Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: ` on March 02, 2005, 06:01:00 AM
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Sorry pathetic suckers. uh huh, right. "brainwashed". sure, whatever. just face it, you suck. pathetic. "but i believed they would court order me so i had no choice".
okay, let me lay it out for you since you get so confused:
1. you were physically ill because you were smoking.
2. who would believe what two evil blodthirsty vampires told them?
3. give me break.
4. you could have run. i can list all the times: yes they had you good in the first host home with three other bitch zombie girls and the car pulled all the way into the garage. but first of all, that one house, all it would take is jumping off the top bunk, grabbing the bag of clothes, and running. you knew where you were. you could have decked the little mexican girl. you could have jumped off the deck at your own house and at that other tiny girl's house. fucking pathetic. give me a break.
5. at the VERY LEAST, you could have spared yourself years of mental anguish by misbehaving. i am the pathetic spawn of pathetic christians.
6. you still believed in the love of your parents. god what fucking farce. i possibly got most of you topped with xtianity bullshit in the home :lol: smash and destroy, and rise again the next morning to smiling and cheerfulness! (yes that was my sister who broke her jaw and couldn't open it but it took three days for my mom to take her to a doctor. fuck off tlc rescue, you have to go in if you have a broken bone. you LIE. ever hear of bone infections? complications?)
7. rise up and fight.
8. why did you think anyone would or could rescue you.
9. you caved and showed your ass to your captors. anyone who took off their clothes and let themselves be strip searched CAVED IN. at the end of the day you had a choice. STOP BELIEVING EVERYTHING THEY TELL YOU. IT IS LIES TO MAKE YOU FEEL LIKE YOU DON'T EXIST! YOU ALWAYS EXISTED. You can't be brainwashed, you can only be fooled, and lie to yourself. You can only be pathetic and weak.
wouldn't you rather know the truth about yourself so you can fix what the original problem was?
FUCK YOU. BRING IT ON. I HAVE HIGHER EXPECTATIONS
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seriously, let's be rational. these are the skills i lacked:
1. first of all, knowing a godamn roomful of zombies when i saw one.
2. determination and perserverance
3. excellent don't fuck with me physical fitness
4. don't even argue with zombies
5. shut the fuck up and don't try to argue with them
6. give them NOTHING
7. plug your ears
8. go limp when they restrain you
9. FIGHT! (the lie of christianity is turn the other cheek! :lol: it only took me til thirty-five to figure that one out!)
10. you don't always have to have ten things in a list, this isn't David Letterman. :lol: [ This Message was edited by: formerly known as on 2005-03-02 03:12 ]
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you forgot, you were weak and lazy. dependency begets captivity.
so if you don't want your children to be suckers in the same way teach them survival skills as young as possible.
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Author Sembler friends posting here?
Sorted in ASC Order
formerly known as
Frequent poster
Joined: 2005-02-14
Posts: 73 Posted: 2005-02-27 22:38:00
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On 2005-02-27 13:16:00, Anonymous wrote:
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On 2005-02-27 12:54:00, kpickle39 wrote:
""Agreed! Kpickle has worked tirelessly to help bring the story of Straight, The Seed, and its spin-offs to everyone."
Well, thanks for the compliament; I do work some to expose the story of the straights, but the ones that work tirelessly....those are the isac folks."
Hey there Kpickle,
I'm one of you're greatest fans. I could tell these folks a lot of stories of the great things to do to help expose those creeps, but what I know I'm keeping in confidence so "Smell Sembler" won't get any material to use against us. Don't cut yourself short bud, I won't let you get away with it.
"
the thing with keeping the "great things to do to help expose these creeps... in confidence" is that the rest of us have to reinvent the wheel. i know that "activists" for other causes (rainforest etc) exchange info via the internet and phone calls and they use code names. there should be a way for us to exchange information and get together with our efforts to close down remaining Straights and/or get some justice for the crimes committed against us all, maybe a list serve that was more stringent in registration, something like that. could you pm me? thanks.
"could you pm me? thanks."
The hell I will ya fuck'n Flake.
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Whatever asshole..tired of hearing that shit..go fuck yourself. :skull:
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Who gives a shit what YOU'RE tired of, go fuck YOURSELF!
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I give a shit. :lol: Why don't you get a life instead of worrying about Semblerites posting here? Who cares if they are? let them.
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Well if you were a Semblerite, then you should of just come out and said so in the first place, people what of understood then.
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And you posted it on the wrong thread anyway, idiot! :rofl:
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On 2005-03-02 06:53:00, Anonymous wrote:
"And you posted it on the wrong thread anyway, idiot! :rofl:"
I meant to do that ...IDIOT! First you want me to "pm" you, then you're over here saying that "we weren't brainwashed", you're a damned flake.
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I don't want no PM from your sorry ass...whoever the fuck you are. :roll:
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I meant to do that ...IDIOT!
Gee, you're so avant-garde...asshole.
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On 2005-03-02 07:00:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I don't want no PM from your sorry ass...whoever the fuck you are. :roll: "
"could you pm me? thanks."
uh, no.
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On 2005-03-02 07:01:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I meant to do that ...IDIOT!
Gee, you're so avant-garde...asshole."
thanks
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Wasn't me..another anon I guess.
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On 2005-03-02 03:01:00, formerly known as wrote:
"Sorry pathetic suckers. uh huh, right. "brainwashed". sure, whatever. just face it, you suck. pathetic. "but i believed they would court order me so i had no choice".
Some were, some weren't, and the effects were different with different individuals. Maybe the term "conditioned" would be more appropriate, and less dramatic.
2. who would believe what two evil blodthirsty vampires told them?
Ignorant, ineffective, or just plain lazy parents.
4. you could have run. fucking pathetic. give me a break.
I know someone that tried running from the foster home they were in one morning after the door was unlocked. They said that they couldn't run because they were out of shape from sitting in a blue chair for 12 hours a day, and were easily caught. A better strategy, IMO, would have been to comply outwardly long enough to leave from a higher phase.
5. at the VERY LEAST, you could have spared yourself years of mental anguish by misbehaving.
I would agree with this point. If more people had misbehaved, Straight would not have been nearly as effective, or as boring.
i am the pathetic spawn of pathetic christians.
So am I.
6. you still believed in the love of your parents. god what fucking farce. i possibly got most of you topped with xtianity bullshit in the home
Not sure about that. I had to wade through a ton of that Xtian bullshit at home. I am pretty sure they hated me as a teen, and the feeling was pretty mutual.
7. rise up and fight.
OK.
8. why did you think anyone would or could rescue you.
This actually happened once or twice. A female phaser's 'druggie boyfriend' and his friends rescued her from the parking lot one night. I think a lot of people may have entertained that thought as a means of giving themselves hope, which could have enabled them to more effectively resist. When hope is gone, resistance is pointless. Despair, and they win without a fight.
9. you caved and showed your ass to your captors. anyone who took off their clothes and let themselves be strip searched CAVED IN. at the end of the day you had a choice.
A strip search before entering a jail or institutional facility is not uncommon, and many of us may have believed the "I'll be out of here in 14 days" lie that was commonly told, and saw it as a merely unpleasant condition to endure. I'm sure that if people knew exactly what they were getting themselves into, their resistance would have been much greater. I thought I was going to be playing ping-pong and watching TV for two weeks, then sign myself out.
wouldn't you rather know the truth about yourself so you can fix what the original problem was?
Of course. But that wasn't what Straight was about. Many, if not most, of us didn't have any kind of problem before entry, only ineffective parents who were freaked out by normal, healthy adolescent rerbellion.
I HAVE HIGHER EXPECTATIONS
Of yourself? Or of everyone? One way to begin may be to drop the self-hatred for not resisting more. You were a kid caught in a fucked up situation that was neither your fault nor your choice. Now you know better, and should be able to better resist indoctrination/assimilation/brainwashing if (and I sincerely hope you don't) you are faced with it again. Cut yourself some slack. You are stronger than many---many did not survive with their will intact, and some lost their lives. The fact that you are here posting and addressing these ideas shows that you have some strength of character and intelligence. I think you might be letting your emotions cloud your judgement, though, and you're being a bit harsh on youreself and others.
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Let's Get High
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On 2005-03-02 03:01:00, formerly known as wrote:
5. at the VERY LEAST, you could have spared yourself years of mental anguish by misbehaving.
Maybe so. I know I had some fun misbehaving, but the real kick was LEAVING, and the most effective way to do that was to haul ass from school or work, anywhere away from the building or the foster home. A head start of a couple of hours could be the difference between being caught and being successful. To do this most effectively, complying long enough to reach a higher phase was necessary. It was possible to do this without fucking with anybody, too, with the posssible exception of confronting people in group, and if you weren't a "strong confronter", you wouldn't have been called on much to do that, anyway.
Misbehaving was fun, and helped to vent frustration, but it didn't have shit on LEAVING.
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I HAVE HIGHER EXPECTATIONS
On 2005-03-02 08:19:00, Druggie Friend wrote:
Of yourself? Or of everyone? One way to begin may be to drop the self-hatred for not resisting more. You were a kid caught in a fucked up situation that was neither your fault nor your choice. Now you know better, and should be able to better resist indoctrination/assimilation/brainwashing if (and I sincerely hope you don't) you are faced with it again. Cut yourself some slack. You are stronger than many---many did not survive with their will intact, and some lost their lives. The fact that you are here posting and addressing these ideas shows that you have some strength of character and intelligence. I think you might be letting your emotions cloud your judgement, though, and you're being a bit harsh on youreself and others.
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Let's Get High
Nice post, Druggie Friend.
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After running away in a strange city twice and being brought back and then walking for the doors and being restrained I just decided to give up. There was no one to help me even if I left. I also felt like I deserved to be where I was as much as I hated it. I admit I did a lot of terrible things (most likely resulting from enviromental influences) to people before I got sent there so it was real easy to buy into thier crap how they were the only one's that could make me a good kid again.
I was actually in a pysch ward and then put in Straight. Before that a run away home. I had no idea Straight would be anything worse than those places. Boy was I ever wrong.
Another thing that got me caught up in wanting to graduate was that I made a lot of friends in Straight and at my new school. I wanted to stay in touch w/ people. I also had 2 host families that I became very close to. They were wonderful to me and treated me as if I was their child. For me to actually be in a stable 2 parent home was actually something I craved and needed.
Hindsight is 20/20 so no point in beating myself up for not continuing to run away.
(edited due to endless typos)
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i haven't read anyone's replies to this thread yet, but i see it is a hot topic.
i had a dream when i got out of Straight. I was in the desert, a southwest kind of desert, flat and scrubby. i don't remember much about the dream, except that there were massive scenery backdrops hanging from the sky. there were four of them, they surrounded me but at a distance. they were painted to look like the desert, but i knew that they were a curtain in front of the real world and i was trying to get around them.
if you have ever been in the desert, the thing about it is the space
p.s. now that i have read everyone's replies i am only flattered to have generated animals (or whoever) traffic :lol: , and i appreciate the responses from other people as well. i know my original post was uhm inciteful, no spelling error, it is really not meant for other people to take personally. Krystene you are the last person i would want to alienate, and thank you for writing your point of view here. this question has been tearing me up for a long time.
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I didn't get close enough to anyone to want to stick around, I just knew I was tired of being in the system. I was turning 17, and I wanted out. No more camps, no more psych wards, no more lies, no more cops, no more control.
As far away from my mother as possible.
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i read an old post about you being homeless after getting out. i admire that.
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On 2005-03-02 14:49:00, formerly known as wrote:
"i haven't read anyone's replies to this thread yet, but i see it is a hot topic.
i had a dream when i got out of Straight. I was in the desert, a southwest kind of desert, flat and scrubby. i don't remember much about the dream, except that there were massive scenery backdrops hanging from the sky. there were four of them, they surrounded me but at a distance. they were painted to look like the desert, but i knew that they were a curtain in front of the real world and i was trying to get around them.
if you have ever been in the desert, the thing about it is the space
p.s. now that i have read everyone's replies i am only flattered to have generated animals (or whoever) traffic :lol: , and i appreciate the responses from other people as well. i know my original post was uhm inciteful, no spelling error, it is really not meant for other people to take personally. Krystene you are the last person i would want to alienate, and thank you for writing your point of view here. this
question has been tearing me up for a long time."
No worries. No bad feelings about your post from me. Even though the Michigan program was screwed up, I know it was the least abusive Straight and I can totally empathize with people who were in programs in other states. I have heard some very disturbing and horrific things so it is no surprise why you feel the way you do.
We all coped in the way we thought best to survive. Most of us were kids and lacked the resources to leave even if we wanted to.
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cool. it is good to see you back here.
there are a lot of ways to explain "what happened" to us in straight. by the way, anonymous, if you seriously think i am in the least a "semblerite" you have not been paying attention. now go do all the homework you missed while you were gone. as for "flake", wrong again. i am loyal to a fault, in the present time, 2005.
anyway, how can anyone know the truth about what happened if they just buy what everyone tells them? ptsd, brainwashing, cult, etc. they are just words. sometimes, using those words, i feel like i felt back when i was still in NA and even in Straight: taking a definition of something and fitting my experiences to it. it's all a cultural thing anyway. hell, we could all be shamans of the age. i'd say we have been on more intense vision quests than most.
i really don't like the word "survivor", or "victim" either. i could be all wrong about human nature. if i understood where i went wrong, because i did go way wrong, because before straight i was cutting classes, i was walking off from principals who were calling me back, etc., i had my own code & wasn't going to sit in a windowless room to make the grade to go to college then grad school then lemmings in shiny metal boxes every morning... so whatever happened. why. i really don't know. i don't understand how in that congressional record thing Sam Ervin is talking about how they ignored us for three days then we changed. defeated, like i was saying before. i see a lot of things. i don't know what is right. i really don't want to temper my words so they don't offend anyone because then how will i know if i am ever telling the truth? and i also don't want to make myself believe something that i really don't know.
today i saw a homeless woman at the music store. she smelled like old clothes or unwashed hair. it scared me, i am afraid of ending up that way. (i really like showers.) in case you can't tell, everything is hitting me like a storm right now.
animals (or whoever anonymous), can't you understand that?
i did misbehave once. i made the mistake of resisting, and this one girl kept twisting my head and i was screaming that she was going to break my neck. when i remembered that a month or two ago, a long-standing obsessive fear of mine went away -- that's how terrified i was. who knows what effect that had at the time. but the reason i misbehaved is because i didn't take my shot at the truck door handle. i just don't think it's wise to give up all culpability. if i understand all this history and know that i would be different now, then i can come back.
[ This Message was edited by: formerly known as on 2005-03-02 20:40 ]
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Where things went wrong:
1)Father just came back from Vietnam, a biker, using heroin, abusing my mom in front of me.
2)Parents divorcing at 5 after I witnessed my mother laying in a pool of blood and I told her I wanted to leave. Felt guilty for not feeling guilty for years.
3)Dad remarries when I'm 6 to an 18 year old woman that was abusive to me.
4)My mom working full time and attending college. College in mornings then working 3-11. Being sent to live w/ father on weekends, summers, and holidays. Rarely seeing my mom.
5)Mentally and physically abusive babysitter who fed me the bare minumum. Teasing and taunting from her grandsons who were forced to walk me to school.
6)Avoiding the babysitter until it was dark and being at my friend's house where they could sneak me food. Mental abuse my their alcoholic parents. Witnessed DV against them and their mom daily. Both parents drunk morning till night.
7) Dad still on drugs, no longer employed, has 5 more kids. Spending money on drugs. Hardly any food, never seconds. Feeling hungry and miserable at his house. Dad becomes more paranoid, delusional, and abusive as the years go by.
:cool: Teachers and principal label me as trouble maker. Becomes self fullfilling prophecy. Best friend's crazy drunk mother writes constant notes to the school to not let me hang around her daughters because I did "XYZ". Lies. Constant pinching, shoving, and swatting is done to me from 1st to 6th grade from teachers and principal. Only told my mother once and she did nothing. After that I told no one. Who was there to tell anyways?
9)Mother moves a man into out house in 5th grade. All hell breaks loose. Never again feeling comfortable in my own home.
10) Start smoking and skipping school in 5th grade. Start using drugs in 6th.
11)B/f in 6th grade. Start having sex.
12)Start skipping school daily, smoking weed, and drinking almosy daily in 7th grade. Stealing non stop.
13)Physical fights w/ other kids and my mother non stop.
14) Running away, sent away, moving back and forth between parents,relatives, and friends.
15) Sexually assaulted numerous times.
16)Attempting suicide, then freaking out and telling.
17) Forced attendance in an abusive church.
18)Several schools.
19) Being an emotional basket case.
20) Being admitted to Straight almost one month after turning 15.
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I liked what you had to say about the lexicon.
i did misbehave once. i made the mistake of resisting, and this one girl kept twisting my head and i was screaming that she was going to break my neck. when i remembered that a month or two ago, a long-standing obsessive fear of mine went away -- that's how terrified i was. who knows what effect that had at the time. but the reason i misbehaved is because i didn't take my shot at the truck door handle. i just don't think it's wise to give up all culpability. if i understand all this history and know that i would be different now, then i can come back.
I know what you mean..
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Dad still on drugs, no longer employed, has 5 more kids.
::bangin:: ::bangin:: ::bangin:: ::bangin:: ::bangin::
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I think another way to look at it is, not what we did while in there since it was a truly unbearable situation, but how we all deal with it now, since we can now think what we want, say what we want, do what we want, and go where we want. I truly believe we all did the best we could under very extreme situations. Another way to look at it is, doing what you have to do to survive doesn't make you weak, it makes you strong.
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anyway, how can anyone know the truth about what happened if they just buy what everyone tells them? ptsd, brainwashing, cult, etc. they are just words. sometimes, using those words, i feel like i felt back when i was still in NA and even in Straight: taking a definition of something and fitting my experiences to it. it's all a cultural thing anyway. hell, we could all be shamans of the age. i'd say we have been on more intense vision quests than most.
i really don't like the word "survivor", or "victim" either. i could be all wrong about human nature. if i understood where i went wrong, because i did go way wrong, because before straight i was cutting classes, i was walking off from principals who were calling me back, etc., i had my own code & wasn't going to sit in a windowless room to make the grade to go to college then grad school then lemmings in shiny metal boxes every morning... so whatever happened. why. i really don't know. i don't understand how in that congressional record thing Sam Ervin is talking about how they ignored us for three days then we changed. defeated, like i was saying before. i see a lot of things. i don't know what is right. i really don't want to temper my words so they don't offend anyone because then how will i know if i am ever telling the truth? and i also don't want to make myself believe something that i really don't know.
Here?s the deal. These things are real, back then you were getting bullshitted. You have to stop thinking everything is ?program-like? in the real world or you will always be confused as to how to perceive and respond to it. Does that make sense?
We were victims, we are survivors. That doesn't make us weak for admitting that, it makes us strong for getting here. Straight was very fucked up, and it fucked up many people. You didn't have a choice as I child/teen but you know better now. Right? :grin:
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Haha... I hadn't read Jane's responce yet. Nice. Great minds... :smile:
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On 2005-03-03 09:18:00, JMA wrote:
"I think another way to look at it is, not what we did while in there since it was a truly unbearable situation, but how we all deal with it now, since we can now think what we want, say what we want, do what we want, and go where we want. I truly believe we all did the best we could under very extreme situations. Another way to look at it is, doing what you have to do to survive doesn't make you weak, it makes you strong. "
This is the 'now' part of the rap.. :lol:
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Well I know that Fucktard may not be people's favorite person to converse with, but this is ridiculous! Don't everyone talk at once now..
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Probably too busy getting high, having pre-marital sex and/or rocking out to second-rate druggie music. You snooze, you lose. A bunch of lazy, good-for-nothing druggies...
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On 2005-03-03 10:01:00, Dr Fucktard wrote:
"
On 2005-03-03 09:18:00, JMA wrote:
"I think another way to look at it is, not what we did while in there since it was a truly unbearable situation, but how we all deal with it now, since we can now think what we want, say what we want, do what we want, and go where we want. I truly believe we all did the best we could under very extreme situations. Another way to look at it is, doing what you have to do to survive doesn't make you weak, it makes you strong. "
This is the 'now' part of the rap.. :smile: And I agree... :grin:
And to Mr. F., I mean, DR. F. :wink: ,
just because the people in straight used to say something doesn't necessarily make it wrong. It may be more likely....but if it makes sense then it makes sense. Being able to decide and think for yourself is what I'm talking about.
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just because the people in straight used to say something doesn't necessarily make it wrong. It may be more likely....but if it makes sense then it makes sense. Being able to decide and think for yourself is what I'm talking about.
You're goddamned RIGHT it doesn't make it wrong! Who in the hell do you think you're talkin' to?? Of course it makes sense! Being able to successfully use the Tools of Personal Change is what I'm talking about, druggie! :flame: :lol:
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Sorry, I get all of my Pro-Straight Trolls mixed up. I guess that would be you?? To be honest, I usually don't read the troll posts much...
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On 2005-03-03 13:47:00, JMA wrote:
"Sorry, I get all of my Pro-Straight Trolls mixed up. I guess that would be you?? To be honest, I usually don't read the troll posts much..."
Maybe you should, Druggie.....then maybe you'd have a snowball's chance in hell of getting Straight. The way you're heading now is directly to jail, institutions , and DEATH!
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Typical druggie laxed attitude.
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I really do hope to avoid jail, institutions, AND untimely death if at all possible :em: :em: :em:
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That was me.
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On 2005-03-02 18:15:00, formerly known as wrote:
"i read an old post about you being homeless after getting out. i admire that."
Hard to believe a rich Dallas girl with a doctor for a daddy could end up homeless, but freedom is good, even without whipped cream and a cherry on top. Sleeping on the ground in an abandoned building, waking up to ants crawling in my hair, and still being happy to be there instead of Straight...I may not have made it out of Texas without that "freedom."
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PA: Who is calling whom a "Semblerite"? I am not calling you one, but you troll around anonymously, failing to engage in the dialogue that might help you understand what a person is saying. I won't stand down from saying what I think because of Anonymous yackers. Did you read some other things I wrote? I hope that helped. Keep in mind that if you see a piece of "Semblerism" in something someone says, it might be because you are assuming the old lexicon when someone is really speaking in a different one. It might be because you expect everyone else to understand their experience in the same way that you do. It might be because that person still has layers of Straight language and beliefs to purge. Just possibilities I thought of. However, that you could accuse me of being a "Semblerite" shows one thing only: you have never spoken with me. You don't see me these days. Soldier, hold your fire. My god, she's not the enemy after all.
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Several years ago someone named Julian Roberts devised the concept of something called the ?locus of control?. The locus is a continuum between the extremes of external and internal. To quote, ?People with an external locus of control believe that the things that happen to them are unrelated to their own behavior and, therefore, are beyond their control. People with an internal locus of control believe that negative events are a consequence of personal actions and thus potentially can be controlled.? Many studies have shown that people with an internal locus of control are less prone to illness. Of course, statistics can be easily skewed and I will refrain from jumping to any conclusions about there being a direct relationship, but one has to accept there is at least a relationship between the two. From Formerly?s posts, it seems that she is trying to progress toward the internal side of the continuum. Please excuse me if I am mistaken about this assumption. If we were speaking of every-day life, I would encourage such behavioral modification attempts; health may benefit greatly from such a change in outlook. It is physically, and probably mentally, much better to feel that one has control over one?s life from day to day. However, with that being said, there is another side to the argument that must also be examined; especially if one wants to know the ?truth?.
Truth, being applied to psychology, let alone to what happened in Straight, is a slippery and subjective thing. Being factual is obtainable through use of science, and showing a perspective is obtainable through arts, such as painting, drawing, photography, literature, conversation, etc. If we wished to be only truthful about Straight, we would be very limited in what we could say. We would merely be able to list the facts and would have to divorce all feeling and speculation from those facts because, as we all know, we can sometimes be mistaken about our interpretation of events and feelings may not fully and accurately correspond with events. Let?s take our most obvious and appropriate example and apply it to our locus of control.
Truth: I was admitted to Straight as an adolescent. (Other facts, devoid of feeling, may be inserted here. I have omitted them because everyone?s experience differed to some extent.)
External locus of control extreme: I was the complete victim of my parents/guardians. I did nothing to cause my parents/guardians to consider treatment. Staff and the group had no reason to react to me the way they did. I was forced to do everything that I did in Straight. I accept no responsibility for any actions I took while in Straight. I had no choice.
Internal locus of control extreme: I was the bad child. My family was dysfunctional because of me. I deserved to be in Straight because of what I did previous to my admission. Staff and the group treated me the way they did because my behavior dictated it. Anything that happened to me while in Straight was entirely my fault. I accept all responsibility for any actions I took while in Straight. I made all choices.
Now, is either extreme entirely correct? I would have to say that both are incorrect. The only completely factual view would be a listing of the facts. That the listing of the facts does nothing to assist in physical or emotional wellness, one has to determine what the healthiest, or most beneficial, view to have is. As humans we need to have something to fill in the gaps that a mere listing of facts leaves us with.
Let me say that in the case of Straight, I think it is highly detrimental to adopt a view leaning toward an internal locus of control. While that attitude is good to have on a regular basis, I think it is only beneficial in tearing apart the self-value of an individual when used in relation to situations of abuse. In the process of growth toward self-actualization I believe the victim of abuse must play a balancing act upon this locus of control. The end result will be different for each person. It is my assumption that those who have suffered abuse that adopt a heavily internal rationalization may be at risk of suicide and other self-destructive behavior in an attempt to punish themselves for their actions. Those of us in Straight saw this manifest itself though self-destructive behavior such as carving. With that being said, I hope it clarifies why many on this board lean toward external rationalization.
Do not think that I am condoning the external extreme. I am not. I think it is just as crucial to recognize the responsibility we had in our situations. In the end however, one cannot overlook the highly authoritarian structure of the program; enforced by the use of physical violence and emotional torment. If one is leaning toward the internal side of the locus, I have to notice the similarity of the speech between the ideas ground into the individual during the program, and what the individual currently espouses. This could be the reason Formerly was mistaken as a Semblerite. Even though you don?t like the word victim, it is what we were. Though yes, we had some control; we were primarily at the mercy of those who wished to harm us in the name of recovery.
You could have tried to run, or you could have attempted all of the things you suggest you might have done. Perhaps you could have succeeded. There are stories of people that did; however, there are far more stories of people that didn?t. Also remember that hindsight is not accurate. Your perspective of the past is now influenced by all you have learned since then. You were much different the decade or two past. It sounds like what happened to you then would never be able to be inflicted on you again. That is good, and I hope that is the case with all who are here on this board. Perhaps your behavior did justify your parent?s actions of seeking treatment for you, but you are not responsible for the violence and emotional trauma enacted upon you, no matter what staff and the group told you, and regardless of what you currently believe. You are no more responsible for being admitted to Straight and what happened to you in Straight, than is a girl who wears a short skirt is responsible for her own rape. It is ok to have control now, and ok that that you didn?t have control then. You weren?t even of the age you were legally responsible for your actions. I hope that you come to a perspective that gives you peace and security, that you are questioning and testing your rationale shows you are well on your way.
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That was a good post, about the Locus of Control. I think a better way to look at it than the two extremes is when DO you have control and when do you not. In straight we really didn't have much, if any. That isn't faulty thinking or whatever, it is the reality of the situation. I think that theory is supposed to apply to people who don't do anything for themselves because they believe it won't matter, which is what we were sort of being taught in straight, unfortunately. Why try to understand the program? It won't ever make any sense. Why make your own decisions about how to learn and how to approach your own life? You'll probably be wrong. I think looking at it this way, you can still have an "internal locus of control" and believe that we had no control while in there, because it's the truth. It's all relative anyways, and I don't this theory (my feeling anyways) was meant to be applied to people in such extreme situations. The problem comes later in life, if we carry on what was taught to us while in there, that we can't think for ourselves, that we can't understand what is good for us. If we keep thinking that way, then we have moved into having an "external locus of control."
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i had not realized that it was unclear what i meant about culpability. i don't believe i am responsible in any way for my imprisonment in Straight or any of the abuse i suffered in there. i only meant that i felt responsible for my choice to comply most of the time, and for i don't know whatever happened inside me that i became a Straightling. no, i hate myself for that but friends have suggested to me that i am being too hard on myself.
how i could have been so terrified of the other phasers i do not know.
thank god it's friday. i am so emo today. i am so glad there are people to talk to about this. that is something, ain't it.
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Straight was very Sadistic. :smokin:
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On 2005-03-11 15:20:00, formerly known as wrote:
no, i hate myself for that but friends have suggested to me that i am being too hard on myself.
how i could have been so terrified of the other phasers i do not know.
You probably are being too hard on yourself. We were afraid of each other because that's how humans, especially young humans, behave in groups. Part of maturity is learning, either overtly or not, how to navigate that whole mess while inventing some kind of independence and self determination. We weren't there yet, nowhere near. We got blindsided. Good people, even wonderful people, often got taken in by the slight of mind.
If there is a God, he is a malign thug.
--Samuel Clemens "Mark Twain", American author and humorist
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::bump::.
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Bradbury is a Semblerite. He works for the guy, his income taxes files say so. Coming from a reliable source.
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i take it back, i was brainwashed. i still hate myself for it though.
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On 2005-04-11 18:23:00, fka wrote:
"i take it back, i was brainwashed. i still hate myself for it though."
No need to hate yourself for being in straight. You were a kid and kid's minds are still developing until the age of 25 or so (so I hear). They used cult tactics to get to all of us and it would be hard for any kid to not break from all that shit. straight even won in regards to people that misbehaved by treating them in even worse and inhumane ways. Sometimes I think some staff secretly loved people that misbehaved so they could have an excuse to torture them. there were no winners in straight. Everyone was damaged regardless of how much they resisted. Of course there will be a few that proudly say straight saved their life blah, blah. blah. Brainwashing seems to have long lasting effects in these cases.
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On 2005-04-11 19:21:00, krystene wrote:
"
On 2005-04-11 18:23:00, fka wrote:
"i take it back, i was brainwashed. i still hate myself for it though."
No need to hate yourself for being in straight. You were a kid and kid's minds are still developing until the age of 25 or so (so I hear). They used cult tactics to get to all of us and it would be hard for any kid to not break from all that shit. straight even won in regards to people that misbehaved by treating them in even worse and inhumane ways. Sometimes I think some staff secretly loved people that misbehaved so they could have an excuse to torture them. there were no winners in straight. Everyone was damaged regardless of how much they resisted. Of course there will be a few that proudly say straight saved their life blah, blah. blah. Brainwashing seems to have long lasting effects in these cases."
I concur. I was affected even though I resisted, sometimes actively, sometimes passively, sometimes just by "conning" my way to a higher phase where I would have a better chance to 'cop out' (which I did twice). I was still affected by the shit---It's kinda like exposure to radiation, it's gonna get you if you're exposed to it for long enough in the intensity we were exposed to.
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:wave: :wave: :tup:
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and a bump bump bump
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bump a roni
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" why did you think anyone would or could rescue you."
that is a damn good question.
I thought it though. Got over it and realized the shit wasn't gonna happen but... waited for saving in the begining
I was never brainwashed.
They attempted it but it didn't take.