Fornits

Fornits Home for Wayward Web Fora
An open discussion about the troubled parent industry

Yeah I noticed that last night actually.  Yup.  Still down.  Oh dear lord.  Please let it be not permanant.  Please let it be some random DDOS attack.  Yes.  Let's all join keyboards and prayer for poor Lon:

"Lord please keep letting Lon, your humble servant, continue to speak the truth to the parents.  Think of the CHILDREN!!!  Oh lord let this be site maintance.  Please don't say massive hardware failure.  Oh lord please tell me Lon kept a backup.  Oh lord please don't tell me his hosting company burned to the ground.  Or the feds found something.  That would... just be too horrible for words."

Where's the backflip emoticon?

EDIT: FUUUUUUCK...  it's back up.

Well I've attended many different kinds of Churches & Church groups & Sunday Schools & Retreats & I  certainly never experienced anything remotely like what this is described as being - nor ever heard of anything like it. Nor have I ever heard of game like "smear the queer"! Or dying for Christ either. So - I would dispute any such thing as being common in Christian churches.

What kind of church did you attend where this was common??!!

Well if you really need to have specifics: The Church of the Apostles in Fairfax, Va; Which had "Halleluja Parties" so kids wouldn't be polluted by halloween.  My family also attended a host of other churches such as the Evangelical Free Church in Annandale (non demoninational, which was also the one in which "smear the queer" was played in youth group).  In general. I'd say this type of thing is quite common among the "bible thumping" crowd.

Yes it is hyperemotional and it borders on brainwashing but it's not like propheets / Friendship Workshop where it's a marathon without food or sleep and traumatic experiences are brought up so you feel like shit and they can later console you.  It's a lot different.  The girl in the trailer was most likely crying tears of joy believe it or not.  These are happy places and although one could argue the happiness is a bit "over the top" with people feeling the "love of god", i don't think it crosses the line of brainwashing any more than the effect of any other group phenomenon including political polarization.

I am not a Christian.  Personally, i can't stand most of em, but i do think they are often unfarily picked on by those who see a snippet of somebody beeing "slain in the spirit" and take it out of context.  Such experiences are rare (unless it's a group event specifically for that purpose) and most of them are probably pretending (i know i did).  The kid flopping around like a fish was probably pretending.  From what i have been told, it is a feeling of peace which "overcomes you".  A lot of this stuff just has to be demystified and explained which was not apparantly the goal of the film, which was to present a carefully edited "freak show".  I however do think, however, bringing a political figure (bush) into a religious institution to have kids look up to him is despicable.

So fucking what if people have wacky beliefs and teach it to their kids.  I don't aggree with it, i think kids should have the choice; however it is a parent's right raise a kid as he/she wants as long as it does not cross the line into abuse.  This is freedom of religion at it's best or worst depending on how you look at it.

Well, yeah. Anyone can make kids lose weight. It's this little thing called "starvation".

They're going to balloon like fuck once they're out.

To Somebody who lives in the UK:

go to this place with a whole bunch of pay as you go phones with the child-line number cello-taped on.  Toss em to the kids over the fence.

Quote from: ""Psianide""

There are ways. Geographical Isolation, stripping one of resources, brainwashing, using relationships to loveones as leverage, extended custody (yes it is possible for a parent to retain legal custody of an adult). You should note that most cults don't employ physical restraint against thier members, and still many members who are genuinely unhappy with their situaiton are retained.

How the hell do you retain legal custody of an adult that is not criminally insane, severely mentally ill and not able to function or severely enough mentally handicapped that they cant look after themself at all?

US law.  Here's the ST howto.

Fornits thread on the subject here

Although the contract has changed significantly since I enrolled in Benchmark Young Adult School, i figured I might post a few excerpts here from their current enrollment contract:

1. Financial Sponsor, (parent/guardian) agrees to purchase the Benchmark Young Adult School personal
growth and independent living program for the Student named herein, and is committed to maintaining  
enrollment in said program for no less than 12 months.
2.    Financial Sponsor agrees to commit to the completion of the entire program, with graduation from the
Benchmark program being the ultimate goal for both the Student and the Financial Sponsor.[/quote]

That's right folks.  The parents aggree to pay until the students graduate, at a speed Benchmark dictates.  Oh.  But what if the kid leaves and wants to come home:

c. Financial Sponsor and the Student understand and agree that they will make every effort to support
Benchmark and the Student in the completion of said Student?s program and should the Student
leave prior to the completion of the minimum 12-month contract, Financial Sponsor will make
every effort possible to promote the Student?s return to Benchmark.

That's right.  Return to sender.  You can't go home to the parents.  This is a contract. it is legally binding.  students read and sign this

b. Financial Sponsor understands and agrees that Benchmark reserves the right to secure additional
behavioral health services for the Student.  Examples include, but are not limited to: outside thera-
pists, psychologists,  in-patient or out-patient recovery, hospitalization or by utilizing alternative
Benchmark programs such as ?Time Out.?  Unless these fees are covered by insurance, the costs
will be charged to the SRF.

"Time Out" is the term for shoving a kid in a motel with the "Benchmark Diet".  So, as i interpret the above, IANAL, the parents not only have to pay for the program, but also for the motels, until the Student "graduates".

c. Financial Sponsor understands and agrees to use the outside professionals that Benchmark selects,
regardless of insurance restrictions.

I've always wonder why Benchmark always uses doctor Nelson.  Ha.  So if you're going to complain to a shrink, your going to complain to thier shrink who hypothetically could write an absoltely horrible evaluation of you.  And hypothetically could possably rely on a Benchmark for much of his business.  For the record, they employ no Psychologists, they bus kids to "Nelson" once a week usually.  "You have a Nelson appointment" is a commonly used staff phraise.

a. We will make every effort with the Student to facilitate the completion of the program within the
minimum 12-month time frame.

I allege that is horse-shit.

The Student/Parent/Financial Sponsor hereby consents to the Student?s participation in all activities and programs
conducted by Benchmark Young Adult School, and releases Benchmark Young Adult School, Inc., its agents, employ-
ees and officers, from all claims, demands, action, judgments and executions which the undersigned may have against
Benchmark (et al) , for all personal injuries, known or unknown, and injuries to property, personal or real, caused by or
arising out of the Student?s participation in the related activities and programs.  This release and discharge further  
extends to any injury caused as a result of the Student?s decisions or actions, made while enrolled as a Student or not.[/quote]

Odd that is in the health and fitness section.  It Hypothetically might have something to do with that alleged (didn't see with my own eyes) suicide.  And multiple attempts I witnessed.

The Student and Financial Sponsor hereby agree to release, waive, discharges and covenants not to sue, indemnify and
save and hold harmless Benchmark Young Adult School, its officers, agents, employees family members and any    
students from any loss, liability, damage or cost, claim or demands therefore on account of injury to the person or
property of resulting in the death of the Student, whether caused by the negligence of Benchmark or otherwise, while
the Student is in, upon, about or using the facilities or equipment of Benchmark.[/quote]

See above hypothetical situation.  Basically they're saying, if they screw up and kill your kid, you can't sue, even if it was their fault.  I wonder what made them put that there.  hmm.  I don't recollect it being in my enrollment contract.

We further agree that this Release shall be construed in accordance with the laws of the State of California.  If any term
or provision of this Release shall be held illegal, unenforceable, or in conflict with any law governing this Release the
validity of the remaining portions shall not be affected thereby.

Ahh.  the severability clause.  So You can basically blow away any other part of the contract... but don't worry, our lawyers spent 90% of their time on this page.

4. Financial Sponsor understands and agrees that Benchmark will use all precautions so that no harm comes to
any under age student.  
 
It is further declared that both Financial Sponsor and the Student will agree to hold Benchmark Young Adult
School, Inc., including its staff and any subsidiaries, NOT responsible if the Student is harmed as a result of
usual and customary standards of practice, by ways and means beyond our control, or if the Student,  by his
or her own actions and free will, causes harm to self or others.
[/quote]

"customary practices" includes "Time Out" (shoving your 17 year old kid in a motel.)  But they never quite explain exactly what "Time Out" is until your kid gets put on it like most students.  Yes they have done this.  I wonder why it isn't thoroughly explained elsewhere.  hmm.

But it really doesn't matter since the parents aggree in three seperate friggin places not to sue.  However.  this does not prevent them from being able to do so ask your lawyer.  misrepresentation is one hypothetical option or the judge may hypothetically use said contract as toilet paper.  Class action is another option.  It isn't the parents suing.  its done technically on their behalf AFAIK IANAL.

Tuition is non-refundable after 5 days, and parental contact is restricted for 30.  So essentially let's compare this to a computer sales person:

You, Mister Joe Luddite, buy a computer, and you aggree not to refund it after five days of the date of sale.  When the computer box arrives 30 days later, it's filled up with a "spell & speak" with a cracked screen.  Since you can't afford another computer you have to find a way to post on fornits with said "spell & speak".  the computer salesperson assures you, though, that it is not only possable, but their customers are 97% satisfied.

It's not a perfect analogy but you get the point.  Parents BEWARE of Benchmark Young Adult school.

Spending a night on the streets, or however long, is a no-brainer decision when escaping an abusive program

I said spending the nights on the streets so you could make an uncensored phone call.  And you try doing it in a high crime area of Southern Cali.  And do it after just turning 18, after growing up in a sheltered enviornment.

so I don't really get this thread. You say the program was abusive and non-effective but you didn't take your option to leave because it was too scary.

Many tried.  Very very few suceeded.  I was not about to take my chances on the streets with no money or identification.  A good friend of mine was raped on the streets.

Which would seem to suggest the program was less frightening than running away from it.

It was less frightening.  This was CEDU style BM, not WWASP.  Go spend a night on the streets of one of those areas you see on "COPS".  They wanted you to eventually feel comfortable there.

 It really makes you wonder why kids are running from isolated wilderness programs hitchiking hundreds of miles to freedom, and grown adults who get to stay at motels can't seem to get away from an urban facility.

Most eventually leave motels.  Some of their parents run out of money.  Some contact friends if they can but is rare for reasons i already explained.  Read a few posts ago as to why it was not easy (read damn near impossable) at all to get a job while in motel (phone calls).  90+ percent of students eventually ended up on the streets.  Most of these kids were barely 18 and few had serious problems.

Most of these kids could have made it on their own if given the chance.  And even if they couldn't, the program claims to be able to help with "emancipation".

They should not have had to take their chances on the streets.  It would have been great if program actually gave them an opportunity to suceed with the program.  They let a few do it for testimonials but most of the time they just want you to stay there as long as possable. If you "work the program" you will work until your parents run out of cash.  Eventually you lose hope and take your chances on the streets after you realize they are not going to let you graduate even if you do everything they say to the letter.

Your paren's won't take you back 95% of the time becuase the program has convinced them over the couse of the year+ that you are a manipulative liar who constantly misbehaves.  The parent says "My god.  my kid has become a monster!"

I have the letters the staff wrote to my parents and it's 80% complete horse shit.  How is a student to contest things when he does not even know the things he is accused of to his parents.  Almost every single letter they were asking for more money becuase I "needed an extra 6 months at least" of "emotional growth".

(disclaimer: i was sent there to finsh high school.  that was my "issue")

They claimed i had been skipping school days at Redlands Adult school when school records would show that i had a perfect attendance record.  They tried to say I was procrastinating my HS graduation and that I did not want to work when fact they did not let me attend Redlands Adult school when Benchmark staff (Flo "full-time teacher" Reynolds) was not there (~2 hours/day).  The idea was to postpone my HS graduation so my parents / their employers, would have to pay for another 6 months.  When the staff letters are contrasted against reality this is crystal clear.

I'm not necessarily saying that the program was as bad as a WWASP program, although it was certainly as bad as a CEDU program.  You still find people who actually "liked" their stay at CEDU.  This was the goal.  Break them until they loved being there, until they actually asked their parents for more.  With enough lifespring and other less-than-legit BM techniques etc... you could do this easily.

The mind is it's own place, and in itself can make a Heaven of Hell, a Hell of Heaven. -- John Milton

The point was to make you feel like it was impossable to leave without the program.  The loss of hope became your prison bars.  It was in their vested interest for you not to leave.  They made thier money by making sure you didn't, and they had enough tricks to do it.

Breaking your will is abuse.  It's psychic murder.

Yes i did see the website deborah. But given that the kid is 18 or even not a kid at all if they are 28, how on earth does the familiy in most cases get the young adult to agree.

Because the ed-con who pitched benchmark to me and my parents advertised it as a Bording school with Therapeutic aspects.  That's a relatively new website.  The old one is here.

To answer your question simply:They do not adveritise as they are.  It looks like a wonderful place when you visit.  I was fooled.  So were many others.

Students interviewed by prospective students and parents are cherry picked.  They make it seem wonderful.  You end up thinking: "gee this place seems really nice".

Surley even if they are mentally ill a person cant legally be placed there without consent as an adult?
i understand that in the US often the family has to pay the UNI fees up front so that this can be a leverage point.

Yup.  no refunds after 5 days.  No parental contact for 30.  I forget what reason they state on the tour for this but they make i sound really plausable (especially for those who know nothing at all about programs).

My question was not designed to belittle the alumni of Benchmark or any other similar place, i am genuinely curious as to what would make someone agree to walk through the door of a programme designed for the parents not the "kid"

No need to apologize ozzie :lol:.  It's good you ask these questions.