Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Elan School => Topic started by: 88 on December 14, 2003, 08:23:00 AM
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U.S Troops have captured Saddam Hussien in Iraq.
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All we need to do is get Bin Laden and we'll be all set
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Damn straight. Let's execute 'em both on live television!
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new meaning to MUST SEE TV
SyN
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send him to Elan for a couple of years, then execute him :smokin:
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What was the deal with the dress Saddam was wearing?
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I thought he had a beard, but a dress too? Is he trying to be circus freak or is he dressing up for his new boyfriend Marty Kruglick?
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Unfortunately, it doesnt mean much of anything except another reason to have 24/7 live coverage of something on CNN for the next few days.
Saddam was here, is here, and will be here....if we were gonna cut his balls off we would have done it ten years ago. I am willing to bet that in 10 more years, he will either be back in power, or retired comfortably in Figi...waiting to die a nice, peaceful death from old age.
Fully funded by our hard earned tax dollars of course.
Saddam made all of Bushies little crew very happy and very rich, what with all this re-building we have pumping dollars into their bottomless pockets.
Has anybody given any thought to the Koreans? Havent they been practically shoving their nuclear program directly up our asses for the last year? I am fairly certain that their weapons of mass destruction have at LEAST an 80% chance of being actually real over anything we are gonna dig up in Saddams place. Oh, but they dont have oil....yeah, forgot about that...lets move on, shall we?
Sorry guys, I am all for bringing someone down who violates human rights the way that man did....but no matter how you spin it, we didnt take him because of that....not because he killed or tortured anyone....or even because he posed a serious threat to the US. No, my friends, its all about the money.
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I'm glad someone here understands that this is all about the oil. I'm with you, Carmel.
Now go on, you guys, go on and congratulate your president for killing all the innocent ppl that he's killed in both Iraque and Afeghanistan "in the name of human rights".
Bush is hated worldwide, is that the kind of representation that you guys want for your country? If Bush was our president here in Brazil, we'd have his ass impeached before he knew it, just like we've done in 1992 with Collor. I can't believe there are ppl that celebrate war.
What's the point on having Hussein captured If Bush is still out?
I mean, think about it.
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Yes, then we could have a stable government and the esteemed standing in the world like brazil has. Where do we go to sign up for that?
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Here's a tongue-in-cheek take on the subject of foreign policy written in 1981 by one of the best bands to ever come out of L.A. ~ Both sides of this debate will appeciate this in different ways -
Foreign Policy
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Democracy is a beautiful thing, except for that part about letting just any old yokel vote.
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Just remember Anon..."the bigger they are, the harder they fall..." and eventually, they always fall.
I dont want to be here when we fall.
One day soon, the world as we know it is gonna get too big for its britches. As it stands, America is everything and more that it sought to flee from at its inception. The rich get richer, the poor get poorer, the violence gets worse and all the while we are sucking our planet dry....
You would think that Saddam would have had a better set-up...what with being the most imminent threat to the US. Its garbage, and you know what, Americans eat it up. No one is even asking the right questions.......Saddam is one man, one single solitary man, and we found him, in a hole, in the dark....and we cant find an arsenal of chemical weapons? Yeah, give Bush a big pat on the back.
I will briefly mention the horrific damage we are doing to our own country by practically eliminating the possibility of decent public education.....gotta fund Saddams retirement pension. Teachers are being cut, supplies being cut, school food is horrendous....what about our children? And their children? What legacy are we gonna leave them besides reels and reels of live news coverage?
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On 2003-12-18 08:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Democracy is a beautiful thing, except for that part about letting just any old yokel vote."
lol thats the most ignorant thing i have heard all day..lol. You should get the oxy-moron of the day award.
SyN
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::bangin:: ::troll::
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Democracy is a beautiful thing, except for that part about letting just any old yokel vote.
Confession: That was me, the intent being to inject a little humor into this thread. Glad you liked it, SyN...I got it here:
http://paul.merton.ox.ac.uk/language/kids-quotes.html (http://paul.merton.ox.ac.uk/language/kids-quotes.html)
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The best band to ever come out of LA was The Doors.
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Brazil is not an example of a good economy... I never said it was. But America has been going down since Bush has been in control, that's all I'm saying. I haven't heard of unemplyment nearly as much as after Bush took over. Forget Brazil, I'm not getting into Brazil cause you guys get rich by exploiting our natural resources and I don't wanna get into that (although America's social issues have been getting closer and closer to the Brazilian ones).
It's not about "where can you sign up for that", dude, it's about paying more attention to the world around you. Be aware of your surroundings, what do you think Bush is doing to the WORLD? Is he really "saving the world" from terrorism or is he killing innocent ppl to get the oil? Ask yourselves this question.
Forget Brazil, I'm pretty sure that's not your main corncern anyways. Think of America and where it stands in the world today. Is that where you want to be? Do you think it's fair what your president has been doing to the world?
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http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... =22&Sort=D (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=3847&forum=22&Sort=D)
If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race?
--Frederic Bastiat -- 1801-1850
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On 2003-12-18 09:00:00, Carmel wrote:
I will briefly mention the horrific damage we are doing to our own country by practically eliminating the possibility of decent public education.....gotta fund Saddams retirement pension. Teachers are being cut, supplies being cut, school food is horrendous....what about our children? And their children? What legacy are we gonna leave them besides reels and reels of live news coverage?
Carmel, ya' know how much I like you, right? So much I'm looking forward to hashing this one out with you cause I know you'll cus me, you know I'll let it roll off and we both know we'll still be friends afterward, right?
Awright.
I don't think we could have reached this state of affairs without compulsory public schooling. Before such a thing was widespread in our society, America was one of the most literate countries on the planet. On paper, we still are. But they've moved the bar. 100% literacy, by the new math, means you can read and understand a TV guide. By the old standard, some yokel in Kenya is a lot more literate than most of us are. They may not be able to read and write about it. But they can discuss world issues as they effect them in at least 2 or three languages and several dialects and do it comfortably and intelligently.
Just check out the distinguished James Shikwati
http://isil.org/resources/fnn/2003summe ... talks.html (http://isil.org/resources/fnn/2003summer/african-on-wto-talks.html)
I'm not suggesting, above, that Mr. Shikwati is a yokel. I was actually thinking of a kid I've known for a few years who landed here at age 14 from Kenya, where he had been regarded as an adult. That was about 6 or 8 years ago. Tonight, we were just discussing debugging C code and his and my daughter's turbulant past. I'm sending him a copy of http://www.libertybookshop.us/mall/Unde ... istory.htm (http://www.libertybookshop.us/mall/Underground-History.htm) I've read articles, essays, reviews and quotes from it for years now. If someone wanted to send me a Christmas gift, I wouldn't return it. I'd read it and then release it into the wild via http://bookcrossing.com/ (http://bookcrossing.com/)
Anyway, I don't think our public schools are really failing. I think they're succeeding splendidly at their purpose. That's why my kids don't have to go. I like them wild and unschooled, just as they are.
The hypothalamus is one of the most important parts of the brain, involved in many kinds of motivation, among other functions. The hypothalamus controls the "Four F's": 1. fighting; 2. fleeing; 3.feeding; and 4. mating.
-- Psychology professor in neuropsychology intro course
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Marina, I'm right with you, except for one thing. I sometimes use "A vote for Büsh is a vote for America's Fürhor!" in my signature. That's only because he's an icon for a certain group of people. Not that I really believe this one man, or even just he and his close cronies, are capable of doing much of anything. Hell, give any of them 3 days food and water and hunting gear, set them down in some rural area, and by the fourt day, they will have robbed the nearest gas station.
It's not just this man, or this administration. It's a long term plan that went into full swing right around the turn of the 20th Century.
Most Americans really do not support what our government does. Like the Germans during WWII, most of us simply refuse to believe any of it could be true. Like Germany just prior to WWII, there is growing dissent. Just don't start bombing us yet, OK? There's still hope for the pen.It takes a village idiot to believe that a family needs instruction from the government to raise a child.
-- Anonymous homeschooler
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Ginger, I have to agree with you about the American educational system. When I was in the States, I got sick of having to answer to numerous questions such as:
"Is Spanish your 1st language"?
"Do you live on cabans on top of trees"?
"So you're from the capital of Brazil? I've always wanted to go to Buenos Aires".
Dude, was that annoying or what?
But then again, I remember we had only one year of World History and three years of American Social Studies. Of course we can't blame the citizens for not knowing much about international affairs, it's all in the way things are taught to them. Ppl who are well informed about the world in the US are ppl who actually take their own inniciative to do their own research because the educational system won't help them at all.
It's a shame that when you travel to South America or Europe, most ppl who's been to school can communicate in at least one foreign language and in the States ppl don't feel the need to learn new languages because the school doesn't encourage them.
It's a shame cause the US offers a big variety of resources of information. You can find many libraries and museums, the best bookstores, universities, etc.
The question is "What can you do to change that"? Enlighten me cuase I don't know the answer to this question.
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Eliminating compulsory public education would be a good start. Repealing the income tax would go a lot further.
I think our big problems started w/ the Industrial Revolution. Most people don't know this anymore, but Rosavelt regarded Joseph Stalin with great affection and open admiration. "Uncle Joe" some ppl called him back then.
Like every revolution, this one has begun to eat it's own young. It's time for another. And I sincerely hope it's civil, not international "war" and that, like the American Revolution against the British Crown, it's mostly mind games, very little real military conflict.
You have rights atecedent to all earthly governments; rights that cannot be repealed or restrained by human laws; rights derived from the Great Legislator of the Universe.
John Adams
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The best band to ever come out of LA was The Doors.
Hey! I forgot about them, that hey were from L.A. I'd have to agree with you there...Well, we could say that Fear was the best punk band to ever come out of L.A., fair enough? And oh yeah - X was an incredibly good band too...
[ This Message was edited by: Froderik13 on 2003-12-18 18:55 ]
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It's not just this man, or this administration. It's a long term plan that went into full swing right around the turn of the 20th Century.
Most Americans really do not support what our government does. Like the Germans during WWII, most of us simply refuse to believe any of it could be true. Like Germany just prior to WWII, there is growing dissent. Just don't start bombing us yet, OK? There's still hope for the pen.
:wstupid: I'm with NOT stupid, that is...
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You're right, I too believe there's hope for the Americans. I'm just wondering what the fuck is Bush still doing in the White House?
Were there any attempts to impeach him?
Froderik, the Doors is definitelly the best band that ever came out of LA and one of the top on my list of best bands ever! I just don't see how the Doors ended up in this Bush- Hussein conversation, but anyways...
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Well, here's what I think. Last post, I refered to the American Revolution against the Crown. In those days, the Sun never set on the British Empire. I know it's so because I have a beautiful Pusser's Rhum bottle with all kinds of wonderful daily prayers and slogans from that era of history. (Also says "To the with that blows, the ship that goes, and the lass who loved a sailor")
Anyway, we had big trouble when the Crown tried to prohibit Americans from minting and using our own currency. The tax acts really put some people over the edge. But they had been teetering there for a very long time due to creeping encroachment on their liberties.
But even that had not been the beginning of it. All over the world, Brittish colonies were falling into chaos and revolt.
We solved the problem with the Brittish Crown, not by cutting off their heads or storming the castles like the French did with their royalty problem. We just made them more-or-less irrelavent.
I think the same thing will happen here. There are signs of it cropping up all over the place. We're not going to storm the capitol or carry off a revolutionary coupe. I think we're just going to quit paying Federal taxes and quit following Federal mandates, thereby relegating those bozos inside the beltway to the drunken uncle status they have so richly earned.
The mind is not a vessel to be filled but a fire to be kindled.
-- Plutarch
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Actually Ginger, I really dig your point of view. I failed to see deeper in my post...I think I was looking for one of the more obvious reasons why the gov't ISNT interested in our safety and well-being currently. What with all this patriotism and defending the American way and so forth...you think it might be a little easier to look at our system in place, and see how we are strangling it in the name of war-mongering (flawed as that system may already be) But, you hit it on the head....I totally agree on both points...school and taxes. Dont even get me started on standardized testing.....
Another good point is the cultural perspective that is gained in other countries....people are aware that the world is a bigger place than just Cleveland or Wichita. In smaller countries, its almost a daily necessity to be able to function under the auspices of different cultures....or so I would think.
No cussin here sister! You da MAN!....er...uh...yeah....
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Well shit! I was looking forward to a good debate. Damn! ::alieneyesa::
If once [the people] become inattentive to the public affairs,
you and I, and Congress and Assemblies, Judges and Governors,
shall all become wolves. It seems to be the law of our general
nature, in spite of individual exceptions.
Thomas Jefferson to Edward Carrington, 1787
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yeah frod thats a funny link, thanks.
SyN
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On 2003-12-18 17:28:00, Marina wrote:
" Ginger, I have to agree with you about the American educational system. When I was in the States, I got sick of having to answer to numerous questions such as:
"Is Spanish your 1st language"?
"Do you live on cabans on top of trees"?
"So you're from the capital of Brazil? I've always wanted to go to Buenos Aires".
Dude, was that annoying or what?
But then again, I remember we had only one year of World History and three years of American Social Studies. Of course we can't blame the citizens for not knowing much about international affairs, it's all in the way things are taught to them. Ppl who are well informed about the world in the US are ppl who actually take their own inniciative to do their own research because the educational system won't help them at all.
It's a shame that when you travel to South America or Europe, most ppl who's been to school can communicate in at least one foreign language and in the States ppl don't feel the need to learn new languages because the school doesn't encourage them.
It's a shame cause the US offers a big variety of resources of information. You can find many libraries and museums, the best bookstores, universities, etc.
The question is "What can you do to change that"? Enlighten me cuase I don't know the answer to this question."
Unless you went to another school besides Elan in the States, don't use Elan to represent the American educational system. The education at Elan that I received was terrible, except for a few teachers. People who got D's in the real world got A's in Elan without trying.
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Yeah right.It was so easy for a d student to become an A student in less then 2 weeks.The school work was like 5th grade or less material, I didn't mine, as long as I didnt wind up in the little red school house and got to watch the sat and sunday night movie I was happy.
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Not talking about the same thing at all, guys. She's talking about the evident result of modern American education. In a word, most of us are total idiots when it comes to any area of interest outside our own professions, sports and pop music. Do you know, for example, the rough population of Rio? I don't remember offhand, but last I looked it was like 5 of New York, or something.
I'm not bragging here. I don't know much either. I try to keep up with things, but there's no one to talk to about it. Until I stumbled onto the net through a back door at FAU, I really thought I was just weird. Ok, ok. I still know I'm weird in some ways. But I mean I thought I was the only one on the planet who was not a politician or an historian or something who was curious about the world.
Ambrose Bierce nailed it; War is God's way of teaching Americans geography. And he kicked off in 1914. It's not just modern American education. I think it has to do with a certain smugness following naturally behind the way we pimp slapped King George and went ahead and prospered anyway.
Bilingual Americans, I think, become bilingual (or more) for the same reasons ppl in other countries do. They have a need for a second language. You can't get along too well in Miami if you don't have the ability and good manners to say "me mira por fumar", which probably meens "I'm looking for fire". But local store clerks know you're trying to get a fair price on a pack of smokes, you're willing to oblige them as best you can, and so they won't send you down to the tourist district where you'll get fleeced for $5/pk.
But I do think public education is a big part of it. Do you know that, not only do our public schools ignore foreign policy, but the ones around here don't do so much as a chapter on local history! At the same time, they want to extend the mandatory attendance age from 6 to anywhere from 16 to 18, all the way to 4 - 18 nationally, by DOE mandate? Kids are not really allowed on the street during school hours, after dark, before dawn, in "certain" neighborhoods, etc. unsupervised by an adult. So they don't meet their neighbors, either, even while they're not in school or waiting for their parents to come home.
Where are these kids supposed to learn the habit of caring about anything that's not in the curriculum, on TV or the hottest fad down behind the grocery store?
IOW, I think the problem we have is broad and well ingrained in our society. But we're not beyond all hope. Trust me on this, at least, Marina. The image that you get of real Americans is probably not all that much more accurate than what the networks tell us about you.
Oh, come to think of it, tell me something firsthand. Is Citrus Canker a big issue in Brazil? Would most people even know what it is? Cause here.... well... here:
http://doacs.state.fl.us/canker/maps.htm (http://doacs.state.fl.us/canker/maps.htm)
The Florida Dept of Agriculture is cutting roughly 95% of citrus trees from small groves, public lands and private homes and businesses despite loud objections from citizens, some agriculture experts and some civil rights organizations.
The story goes that, In Brazil (which, we're told, is a very socialist, government controled country), they don't take trees from private gardens. Instead, the citrus industry covers all the costs of chemical treatment, wind breakers, loss of infected trees, etc. And that they're fairly kicking our butts in the citrus market.
U know anything about that?
Fresh beauty opens one's eyes wherever it is really seen, but the very abundance and completeness of the common beauty that besets our steps prevents its being absorbed and appreciated. It is a good thing, therefore, to make short excursions now and then to the bottom of the sea among dulse and coral, or up among the clouds on mountain-tops, or in balloons, or even to creep like worms into dark holes and caverns underground, not only to learn something of what is going on in those out-of-the-way places, but to see better what the sun sees on our return to common everyday beauty.
-- John Muir
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"Me mira por fumar" translates directly to "looks me by smoking" according to freetranslation.com.
Fumar is the infinitive verb meaning "to smoke" Mirar means "to look at" something or someone. Buscar means "to seek, search, or look for.." Gustar, "to please" (Me gusta por fumar) Comprar, to buy (Querría comprar algunos cigarrillos)
A good one to know: Con permiso (excuse me)