught parent raps twice a year for 2.5 years. I think she's in denial about the fact that the shit they were teaching was totally bogus and about the fact that tough love is not the way to go. C'est la vie. At this point I'm not going to try to change her mind. She still uses terms like druggie, and still had preconceived nothings about ANYONE who uses drugs. At the same time I have had my own issues with certain drugs, and I've always been open with her about it. I really had a time w/ somethings but I was able to get myself off them. At the same time I'm not one who believes because you shouldn't do coke, heroin, and meth, that that means you can't have a glass of wine or smoke a joint (seeing that weed is a plant not a drug). So many people believe this lie about all drugs being the same and they are all bad you should not do any of them. Sure maybe some people choose to steer clear of it all, but again it's not black and white, yet she sees it that way. Really not my problem at this point, I have no desire to try to "change" her mind. I can only continue to be open about what I do and see if it can wake her up a bit. As an example i have a cousin, who she things is awesome. Well he's smoked weed and done mushrooms. I asked him if I could share this with her and when I did she was shocked. But at the same time it might have given her a clue that not everyone just parties to get high (and if they do that's their business) but some people use what God placed her on this planet to gain some insight, or whatever. I am rambling now. :D
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exaggerated figures. they all do the same thing. so evil. torture cults faking legitimacy by inventing more customers. :( :(
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Gawd, I just gotta say this . . . ."if they were up your ass you'd know where they were" LOL (sorry folks, been restraining myself for about 1 week from saying this, but it's Friday and I'm feeling rather goofy) :)
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Dad has already seen some trailers and he told me he is looking forward to seeing the complete film. Mom, well she is another story. I sure love my mom, but she is still trying to justify putting me in the place and that I needed an "intervention" of some type. I told her maybe, but I sure as hell didn't need straight.
You were a 17 year old weekend warrior who smoked weed and drank beer.How many of your old friends are currently accessible on the Florida DOC Website?None?Hmmmm......Looks like they didn't need an intervention....why did you?You needed a chance to grow up!Your mother,like mine,is not ready to face up to the dreadful mistake they made.They probably never will.To justify Straight is to justify sadism and incompetence.