Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => CEDU / Brown Schools and derivatives / clones => Topic started by: Hell on Wheels on April 12, 2004, 12:35:00 PM
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[ This Message was edited by: Hell on Wheels on 2004-07-07 19:35 ]
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I went to BCA from 95 til 97 and RMA from 97 to 98.
I graduated the program.
Went to college, graduated, and now work for a living.
All that said and done, I still do not have many nice words to say about the schools.
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By the way, if anyone wants to hear stories or has questions, give me a nudge and I will throw down some posts.
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nudge.
On 2004-04-13 10:42:00, chinsk wrote:
"By the way, if anyone wants to hear stories or has questions, give me a nudge and I will throw down some posts."
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To start off I would like to say that I never felt like attending cedu affects me still today. I pretty much put it past me and went on to bigger and better things.
I felt that college was a bit harder than it should have been due to the poor academics there. I of course chose to go into a major that was something I was interested in (Electrical Engineering) and of course cedu's academic program in no way shape or form prepared me for what was required. Fortunatly school never was difficult to me so I picked things up rather quickly and did quite well (if you dont count first quarter freshman year).
I also don't feel like I was treated terribly bad there. I saw a lot of stuff that was messed up and quite frankly completely innapropriate for the type of program they are. This included a lot of staff members that I now know were not qualified for that type of work. Numerous ones even admitted they had no experience. Some staff though I felt like they generally wanted to help, which leads me to my first story.
When i first got to BCA in september 95 or whenever I was placed on the Wolf Team headed up by a guy I came to respect (didn't care to much for him in the beginning though). As time went by there, maybe almost a year or so, it became apparent that he was one of the few staff that really cared about what was going on. There were a lot of staff members that acted as if they got off on getting angry at kids. I remember a guy that left shortly after I got there (a few months or so). He was a psychologist there and he was known for going berserk in raps, I mean jumping up out of his chair and yelling at the top of his lungs at you all sorts of profanity and then going back to being calm. It gave the appearance of total fakeness, he wasnt yelling at you because he cares, it was his systematic way of holding these rap sessions. I don't recall ever being the brunt of his out bursts but based on this I could tell he was a dick and I didn't like him. Anyway back to the point. My team leader was a great guy and at this point I could sense the tension between him and the staff members. A lot of the people on the wolf team were my friends and we all kind of came from the same genre of thuggish acting punk kids. I guess dealing with the hard cases was his specialty because there was a lot of us knuckleheads on his team. But later I got the gist that they (other staff and administration) were getting on him for being "too lax" with us. He let us get away with being kids and goofing off but we respected him and stayed in line (for the most part) becausae he bothered to earn our respect unlike other staff who demanded it because they can power trip on you and yell more profanity at you than 10 episodes of def comedy jam. But to summarize things one day he didn't show up to work and we were of course suspicios due to the circumstances of what was going on with him and the "system" (those were dr evil quotation marks by the way) at the time. They of course told us that they came to a "mutual agreement" that it was his time to move on (gee sounds a lot like how they do it in corp america right? trust me, I work in it). They then split us all up into different teams and had house raps to talk about all the wonderful stuff and things. I later approached a staff on the old team about the fact that i know he was fired, of course all I got in return was a blank stare proving I was right. But the moral of the story was that a good guy was fired from there with the total situation being blatantly honest to everyone (students and staff) because he didn't fit the corrupted mold they had going on there, only to leave the staff that really needed to take a hike able to move up in the chain of command.
Shortly after this incident I was transfered to RMA..... /SARCASM ON gee, sure didn't see that one comin'/SARCASM OFF
Enough typing for now, the way-back machine needs a rest.
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Was your team leader Rob Lo?
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No it was Mike Bonner.
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"Tell it all brothers and sisters, tell it all" ha ha ha ah
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On 2004-04-14 08:37:00, Anonymous wrote:
""Tell it all brothers and sisters, tell it all" ha ha ha ah"
When I get off from work I will write some more.
Currently dealing with the slew of Windows vulnerabilities released yesterday. Joys of managing the IT infrastructure for a fortune 500 company.
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Let me try to summarize my cedu stay the best I can. It happened in 3.1 sections.
Section .1
Arrive at cedu. I wasn't escorted like a lot of people I know, thank god too. After hearing about how some of those guys drag you out of your house, talk about excessive. Although a buddy of mine had a pretty good time with the escorts. Pretty much sat in the back seat pestering them the whole trip with things such as the are we there gimmick. He tells the story much better.
The school was described to me like it was a summer camp basically and didnt really seem all that bad. I mean it has rules but what kids my age follow the school rules right? WRONG! When i got there I was blown away. Every kid there seemed like a zombie to me and I was kinda freaked out by the mass amounts of hugging and whatnot going on. Definatly a different world for me.
To try to see what the haps were on the place I started talkin to folks (some were forced upon me by staff to give me the "things are so cheery here!" bit). Whenever I asked about the types of music people listened to I was introduced to a phrase called "popping off", ummmmm ok. Evidently popping off describes the act of discussing or singing out of agreement music. Out of agreement, it seemed to me like every thing was out of agreement, talking about girls (hey I was 15, give me a break), not making beds, cleaning, talking to certain people. Defenition number 2: bans, which is the process by which people arent allowed to talk to certain types of people. Example, I have quest down bans.
What?
I was then introduced to the different levels that you achieve as you progress on in the program. I forget what the "proper" term was for them. At this point I was ready to say the hell with it and take off. So I did. My third day there I took off during team chores. I went up in the woods and wondered in the direction that seemed most logical for Bonners Ferry to be located (didn't pay well enough attention on the ride up I guess). Well, I managed to miss Bonners Ferry and ended up bout halfway to Sandpoint when a bounty hunter picked me up. Meet Chuck Selent. Evidently a pretty tough hombre as I come to find out. He grabs me and I slugged him a good one in the jaw and he didn't flinch. Ok my bad, won't do that again eh? I am then places in handcuffs. It just happens to be that the place I got picked up was right near Naples, not so far from Ascent. In the car I was given the ultimatum of going back to BCA and being on a "full-time" or going to Ascent. You know, full-time, that thing you do where you sit at a table all day and do kind of odd writing assignments and do work all day while you arent allowed to speak to anyone, yeah thats the one. Hell I knew of a few people that were on fulltimes for months at a time. I don't understand how this is worth what it costs each month but the staff there seemed to think it did some good. 99% of the time all it did was give kids enough time to accept the fact that the only way they will get off the ting was to suck it up and kiss-ass and act like you are a born again cedu-staff-wannabee. I was pretty anwry at the time so I said a few choice words and off to Ascent it was.
Driving up to ascent was fun, felt like I drove into the set of Deliverance but fortunatly that wasnt the case. I was dropped of at the logistics cabin where I was strip searched, told what the rules are and whatnot. I know a lot of the Ascent staff have been known to just yell at kids for no reason and whatnot, I witnesses quite a bit of it, but in this particular case I deserved the yellins I got. I wasn;t the most friendly person when I walked into the place. To make it a short story I got into a scuffle with staff and tried to dart off (and ended up tripping over my boots because they took my laces, good for them because I ran track). Ended up staying my first night at ascent wearing nothing but underwear in the center of the circle in a sleeping bag in september in the rain. I had to eat my dinner out in the rain as well, which isnt so pleasant when its pouring.
Ill finish up the Ascent portion next post.
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I think the term "agreement" is used the same way as in the Elan program. I wonder how many other similarities there may be.
Do you support drug prohibition because it finances criminals at home or because it finances terrorists abroad?
--Anonymous
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Which good employee that they fired was it? If it was when I was there it would have been Greg, Cowboy Bob, Wendy and a few others who were not therapists. Cowboy Bob got canned for complaining to the state about the "jumpsuits." After they fired him the State actually did make the staff get rid of them and re write the "propheets" - now called "workshops." they just wrote new scripts and kept doing the same shit - with less sleep deprivation.
They are and always were useless. Every time they were done the kids would rave about them in front of the staff, then come to my clinical office and tell how phoney, idiotic, infantile, chiche and stupid it all was and how the staff acted like they were crowned with glory while the kids held back laughter.
I too had many moments of "easy stomach" nausia at those staged coming out of propheet rituals. "Like La, you were so Awsome." "Boo Hoo I can't believe how you went for it in there." Then God the Mormon come up and tells all the converts to "take it easy with thse guys" - "go slow around them." Yeah, while we scream at them.
What a scham !!!!!!!!!!!!
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the good employee fired was mike bonner
as far as propheets are concerned they were just a chance for me to be full of crap and do what it took to get through them. the breakdown of the propheets is as follows
Truth:
This was mega stupid. I heard a lot of things about people that I would rather not hear. This was the emotional growth session where you were supposed to address your "disclosures". Disclosures defined as things you have experienced in life you generally feel bad about. For me it was no big deal because I didn't feel particularly bad about to many things. I mean all I was ever guilty of was acting like a troublesome teenager. I never had some horrible act under my belt. Pathetic part about this was how out of proportion staff got with things. If you had sex with a guy and you were a girl you were called a slut and had some pretty profane things yelled at you. I heard staff yell things at teenage girls that would get them arrested outside of BCA. Terrible stuff, they also got in pretty graphic detail when talking about such things. If the staff didnt feel like you got all your disclosures off your back they would pester you call you "chicken shit" and such. I ended up making stuff up to get them off my back. I was credited with "doing my work". Whatever, I was doing what it took to get this thing over with.
Childrens:
Getting in touch with your inner child. This is where you are supposed to A: Feel bad by thinking about how you "destroying your inner child" with your actions or B: get mad at your parents for supposedly destroying your inner child. Whatever, move on.
Brothers:
Your friends really arent your friends. I don't fully understand cedu's definition of a friend but evidently its someone you are constantly expected to berate in raps and nag constantly about emo stuff. You just weren't being a good friend if you didnt yell at your buddy in raps. BTW the definition I heard of a friend seemed to change weekly. One day I hear I am being a good friend, the next day I dont. Blah, I give up.
Dreams:
Pretty much slept through this one. Hah :wink:
I want to live:
I liked this one because you got to wrestle around with your buddies and break stuff and not get in trouble. Once again like all propheets you were expected to talk about your feelings, get told they are bullshit and let staff tell you your feelings. Girls are once again sluts, if you even tried a drug oncce you were a dying addict, if you got angry you were going to be murderer when you got older, etc. Pretty routine by this point, seeing a patern yet?
Values:
This one wasn't so bad, mine was devoid of a lot of the dumb stuff usually found in propheets. Most likely due to the fact that mine was ran by a decent guy. Unlike most staff who I think jump at the chance to be in a propheet because they enjoy whatever game it represents to them or move up on the emotional growth staff chain of command.
Imagine:
Now this one I really did get a kick out of. For about I guess the first 12 hours of this thing you are sitting in a room having the staff ask you questions that have no point and go in circles, argue with everything you say, screw with you repeatedly. I mean this thing is rediculous. This was the first propheet I had with my RMA counterpart peergroup. Boy were those guys good at the game, they had the whole routine down to a T, the crying, the indictments, the self realization, etc. A buddy of mine told me about this part so I pretty much kept silent until it was over. I did have an outburt with a staff where I mocked the situation but after they figured out I wasn't going to break down and cry like everyone else I was simply written off as being dishonest with my feelings and we moved on.
The next two activiteies were I and Me and the Summit. Now these two things are filled with the most rediculous activities, verbal ridicule, and mental abuse. The summit is basically 5 days of telling you you are a piece of shit and the 5th day you are supposed to celebrate because you are now super, thanks for asking. Of course I came out being all happy and what not, part of it was the upper school look-good requirement and the other half was that I was happy as hell I was done with all that nonsense. It truely did feel good to be out of the summit, it meant i never had to do one of these stupid exercizes again.
What got me the most in all these experiences was how the "power staff" appeared to take it so seriously. I mean their dedication to carrying out these rediculous and innaproprate sessions was way past the point of fanatical. A lot of staff exhibited behavior that I just cannot condone no matter how it is rationalized to me. They acted rediculous and abusive, period. Nothing gives them the right to say the things they did and the worse feeling was that you couldn't speak your mind or put some of these bastards in their place. Doing so resulted in consequences ranging from: dropping you a peer group, full times, indefinite work assignments, ascent, etc. Having your own oppinion or own way of doing things was unacceptable. You had to be the cedu staff super emotional being clone. You were trapped and had to conform. In the end it isnt all that bad to go along with the program just so things were easier on you and you didn't have to deal with all the mess.
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Bwahahahhahha
I remember that shit, except I can't remember wrestleing in the I want to live, dammit.If I remember right, I was either paired with a staff or didn't have a partner, becacuse I would have remembered getting to break the violence agreement. Yeah, I remember getting out of the summit, what a great feeling, 30 days and a wake up and I was home. I still have all my scrolls and posters, I should throw them away, but I vowed I would never forget, and they keep me real. I have developed a severe hatred of john denver, anne murray and other propheet singers
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On 2004-04-14 18:03:00, Hell on Wheels wrote:
john denver, anne murray and other propheet singers..
:question: :question: :question: :question: "The Libertarian Party is a coalition of those who hold dear the economic freedoms championed by conservatives, yet abandoned by Republicans, and the civil freedoms championed by liberals, yet abandoned by Democrats."
--Rick Root
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There were certain songs they would play over and over again during these propheet experences. A lot of john lennon and such. I can only remember a few songs. I mean sometimes they would play some of these songs for hours at a time. You grow to hate them after awhile. Too bad, I like lennon.
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yeah, but Yoko sucks
they were supposed to play the misfits during the summit, I wonder if they ever did....East Coast punk rules
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Dude,
Don't blame the artists. I'm sure Denver and John would be sick to know how their music is used to brainwash - but who am I to judge? Hell, I'd burn the stuff to let go of the hate. I'd throw everything in the fire.
I'll never forget the time I went into the bridge and put on Bob Dylan "Everybody Must Get Stoned." Those staff idiots looked like swarming ants. I laughed my ass off.
Music is not related to drug use. And, humor actually prevents it by releasing stress. I never saw that CD again. I would play AC DC in my office for them though and those Mormons would pace around outside my office. They couldn't do anything about it.
They are clearly frustrated that they have not yet been promoted to Godhood, though they are practicing daily. They just can't get that lightning bolt thing down, and they are lousy at floods and famines - they do hire human locusts however. But, the locusts are not very smart or effective. They just swarm around - it is very frustrating to them. Denial of music as drug prevention - who ever heard of that? Reminded me of the Movie "Footloose" where the town banned music and dancing and the kids rocked out "underground" - Great movie - rent it.
Little did they know that the kids were indeed acting like good CEDU boys and girls while all of them just accepted the fact that the place was a total joke run by total idiots - lemmings, locusts whatever.
They would ban Bob Dylan and other "subversive" "propaganda" while the kids brewed their own alcohol, broke into staff offices, had sex or took cigarettes out of offices, and got deliveries of pot. Ulrich's psychotropic drugs were mixed into cocktails, amphetamines were bought and sold by the, so called, ADHD kids. People cheeked and threw away antipsychotics or broke them up to get high, Todd Degraff, LaTeresa and BCA was "in charge" "in control" What a F...ing Joke
We would try helping the staff deal with these issues, but their "interventions" of screaming and yelling, all day Raps, sickening transparent fake love and concern, restrictions lasting weeks or months, these would only make the problem worse - making kids so angry that all they wanted was to subvert the system or burn down the whole place.
I would try to tell staff that making enemies and imposing standards that would make Islamic fundamentalists uneasy produced the opposite results from those they wanted, but, as La said "The therapists don?t understand what we do."
Hell, we understood it just fine. We clearly understood that the collective IQ of the place was around 65. We knew intimately that you can't explain to a dog how to make a paper airplane because a dog is not interested in paper airplanes. They want to chew on sticks and bark.
They are all still there chewing on sticks and barking for $160 thousand dollars per kid per year.
So we therapists finally realized that subverting subversion was not subversive. It was subversive to support the subversive subversion (funny huh). Well, I'm the funniest guy I know. "Get her done."
Anyway, seeing the futility and illegality of mandatory reporting of danger to children to "risk management" instead of CPS as required by CEDU. (They would just sweep it the rug), I eventually, just reported to CPS. After all, this is the law, and, it is illegal for CEDU to decide for the therapist what is reportable and withhold it, but they did anyway and still do.
It sucked; you had to sneak around them to CPS and report anonymously. It made no difference anyway. CPS fears Mel's or Brown's mafia - and rightly so. In fact CEDU scares the hell out of me. They will spy. They will hack. They will lie about you. And, frankly, I would not even consider murder beyond their capabilities. That is why I stay vigilant 24 hours a day almost two years after leaving BCA.
I hope parents gat the picture because if anything happens to the child the parent is held legally responsible - not BCA, not RMA, not NWA. not Milestone, not CEDU High School, not Ascent or Cedu Middle School has any liability. The liability is with the parent
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I am not sure of their ability to get your or comparing them to the likes of the mob. I don't understand why they are viewed as being scary. In reality what are they going to do? I would love for them to come after me, but why the hell would they? What is so scary about them?
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If you worked there and were able to assess the mental stability of the staff, you would fear them.
If you knew what the management was really like and how they treat their employees, tou would fear them.
This is an evil place - very evil.
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from Jack "
I would love to collaborate, and I know a therapist who worked there who would. However, the threat of lawsuit is so scary. I hate this. I feel like I don't have any testosterone! They are scary, man!/
Then
On 2004-04-04 21:48:00, Anonymous wrote:
"These staff stories are absolutely horrifying and I feel for each and every one of you. How I wish parents could hear what goes on in these places from the perspective of counselors and therapists that no longer work in these hellish places. Why don't you all hook up and collaborate on a book? If you can get around the threat of lawsuits for "telling it like it is", and with the right literary agent, this book would be a bestseller right up there with the latest Steven King novel.
It's that nightmarish!!!! Anyway, thanks for sharing and trying to get the truth out there. Like Ginger always says, "it takes a 1,000 voices"
"
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CEDU has zero integrity. I would not want them plotting against me. These people have no respect for anything except power.
I knew the law inforcement in Bonners Ferry personally. They HATE CEDU! They know that CEDU tortures children. They know that half the staff at CEDU are using drugs. Do you know how many staff have been picked up for DUIs? More than the average, I promise you. The Bonners Ferry police and Boundary County Sherriff Dept. are forced to turn their heads because of the revenue CEDU brings in, much of it under the table I suspect. It is very sad.
Why does the State also turn its head on the hundreds of reportings of child abuse? Because CEDU plays hardball that's why. They know who to pay and who to play.
Does that mean CEDU will win? I don't think so. CEDU will crumble because they are dependent on parents sending their children to them, and the more educated parents become about CEDU and the Teen Help Industry, in general, the less likely they will choose schools like CEDU.
That is my hope!
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Below is the best description of the Propheets I have ever Heard. Please note that most of the I-and-Me and The Summit Workshops came from the Life Spring EST cults.
I went through the same high in the Basic course and the same berating in Life Spring's Advanced Course. My opinion is that it is all worthless and damaging. It is exactly as stated here.
In fact, the whole "science" of all of this comes down to dragging people down emotionally by berating and shaming and evoking sad emotion in them and then opening the trap and letting them out to the sound of charismatic music about freedom, and love, and a plethora of hugging, and other bullshit.
In summary, there is no science other than dragging the kid into a carefully crafted manufactured hell and then releasing him into a carefully crafted manufactured bliss, whereby he or she is convinced that a transformation has occured within. Nothing has actually occured.
In actuality, all that has happened is a mental minipulation - induced depression followed by the induced euphoria of being let out of the depression.
That is what parents are paying big bucks for. It is a total deception and nothing more. No improvement in personality, mood, or mental stability occurs. People actually are made more unstable of mood by these processes. Just look at the staff who have been going through these workshops - the term "histrionic" would describe the worst of them, "unstable" the best of them.
On 2004-04-14 17:35:00, chinsk wrote:
"the good employee fired was mike bonner
as far as propheets are concerned they were just a chance for me to be full of crap and do what it took to get through them. the breakdown of the propheets is as follows
Truth:
This was mega stupid. I heard a lot of things about people that I would rather not hear. This was the emotional growth session where you were supposed to address your "disclosures". Disclosures defined as things you have experienced in life you generally feel bad about. For me it was no big deal because I didn't feel particularly bad about to many things. I mean all I was ever guilty of was acting like a troublesome teenager. I never had some horrible act under my belt. Pathetic part about this was how out of proportion staff got with things. If you had sex with a guy and you were a girl you were called a slut and had some pretty profane things yelled at you. I heard staff yell things at teenage girls that would get them arrested outside of BCA. Terrible stuff, they also got in pretty graphic detail when talking about such things. If the staff didnt feel like you got all your disclosures off your back they would pester you call you "chicken shit" and such. I ended up making stuff up to get them off my back. I was credited with "doing my work". Whatever, I was doing what it took to get this thing over with.
Childrens:
Getting in touch with your inner child. This is where you are supposed to A: Feel bad by thinking about how you "destroying your inner child" with your actions or B: get mad at your parents for supposedly destroying your inner child. Whatever, move on.
Brothers:
Your friends really arent your friends. I don't fully understand cedu's definition of a friend but evidently its someone you are constantly expected to berate in raps and nag constantly about emo stuff. You just weren't being a good friend if you didnt yell at your buddy in raps. BTW the definition I heard of a friend seemed to change weekly. One day I hear I am being a good friend, the next day I dont. Blah, I give up.
Dreams:
Pretty much slept through this one. Hah :wink:
I want to live:
I liked this one because you got to wrestle around with your buddies and break stuff and not get in trouble. Once again like all propheets you were expected to talk about your feelings, get told they are bullshit and let staff tell you your feelings. Girls are once again sluts, if you even tried a drug oncce you were a dying addict, if you got angry you were going to be murderer when you got older, etc. Pretty routine by this point, seeing a patern yet?
Values:
This one wasn't so bad, mine was devoid of a lot of the dumb stuff usually found in propheets. Most likely due to the fact that mine was ran by a decent guy. Unlike most staff who I think jump at the chance to be in a propheet because they enjoy whatever game it represents to them or move up on the emotional growth staff chain of command.
Imagine:
Now this one I really did get a kick out of. For about I guess the first 12 hours of this thing you are sitting in a room having the staff ask you questions that have no point and go in circles, argue with everything you say, screw with you repeatedly. I mean this thing is rediculous. This was the first propheet I had with my RMA counterpart peergroup. Boy were those guys good at the game, they had the whole routine down to a T, the crying, the indictments, the self realization, etc. A buddy of mine told me about this part so I pretty much kept silent until it was over. I did have an outburt with a staff where I mocked the situation but after they figured out I wasn't going to break down and cry like everyone else I was simply written off as being dishonest with my feelings and we moved on.
The next two activiteies were I and Me and the Summit. Now these two things are filled with the most rediculous activities, verbal ridicule, and mental abuse. The summit is basically 5 days of telling you you are a piece of shit and the 5th day you are supposed to celebrate because you are now super, thanks for asking. Of course I came out being all happy and what not, part of it was the upper school look-good requirement and the other half was that I was happy as hell I was done with all that nonsense. It truely did feel good to be out of the summit, it meant i never had to do one of these stupid exercizes again.
What got me the most in all these experiences was how the "power staff" appeared to take it so seriously. I mean their dedication to carrying out these rediculous and innaproprate sessions was way past the point of fanatical. A lot of staff exhibited behavior that I just cannot condone no matter how it is rationalized to me. They acted rediculous and abusive, period. Nothing gives them the right to say the things they did and the worse feeling was that you couldn't speak your mind or put some of these bastards in their place. Doing so resulted in consequences ranging from: dropping you a peer group, full times, indefinite work assignments, ascent, etc. Having your own oppinion or own way of doing things was unacceptable. You had to be the cedu staff super emotional being clone. You were trapped and had to conform. In the end it isnt all that bad to go along with the program just so things were easier on you and you didn't have to deal with all the mess.
"
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God Bless you for having the generosity ande guts - speaking the truth as you have done. You appear to understand the following:
"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few - or the one"
From Star Trek
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OK here is the continuation of my stay.
Section 1: Ascent
Like I said before my introduction to ascent wasnt exactly timid. But anyway, the first night of me sleeping in the circle was over and next morning we were awakened early. At ascent the normal accomodations were teepees. Yes, you slept in teepees just like the native americans did. I personally did not mind them too much, some people really hated em.
I don't remember what time we got up in the morning, I know it was early (we werent allowed to have watches, I remember staff getting mad when you looked at theirs, I saw some kids get restrained for that). The normal routine if I remember correctly was wake up, goto the bathroom, do PT's then continue with the daily emotional growth activities. Speaking of bathroom, when you were first there or if you were a run risk you wore these things called "potty boots". Those boots were a very large size of water waders, but totally uncomforable, made running for PT difficult and were never cleaned. I didnt have to wear them for too long as I remember. But anyway, morning bathroom breaks were in the outhouse. The bathroom facilities were just yer standard outhouse, a building with a "toilet seat" over a large hole. What used to bother me was the fact that the staff would stand there and watch you go to the bathroom. Kind of degrading but I guess they were into that R. Kelly style stuff (please tell me someone here watches Chappelle's Show). I remember one time a kid took of his "new student" jacket which was basically a reflective orange vest and he chunked it down the toilet. I saw staff hold him up by his ankles while they dangled him INSIDE the hole and made him fish it out with a rake. I heard the kid was gagging and throwing up but they wouldnt bring him up until he fetched it. I know it was a stupid thing to chunk it down there but I dont see how dangling him inside an outhouse hole was legal. PT's werent bad, sometimes staff took it too far but I got a good work out from the deal and got in great shape. The daily activities usually consisted of chopping wood in the wood shed or hiking up the mountain and bringing logs down. I don't mind physical labor so none of this was to bad for me. Although one time some staff was being a dick and made us eat our lunches WHILE holding logs on our shoulders hiking down the mountain, which was a difficult task to say the least. The staff then went on a rant saying about how thye don't have to feed us, and if they wanted they could give us all 3 of our meals at once and never give us anything to eat for the rest of the day. For some reason I don't think CPS would be a fan of that.
Occasionally we would have 2 or 3 times a week. These raps were usual fare, girls were whores, guys were thugs, we were all going to die or end up in jail, etc. Raps at ascent really gave look-goods and ass kissers a time to shine. Was kinda funny to watch those kids. Staff bought there little act too. Ascent was broken up into 3 sections, first two weeks consisted of labor and whatnot, second 2 weeks you trained to go out on course, and the last two weeks you went out on course and finished up the program. The second set of two weeks consisted of some wilderness training with your group and a lot of raps to get to know the staff you were going on course with. I rember in our group we had this one staff member that was a real dick. He would just ridicule and make fun of kids for no reason. He would push you until you acted out, he laughed like he got enjoyment out of it. This is the staff I popped twice for doin that routine to me on course. Of course I got restrained but that is to be expected. All in all course was not that bad, it was just real cold out and that was my only complaint from the ordeal. That and the fact that the dick staff that was with us would have temper tantrums and give us 30 seconds to eat our meal, which usually meant no meal because you could not unpack you backpack and pack it back up in that time frame (hey these packs weighed like 50 pounds, there was a lot of stuff in there).
The last week or so of ascent wasn't that bad, by this time the staff pretty much quit screwin with you unless you were a real hard head. I was in the kitchen for most of that time which was a major plus. The wood burning stove was in here so it was nice and warm and it gave you a pass out of a lot of the labor and whatnot. As long as the dishes were clean and the food was served up it wasnt a big deal. Pretty easy stuff.
Showers/Baths. I only remember getting a bath a few times there. They took place in a teepee that had 4 or 6 stalls with buckets. You would pump the water and heat it on a stove and dump it in the bucket and are given a large bottle of dial soap. That is how you took showers. Sometimes people got to take frequent ones, especially those that smelled particularly bad. It wasnt very pleasant because it would be in the teens outside and the water in those buckets got cold quick.
I remember one time they were shooting an ascent commercial there. Was very entertaining to watch. First we werent allowed to talk to any of the actors or crew. The staff were also very nice during this time, all friendly actin like they were buddies with us. Gotta put on a good face for the outsiders. What was especially entertaining was all the actors were wearing outdoor gear (nice gear, not like the old cheap garbage we got) and carrying canoes and all sorts around. It was pretty entertaining because it was completely bogus and fake. You see these nice shiny clean actors and then look over at us dirt caked and filthy kids. Gotta do that marketing and PR though I guess.
All in all my stay at ascent was worthless, I learned nothing but to conform and keep my mouth shut until it was over. It was 6 weeks so it was pretty easy to do your time until it was over. For how much it costs I don't see the point. After ascent I returned to BCA to finish the program. What would bother me is that they would send kids to ascent all the time, not necesarilly because they needed to be there. I think ascent was just a huge quick cash cow for them and they used it as such. Mel needed some work done at his house so you send a kid there for 6 weeks, collect your 15K and walla new siding on casa de Mel.
Ill continue with the BCA portion next. I may have forgotten some stuff so ask me questions and tha tmay trigger some old memories.
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It does sound paranoid, but many ex-staffers are fearful of CEDU. It's not like we think they are going to do a driveby. We just fear that they will sue us for libel or have a negative impact on our careers. My fear is lawsuit. Although everything I post is true, what happens in courtrooms is not necessarily just nor is it true. Plenty of bogus claims are rewarded in the courtroom. So, I'm not willing to step forward.
I think part of the experience is the way they spied on us. I mean, it was unreal. Information got back to me that they could not have have possibly known had they not been spying on me. As people say, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean someone isn't out to get you!
On 2004-04-15 10:17:00, chinsk wrote:
"I am not sure of their ability to get your or comparing them to the likes of the mob. I don't understand why they are viewed as being scary. In reality what are they going to do? I would love for them to come after me, but why the hell would they? What is so scary about them? "
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Summit waas way weird, guess there is a reason it is saved for last. Life boat, stuff like that. Although the stretch was pretty cool, I caught a woman shoplifting, and she gave me her contact info. I guess I won. Shit by then you were so far out of your mind, you didn't know what the hell was coming next. Course then the fun began, we got to scare the new kids with our dancing after we got out. of course that was a little weird when one of my peer group cleaned his dirt up right then and there. Scared me. Oh well, it was only 30 and a wake up from then on out. Cake. except, they are not supposed to put you in raps, but I somehow made it to almost every one. Guess I just kept screwing up, and was broken
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hey I don't blame ya for being a little paranoid, I still am, although I am still not thinking they will come after you. They just destroy your reputation. I saw a lot of it and after I left I heard there was a lot of it. Just putting the fear into them I guess. "Use your tools, xxxxx xxxxx didn't and is fucking up outside" stuff like that
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[ This Message was edited by: Hell on Wheels on 2004-07-07 19:37 ]
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Hey that flannel wasn't commissary! I remember when I got there I was able to keep like 10% of the clothing I had with me. Most of my stuff was out of agreement. I remember there was a time at BCA when I was on bans from loose fitting pants, I had to wear butt-tight jeans until my restriction was up. Guess I deserved it because we used to sneak in all types of clothing. You just had to make sure that your plane back from home visits arrived after hours. That way you could just take the stuff you didn't want to have checked in to your dorm (nightwatch could care less). Altho the catch 22 of that was when I was transfered to RMA, they made me send my clothes through the commissary and all my out of agreement clothing got ganked. I was so disappointed.
Speaking of night watch, those guys were cool most of the time. They would let upper school have birthday parties where you could watch a movie in the lodge after lights out. No staff would stick around so the nightwatch was watching you. The rules were that you had to go back to your dorm after your flick but little did staff know we had movies that we snuck in and ended up watching flicks till about 2 in the morning. That was a good time. Chance to hang out with your buds with no staff around. I also wired up the satellite reciever they just put in the lodge and we listened to the music channels. THat is one thing that bothered me the most, not being able to listen to music you liked. If simon and garfunkle, sting, and fleetwood mack were your thing they played that all the time in the lodge. I remember going home on visits and listening to my music, was like candy to my ears. Its amazing how much you miss that stuff.
On 2004-04-17 15:32:00, Hell on Wheels wrote:
"I remember Matt's first day before his ascent vacation, watching him wander off campus in his new yellow and black commissary flannel. How was I to know I would still be in contact with him 8 years later. That was the one neat thing about it, you could make friends fromo across the country, (course when I was there, we had a few foreign nationals). I think it is funny though, the cedu site still has pics from when I was there. It looks so loving I would almost send my kid there."
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[ This Message was edited by: Hell on Wheels on 2004-07-07 19:38 ]
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http://www.carlinamerica.com/titles/sf/ ... BROTHER.rm (http://www.carlinamerica.com/titles/sf/TELL%20IT%20ALL%20BROTHER.rm)
That will bring back some memories, I haven't heard this song since I was at cedu. You gotta have real player to listen to it (sorry, I know I hate real player too).
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I was on the Wolf Team. I was also very close to Mike Bonner- I respected him because he respected me. He left after I did. I heard it was personal problems. He was having problems at home.
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Who are you? I joined the wolf team in about sept 95 and was absent for about six weeks there :wink:.
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I am an ex BCA student currently in the process of filing a large lawsuit against cedu for the time i was there...if anyone has any interest in joining the lawsuit we already have a great lawyer and a bunch of kids and staff working with us. feel free to either email me at [email protected] or Instant Message me at jmg532
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Beware- who are you, and who is your attorney?
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Give your lawyer's name and phone number lon and larry
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why beware, im involved with many other people that will no longer allow cedu to scare and threaten us. we will win this. you seem to be someone employed or once employed, who are you?
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That's right. Some of us employees know what CEDU is capable of. They tear down staff like they tear down kids. I do not want their dogs on my heals.
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Uhhm, this is America, where we have a right to be free, and own guns. Why is there all this yammering about "I'm so scared" and "You don't know what they are capable of" it is ridiculous. Now for you ex-staff out there, maybe it is gut check time, maybe you have a little dirty laundry in the closet, maybe you did mean things, and maybe just maybe, you too relished playing god. Because my guess is that CEDU probably won't send a contractor out to your house, I'm just not seeing them as a strong arming group of people. Now that doesn't mean I am not saying they can't screw with your careers, because I'm sure they will, but if you are truly in the right, and I mean all right, then you should not have anything to worry about. But if you think there is a way for CEDU to get to you and you don't sleep well at night, then maybe you did something wrong. There is not one single staff that I could truly single out as not having any enemies in the ranks, not one, and that includes friends of mine. Not one full time staff member has any right to claim they were perfect and loved by most, it is not fair. Some of it is CEDU's doing and those that were like that I can forgive, but there were an awful lot of them that would take their anger out on us, some women staff that would get their "not pretty enough" issues worked out by fucking with pretty girls, and so many staff that were "small people" that would simply power trip on anyone that they could, and if you let them run you over, they would not stop until you lost it. And there were a few who were so good at the beginning, and then they let their power go to their heads. It reminded me of Bruce Almighty, you could have all of god's power, but they couldn't make us love them, even with the cultish stuff happening. That is not love that is Stockholm syndrome.
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Is this Dan Krumpoticth?
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I graduated in Dec 95. Julie Stewart...And no, I am not for the program. Some of it was good for me - most of it was not. I see the verbal abuse, I see the underground. It sucks how they treat the staff and kids. I am glad I am no longer there. I do not remember you.
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You have NO IDEA what we went through and what CEDU is capable of. Of course we don't think they'll kill us. That's just stupid. However, they can sue for libel. That's a fact. Stop being such an ass, please. I NEVER ONCE abused a kid and got out as soon as I could. I constantly caught hell for being kind to the kids. When I was hired, I had no idea it was the way it was. How could I? They told me that they were changing kids' lives and doing great things. I believed it. It was only after I was hired and SAW how they treated kids that I knew I had to leave right away.
You weren't staff, you weren't one of us who suffered and left as soon as we could. We had to put food on the table, you know. And even for those who bought into it, maybe they now know they were wrong and feel remorse. You never made a mistake?
On 2004-04-20 18:18:00, Hell on Wheels wrote:
"Uhhm, this is America, where we have a right to be free, and own guns. Why is there all this yammering about "I'm so scared" and "You don't know what they are capable of" it is ridiculous. Now for you ex-staff out there, maybe it is gut check time, maybe you have a little dirty laundry in the closet, maybe you did mean things, and maybe just maybe, you too relished playing god. Because my guess is that CEDU probably won't send a contractor out to your house, I'm just not seeing them as a strong arming group of people. Now that doesn't mean I am not saying they can't screw with your careers, because I'm sure they will, but if you are truly in the right, and I mean all right, then you should not have anything to worry about. But if you think there is a way for CEDU to get to you and you don't sleep well at night, then maybe you did something wrong. There is not one single staff that I could truly single out as not having any enemies in the ranks, not one, and that includes friends of mine. Not one full time staff member has any right to claim they were perfect and loved by most, it is not fair. Some of it is CEDU's doing and those that were like that I can forgive, but there were an awful lot of them that would take their anger out on us, some women staff that would get their "not pretty enough" issues worked out by fucking with pretty girls, and so many staff that were "small people" that would simply power trip on anyone that they could, and if you let them run you over, they would not stop until you lost it. And there were a few who were so good at the beginning, and then they let their power go to their heads. It reminded me of Bruce Almighty, you could have all of god's power, but they couldn't make us love them, even with the cultish stuff happening. That is not love that is Stockholm syndrome."
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i recently talked to the kid who posted his email about having a case against cedu. while i am not one to sue people, he did seem to be part of a pretty good case, he was clearly not the one heading this case, he said he got involved a few weeks ago. the lawyer they are using is named todd reed and he is located in sandpoint. as i said i do not agree with lawsuits, however if this kids not full of shit the person who is heading this whole thing does have a fairly decent case. I hate cedu as much as everyone else and wish these kids luck, however i cant involve myself in this.
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i also talked to this kid who claims he has a lawsuit. he did not have much info, all he knew is that the person heading this had "a bunch of people" involved in it. if think the idea of suing that fuckin place is great. First of all, all the staff that say if was just as hard on them there as it was on us kids clearly rode the short bus to school. the reason it was hard on us was them. there was no staff that everyone liked that was not called a parent communicator. Well its nice to hear you people feel bad now, its a bit too little too late. i know for my time at RMA my life was hell. the staffs ridicule and abuse, yes i said abuse was unbearable. i went in with no sexual past at all, yet becaue i was a girl with long pretty hair i was yelled at for being a "slut" this did come from the staff, and for all you people saying you were the mother Therisa's of CEDU, clearly you werent there with me, because the staff when i was there either laughed or joined in, and when i started to get depresseed about they way i was treated i was quickly put on medications. well at this time i am not part of this lawsuit, i dont see it as a bad idea. For all the staff that claim there good people that were like us a victom of the system, i tell them what they said to me so many times. push through your fuckin fear and help these kids out. if you ever want to be able to feel good for what you have done start to make a mense. clearly your lifes not goin to well anyway, you live in north idaho, and knowing that you used to work at cedu id say you have about the same education as many of the other staff that worked there
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A lawsuit is a great idea. I have heard of so many i am tired of it. Get the name of his lawyer on this site and that should prove he is serious and not just anothe blow hard kid.
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His lawyers name was posted above, its Todd Reed. I just checked into him he has represented kids against cedu before, but all his cases were settled out of court. I wish these kids good luck and personally will be in contact with them as soon as i see him online.
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Like I always say, I never saw one staff's heart bleed when I was there, why should it bleed now 5 years later????? "I left because it was too bad" well shit maybe you coulda done something about it before.
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i agree with these kids. i know how full of shit the staff were when i was there, and i dont believe that they have changed so much quick. i hope you llive with the fear you made us students lived with while we were there, as they say, what goes around comes around. who does it feel now ex staffers, how does it feel to be us?
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What sort of ligitimacy do you think this forum would have with prospective parents without ex-staffers who thought they were going to work at CEDU to help problem kids and found out what was really happening there? I thought we were on the same team here, but clearly you are still stuck in the past, and haven't realized the strength in numbers game of life.
I want to inform parents not to send their kids to CEDU because it is a scam. I appreciate the feedback from all of you because when all the opinions are laid out, CEDU comes out a loser.
I did try to stop the abuse at CEDU and lost everything. I paid dearly, and I know other staff who have as well. I am truly, truly sorry that you had to spend a month, a year, or three years at that place, but don't fool yourself that all staff were evil and, therefore, are responsible for your abuse. Direct your anger to the place that will make a difference for the better, only then will you have hope of getting rid of it. That is not from CEDU, that is my own wisdom. I encourage you to seek some wisdom of your own.
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HOW DOES IT FEEL............... boy those words bring it all back don't they. And that is true, when I was up there, it did not matter if staff was good or bad, they got lumped as the enemy, I did not fear them as people, but I feared the power that they held, and that fear is a fear I won't soon forget. So on the same note, now you know how it feels, except your hearts and souls are not on the line, just your job, and future earning potential. You can always make money, you cannot replace a shattered childhood, no matter how hard you try or how much money you make, or how many toys you own, believe me I have tried. My sympathy is there, and my compassion, but the anger forces that feel-good crap right back out of the way. I have no heart, and have lost my soul, and simply feel that turnabout is fair play. Is it not????
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i love hell on wheels, who are these staff that think they are not innocent and exonerated of all charges. you were the problem and choose not to be the solution, dont try to be it now years later cause we dont wanna hear it
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I've figured it out. Some of the people posting just want to rage. They refuse to listen, they don't care about the truth, they will not tolerate any input that goes against their beliefs. Too bad. I came onto these posts to help. I want to get parents to not send their kids to CEDU. I was stupid enough to think that these boards were for giving out information and for discussions. Hell on Wheels just wants to beat people up.
You have no idea what it was like to be a staff and I've said it several times here - I NEVER MISTREATED A KID - and I left very quickly after starting. I am sorry that you had your bad experience. YOu can ask any kid who knew me in Running Springs and they will tell you that I CARED and I was NEVER mean to them. I constantly caught hell for this. Furthermore, several kids were devastated when I left and here it is, almost 10 years later, and I STILL get letters from some of them. They tell me that I helped keep them sane and they were devastated when I left.
I wish you had the backbone and integrity to respect the fact that some of us were NEVER like those whom you are so angry with. I feel for you, but I wish you would engage in meaningful discussion instead of constantly raging at everyone.
And, as I've said before, some of the staff who DID buy into it were almost brainwashed. They believed they were doing the right thing. Were there controlling, horrible people in the staff. Absolutely. But to paint all with the same brush is ridiculous.
Also, I am not on these posts to whine. I am hoping to see some legal action against CEDU and I would like to submit my testimony. I want NOTHING from CEDU. I don't want a dime. But I can help in any lawsuit that is going on.
So, Hell on Wheels, consider that you may be causing some parents to ignore your points with your rageful attitude. You want to convince them - not make them think you're a raging nut.
On 2004-04-22 21:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
"i love hell on wheels, who are these staff that think they are not innocent and exonerated of all charges. you were the problem and choose not to be the solution, dont try to be it now years later cause we dont wanna hear it"
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Thats all we want Jack1963. i too just joined this lawsuit against cedu for the abuse i went through there and want staff that are willing to practice what they preach. you may never have abused a child there, but i know you saw it. if you truely are willing to submit testimony on this issue them you are truely a good person and i forgive you. im just sick of all these staff members whinning about being scared of chuck salant and cedu. chuck is a little faggot, and cedu is a program very close to being shut down. as i said, if you can practice what you preach and are really willing to submit testomoney then give us some way to contact you. if you are truely this strong a person, i think i can speak for everyone in saying we forgive you and need your help, if not please dont say you are again.
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Thank you. That means a lot to me. I wasn't there very long because I started looking for another job immediately. But I've contaced one of those lawyers we've discussed on the boards. Yes, I'm scared of CEDU. I won't deny it. But I know all I have to do is tell the truth and the lawyer will protect me. My memories of CEDU make me sick. I thought some of those staff were decent and was shocked to see and hear them talk to the kids. And those profeets were just pure brainwashing-and abuse. And I saw that kid's grandfather trip and fall in Running Springs on a rug that we constantly complained about. It killed the old man. I hope the family reads these posts and contacts the attorneys.
On 2004-04-22 22:02:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Thats all we want Jack1963. i too just joined this lawsuit against cedu for the abuse i went through there and want staff that are willing to practice what they preach. you may never have abused a child there, but i know you saw it. if you truely are willing to submit testimony on this issue them you are truely a good person and i forgive you. im just sick of all these staff members whinning about being scared of chuck salant and cedu. chuck is a little faggot, and cedu is a program very close to being shut down. as i said, if you can practice what you preach and are really willing to submit testomoney then give us some way to contact you. if you are truely this strong a person, i think i can speak for everyone in saying we forgive you and need your help, if not please dont say you are again."
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well out attorney is todd reed in sandpoint and we are gonna make a hell of a case against those fuckers, how can we get in contact with you jack. if your a man of your work i respect you and would like my attorney to talk to you
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i too find it hard to trust ex staff, but am involved in a lawsuit and assume its the same one and the person above. please tell us how we can contact you, well contact you tommarow and then you can edit your thing so no one else can get a hold of u, i can tell you that i would have a ton of respect for an ex staff willing to stand up to this place.
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i see you, jack.
On 2004-04-22 22:38:00, Jack1963 wrote:
"Thank you. That means a lot to me. I wasn't there very long because I started looking for another job immediately. But I've contaced one of those lawyers we've discussed on the boards. Yes, I'm scared of CEDU. I won't deny it. But I know all I have to do is tell the truth and the lawyer will protect me. My memories of CEDU make me sick. I thought some of those staff were decent and was shocked to see and hear them talk to the kids. And those profeets were just pure brainwashing-and abuse. And I saw that kid's grandfather trip and fall in Running Springs on a rug that we constantly complained about. It killed the old man. I hope the family reads these posts and contacts the attorneys.
On 2004-04-22 22:02:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Thats all we want Jack1963. i too just joined this lawsuit against cedu for the abuse i went through there and want staff that are willing to practice what they preach. you may never have abused a child there, but i know you saw it. if you truely are willing to submit testimony on this issue them you are truely a good person and i forgive you. im just sick of all these staff members whinning about being scared of chuck salant and cedu. chuck is a little faggot, and cedu is a program very close to being shut down. as i said, if you can practice what you preach and are really willing to submit testomoney then give us some way to contact you. if you are truely this strong a person, i think i can speak for everyone in saying we forgive you and need your help, if not please dont say you are again."
"
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You know my sister teaches elementary school, and the hardest part of it is seeing kids come to school beat up from home. When that happens, she has to call people and report it. And sometimes no matter what she does, the kid still goes back to their home at night. She has to report abuse even if said parent is a very scary individual, who lives 20 minutes away from her.
Moral of this story????? If there is suspected abuse, it needs to get reported, no matter the consequences, even if the parent comes looking for you. Teachers have saved countless numbers of children by caring enough to report abuse. And then there are some children who have died because somebody did not have the balls to report it.
So think about that all you do-gooders, put that in your pipe and smoke it. You were responsible for us, you were our caretakers, you kept watch over us, and either you abused us or you let us get abused. And quite frankly, the ones that let the abuse continue are much worse people than those who abuse people. Reason being?? Well, the ones that do nothing to stop the abuse when they are there know that it is abuse. To the students and staff involved in the abuse, that was life at CEDU, no one knew any different. Now you know the rest of the story. And now you want to stop the abuse now?? Well that IS good, do not get me wrong, any thing against CEDU is alright, but when you go to sleep at night, I hope you picture all the kids that were there when you were there, and remember everything about them, the good, the bad, everything, think about good times, getting to know some of them, turning into their "parent". And then imagine yourself taking a gun and pulling the trigger on them. All because you did not have the goddamn balls to get a voice against CEDU. I bet it was real easy to quit, if you are everything you say you are. To just run away. No that is not okay, that is not good enough, you are a bad person. (I kinda like using CEDU language, it make me laugh because it is so ridiculous.) Like I said, I was there, I saw it and felt it, and went through it. And I feel I have the right to judge on it. I find ex-staff guilty of negligence, and weakness, and for a bunch of world changers, ya had your chance, you coulda had your own war , coulda been a hero, now ya just look back and have to shake your head at a chance you let slip. Yeah it would be great to stop CEDU, it really would, but I needed it stopped about 10 years ago. Coulda used the fire in yourbellies back then. But you were just weak back then. You saw it, you didn't like it, and you didn't do a goddamn thing about it.
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" I have no heart, and have lost my soul, and simply feel that turnabout is fair play. Is it not????"
I think it's time to get a heart and find your soul. You can spend the rest of your life blaming CEDU for feeling the way you do, or you can change the way you feel. It makes no difference to me or anyone else how you choose to spend your time here, but recognize that the staff here who tried their best and failed to make any difference at CEDU are moving forward.
If you can't forgive yourself who will, and if nobody else forgives you then at least you did.
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Silence is a crime. And those who commit it need to die. That means all ex-staff. Hell on wheels is fucking right, he's telling it like it is. Fuck all staff, and Fuck CEDU. Oh and Jack, tell me what is new and good in your life.....tell me what makes you able to judge me? Tell me what makes you a little better than the rest of us. Or better yet keep your clinical observations to yourself, we had enough of that years ago.
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Wow. I judge no one. I don't judge you. And I am no better than anyone. You need to chill so we can accomplish something here.
On 2004-04-24 09
:26:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Silence is a crime. And those who commit it need to die. That means all ex-staff. Hell on wheels is fucking right, he's telling it like it is. Fuck all staff, and Fuck CEDU. Oh and Jack, tell me what is new and good in your life.....tell me what makes you able to judge me? Tell me what makes you a little better than the rest of us. Or better yet keep your clinical observations to yourself, we had enough of that years ago."
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OK, I haven't posted in awhile (work.. arg) but I see there is some hostility going up. I will try to break up the tension with another section of my cedu story.
Section 2: BCA
Well after I got done with the oh so theraputic ascent I got sent back to BCA. I was disappointed, was hopin I could go home after ascent, but I guess every kid does. But here goes my second introduction to BCA. There was a farm there and a lot of kids worked on various things at the farm. Some took care of animals, some built stuff, some were chopping wood or turning the manure pile on work assignments. There were so many things to do for a work assignment. The main house at the time was what is now the dining hall at bca. There were various portable buildings that were team rooms as well. There were only two dorms 1 guys and 1 girls dorm. I think they had upper school dorms in sleepy hollow but i am not entirely sure. What was later the garden was at first a pig pen with 2 hogs in it. Kind of shocked me because I have never seen a pig in my life as big as those two were. And as we all know now from previous posts someone later had sexual relations with jazzy the female pig. BCA was way different when I first got there than what it became. The attendance there was not very high, I want to say 40 kids. It was still relatively new at the time too, I dont remember exactly what number student i was to attend but I was in peer group 7, I know it was less than the 100th student by a decent bit. Things seemed to be stricter at those times as well, but if you ask me the kids had a lot more problems at that time of the school. Hell, it could also be that the staff at the time made them that way.
I remember there was this staff guy named Doug there, he was working on his psychology phd or something like that, I know he was writing a dissertaion. Thinking back on it, I think he saw kids in a psycologist role as well as a staff role in the school. Sounds kinda fishy to me. He used to be in raps all the times and ran propheets. This guys behavior was terrible though, he had a very loud voice that scared the hell out of a lot of kids. He would always yell at ya, say just some terrible things to you (especially girls) and be so routine with it. He used to tighten the watch on his wrist so tight for raps so that when he is yelling and pointing at a kid he would flex his arm muscle and the watch would pop off. Didnt too much care for his tactics. He shortly left afterward, I think it was degree related or something.
Like I said in previous posts, I was on the wolf team. It was headed up by Mike Bonner which was a great guy. We were a bunch of knuckleheads at the time and I think that was his specialty. I think shortly later I did the truth propheet in peer group seven. I think peer group A (it went A,1,2,3,4, ... 7, etc, dont ask me) graduated about that same time too. That was a kind of odd bunch. I remember after they left they were doin dorm cleanup in their upper school dorms, found like girls panties and all kinds of crap up there. I don't want to go to much into a lot of their characters so I will end it there. Kids used to run away a lot more in that time it seems, it seems a lot more kids got permanently moved to the mental hospital (N.I.Be.High).
Leading into my next part I will begin with introducing the concept of "cleaning up attractions". When you cleaned up your attraction you would confront someone you were attracted to in a rap and tell them how you thought. Typically afterward the two people were usually put on bans and the girl would do a fulltime to deal with the issues of a) why she is a slut or b) her pattern of going back to guys. Was almost formulaic. Girls got put on all-guy bans alot. I remember there was this one guy that would always be the all-guy ban girl's only exception. Staff I guess had the impression that he was this little angel. Don't get me wrong, I am not knockin the guy, I liked him a lot, he was definatly a good guy. But like any guy our age he was kinda a horn dog. How out of touch staff were with that fact used to always crack me up. Couselors seemed to be a little more intense in the early days of the school. the kids really feared em. As time went on more confident and outspoken kids came along and the staff didnt always such an easy time controlling them and forcing their rule.
I did a couple more propheets I guess I would be up to my brothers by now. Funny story from that time is when we had health inspectors show up to check out the kitchen. Evidently they were in all kinds of violations and they knew they were. Before the inspectors came they kid all the chipped plates under a chusion (yes under a fucking cushion) in the staff fishbowl. They also didnt serve food and store plates on the little table outside the sneeze guard (on any other night they would put food out on tables with no sneeze guards, which is a health code violation). I saw them do this with the plates and staff over heard me tellin some other kids about this. When the health inspectors came they made sure all kids were out of their way. What is the best way to do this? All day raps, ding ding! But as soon as the inspectors were gone everything went back to how it usually was. Plates removed from the cushions and put back to use, etc. A couple months later they got a lot more new plates. They also later turned the entire lodge to a dining hall and got a decent setup for both cooking, serving, and cleaning up dishes. The Don Quixote lodge was done being built at this time. The first months of that building were hilarious. OK, its first winter. Evidently they did something terrible wring with the roof and its drainage system because the first big snow and freeze months ice built up on the roofs of the front patios and caused them to separate from the building and begin to collapse. The freezing made this a slow progress so it was entertaining every day to see how far the roof was to ripping off every morning. They repaired it when it thawed out, oh did I say thaw? Apparently someone thought it good to build the place on a natural spring, and when it thawed the water started seeping into various parts of the building. The HVAC ducting in the floors were filled with water and you could sail little paper boats from vent to vent. When it started to get hot again the wood started to dry out, mind you they let this wood sit outside in rain, snow, sleet, etc when they were building it, so when they slapped it up it was very moist wood. As you all know when would dries it shrinks a bit, you could see through the cracks in the walls at some place. Was kinda entertaining. They also had a decent computer lab in the new building, me being the computer dork I quickly moved myself into the position of being in charge of the computer lab.
Speak of the devil, another story. One of the best times I remember having there was when we used to sneak back games from home visits and such and since I was in charge I could install them on all the pc's and setup a routing for allowing kids to play them. We would have 10 player quake death matches, oh man it rocked. We got caught in the end, a staff sneaked in quietly while I wasnt paying attention and give everyone the command to swap out of the game real quick to a word document they had running in the background. We got busted, I didn't really get in trouble at all, I think computers intimidated a lot of staff there. This was though one of the reasons I ended up getting transfered to RMA. It was still a good time and I wouldnt take it back.
Another tale of the times. One winter we lost power for like a week and a half. Guys slept in the quixote lodge and girls in the dining hall. We had to do this cuz there was no heat and those were the only two buildings with fireplaces. I remember going back to the dorms and cups of water were frozen in some of them. Damn cold if you ask me. But another construction flaw of quixote lodge reared its head. They built the bow on the fireplace to high and when the fans werent running the fly was basically useless so the lodge filled with smoke, was terrific. They later built smaller fires and smoke was a minimum. We got our water from a well so the electric pump wasnt working and water was limited. Could only shower every other day or something like that, and couldnt flush. Which after awhile was nasty when ya only had 3 toilets in the dorms. I was surprised they never got generators, you would think an institution like this would require them. I don't know for sure tho.
I have written quite a bit. I will finish up the BCA stories later.
Hope ya enjoyed the reading.
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[ This Message was edited by: Hell on Wheels on 2004-07-07 19:43 ]
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Yeah Greg on the farm was a good guy. I did a lot of projects with him. I worked on the farm alot because it was a nice escape from the goings on at school sometimes. You could concentrate on building things or working on things and get lost in it. On top of all that you mighta learned something and had a good time. For one of the elective classes he taught we built a raft. Chopped down a tree in the woods, debarked it (after carrying the heavy f'er back to the farm, good excersize tho), then notched and nailed it together. Floated pretty good, we put it in the pond down on the farm and is was just a barge out in the middle of it. Was one of the few rewarding things I did there.
I remember for our graduation day thing we ate at his resturaunt. He played the harmonica and jammed for awhile. He was a real cool guy with a good heart. He is another example of a good staff they hired.
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He was too good. Latresa hated him,so she fired him. Any staff that actually had respect from the kids was fired by Latresa. She really is the deviil.
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Greg was fired? Jesus christ.....
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http://www.bouldercreekacademy.com/about/welcome.shtml (http://www.bouldercreekacademy.com/about/welcome.shtml)
I think this is funny as hell. How sick is that shit.
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On 2004-04-23 13:16:00, Anonymous wrote:
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" I have no heart, and have lost my soul, and simply feel that turnabout is fair play. Is it not????"
I think it's time to get a heart and find your soul. You can spend the rest of your life blaming CEDU for feeling the way you do, or you can change the way you feel. It makes no difference to me or anyone else how you choose to spend your time here, but recognize that the staff here who tried their best and failed to make any difference at CEDU are moving forward.
If you can't forgive yourself who will, and if nobody else forgives you then at least you did."
Those who abused and allowed abuse continue on children should be brought to justice. I think that was hell on wheel's point. How about you get your fucking hands off his psyche and mind your own business. You make me sick.
Let's forget about ourselves for a moment and concentrate on the kind of shit these kids are outrageously recieving. Let's concentrate our efforts against Cedu. A body divided cannot stand.
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A girl from Oklahoma is claiming 6 months of sexual abuse at CEDU in Running Springs. Anybody know about it?
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yes i posted an article on topic list
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If you really want to know who needs to be brought to justice - look no further than the Idaho Attorney General, Mike Starns ogf Idaho Health and Welfare in Bonners Ferry and the Govenor - They were all notified of the sodomy, abuse, and they know about what goes on in the workshops and do nothing - especially Idaho Regional Treatment Center (RTC) licensing - Jim Puett [email protected]
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Did Anybody write to ol Jim Puett yet?
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Sodomy???? Who the fuck was sodomized?? We had kids performing self sodomy, but nothing else. Quit making shit up, it is lame.
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i know krump
man, this is strange for me...
i feel really old school, though
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To whoever it was who had the balls to put their name and phone number up, I respect you...that's straight up. Hell on whells: I feel the same as you. That's straight up too. To the staff and xstaffers: we DO need your testimony if we desire the ear of would be future parents and staff. Yet it is difficult to think that you can truly empathize as much to cancel out your title as a staff member. It don't really matter what you did or didn't do...it's what you represent. You can't help that the same way we couldn't help being at RMA. So you just have to accept that whether or not you as an individual did right or wrong you represent the most arbitrary elements of terror that existed there. See "Hitler's Willing Executioners" for the really long explanation.
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To whoever it was who had the balls to put their name and phone number up, I respect you...that's straight up. (And I love the Alister Crowley quote) Hell on whells: I feel the same as you. That's straight up too. To the staff and xstaffers: we DO need your testimony if we desire the ear of would be future parents and staff. Yet it is difficult to think that you can truly empathize as much to cancel out your title as a staff member. It don't really matter what you did or didn't do...it's what you represent. You can't help that the same way we couldn't help being at RMA. So you just have to accept that whether or not you as an individual did right or wrong you represent the most arbitrary elements of terror that existed there. See "Hitler's Willing Executioners" for the really long explanation.
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I loved this post - Re Sodomy, Kids sodomized animals and also did it with objects - and it was suggested that it happened under worse circumstanced. F BCA
Which good employee that they fired was it? If it was when I was there it would have been Greg, Cowboy Bob, Wendy and a few others who were not therapists. Cowboy Bob got canned for complaining to the state about the "jumpsuits." After they fired him the State actually did make the staff get rid of them and re write the "propheets" - now called "workshops." they just wrote new scripts and kept doing the same shit - with less sleep deprivation.
They are and always were useless. Every time they were done the kids would rave about them in front of the staff, then come to my clinical office and tell how phoney, idiotic, infantile, chiche and stupid it all was and how the staff acted like they were crowned with glory while the kids held back laughter.
I too had many moments of "easy stomach" nausia at those staged coming out of propheet rituals. "Like La, you were so Awsome." "Boo Hoo I can't believe how you went for it in there." Then God the Mormon come up and tells all the converts to "take it easy with thse guys" - "go slow around them." Yeah, while we scream at them.
What a scham !!!!!!!!!!!!
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Did anyone ever write MR Puett and tell him about CEDU and have him read all the posts about them. He is the Idaho State Residential Therapeutic Boarding School Inspector that allows the abuse to go on - he's probably paid off.
[email protected]
Here's his e mail; give him some hell
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duuuuuuude i wanna know what goes on up there. e mail me. the imagine. summit and i and me...... [email protected]
im enrolled in cedu right now hopefully im getting pulled soon
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Do you have a safe place to run away to if your parents don't take you out of the program?
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I was just watching that tv show on abc brat camp and decided to search the internet see if anyone from rma/bca was on. I think I was either in your peer group Matt or 1 or 2 below you. It was like a lifetime ago so I don't quite remember, but I was I think the only Asian guy at the school.
Yeah, I remember all that shit you're talkin about. So funny.
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Are you Ray Kalona?
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Don't remember anyone named Ray but I DO remember Mike Bonner. For only 2 days I knew him, but he did seem to be a little more compassionate than the others!!
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No, I wondered if rayisonit is ray kalona, not you...
I remember mike bonner too. We called him mike boner. He worked in the wood corral with us.
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I understood perfectly well who you were talking to. Just kind of thinking out loud, ya know? :lol:
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Nah. I think I might have heard that name at the end when I was there. I think I was in peer group 7. I was at rma for 3 months and bca for about 8-9 months I think. People I hung out with was like Sam and Joannie. I was in Mike Bonner's team. He was a nice guy, but a little cheeseball for me.
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Blonde Sam and the whole dinner table thing? HA HA HA! That was hilarious when they did that. Did you dress up with them too? What is your name? I'm sure I know you. Peer group 7? I was friend's with quite a few people from that peer group.....
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i kicked it with sam and casey b after i graduated
-- hey dominic :grin:
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Ok...now who are YOU!!!! :lol:
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Patrick Meredith
:exclaim:
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whats been up with you dominic.. cant belive its ben 5 years :eek:
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HEY PATTY!!!!! Sure do miss the hell outta you. Who is the second Anon. Is that you too? You sure can't tell time very well Patty! Just kidden! Anyway, what's up with good ol' Dominick? Well, for starters, it isn't Dominick anymore. It is Lakey, but I still answer to Dominick (can't give up a pimp name like that). I have a 2 year old son who is well over 3 feet (God Help Me) and who is just a complete sweetheart! I am in the process of undergoing 3 different surgeries. (If you want to know why then PM me, don't really feel like posting it to the world). Work as a loan officer and am busy in the studio recording my FIRST cd. For those of you that know, I love to sing but I started rapping a bit. (I kept it with the singing though, HAH!) Hmm, let's see....other than that, making money and sitting on it! Fun STUFF! So what's new with you.
To the second Anon, if you aren't Patty, then let me know who you are :exclaim:
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My name is Ray Tseng, but I think they made me use my chinese name at the end when I was there for some cheesy get to know my roots thing. Yea Sam was blonde and he was from Wisconsin. I don't remember a whole dinner table thing, but it's hard for me to remember anything it's been almost 10 years I think.
I'm trying to think of other ppl in my peer group. I think Tara was in my peer group. This blonde chick who had some thing with Chris. That reminds me Chris I think pg6 was pretty cool. The mexican guy, but he probably left early too. Scott from I think pg9 I remember was pretty cool.
Oh yeah wait there was one other Asian guy when I was there Dave Henderson. I think pg 1.
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Ohmigod, Chris Pinyero! Is that who you are referring too when you say Mexican Chris? Now, my first graduation was Jaques Miller's. Were you still there, or were you already gone? The whole dinner thing happened after you left probably. It was a riot though! HILARIOUS!
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Yea that's it. He was mad cool. I remember he used to tell the funniest stories like the time he caught this dude having sex with a cat. Yeah, I don't know who Jaques Miller is I was probably gone by then.
What's this dinner table deal?
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I ran away from RMA and got transferred to BCA and Chris and Zach kind of took me under their wing for awhile when i was first there. Zach was from Philly I think? He had something going with that Jodie chick I think from pg1 or 2. But, I remember that Chris, Zach, and Matt used to rap haha that was funny. Did they have big brother type things over at BCA I forget? One of those guys was probably mine if they did.
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Yea, BCA did the whole big brother/big sister thing. Zac Bluestein is who I think you are referring to, he was from St. Louis. That's weird that you don't know Jaques. I remember Jodie, she wanted to be my big sister, but they wouldn't let her or something. The dinner table deal was so funny. About 6 or 7 guys would ALWAYS eat dinner together. They would dress up, or do show and tell or weird things like that. They would make sure EVERYONE heard what was going on at that table. They eventually were told that they had to eat dinner with other people, because well BCA didn't want you to get too close with people. But it was cool!
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Hey Ray whats goin on man. This is matt. I remember the table, I think that was disbanded shortly after Rob Lowe put us all on "Thug-Down bans".
Chris graduated, I lost contact with him shortly after I graduated. I spoke to Bluestein a little bit after as well but lost track of him.
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Thug-down Bans?!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Yes it was rediculous. Me, Zach, Chris, Jared, Hedican.... and a bunch more were all on bans from each other because we were "thugs".
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I thought you knew that about yourself Chinsk! Isn't that the reason why you were sent to BCA? Because of the huge thug inside of you?! It's ok to let it out here! You ARE safe here! Hee hee!
Can't get called a thug without Hedges-Hiller I thought?! :razz: [ This Message was edited by: If u want to know..then ask on 2005-08-02 08:53 ]
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Of course, cant forget Dave, he was included in that group.
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That is WAY to much! I don't know what they were talking about though. Dave had the softest blue eyes. I couldn't ever look at any of you and call you THUGS! Please! I must have been the thugett in that case! hee hee
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On 2005-08-02 14:04:00, If u want to know..then ask wrote:
"That is WAY to much! I don't know what they were talking about though. Dave had the softest blue eyes. I couldn't ever look at any of you and call you THUGS! Please! I must have been the thugett in that case! hee hee"
Thats the rediculous part of it.
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Everyone that worked there seemed ridiculous in one way, shape or form! Omigod, weren't you there for Jane Haberman Chinsk?
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Hey kids! It's Frances. Patty if you're here...I was in Atlanta for a day and I couldn't find your number!!! I miss you!!!
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For some reason I dont remember Jane Haberman, who was that?
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She became the new team leader on the Mt. Lions. Man, anything you did that she thought was wrong...you could be picking your damn nose....and she was all over you!
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She works ar another EG school now
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That poor school!
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Hey Dominic, Hey Francis!....
Its been a long long time. Hope everything has been going well for you Francis, and hope you didnt get deployed to Iraq by that psycho who stole the election. (you were in Italy last time we talked I think)
anyhow, I've been living in ATL for about six months now, loving every minute of it (almost), and tryin to stay out of trouble. Tryin to do this music thing, and tryin to avoid crazy female drama. I do this by reading my values statement in the mirror to myself everyday... JUST KIDDING.
So, definatley email me when yall get the chance to....
[email protected]
Love, Patrick
PS miss you guys :cry2:
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Hello? Patty- I emailed you, did you get it?
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I was at BCA 95-96 shout out to peer group a-6
Since then I too have graduated high school in Cali and am finishing up my marketing degree (CEDU taught me the art of psychology)and as much as i've been putting it off, I'll be taking the LSAT in the spring.
For work I'm a radio jock and a DJ (you know... records)I just left 104.1 KISS New Orleans about 3 weeks or so ago. They decided to change from hip hop to gospel. :lol:
I gotta say this though...CEDU and BCA fucked me academically...to be in schools where you make paper airplanes in natural science and instructors that pass you if you don't cause disruption is far different than going to a college-prep school.
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No shit man, anyone try to take a business calc class at a top university after making little paper dodecahedrons for your final grade in cedu's little 2 year math requirement? And shit those paper airplanes in science definitely helped me out in organic chemistry.
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Well, I managed to miss Bonners Ferry and ended up bout halfway to Sandpoint when a bounty hunter picked me up. Meet Chuck Selent. Evidently a pretty tough hombre as I come to find out. He grabs me and I slugged him a good one in the jaw and he didn't flinch. Ok my bad, won't do that again eh? I am then places in handcuffs....
Selent's Escort, Intervention, Interim Care business
http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=22922 (http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=22922)
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No shit man, anyone try to take a business calc class at a top university after making little paper dodecahedrons for your final grade in cedu's little 2 year math requirement? And shit those paper airplanes in science definitely helped me out in organic chemistry.
Did you have mortenson math, too? Algebra and calculus with legos! They give you a block and say "this is x cubed." Gee, thanks for that, but I think this is a tad more cumbersome than paper, pencil and a calculator.
Granted, it is a helpful educational tool for assisting students to grasp the concept of abstracts, but it was designed by a MONTESSORI TEACHER... for YOUNG KIDS.
Well, CEDU was all about regression anyways.
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In the first semester of college Stats and English kicked my ass. I remember the first 'paper' I turned in English class - there was more red ink from the teacher's corrections then there was black ink. I was irrate at the fact I had wasted 2 1/2 years in the biggest academic circle jerk of the NorthWest. Academics and Emmerson go together like burkas and strip clubs.
Stats and biology freshman year??? - holy fuck I think I worked 5-10 times as hard as the student next to me that had the same intelligence.
I ended up graduating with decent marks from a good univeristy but for the love of god - cedu academics were a joke.
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ACADEMICS? There were academics when you were there. I was at RMA in early 80s, just after a group from CEDU travelled up to Idaho to open the 2nd CEDU campus. We did not have academics. We worked from around 8am until noon on MWF and then had raps in the afternoon. On Tuesdays and Thursdays we worked until noon and then had "class" in the afternoon. Now, class could have been taking aerobics. Maybe doing some watercolor on the deck. Or scrimshaw. No math. No history. No English.
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