Fornits

Fornits Home for Wayward Web Fora
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry

First of all, I do apologize for my (degrading to you and me) rant following the responses to my post regarding my old druggies friends, that was uncalled for, base - a more civilized response from me would have been appropriate.
Regarding the oft requested apologies for my part in The Seed, that would be the equivalent (to me) of supporting a lie, feeding a delusion. I further believe that if you don?t understand this, it?s simply because you don?t want to. This is what I believe, ...me! Some of the posts reflect a belief that I have an expectation that you need to believe, I don?t, not the tiniest. I do not begrudge anyone whose opinion is vastly different from mine, nor do I begrudge them the right to shout it from the mountaintop(s) if they so desire.
You invited me to post at this site to answer questions that would clear up certain ambiguities. I have. And yes, in my doing more than that, (expressing personal opinions, feelings), the attention has become focused on me, not the answers you sought. If I continue to post at this site I have no intention of not expressing my thoughts and opinions, but I will try to minimize so as to not misdirect from what you specifically ask.
Let?s begin with my answering one I already answered. NO, I never struck fuelaw (whoever that is) or anyone else at The Seed, never happened, an absolutely bold face lie! Now let me ask you a question. No one here, not even the most adamant Seed haters, remembers the staff actually hitting anyone, yet fuelaw claims he was ?beat-up? by staff,...and more than once, both in Miami and Fort Lauderdale. Does this not give you cause to think about, question the validity of his claims? If not, sobeit, no more on comments from me on this subject.
Yes, I did, (as did other staff), turn down parents who attempted to place their kids in The Seed if I thought they, (and this is the term I used to parents), were not candidates for the program. The contagion that effected many parents during those years resulted in many kids showing up that did not need the program. In fact, the most prominent, outspoken member of this web site was one of those turned down, her parents being told she did not need the program.
If there was any doubt about an intake, even if substantial drug use was admitted, they were required to first see a psychiatrist for evaluation. In Miami, Ft. Lauderdale, Ft. Pierce it was Dr. Lester Keiser. In Cleveland it was Dr. David Logan. I do not remember the name of the doctor in St. Pete, though I?m sure if you want it, his name could be easily obtained. This was done strictly to determine if there was reason to suspect there may be other problems, not drug related.
There was one other post I read that I would like to respond to since I do have first hand knowledge regarding the validity of the accusation. Neither Judge Al Sepe or Judge Ellen Morphonios, (both sent many to The Seed), ever placed anyone in The Seed at the bequest of parents. Never. These are both people I knew well, considered friends, and neither took their judicial responsibility that lightly. Parents were never involved until after the fact and in many cases there was no parental involvement before or after. This was adult felony court at, (what was then called), The Criminal Court of Record at the Dade County Justice Building. These persons were all charged with felonies, - certain ones, at arraignment were interviewed, and if deemed candidates for rehabilitation, were give the choice of entering The Seed or continuing their entitled due process, not going to jail. I know, I was the one that sat in the court at the public defender?s table (in Sepe?s court) as they went through the court docket every morning. (A little side note here: Roy Black was one of the two public defenders permanently assigned to Sepe?s court during this period, I still get a kick out of how famous he has become).
Any other questions you have, ask, if I know, I?ll answer, but probably not in a timely manner.
Any other ill-founded, debasing, slanderous, profane, dishonest remarks, ...well, as you have so accurately and consistently pointed out, ... I have no control...

Defendant: The Seed
Issue: Good v. Bad
The problem with the trial we have going on here is that there is no judge, there is no jury. What we have is a continuous loop containing arguments and testimony from both sides. Though some questions may be answered and minor details cleared up, there is no resolution (verdict) in sight, nor will there ever be to the satisfaction of everyone.
The architecture (and intent) of this site is designed with the Seed as defendant. If we are going to continue to hold court, why shouldn?t it be the other way? Why shouldn?t The Seed be the complainant?
Why did you fail The Seed? What did you fail to do? Why did you fail your parents? Why did you fail yourself? Why didn?t you benefit when so many did? What was (is) lacking in you that made The Seed experience was so negative, while others only have positive memories?
How many people?s lives have you personally destroyed who may have been helped at The Seed, but the influence of your attitude prevented them from ever having a chance?  
Do you believe you?re are God, so omniscient that you can answer the previous question with complete confidence? Or are you so arrogant that you just don?t care? Have you failed at everything? Have you been successful when no self-examination is required? Have you failed when responsibilities charged to you were not to your liking? Why did you allow your thinking to set you up for failure from day one? Why are you still failing to comprehend? Why do you choose to point your fingers at others instead of yourself? Are you living in such denial, buried in false pride that you fear swallowing it might lead to asphyxiation? Is separating yourself now from the good The Seed did self-affirming, ego satiating? Are you capable or willing to honestly answer (to yourself) these questions today?
Maybe the most important question is, why are you even here? ...to engage in some contrived pseudointellectual debate that exists only for its own sake? Are you ego driven, is jealously a motive, do you ever, ever take time to challenge your own thinking? And finally, if awareness, enlightenment can simply be gained from life (as so many of you propose), without the intervention of a prominent catalyst, how do you explain the state of the people, the nations, the condition of planet earth today?
Okay, enough of this. There were a few questions I found in reading recent posts that I would like to attempt to answer. The program lasted as long as it lasted. Initially, two weeks as a newcomer, three months as an oldcomer. (Not a lot of those) For those sent by the court, two weeks as a newcomer, six months as an oldcomer. (A few more of these met the time frame)
Someone asked if I was asking for forgiveness because of the Socrates quote. I?m not asking anything, except the aforementioned questions. This is a principle that I believe in applying to my own life. (And no, I?m not in the one-hundred percentile group, obviously; if I have days where I?m in the upper 80s, I feel pretty good, they?re not common, but I?m still working at it, everyday, and getting better, of course that?s always been the case) Coercion! Of course there was coercion, we wanted people to stay. As for those 18 and over without court order, we could not make them stay, contrary to what has been stated here. We would, however, attempt to have the person?s parents intercede. If this worked they stayed, if it didn?t they were gone. To answer another question, living in Broward County, my path has crossed maybe 200, give or take a few, former Seedlings in the past 25 years. As I related to GregL on the phone, only one had anything negative to say to me. He chose to get in my face, spouting not so nice things, at a softball game about 15 years ago, I remembered him well and was not surprised. One out of 200 or so, and he was drunk at the time. ?Get out of your head,? simply was/is synonymous with ?Wake up and smell the flowers,? though I gather some of you had a problem staying awake period.
As I told GregL, I will try and post on this site occasionally and answer legitimate questions where genuine information gaps exist. Becoming a part of the day to day debate, I just cannot do, don?t need to. Finally, I reread my two initial posts today and found that many of the answers to questions continuing to be asked I?ve already answered.

The Seed was an ideal, not Art Barker, not Shelly Barker, not myself or any other staff member.
Principles such as self-honesty, self-respect, brotherly love, courage, and a willingness to dedicate yourself to these convictions constituted the ideal. Be your own best friend while learning to love yourself was the intended pursuit, ...agenda if you will. The inability (or unwillingness) to separate personalities and methodology from what The Seed offered was never a problem for me, I was lucky I guess. I got it from day one when I was still in the front row with the cotton in my mouth.
This ideal remains the foundation of my life to this day, which is why, in part,  I initially hesitated at the request to post at a site, (which I only learned of the night before last), that on the surface appears contrary. Nevertheless, some lingering, probably ill-advised, sense of responsibility to those who were in the program led me here today.

After a cursory journey through the postings I was appalled, but after some reflection I decided some of you might be sincerely interested in the first-hand knowledge and views of another Seed graduate, one who worked there for 6 years. Those who use this site solely to spout venom for its own sake, and thrive on the venom of others, probably should stop here. You won?t be interested.

First, some specific questions posed at this site. No, neither Art or anyone at The Seed in a position of responsibility, had any affiliation whatsoever with Synanon. There was a rehab in Wilton Manors, Spectrum House, that was loosely modeled after Synanon. The program was inspired by Alcoholics Anonymous, modified by Art, (with the help and suggestions of others such as Dave R., [who did have a degree in psychology], his wife and others whose names allude me), to better fit the drug culture. Initially it was informal rap sessions with a dozen or so participants. However, as the program grew, outside monies were acquired, parental and court(s) involvement became a factor, thus rules were necessitated.  The steps were a tailored version of the 12 Steps of AA. All of the signs and slogans, i.e. ?You Are Not Alone,? ?First Things First,? ?Easy Does It,? et al, are the same ones that are postered on the walls of AA. This is not any great mystery.
No full-time Seed staff member with any meaningful duration of service and dedication to the ideal had anything whatsoever to do with Straight. We thought it was conceived and based in conceit, ...we thought it was dangerous! The relentlessness of parents who believed they knew how to better operate The Seed and the problems arising from their zealousness is the only reason The Seed left St. Petersburg. They got what they wanted. The perception that government reports, the Times, or grant money had any effect on Art or those of us in positions of responsibility is farcical. We thought it was a joke and could not have cared less. As stated, however, the volume of parental interference was intolerable. The irony here, of course, is that many of your postings suggest and allege excessive fervor, while personally we were accused on a regular basis, by parents, of being ?too soft.?
Which brings me to allegations of physical abuse posted at this site. This was never acceptable or tolerated under any circumstances. I am not omnipotent, nor was anyone I worked with. Despite popular belief, we did not know everything that occurred away from The Seed. If I, or anyone I was close to, even suspected physical abuse, the consequence to the perpetrator would have been severe. I read one post that stated kids were taken outside and beaten while the group sang to cover up the sound. This, like several similar posts, is 100% bullshit, and undermines the  credibility this site! There are some things that no one could have or would have got away with!
Personally, I had no problem coming down on those whose disruptive personalities were defined by arrogance, self-centeredness, lack of respect and consideration of others. I had a very low tolerance for self-indulgent, immature, unnecessary and inappropriate behavior. That hasn?t changed. Stupidity always carries a consequence.
What happened? (To the program and me) As the program expanded more rules and regulations, or at least the rigidity of enforcement, was necessitated to maintain control. This occurred in direct proportion to growth. It is my opinion, and mine alone, that the amount of control actually needed was far less than that perceived necessary, which was integral to the eventual downfall of The Seed. Not enough competent staff to go around was an obvious problem, but not to everyone. Good people, dedicated staff were thrown in over their heads, without adequate support, particularly in St. Pete and Cleveland. An unfortunate situation that led to many of the problems at St. Pete and, as previously stated, one that many of the St. Pete parents attempted to exploit. Art and The Seed is analogous to a parent who lives in fear of his child growing up and going out on their own. He wouldn?t have it, and this was fatal to the potential of The Seed, the dream. The dream and the vision were Art?s, and he deserves the appropriate credit. For the record, (as it is the subject many posts here), his oft embarrassing showboating, sometimes bordering on buffoonery, were irrelevant to me. Personalities were minor details in my mind when compared to what we wanted to achieve, and my respect for his initial goal was never diminished because of his behavior, nor was my respect for what he had accomplished. Nevertheless, refusal to concede that The Seed, the ideal had become bigger, and in my mind more important than Art, was akin to blasphemy, and at the core of the demise.
?Art is The Seed,? was thrown at me during a confrontation with Lybbi on my final night at The Seed, in front of Art and Shelly. Prophetic, in that the program was to shrink to proportions that made this true. When my loyalty after all those years was questioned, my only response was that my loyalty was to ?The Seed first, Art second.? This distinction was deemed unacceptable in no uncertain terms that very night. So I left.

I realize that, by no stretch of the imagination, does this answer all of the questions nor allay any of the ill feelings, nor is it my intent to do so.

I wrote earlier of my initial disdain so I will close by commenting on the characterizations used by some to relate The Seed experience. Terms like ?survivors? used to portray faux heroism for enduring an ordeal, the suffering experienced for having to eat peanut butter and jelly and sit in hard chairs, sleeping in uncomfortable conditions, comparing the experience to Korean brainwashing facilities or gulags, speaks volumes about who you are, and is reflective of the spoiled, self-indulgent mind set you still carry, and your ridiculously exaggerated sense of self-importance. This isn?t just your problem, it seems to be a common and acceptable malady in today?s America. When one of you volunteers to live on the streets of Sao Paolo or Calcutta for a month, actually spends time in a North Korean prison, takes up residence in the bush of the west Congo, et al, then perhaps you may be qualified to speak about survival.
Love, willingness, faith and acceptance, mixed with some gratitude and humility, nurtured to fruition with unwavering, rigorous self-honesty, that hopefully lead to greater self awareness, was the order of business at The Seed to me. Those who got it and wanted to learn, did.
Those who didn?t, evidently, are at this web site.

Nevertheless, I do congratulate Greg and Ginger for providing a forum that allows all opinions to be heard. At least I don?t think the First Amendment has been incorporated into the Patriot Act yet, hold on let me check today?s paper....