Fornits
Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => News Items => Topic started by: Hamiltonf on June 19, 2003, 10:45:00 AM
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Recent posts gave me some optimism that I might be able to talk to someone who supports AARC, by way of "private messages". An anonymous poster supporting AARC said "I'll talk", but after several reminders has not followed through. Then we get a post pointing out the obvious contradictions of David Suzuki. This must really have pushed someone's buttons because now the verbal abuse comes.
Really shows the true colours of AARC, doesn't it?
Sort of reminds me of the "gay bashing" Alberta's fundamentalist right wing are indulging in right now.
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I would be willing to talk to you, but will you listen with an open mind or is it a waste of time?
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At the age of 63 and having represented and advised people on both sides of the issue, and having two grown kids who have thoroughly studied the issue, one of whom is pursuing post-graduate studies on addictions, and having dealt with numerous cases of individuals who have been accused of abusing drugs, and having dealt with others who have used drugs with no ill effects, I think I can tell you that I will suspend judgment until I know all the facts. Why else would I want to hear your side of the story?
You have to realize, of course, that David Suzuki long ago lost credibility in the scientific community. He's a journalist, and he certainly isn't a psychologist, so his assessment of AARC is being viewed with great scepticism. Having an open mind doesn't mean having a mind like an open sewer that accepts any crap that you send it ( which is a frequent phenomenon with the media.) You have to be prepared to give me the facts, not just spin, if you are to convince me of anything.
My mother always told me -- "believe half of what you see, a quarter of what you read and only a smidgeon of what you hear and you'll not go wrong"
So--- talk to me.
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I went through AARC a long time ago and I agree back then it wasn't that healthy.The peer staff came from KIDS and unfortunatly had a lot of issues themselves but they did the best they could.Over the years AARC has evolved into a treatment center that isn't about breaking the spirit.AARC has had its growing pains but is always trying to improve.i know who you are lawyer girl and I haven't seen you around AARC in years before you judge it from the early days come check it out now.
Thanks for letting me post
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So why don't you contact me by private message on this forum so that we can properly introduce ourselves to each other and then I can drop into AARC with my daughter and a psychologist and a former social worker, now lawyer, who was instrumental in closing down CASA as an abusive centre a number of years back. All the above who saw "Saving Krystal" perceived it as the same old same old. So we're not going to be easily convinced that the leopard has changed his spots. But as I said, being open minded does not mean you will be able to get us to swallow crap....
After all, what I saw in "saving Krystal" flies directly in the face of what you just said...
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It sounds to me like you just want to argue...whats the point?
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No, we want to visit.
Maybe you can bring us in to show us all the strengths and positive things about AARC that we were unable to discern in "Recovering Krystal"
If you have the courage of your convictions this shouldn't be a problem, should it?
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As one of the first clients who graduated AARC, I invite you to look into the professionals who started the program. Both psychologists who were involved with the program from the beginning are highly respected and acredited. Many professionals, psychologists, medical doctors, social workers, legal professionals etc have toured the facility, sat in on open meetings and talked to clients and staff. Feel free to call the centre. While they are very busy, I am sure the would welcome your call.
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I met Lonny in Kelowna last year. But I wasn't aware of his connection with AARC at the time.
I'm leaving for a holiday and will be away from my desk for a couple of weeks. In the meantime, I am well aware of the Calgary Glitterati who have put their names to supporting AARC -- people like Jim Dinning, for example, or even Edmonton's Nancy Betkowski, whom I know personally. And the place was started up with the blessing (and some funding) of the president of the Alberta College of Physicians and Surgeons.
But when I visit the place -- and I will -- it will be with people that I know will be able to look beneath the surface, will all be equally well qualified perhaps better. They will want to see proper peer reviewed credentials for the people you tout as the instigators, and to date NONE of my research indicates that there is such a thing , and that the methodology of AARC is anything but a derivative of KIDS & Straights. But don't let me discourage you -- I want you to pull out all your big guns and demonstrate to me that AARC has abandoned those roots and methodologies.
Skeptical
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On 2003-07-02 15:12:00, Anonymous wrote:
"As one of the first clients who graduated AARC, I invite you to look into the professionals who started the program. Both psychologists who were involved with the program from the beginning are highly respected and acredited."
OK. So send me a private message with the list of credentials of these people. As far as I know they are not accredited with the Psychologists Association of Alberta -- but then, I could be wrong. Were their degrees purchased over the internet?
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"Were their degrees purchased over the internet?"
Comments like that show you are only interested in an advesarial view. Very professional. In fact both psychologists are accredited, and have highly successful practices. Since your "research" has not provided accurate information, and your comments encouraging contact from happy graduates are condescending, I suspect you won't get too far in getting help. Were you aware that over 140 graduates attended the AARC Gala recently? I (personally), after 10 years of recovery initiated by treatment at AARC am happy, healthy, married, have children, made over $100,000 last year and have just started another business. I suspect you are a lawyer interested in lining your pockets at the expense of a successful institution. Well, I would be the first to testify as to the success of the AARC program.
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You say you'll testify to something but you won't allow someone from the outside to come in and see it for themselves? Won't even talk to them privately about it? Why can't you post the supposed credentials of these people? You can say that AARC is great and that your leaders have credentials all you want but unless you actually SHOW it and PROVE what the credentials ARE it's just a bunch of wasted strokes of the keyboard.
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Comments like that show you are only interested in an advesarial view. Very professional.
I'm glad you appreciate that by training, a lawyer is supposed to be adversarial. That's how we try to get at the truth underlying the spin, imperfect as the method is, "cross-examination" is still the best way of undermining a weak story.
In fact both psychologists are accredited, and have highly successful practices.
So please, tell me who they are, or better still, refer them to me so that I can explore their credentials. What are you trying to hide?
Since your "research" has not provided accurate information, and your comments encouraging contact from happy graduates are condescending, I suspect you won't get too far in getting help. Were you aware that over 140 graduates attended the AARC Gala recently? I (personally), after 10 years of recovery initiated by treatment at AARC am happy, healthy, married, have children, made over $100,000 last year and have just started another business.
I suspect you are a lawyer interested in lining your pockets at the expense of a successful institution. Well, I would be the first to testify as to the success of the AARC program."
If I were interested in "lining my pockets", I certainly wouldn't be concerning myself wanting to examine an institution that has the support of the Calgary establishment.
Interesting, though, I was in Calgary a couple of days ago and just happened to make an enquiry about AARC of an individual with a long standing of public service in the Calgary community. She fairly bristled and said "there's nothing wrong with AARC. They are very successful in what they do. I've seen the statistics"
I know AARC trots out its successes to the media and to the Legislature from time to time. But if anybody can be seen to be "lining their pockets", I rather suspect it's the failed Drug War Industry of which such institutions as AARC and DARE are just a part. The police, psychologists, judges, lawyers, the prison industry and moral entrepreneurs descended from people like Ainslinger and Emily Murphy all have a vested interest in perpetuating myths and moral panics about drugs. Whether it's Mel Sembler or Dean Vause, I would like you to prove to me that the people running these types of institutions are not "lining their pockets" in the manner that you accuse me of doing.
Bye bye
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Virgil just took a $6.5M soaking for what he had done to Lulu Corter and her family!
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?to ... m=10#14785 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?topic=2459&forum=10#14785)
Is Dean next? I think it's really only a matter of time.Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway.
Andrew Tannenbaum
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On top of an AARC name being included in that article the description of KIDS seemed very familiar. In fact it didn't seem any different. Can anyone see any differences other than location?
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CRAZY!!!!!! STOP the maddness please! Hamilt whatever your name is. Come on give the people who went through aarc and are sober and happy a break. if you think its bull ok, but even if it is, Im so much happier. Its not like im trying to make you believe. Just to be happy for people who have gone through enough already and feel so much better about themselves. Is this not right to do? why?
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Please reply to this hamil.. why do you think so negativley to something that helped me? Dont even think of telling me that it didnt because i have facts. grades..friends..family..umm how bout i dont weigh 90 pounds...a job...im not pumped full of drugs. Or should i be i guess thats the healy thing now a days? im not a prostitute. the list goes one. AARC helped me ok. it may have fucked your life. you spend enough time thinking about it. try. letting it go...move on.one thing. if your kid was doing cocaine heroin and extacy and they didnt want your help, you watched them prostitute for money for drugs..what would you do? watch em die?
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Are you saying the options to help an addict are either AARC or death?
How many prostitutes in AARC used their money to support drugs, and how many used it to support pimps? Don't most loose all their money to the pimps, and the pimps give them drugs? Do you think that's the same thing? I don't.
How many of the "prostitutes" actually made up most of those incidents because they were told if they didn't tell more incidents in girls rap they wouldn't progress, and told that they were lying when they said they didn't have any?
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On 2004-08-26 21:15:00, Anonymous wrote:
"Are you saying the options to help an addict are either AARC or death?
How many prostitutes in AARC used their money to support drugs, and how many used it to support pimps? Don't most loose all their money to the pimps, and the pimps give them drugs? Do you think that's the same thing? I don't.
How many of the "prostitutes" actually made up most of those incidents because they were told if they didn't tell more incidents in girls rap they wouldn't progress, and told that they were lying when they said they didn't have any? "
Hammy, you say that being adversarial comes with the line of work you are in... So then employing dishonest and manipulative methodology to take healvily biased opinions from failures must be too. You are hardly objective... To be completely honest, I sincerely think youre in bed with the sites creator/moderator. You arent objective in any way! You would go into aarc, realize you have been duped by the very woman who is giving you *ahem* LIP service, and never return to this site. OR you will come back with bullshit stories of what went on.
Is what I am saying disgusting? Is suggesting that there is a sexual relationship between you and *someone* here inaccurate? NO. You are unlicensed... if you couldnt find DV's credentials anywhere, so I guess I must question your competence...
[ This Message was edited by: BigJoshuaP on 2004-12-12 13:37 ]
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On 2004-12-12 13:31:00, BigJoshuaP wrote:
I sincerely think youre in bed with the sites creator/moderator. You arent objective in any way! You would go into aarc, realize you have been duped by the very woman who is giving you *ahem* LIP service, and never return to this site.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :grin: