Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => News Items => Topic started by: TheWho on April 07, 2009, 04:40:45 PM
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ok people, i have read the things you have written. this is katie. i am an 18 year old who struggles alot. thinking about it i am in an undeniable way afraid to do things after the program. for the first few months i was afraid to even look at or talk with boys. At the "program" we were seperated and told that it was bad for us to interact. i am still afraid of many things, such as the fact that in july i turn 19 and i will have to get an aprtment. i am scared so much. sometimes i wonder if there is an actual place for me in the world. i have made mistakes. throughout the program i learned things, i saw things, and yes I was physically restrained. i still remeber the staff joking about the isolation room as "happy land". i was in that room 6 times. The first few months were very difficult and were hard on me. i still hold alot of guilt over my head becuase of "wasting my parents money". Not only do my parents feel as if it was a waste of time and money, but they feel as if it could be better spent on our family or my older's brothers/ stepsisters college.
Right now, seeing my own words on the blog scares me. What if my parent see them? will there be al hell to pay? I am not afraid of saying what i feel... but i am afraid of what Diane will do. (OH! I have not caled her a bitch or any rude names in months by the way, i am trying to stay out of the line of fire...) In all honesty i do love her. She is the only mother i have ever known and, she has really taken a risk to be in my life. i have not been the best step daughter... but i do love her. Even now, when i tell her this she ignores me and it breaks my heart... For my daddy, he is the best dad anyone could ask for... he has fought for me all if my life... he saved me from my biological mother, but he has led me into the relationship with Diane.
I will be posting comments of my opinions and story daily starting with this. If you wish i will do an autobiography fro those of you who want to watch out for the warnign signs. But please know this: I love my family. Even though it hurts me to say this i feel as if things would be better for them if i were not around ( In which i am reminded of quite often) for those of you who want to comment feel free to do so, but know that i will not tollerate abuse of any kind. I want people to know my thoughts or feelings, so tomorrow our journey thorugh my life will begin.
Thanks for reading.Please any comments or questions email me @ [email protected]
(dont take advantage of this though.) Katie's thoughts
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Hi Katie! I replied (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=27188&p=329536#p329536) to your post on the other thread, but if you want to keep your story separate from that thread, that's cool too...
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I'll respond more in the mean time, but for now, please stop feeling guilty over your *parent's choice* to waste their money on cross creek. I know they must give you the standard "we've spent so much money on you and you are such a disappointment" line, but please try not to take it to heart. Regardless of what issues you may or may not have had, there are at-home options, and it was your parents' choice to send you away. You did not "make" them send you away and as such you should feel no guilt over their bad choices. I would argue it's them that should feel guilty to sending you into a program with such a horrendous track record.
I would very much like to hear your story, so i'll stop here and let you tell it.
Also, minor note... I don't think you'll get much abuse at all on this forum, but it is unmoderated here, so if you feel like it's getting too harsh, you might want to post in the CAN forum, which is moderated. link here:
viewforum.php?f=59 (http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=59)
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Hello.
As promised I am at the beginning of my journey with you. For starters I want to begin by saying I am apprehensive of what I will have to remember and think about. I need your support not only to keep me moving forward, but to help me see myself as a person whose story is worth being told.
I am not going to start at the very beginning of my life, but rather later on when my problems fist started. You see, I don’t remember much, due to mental blockage. My mind has blocked out all of the times I spent with my mother, and even now I shiver with fear thinking of how my life was when she was in my life. My parents began the divorce when I was seven years old. I was forced into therapy to evaluate if there would be any emotional scarring. I remember the woman. She was like the fist grade teacher you never forget, you know the one… she made you feel like you were the poster child for cuteness. She had me draw pictures for her, while she talked to me. One day, she asked me who I wanted to live with. As a seven year old what do you expect? I told her “My daddy, because mommy can take care of herself.”
My older brother and I went to live with my Dad. My younger brothers went with my mom to live in New Mexico. And that is the starting line in which we begin. For 4 years I blamed myself for the divorce thinking it was my fault for the family to be split up… if only I was a better child, if only if only, if only. My dad constantly told me that it wasn’t my fault and that canned line “We both love you, but we don’t love each other anymore”. If they both loved me so much, why did my mom leave me? After a few years of holiday visitations my father fought for us in court. He was given full custody of my brothers and I, and for a while we were together. We missed our mother terribly, but our dad made up for it. He gave us everything he could. He was the mother, the father… he was our best friend.
As people grow older they get lonely. My father met Diane on a chat room for people who want to fix their marriages. Soon after the divorce my dad began dating her. I remember Miss Diane. Sweet, kind, funny… then one summer we went to visit our mother in New Mexico. During that summer my Dad married Diane. (My brothers and I were not involved in the ceremony which is kind of messed up if you ask me) For that year things were not much different, Diane would visit from Minnesota for a week, every month or so, then we got a new house and she moved in.
The first year went smoothly enough. There were adjustments to be made, but when families combine that is expected. Diane even took me on a girl’s weekend to Chicago, and I had the greatest time. All the while the relationship between my mother and me was growing cryptic. She would tell me horrible things about my father, how he had an affair, how I wasn’t worth the trouble of raising… etc. I believed her, she was my mother after all. I began to resent Diane, to hold a grudges. I was 12 years old. I didn’t know any better. My mother would say one thing, my dad and Diane would say another. I was lost in a loop of truth and deceit.
My dad’s time was divided between his wife and his kids. Immediately, I noticed the change in things. She became strict and different as if she was a warden coming into a new prison to find all the convicts allowed to leaving the facility for months at a time. I began to wonder if the sweet kind and funny person was an act. But my dad was in love with her, so I decided to let him be happy. (In my 11 year old mind I thought I was obligated to this still thinking I caused the divorce.)
I began to rebel against her, thinking that I would lose my dad. We both treated each other poorly. Soon it was a war zone in our house. I began to rebel in different ways I made friends with a girl who introduced me into cigarettes alcohol and cutting. That’s when it all went wrong.
Well. I don’t want to tell it all in one night would I?? :hug: LOL Thank you for reading my own meandering experience. I will write more tomorrow. Again any questions or comments you know where to go.
[email protected]
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Hi Katie, welcome. I am going to write you later when i have more time. But quickly, I want to tell you what a kind person you seem like and how great your life is going to be, with a little luck.
Some things very briefly. After getting out of program a lot of kids are confused about their past.
Some think things that aren't true at all, like that they were/are drug addicts, or, that they were sick, bad people...They also think certain things about their parents that aren't true. WWASP, CEDU, ASPEN, and other programs have their version of your life that they force you to accept as true. its very confusing and it takes some time to figure out what's real, and what's WWASP's spin on your life
it usually takes moving away from your parents, time, education, and friends to tell you about their adolescences to put it in perspective.
Just realize, what was done to you was not your fault; it was your parents fault. Their bankruptcy is their comeuppance, in one tiny way. Don't feel bad about it.
Think about joining this lawsuit.
http://74.125.93.104/search?q=cache:IfK ... clnk&gl=us (http://74.125.93.104/search?q=cache:IfKu-8LXs5kJ:www.webwire.com/ViewPressRel.asp%3FaId%3D22096+lawsuit+%22cross+creek%22+wwasp&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)
Contact isac. They’ll put you in touch with the right people
http://www.isaccorp.org/ (http://www.isaccorp.org/)
or contact this woman, who released that press announcement:
Isabelle Zehnder
Founder and President
Coalition Against Institutionalized Child Abuse (CAICA)
360-903-3951
[email protected]
You are out so soon…write down everything you can remember about what was done to you, not necessarily publicly, just so you can remember it in the future. It will be good to have everything down to use if you want to press criminal charges or join that lawsuit. For holding you prisoner, alone, the leaders of WWASP deserves to pay with their lives
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So far so good.
1) If you want to mess your kids up, then use them as weapons after a divorce. Let them be the rocket you deliver your verbal bomb load with. How is the rocket doing when it arrrives at its target? Oh. It explodes!
2) If you want to destroy a household, then invite a new partner in your home and let this person become the disciplinarian. The birthparent has to set the rules or change them if the step-parents want changes. The birthparent does also have to enforce them. The child has not chosen the step-parent. The step-parent has chosen to engage in a relationship where there are children. A male lion kills the kittens not produced by himself once he takes over a lion family. That option is fortunately not one a human can choose but then they have the option of WWASP. Somehow the step-parent shows that the difference from being an animal to being a human which involves a whole lot of empati is deselected.
3) If you want to increase the risk of your kids being involved with alcohol or drugs, create the basis for the child to find a group of peers which seems to care outside the family. The cutting is not a problem it is a symptom that the child need a dumping place for all the thoughts any human gathers during time. Once a person starts to cut this person feel releaved for the problems and are ready to take on new challenges. In a divorce the children often picks up small pieces of guilt due to the shattered relationship between the parents and put them in their emontional backpack. That backpack becomes heavy to carry and then the cutting starts. If I found my child cutting I will know that she needs another adult to speak about her problems with before she starts talking to the dealer. You have to remember that the dealer is a businessman. Of course he will listen to his customers and let them cry out by his shoulder if he cares for his business.
You are making a good start.
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Thank you for sharing that, and I want you to know that I can really relate. I had a super strict step mom as well who was deathly afraid I would turn out like her loser drug addict brother. I know you didn't mention too much about the tension in the home, but I remember it well and understand how hard on you that must have been.
I hope you know that your story most definitely is worth telling, and I know that its hard to go back and access all these buried feelings but I hope you know that you are not only helping yourself heal, but you could very well help others to do the same. I hope you know that you were not a bad kid, and you didn't deserve to get sent away. It seems like you struggle with depression and you shouldn't carry any blame for that, you were born with it. As sad as it is, some of us just get dealt a shittier hand then the rest of the players in this game, and all you can do is work with what you've got. Your parents had the responsibility to help you through the hard times and give you the love you needed to grow up feeling worthy. The fact that your step mom felt it appropriate to judge, chastise and punish you all the time for normal teenage behavior is clearly an issue of bad parenting skills, and considering she isn't your parent makes it that much more inappropriate. I read some of the things she said about you, she wasn't worried about you as much as she resented you and judged every little thing you did. Do you know how happy most parents would be if their kid was just smoking cigarettes as a teen? I can understand parental concern, but I don't think she handled it correctly and in my opinion made your depression (not to mention the family relationship) much worse with all the confrontation and blame games. Do you feel as if she may have turned your family against you?... because that's what it seems like to me, and I also think her mind games have effected your self esteem.
At some point I would recommend mentally separating your feelings from anything she ever said or did to you. I personally do this by reminding myself that the problems with my step mother stemmed from her issues, not mine. Not that I didn't have any problems, but I believe those are better handled with someone who loves me unconditionally. Basically, if she doesn't truly want to help me or she tends to go crazy then my problems are none of her business. My relationship with my dad and step-mom now is fine, as rocky as it was when I was a teen we have put all that behind us because they choose not to get involved in my problems. That doesn't mean I lie to them or don't ask for help if I need it, it means they simply realize their days of being "the punisher" are over and I am the one who builds my own moral compass. Oddly enough, I think I have done a much better job then they ever could, maybe they realize that, and someday your parents will too.
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Actually if you get anywhere near Izzabelle can you do me a favor? Tell her Che Gook says, "Izzy you are still a fat tub of lard who still needs to get herself a pair of concrete boots."
That's all..
Best of luck for you and relax as fear is normal in any transition. Just chill out and think about the upside of have your own crib. All those boys you have missed out on can come over without your parents prying and interfering.
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Katie is a sweet , beautiful, talented girl.
Just sayin' :karma:
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Let’s see.
:waaaa: I left off, the summer I met Christy. Looking wherever I could for friends, I found some. I began hanging out with people who were different. People like me. At the beginning we were innocent teenagers, watching movies, laughing making stupid jokes, and then we began to grow up. After a while Christy and I both were having issues with our lives, so like everyone in this world we held onto something that was not changing. Each other.
I found Christy cutting herself with a razor blade one day after letting myself into her house. I began to cry to see her hurting like that. She explained it was the only way to get rid of her pain. Looking for any escape I could, I tried it. The first cut was the hardest. I couldn’t believe the relief as I saw the droplets of my own blood forming on my arm. I felt so relieved. Over and over again, I cut until I didn’t feel the jabbing pain inside of my chest from my broken heart.
After that first day, I went home I sat at the dining room table trying to hide my arms. I didn’t want anyone to know. I was reading a book tucking my arms under my sleeves. Unfortunately it was a white shirt and they still bled. Walking up behind me Diane saw the blood. She didn’t say anything to me but she went and whispered to my dad. I didn’t suspect that they knew. As I got up my dad did also. He grabbed my arms, not only pulling up the sleeves of my shirt but opening the temporary scabs. He looked at me as if I were Satan. “If you EVER do this again we are going to have you committed to an insane asylum” he said. I began to cry. Diane looked at me, and said “Do you understand how serious this is? Are you trying to make this family more stressed because of you?” every word dripped with disdain. I rant to my room. I wanted to hide forever.
I cried myself to sleep for the few moments I was cutting I was not hurting, and they didn’t understand. The next day, I went over to Christy’s and told her about what had happened. She was the only one who understood my pain. Our routine began. We hung out, and then if we needed it cut. We did everything together. This continued for a few months. After a while the cuts became more frequent and deeper, and I no longer was with Christy when I cut myself. I did it on my legs, thighs upper arms stomach.
After a while Christy began getting into drugs. Weed, coke, shrooms. I was so scared to even touch the stuff. However I found myself content with cigarettes, and alcohol. I was with Christy almost every spare minute I had. Sneaking out to go to parties, walking around neighbourhoods all night. We were the rebellious teenagers, more so her than me. I got contact high quite a few times, but as I said before I was scared shitless to really use.
The excitement of it all was wearing off. Cutting wasn’t working anymore, and people began to notice all I wore was baggy sweaters to hide the cuts and scars. I was bored and I wanted to join in with my friends. I began huffing Lysol and paint. The first few times it was nice. Then one day Christy passed out. I couldn’t wake her up, so I did what anyone would do. I called 911. the hospital was a nightmare. Not only was I scared but my parents were called. At that point my dad came and got me. He made me tell him everything about what I had been doing. I was terrified. I was forbidden to see Christy.
The situation worsened I lied more and more to se her. I stole money for her. I wanted her friendship so bad I let her take advantage of me, and soon it turned ugly. It was a Tuesday afternoon, and after being made fun of at school I didn’t want to take it anymore. I went up to my room and wrote notes to all of my friends. I wanted to die. I went down to the living room and sat on the couch. I began to cut myself, daring myself to do it. I wanted it so bad, and the cuts were only the shallow ones. It wasn’t working. My dad walked into the house just as I got up to try another way. I grabbed my med box and almost had the pills down when my dad forcibly got them out of my mouth. He called the ambulance.
Since I hadn’t ingested any of the pills, I was taking to a psychiatric ward called KHYS. An outpatient program for kids who had tried to commit suicide. I was there for 2 ½ weeks. It was scary. White walls, limited visits. I was given different heavier medication to help with the depression. My family visited me every night bringing McDonalds and games, trying to make everything better. I thought it was a genuine attempt at fixing our family. But unfortunately it didn’t last. My dad was there the entire time. I felt a new respect for him, and I began to heal superficially. The meds made me a zombie once I took them and knocked me out at night. I was more calm and less expressive. I was discharged. I went home. I did well for a few weeks, until the things went back to the way before. The second time around things got much much worse. :waaaa: ::OMG::
Again i thank you to everyone who will read this and i will write more tomorrow. this was hard for me to write so need support if you can give it.
Please any comments or questions you know how to reach me
[email protected]
i'll be back tomorrow
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I'm honestly to the point of tears reading that. I'm surprised that your parents would react in such a way, if you were my child and i saw that, I would break down in tears and hold you and tell you how much I love you. what did they think this was just acting out? of course its serious, its a serious expression that you are miserable! I just can't believe that your parents would even consider a behavior modification program considering what a fragile state you much have been in. The more I hear about your life the more I resent your parents for giving you exactly opposite of what you truly needed at that point. I can understand the fact that something like this would be troubling to a parent but I don't understand what kind of person would respond in this way. I know I surely wouldn't.
ill let you go on before I decide to get too worked up. I just hope you realize that NONE of this was your fault, depression is a mental and medical disorder and needs to be treated with care, love and professional help. Considering that people with severe depression are mentally fragile, using judgmental comments and punishment to try to stop them from hurting themselves really makes no sense to me. You deserved better treatment, and if they were unable to give it to you they should have found much better help, namely professional help instead of a program that was designed for and promised (in their marketing materials) to change your behavior to serve them, instead of really help you with your condition.
Im sorry you had to go through this, I think that its about time you realize that you didn't deserve it, and that you needed something much different then what your parents were willing to give you.
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Katie, I am so sorry. I am full of emotion right now.
Just want to let you know, that my daughter reads this also - we talk about your experience very much. It helps me as a parent to learn about teenagers´s point of view - its really very helpfull.Thank you so much. I can only imagine how hard this must have been for you.
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Reflection on part 2
I understand how parents can be scared when they discover a bloody arm. I am a parent myself.
However I am a product of the cold war. I live in a country which would have been one of the first the Russian would have taken if they wanted to conquer Western Europe.
When I read of youth, who during therapy has been forced to plan their own funeral, it is déjà-vu. Having been trained to stand in the way of the red army we are asked to prepare everything for those we leave behind, so we can fight for our cause without having to worry about anything, we missed saying. I worry for death and having to drive through the local warzone called Noerrebro every single day to reach my work, it is a real risk I take. But I take it well knowing that I have done my best to prepare my children and wife for the situation of me ending up dead.
However another lesson I learned in school, which is related to part 2, is that we all go through life picking up small pieces of pain, frustration. We have to contain anger and sorrow. There is no time to react on them in daily life. So we put them in our emotional backpack where they remain until we have time to process them. What happens if we don’t get this time and the backpack becomes too heavy to carry? My background as a Dane makes me able to choose a different option if/when my children choose to cut in order to unload their problems.
Katie: What you did at that time, when you started cutting, was healthy. You had insight to know that you needed to unload your backpack. It certainly wasn’t the smartest way of unloading your baggage, but you were not educated to know better. What’s worse your father and step-mom wasn’t either. That’s the real tragedy in this story.
As for the drinking and its part towards drugs - which in your culture is related because the alcohol drinking by teens opposite the situation in Denmark is not accepted – it follows as a consequence of the lack of motivation from your family to engage the problem rather than condemning it. I hope that the program has taught them the reason for cutting so they can take a wiser approach towards your siblings. Else their money is truly totally wasted.
When I meet social workers they are always on the look for places where teens drink, so they can out there and listen. Whenever the police spot such a place they are quick to start communicating and this summer they grilled sausages for the teens so they didn’t drink on an empty stomach. A lot of the problems can be stopped before they grow into disasters when someone will listen.
It is a sad story to read because there wasn’t really a problem which needed professional help until the adults stopped listening and started to condemn.
I wonder where Christy is today. You were not the only one and I will bet 100 dollars that in the local community there ware at least 10 more in the same situation. That’s why I support community programs. There are not reasons for every parent to pay 50-100,000 dollars on treatment if it can be done locally for 1/10 of the price.
Taking a person to the hospital, stabilizing them and then releasing them are no cure. It is a huge, huge red flag no to understand that once a person leaves the hospital the treatment starts. As some know the founder of Spft has some experience in this matter with family. With his permission I can reveal that 20 weeks on intense therapy 3 times per week combined with additional treatment for anxiety did work, but did not restore the individual to a level where a full time job is a possibility. There are – 2 years later – a long way to go.
It was a big mistake by your father not to remain in the situation and personally drive you to therapy - outpatient therapy – but intense therapy I have to point out.
Your parents are not educated in medicine. That’s why they should have been advised by the hospital that it could have cost you your life, if you did not remain in an out-patient program - a program, which could have addressed the problems. The cutting, alcohol and drugs are not the issues, they are only a symptom. I am so sorry that this chance was wasted.
The first two chapters don’t create basis for a mandatory stay in a program.
What is there to say? Did the program teach you how to handle problems or did they just as any cult point out a single answer to life? Based on what I have seen so far, I will recommend you to read some novels by the Danish author Soeren Aabye Kierkegaard. As he writes life hurts. There is no single answer to a problem. Life is supposed to be complicated.
Once again I have to state that you should not feel bad about yourself smoking and cutting today. Smoking is a skip action method. You shouldn’t feel guilt over it, but if you want to quit find some other activity to do so you can take some time off during the day to do instead. Is cycling possible in your area? I personally find that this activity to both gives me time to reflect and remove some of my aggressiveness at the same time.
As for the cutting my best advice would be to find a person you can trust. How is your extended family? Another Cross Creek survivor (from around 1990) found an aunt which helped her to go on in life and she has made it. I feel that you are a strong person who just now is looking for resources inside. You found the strength to take the exit plan because you knew that you were finished with the program. There was nothing left the program could give you and the insight to realize it and take the consequences based on that insight testifies about a strong personality, who just needs a place to dump the worries in order to succeed in life.
Find this person. Dump your weekly load of worries by this individual.
Yet another good piece; you are a good writer.
As sad as this story is, I cannot wait to read the next installment.
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You sound like you are a lot tougher and stronger than most people are willing to give you credit for. Perhaps more than you are willing to give yourself. Take heart in this and be glad. Being mentally strong is a rare trait these days as people tend to associate mental toughness with loudmouth idiocy rather than anything deeper and more genuine.
As for Oscar:
Damn when I was young the fuzz made us pour our beer out and they laughed at us after threatening to call our parents if they caught us again. No one grilled wieners for us!
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Femanon (and everyone), I would caution against trying to create good guys and bad guys here. The fathers anger at seeing his daughter harmed was a natural response and he felt powerless to fix it because the person hurting his daughter was his daughter. There are also many layers that need to be considered inwhich we don’t know about. Adults don’t always just fall in love with someone elses children and then decide to marry the parent hoping someday they will love them too and be loved the same in return. Most of the time it works the other way around, the adults fall in love with each other first and then hopfully learn to love the others children. A preteen or teen having their biological mother out of the picture is hard enough but when you add a replacement it takes on a whole new set of dynamics and problems. As you read thru the fathers blog you can see that he loves his daughter very much and would never want to see her hurt. This is a family that has been harmed not just one individual. If we have learned anything from reading here on fornits expending your energy on anger, spewing venom and blaming parents, staff and programs in general does not lead to recovery or healing.
The best we can hope for is that Katie can learn to understand what happened to her and her family so that she can define it, make it tangible, hold it in her hand and begin to make sense of it all and not until then can she be able to set it down and move forward.
I think we should encourage Katie to stay open minded and write her story without a predefined antagonist set upon her.
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As much as I might agree that blame is not constructive at this point, her father's reaction was cold and insensitive. Instead of asking "what made you do this" he resorted to threats, further creating distance and further compounding the problem. I think a good therapist could have done a lot of good in this situation. It seems like Katie just needed somebody to talk to who had been through similar experiences and found a "way out" of the funk of depression.
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Femanon (and everyone), I would caution against trying to create good guys and bad guys here.
I think we should encourage Katie to stay open minded and write her story without a predefined antagonist set upon her.
I'm all for setting my judgments on her parents aside while she writes her stories, however its apparent to me that she blames herself, and accepts the blame her parents give her without questioning it. I think its healthy to question authority and the accepted social norms because its important for young adults to learn to make up their own minds about themselves and the world around them. I am not saying that her parents reaction wasn't expected, most parents are unprepared to handle a behavior like cutting so they do what comes natural, scold, punish and pawn the problem off to some institution. But that was NOT what Katie needed. Therefore because she did not get the help (and love) she needed she shouldn't feel guilty for the money it cost them to make the wrong choice to send her to a behavior mod program.
You might all know by now I have ALWAYS been the non-conformist type, before, during and certainly after the program. No one has EVER been able to mistreat me without me resisting or standing up for myself. But it looks like Katie hasn't always had that strength, and while my observations may be from a slightly extremist point of view, if she considers an opinion opposite of hers she might decide to see things just a little different then she always has. I think its about time Katie stood up for herself, defended her problems as symptoms or reactions to the misery that her parents are creating in her life and call them out on their selfish, morbid and malicious behavior. If they think its okay for them to constantly call her out on her teenage behavior she has the right to flip the tables and point out their magnanimous parental mistakes. Sometimes it takes the child realizing that their parents aren't always right, and are very often wrong to mentally release themselves from an unnecessary amount of guilt. Especially when that guilt and lack of self esteem is the root of what is causing these symptomatic problems. I just don't understand why a parent would want to try to force a kid not to be depressed by fighting with them and making them miserable.... that really makes no sense. It only suggests that her step mother has no other parenting style besides punishment and blame, so how could we NOT place the blame on her? This woman's antics are primarily responsible for Katie becoming so depressed, severe enough to cut herself, don't you think the whole "bad guy" role is fitting in this situation?
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Femanon (and everyone), I would caution against trying to create good guys and bad guys here. The fathers anger at seeing his daughter harmed was a natural response and he felt powerless to fix it because the person hurting his daughter was his daughter. There are also many layers that need to be considered inwhich we don’t know about. Adults don’t always just fall in love with someone elses children and then decide to marry the parent hoping someday they will love them too and be loved the same in return. Most of the time it works the other way around, the adults fall in love with each other first and then hopfully learn to love the others children. A preteen or teen having their biological mother out of the picture is hard enough but when you add a replacement it takes on a whole new set of dynamics and problems. As you read thru the fathers blog you can see that he loves his daughter very much and would never want to see her hurt. This is a family that has been harmed not just one individual. If we have learned anything from reading here on fornits expending your energy on anger, spewing venom and blaming parents, staff and programs in general does not lead to recovery or healing.
The best we can hope for is that Katie can learn to understand what happened to her and her family so that she can define it, make it tangible, hold it in her hand and begin to make sense of it all and not until then can she be able to set it down and move forward.
I think we should encourage Katie to stay open minded and write her story without a predefined antagonist set upon her.
who, do everyone, including katie, a favor and save your program promoting agenda for every other string? Do you really think its fair to do it at Katies's expense. Please shutup, you sick murdering, child abuser.
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Part three: I cannot even begin. The second round of my depression had begun.
As I said before I was doing whatever it took to be with her. I snuck out of my house only to return at 5 am before anyone was awake. I was living a secret life to be honest. Whatever she wanted I did whatever I could to give it to her. The situation at home just got worse. Diane was screaming at me every moment, and in response I screamed back. When I was at home, I would be up outside on the roof, trying to avoid everything. For my thirteenth birthday, my parents took us to New York. That was the best and worse day of my life. We went to a fancy restaurant with my extended family, and then we saw Lion King on Broadway. I felt as if they wanted to make everything with our family good again, and I felt so happy the problems were finally over….or so I thought.
We were driving to my aunts house back from the city, when I began talking about my friends, and how I wished they could have been there to experience it as well; (taking care not to mention Christy). Somehow it turned into an argument about how my friends were lazy scumbags etc. etc. I rose to their defense like a cobra and I was ready for a fight. “Those scumbags,” I screamed from my seat, “Are the only actual family that wants me around, unlike you, who doesn’t give a damn!” Diane demanded the car be stopped. She got out, and told my dad to drive back to my aunt’s, saying she needed some air. I was so angry I saw red. My blood was boiling. “WHY DO YOU PUT UP WITH IT??” I screamed at my dad after we drove away. It was his turn. Calmly he said, “You will not talk about my wife like that…I will not allow you do disrespect her.” Those words hit me like a ton of bricks. Why wouldn’t he say that about me? When she insulted me, he was a silent man. When I defended myself, I was the bad one, the stupid one. I Was always wrong.
That night, I went into the guestroom. I did the only thing I could think of. I cut again. I hadn’t cut ever since the hospitalization. At once I felt better. Numb. I went deep this time, feeling nothing but an emotional bliss. After I felt I was finished I went into the bathroom and cleaned myself up, making sure to bandage myself ankle and keep it hidden. I didn’t want anyone to see. I felt so relieved I couldn’t bear it if I ended up being wrong again.
A few hours later sitting at the table in the kitchen reading Diane got home. She saw me and went off. She kept her voiced low, so as to not have anyone else hear her:
:flame: “You stupid little bitch. You are the main issue in this family and if you ever fucking talk like that to me again I swear I will hit you so hard you can’t remember your own name. I don’t know why you can’t be a decent human being. Your brothers are afraid of you. Nobody wants you around them! Why can’t you be more like your brothers, like normal people? You have to be such a pain in the ass! :flame: :heartbreak: :waaaa:
I was in shock, and in that one moment all affection that I had for her died in me. I hated her. I thought to myself how she was a stupid horrible person. I watched her walk upstairs acting like she had just taken out the garbage or cleaned the dishes. Then the anger faded leaving the thought: I was the problem. I was her garbage that she tried to hide from everyone. I was an embarrassment.
I remember nothing else from the trip, only that I was almost a ghost, isolating myself from the family, since I was the black sheep in our white flock. I was the failure. Getting back to the comfort of my friends I threw myself into my behaviors, thinking my family would be happier were I not there. I grew distant. I started stealing money for cigarettes and alcohol, and taking my meds more than directed. I felt like I was never going to be good enough, so I avoided them to stay way from criticism.
I started 8th grade. 6 months went by. Bullies make me easy pickings. I was the loner, bigger girl who had the scars. I was an easy target. Especially for boys. I was overweight and I ate to cope with it. One day I got home and directly went to Christy’s. We walked around, and not knowing it, my dad had left to pick up my brother from his practice. He saw me and her walking as he was driving home. He stopped the car and told me to get in. he was so angry. I didn’t care anymore. I didn’t hear anything of what he said. To this day I still don’t know what he told me in the car, I’m sure it was not too pretty. I was grounded. I read books. I cut. I cried.
Again I was forbidden to see her. I didn’t care. She was the only one I could ever relate to… I went against his will anyway.
To get away from school and bullies I began to fake sick, forcing myself to puke so I could go home. ::puke:: I wouldn’t stay in bed like I was told. I would leave the house, with no opinion of who saw me. I was an empty shell.
It was a Tuesday. I got home from school. I had been pushed to the limit by bullies. I wanted the pain to stop! KHYS said that everything had to worse before it got better, or there’s light at the end of the tunnel. Where was my goddamn sunshine? I was angry and began to cry. Again I resulted to the only thing I could. I cut myself.. I was light headed and angry, I cut deeper than I meant to. I didn’t notice at that point however I just wanted the pain to end, so I continued hacking at my arms. All the while my dad had gotten home from work, and I didn’t notice. He walked into the room. He screamed “WHAT ARE YOU DOING?” Running over he grabbed the razor from my hand, while I tried to fight him off. Baby why are you doing this? He was crying. He pulled me to him and held me, my blood staining his shirt. He was talking gently a, stroking my head as I cried. Then he cleaned me up and out bandages on my arms. He held me close to him and called my brother upstairs telling him to get the phone and a blanket.
He held me and called the only place he could think of. KHYS. I was admitted again. The looks of the staff were that of scorn and disappointment that I had returned to treatment. The one nurse who was not condescending, and held me for a long time was Mollie. She was so kind the first time around; keeping me company and giving me the affection I needed. She was so warm as she held me. I never wanted her to let go. :'(
That is about all i can handle for today. But i want to thank you all again for reading. Part four will be posted tomorrow.
Any comments or questions email me:
[email protected]
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About part III:
Once again I remain amazed. How can the people at the hospital be surprised or disappointed of your return? You were only stabilized the first time. You were not treated. I know that we have a huge waiting list for youth here in Denmark but at least it is common knowledge what it takes to progress from a suicide attempt.
I have been looking at NAMI’s latest statistic (http://http://www.nami.org/gtsTemplate09.cfm?Section=Grading_the_States_2009) and there seems for sure that there is a long way to go.
It is tough reading. It certainly called for intense family therapy – not only therapy involving your father and step-mom but also your birth mom.
Still however, I must say that there still was no reason to get you into a therapeutic boarding school. We have continuation schools here and while they are very used by people who for some reason cannot function in the general school system. We call them hideouts from the real world. The students are general happy with them and they don’t offer therapy. Ok. They cross dress (http://http://i28.tinypic.com/288pfdc.jpg) and use sleep deprivation (http://http://www.magleby-efterskole.dk/overlevelsestur09/indeks.htm) but the students goes home most weekends if they want.
Another problem I hope that time has taken care of in your place is the issue of school bullying. I hope that precaution is taken to reduce this evilness. At the school my kids are attending there are special teachers educated to diffuse this. Some of the students have received special education in solving conflicts. If a class is to remain competitive it cannot be in conflict with itself.
It is quiet common for people who are being side kicked by life to be together. We had several cases where girls were bullied together and then they are ending up in the newspapers when they learn to turn their anger outwards. You didn’t reach that stage with Christy. I wonder where she is today.
Anyway I am surprised that they didn’t discuss living with relatives before the second suicide. Maybe they were too caught up in the situation.
I think that you are unspeakable brave to write this story and I understand why you are tired. Take the time before you write the next installment.
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Hi. This is Katie's dad.
I just wanted to put one quick note here, and that will be all. This is her story, from her view, in her words. It is not mine - and there are events that I remember quite differently myself. Katie has a great talent for writing, and it is definitely coming out here. I've told (and am telling) my side in my blog (http://parents-of-a-troubled-teen.blogspot.com/ (http://parents-of-a-troubled-teen.blogspot.com/)) - I'd actually recommend that Katie set up a blog there to post to instead of a thread in a bulletin board.
There are at least two sides to every story - this one is Katies.
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Hi. This is Katie's dad.
I just wanted to put one quick note here, and that will be all. This is her story, from her view, in her words. It is not mine - and there are events that I remember quite differently myself. Katie has a great talent for writing, and it is definitely coming out here. I've told (and am telling) my side in my blog (http://parents-of-a-troubled-teen.blogspot.com/ (http://parents-of-a-troubled-teen.blogspot.com/)) - I'd actually recommend that Katie set up a blog there to post to instead of a thread in a bulletin board.
There are at least two sides to every story - this one is Katies.
Yours is the one of an abusive asshole who imprisoned and tortured your daughter for 3 years, and would have done so longer had your money not run out. How long would you have incarcerated her, Micheal? 5 years? 10 years? You know, before human rights laws were as liberal as they were today, a man could lock his children up in institutions literally for their entire lives ; he could do the same to his wife, anyone, if a relatively powerful person targeted them, could be locked away forever in insane asylums. So, if it were legal,and you had unlimitd supplies of $$$ how much of Katie's life would you have ripped from her, Micheal, you sick fuck?
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look just a quick note. my parents did what they thought was best but by insulting them only makes things worse for me. please. to my readers i thank you. but please stay respectful. they are my parents. there are some things i disagree with and disrespect is one of them. please. for my sake be respectful . It would help me to grow and be willing to share my thoughts. please realize that i love them even if there are issues. as before i'll write part 5 tomorrow. :nods: :nods: :nods: :nods: :nods: :nods: :nods: :nods: :timeout: :timeout: :timeout: :timeout: :timeout: :timeout: :timeout:
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I must be getting old.
I read a good portion of the parent blog around the time it first got crosslinked on fornits, and started at the beginning.
And when I read stuff like this, the whole idea of fault kind of just pisses itself away, and all I am left with is this deep sorrow. I just don't have the energy to be mad or uppity about it, or call anyone evil or a child abuser.
It just makes me sad. These places destroy lives, they destroy families. They promise a happy ending and give you the opposite.
I don't care who in the family was unreasonable, in the end, nobody wins, except for the program.
I think about Daniel (http://http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/y/yuen_daniel.html) more often than I should. If he's alive, and if so, where? I never knew the kid, but when I first read the story, it hit a nerve.
So when I read things like this, I think about him.. and his father.
And it makes me sad.
I definitely must be getting old.
To katie's dad, thanks for posting: all I really would like to say is... please, if you *are* still doing referrals, please stop. That is blood money.
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:tup: Well said, Castle, I couldn't have said it any better (actually, that last goes without saying given my social ineptitude). This whole situation is primarily one of dysfunctional family dynamics, rapacious greedy corporations that will bleed a family dry regardless of human cost, and an inherently sucky sucky world.
Comment about dysfunctional family dynamics: just like some individuals sometimes cut to make themselves feel better and provide a controlled release for pain, a dysfunctional family almost always choses to focus on a single member as being "the root cause" of all their problems. Katie is just subconsciously expressing it all for you, right down to even fulfilling the role of self-cutter to complete the metaphor!
Healing from all this takes time and love, and lots of retracting that "finger of blame" by all sides concerned.
Here's a link for all you might ever want to know about cutting, originally provided (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=26676&p=324419#p324419) by Eliscu2 on another thread:
http://www.palace.net/~llama/psych/injury.html (http://www.palace.net/~llama/psych/injury.html)
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I'm sorry, but when it comes down to the fact that a little girl, who was so sad and felt so unwanted that she would cut herself to relieve the pain I HAVE to blame the parents. I hear this often from the network of mothers I work with, when hearing of a tragic story involving children they always say "where were the parents?" and this is true for this story too. I wouldn't place the blame as much on the father as I would the step mother, for the emotional abuse, I gathered that much before Katie even started writing this story, her distain and malice was terribly clear in her blogs. However the choice to send a depressed child into an environment like that of the program was just morbidly wrong. Katie didn't need to learn to behave, she needed to be loved and that was obviously something these parents were unwilling to give her. Instead they left her to rot in a program for 3 years! 3 years is an abnormal amount of time, even for WWASP kids and considering that if they hadn't ran out of money she would have stayed longer there is no evidence what so ever that these parents weren't being intentionally negligent.
It is very hard for me to release either parent of the blame they should carry for sending their suicidal daughter to a behavior modification program, especially a WWASP program. I can't imagine how anyone could convince themselves that "tough love" could be a cure for depression, but my guess is that they weren't concerned for Katie's life or well being, their only intention was to purge her from the home as long as possible. The programs are not designed to help kids with depression or serious issues like cutting and suicide, they may not admit it in their marketing materials but that environment is not conducive to healing and the kind of family dynamic change you needed. The program is designed to put you in your place and make you so fearful of punishment (ie being restrained) that you obey. These programs are designed to cater to the parents wishes not the child's needs. That is why I fault your parent's Katie, because they weren't thinking in your best interest, they were only thinking of their own and because of those choices your entire adolescence was wasted and your "problems" were only made worse.
I'd like to know Katie, do you still cut?... Are your family problems just about the same as before you left or worse? Do you think it was worth it to have missed so many vital years and experience considering that what you traded it for, was what you experienced at WWASP? I'd also like to know if your parents still praise the program knowing that none of the changes that WWASP promised ever happened and all they got was 3 years of you out of the home.... was that what they wanted?... is that what was worth it to them?
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Hi. This is Katie's dad.
I just wanted to put one quick note here, and that will be all. This is her story, from her view, in her words. It is not mine - and there are events that I remember quite differently myself. Katie has a great talent for writing, and it is definitely coming out here. I've told (and am telling) my side in my blog (http://parents-of-a-troubled-teen.blogspot.com/ (http://parents-of-a-troubled-teen.blogspot.com/)) - I'd actually recommend that Katie set up a blog there to post to instead of a thread in a bulletin board.
There are at least two sides to every story - this one is Katies.
It could be a good idea if her story ended up in a blog.
Of course there is two sides of the story. How is it Dr. Phil is saying "As thin as you can make a pancake, it still have two sides".
She is going through a heal-process right now. She is writing things as she saw them. She was the one who was removed from her family and placed in a restricted environment where she could not communicate freely as her letters were edited before they were sent. She has extended family. She could not reach out to them. She had friends - few but they existed, but she could not reach out to them for support.
She needs to come to closure with all the anger and frustration she has built up in her before the program, during the program and of course after the program where she has experienced difficulties adjusting to real life.
In the other thread, you mention her lack of motivation to get up from bed and to engage in exercise. Working in an environment where the issue of depression is handled on an everyday basis, I recognize the symptoms. While it should be treated she needs to come to a point where it can be treated, because the most important illness she needs to cope with right now is the posttraumatic stress disorder (http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ptsd) (PTSD) she as many people got when she returned from the intense environment Cross Creek is. While it for some reason has become a state-license facility the nature of the environment for students are very intense. They have to be 100% aware not to break rules because there are so many of them and the consequences are so severe. There is no room to be relaxed. They are on alert 24/7. You can compare it with soldiers in a war. If they relax they can become victim of a road side bomb. If you doubt that the internal environment are more intense than you have experienced during the doctored parent visits, then ask yourself why people would rather be in jail (http://http://www.savemichaelperry.info/casabythesea.asp) than at one of the programs.
She is dealing / treating herself from the PTSD through her writing. Once she has written her story and this burden is away, in due time she would be ready to battle the depression she according to my analyze of both your blog and her story got when she became verbal weapon in the divorce war between you and your ex-wife. She will write things you don’t like in this process. You will properly feel that some of the things she writes could be written as an attack on you, but I don’t feel it that way. She is the one who are asking people to back off from you.
If she discontinues her story, how will she try to overcome her problems? If you google our datasheet on their former Samoa program (http://http://www.secretprisonsforteens.dk/fornitswiki/index.php/Paradise_Cove), you will discover the trial based on the murder in Coral Gables (http://http://www.isaccorp.org/wwasps/wwasps.06.07.05.html). Let her choose a verbal way of removing her burden rather than a physical.
I don’t know how this story will end. Maybe maybe as new Comeback book (http://http://www.secretprisonsforteens.dk/fornitswiki/index.php/Comeback,_Book), which I guess you have already on your bookshelf.
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Femanon (and everyone), I would caution against trying to create good guys and bad guys here. The fathers anger at seeing his daughter harmed was a natural response and he felt powerless to fix it because the person hurting his daughter was his daughter. There are also many layers that need to be considered inwhich we don’t know about. Adults don’t always just fall in love with someone elses children and then decide to marry the parent hoping someday they will love them too and be loved the same in return. Most of the time it works the other way around, the adults fall in love with each other first and then hopfully learn to love the others children. A preteen or teen having their biological mother out of the picture is hard enough but when you add a replacement it takes on a whole new set of dynamics and problems. As you read thru the fathers blog you can see that he loves his daughter very much and would never want to see her hurt. This is a family that has been harmed not just one individual. If we have learned anything from reading here on fornits expending your energy on anger, spewing venom and blaming parents, staff and programs in general does not lead to recovery or healing.
The best we can hope for is that Katie can learn to understand what happened to her and her family so that she can define it, make it tangible, hold it in her hand and begin to make sense of it all and not until then can she be able to set it down and move forward.
I think we should encourage Katie to stay open minded and write her story without a predefined antagonist set upon her.
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Wow Neil, I thank you for a well thought out and non-venomous response. I feel like a lot of the angry responses here are from those people without children, that hopefully from their responses will NEVER procreate, and have never had tough choices other than what time to wake in the afternoon so they can sit in their parents basement on their computer and get their jollys by telling people to just kill themselves.
Maybe I've just stooped to their level here by saying that, but as a parent that has had to make tough choices, I get so tired of these people.
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Femanon (and everyone), I would caution against trying to create good guys and bad guys here. The fathers anger at seeing his daughter harmed was a natural response and he felt powerless to fix it because the person hurting his daughter was his daughter. There are also many layers that need to be considered inwhich we don’t know about. Adults don’t always just fall in love with someone elses children and then decide to marry the parent hoping someday they will love them too and be loved the same in return. Most of the time it works the other way around, the adults fall in love with each other first and then hopfully learn to love the others children. A preteen or teen having their biological mother out of the picture is hard enough but when you add a replacement it takes on a whole new set of dynamics and problems. As you read thru the fathers blog you can see that he loves his daughter very much and would never want to see her hurt. This is a family that has been harmed not just one individual. If we have learned anything from reading here on fornits expending your energy on anger, spewing venom and blaming parents, staff and programs in general does not lead to recovery or healing.
The best we can hope for is that Katie can learn to understand what happened to her and her family so that she can define it, make it tangible, hold it in her hand and begin to make sense of it all and not until then can she be able to set it down and move forward.
I think we should encourage Katie to stay open minded and write her story without a predefined antagonist set upon her.
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Wow Neil, I thank you for a well thought out and non-venomous response. I feel like a lot of the angry responses here are from those people without children, that hopefully from their responses will NEVER procreate, and have never had tough choices other than what time to wake in the afternoon so they can sit in their parents basement on their computer and get their jollys by telling people to just kill themselves.
Maybe I've just stooped to their level here by saying that, but as a parent that has had to make tough choices, I get so tired of these people.
Geez Louise! Somehow, I just can't wrap my brain around Michael Carter saying this about his daughter, especially given his predilection for advertising his identity on the internet and disdain for "cowardly anonymous" guest posters. Plus, he has posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=27274&p=329758#p329706) his avowed desire to stay out of this thread out of deference to Katie (given that this thread is her story).
Yet this person "guest2" seems to have a certain unmistakable "parental" take on this particular situation. Hmmm. This really leaves very few possible candidates... Gee, who could it be?
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Healing from all this takes time and love, and lots of retracting that "finger of blame" by all sides concerned.
Ultimately, I think you're right. My parents and I just don't talk about the "reasons" anymore, and as a result, we get along fine. Sometimes agreeing to disagree, or agreeing not to discuss a topic, is the wisest choice... but it's something both parties must agree on mutually and consensually. Programs that include similar conditions in their "home/visit contracts" are just looking to cover their own asses.
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Geez Louise! Somehow, I just can't wrap my brain around Michael Carter saying this about his daughter, especially given his predilection for advertising his identity on the internet and disdain for "cowardly anonymous" guest posters. Plus, he has posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=27274&p=329758#p329706) his avowed desire to stay out of this thread out of deference to Katie (given that this thread is her story).
Yet this person "guest2" seems to have a certain unmistakable "parental" take on this particular situation. Hmmm. This really leaves very few possible candidates... Gee, who could it be?
I'm sorry you think that. This is not Mr. Carter, nor do I know of him. I'm just responding as a parent would who has grown up being taught of right and wrong and yes a little healthy fear of my folks. And respect for others views. I don't want to sign my name as I don't want to get into a pissing match with those of you who think you need to spew venom at someone who doesn't think the way you do.
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Femanon (and everyone), I would caution against trying to create good guys and bad guys here. The fathers anger at seeing his daughter harmed was a natural response and he felt powerless to fix it because the person hurting his daughter was his daughter. There are also many layers that need to be considered inwhich we don’t know about. Adults don’t always just fall in love with someone elses children and then decide to marry the parent hoping someday they will love them too and be loved the same in return. Most of the time it works the other way around, the adults fall in love with each other first and then hopfully learn to love the others children. A preteen or teen having their biological mother out of the picture is hard enough but when you add a replacement it takes on a whole new set of dynamics and problems. As you read thru the fathers blog you can see that he loves his daughter very much and would never want to see her hurt. This is a family that has been harmed not just one individual. If we have learned anything from reading here on fornits expending your energy on anger, spewing venom and blaming parents, staff and programs in general does not lead to recovery or healing.
The best we can hope for is that Katie can learn to understand what happened to her and her family so that she can define it, make it tangible, hold it in her hand and begin to make sense of it all and not until then can she be able to set it down and move forward.
I think we should encourage Katie to stay open minded and write her story without a predefined antagonist set upon her.
-----
Wow Neil, I thank you for a well thought out and non-venomous response. I feel like a lot of the angry responses here are from those people without children, that hopefully from their responses will NEVER procreate, and have never had tough choices other than what time to wake in the afternoon so they can sit in their parents basement on their computer and get their jollys by telling people to just kill themselves.
Maybe I've just stooped to their level here by saying that, but as a parent that has had to make tough choices, I get so tired of these people.
Geez Louise! Somehow, I just can't wrap my brain around Michael Carter saying this about his daughter, especially given his predilection for advertising his identity on the internet and disdain for "cowardly anonymous" guest posters. Plus, he has posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=27274&p=329758#p329706) his avowed desire to stay out of this thread out of deference to Katie (given that this thread is her story).
Yet this person "guest2" seems to have a certain unmistakable "parental" take on this particular situation. Hmmm. This really leaves very few possible candidates... Gee, who could it be?
I'm sorry you think that. This is not Mr. Carter, nor do I know of him. I'm just responding as a parent would who has grown up being taught of right and wrong and yes a little healthy fear of my folks. And respect for others views. I don't want to sign my name as I don't want to get into a pissing match with those of you who think you need to spew venom at someone who doesn't think the way you do.
I have re-quoted the exchange since you saw fit to mis-attribute portions thereof. I most certainly wasn't implying that you were Mr. Carter. :D
I was responding to the the specificity of the following description:
...so they can sit in their parents basement on their computer and get their jollys by telling people to just kill themselves...[/list]
Gee, now... how would you know that? Am I missing something? Did Katie ever describe the computer as being in the basement?
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Geez Louise! Somehow, I just can't wrap my brain around Michael Carter saying this about his daughter, especially given his predilection for advertising his identity on the internet and disdain for "cowardly anonymous" guest posters. Plus, he has posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=27274&p=329758#p329706) his avowed desire to stay out of this thread out of deference to Katie (given that this thread is her story).
Yet this person "guest2" seems to have a certain unmistakable "parental" take on this particular situation. Hmmm. This really leaves very few possible candidates... Gee, who could it be?
I'm sorry you think that. This is not Mr. Carter, nor do I know of him. I'm just responding as a parent would who has grown up being taught of right and wrong and yes a little healthy fear of my folks. And respect for others views. I don't want to sign my name as I don't want to get into a pissing match with those of you who think you need to spew venom at someone who doesn't think the way you do.
look. Anybody can and does post here. Please don't blame the whole forum for the views of a single person's suggestion.
Ps: Katie: this portion of the forum is unmoderated. If you find it too harsh, feel free to continue this topic in the CAN forum which is moderated:
viewforum.php?f=59 (http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=59)
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Geez Louise! Somehow, I just can't wrap my brain around Michael Carter saying this about his daughter, especially given his predilection for advertising his identity on the internet and disdain for "cowardly anonymous" guest posters. Plus, he has posted (http://http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=27274&p=329758#p329706) his avowed desire to stay out of this thread out of deference to Katie (given that this thread is her story).
Yet this person "guest2" seems to have a certain unmistakable "parental" take on this particular situation. Hmmm. This really leaves very few possible candidates... Gee, who could it be?
I'm sorry you think that. This is not Mr. Carter, nor do I know of him. I'm just responding as a parent would who has grown up being taught of right and wrong and yes a little healthy fear of my folks. And respect for others views. I don't want to sign my name as I don't want to get into a pissing match with those of you who think you need to spew venom at someone who doesn't think the way you do.
Just fixed the quotes. That wasnt me that posted that.
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Just fixed the quotes. That wasnt me that posted that.
Thanks, NeilWho! ;)
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So what if I am a parent, does that make me bad? I come to fornits for good reasons. When a kid posts their story of what they claim happened in a program, someone needs to play devils advocate and question their story. I do this through direct confrontation, or humor. If a kid says they were sexually abused, I might make a joke about it. I know for a fact sexual abuse doesn't happen in programs, so I don't see the issue with making it into a humurous situation.
If some kid decides to list the abuses directed against them, I might copy the list then point out which individual actions of abuse amuse me the most, and which one's are my favorites. You have to remember, abuse doesn't happen in programs. When some of you claim that it does, I know you are lying and I know pointing it out will make you upset. Then I can point out how venemous you are, and go to bed feeling like I made a difference in the world for good.
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at first i was gonna get angry then i realised thsiw as a treoll :(
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So what if I am a parent, does that make me bad? I come to fornits for good reasons. When a kid posts their story of what they claim happened in a program, someone needs to play devils advocate and question their story. I do this through direct confrontation, or humor. If a kid says they were sexually abused, I might make a joke about it. I know for a fact sexual abuse doesn't happen in programs, so I don't see the issue with making it into a humurous situation.
If some kid decides to list the abuses directed against them, I might copy the list then point out which individual actions of abuse amuse me the most, and which one's are my favorites. You have to remember, abuse doesn't happen in programs. When some of you claim that it does, I know you are lying and I know pointing it out will make you upset. Then I can point out how venemous you are, and go to bed feeling like I made a difference in the world for good.
I'm not going to get upset or angry either. In fact I am going to remain incredibly calm while I tell you Mr. Dearest Neil, that you are a sick, sick, sick fuck.
That is all.
-DP
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So what if I am a parent, does that make me bad? I come to fornits for good reasons. When a kid posts their story of what they claim happened in a program, someone needs to play devils advocate and question their story. I do this through direct confrontation, or humor. If a kid says they were sexually abused, I might make a joke about it. I know for a fact sexual abuse doesn't happen in programs, so I don't see the issue with making it into a humurous situation.
If some kid decides to list the abuses directed against them, I might copy the list then point out which individual actions of abuse amuse me the most, and which one's are my favorites. You have to remember, abuse doesn't happen in programs. When some of you claim that it does, I know you are lying and I know pointing it out will make you upset. Then I can point out how venemous you are, and go to bed feeling like I made a difference in the world for good.
I'm not going to get upset or angry either. In fact I am going to remain incredibly calm while I tell you Mr. Dearest Neil, that you are a sick, sick, sick fuck.
That is all.
-DP
Sorry everyone, a troll hijacked my name and making some havoc. Guess thats what I get for not opening up an account.
NeilW
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^^^thats what theWHO says when he realizes he crossed a line and what he says isn't going over as well as he thought. :roflmao:
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Out of respect for Katie, perhaps we can wait stay on-topic... Just a kind request.
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Out of respect for Katie, perhaps we can wait stay on-topic... Just a kind request.
Yes, ignore Who.
Ugh.
I don't know….Whos bad enough…But I really cannot understand how her own parents could be so abusive, and so immaturely self-interested.
It’s interesting that Castle mentioned being brainwashed into idolizing his dad.
I believe these programs tend to generate a ‘Stockholm syndrome’ style connection to program-parents.
Worse, the kids get out of these organizations so debilitated they become dependant on their parents to an unnatural extent, sometimes trapping them in dependence and therefore a Stockholm syndrome like attachment to their parents for years (Jackie Walters)
Katie, I really recommend joining the lawsuit to help with your independence, something you should be further along with now—and would have been had you not been incarcerated and tortured/brainwashed throughout your entire adolescence—I can promise you, justice is the best cure for depression and ptsd!
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Thanks psy, just a thought, What may serve two purposes is to have a thread opened on the CAN (moderated thread) and post Katies installments there as well as on this one (un-moderated thread). This way her story would not be buried within pages of reaction to each of her installments and would make it easier for first time readers to catch up and follow. If Katie agrees to it.
NeilW
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I'll let her start a thread in CAN if she feels it necessary.
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Out of respect for Katie, perhaps we can wait stay on-topic... Just a kind request.
Katie, I really recommend joining the lawsuit to help with your independence, something you should be further along with now—and would have been had you not been incarcerated and tortured/brainwashed throughout your entire adolescence—I can promise you, justice is the best cure for depression and ptsd!
http://www.turleylaw.com/ (http://www.turleylaw.com/)
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Out of respect for Katie, perhaps we can wait stay on-topic... Just a kind request.
Katie, I really recommend joining the lawsuit to help with your independence, something you should be further along with now—and would have been had you not been incarcerated and tortured/brainwashed throughout your entire adolescence—I can promise you, justice is the best cure for depression and ptsd!
http://www.turleylaw.com/ (http://www.turleylaw.com/)
The Turley suit is not taking new plaintiffs at this time.
But guys, lets remember that she is just now coming to terms with her stay in Cross Creek, she has mentioned to me that she doesn't think she was abused, yet she also said that she had been restrained and isolated, so I think she has a way to go before she understands the gravity of the "treatment" she received in CCM. I think we should let her get to that point in the story before we suggest lawsuits, at this point I would be more inclined to suggest that her parents were even more psychologically abusive then the program was. In fact, from what I gather, and as sad as this sounds she might have been happier at CCM than she was/is at home.
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It’s interesting that Castle mentioned being brainwashed into idolizing his dad.
I should, perhaps, elaborate on that.
The seeds had already been sown when they separated. People now are more knowledgeable in terms of how to create a healthy dynamic between the parent who has custody and the one who does not. But in the 70s, that was not the case.
My mother had custody. As such, when my father had visitation, every time was "fun time". Junk food, staying up late, toys, chuck e cheese and water slides. If you see your kids every other week, you want to make the most of it, you know? My dad's mid-life crisis/bachelor lifestyle, with the porsche and the boat and the good looking girlfriends didnt help, either. All of this easily sets up a "good guy/bad guy" situation. My mom was the disciplinarian, she had to deal with my drek every day, whereas I normally only got one or two star-studded backhands from my father during the weekends, which were quickly forgiven, since I was so happy to see him. (And no, he is not a child abuser. 70s parents did things differently. You mouthed off, the riposte was the hand of dad, and I have always had an extremely foul, vulgar mouth. Doesn't mean its right, though.) It paled in comparison to the whippings and thrown objects from my mother. It never occurred to me that if I were living with my dad, things would have been just as explosive.
It is known now that parents with visitation have to have down time with their kids as well, to prevent this lopsided perception issue.
All my mother heard from me was how badly I wanted to live with him. Every time I came back from a visit, I'd be in tears. This certainly didn't help her emotionally. She was the one who had to take care of me, clean up after me, discipline me, go to the parent teacher meetings, get a job a substitute teacher so she could support my sister and I, while the old man walked out, didn't pay much child support (especially for a kid with as many medical problems as I), and basically embraced the lifestyle of a recent college grad. Trust me when I say that many times she wished I COULD go live with my father, and she said so often, at about 90 decibels.
CEDU exploited that. They oversimplified the situation. Never addressed the overall issue, never put it in its proper context. (ESPECIALLY never talked about how the relationship became primarily materialistic, and was initiated by the parent.) Not only that, they also encouraged demonizing my mother, who certainly didnt deserve that. They exacerbated the already slanted perception. So he was the one I cried about every time they played "I need you" or "what about me?" in propheets (ugh), this despite the fact that after finally living with my father full-time before I was placed, I couldn't stand him, and he and my stepmother kept their bedroom door locked at night because they thought I was going to kill them. (which was ignorant and paranoid on their part. So I was into wicca, big whoop-de-doo.)
However, coming out of the place, everything was suddenly hunky dory, even though NOTHING in our relationship had been resolved. Especially since any parental issues kids work with at the place is done in isolation, and not with the parent. As such, the honeymoon had the half-life of a mayfly.
The sad thing is, the thought of seeing him as my hero today makes me cringe, and to this day, even though I remember clearly my crying fits after visits when I was a child, I honestly can't comprehend why I felt that way. I was made to scream about it so much at CEDU, that whatever true sorrow I felt about the divorce was run through a grinder and rendered into dust. The issue was never really addressed, it was simply killed, and true perspective was never achieved. I was made to regard it as if I were five years old again.
My connection with my parents was effectively severed. It took me years to rebuild one with my mother. I dont know if it will ever happen with my dad.
My friend and fellow alum S experienced the exact same thing. We pretty much freaked each other out when we had a conversation about it as adults. The similarities were uncanny.
Which is why I staunchly maintain that programs do not help families. They destroy them. No matter how much gets patched up afterwards, over a period of years, it will never ever be the same again.
Programs constantly encourage and facilitate regression in their "therapeutic" practices. As a result, it makes it impossible for the kid to relate to their parents as an adult when they get out. You basically pick up where you left off before you went into the clink, with about ten trunks more baggage.
I think we should let her get to that point in the story before we suggest lawsuits,
Agreed. Now is the time for decompression and debriefing between her and her folks, on whatever level that may be.
Hopefully it will work out better than it did for some of us. All I can really offer is my perspective, so I hope it can help.
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In fact, from what I gather, and as sad as this sounds she might have been happier at CCM than she was/is at home.
You win the prize for stupid.
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Out of respect for Katie, perhaps we can wait stay on-topic... Just a kind request.
Katie, I really recommend joining the lawsuit to help with your independence, something you should be further along with now—and would have been had you not been incarcerated and tortured/brainwashed throughout your entire adolescence—I can promise you, justice is the best cure for depression and ptsd!
http://www.turleylaw.com/ (http://www.turleylaw.com/)
The Turley suit is not taking new plaintiffs at this time.
But guys, lets remember that she is just now coming to terms with her stay in Cross Creek, she has mentioned to me that she doesn't think she was abused, yet she also said that she had been restrained and isolated, so I think she has a way to go before she understands the gravity of the "treatment" she received in CCM. I think we should let her get to that point in the story before we suggest lawsuits, at this point I would be more inclined to suggest that her parents were even more psychologically abusive then the program was. In fact, from what I gather, and as sad as this sounds she might have been happier at CCM than she was/is at home.
Kaite, contact these people anyway. Lawsuits against the people who tortured you, heal. Criminal charges are even better, if you can get the feds to help you
there is no healing without justice, imo
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Programs constantly encourage and facilitate regression in their "therapeutic" practices. As a result, it makes it impossible for the kid to relate to their parents as an adult when they get out. You basically pick up where you left off before you went into the clink, with about ten trunks more baggage.
Thank you for that Castle, I really enjoy reading your posts. :notworthy:
I think the same is true for WWASP as well... We were taught to accept that our parents were always right, and perfect (well the ones paying the paycheck that is) and anything we had to say about how they acted was automatically turned around to point out some kind of problem we had that justified their actions. I never understood it, yet I saw it time and again and not just from staff but the upper levels and other kids too... that was simply part of the doctrine there "obey thy mother and father, they can do no wrong". I can remember one time in particular there was this 14 year old girl who was such an amazing person to be around, she had a great sense of humor and a quick wit, you might say she had an attractive personality. Her problem was with "partying" apparently she drank and smoked weed but you could really consider that normal teenage stuff, she kept up her grades and rarely got into any trouble. Her mom however was a mentally unstable, abusive, drug store addict/ alcoholic and this girl told us of some really fucked up shit that her mom did to her and her dad (who moved to a different city just to escape her mother). Yet, for some reason people always gave her feed back that she was somehow taking advantage of her mothers illness in order to use drugs (only weed mind you), or that she was the one driving her mother crazy. There were more than a few times I would just laugh out loud at the ridiculous concepts the program tried to force on us, i feel sorry for those that came to believe it but I just don't see the logic in that. Our parents are human too and they also happen to be half of the goddamn problem.
I really think programs are designed to be the child repair factory for parents, not actually help the kids. That's why when it came time for the kids to come home all we knew is the program jargon and not how to maintain a healthy lifestyle. This really got in the way of relating to our parents as anything else besides the authoritarian despite the fact that we were of the age that we were supposed to be making our own decisions, and the parent child relationship would be dissolving. I think it was hardest for me to talk to my mom when I got home, because instead of confiding in her, I was always afraid that she would punish me or more namely that she would send me back to the program. Trust with my mom wasn't established until well into my young adult years, after I had moved out and wasn't under the threat of her parental wrath. Now, as that fear of her authority wore off, we get along much much better.
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Attention peoples...
thread continued here:
viewtopic.php?f=59&t=27302&start=0 (http://www.fornits.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=27302&start=0)
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Alright everyone. Lets get this started again. Part four.
I was hospitalized in Khys again as I said, for slightly longer this time. I still continued to receive visits from family, but the tension was apparent even in a structured and moderated facility. The second time I was in treatment I had a room by myself. I felt so scared and alone I would beg Mollie to come and sit in my room until I fell asleep. I needed someone there. I turned off my emotions, thinking that no body could help me, due to beliefs ingrained in me not only by my biological mother but from my step-mother. I dearly wished that I would have died in that second attempt. Again my medication changed. I was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder ( a very mild form of bipolar) and night terrors at 14 years old. I was the family screw up. Has anyone read the trumpeter swan or saw the movie? To be swift about explaining my point a swan is born with no voice and everyone thinks there is something wrong with him. He leaves his family to try and find a way to communicate. While he is gone his father steals a trumpet that simulates the sounds a swan makes. This is basically how I felt. I was the swan with no voice. I was the one with the problem I was the one who was different than anyone else. Yet again I was discharged, but this time to “ensure my safety” I was put into an outpatient program where I could go to school at the facility and have daily check-ups then go home at night. This continued for 4 weeks. I became comfortable. I felt as if I was safe while I was there. No yelling, fun activities and fieldtrips. I had Mollie. I began to feel better again. I felt that I was finally starting to become normal, but as if so happens in my life, my perception is no where close to reality. When I “graduated” I got to go back to middle school. YAY! Not.
My brothers had let it slip that I had been admitted to Khys. You see in my school, everyone knew about the facility. It was “the suicidal hangout” or the “crazy people place”. The moment I walked back into the school the whispers began. The pointing. It was even worse than before. You see I had been able to slip under the radar as just another person people get interested in for a few days and move on, now I was a psycho kid. I was ‘the freak”. In sociology there are three main causes of deviant behaviour, Labelling is one of them. When labelled often a person will live up to the label so as to fit in with those like them. This was my case. I dressed in all black. I hung out with the “Goth or Emo” kids. I tried to stand out in the crowd. All in all, after the second hospitalization I didn’t care whatsoever for anyone or anything. I began to slack off in my school work and blow it all off to hang out with… yep you guessed it. Christy.
Her family got evicted due to late rent so she moved into the motel a few blocks from my house. It was even more convenient fro me, because my parents didn’t know what room she was in, so I could go and they couldn’t find me. I could hide from everything they wanted to blame me for.
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Kaite, contact these people anyway. Lawsuits against the people who tortured you, heal. Criminal charges are even better, if you can get the feds to help you
there is no healing without justice, imo
I think this is a bit premature, guest. Katie hasn’t mentioned any torture that I can see with the exception of the public school system. Spending years trying to pursue lawsuits and a continual rehashing of what you went thru is not only unhealthy but leaves the victim even more hollow and deserted after the trial when everyone goes back to their lives and you realize you have spent years spewing venom and hatred and put your life on hold and now have no one in your life.
I would suggest that Katie continue to move forward and start to build her life anew and surround herself with people who love her for who she is (not lawyers and other parasites). Lets not try to use Katie for our own agendas, she has been through enough. Let her decide if she wants to put this all behind her or spend her life hating and pursuing revenge.
At this point writting her story is a healthy response and step in her life and will lead to understanding of what happened to her.
NeilW
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Yup, he's getting paid to post here. "Please don't sue us for abusing you! Please remain a silent victim!"
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Kaite, contact these people anyway. Lawsuits against the people who tortured you, heal. Criminal charges are even better, if you can get the feds to help you
there is no healing without justice, imo
I think this is a bit premature, guest. Katie hasn’t mentioned any torture that I can see with the exception of the public school system.
NeilW
katie has not described torture, she has described bullying. As someone who feels everything is innapropriately turned into "torture" on this website, you'd think you'd be more apt with your language
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Kaite, contact these people anyway. Lawsuits against the people who tortured you, heal. Criminal charges are even better, if you can get the feds to help you
there is no healing without justice, imo
I think this is a bit premature, guest. Katie hasn’t mentioned any torture that I can see with the exception of the public school system.
NeilW
katie has not described torture, she has described bullying. As someone who feels everything is innapropriately turned into "torture" on this website, you'd think you'd be more apt with your language
Stick around, some people would define bullying as torture and abusive. You must have missed the colored t-shirt discussion.
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Let's not be to premature about passing off torture as bullying. For all we know the "bullying" could have been the systematic targeting of one person by request of staff.
I've seen it before and if you know anything about CEDU such shennanigans are common place in their raps. Captives are reduced to tears or worst by other students in front of staff and often at the encouragement of staff.
I'd call that abuse and mental torture.
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Let's not be to premature about passing off torture as bullying. For all we know the "bullying" could have been the systematic targeting of one person by request of staff.
I've seen it before and if you know anything about CEDU such shennanigans are common place in their raps. Captives are reduced to tears or worst by other students in front of staff and often at the encouragement of staff.
I'd call that abuse and mental torture.
the bulllying happened in a regular public school. You should edit that, dear, maybe :nods:
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Ok. It seems like with every single instalment my story becomes more and more difficult to write…
At this point in 8th grade I began to skip classes and hang out in the counsellor’s office. I was depressed and lonely. Christy had quit coming to school for a long while, and I jest felt as I if were the only one in school that had the same issues I did. I began to slack off in my favorite class: orchestra. I had been plying the cello for 4 years and was the 1st chair of my section (basically the captain). I was put to 2nd chair because I wasn’t concentrating enough and my playing was suffering. I felt horrible. Music was one thing I did well, that not even yelling could affect…. I felt like it was taken away from me. I began to fake sick more and more so I could go home, and get away from the craziness of the world around me.
My parents arranged for me to have a therapist when I graduated form khys, and I went once a week. She helped me to unload all of the shit I built up over the time I was away from the safe environment. Just the drive to the office was a hassle for me and Diane. Almost 90% of the time in the car` was spent in silence and the other 10% consisted of us yelling at each other. To put it bluntly things were like having my own personal hell at home, when most kids have their own personal sanctuary, in the thought that most kids can drop the act of images and happiness, as well as who they have to be at school. I didn’t I have that luxury. The mask of my image went on, and never came off. I became the clothes; the music. I was no longer me. There was no place that I could be myself. I remember writing in my journal:
“I am alone in a crowded room, as the only person in a mask. For people are masquerading as something else but when the night comes, the masks fall off and become dust. Mine stays as if cemented to my being. I am unable to remove it even if I wanted to.”
Nowhere was safe. I always had to protect myself with my only defence, my attitude and my friends.
I wasn’t interested in the same things anymore. All I wanted to do was be around Christy somehow, every time I was with her I felt alive again. Whole. It wouldn’t last. As I said before, I had a completely skewed perception of reality. I was 14 years old. I felt as if there wasn’t anything to live for. Yet again. I attempted suicide. This time I made it known. Goodbye, I screamed to my parents. I wanted them to know that I loved them. I took my med card out of the kitchen and up into the bathroom in a flash. My dad saw and followed me. He was shouting for my brother to help him. I locked the bathroom door. I looked at myself in the mirror and hated what I saw.
I began to empty the med card, and take the pills that would end my life. My dad got into the bathroom. He wrestled one out of my hand. I was stunned. I didn’t understand why. Why was he trying to stop me? Isn’t this what he wanted? Wouldn’t he be happier? I didn’t get it at the time. Why did he care?“LEAVE ME ALONE! LET ME DO THIS!!!” I kept screaming at him. I wanted it to be over. I would not be hurting so much… I didn’t understand why he suddenly cared about me now…
I was taken to the hospital. I had to drink charcoal. And I hated it. Sometimes I wish I would have died. Maybe it would have relieved me of the pain I had to go through later on, but that is another story. The nurse gave me a look of utter disapproval. I was embarrassed. I was crazy. Every doctor that looked at my chart knew why I was there. Every single one of them mad me feel…….worthless. Their faces are burnt into my memory, like the spots in your vision if you stare at the sun too long. The expressions weren’t of compassion like doctors have in the movies. The looks were of disgust. I was disgusting. I surely felt it. I had charcoal on my face, and my hands. I was vomiting charcoal, pooping charcoal. I felt like I was being drowned in it. I had to drink a gallon to neutralize the toxins from the medications I took. It was demoralizing. I felt violated.
I was evaluated by the on site psychologist. I was to be admitted into a treatment center once again. Khys was full. I was horrified. At least Mollie would have been there to help me understand to explain why my life was worth living. I was transported in the ambulance. I was strapped to the gurney for a 2 hour ride, with the medics staring at me like I was a monster. My parent went home. I was admitted to Dettmer mental hospital. I got there at around 2 am in the morning. At this point I was so tired I just went to sleep on whatever mattress they told me. I was in Dettmer for 3 1/2 weeks with a daily check-up, by yet another therapist. I was again diagnosed with borderline personality disorder and night terrors. I grew frustrated because I already knew that.
The visits were less frequent due to the drive. My parents always ended the visits with: we love you and what to help you get better. They wanted to help me. Why would they allow the arguing and insults? It takes two people to tango, so it was not all my fault. But I was told I was the problem. It was ME who was causing the issues. I had to get better. It was like a goddamn pointing fingers game. I had to be the one who took responsibility for my actions…. (Take the blame) what about everyone else? I got yelled at for insults… did anyone else? I think not.
QUICK NOTE HERE: I am the child. I am supposed to make mistakes. To get angry, and yell once in a while, but what about the adults? Do they get punished? No. they get a slap on the hand and a get out of jail free card. The children have to be the responsible ones. When did that role switch? Can anyone tell me, because I missed the memo.
Anyway back to my story…while at Dettmer I grew very distant. I didn’t speak much. All I wanted was an escape from hell. A get out of jail card, not a free one, but a get out of jail card. Sadly life isn’t like monopoly and no matter how many times I rolled to get out of prison I never got out.
Questions or comments you know where to go: [email protected]
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Let's not be to premature about passing off torture as bullying. For all we know the "bullying" could have been the systematic targeting of one person by request of staff.
I've seen it before and if you know anything about CEDU such shennanigans are common place in their raps. Captives are reduced to tears or worst by other students in front of staff and often at the encouragement of staff.
I'd call that abuse and mental torture.
Good point Che Gookin. If you read Katies story and the blog the abuse and mental torture incurred from the local public school system was unbearable. Katie was being abused terribly and her father pulling her from this destructive environment was the correct thing to do imo,(I don’t think anyone could effectively argue against this decision).
So if the local school system and local therapies are not working then there is only one logical next step and that is to seek help outside of the community which is what Michael did. If he cared about his money more then he cared about his daughter he would have just let her suffer thru school and hope she survived the abuse and suicide attempts long enough to graduate like many here suggest is the better route to take, ie doing nothing is better than any program.
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Che Gookin wrote:Let's not be to premature about passing off torture as bullying. For all we know the "bullying" could have been the systematic targeting of one person by request of staff.
I've seen it before and if you know anything about CEDU such shennanigans are common place in their raps. Captives are reduced to tears or worst by other students in front of staff and often at the encouragement of staff.
I'd call that abuse and mental torture.
Good point Che Gookin. If you read Katies story and the blog the abuse and mental torture incurred from the local public school system was unbearable. Katie was being abused terribly and her father pulling her from this destructive environment was the correct thing to do imo,(I don’t think anyone could effectively argue against this decision).
So if the local school system and local therapies are not working then there is only one logical next step and that is to seek help outside of the community which is what Michael did. If he cared about his money more then he cared about his daughter he would have just let her suffer thru school and hope she survived the abuse and suicide attempts long enough to graduate like many here suggest is the better route to take, ie doing nothing is better than any program.
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Good point Che Gookin. If you read Katies story and the blog the abuse and mental torture incurred from the local public school system was unbearable. Katie was being abused terribly and her father pulling her from this destructive environment was the correct thing to do imo,(I don’t think anyone could effectively argue against this decision).
So if the local school system and local therapies are not working then there is only one logical next step and that is to seek help outside of the community which is what Michael did. If he cared about his money more then he cared about his daughter he would have just let her suffer thru school and hope she survived the abuse and suicide attempts long enough to graduate like many here suggest is the better route to take, ie doing nothing is better than any program.
Yet he decided to send her to Cross Creek Manor and he keeps defending his decision to do so.
3rd Eye treatment is suggested.
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oh for fucks sake, like those are the only two options?
My friend R suffered from terrible bullying in high school. I mean, really really bad. Totally relentless. She was withdrawn, quiet and totally miserable.
So what did her parents do? They found another high school. FUCKING DUH.
BTW, she loved the second one.
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I had some bullying done to me in middle school. I went to my grandpa, former British Special Forces, and asked him for a few tips. Bullying stopped a week or so later.
:)
Those who dare.
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I think Katies father did the right thing in removing her from the abusive public school system that she was in. I am sure Katie felt much better not having to sustain the daily bullying.
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Yet he sent her to Cross Creek Manor. One can hardly laud the actions of a man when the end result is so obviously detrimental. Saying congrats to dad for taking her out of public school and then sending her to CCM is akin to saying, "WE burnt the village to save it."
You see what I did there programmie?
I can use red herrings as well except mine are cooler.
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Yet he sent her to Cross Creek Manor. One can hardly laud the actions of a man when the end result is so obviously detrimental. Saying congrats to dad for taking her out of public school and then sending her to CCM is akin to saying, "WE burnt the village to save it."
You see what I did there programmie?
I can use red herrings as well except mine are cooler.
What we do know is that her father removed her from an abusive enviornment and placed her in CCM. As far as we know Katie is better off today, I dont think she has tried to take her life since leaving cross creek, which in itself is a great step. I am not sure if the bullying continued at CCM but we will see through her story whether it did or not. We cannot speak to that yet.
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Whocologist to the rescue! It's a wonder parents don't pay this guy for his stellar advice.
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What we do know is that her father removed her from an abusive enviornment and placed her in CCM. As far as we know Katie is better off today, I dont think she has tried to take her life since leaving cross creek, which in itself is a great step. I am not sure if the bullying continued at CCM but we will see through her story whether it did or not. We cannot speak to that yet.
I don't need her to confirm or deny anything. CCM has numerous reports of abuse, a lawsuit pending against it, and a slew of other issues that would make a bullying a godsend if that is the only thing that troubled here there.
Except it wasn't..
High Schools can be changed, or he easily could have sent her to a local private school. Even home schooling comes to mind, but bullying at school really seems to be the least of her issues.
Katie's problems seem not to be this "bullying" that you beat on and on about, but rather her nutbag of a father and step-mumsie. Old daddio could have told step-mumsie to take her little freakshow elsewhere but he didn't. Instead he allows this toxic vile person, probably a gold digger at that, near his daughter who was already struggling.
His solution to the problem is to send her to CCM.
Not cool old bean.. not cool.
Keep spinning Whooter or whoever the hell you are. I'm going to go drink about 4 beers, piss off my balcony, and watch a crappy movie. You've got nothing worth reading other than the same old programmie spin control. That tripe got old years ago.
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Another solution could have been for Katie to lose some weight and quit cutting herself (maybe mix in some others colors other than black every other day) and that would have helped with the bullying and then show a little respect at home like her brothers did and all of this would have been avoided.
I dont think her brothers had a problem with the school system or home arrangements and put a lid on the drama. If they did they were smart enough not to get their asses sent away.
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No child deserves to be abused or to witness it. Katie bears no responsibility for her parent's incompetence. The only thing Katie bears responsibility for is herself, and finally for the first time in god knows how long she'll have the chance to exercise her freedom as a person and not some mark on a ledger. Hopefully, and I suspect she'll be able to do so as well, that she'll flourish in spite of the trauma inflicted upon her by the shitbirds at CCM.
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No child deserves to be abused or to witness it. Katie bears no responsibility for her parent's incompetence. The only thing Katie bears responsibility for is herself, and finally for the first time in god knows how long she'll have the chance to exercise her freedom as a person and not some mark on a ledger. Hopefully, and I suspect she'll be able to do so as well, that she'll flourish in spite of the trauma inflicted upon her by the shitbirds at CCM.
Agreed and I will take it a step further to say no one should be subjected to abuse or have to witness it (Adults or children). The tension in the house subsided after Katie left. Katies siblings were getting their brunt of abuse from Katie as well. If children are subjected to abuse there is little they can do about it except notifying an authority figure and hope that they help you. Adults have a little more control and can have the abusive child removed from the house or sent to a school setting off site.
I see this as a family issue and it is difficult to carve out responsibility or fault for one person. Like all kids who come of age she will be able to live on her own soon.
Katies time spent at CCM has kept her safe and given her time to mature at the very least. She has become very good at understanding herself and her feelings as is evident in her writing (she should head for journalism as a profession). As soon as she cuts her ties with the past and feels comfortable with all the past events in her life I believe Katie will do well.
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Another solution could have been for Katie to lose some weight and quit cutting herself (maybe mix in some others colors other than black every other day) and that would have helped with the bullying and then show a little respect at home like her brothers did and all of this would have been avoided.
I dont think her brothers had a problem with the school system or home arrangements and put a lid on the drama. If they did they were smart enough not to get their asses sent away.Guest
i think those are the only two people who wuld have the dexterity to go and say that. If you want to insult me do it somewhere in your own mind please i dont want to hear the bullshit on here thankyou very much. :blabla: :lala: :feedtrolls: :fuckoff:
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Katie, don´t worry about the guest comments.
Just keep writting - you are very talented !
I must say I admire how mature you sound - but then again its no wonder after all you have been through.
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Probably her dad or someone in her family trying to get her to stop from the sounds of it. Ignore it and type away.
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Katie, don´t worry about the guest comments.
Just keep writting - you are very talented !
I must say I admire how mature you sound - but then again its no wonder after all you have been through.
I have noticed reading from the parents blog and Katies personal account that she matured tremendously during her time at Cross Creek and an increase in self esteem comes across also. This is one of many accomplishments that "some" programs provide. I say some because I have read here about programs which do not accomplish this. My child realized an accelerated period of maturation (and also in self esteem) while attending her program .
NeilW
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Katie, don´t worry about the guest comments.
Just keep writting - you are very talented !
I must say I admire how mature you sound - but then again its no wonder after all you have been through.
I have noticed reading from the parents blog and Katies personal account that she matured tremendously during her time at Cross Creek and an increase in self esteem comes across also. This is one of many accomplishments that "some" programs provide. I say some because I have read here about programs which do not accomplish this. My child realized an accelerated period of maturation (and also in self esteem) while attending her program .
NeilW
Or maybe she's been beaten down and broken so much she's afraid of starting any conflict at all...
asshole.
What you call "mature" I call "well trained". Maturity for it's own sake is one thing (a good thing), but when it's done out of knee jerk fear, it's not so good. Sometimes a good "effect" is just window dressing for something more sinister required to produce the effect.
Oh programs produce "results" (temporary, mostly). I've never argued with that. But the way they do it... that's what I have a problem with. When it's not actively beating kids down until they obey unquestionably, it's stripping them of their identity and changing them without their express knowledge and consent. In the long run, that's not maturity at all, and certaily not healthy.
What programs teach kids is not maturity per-se, but to act mature (or else!). There is a big difference. Acting and knowing why are two very different things. In the end, only growing up and maturing, can teach those lessons. There is no quick way. There is no "pay me and i'll teach your kid these values". Like most marketing, it's bullshit.
Example: most kids get taught lots of words in program.. lots of "tools" and so on. You ask a kid what they learned in program and the'll tell you taht they learned the tools they need to suceed, that they learned responsibility and accountability and bla bla bla, but if you ask them to actually define any of those terms or any of those tools they go blank. They've been taught to speak and act on que, yes, but not to think (quite the opposite).
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Another solution could have been for Katie to lose some weight and quit cutting herself (maybe mix in some others colors other than black every other day) and that would have helped with the bullying and then show a little respect at home like her brothers did and all of this would have been avoided.
I dont think her brothers had a problem with the school system or home arrangements and put a lid on the drama. If they did they were smart enough not to get their asses sent away.Guest
i think those are the only two people who wuld have the dexterity to go and say that. If you want to insult me do it somewhere in your own mind please i dont want to hear the bullshit on here thankyou very much. :blabla: :lala: :feedtrolls: :fuckoff:
As clinical studies have shown, kids aren't bullied for how they look, but because they cannot psychologically "fight back."
Two causes, have been clinically established as creating kids who can't "fight back"—being raised by parents who are overprotective, or parents who are abusive. A huge percentage of abused kids get bullied at school, because they are psychologically weaker than other kids and provide an open target for people seeking the emotional high of domination and sadism.
Katie, that monster insulting you is thewho. Pay him no mind, he mocks sexual abuse victims with regularity and invariably defends the beating deaths of children in due-processless captivity. He is a hired gun for the industry/completely insane. Funny, he is good for apt representation of the "therapy" in cross creek and places like it, as there blame and shame is aimed creully and medically invalidly at the detainee in the form of "feedback" and "confrontation."I guess its a lot easier hearing that sort of thing over the internet than for 4-12 hours a day at Cross Creek
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Katie, don´t worry about the guest comments.
Just keep writting - you are very talented !
I must say I admire how mature you sound - but then again its no wonder after all you have been through.
I have noticed reading from the parents blog and Katies personal account that she matured tremendously during her time at Cross Creek and an increase in self esteem comes across also. This is one of many accomplishments that "some" programs provide. I say some because I have read here about programs which do not accomplish this. My child realized an accelerated period of maturation (and also in self esteem) while attending her program .
NeilW
The who, that's funny. On another thread, what you said was great about the supposed program you put your suoppsed daughter in, was that it 'de-matured' her. The problem being she was too mature. Your bullshit changes from moment to moment. As a hired gun, you truly suck
KATIE, SUE CROSS CREEK IN THE TURLKEY LAWSUIT.
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........... On another thread, what you said was great about the supposed program you put your suoppsed daughter in, was that it 'de-matured' her. The problem being she was too mature. Your bullshit changes from moment to moment. As a hired gun, you truly suck.
Why not provide the link where I said her program made her less mature? I will defend my statements, but I need to know what you are talking about.
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........... On another thread, what you said was great about the supposed program you put your suoppsed daughter in, was that it 'de-matured' her. The problem being she was too mature. Your bullshit changes from moment to moment. As a hired gun, you truly suck.
Why not provide the link where I said her program made her less mature? I will defend my statements, but I need to know what you are talking about.
You just admitted to being "thewho." Whoops! Thanks
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Katie, that monster insulting you is thewho. Pay him no mind, he mocks sexual abuse victims with regularity and invariably defends the beating deaths of children in due-processless captivity. He is a hired gun for the industry/completely insane. Funny, he is good for apt representation of the "therapy" in cross creek and places like it, as there blame and shame is aimed creully and medically invalidly at the detainee in the form of "feedback" and "confrontation."I guess its a lot easier hearing that sort of thing over the internet than for 4-12 hours a day at Cross Creek
I forgot to mention that he also killed his entire family and travels around the country trying to get people to send their kids to programs and raping children. He is a monster, Please dont trust him, you need to listen to me, the voice of reason. I really am!! Dont listen to anyone else here accept me. You can recognize my posts because I log in as "Guest".
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There's always plenty of conjecture about what really drives Who's passion. While there may be money involved, I don't think that explains it so well or so simply as the obvious fact that these programs are cults. Cults tend to proselytize and be all evangelical. They also tend to isolate people from those who may have witnessed the same events from the past but have a non-program-compliant view of them. So people involved in them often honestly remember things very differently from how they happened. Now everybody's memory is a little flawed, more so than most people would like to believe.
I don't really have a need to go to accusing the guy of making money doing what he loves. It's enough to note that he's doing it, whatever his motivation.
The thought reform techniques used at CCM are nearly identical to those employed at Straight, Inc. and they are psychologically and emotionally brutal. There simply is no kind or gentle way to change someone's beliefs or behavior against their own will. The only way to do that is to break their will and that's just never a gentle process.
And I can tell you from experience that it is tremendously painful and demoralizing for someone coming out of a couple of years in a program to have the Program line shoved down your throat some more.
Write on, Katie! Write on!
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Not to brag or anything, God knows I'm far from a perfect mother. But this seems to be working out ok. When my daughter was being severly bullied at school, we seriously considered my moving to the next town so that she could escape the situation. We both looked at places together, scratched out the math, did the logistics and discussed all the implications over hot chocolate at the lunch counter in that town. In the course of all this, we pretty much figured out that the same kids who were mistreating her tend to shuttle back and forth between the two towns anyway. In fact a few of them were already there.
At the same time, we all (me, her sisters, their friends and mine) gave her some tips on self defense, diffusion, choices in friends. I don't know how much of it was the content of the advice and how much was just being made to feel important and loved and a little bit trusted but she seems to be having a better time of it.
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Chapter 5 of the Escaper's guide might help with your wee one. It has some good pointers on how to cripple escorts in order to escape.
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Another solution could have been for Katie to lose some weight and quit cutting herself (maybe mix in some others colors other than black every other day) and that would have helped with the bullying and then show a little respect at home like her brothers did and all of this would have been avoided.
I dont think her brothers had a problem with the school system or home arrangements and put a lid on the drama. If they did they were smart enough not to get their asses sent away.Guest
i think those are the only two people who wuld have the dexterity to go and say that. If you want to insult me do it somewhere in your own mind please i dont want to hear the bullshit on here thankyou very much. :blabla: :lala: :feedtrolls: :fuckoff:
Doesn't this sound like Dianne? I recognize the attitude from her blog when talking about Katie. This woman is truly a vile creature, I don't understand why her father would want to even be affiliated with this trashy woman. Maybe that's just a reflection of what he feels he deserves, but Katie certainly shouldn't be forced to endure her. I wonder if reading this Her father will come to the realization that the source of the problem was his wife, and if he did, would have have the balls to do anything about it?...
Katie, great installment, I understand how this can be hard for you to write because in many ways you are reliving the past and revisiting all the painful memories, but just remember to allow yourself to put all this into prospective... to learn a valuable lesson from all of this and grow stronger from it. I hope that you are willing to channel these experiences into confidence, in that once your truly know yourself, other people will not have any power over your emotions.
So far I have kept my onslaught of sociological theories out of this thread and I intend to continue to do so, however I suggest you analyze your past, yourself and the world around you and start making up your own mind about your life. Throw away everything everyone ever told you and decide for yourself. You don't ever have to blindly accept ANYTHING as truth ever again, find your own truth and let it defend and protect you. You are entering the age of true self discovery, and taking some college classes, like psychology, sociology, philosophy and some creative writing/journalism would significantly assist this process.
I think once the pain of your lost adolescence fades you will realize how strong you really are... and I'm not sure what kind of religious (or non religious) beliefs but often is heard the phrase, "God wouldn't give you anything you couldn't handle" and I think that rings true in your case. In my opinion however "God" wasn't the one who chose these challenges for you, you did. You knew this is exactly what you had to experience in order to learn the lessons in life that lead to the enlightenment of the soul. Forgive me for assuming, but I think the greatest lesson you could learn this lifetime is how to love yourself. As much as that sounds cliche, its actually much deeper than you think... knowing yourself, believing in yourself and taking everything else with a grain of salt is truly a life changing philosophy to adopt. Once you figure out how to make yourself whole, and fill the voids of your childhood and self esteem with knowledge and pride, there is NOTHING that will stop you from success.
Keep writing hun, your really making some great progress.
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Another solution could have been for Katie to lose some weight and quit cutting herself (maybe mix in some others colors other than black every other day) and that would have helped with the bullying and then show a little respect at home like her brothers did and all of this would have been avoided.
I dont think her brothers had a problem with the school system or home arrangements and put a lid on the drama. If they did they were smart enough not to get their asses sent away.Guest
i think those are the only two people who wuld have the dexterity to go and say that. If you want to insult me do it somewhere in your own mind please i dont want to hear the bullshit on here thankyou very much. :blabla: :lala: :feedtrolls: :fuckoff:
Doesn't this sound like Dianne? I recognize the attitude from her blog when talking about Katie. This woman is truly a vile creature, I don't understand why her father would want to even be affiliated with this trashy woman. Maybe that's just a reflection of what he feels he deserves, but Katie certainly shouldn't be forced to endure her. I wonder if reading this Her father will come to the realization that the source of the problem was his wife, and if he did, would have have the balls to do anything about it?...
Katie, great installment, I understand how this can be hard for you to write because in many ways you are reliving the past and revisiting all the painful memories, but just remember to allow yourself to put all this into prospective... to learn a valuable lesson from all of this and grow stronger from it. I hope that you are willing to channel these experiences into confidence, in that once your truly know yourself, other people will not have any power over your emotions.
So far I have kept my onslaught of sociological theories out of this thread and I intend to continue to do so, however I suggest you analyze your past, yourself and the world around you and start making up your own mind about your life. Throw away everything everyone ever told you and decide for yourself. You don't ever have to blindly accept ANYTHING as truth ever again, find your own truth and let it defend and protect you. You are entering the age of true self discovery, and taking some college classes, like psychology, sociology, philosophy and some creative writing/journalism would significantly assist this process.
I think once the pain of your lost adolescence fades you will realize how strong you really are... and I'm not sure what kind of religious (or non religious) beliefs but often is heard the phrase, "God wouldn't give you anything you couldn't handle" and I think that rings true in your case. In my opinion however "God" wasn't the one who chose these challenges for you, you did. You knew this is exactly what you had to experience in order to learn the lessons in life that lead to the enlightenment of the soul. Forgive me for assuming, but I think the greatest lesson you could learn this lifetime is how to love yourself. As much as that sounds cliche, its actually much deeper than you think... knowing yourself, believing in yourself and taking everything else with a grain of salt is truly a life changing philosophy to adopt. Once you figure out how to make yourself whole, and fill the voids of your childhood and self esteem with knowledge and pride, there is NOTHING that will stop you from success.
Keep writing hun, your really making some great progress.
I hioe some people are making freinds with Katie off-line. Her family, her dad too, are abuseive worthless people
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, "God wouldn't give you anything you couldn't handle" and I think that rings true in your case. In my opinion however "God" wasn't the one who chose these challenges for you, you did. You knew this is exactly what you had to experience in order to learn the lessons in life that lead to the enlightenment of the soul. Forgive me for assuming, but I think the greatest lesson you could learn this lifetime is how to love yourself. As much as that sounds cliche, its actually much deeper than you think... knowing yourself, believing in yourself and taking everything else with a grain of salt is truly a life changing philosophy to adopt. Once you figure out how to make yourself whole, and fill the voids of your childhood and self esteem with knowledge and pride, there is NOTHING that will stop you from success.
Keep writing hun, your really making some great progress.
SORRY, THATS THE MOST IDIOTIC THING EVER SAID
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I hioe some people are making freinds with Katie off-line. Her family, her dad too, are abuseive worthless people
Yeah, guess it depends on who you talk to, people are making friends with the dad too. Seems Katie is back to sitting around all day and starting right back up on abusing her brother and stepmom again. Time for her own apartment it would seem, if it were my house.
Why is she still there?
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I hioe some people are making freinds with Katie off-line. Her family, her dad too, are abuseive worthless people
Yeah, guess it depends on who you talk to, people are making friends with the dad too. Seems Katie is back to sitting around all day and starting right back up on abusing her brother and stepmom again. Time for her own apartment it would seem, if it were my house.
Why is she still there?
Are mass murderers of innocents capable of "making friends"? Well, Charles Deidrich managed it, i guess. Still, I doubt you are capable of genuine relationships.
OK. WWASPite, you want to help these parents?
Why not allow them back at your "parents support meetings"?
You know, the ones you kicked them out of once they ran out of money?
What's the explanation for that?
You've drained their money, so WWASP has initiated the “spit ‘em out” segment of their predatation cycle ?
Or, is it that WWASP Cross Creek doesn't want what happens to the kids who have been through WWASPS--mental destruction, loss of personal effaceiency,etc.-- made evident to the loathsome wallets pumping money into your cult?
My guess:both.
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Are mass murderers of innocents capable of "making friends"? Well, Charles Deidrich managed it, i guess. Still, I doubt you are capable of genuine relationships.
Oh, come on no one is calling her a mass murderer. She is just abusive to her family and sucking the life out of them. She is definitely capable of making and maintaining a relationship with peers. In fact that may be the best thing for her. Peers tend to not put up with all the drama and ask you to pull your own weight as room mates. Katie will have great relationships in the future she just needs to learn a few life lessons first.
Dont be so harsh and dramatic!
The rest of the post I believe was directed at the program. I am not up on all the meeting schedules and requirements, costs etc.
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Are mass murderers of innocents capable of "making friends"? Well, Charles Deidrich managed it, i guess. Still, I doubt you are capable of genuine relationships.
Oh, come on no one is calling her a mass murderer. She is just abusive to her family and sucking the life out of them. She is definitely capable of making and maintaining a relationship with peers. In fact that may be the best thing for her. Peers tend to not put up with all the drama and ask you to pull your own weight as room mates. Katie will have great relationships in the future she just needs to learn a few life lessons first.
Dont be so harsh and dramatic!
The rest of the post I believe was directed at the program. I am not up on all the meeting schedules and requirements, costs etc.
Oh, Thewho, Goebbels of ASPEN Education, if only you could see how your sociopathy thwarts your bizare whitewash attempts to the non-crazies of the world.
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Oh I agree Katie will probably have some wonderful relationships in her future, just as soon as she moves far away from her step-witch and daddykins. After that she'll be free of her step-witch's nasty abusive attitude. Her relationships with her brothers will recover on there own. I mean who wasn't some kind of dick to their brothers or sisters when they were young?
My brother and I used to beat the shit out of each other. I used to hang my sister's dolls from the tree in a hangman noose and threw her in an irrigation ditch. She retaliated by breaking some of my stuff.
Dysfunctional yes, but pretty normal for a bunch of high strung kids living on a farm with a pair of abusive parents. Step-witch, and the whooter, are conveintly ignoring the aspect that an acting out child more often than not reflects the atmosphere of the family.
I definitely know that my wack job parents played a role in my brother and I acting like goons.
So given enough time we'll see what step-witch and daddykins did to promote katie's acting out. I still don't get how katie being a kid and reflecting the emotionally unhealthy environment of her step-witch and daddykins justifies a program like CCM.
OH my god, She's being bad! Bring on the abusive program, That'll serve her right..
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HEY EVRY1 NEW INSTALLEMT ON THE CAN BLOG!!!
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CAN blog? Link?
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Ok. I am dearly sorry to all of those who were reading my story. It had been a few days since the last instalment and I have been extremely busy. So to make up for some of the days I missed I will try to write more than usual.
So we left off when I was admitted to Dettmer. While I was there I learned a lot about holding back my emotions and my actual thoughts I became an expert craftsman of bullshit and I actually prolonged my stay there, due to lack of communication. The facility was locked down of course, but there was still the thought of scaling the walls and running away forever. My reasoning was that if never went home I would never be depressed, if I was never depressed I wouldn’t end up trying to kill myself and my parents would be happy and things would go greatly. Like a clip out of “Leave it To Beaver”. Everyone has there own dreams and fantasies. Mine was irrevocably wrong.
I was discharged and I went home again. This time I tried to make things different. I became more and more distant, only speaking when I couldn’t handle the silence anymore. At one point I didn’t talk to anyone. I would hide and when provoked I would yell. That was life for me. I was barely home and when I was I wasn’t a happy camper.
It seemed to me that when I wasn’t home my family was somehow better, and when I was home I got a reality check of how screwed up my family really was. It was scary for a while. You know how you eat too much ice-cream and it starts to taste real bad? Then a few months later you have some and miraculously it tastes good again? Well, that’s how I felt. When I wasn’t around them I missed them. When I was around I saw how crappy life was.
Dettmer stayed with me. I learned to keep my emotions in check…. most of the time anyway (but when put under a lot of pressure eventually a carbonated soda pops right? Yeah. Me = carbonated soda; pressure = KABOOM!) I had to stop cutting, because my parent would check my arms. I had to check in with them every hour to make sure I wasn’t with Christy. NOT by phone of course. I would have to physically check in at the house.
But, even with a stricter structure for me things at school were declining even more rapidly than before. Diane and I would have hour long screaming matches, and I was a wreck. I was pushed down the stairs one day at school. I strained my wrist, and I had to have a cast out on it. I was so hurt and frustrated. I felt like the biggest loser in the world.
A few days later, my Dad had to pick me up from school for some reason. I fell down the stairs again and this time I was knocked unconscious for 4 minutes. I guess my dad was freaking out trying to wake me up, and screaming for someone to call 911. I was put in an ambulance and taken to the hospital. I woke up while in the ambulance very confused. My dad was following in his car so I was alone. The paramedics had oxygen on my face and I was crying. They calmed me down saying I was going to be alright. I knew I wouldn’t be. I kept thinking to myself, after all of this why can’t I die? Is there some twisted god up there letting me suffer?
After that my classes were unbearable. Due to lack of sleep I would doze off in math class and my teacher would let other students drop books on my desk to scare me awake. I would hang out with my English teacher everyday during lunch. He was the best teacher I ever had. I was a poet then… he would read everything I wrote. We would talk about the trivialities of everything and whenever I was in his classroom I felt right with the world. Like there was something that was worth living for. I think back now, and he was one person who really made me think twice about wanting to give up on life. During all of my different hospitalizations my biological mother and I had been talking over the phone. That December I went to visit for Christmas. It was a reprieve form the hell I was in. Yeah there were problems but god, it was better than home. Seeing her was such a relief for me. In her arms was the most adorable and angelic thing I had ever seen. Nicholas. (After my parents divorced my mom had 3 more children. 3 little boys. I knew Bryan and Benjamin.) My mom had part time custody of Bryan and Benji so they werent there. Seeing Nicki was like seeing a part of heaven in a body of the cutest little boy. Nicholas was born 3 months premature. He was so small at birth he could have fit in the palm on my hand. He was born 76% deaf. He was truly a miracle. He also had an auto-immune disease called lupus. This disease causes his body to produce antibodies that attack his own cells. His internal organs are affected and they harden at an abnormal rate.
Learning this I became devoted to him. He was the cutest little ladies man. Leaving my mom and Nicholas at the end of those two weeks was hell for me. I didn’t know when I would ever see them again.
Getting back to school…………I began to skip classes and hang out in the office. Faking sick was getting really old. Finally the counsellors had enough. The called my parents saying that I had two choices really. I could stick out the rest of the year IN class and not skipping or I could stay home for the rest of the year. At this point there was like 6 days left of 8th grade.
I got home from school and Diane was yelling at me saying I would never amount to anything, I was a fucking drop out I would end up pregnant on the streets etc. etc. I was angry and all I wanted was to get away from her, from my dad, from my brothers. I needed an escape. I called my mom and told her what was going on. She immediately told my dad that I was going to spend the summer with her. I flew out to New Mexico that Saturday.
Those first few weeks were like paradise. I was wanted in the house. i was needed. I was a part of the fmaily again. But as it has hapened before it was too good to last. I didnt have many friends there and at first it was fine with me. But being 14 years old i got lonely. i began to search the aprtment complex for friends and i found them. A few were my age but mostly they were older. Tracy was my favorite. She was 24, and lived right next to us. i would be home during the day since my mom was at work, and my brothers were at day care so after i did my chores i went over to tracy's. I had quit smoking due to the restrictions for nicholas's health, but being with tracy had me starting up again. my mom didnt know i was hanging out with people older than me and when she found out she was uncomfortable. she didnt want me to go on the same path i was on at my dad's. Things startd to go bad after she found out about me hanging out with tracy she grew really rptective. I found myslef doing more and more chores around the house. In some ways having a 5 and 6 year old around the house gets rid of loose energy in other ways it puts on a whole lot of mess! I was cleaning up after them all the time.
I grew more and more short with them not understanding why i was the one to clean up after them. when they were with their dad things were great the house was clean and me and my mom did fun things together. Even nicholas was happy. Dont get me wrong. I love my borthers and i miss them terribly but being 14 and having to clean the crap off of the tub and tiolet seat before I could stand to use them got really old! Me and my mom began to argue. I missed my dad and believe it or not i missed diane. I talked to them about once a week. And my mom was very difficult when i wanted to call them. She didnt understand why i wanted to talk to them after diane's comments all the time. July turned to august. I began to grow distant, and i was nervous all the time. i felt that i couldnt make any mistakes this time. I had to be perfect so that my mom and i could have a relationship. I didnt want to screw up this one too.
OK folks thats all i can handle right my mother and i havent talked or heard from each other in about 4 years and as you will read later things got worse. I am angry at her still due to impressions forced on me by CCM. I cant seem to erase those thoughts from my mind. Writing about her makes me miss her terribly and right now, i cant write any more it hurts too much.
P.S. If my mom is reading this... Stephanie Lynn Bilkey, if you are reading this i love you and i am sorry. please if you can call me or write to me. i miss you and i love you.
Please email me with questions or comments : [email protected]
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Hey Katie,
I'll probably have to make this short, I'm working, but I wanted to let you know that I know how that feels to go back and fourth between 2 different households that really seem like 2 different universes. I think that in itself is a tough thing for a kid to experience, its just a bit confusing if you ask me. My mother and father were like night and day... my father was remarried and had the nice house and nice things and my mom was a single mother working really really hard just to afford rent in our 2 bed apartment. I had so much freedom at my moms and not even an inch to breathe at my dad's... I of course wanted to escape to my mom's but she was so busy and stressed the last thing she could handle was raising an unruly teenager. Sometimes tho, I did miss the home cooked meals, the dog and the house even spending quality time with my dad. But as soon as I returned for a visit I felt like the punishment of the last week just continued.
Anyway I don't want to interrupt your story, but I just wanted to let you know how similar our stories were, and that I know how you felt.
Keep writing hun!!
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new installment on can blog
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new installment on can blog
glad to see it:)
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look everyone i am dearly sorry that i havent written, i have been so busy with school! I am senior this year so there are alot of after school activities that hold me there unitl at least 10:00 pm , and then i have to do homework, take a 5 second shower and get inot bed to redo it all again the next day. However my involvement with our High school musical, "Anything Goes" is almost over, our show is finally being performed on friday, saturady and sunday this week, and after that i dont know what i'll be able to do with myself!
SO, back to the story, last i left off, i was at my mom's and things were going ok. Soon we moved out of are artment closer to some support system for my mom, and closer to my new high school. The move was really difficult for me. I was nervous about ym new school, and for the longest time i was afraid i would not find any friends at highschool. I was so nervous, because of the iussue at my last school. I was a loner there, and i was so nervous that i would end up being one there to. New mexico was very different from ohio. There was no humidity, and the heat was almost a bliss. I began to lose weight, not of my own doing, but of lack of food. My mom wasnt very well off, and often i gave up my dinner to feed my little brothers. i didnt mind however. I thought often, that a meal would go better with their stomachs not mine.
My mothers ex, the father of brian and benjamin, wqould have them druing the week most of the time, and when they were with us, me and my mother tried to make things fun for them, taking them swimming, watching movies at home. We really tried to make their lives less hectic after having to be switched from house to house every week.
It was the first house my mom had ever had on her own. It wasnt a mansion and wasnt a slum, but to me it was perfect. My bedroom was half of the living room, with a curtain seperating the two. i loved that room. School began, and i was wrong.
For me i was so nervous, but as i went to school that first day i was clearly mistaken about not finding frineds. they were evrywhere. I had friends up the wazoo! I felt that my life was going right for once. I was the mananger of the varsity volleyball team and often io spent my nights at practice then went home and cooked or hung out with my mom. My paradise wouldnt last however. i started to get inot the wrong group of friends. I swear i think that i am a magnet for trouble, cause everywhere i go, i get into it.
My friends were the same sort of group as they were in ohio. In a way hanging out with them made me feel like i wasnt alone and that i wasnt the only one in the world with problems. Our idea of fun, was at lunch hour to goof off, running around our huge courtyard screaming "The chickens are coming!" We would almost die laughing.
I became friends with a few girls who were bisexual. At that point i didnt see a problem with it, and i believed that i was as well. To be safe, i was cautious and never overstepped any boundaries, but i did have a so to speak "girlfriend". (Thinking now, i was exploring my sexuality anbd i was confiused, so i am GLAD i grew out of that...)
I began cutting agina. My mom had no clue, and i wasnt going to be the one to tell her about it either. It was shallow and small but still it was my addicttion. my friends would try to get me to stop and to see that my life was worth moree that trying to hurt myself. It was strange, In Ohio, with christy they saw cutting as a relief and they supported me in it. Here they saw it as a plea for help, and they diagreed with me, trying to get me to stop. I felt horrible. i would cut in places to hide it. Not only was i hiding from my mom, but now i had to hide it from my freinds.
I did well for about 4 months at school. good grades, and everything. I was a good student and i loved my classes, (EXCEPT MATH, I STILL CANT STAND IT)
My mom became involved with a church for the beginning of my stay with her. we didnt talk about it ever, so i didnt really wonder. one day on our way home picking up Nicholas from daycare, she stopped by the building. I read the sign. "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints". I was 15. I had no clue what this was. I gave my mom a questioning glance and she said, "I'm A mormon." It took a moment to register. Polygomy, cult craziness. "NOT MORMON!" I was astonished.
She gave me an ultimatum. I could ive with her and follow her beliefs, and her rules or i could go back to ohio. Of course I picked what anyone would pick, after living with Stepmonster. I started going to church with her. I began to conform. I was babtized. I didnt follow it. asfter all it was just a title. I didnt believe the ajrgain, but i wanted to make my mom happy. I was a master pretender, so this was just another role.
school bacame hectic for me. i ended it with my so called "girlfriend". I tried to not to cut myself. I tired over and over. But as you will read later.... trying is never enough.
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I read your mother sold your things. Very messed up and abusive. Some people are not adequate to the task of raising kids.
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do you think we can commit to one thread?
or would you like to keep comments here and just your blog in the CAN thread?
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do you think we can commit to one thread?
or would you like to keep comments here and just your blog in the CAN thread?
Me? I'll do whatever you and katie want. just the Can thread then. Unless told otherwise
:nods: :cheers: :rose: :-* :rasta: O0
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lol no I was talking to katie, or all of us, just seems odd to have 2 threads going on at the same time ya kno?
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the can thread was made to just post the story, but we can limit them if you want. i like checking them b oith becuase people are more willing to write what they think on the other one. whatever we feel is best.
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I believe guests "cannot" post on the CAN thread so all comments are greatly reduced. It is nice to have your story posted in both places, that way if a flame war occurs or a troll decides to write all over it your story it is still preserved in the Can thread for people to read without having to sift thru pages and pages to find each of your postings.