Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => Straight, Inc. and Derivatives => Topic started by: demonandmonk on May 11, 2005, 08:53:00 AM
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Hi! My new book The Demon and the Monk has just come out. I was in AARC (The Alberta Adolescent Recovery Centre) in Calgary. The book is about my life before AARC, how I got to AARC and what has happened since. I think it gives insight into how AARC works, and what it did for me in particular. It also goes into a little of the history of the Centre, and how it was created. I hope people will read the book, and perhaps learn a little. As I have said on this site before, it is only my experience, and everyone who has gone through AARC will have their own to share.
If you are interested, please go to my site http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com) and check it out.
Dave Grant
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Good for you David!
You have come so far and seem to be going even farther. This book can not be disputed (but it will) as it is about your experiences through AARC. For all the people who don't know AARC as AARC but think it is still related to Newton it will be good for them to read to learn about AARC and where it came from.
Thanks for carrying the message,
JS
PS I hope you mention me in the book :lol:
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On 2005-05-11 06:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"FUCK YOU for posting a link to a page that has an ADVERTISEMENT FOR AARC!!! Post what you want about your experience but don't fucking push they're rhetoric here and advertise for a place that has harmed so many kids.
Wasn't the author of BINGO an AARC person???"
So much for free speech! It amazes me that people who feel they were abused, muzzled and not allowed to speak what they truely felt will turn around and judge my writings before ever reading them. "Contempt prior to investigation." My story involves my time at AARC, and so the site that has my book on it has links to AARC as well as some of the history of AARC.
I really don't know what to make of the "BINGO" comment. The only BINGO I know is written from a guy in Quebec named Roger Caron who was a life long criminal.
PS Hi JS - only mentioned in passing, and everyone is anonymous.
Dave
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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While I feel bad that you are so angry, I can't change that. As far as your comment again to "F-U" that is too bad. By the way, who are you? It's easy to make viscious comments when being anonymous. Do you know me? where you in AARC? Have I harmed you in some way? What is your truth? Please feel free to speak your mind.
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On 2005-05-11 13:40:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I'm just a wise old woman whose been through one of AARC's predecessors and done enough reading and research about AARC to see that the acorn indeed did not fall far from the tree. :smokin: "
Gotcha! And you are certainly entitled to your opinion, I only encourage you to do more research. AARC was a very diferent experience for me compared to what I was told about KIDS of Bergen County from the former KIDS prisoners who worked at AARC. I would think that in this information age and in such a litigious society that if AARC were anything like Straight or Kids that it would have been shut down. My parents (Dad saw K of BC in action) would have withdrawn any support immediately.
Respectfully,
Dave Grant
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Riiiiight. Because you have been here to Calgary, and checked it out yourself. It's like me saying Disney Land is the Devil's playground, though of course I've never been there, but someone told me it's scary. Personally, I trust my own experience.
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On 2005-05-11 12:30:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
On 2005-05-11 06:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"FUCK YOU for posting a link to a page that has an ADVERTISEMENT FOR AARC!!! Post what you want about your experience but don't fucking push they're rhetoric here and advertise for a place that has harmed so many kids.
Wasn't the author of BINGO an AARC person???"
So much for free speech! It amazes me that people who feel they were abused, muzzled and not allowed to speak what they truely felt will turn around and judge my writings before ever reading them. "Contempt prior to investigation." My story involves my time at AARC, and so the site that has my book on it has links to AARC as well as some of the history of AARC.
I really don't know what to make of the "BINGO" comment. The only BINGO I know is written from a guy in Quebec named Roger Caron who was a life long criminal.
PS Hi JS - only mentioned in passing, and everyone is anonymous.
Dave
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
It is precisely because of the things you say like "contempt prior to investigation" along with your support of an abusive cult that makes people angry. They are not telling you that you are a horrible person (like aarc does), just very brainwashed and they dont want to be like you. That's all. What they're saying is, don't spew this brain numbing stuff around us, we're trying to escape and keep whatever sanity that we have left intact. That message is very different than a group of people basically keeping people locked up and convincing them that they can't even trust their most basic instincts and that they're horrible people. Two totally different things. Your inability to discriminate these two things also is a sign that your higher intellectual abilities have been disrupted.
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On 2005-05-11 16:56:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Riiiiight. Because you have been here to Calgary, and checked it out yourself. It's like me saying Disney Land is the Devil's playground, though of course I've never been there, but someone told me it's scary. Personally, I trust my own experience. "
Well so you're saying you'd rather get treatment even descending from a program created my INSANE CHILD ABUSERS than, say, treatment that was created by real psychologists with a method that has been researched and that is accepted by mainstream therapists, along with society. Why would you choose that one over the other?? Because you were there? Ever hear of the syndrome where you come to love your abusers?
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On 2005-05-12 07:40:00, Anonymous wrote:
Well so you're saying you'd rather get treatment even descending from a program created my INSANE CHILD ABUSERS than, say, treatment that was created by real psychologists with a method that has been researched and that is accepted by mainstream therapists, along with society. Why would you choose that one over the other?? Because you were there? Ever hear of the syndrome where you come to love your abusers? "
You mean Real Psychologist like my father, a Ph.d? Or how about my mother, an MSc. Ch. Psych. Both were involed from the inception. You don't get more mainstream than them. As far as choosing one method over another, the Government of Alberta has struggled for over 20 years with helping adolescents get sober using 28 day programs, day programs etc. Now they are holding up AARC as the example for the future because most of the almost 300 clients are doing well, living very independently of AARC and contributing to society, drug free. The Corrections Centre for youth where I volunteer is full kids who have been through the regular facilities, here, in other provinces and in the US. In 13 years sober, I have met only a handfull of kids who got sober, stayed sober from going through your idea of accepted methodolgy. AARC uses AA aaproved material, the kids go through all 12 steps, (not 7 like KIDS), get help with schooling (teachers are on staff), help with jobs, family counselling, etc.
Talk to former Kids prisoners who have seen AARC or worked there and ask what they think. The ones I know say it is incredibly different from Kids. Do they have Stockholm Syndrome as well?
AARC certainly worked for me. Prison didn't. Family counselling and individual therapy didn't. I find it interesting that people who are against AARC always claim supporters have Stockholm Syndrome, and thus cannot be trusted, yet those against are perfectly rational.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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I wasn't claiming Stockholm Syndrom simply because you like it there, but I reasoned it out. Things are not black or white (for me). Your parents were obviously NOT mainstream if they got into that. Regardless of their degrees. What research are you getting your info from?? There is actually research to the contrary, that harsh places like that do NOT work, instead family therapy at home is recommended. Or are you just quoting someone with an agenda. There is no research proving AA is any better than anything else either. The majority of people actually have been shown to get better *all by themselves* over time. People in a cult absolutely cannot accept this information though, it would destroy them. So truth be damned.
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On 2005-05-12 07:34:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-11 12:30:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
On 2005-05-11 06:21:00, Anonymous wrote:
"FUCK YOU for posting a link to a page that has an ADVERTISEMENT FOR AARC!!! Post what you want about your experience but don't fucking push they're rhetoric here and advertise for a place that has harmed so many kids.
Wasn't the author of BINGO an AARC person???"
So much for free speech! It amazes me that people who feel they were abused, muzzled and not allowed to speak what they truely felt will turn around and judge my writings before ever reading them. "Contempt prior to investigation." My story involves my time at AARC, and so the site that has my book on it has links to AARC as well as some of the history of AARC.
I really don't know what to make of the "BINGO" comment. The only BINGO I know is written from a guy in Quebec named Roger Caron who was a life long criminal.
PS Hi JS - only mentioned in passing, and everyone is anonymous.
Dave
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
It is precisely because of the things you say like "contempt prior to investigation" along with your support of an abusive cult that makes people angry. They are not telling you that you are a horrible person (like aarc does), just very brainwashed and they dont want to be like you. That's all. What they're saying is, don't spew this brain numbing stuff around us, we're trying to escape and keep whatever sanity that we have left intact. That message is very different than a group of people basically keeping people locked up and convincing them that they can't even trust their most basic instincts and that they're horrible people. Two totally different things. Your inability to discriminate these two things also is a sign that your higher intellectual abilities have been disrupted. "
You seem to have learned your lessons of how to abuse, patronize and belittle people well from your former captors. Telling someone that "They are not telling you that you are a horrible person (like aarc does), just very brainwashed and they dont want to be like you." and "your higher intellectual abilities have been disrupted" is wonderful. Because, of course what you believe about AARC is "right" and anyone else with an opinion, especially one based on first hand knowledge and end results, is wrong (brainwashed). But then the abused often become the abuser, and worst of all they do it with amazing self-righteousness (and anonymously).
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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"family therapy at home"
I left home at 16, was involved in crime to keep my addition fed and pay the bills. As I said we tried family therapy. It did not work for us. Every client of AARC's that I have spoken with went through multiple therapy and treatment options, none of which touched them, only gave them a great therapeutic vocabulary. Straight and Kids did not work. But AARC is very different from both those places - ask the Kids of BC survivors who know AARC. But oh yeah, truth be damned.
And you pooh pooh my parents credentials - what are yours?
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-05-12 08:36:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Look, the whole concept of 'breaking' a kid is fucked!! The similarities between AARC and Straight absolutely CANNOT be denied...PERIOD. You can tap dance around it all you want, but its the same shit with a slightly different wrapper. A complete mindfuck and rape of the soul."
Riiiight....because you say so. Have you been in AARC? Have you spoken with clients and families who have been through there and gotten the variety of stories from them? I certainly was not broken, and anyone who knows me, whether they like AARC or not, would likely agree. My soul is not only intact and whole, it grows better all the time. I know my past, and the things I did. I don't do those things anymore, and have a terrific life. I feel sad for you, because I believe that your mind and soul were affected by your experience. I hope you experience the healing you need, I hope you can stop the hysterical, nasty diatribe and engage in a reasonable, mature discussion.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Friday, October 15, 2004
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Panel Finds that Scare Tactics for Violence Prevention are Harmful
Good news is that positive approaches show promise
Bethesda, Maryland ? Programs that rely on ?scare tactics? to prevent children and adolescents from engaging in violent behavior are not only ineffective, but may actually make the problem worse, according to an independent state-of-the-science panel convened this week by the National Institutes of Health (NIH). The panel, charged with assessing the available evidence on preventing violence and other health-risking behaviors in adolescents, announced today its assessment of the current research.
The panel found that group detention centers, boot camps, and other ?get tough? programs often exacerbate problems by grouping young people with delinquent tendencies, where the more sophisticated instruct the more naïve. Similarly, the practice of transferring juveniles to the adult judicial system can be counterproductive, resulting in greater violence among incarcerated youth.
?The good news is that a number of intervention programs have been demonstrated to be effective through randomized controlled trials,? explained Dr. Robert L. Johnson, Chair of the Department of Pediatrics at the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey, who chaired the state-of-the-science panel. ?We were pleased to find several programs that work, and we hope that communities will adopt them and continue to develop other interventions that incorporate the features common to successful programs.?
The panel highlighted two programs that are clearly effective in reducing arrests and out-of-home placements: Functional Family Therapy, and Multisystemic Therapy. Among the important characteristics that these programs have in common are a focus on developing social competency skills, a long-term approach, and family involvement.
The panel also identified strengths and weaknesses in the field of violence prevention research, and made a number of recommendations to shape future efforts. Among these, the panel advocated a national population-based adolescent violence registry, and greater emphasis on economic research into the cost-effectiveness of intervention to prevent violence.
The panel released its findings in a public session this morning, following two days of expert presentations and panel deliberations. The full text of the panel's draft statement will be available late today at http://consensus.nih.gov (http://consensus.nih.gov). The final version will be available at the same Web address in three to four weeks. Statements from past conferences and additional information about the NIH Consensus Development Program are also available at the Web site, or by calling 1-888-644-2667.
The panel is independent and its report is not a policy statement of the NIH or the Federal Government. The NIH Consensus Development Program, of which this conference is a part, was established in 1977 as a mechanism to judge controversial topics in medicine and public health in an unbiased, impartial manner. NIH has conducted 119 consensus development conferences, and 23 state-of-the-science (formerly "technology assessment") conferences, addressing a wide range of issues.
The conference was sponsored by the Office of Medical Applications of Research and the National Institute of Mental Health, of the NIH. Cosponsors included the Office of Behavioral and Social Sciences Research, the National Institute of Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism, the National Institute of Child Health and Human Development, the National Institute on Drug Abuse, National Institute of Nursing Research, the National Library of Medicine, the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, the U.S. Department of Education, and the U.S. Department of Justice.
The 13-member panel included practitioners and researchers in community and family medicine, pediatrics, nursing, psychiatry, behavioral health, economics, juvenile justice, outcomes research, and a public representative. The panel reviewed an extensive collection of scientific literature related to youth violence prevention, including a systematic literature review prepared by the Southern California Evidence-Based Practice Center, under contract with the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality. A summary of the Evidence Report on Preventing Violence and Related Health-Risking Social Behaviors in Adolescents is available at http://www.ahrq.gov/clinic/epcsums/adolvisum.htm (http://www.ahrq.gov/clinic/epcsums/adolvisum.htm).
The archived webcast of the conference sessions will be available shortly at http://consensus.nih.gov/ (http://consensus.nih.gov/).
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MST TREATMENT MODEL
MULTISYSTEMIC THERAPY
AT A GLANCE
Program Overview:
Multisystemic Therapy (MST) is an intensive family- and community-based treatment that addresses the multiple determinants of serious antisocial behavior in juvenile offenders. The multisystemic approach views individuals as being nested within a complex network of interconnected systems that encompass individual, family, and extrafamilial (peer, school, neighborhood) factors. Intervention may be necessary in any one or a combination of these systems.
Program Targets:
MST targets chronic, violent, or substance abusing juvenile offenders at high risk of out-of-home placement and their families.
Program Content:
MST addresses the multiple factors known to be related to delinquency across the key settings, or systems, within which youth are embedded.. MST strives to promote behavior change in the youth?s natural environment, using the strengths of each system (e.g., family, peers, school, neighborhood, indigenous support network) to facilitate change.
The major goal of MST is to empower parents with the skills and resources needed to independently address the difficulties that arise in raising teenagers and to empower youth to cope with family, peer, school, and neighborhood problems. Within a context of support and skill building, the therapist places developmentally appropriate demands on the adolescent and family for responsible behavior. Intervention strategies are integrated into a social ecological context and include strategic family therapy, structural family therapy, behavioral parent training, and cognitive behavior therapies.
MST is provided using a home-based model of services delivery. This model helps to overcome barriers to service access, increases family retention in treatment, allows for the provision of intensive services (i.e., therapists have low caseloads), and enhances the maintenance of treatment gains. The usual duration of MST treatment is approximately 4 months.
Program Outcomes:
Evaluations of MST have demonstrated:
reduced long-term rates of criminal offending in serious juvenile offenders,
reduced rates of out-of-home placements for serious juvenile offenders,
extensive improvements in family functioning,
decreased mental health problems for serious juvenile offenders,
favorable outcomes at cost savings in comparison with usual mental health and juvenile justice services.
EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Background
Multisystemic Therapy (MST) was developed in the late 1970s to address several limitations of existing mental health services for serious juvenile offenders. These limitations include minimal effectiveness, low accountability of service providers for outcomes, and high cost.
Treatment efforts, in general, have failed to address the complexity of youth needs, being individually-oriented, narrowly focused, and delivered in settings that bear little relation to the problems being addressed (e.g., residential treatment centers, outpatient clinics). Given overwhelming empirical evidence that serious antisocial behavior is determined by the interplay of individual, family, peer, school, and neighborhood factors, it is not surprising that treatments of serious antisocial behavior have been largely ineffective. Restrictive out-of-home placements, such as residential treatment, psychiatric hospitalization, and incarceration, fail to address the known determinants of serious antisocial behavior and fail to alter the natural ecology to which the youth will eventually return. Furthermore, mental health and juvenile justice authorities have had virtually no accountability for outcome, a situation that does not enhance performance. The ineffectiveness of out-of-home placement, coupled with extremely high costs, have led many youth advocates to search for viable alternatives. MST is one treatment model that has a well-documented capacity to address the aforementioned difficulties in providing effective services for juvenile offenders.
Theoretical Rationale/Conceptual Framework
Consistent with social-ecological models of behavior and findings from causal modeling studies of delinquency and drug use, MST posits that youth antisocial behavior is multidetermined and linked with characteristics of the individual youth and his or her family, peer group, school, and community contexts. As such, MST interventions aim to attenuate risk factors by building youth and family strengths (protective factors) on a highly individualized and comprehensive basis. The provision of home-based services circumvents barriers to service access that often characterize families of serious juvenile offenders. An emphasis on parental empowerment to modify the natural social network of their children facilitates the maintenance and generalization of treatment gains.
Brief Description of Intervention
MST is a pragmatic and goal-oriented treatment that specifically targets those factors in each youth?s social network that are contributing to his or her antisocial behavior. Thus, MST interventions typically aim to improve caregiver discipline practices, enhance family affective relations, decrease youth association with deviant peers, increase youth association with prosocial peers, improve youth school or vocational performance, engage youth in prosocial recreational outlets, and develop an indigenous support network of extended family, neighbors, and friends to help caregivers achieve and maintain such changes. Specific treatment techniques used to facilitate these gains are integrated from those therapies that have the most empirical support, including cognitive behavioral, behavioral, and the pragmatic family therapies.
MST services are delivered in the natural environment (e.g., home, school, community). The treatment plan is designed in collaboration with family members and is, therefore, family driven rather than therapist driven. The ultimate goal of MST is to empower families to build an environment, through the mobilization of indigenous child, family, and community resources, that promotes health. The typical duration of home-based MST services is approximately 4 months, with multiple therapist-family contacts occurring each week.
Although MST is a family-based treatment model that has similarities with other family therapy approaches, several substantive differences are evident. First, MST places considerable attention on factors in the adolescent and family?s social networks that are linked with antisocial behavior. Hence, for example, MST priorities include removing offenders from deviant peer groups, enhancing school or vocational performance, and developing an indigenous support network for the family to maintain therapeutic gains. Second, MST programs have an extremely strong commitment to removing barriers to service access (see e.g., the home-based model of service delivery). Third, MST services are more intensive than traditional family therapies (e.g., several hours of treatment per week vs. 50 minutes). Fourth, and most important, MST has well-documented long-term outcomes with adolescents presenting serious antisocial behavior and their families.
The strongest and most consistent support for the effectiveness of MST comes from controlled studies that focused on violent and chronic juvenile offenders. Importantly, results from these studies showed that MST outcomes were similar for youths across the adolescent age range (i.e., 12-17 years), for males and females, and for African-American vs. white youths and families.
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"MST is a pragmatic and goal-oriented treatment that specifically targets those factors in each youth?s social network that are contributing to his or her antisocial behavior. "
Imagine that!!! So it's not all because the kid is selfish or self centered!! It's actually a family and social problem, with each part contributing. NOVEL idea. REally
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quoted from above;
"The panel highlighted two programs that are clearly effective in reducing arrests and out-of-home placements: Functional Family Therapy, and Multisystemic Therapy. Among the important characteristics that these programs have in common are a focus on developing social competency skills, a long-term approach, and family involvement. "
All of which AARC does. My family learned many tools to function together. I had not lived at home for 6 years, but on level 2, I went home with my family and lived there during treatment and 2 years after. And it certainly doesn't get more "Multisystemic" than the varieties of levels
I was treated on. I was helped to function again in society (I was on the margins of society being a criminal), AARC was long-term, slow reintegration into the community(especially school and work), and my family was involved every day.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-05-12 08:28:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
You seem to have learned your lessons of how to abuse, patronize and belittle people well from your former captors. Telling someone that "They are not telling you that you are a horrible person (like aarc does), just very brainwashed and they dont want to be like you." and "your higher intellectual abilities have been disrupted" is wonderful. Because, of course what you believe about AARC is "right" and anyone else with an opinion, especially one based on first hand knowledge and end results, is wrong (brainwashed). But then the abused often become the abuser, and worst of all they do it with amazing self-righteousness (and anonymously)."
I am trying to explain that people react to you this way because they are scared of you. You are promoting a point of view that harmed them when they were young, and probably still does. My point is whatever the approach towards you, that is still very different than what AARC does, which is trying to protect and defend itself against abuse, but to perpetuate it. To hurt others. These are two very different things. I was trying to explain that and point out that your inability to see the difference in those two things shows that there is some part of your reasoning abilities that are not accessible by you. I am sorry if that sounds harsh, but that is the nature of being in a cult, you stop being allowed to critically analyze things.
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I meant, which is NOT trying to protect and defenc
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On 2005-05-12 09:07:00, Anonymous wrote:
""MST is a pragmatic and goal-oriented treatment that specifically targets those factors in each youth?s social network that are contributing to his or her antisocial behavior. "
Imagine that!!! So it's not all because the kid is selfish or self centered!! It's actually a family and social problem, with each part contributing. NOVEL idea. REally"
"factors in each youth?s social network that are contributing to his or her antisocial behavior"
Like drug addiction? Criminal involvement? Associating with using addicts and criminals? Excellent!
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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???
I thought we were discussing the treatment model, not whether or not the kids needed help. Two different things...
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On 2005-05-12 09:13:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 08:28:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
You seem to have learned your lessons of how to abuse, patronize and belittle people well from your former captors. Telling someone that "They are not telling you that you are a horrible person (like aarc does), just very brainwashed and they dont want to be like you." and "your higher intellectual abilities have been disrupted" is wonderful. Because, of course what you believe about AARC is "right" and anyone else with an opinion, especially one based on first hand knowledge and end results, is wrong (brainwashed). But then the abused often become the abuser, and worst of all they do it with amazing self-righteousness (and anonymously)."
I am trying to explain that people react to you this way because they are scared of you. You are promoting a point of view that harmed them when they were young, and probably still does. My point is whatever the approach towards you, that is still very different than what AARC does, which is trying to protect and defend itself against abuse, but to perpetuate it. To hurt others. These are two very different things. I was trying to explain that and point out that your inability to see the difference in those two things shows that there is some part of your reasoning abilities that are not accessible by you. I am sorry if that sounds harsh, but that is the nature of being in a cult, you stop being allowed to critically analyze things."
Thank you for your concern!
Now back to chanting.....
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-05-12 09:18:00, Anonymous wrote:
"???
I thought we were discussing the treatment model, not whether or not the kids needed help. Two different things..."
Look, I was not in the home, had not been in the home for 6 years. I went through family and individual counselling it didn't touch me. I used drugs and committed drug related crime for 10 years, every day. My psychologist parents would have loved an in home solution that could have touched me. Believe me they tried. I signed myself into AARC, could have left any time. I stayed, my family was there, we worked on a ton of issues about our family, and about my drug addiction. I learned to like myself, got rid of my shame and guilt for the type of person I was, got a job for the first time at 22 and have not looked back. Needed help. Got help. Moved on.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Like drug addiction? Criminal involvement? Associating with using addicts and criminals? Excellent!
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Dave Grant (Demonandmonk) was a staff member at AARC when I was brought in. I was illegally held there for over one year. I was threatened that I would be restrained if I left and I saw other victims being restrained while I was there. I think actually Dave may have been one of the people helping to restrain A*r*l B**g*s? While myself and Dave were in AARC there was a lot of criminal activity, including child abuse through means of things like "The Zero Club" which involves "newcomers" having to urinate and defecate in front of staff and "oldcomers" and having to ask for one square of toilet paper at a time, and the staff and Oldcomers are allowed to deny them that right. Also sitting and holding kids down whenever they step out of line (basically physically stepping out of their chairs without being given permission first. Dave also partook in denying us our civil rights, and probably invasion of privacy, like when I found out friends were sending letters to me, and AARC was opening them up and reading them, then denying them to me. Having sold drugs (It was pot, right?) is a much less violent and harmful crime than what Dave partook in as a staff member in AARC.
There were some staff in AARC who clearly enjoyed recycling their abuse onto us. Dave was not one of those people. He believed (and apparently still believes) that AARC is the necessary evil to save people from "the disease". For most of us there was a time when we were programmed into believing it too.
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On 2005-05-12 10:50:00, Mel wrote:
"
Like drug addiction? Criminal involvement? Associating with using addicts and criminals? Excellent!
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Dave Grant (Demonandmonk) was a staff member at AARC when I was brought in. I was illegally held there for over one year. I was threatened that I would be restrained if I left and I saw other victims being restrained while I was there. I think actually Dave may have been one of the people helping to restrain A*r*l B**g*s? While myself and Dave were in AARC there was a lot of criminal activity, including child abuse through means of things like "The Zero Club" which involves "newcomers" having to urinate and defecate in front of staff and "oldcomers" and having to ask for one square of toilet paper at a time, and the staff and Oldcomers are allowed to deny them that right. Also sitting and holding kids down whenever they step out of line (basically physically stepping out of their chairs without being given permission first. Dave also partook in denying us our civil rights, and probably invasion of privacy, like when I found out friends were sending letters to me, and AARC was opening them up and reading them, then denying them to me. Having sold drugs (It was pot, right?) is a much less violent and harmful crime than what Dave partook in as a staff member in AARC.
There were some staff in AARC who clearly enjoyed recycling their abuse onto us. Dave was not one of those people. He believed (and apparently still believes) that AARC is the necessary evil to save people from "the disease". For most of us there was a time when we were programmed into believing it too. "
Sorry, I have no recollection of you from any of my time at AARC, I wish I did. As far as what I did before AARC, selling pot was about the least serious. And I NEVER, EVER restrained ANYONE while I was at AARC. I did grab a kid who illegally trespassed on a neighbors property, and he later signed himself out, with no one getting in his way. I saw countless kids sign themselves out. I also never was in a bathroom when someone used the toilet or showered, either at the Centre or in my home. If I did any of these things, file a human rights abuse complaint or call the cops. It is really easy to throw innuendo and accusations - "may have been one of the people....", alluding to child abuse by myself, denying your civil rights etc. This is unfair and total BS. How you talk about your time in AARC is up to you, but don't try and paint me as an abuser - that is crap.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Dave I'm connecting you to being a part of it, because you worked there and knew that this was going on. You enforced the same rules as everyone else in AARC. Countless kids who signed themselves out? Were they under the age of 16? Because I was told that I couldn't sign out under the age of 16 and that I'd be restrained if I tried to, and I saw that happen to others. I went to host homes in child locked doors and child locked windows, beds pushed in front of doors so that we couldn't escape, and our shoes hidden. I had oldcomers surround me so that I couldn't move. Calgary social services informed me that AARC did not have that right. I sobbed to you about wanting out, and I begged you to help me (while staring at your Salvidor Dali poster), and you enforced the rule that I couldn't leave. Legally, you should have helped escort me out. That was a denial of my civil rights which lead me to loosing one year of freedom during my youth which I desperately want back.
I know that you believe that you had the legal right to do this and that you were only helping. I recall you trying to have good relationships with each of the kids. Unfortunately you didn't have the right to keep me and you didn't help. You didn't listen to what I was telling you because you believed that we were all "druggies" and "full of BS". If you hadn't been taught that way of thinking then you most likely would have been able to see me with clarity and try to help me away from my family to a stable place. I certainly don't blame you specifically for this, just like I don't blame the other peers who I maintained friendships with for some time. But I do hold you just as accountable as all of the rest for not doing anything about it.
You were not with AARC for long while I was there. I have only a little recollection of you which includes that talk with you in your office, one talk with you in the kitchen, breifly some raps and what you wore, chickens, the job you went on to when you left, your girlfriend (wife?) and your mom. I remember Andrew and Mr. G restraining A*r*l and I think that you may have still worked there at the time.
My sibling only has three memories of the entire time in AARC and one is a sibling rap with you, and two of the rules. No Open Meeting, no Talks, she doesn't remember any of it at all.
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"You were not with AARC for long while I was there. I have only a little recollection of you which includes that talk with you in your office, one talk with you in the kitchen, breifly some raps and what you wore, chickens, the job you went on to when you left, your girlfriend (wife?) and your mom. I remember Andrew and Mr. G restraining A*r*l and I think that you may have still worked there at the time. "
Sorry, I wish I remembered you. Feel free to lump me in with your experience. But if I did something specific beyond what you oulined lay it out. I have no problem with the way I behaved at AARC, I belive I had integrity and was constantly learning and trying to help.
I forgot about the chickens! Wow! Damn, I wish I had included it in the book. What a fool I was. I can't believe you remember that! Girlfiend became wife. much in love still. Sadly my Mum passed away 18 months ago. Saddest time of my life, it almost sent me back out.
Take care Mel, I wish you only happiness and peace.
That's it for me for a while. If anyone wants to know my experience or opinions about AARC - buy the book.
Dave
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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While I was in AARC there was no question that abuse was going on, verbally and physically. I've seen someone get knocked down to the floor. That's just one out of the few incidents i've witnessed first hand. I've been personally subjected to abuse and if you have any questions about that send me a message.
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Dude, please edit your username. (use the Profile link to the left) If you use spaces, it'll wrap and not throw off the page formatting.
Thanks. Truth does not have to be accepted on faith. Scientists do not hold hands every Sunday, singing, "Yes gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! Amen.
--Dan Barker, former evangelist and author
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On 2005-05-12 08:19:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 07:40:00, Anonymous wrote:
Well so you're saying you'd rather get treatment even descending from a program created my INSANE CHILD ABUSERS than, say, treatment that was created by real psychologists with a method that has been researched and that is accepted by mainstream therapists, along with society. Why would you choose that one over the other?? Because you were there? Ever hear of the syndrome where you come to love your abusers? "
You mean Real Psychologist like my father, a Ph.d? Or how about my mother, an MSc. Ch. Psych. Both were involed from the inception. You don't get more mainstream than them. As far as choosing one method over another, the Government of Alberta has struggled for over 20 years with helping adolescents get sober using 28 day programs, day programs etc. Now they are holding up AARC as the example for the future because most of the almost 300 clients are doing well, living very independently of AARC and contributing to society, drug free. The Corrections Centre for youth where I volunteer is full kids who have been through the regular facilities, here, in other provinces and in the US. In 13 years sober, I have met only a handfull of kids who got sober, stayed sober from going through your idea of accepted methodolgy. AARC uses AA aaproved material, the kids go through all 12 steps, (not 7 like KIDS), get help with schooling (teachers are on staff), help with jobs, family counselling, etc.
Talk to former Kids prisoners who have seen AARC or worked there and ask what they think. The ones I know say it is incredibly different from Kids. Do they have Stockholm Syndrome as well?
AARC certainly worked for me. Prison didn't. Family counselling and individual therapy didn't. I find it interesting that people who are against AARC always claim supporters have Stockholm Syndrome, and thus cannot be trusted, yet those against are perfectly rational.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Now your last name is Grant, right?
http://www.cap.ab.ca/PPA/Registry.asp?v ... 1&Run=True (http://www.cap.ab.ca/PPA/Registry.asp?varLinks=1&Run=True)
Which of the only two registrants with the Alberta College of Psychologists is your father, by the way, or your mother?????
Like, Dean Vause holds himself out as a psychologist but doesn't have the credentials. So how do we know you are telling us the truth?
Name them.
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the only to with your surname on the list are:
Grant Lynda Edmonton 2283 Chartered Psychologists Practicing
Grant Pamela San Francisco 1111 Chartered Psychologists Non Practicing
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On 2005-05-12 08:27:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I wasn't claiming Stockholm Syndrom simply because you like it there, but I reasoned it out. Things are not black or white (for me). Your parents were obviously NOT mainstream if they got into that. Regardless of their degrees. What research are you getting your info from?? There is actually research to the contrary, that harsh places like that do NOT work, instead family therapy at home is recommended. Or are you just quoting someone with an agenda. There is no research proving AA is any better than anything else either. The majority of people actually have been shown to get better *all by themselves* over time. People in a cult absolutely cannot accept this information though, it would destroy them. So truth be damned."
I agree, because Professor Kalant, Medical doctor and Pharmacologist, former Head of Toronto's school of pharmacology (and almost always used by the prosecution in major drug trials) acknowledges that AA based programs are HIGHLY SELF SELECTIVE and their stats questionable.
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On 2005-05-12 17:44:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 08:19:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 07:40:00, Anonymous wrote:
Well so you're saying you'd rather get treatment even descending from a program created my INSANE CHILD ABUSERS than, say, treatment that was created by real psychologists with a method that has been researched and that is accepted by mainstream therapists, along with society. Why would you choose that one over the other?? Because you were there? Ever hear of the syndrome where you come to love your abusers? "
You mean Real Psychologist like my father, a Ph.d? Or how about my mother, an MSc. Ch. Psych. Both were involed from the inception. You don't get more mainstream than them. As far as choosing one method over another, the Government of Alberta has struggled for over 20 years with helping adolescents get sober using 28 day programs, day programs etc. Now they are holding up AARC as the example for the future because most of the almost 300 clients are doing well, living very independently of AARC and contributing to society, drug free. The Corrections Centre for youth where I volunteer is full kids who have been through the regular facilities, here, in other provinces and in the US. In 13 years sober, I have met only a handfull of kids who got sober, stayed sober from going through your idea of accepted methodolgy. AARC uses AA aaproved material, the kids go through all 12 steps, (not 7 like KIDS), get help with schooling (teachers are on staff), help with jobs, family counselling, etc.
Talk to former Kids prisoners who have seen AARC or worked there and ask what they think. The ones I know say it is incredibly different from Kids. Do they have Stockholm Syndrome as well?
AARC certainly worked for me. Prison didn't. Family counselling and individual therapy didn't. I find it interesting that people who are against AARC always claim supporters have Stockholm Syndrome, and thus cannot be trusted, yet those against are perfectly rational.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Now your last name is Grant, right?
http://www.cap.ab.ca/PPA/Registry.asp?v ... 1&Run=True (http://www.cap.ab.ca/PPA/Registry.asp?varLinks=1&Run=True)
Which of the only two registrants with the Alberta College of Psychologists is your father, by the way, or your mother?????
Like, Dean Vause holds himself out as a psychologist but doesn't have the credentials. So how do we know you are telling us the truth?
Name them.
"
its in the booooook..........
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and I said earlier, my mother died 18 months ago....and it was my step-father I was referring to, and his name is obviously different....but I call him my dad.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-05-12 18:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
"and I said earlier, my mother died 18 months ago....and it was my step-father I was referring to, and his name is obviously different....but I call him my dad.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Ahah!
So your natural parents were separated/ divorced/or your father was deceased. Now, tell me again, why was it that you got into using drugs in the first place? depression? anxiety? rebellion? mental illness? self medication? low self-esteem? Or just because you were a self-centered no-good low life that AARC would cure?
Do tell, as I'm not inclined to buy the book geven the poor job of promotion that you have done.
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On 2005-05-12 19:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 18:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
"and I said earlier, my mother died 18 months ago....and it was my step-father I was referring to, and his name is obviously different....but I call him my dad.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Ahah!
So your natural parents were separated/ divorced/or your father was deceased. Now, tell me again, why was it that you got into using drugs in the first place? depression? anxiety? rebellion? mental illness? self medication? low self-esteem? Or just because you were a self-centered no-good low life that AARC would cure?
Do tell, as I'm not inclined to buy the book geven the poor job of promotion that you have done."
and your step-father's name is.............
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On 2005-05-12 19:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 18:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
"and I said earlier, my mother died 18 months ago....and it was my step-father I was referring to, and his name is obviously different....but I call him my dad.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Ahah!
So your natural parents were separated/ divorced/or your father was deceased. Now, tell me again, why was it that you got into using drugs in the first place? depression? anxiety? rebellion? mental illness? self medication? low self-esteem? Or just because you were a self-centered no-good low life that AARC would cure?
Do tell, as I'm not inclined to buy the book geven the poor job of promotion that you have done."
:sad:
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On 2005-05-12 19:13:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 19:11:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-05-12 18:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
"and I said earlier, my mother died 18 months ago....and it was my step-father I was referring to, and his name is obviously different....but I call him my dad.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Ahah!
So your natural parents were separated/ divorced/or your father was deceased. Now, tell me again, why was it that you got into using drugs in the first place? depression? anxiety? rebellion? mental illness? self medication? low self-esteem? Or just because you were a self-centered no-good low life that AARC would cure?
Do tell, as I'm not inclined to buy the book geven the poor job of promotion that you have done."
and your step-father's name is............."
.......in the book....
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Notice how everything is "in the book" EXCEPT for any questions about what got him into drugs etc and how his family life may have been stressful.
Demon, why is it so hard to admit that you are not a selfish asshole?? I hope your book doesnt perpetuate this abuse onto other families....
:sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad: :sad:
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On 2005-05-13 11:04:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Notice how everything is "in the book" EXCEPT for any questions about what got him into drugs etc and how his family life may have been stressful.
Demon, why is it so hard to admit that you are not a selfish asshole?? I hope your book doesnt perpetuate this abuse onto other families....
"
Actually there is plenty in the book about how my family life was stressful, and you can decide what contributed to my drug use. I'm pretty candid about it.
I really don't think that I am a selfish asshole - though I was pretty selfish while I was using. You have to be to commit the crimes that I did. I am not today. I volunteer, takse care of my family, imediate and extended, and share my story in spite of the cynicism and rage that gets thrown my way.
Thanks for your interest!
Dave
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-05-12 13:02:00, Mel wrote:
"You were not with AARC for long while I was there. I have only a little recollection of you which includes that talk with you in your office, one talk with you in the kitchen, breifly some raps and what you wore, chickens, the job you went on to when you left, your girlfriend (wife?) and your mom. I remember Andrew and Mr. G restraining A*r*l and I think that you may have still worked there at the time."
I did some asking around, and there wasn't anyone named "mel" or "Mylitta" who was in AARC while I was there. I like the name though!
Mylitta:Sumerian Goddess of Moon and Fertility.
She can turn flowing water and Heavenly Fire into Sexual Energy.
Dave
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Yes, that's right because I had a legal name change. In fact according to the records the client who you knew died in 1998 and her social insurance number has been reassigned.
Mylitta is indeed a great name, and it was in the "M" section of a name book.
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Demon and Monk, the story of a guy who can't think for himself.
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On 2005-06-27 06:05:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Demon and Monk, the story of a guy who can't think for himself."
I sure hope you have read the book. But my guess is you have not.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Nope, sure haven't.
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On 2005-06-30 16:08:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Nope, sure haven't."
ok, feel free to pass judgement with no facts.
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The guy makes asshole posts here, he's a former staff of AARC, and an AARC-apologist who COULD NOT THINK FOR HIMSELF so he "had" to go to AARC to get off drugs. Wimp! Sicko! Child-abuse apologist! Disgusting.
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On 2005-07-01 08:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
"The guy makes asshole posts here, he's a former staff of AARC, and an AARC-apologist who COULD NOT THINK FOR HIMSELF so he "had" to go to AARC to get off drugs. Wimp! Sicko! Child-abuse apologist! Disgusting."
I'd much rather be cool like you
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On 2005-07-01 08:03:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-06-30 16:08:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Nope, sure haven't."
ok, feel free to pass judgement with no facts."
OK thanks! Not that I need your permission to do so. I will continue to think you are a jackass, with your blessings apparently. :wink:
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On 2005-07-01 08:28:00, Anonymous wrote:
"The guy makes asshole posts here, he's a former staff of AARC, and an AARC-apologist who COULD NOT THINK FOR HIMSELF so he "had" to go to AARC to get off drugs. Wimp! Sicko! Child-abuse apologist! Disgusting."
Seems like you learned you lessons of abuse and degradation well from you captors. Keep passing it on.
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The captors that you defend. I bet you love it.
Just a point of interest, I think there are at many different anons posting here.
Also, to say someone (you) who is attempting to perpetrate abuse onto others (by trying to say the abuse others suffered is actually OK or good) is sick etc, is actually quite different than our captors telling people they were sick for hurting only themselves, if even that (some people didn't even have any problems beforehand).
Get a heart man. Shame on you and it's called having empathy for those who are struggling. That's what our captors and you should have done, and what you should be advocating for, not this sick twisted idea of so-called "therapy." It IS disgusting. ::puke::
Another point of interest, I have a degree in counseling, and I've never read or heard anything even remotely resembling this pathetic excuse for "therapy" while in school. The professionals that get sucked into this nonsense are learning it from other individuals, not in any school that's in existance. You know why? It's illegal. Not to mention unethical. The ones still using it (in the US anyway) keep it very secretive and lie about it when asked by licensing boards. Why should they do that if they are doing nothing wrong? It's because the ethical standards of every single professional organization in the US would not allow it. So you're saying that the entire US is wrong, and you and a few professionals not following their own ethical code, are right. You know what I have to say? RIIIGHT....................
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You seriously need to stop confusing anger at abusors with anger expressed at people who have not abused anyone else.
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On 2005-07-02 12:50:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
Another point of interest, I have a degree in counseling, >"
I sure hope you use more compassionate language and open mindedness when dealing with the people you counsel. You sound more judgemental and norrowminded than what you accuse me of being becuase I went through AARC. I graduated over 12 years ago. I was on staff for 2 years. For 10 years since then I have beneffited greatly from the treatment I got there. Good job, great family, peace and security. I write, am artistic, and volunteer with young people in jail. You judge me with out knowing me, and likely not knowing AARC, which was small but important part of my story. 2 former prisoners at KIDS have read my book and both have said my experience was very different from what they went through. Your judgement and condemnation is your opinion. I challenge others to look deeper.
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My experience with "former prisoners" of The Seed, The Straights, and Kids of America who associate with those still involved with the program such as yourself, is that they are STILL prisoners. Of course the way that you write about AARC is the way that you want to percieve it and the way you hope others will percieve you. But why do so many others express such a drastically different experience in AARC than you?
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On 2005-07-03 22:22:00, Anonymous wrote:
But why do so many others express such a drastically different experience in AARC than you? "
So many others? Out of almost 300 graduates, and unknown others who did not complete AARC, how many have spoken negatively about their experience on this forum? 5? 10? And what you don't seem to get is that I respect their opinions. I for one want to know how their experience differed from mine. I have a great deal of compassion for anyone who went through AARC and felt they were harmed. I see AARC graduates every week, with sobriety ranging from a few months to many years. Without exception, they are bright, intelligent, humorous, and all stuggle to some extent with life - like everyone else. They are free to use their talents and gifts any way they choose - or choose not too. Most talk a bout the being grateful for the freedom they have today, that they worked hard to achieve, as have I.
Comparing AARC to KIDS or Straight or the Seed does a huge injustice and is a slap in the face to all who survived those US prison camps.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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"I sure hope you use more compassionate language and open mindedness when dealing with the people you counsel"
Again....the exact same behavior you are defending from your time in AARC. So which is it?
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I'm defending using compassionate language and openmindedness? Yeah, you are right. I am. Sorry you don't like it. I guess it will reflect in the success off your clients.
since you are such an expert on AARC, what is your experience there? When where you involved? Did you graduate? I speak from my personal experience.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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YOU are a complete moron and that is becoming more and more clear. UGGG. I will not be "openminded" about being abused!!!! Get that through your thick head. And stop defending the same behavior of your and my abusors, and then condemn me for (what you are calling) the same thing. Although you are too brainwashed obviously to see the clear difference.
Again, one is anger at being abused (even by you) while our abusors were angry at people that had hurt only themselves if even that. The fact that you are now resorting to PRETENDING you don't understand what I'm saying shows that not only do you have nothing to say in response, you may actually know deep down that I'm right.
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On 2005-07-05 07:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
"YOU are a complete moron and that is becoming more and more clear. UGGG. I will not be "openminded" about being abused!!!! Get that through your thick head. And stop defending the same behavior of your and my abusors, and then condemn me for (what you are calling) the same thing. Although you are too brainwashed obviously to see the clear difference.
Again, one is anger at being abused (even by you) while our abusors were angry at people that had hurt only themselves if even that. The fact that you are now resorting to PRETENDING you don't understand what I'm saying shows that not only do you have nothing to say in response, you may actually know deep down that I'm right.
"
Rave on. You seem to have this incredible need to push your views about a place that you have never been to. Your vitriolic, nasty, abusive posts do little to advance your cause. Perhaps some therapy would be wise before your misplaced rage towards me does you some internal harm. I hope that is not the case. You are probably a pretty good person suffering from abuse at the hands of US based prison camp "treatment" - which I am the last person to advocate. The first people I met when I came to AARC told me of the horrors of KIDS, and they were determined not to let that kind of abuse happen at AARC. They succeeded. Come see for yourself.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-07-05 13:28:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
On 2005-07-05 07:47:00, Anonymous wrote:
"YOU are a complete moron and that is becoming more and more clear. UGGG. I will not be "openminded" about being abused!!!! Get that through your thick head. And stop defending the same behavior of your and my abusors, and then condemn me for (what you are calling) the same thing. Although you are too brainwashed obviously to see the clear difference.
Again, one is anger at being abused (even by you) while our abusors were angry at people that had hurt only themselves if even that. The fact that you are now resorting to PRETENDING you don't understand what I'm saying shows that not only do you have nothing to say in response, you may actually know deep down that I'm right.
"
Rave on. You seem to have this incredible need to push your views about a place that you have never been to. Your vitriolic, nasty, abusive posts do little to advance your cause. Perhaps some therapy would be wise before your misplaced rage towards me does you some internal harm. I hope that is not the case. You are probably a pretty good person suffering from abuse at the hands of US based prison camp "treatment" - which I am the last person to advocate. The first people I met when I came to AARC told me of the horrors of KIDS, and they were determined not to let that kind of abuse happen at AARC. They succeeded. Come see for yourself.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
You are really amazing! You continue, to condemn me for not taking abuse from others, while then sticking up for people who, according to you, did the same thing. Something which may have escaped your observation---I don't kidnap people and try to brainwash them. I don't counsel people by controlling every aspect of their lives and scaring them with threats of death. You can say whatever you want to, you can keep repeating yourself over and over, but that doesn't change the fact that you aren't making any sense and you KEEP contradicting yourself. And I feel so much better knowing that AARC was only a watered-down version of a *highly abusive* rehab. Are you joking by thinking that's in your favor??? Let me let you in on something --- that is NOT in your favor. Oh and PS, don't bother patronizing me. I don't need you to tell me if I'm a good person or a shitty person.
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Are you saying that it's a good thing for AARC to be a "watered down version"? Having been through AARC and heard so much about Kids I don't think it's all that watered down. Regulations control AARC from having as many kids and instead of starving kids they over feed them but that's about the only difference I'm aware of. And I'm sure we would have starved if the issue hadn't been confronted when AARC was gaining funding to open. Even if AARC let kids free at night, had college funds for us and an amusement park in the back yard, would it be any better than Kids? The exact same "behavioral modification" is being used. The same lingo. The same concept of what is "healthy". The same perception of an ideal graduate. The same insults. The same narrow mindedness. As long as AARC uses the aspect of Kids that did the actual programming, what is the difference? Starvation was just the cherry on the cake at Kids. Going hungry doesn't cause people to break down or become brainwashed. The Program does. Torture is standing in front of a group of people who know nothing about you yet tell you you're sick, unhealthy, or "hurt'n" for hours at a time and being told how to live your life by ex drug users and teenagers. Personally I'd rather have starved.
And while you say that you know former victims of Kids who claim AARC is better, I've met victims of Kids who've attended AARC open meetings and say that it's the exact same thing.
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And I feel so much better knowing that AARC was only a watered-down version of a *highly abusive* rehab. Are you joking by thinking that's in your favor??? Let me let you in on something --- that is NOT in your favor. Oh and PS, don't bother patronizing me. I don't need you to tell me if I'm a good person or a shitty person. "
Watered down? Hardly - just different, and effective. For such a self proclaimed educated person, your lack of objectivity and willingness to listen to people who have actually been through AARC is sad. Once again, out of the almost 300 graduates and however many people who did not finish AARC, only a handfull are claiming it was harmful. No lawsuits, media articles, police investigations - nothing. (let me save you the trouble - there is no conspiracy, but feel free to claim one). 13 years of work.
As far as patronizing you, I don't feel I am. I think you don't have all the facts, and are going off half cocked, and lumping AARC together with "programs" that are BS. You also use incredibly angry and viscious language targeted to hurt and demean me, while claiming to want to help people. That is too bad. But it does give insight into your character.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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On 2005-07-08 09:19:00, demonandmonk wrote:
"
And I feel so much better knowing that AARC was only a watered-down version of a *highly abusive* rehab. Are you joking by thinking that's in your favor??? Let me let you in on something --- that is NOT in your favor. Oh and PS, don't bother patronizing me. I don't need you to tell me if I'm a good person or a shitty person. "
Watered down? Hardly - just different, and effective. For such a self proclaimed educated person, your lack of objectivity and willingness to listen to people who have actually been through AARC is sad. Once again, out of the almost 300 graduates and however many people who did not finish AARC, only a handfull are claiming it was harmful. No lawsuits, media articles, police investigations - nothing. (let me save you the trouble - there is no conspiracy, but feel free to claim one). 13 years of work.
As far as patronizing you, I don't feel I am. I think you don't have all the facts, and are going off half cocked, and lumping AARC together with "programs" that are BS. You also use incredibly angry and viscious language targeted to hurt and demean me, while claiming to want to help people. That is too bad. But it does give insight into your character.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Hmmm...should I repeat myself, YET AGAIN? No, I'm actually starting to get bored with this.....
YAWN.......
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On 2005-07-08 09:19:00, demonandmonk wrote:
No lawsuits, media articles, police investigations - nothing.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Well there's been at least 3 investigations that I've partaken in which are still in effect. I've done 1 radio interview and I'm aware of 3 news shows which have done shows portraying AARC as it is and I've been asked to partake in more. I can't imagne that you are unaware of these things and I don't know why you would tell others that they don't exsist.
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Hee hee....there are a lot more than one anon here too....just keep that in mind DAM. They're not all from only one person.
Jackass.
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I have seen one show, on ctv, and the graduate, who has no love for AARC, told me they edited and spun her story.
So regarding these ivestigations, what have the results been?
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oh, a lot more! Well you sure put my statement to shame. But that is the joy of being anonymous. You can say anything, no proof, no facts, no accountability.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Brainwashing -- also known as Coercive Persuasion, Behavior Modification or Thought Reform -- is and was practiced at ALL of the Straights and the Straight copy-cat programs, of which AARC is one.
Margaret Thaler Singer, internationally known cult expert, classified Straight, Inc. as a cult, not strictly because of any obscene physical abuses, but because of the systematic methods used upon children that can be better understood by reading the following article: "How Thought Reform Works" by Margaret Singer.
http://http://www.freeminds.org/psych/thought_reform.htm
one quote from the article:
"...in United States v. Lee 455 U.S. 252, 257-258 (1982), the California Supreme Court found that "when a person is subjected to coercive persuasion without his knowledge or consent... [he may] develop serious and sometimes irreversible physical and psychiatric disorders, up to and including schizophrenia, self-mutilation, and suicide."
Mr. Demon and Monk, sir, there is no way of getting around the facts just established. Not only Margaret Thaler Singer, but the California Supreme Court has recognized the damage that Thought Control/Behavior Modification/Coercive Persuasion can do. AARC is abusing children with methods KNOWN to cause severe mental illnesses.
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I guess that is why after 13 years the psych wards in Alberta are full of AARC graduates......Or not. The thriving, successful, happy, community oriented people that are the vast majority of AARC graduates refutes your claim. Of course Straight and the programs that followed were abusive. AARC is very different and the proof is in those young people, like me who are doing extremely well. Once again, you no nothing about AARC, and choose not to learn. That is sad, but it keeps you "right" in your mind.
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
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Oh, so you or someone you know has kept in touch with all of the AARC graduates to do follow-up studies to determine the factual effects of Behavior Modification? Please, cite the research papers, this is very interesting news. I suspect you have no research papers to cite! I suspect that you did not even read the article on Coercive Persuasion. Perhaps you did not notice the word "may" in the quote from the article: "[he may] develop serious and sometimes irreversible physical and psychiatric disorders..." Kinda like Russian Roulette. So, maybe you didn't turn out nuts, just ruthless. What kind of values do you have, that you would promote an institution that, by it's very methods, as outlined in the article by Margaret Singer, a respected cult expert and Professor Emeritus of the University of California at Berkeley, practices the technique of Thought Reform/Brainwashing/Coercive Persuasion on children? So what if you're a tough nut who came out unscathed, I have presented clear evidence here that AARC is blatantly endangering the mental health of children. I suggest that you, as a citizen, take more seriously the evidence that I have presented. Mr. Demon and Monk, sir, the central question is, will you keep on promoting an institution that is endangering children?
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show me your evidence that AARC is doing harm. I have plenty that it is doing great things - and not just for me. I have had the pleasure of knowing dozens of graduates and their families. How about you?
" I have presented clear evidence here that AARC is blatantly endangering the mental health of children"
No you have not. You have presented your opinion backed by a research paper that does not look at AARC and it's outcomes specifically. You are irresponsible and unethical for spouting accusations that are baseless, unfounded and unresearched. Blinded by your justified rage against the criminal institution that harmed you, you continue to spout of against an organization you know nothing about. And you do it anonymously, and I might add cowardly. Your unremitting stream of venom is indeed tiresome, and an insult to those who are doing so well after springboarding from AARC to forge their own path of success. I sure hope your therapy helps you.
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AARC's methods are methods of Behavior Modification/Thought Reform/Coercive Persuasion. You cannot overcome this basic fact, nor its corollary.
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I'm calling it...DAM is a troll. He ignores everything that is said, is boring, is completely self-absorbed, and apparently loves to try and emotionally traumatize others.
::troll::
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On 2005-07-11 12:43:00, Anonymous wrote:
"I'm calling it...DAM is a troll. He ignores everything that is said, is boring, is completely self-absorbed, and apparently loves to try and emotionally traumatize others.
::troll:: "
Hmmm... a Troll. Ok.
Ignores everything that is said. - sure.
Boring - You Bet! I lead avery mundane, uninteresting existence. Thank goodness. And boring enough to get repeatedly insulted and abused on this site. I guess I could make up outrageous claims of abuse at AARC to try and fit in with real survivors of abuse. I'll consider it.
Self-absorbed. Hmm. Except for my family, friends and kids I volunteer with, yeah probably.
As far as trying to "emotionally traumatize others" I am not the one insulting and belittling others - anonymously. It takes a special kind of person to do that.
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On 2005-07-11 18:39:00, Anonymous wrote:
"
On 2005-07-11 12:43:00, Anonymous wrote:
I am not the one insulting and belittling others - anonymously. It takes a special kind of person to do that."
Wow, that last statement is so very ironic on so many levels... It's truly baffling to me that the concept of Anonymity is lost on so many graduates on here who seem to be such thorough proponents for AA's philosophy... Remember kids, "...Half measures availed us nothing." so if you're going to be an AARC-speak spewing zealot, at least have the good sense to be consistant about it.
--John Doe aka Bob Smith aka Harold Johnson XI[ This Message was edited by: Eudora on 2006-03-14 11:13 ]
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:skull: Just wondering if you are talking about GVG your birth father a real PHd. or RKD your stepfather a Dd. Your real father would have had nothing but contempt for a cult such as AARC.
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Gerard V Grant was Davids father
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That is so creepy you know that! Are you stalking David? Dude I have known David for years and didn't know that ... maybe you should get a different hobby or atleast some help I am not logging in becasue I don't want you stalking me :wave:
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It's too bad you think that.Maybe you should get to know people a little better before you defend them. By the way I've known Daves family for more than 25 years.
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So why are you slagging him if you have known his family for 25 years? I wouldn't want to be your friend if thats how you treat people.
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Excellent job Mr Grant!!!! It takes courage to tell it the way it was to the public.Im on the hunt for your book,and I have been lucky to have had you as a peer.
Your friend
Graduate #49 ------> Scott F.
LETS DO LUNCH!!!![ This Message was edited by: SPANKY on 2006-03-24 18:30 ]
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On 2006-03-18 10:31:00, Anonymous wrote:
"It's too bad you think that.Maybe you should get to know people a little better before you defend them. By the way I've known Daves family for more than 25 years."
I don't need anyone to defend me. And anyone who knew my father GVG and what he did to his family would know I could care less what he thought of AARC. And as far as cults go he was a part of EST. BTW, my stepdad is a Phd as well, and it is him that I refer too. My real father was in far more need of therapy than anyone I know. He had a sad, lonely self-absorbed life full of anger and delusion.
David Grant
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On 2006-03-24 18:23:00, SPANKY wrote:
"Excellent job Mr Grant!!!! It takes courage to tell it the way it was to the public.Im on the hunt for your book,and I have been lucky to have had you as a peer.
Your friend
Graduate #49 ------> Scott F.
LETS DO LUNCH!!!![ This Message was edited by: SPANKY on 2006-03-24 18:30 ]"
Scott you can contact me any time through my site http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)
cheers
David
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So the sins of the fathers really are vested upon their sons.I guess the apple does'nt fall far from the tree.
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any time you want to say that to my face, come look me up.
David Grant
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On 2006-04-30 18:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
"any time you want to say that to my face, come look me up.
David Grant"
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Dave Rocks.
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Brainwashing -- also known as Coercive Persuasion, Behavior Modification or Thought Reform -- is and was practiced at ALL of the Straights and the Straight copy-cat programs, of which AARC is one.
Margaret Thaler Singer, internationally known cult expert, classified Straight, Inc. as a cult, not strictly because of any obscene physical abuses, but because of the systematic methods used upon children that can be better understood by reading the following article: "How Thought Reform Works" by Margaret Singer.
http://http://www.freeminds.org/psych/thought_reform.htm
one quote from the article:
"...in United States v. Lee 455 U.S. 252, 257-258 (1982), the California Supreme Court found that "when a person is subjected to coercive persuasion without his knowledge or consent... [he may] develop serious and sometimes irreversible physical and psychiatric disorders, up to and including schizophrenia, self-mutilation, and suicide."
Mr. Demon and Monk, sir, there is no way of getting around the facts just established. Not only Margaret Thaler Singer, but the California Supreme Court has recognized the damage that Thought Control/Behavior Modification/Coercive Persuasion can do. AARC is abusing children with methods KNOWN to cause severe mental illnesses.
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On 2006-04-30 18:32:00, Anonymous wrote:
"any time you want to say that to my face, come look me up.
David Grant"
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
Dave Rocks.
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yeah, dave, and a number of aarc proud graduates are threatening to beat up kids..girls too! all over this forum. Always afterwards that josh person says what a great idea this is.
Im guessing Dave is around 40? I dont know how old Josh is mid-late twenties?. But really, anywhere over 9 is old for those sorts of threats to seem reasonable and exciting.
Serious damage.
And yes these people who try to beat up kids who give them lip on THE INTERNET in a forum for abused children.....were/are "peer therepists" (read guards/owners who have complete authority over their prisoners) suposedly providing counsel and therapy for children. The lunatics litterally run the asylum for the lunatic that owns the asylum.
I dont feel bad for Dave but Josh just seems like a lost kid who has been exploited by some bad people
30 years of torturing and exploiting kids and counting. My guess is that AARC wont last as long as MIller Newtons hellhole did. I think Canadians are more attentive to human rights. Keep up the good work Velvet Racheal Mel et all. I admire your goodness and strength
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I've watched this forum for a long time, and no offense to her; but, I also know that Jessica fabricated that hogwash about Josh "threatening" her with violence. Josh wouldn't hurt a fly, and he definitely wouldn't get rough with a girl. I remember exactly what he said and it didn't even come close to what you witless idiots are on about.
You people need to clean out your eye-pieces. :rofl:
You also need to get laid more often.
Brutal.
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Some very curious gaps in logic displayed in js and david's posts. Our society is not as litigious as that in the United States. In the US, Miller Newton was frequently sued, and both Straights and Kids in the various forms were repeatedly shut down. Vause's links to Newton and thus Kids and the Straights is indisputable. The continuous thread through all of this is that some AARC clients will vouch for the institution, and the fact that Vause's PHD comes from Newton Miller's non-accredited alma mater, and that the methods employed at AARC have been deemed to be brain-washing, and that terrible abuses have occurred in the host homes don't matter. It doesn't matter to the pro-AARC posters that AARC doesn't have a psychiatrist, nor that the counsellors have in general no recognized, specialized training. They are able to employ the famous Catch-22: If you're bad, you won't believe in AARC. If you don't believe in AARC, you're bad.
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The university was Accredited by The NCA (Northern Central Association) in 1985. A university that is regionally accredited by its region in the U.S. has received a legitimate form of accreditation. For example, Florida schools are accredited by SACS (Southern Association). There are many professors in the U.S. who hold a Ph.D. from UI, and they work, in turn, for accredited instituions.
You might not agree with the way UI delivers knowledge, and many will agree that UI has always been non-traditional. However, the fact is it is an accredited university in the U.S. despite your perspective on its reputation in higher education. Since it is accredited, you can not argue that its graduates do not hold a real and official degree according to U.S. standards.
The question as to whether that degree qualifies Newton or any
other rehab "leader" to do what he or she does is a different debate.
Please get you facts straight on accreditation before you confuse someone on this forum with unfounded opinions.
BTW, my degree is from a campus-based traditional university, so I have no personal bias to defend UI or its graduates. I simply know the facts on accreditation.
Here is UI's website, so you can expand your research:
http://www.tui.edu/history/unique.asp (http://www.tui.edu/history/unique.asp)
:idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea: :idea:
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Terrifying that you hold a degree from anywhere if you qualify anyone's opinions as unfounded. My opinion is that a Ph.D. acquired without a dissertation but rather with a report on your newly established "treatment business", does not qualify you as a doctor. As to my argument that it's graduates do not hold real degrees, "The Institute" handed out degrees for two decades before 1985. I would trust that a reader of this forum would be able to think for themselves and not be confused. In this country, where AARC operates, one could not get a Ph.D. in the fashion of Mister DoctorVause. One could only guess as to Mister DoctorVause's motivations for choosing "The Union Institute". Whether it had anything to do with being able to get the special doctor paper while running a drug-treatment center in another country rather than doing research is beyond my knowledge.
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One also must ask if conflict of interest is part of the curriculum at the "Institute". Of the endorsements for AARC, two come from Union Institute folks, Faulkner and Kelly. And as I mentioned on another post, the "evaluator", Patton, is on the faculty of good ol' Union. Just because AARC is in Calgary, home of the University of Calgary, a couple hours south of the University of Alberta, a couple of hours north of the University of Lethbridge, is no reason I guess not to seek out the opinions of people from the "non-traditional" schools. Er, sorry, from one non-traditional school. And as to many agreeing "the institute" is non-traditional, I can't find anyone who has ever heard of it to have an opinion one way or the other. But then I'm in Canada. Where AARC is. Any reason that you, with your expertise in accreditation, are so familiar with "the institute", or is it just another coincidence like all of the institute connections to AARC. By the way, if anybody wants a laugh, look up one of the other good "doctors" who provided a rousing endorsement in AARC's nascent period. Mister DoctorAndrews, expert on free enterprise, which is kind of like treating drug abusing youth, just gushed about the importance of AARC to Alberta, even though he's in umm, that remote part of Alberta called Connecticut. It would be laughable if it weren't so harmful.
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If you are talking about Union Insitute of Ct ..its not a real university- its a correspondance course system.
Corespondance courses and Universities are completely different entities .Vause knows this. A "degree" from a correspondance system is not accepted by any medical, scientific,or academic group where certification of knowledge & expertise is mandatory. It not a real degree
It might be useful if you are applying for a job as a photo editers assistant or a similar job where certification of knowledge and expertise does not need to be ensured and are hired basically on a portfolio and "personality" but it does not meet the criteria if one is REQUIRED to have a college degree.
Thanks Ajax
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the degree would not be accepted even in the US where I am based
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The other day my Special Lady Friend, former prisoner of AARC, showed me some photographs taken in AARC while she was there. Of the children pictured, well Natalie Oldcomer wasn't a child, being admitted at 21, but anyhow, one is a stripper now, one went back to being a prostitute, one was impregnated by another, and one, whom I have met, a young man, has nothing but animosity for AARC. Such shining success David!
I think that deep down David you really want someone to shut down AARC. Whatever the role your mother and step-father had in bringing AARC to Calgary, it's not your fault.
Interesting that your step-father visited Kids, yet supported the Wiz.
How come the Wiz stayed with Kids, and in fact was tapped by Obi Won Newton to run the Calgary diocese of Synanon/Seed/Straight/Kids?
Sandra Levy Barbero, social worker, recoiled in horror at what she saw and wrote to a variety of state authorities in Texas, California and Utah to have Kids closed after she was there in 1989, the period in which the Wiz was being trained at Kids.
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br>You mean Real Psychologist like my father, a Ph.d? Or how about my mother, an MSc. Ch. Psych. Both were involed from the inception.
Although it may seem to be flogging a dead horse, I believe that it is vital to examine the relationships of David Pablo Escobar Grant and his family to AARC. Readers of this forum will recognize Escobar Grant as the former head of the Chinese Triads, the Russian Mafya, and both the Medellin and Cali cartels. After years of imprisonment in maximum security facilities, where he was kept in suspended animation, Grant emerged to write a propaganda manual for All About Receiving Cash.
In addition to his life as a super criminal, convict and drug-crazed fiend, Grant was an aliented suburban kid who liked to smoke pot and had a bad relationship with his family. His step-father went to Kids and decided to bring the program to Calgary, and along with it, the Wizard.
Grant has repeatedly stated that his step-father was a PhD, but this is, like so much of the info put out by AARColytes, a lie. His step-father has a bachelor of divininity, and a doctor of ministry. Neither of these is a PhD. These degrees in fact, are something Dr. Dookie has in commmon with Miller Newton, who was a divinity student. So, like everyone involved in AARC, Dr. Dookie had no expertise in youth drug treatment. He is essentially a career counsellor. This is the man who decided that Synanon was just what Calgary needed, and who set up the Wizard in his little fiefdom.
Lots of lurnin' 'bout Jezuz, not so much about pharmacology, child psychology, etc.
Every time you look at someone involved with AARC, you find them obscured by a cloud of dishonesty.
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Greg - you are a coward.
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Well, that may or may not be true. However, I don't run a cult that tortures children in the name of helping them. I don't lie about my academic credentials. I don't keep children in a facility against their will, and then lie about their right to leave. I don't sit in a courtroom and send children to a facility where they are humiliated, assaulted and psychologically mutillated. I don't work as a probation officer, sending kids to such a facility. I didn't arrange for such a facility to be opened, and then turn it over to a psychopath. And I never worked in a facility like that, sucking up to the psychopath and then writing a book to perpetuate the lies that underlie such a facility. So cowardice looks pretty mild as far as vices go if I'm on the yardstick with the Wizard, the people who brought him here, and anyone who worked for AARC.
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Greg - you are a coward.
Oh its true. Throwing out insults and character assassination while hiding anonymously behind a screen name. If you are so passionate about exposing what you believe to be an evil organization, why don't you sit outside AARCs building and hand out your "information" there? Why don't you start a petition or write letters to the editor - using your real name? Or are you just content to abuse people you have never met?
Its interesting that on any other forum you would be immediately labeled a troll and barred. Here you can say whatever you like, no matter how nasty. Sad.
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Greg - you are a coward.
Oh its true. Throwing out insults and character assassination while hiding anonymously behind a screen name.
Oh how cute. An anon attacking someone for being anon.
:roll:
If you are so passionate about exposing what you believe to be an evil organization, why don't you sit outside AARCs building and hand out your "information" there? Why don't you start a petition or write letters to the editor - using your real name? Or are you just content to abuse people you have never met?
Well, on the occasions that I've done that with AARC's predecessor, Straight, I've ended up threatened and harassed. We know well what's in store for those that dare to speak out against what really goes on in those places.
Its interesting that on any other forum you would be immediately labeled a troll and barred. Here you can say whatever you like, no matter how nasty. Sad.
Fucking troll!
:roll: ::both:: ::both::
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Greg - you are a coward.
Oh its true. Throwing out insults and character assassination while hiding anonymously behind a screen name.
Oh how cute. An anon attacking someone for being anon.
:roll:
If you are so passionate about exposing what you believe to be an evil organization, why don't you sit outside AARCs building and hand out your "information" there? Why don't you start a petition or write letters to the editor - using your real name? Or are you just content to abuse people you have never met?
Well, on the occasions that I've done that with AARC's predecessor, Straight, I've ended up threatened and harassed. We know well what's in store for those that dare to speak out against what really goes on in those places.
Its interesting that on any other forum you would be immediately labeled a troll and barred. Here you can say whatever you like, no matter how nasty. Sad.
Fucking troll!
:roll: ::both:: ::both::
YOU are the one quoting frank Zappa in your sig you tool.
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YOU are the one quoting frank Zappa in your sig you tool.
And your point would be?
:roll:
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I've used my name to correspond directly with the Wizard. Same goes for the fifth estate, the Toronto Star, my MLA, the Attorney General, the CRHA, etc.
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Greg - you are a coward.
Oh its true. Throwing out insults and character assassination while hiding anonymously behind a screen name.
Again, which part of what I said is not true? The little toad from Saskabush has repeatedly lied about being a psychologist. He is so deluded that you can still find these misrepresentations on the AARC website. And David, you have lied about your step-dad being a PhD. Flat out lied. That's not character assassination, it's just a case of someone trying to point out to anyone who cares that you guys lie. No one from AARC can ever address the facts, because they all stem from All About Receiving Cash being the Calgary Straight, run by a psychopathic fraud. No more no less.
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Like drug addiction? Criminal involvement? Associating with using addicts and criminals? Excellent!
http://www.demonandmonk.com (http://www.demonandmonk.com)"
Dave Grant (Demonandmonk) was a staff member at AARC when I was brought in. I was illegally held there for over one year. I was threatened that I would be restrained if I left and I saw other victims being restrained while I was there. I think actually Dave may have been one of the people helping to restrain A*r*l B**g*s? While myself and Dave were in AARC there was a lot of criminal activity, including child abuse through means of things like "The Zero Club" which involves "newcomers" having to urinate and defecate in front of staff and "oldcomers" and having to ask for one square of toilet paper at a time, and the staff and Oldcomers are allowed to deny them that right. Also sitting and holding kids down whenever they step out of line (basically physically stepping out of their chairs without being given permission first. Dave also partook in denying us our civil rights, and probably invasion of privacy, like when I found out friends were sending letters to me, and AARC was opening them up and reading them, then denying them to me. Having sold drugs (It was pot, right?) is a much less violent and harmful crime than what Dave partook in as a staff member in AARC.
There were some staff in AARC who clearly enjoyed recycling their abuse onto us. Dave was not one of those people. He believed (and apparently still believes) that AARC is the necessary evil to save people from "the disease". For most of us there was a time when we were programmed into believing it too.
:o
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He believed (and apparently still believes) that AARC is the necessary evil to save people from "the disease". For most of us there was a time when we were programmed into believing it too. [/color]
Can we all say
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[
You mean Real Psychologist like my father, a Ph.d? Or how about my mother, an MSc. Ch. Psych. Both were involed from the inception. You don't get more mainstream than them.
AARC certainly worked for me. Prison didn't. Family counselling and individual therapy didn't.
This is the root of the entire problem. As was pointed out earlier in the thread, old d and m is lying about the qualifications of his step-father, who was in no uncertain terms, not a PhD. He was a Doctor of Ministry and entirely without qualifications to assess and implement a drug treatment program. His mother was a speech therapist. Again, entirely unqualified to be involved in the implentation of a drug treatment program. These are the kind of people who gave us AARC. And as far as mainstream goes, his mother was an enthusiast of "rebirthing".
Prison may not have worked for d and m because he was never in prison. He used to have his rap sheet posted on the book website. If you read the small print he did some week-ends in Calgary Remand.
The point is that AARC is based on quackery.
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AARC is based on vulnerability, greed and fear.
Classic client/center/parent relationship.
(Notice the center coming between the client and their parents - AARC's version of "family therapy")
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quoted from above;
"The panel highlighted two programs that are clearly effective in reducing arrests and out-of-home placements: Functional Family Therapy, and Multisystemic Therapy. Among the important characteristics that these programs have in common are a focus on developing social competency skills, a long-term approach, and family involvement. "
All of which AARC does. My family learned many tools to function together. I had not lived at home for 6 years, but on level 2, I went home with my family and lived there during treatment and 2 years after. And it certainly doesn't get more "Multisystemic" than the varieties of levels
I was treated on. I was helped to function again in society (I was on the margins of society being a criminal), AARC was long-term, slow reintegration into the community(especially school and work), and my family was involved every day.
Functional family therapy would include the WHOLE family talking to one another.
Being reunited with your family after 6 years is an incredible feat considering you didn't actually TALK to your parents until this reunion!! (Earned TALKS don't count as two-way communication)
How is the family unit restored if you don't talk to each other? Is it because everyone has reached an acceptable level of brainwashing?
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There's always something freaky to be gleaned from one of David's posts. It cannot be stressed enough that this guy was a grown man when he let himself be put into AARC. Apparently, David thinks it's a good outcome for a twenty-two year old man to move back home with his parents after six years away, while partaking in a program for adolescents. And how does AARC reduce out of home placements, when it immediately places children... out of home? And whenever David sings the praises of AARC, one can't help but point out that his step-father brought AARC here from New Jersey. It is his family's eternal shame.
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David is no different than anyone who joins a cultic group. If you are not sure who you are, if you want to be accepted by a group, if you don't know what direction you want to take in life, then why wouldn't you sign yourself in for help and then feel grateful for someone pointing you in a direction and making you a member of the family for having accepted their ways?
Our cases are unusual because we were physically unable to leave and most of us physically forced in, but in most cultic groups people join freely and stay freely, with only disapproval from the group and leader keeping them in.
People like such are often totally blind to the abuses happening within the group, and when revealed to them they can not believe it. In my experiences with Dave, I honestly think that he is one of those people. I don't think he is aware of the severity of the situation and what kind of abuses you and I know of. Dave practiced what he preached, he truly believed that AARC was a path to happiness and he wanted to share that. I never once felt that he was receiving joy for making me feel miserable, like most of the others.
I am not defending his choices - I agree that it's "freaky" that someone would do that and stay committed for so many years, but realistically it's happening to people all over the world every day. There are so many religious, therapeutic, and psychological cults out there, and they are full people there on free will.
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Having read David's book, and having thoroughly perused his late website, I disagree that he was unaware of abuses, and I find him to be particularly disingenuous. He has claimed in posts on this forum that no one is held at AARC against their will, a patent falsehood. In order to establish his credibility as a proponent of AARC, he has described himself as a criminal and has claimed to have served time in prison. He served some week-end time in Calgary Remand, and most of his petty anti-social acts resulted in Conditional Discharges. In his book he attempted to paint a picture of AARC as a very different place from Kids, inferring that belt-looping and other abuses took place in Kids, but not at AARC. Untrue, as anyone left under Janne Holmgren's control can attest. David has attempted to lend credibility to his step-father's decision to bring AARC here as a representative of the Rotary Club, by claiming that his step-father was a psychologist with a PhD. In fact, the old boy had a Doctor of Minstries, with no real knowledge of addictions or child psychology. As a true fear-mongering asshole, David described his chronic use of marijuana as a chemical addiction. He attempted to paint his pot-use as something akin to the truly destructive behaviour of hard drug users like crack-heads or meth addicts. He claims to have made a living selling drugs, yet the same thread he posts that upon entering AARC his parents quit paying for his drugs. In short, in addition to being an alienated Mama's boy who joined a cult, he is a colossal liar whenever he feels the need to support his cult. Lying scumbags are what makes cults like this work. David went so far as to offer his services as a lecturer on the merits of AARC, and at the time that his website Dimwitandmonkeyboy went tits up, he was working on a book of AARC grad stories. This after repeatedly claiming in his anon posts on this forum that he has very little to do with AARC anymore. It's one thing to be taken in by a cult because you have a particular set of vulnerabilities, it is quite another to go on lying about yourself and the cult for over ten years.
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Both functional family therapy and multisystemic family therapy are *outpatient* and require the child to live *at home."
Therefore, AARC cannot practice either. Multisystemic Family Therapy is also only available to kids in the US in the criminal justice system, which would rule out AARC that way as well.
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Multisystemic therapy (MST) is an intensive family-based treatment that addresses the known determinants of serious antisocial behavior in adolescents and their families. As such, MST treats those factors in the youth's environment that are contributing to his or her behavior problems. Such factors might pertain to individual characteristics of the youth (e.g., poor problem solving skills), family relations (e.g., inept discipline), peer relations (e.g., association with deviant peers), and school performance (e.g., academic difficulties). On a highly individualized basis, treatment goals are developed in collaboration with the family, and family strengths are used as levers for therapeutic change. Specific interventions used in MST are based on the best of the empirically validated treatment approaches such as cognitive behavior therapy and the pragmatic family therapies. The primary goals of MST are to reduce rates of antisocial behavior in the adolescent, reduce out-of- home placements, and empower families to resolve future difficulties.
Several programmatic features are crucial to the success of MST. The use of a home-based model of service delivery (i.e., low caseloads, time limited duration of treatment) removes barriers of access to care and provides the high level of intensity needed to successfully treat youths presenting serious clinical problems and their multi-need families. Second, the philosophy of MST holds service providers accountable for engaging the family in treatment and for removing barriers to successful outcomes. Such accountability clearly promotes retention in treatment and attainment of the treatment goals. Third, outcomes are evaluated continuously, and the overriding goal of supervision is to facilitate the clinicians' attempts to attain favorable outcomes. Fourth, MST programs place great emphasis on maintaining treatment integrity, and as such, considerable resources are devoted to therapist training, ongoing clinical consultation, service system consultation, and other types of quality assurance.
This program is for treating antisocial behaviours. AARC claims, in no uncertain terms, that it exists to treat people with a chemical addiction. AARC is not supposed to be a behaviour modification institution. However, since everything about AARC is a fraud, it is at least consistent for them to claim to cure all manner of ailments. Vause is true to his calling as a snake-oil salesman. AARC cures the vapors, grippe, flux, dyspepsia, rickets and hoodlumism. Just ask non-licensed, non-psychologist, Mr. Doctordeanscamartist.
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Amazing they accomplish this during the first phase when the clients don't talk to their parents, and then during the second phase when the clients become oldcomers and are mainly responsible for other newcomer clients.
Third phase the parents seem to be even more detached from the whole situation.
A new host home parent said she's not sure if her third phase child is in school or not.
She also said the clients go to a different recovery home each night to avoid "planned escapes". Why would they need to "plan" if they are all provided a key in case of a fire emergency?
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Amazing they accomplish this during the first phase when the clients don't talk to their parents, and then during the second phase when the clients become oldcomers and are mainly responsible for other newcomer clients.
Third phase the parents seem to be even more detached from the whole situation.
A new host home parent said she's not sure if her third phase child is in school or not.
She also said the clients go to a different recovery home each night to avoid "planned escapes". Why would they need to "plan" if they are all provided a key in case of a fire emergency?
OK, now let me understand this:
If the parent is not consenting to the youth remaining in AARC
And if the youth is being kept in AARC against his will:
does this apply?
Criminal Code of Canada s. 279 (2)
Everyone who, without lawful authority, confines, imprisons or forcibly seizes another person etc
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Not if they are there under a court order and if they are saying they want to stay. Wouldn't be considered "against their will", at that point.
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Not if they are there under a court order and if they are saying they want to stay. Wouldn't be considered "against their will", at that point.
True, but if the re was initially duress, AND if the court order was obtained by fraud or misrepresentation, AND the Judge's husband were to be the treating physician of the unlawfully confined, I suspect there would be a basis for complaints to
a) the Judicial Counsel re the Judge's obvious conflict
b) the College of Physicians and surgeons for improper practice
and possibly to the police, once again, for conspiracy, obstruction of justice, etc, etc.
Question: How many people have been put into AARC by court order? By that same judge?