Fornits

Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform => The Troubled Teen Industry => Topic started by: Anonymous on November 26, 2007, 10:45:33 PM

Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 26, 2007, 10:45:33 PM
any place to find a list of all the synanon cedu and seed spin offs? Maybe a chart?
thanks
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Che Gookin on November 27, 2007, 01:19:12 AM
Maia tried once and ended up missing about half of them... wierd shit though.. been visiting Benchmark all week and these places are scary business.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 27, 2007, 01:25:38 AM
youre such a sweetheart, che. go you
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anne Bonney on November 27, 2007, 11:15:52 AM
This isn't complete and it mostly deals with Straight, but maybe its a start.


http://www.thestraights.com/flowchart.htm (http://www.thestraights.com/flowchart.htm)


(http://http://www.thestraights.com/the-straights/thestraights1.gif)
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: dishdutyfugitive on November 27, 2007, 01:37:50 PM
Fuck Yes!  Good work. That was long overdue!
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 27, 2007, 01:41:25 PM
Here is the chart mentioned by Gook a few posts up.  It originally appeared in Maia Szalavitz' article "The Cult That Spawned the Tough-Love Teen Industry," in the August 20, 2007 issue of Mother Jones.

relevant LINKS:
To thread on fornits (http://http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?t=22874).
To original article (http://http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2007/09/how_a_cult_spawned_the_tough_love_teen_industry.html).


(http://http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2007/09/how_a_cult_spawned_the_tough_love_teen_industry_630x738.gif)
* Has disavowed extreme and humiliating tactics
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Che Gookin on November 27, 2007, 05:27:00 PM
Dear god.. that chart Anne posted is unbelievable.. and ps.. Psy is to congrat with most of this Benchmark raid.. this is his vision.. his hard work.. I'm just along for the ride and the chance to piss off staffers.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 27, 2007, 05:32:45 PM
Yeah, I'm familiar with an earlier version of it that used to be linked into Fornits' AnonAnon page, but it was in really bad shape and hard to read.  I'm glad to see this more updated and cleaned up version!
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 27, 2007, 06:29:08 PM
there needs to be one like that for cedu
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 28, 2007, 05:31:25 PM
bump
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 28, 2007, 09:59:35 PM
I would like to know how the Seed got placed in direct lineage with Phoenix house in that chart.  That isn't right!
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 28, 2007, 11:30:21 PM
Quote from: ""GregFL""
I would like to know how the Seed got placed in direct lineage with Phoenix house in that chart. That isn't right!

Probably the AA roots.  Phoenix was closely tied in with Synanon when they attempted to "take New York" with the therapeutic community model.  

One early connection Maia missed was Hyde School.  Hyde definitely also has AA roots. Officially begun in 1966, but Gauld possibly tried it earlier at New Hampton in the late 50's, and definitely at Berwick Academy prior to '62.  Others did not share his "vision" so he started his own school.  In the earliest days, students were required to acknowledge a "higher power" and to observe religious services.  He stopped making them go to church, but the lingo is still peppered with AA phrases and terminology.  That and est/business buzz words about "unique potential," "moral compasses," and "destiny."
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Che Gookin on November 28, 2007, 11:33:45 PM
Quote from: ""GregFL""
I would like to know how the Seed got placed in direct lineage with Phoenix house in that chart.  That isn't right!


Try Another Castle reported that an ex-boyfriend of his knew of a Phoenix House that was chock full of ex-synonanite douche bags working as staff members. Can't recollect where I saw this statement but I think it probably is buried on the Synonan forum somewhere.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 29, 2007, 12:26:26 AM
I think I remember a post like that too.  The differences between Synanon and Phoenix House in those early days were less than their similarities.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2007, 07:11:16 AM
Quote from: ""Ursus""
The differences between Synanon and Phoenix House in those early days were less than their similarities.

Wouldn't it be easier to simply say that the two were similar, instead of employing the cumbersome comparative?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2007, 08:14:54 AM
Quote from: ""Guest""
Wouldn't it be easier to simply say that the two were similar, instead of employing the cumbersome comparative?

Wouldn't it be easier if someone got a life?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2007, 09:11:11 AM
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
Wouldn't it be easier to simply say that the two were similar, instead of employing the cumbersome comparative?
Wouldn't it be easier if someone got a life?

Wouldn't it be easier if you fucked off? Idiot.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2007, 09:24:02 AM
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
Wouldn't it be easier to simply say that the two were similar, instead of employing the cumbersome comparative?
Wouldn't it be easier if someone got a life?
Wouldn't it be easier if you fucked off? Idiot.

 :rofl: .  . .  :rofl:  :rofl:
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2007, 09:38:04 AM
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
Wouldn't it be easier to simply say that the two were similar, instead of employing the cumbersome comparative?
Wouldn't it be easier if someone got a life?

Suck a dick.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 29, 2007, 09:49:51 AM
Can we please get back on topic and discuss what an infernally deluded numbskull spirit23 is?  :rofl:
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 29, 2007, 05:28:39 PM
Quote from: ""Che Gookin""
Quote from: ""GregFL""
I would like to know how the Seed got placed in direct lineage with Phoenix house in that chart.  That isn't right!

Try Another Castle reported that an ex-boyfriend of his knew of a Phoenix House that was chock full of ex-synonanite douche bags working as staff members. Can't recollect where I saw this statement but I think it probably is buried on the Synonan forum somewhere.


the problem is the connection has not been made.  No one *knows*, at least no one is talking, about where Art Barker acquired the synanon techniques.  therefore, the entire seed/straight/kids/SAFE/et al lineage remains directly unconnected to the synanon and synanon spinoffs.

I say directly because it is obvious some of the synanon techniques showed up at the seed and then at the seed spinoffs (straight et al). So, indirectly..yes we know they were acquired. *HOW* is the missing link.

 The chart shows a direct connection which is speculative at best, misleading at worst.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: dishdutyfugitive on November 29, 2007, 05:54:09 PM
So you're basically asking for evidence of a tangible paper trail right?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: dishdutyfugitive on November 29, 2007, 06:03:49 PM
It ultimately goes back to religious institutions and the omnipresent mouth-breathers that wake up every day to fuck with others and control them. They were here on day 1 and will ultimately drive the human race to extinction.


http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/11/29/ ... tahawy.php (http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/11/29/opinion/edeltahawy.php)

Look no further than the case of a 19-year-old Saudi woman who was gang-raped last year.
Despite being abducted and raped by seven men, a court in Saudi Arabia sentenced her to 90 lashes because she was in a car with an unrelated man before she was abducted.

Saudi Arabia's ultra-orthodox interpretation of Islamic law preaches a strict segregation of the sexes.

The young woman had the temerity to appeal - and publicize her story in the media. And so, earlier this month, the court increased her punishment to 200 lashes and six months in jail. Her lawyer, a prominent human rights defender, was suspended and faces a disciplinary hearing.


....I got nothing against Islam (versus any other religion), or muslim folk as individuals but fuckinga those countries make south park look like an afternoon spent with the local librarian. And yes, I know the US is as corrupt and fucked up as the next guy.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: dishdutyfugitive on November 29, 2007, 07:05:58 PM
double post
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 29, 2007, 10:09:08 PM
Quote from: ""dishdutyfugitive""
So you're basically asking for evidence of a tangible paper trail right?




Paper trail, a witness that knows where Art Barker received his Synanon training, or any other credible evidence linking Art back to the synanon. Art Claimed in the press that he had 13 years working with juveniles and alcoholics..but no one will say where.  Given Artie's penchant for bullshit and self promotion no one even knows if it was true.  

The hard connection from the synanon to the Seed, and then to the Seed spinoffs like Straight, Inc. has NEVER been made.  We from the early days of this 'movement' have tried but the connection is still only circumstantial.

I personally have tried. I have researched, interviewed former staff, disquised myself as a former syanonite and infiltrated their web forum and posed the question and no one remembers Art.

So if Art got direct synanon training I believe it was in a Syanonon spinoff.  There are other theories that Ginger and I have kicked around. One of them that seems credible is this:

When Art started getting federal funding the person in charge of the federal grant, Robert Dupont, had a connection back to the synanon.  Also, around this time the Seed drastically changed into a lock down synanon style 'rehab'.  When Art started getting his funding pulled, the seed started morphing back into the less harsh but  always wacky personality cult.  The harsh days of the Seed lasted roughly from 1972 to 1977, with the real harsh times being 72,73,74...interestingly the exact years of the involvement with Dupont.  In later years under oath Dupont said that "it all started at the synanon". This is intriquing, No?

The theory basically developed by Ginger and I bantering around ideas is that Dupont, upon Granting Art Barker funds, also sent some Synonite staff member to help him 'develop' his program. Before this the Seed was located in a house, and people came and went as they pleased. Imagine that!  

 I was theres  in the early days (1973) after the voluntary seed during its heyday   and remember some older, harsher staffers that didn't seem to have come up thru the ranks like all the other staff members. I distincly remember one of them with a new york accent telling us about some other place that 'this all came from' and that we 'had no idea'. This was in a day rap during my first 14 days, but I can't remember the name of the place as this was Some 35 years ago.

So, that is the Theory. There are no hard facts.  That chart needs to be, at least, show a broken line down to the Seed along with a notation.  The Seed, to the best of my knowledge was not decended from Phoenix house.  Of course, it is possible that Art was connected to PH, but this is unsubstantiated and to date I have not even seen anybody claim it to be even rumoured to be true.

hope this helps or in some way is interesting to whomever had to drudge thru it.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: dishdutyfugitive on November 30, 2007, 12:44:13 AM
I see your point. Thank you for the synopsis.

Reading you last post made me rember that Penn Sanger graduated from RMA in 1988/9 when I was there. He was a DuPont child. He was a cool guy and I don't like half-hartedly dragging people through the mud but dupont irony is what it is.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: try another castle on November 30, 2007, 03:54:52 AM
Quote from: ""GregFL""
Quote from: ""Che Gookin""
Quote from: ""GregFL""
I would like to know how the Seed got placed in direct lineage with Phoenix house in that chart.  That isn't right!

Try Another Castle reported that an ex-boyfriend of his knew of a Phoenix House that was chock full of ex-synonanite douche bags working as staff members. Can't recollect where I saw this statement but I think it probably is buried on the Synonan forum somewhere.

the problem is the connection has not been made.  No one *knows*, at least no one is talking, about where Art Barker acquired the synanon techniques.  therefore, the entire seed/straight/kids/SAFE/et al lineage remains directly unconnected to the synanon and synanon spinoffs.

I say directly because it is obvious some of the synanon techniques showed up at the seed and then at the seed spinoffs (straight et al). So, indirectly..yes we know they were acquired. *HOW* is the missing link.

 The chart shows a direct connection which is speculative at best, misleading at worst.



Nope, he never worked at phoenix, but he did interview when he moved up to new york. (not the brightest bulb) What he worked at was walden house in san francisco, another synanon started rehab. It even says it on George Farnsworth's site on the front page. www.synanon.org (http://www.synanon.org). Both places came right out of there, and he said that the staff there talked about synanon all the time.




I remember Penn. He supported on my wilderness challenge.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: ABOUT TO SNAP on November 30, 2007, 09:32:46 AM
you can't forget about all those motherfuckers at the beginning. tim brace working for the naval intell in annapolis he used to talk about all the time? why? why would he always talk about his wierd times before meeting mel wasserman and going to CEDU?
and then there were the spinoffs. cedu needs it's own fucked up family tree because once everyone saw how much money they could make, fuckit i'll start my own school MICHAEL ALLGOOD and call it CASCADE. then he hired some people who probabnly went off and did spring creek in montana and all those other early places. there were only like four. now there are hundreds in that state alone, as far as i think they are all cedu people clone sheep phuckers.
and the wilderness people there were that went and did the wilderness and or 3escort stuff. those people were around in the CEDU early days too. they had there other places like SORENSON's Ranch L. jay Mitchell and that DENNIS dude who went and started SUWS, and they had deaths of kids in their first year! no one will be able to name all the names of the pigfuckers theat went and started all those places. they spread like cancer, ruining families and trust funds as they go.

yeah. the public braiwashing world of florida and NANCY all lies see her birth certificate REAGAN and the private mind controlling teen killing parent scamming moneymakers were connected only by political contributions and clout.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Troubled Turd on November 30, 2007, 10:11:03 AM
I hate programs... they're a scam, like Niles said.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 30, 2007, 10:41:43 AM
Quote from: ""try another castle""
Quote from: ""GregFL""
Quote from: ""Che Gookin""
Quote from: ""GregFL""
I would like to know how the Seed got placed in direct lineage with Phoenix house in that chart.  That isn't right!

Try Another Castle reported that an ex-boyfriend of his knew of a Phoenix House that was chock full of ex-synonanite douche bags working as staff members. Can't recollect where I saw this statement but I think it probably is buried on the Synonan forum somewhere.

the problem is the connection has not been made.  No one *knows*, at least no one is talking, about where Art Barker acquired the synanon techniques.  therefore, the entire seed/straight/kids/SAFE/et al lineage remains directly unconnected to the synanon and synanon spinoffs.

I say directly because it is obvious some of the synanon techniques showed up at the seed and then at the seed spinoffs (straight et al). So, indirectly..yes we know they were acquired. *HOW* is the missing link.

 The chart shows a direct connection which is speculative at best, misleading at worst.


Nope, he never worked at phoenix, but he did interview when he moved up to new york. (not the brightest bulb) What he worked at was walden house in san francisco, another synanon started rehab. It even says it on George Farnsworth's site on the front page. www.synanon.org (http://www.synanon.org). Both places came right out of there, and he said that the staff there talked about synanon all the time.

.


We KNOW Cedu and Phoenix house have direct linkage to Synanon.  That is not in dispute.  

What I have been trying to do unsuccessfully for 7 years is connect Art Barker to the Syananon or a synanon spinoff and I have been unable to do so.

Who are you saying worked at Walden house?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 30, 2007, 12:29:20 PM
Just prior to Florida, Art came from Brooklyn, if I am not mistaken, and was heavily into the AA scene there...  Maybe he knew Father O'Brien?  That would be a trip.

As far as Synanon infiltrating the NYC area, I think Daytop (1963?) was the first spinoff.  This was originally the brainchild of Monsignor William O'Brien (from Brooklyn).  He allegedly got some inspiration from the Connecticut outpost of Synanon.  He and New York psychiatrist Dan Casriel recruited Deitch from Synanon to help get it off the ground a few years in.  See also this post for some insight, written by one of O'Brien's relatives:
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=285188#285188 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?p=285188#285188)  

As the Vietnam War progressed, there was a lot more heroin floating around and NYC got involved with the addiction treatment scene (Mayor Lindsay).  Both Odyssey House and Phoenix House sprung up at around the same time (1967), but I am guessing that maybe Odyssey was first.  Odyssey House began as a 1966 pilot program/research project at some local hospital, I think.  Phoenix was begun as a actual "house," i.e., 6 addicts living together to make it work.

See also this thread re. David Deitch.  He has links to Synanon (as an addict and as an administrator), Daytop (co-founder?), and Phoenix House (Chief Clinical Officer, in the 80s, I think).
http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=23440 (http://fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=23440)
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 30, 2007, 01:53:11 PM
well yes, we (Wes, ginger and I) long speculated that Art MAY have been involved with Daytop.  This is another one of the 'theories' I alluded to in an earlier post that we have held about just where the hell Art lurned himself those lock em up, break em down and yell at em modalities

Again, this is just another theory until someone comes forward and makes the hard connection. To this very moment in the history of the internet expose' of the program, the Seed/Straight et al connection to the synanon still remains speculation and an outright mystery. A mystery I might add, that I have been unable to solve.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 30, 2007, 01:53:55 PM
DAYTOP HISTORY (http://http://www.daytop.org/history.html)

On July 30, 1957, Father William B. O'Brien, a young parish priest from Tuckahoe, NY on duty at St. Patrick's Cathedral, was fatefully drawn into the seamy world of drug abuse and crime. The mother of a gang member frantically came to the priest for help when her son, along with seven others, was accused of the murder of a rival gang leader. Father O'Brien quickly realized that the common denominator in this, and most other street crime, was drugs. Deeper inquiry revealed an appalling scarcity of programs treating substance abuse with any measure of success.

In the 1950's, the public attitude was "once an addict, always an addict." Neither jail nor hospital stays seemed to make a bit of difference to an addicted person. Father O'Brien started researching other means of treating addiction. One of the places he looked at was Synanon. In 1958, Charles Dederich, himself a recovering alcoholic, started Synanon as a community of recovering people. This system was based on group encounters and addicts confronting each other, demanding self-revelation and responsibility.

Concurrent with Father O'Brien's search, a group of learned men from the Brooklyn Court system was on a similar quest. Dr. Alexander Bassin, Chief Researcher for the Kings County Supreme Court Probation Department, was perturbed by the disheartening results of turnstile sentences given to addicts. Dr. Bassin's strength of purpose spurred his boss, Joseph Shelly; criminologist Herbert A. Block; and Dr. Dan Casriel, a consulting psychiatrist with the Brooklyn Court, to a nationwide search for an effective response to the addicts who showed up in their courtrooms. They also saw possibilities in Synanon.

By a fortuitous turn of fate, Father O'Brien and Dr. Casriel chose the same day to visit the Synanon intake center in Westport, Connecticut. What they saw there convinced them that they were on the right track.

Dr. Bassin's team from the Brooklyn Court, based on their findings, applied for and were granted $390,00 from the National Institute of Mental Health on April 15, 1963. This grant led to the founding of Daytop Lodge at Butler Manor, Staten Island. This first rehabilitation facility was designed for 22 male probationers from the Brooklyn corrections system.

The basics of the treatment program were group therapy sessions, role modeling, job assignments and a hierarchy of peers. As residents progressed, they received more responsible duties, and earned more privileges. Those coming after them could see that others like themselves were gaining respect, and that life without drugs was possible. These basic elements have remained, as the therapeutic community evolved to meet the changing populations and needs of the clients.

The early days of Daytop Lodge were stormy with shifting leadership, which culminated in its absorption into Daytop Village, Inc. in October 1964 at Prince's Bay, Staten Island. The Staten Island community was adamantly against Daytop's presence in their neighborhood, and hundreds of residents picketed, and managed to block funding for the new agency for many months.

By now Daytop Village was a full-fledged therapeutic community, whose residents included men and women, arrestees as well as voluntary referrals. As Daytop's success in drug treatment became known, the need for treatment centers grew. Father O'Brien and his Board of Directors began to look at Sullivan County in the Catskill Mountains of New York State for more space. By moving treatment centers out of the city, they also would remove the residents from the temptations of the city. The first such residential facility was Daytop Swan Lake, which opened in June 1966.

In the next couple of years it became evident that there was a problem with more casual drug users, as well as hard-core addicts. In response, Daytop developed its first outpatient center. This facility (or outreach), located in Mount Vernon in Westchester County, New York, opened in 1968 and served residents of the community.

In the late 1960's conflict over the Vietnam war and drug use as rebellion surged throughout the youth population of the country. There was more and more need for rehabilitation programs. Daytop expanded with more residential facilities, and more outpatient centers throughout the New York Area.

As each center opened, there was initial community opposition, but as Daytop proved to be a good neighbor, this attitude changed. Still political resistance continued, sometimes opposing and delaying funding. In 1972 Daytop was completing negotiations for the building that is now Daytop World Headquarters, and funds weren't available for the down payment. Daytop turned to its Family Association, which is an organization of concerned family members of Daytop clients and graduates. Through an incredible effort, they raised the $100,000 needed for that down payment in less than thirty days!

Community support has come and gone and come again. The profile of our clients has changed over the years. The numbers of adolescents using drugs keeps going up, and their ages keep going down. Parents recognize that early treatment can save much pain and trouble later, and so these adolescents are getting help sooner. Employers recognize that trouble on the job may be a sign of substance abuse, and refer their employees to programs for help. Medical, educational and other services have been added to treatment programs to meet the needs of new populations. But Daytop has kept the basic tools that proved successful so many years ago and adapted them to today's changing population. And Father, now Monsignor, O'Brien, still passionately presides over this miracle of amazing change and growth flourishing at our treatment centers.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 30, 2007, 01:59:15 PM
Quote
Dr. Bassin's team from the Brooklyn Court, based on their findings, applied for and were granted $390,00 from the National Institute of Mental Health on April 15, 1963. This grant led to the founding of Daytop Lodge at Butler Manor, Staten Island. This first rehabilitation facility was designed for 22 male probationers from the Brooklyn corrections system.

The basics of the treatment program were group therapy sessions, role modeling, job assignments and a hierarchy of peers. As residents progressed, they received more responsible duties, and earned more privileges. Those coming after them could see that others like themselves were gaining respect, and that life without drugs was possible. These basic elements have remained, as the therapeutic community evolved to meet the changing populations and needs of the clients.


Did Art perchance spend some time in the Brooklyn corrections system?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 30, 2007, 05:00:25 PM
If he did it didn't show up on his list of 'accomlishments'.

I sure would like to put this piece of the puzzle together as  it has been a minor annoyance of mine for years.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 30, 2007, 05:00:44 PM
If he did it didn't show up on his list of 'accomlishments'.

I sure would like to put this piece of the puzzle together as  it has been a minor annoyance of mine for years.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Che Gookin on November 30, 2007, 05:09:46 PM
I can't imagine Art putting down he is a proud alumni of The Brooklyn Correctional System on his resume.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on November 30, 2007, 05:38:15 PM
Those "probationers from the Brooklyn corrections system," which were used as the initial test cases at Daytop, would probably be folks in whose shoes Art probably walked at some point or another, whether or not he was in that particular set of 22 pairs.

From what I have read of what must pass for a CV in the addictions treatment field in those days, and from the strikingly different versions that I have encountered of Art Baker's, I find it extremely plausible that a stint in the Brooklyn lockups for copious alcohol consumption might well have occurred at some point.  He was a bit of a rabble rouser in those days, is my impression...
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Che Gookin on November 30, 2007, 05:43:44 PM
I have no doubts that doing time is nearly a prerequisite for being a D/A counselor back then. They still consider it a going concern at Benchmark where god knows how many of the staff have done time.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on November 30, 2007, 10:04:09 PM
There are alot of great sites about straight and it's offshoots, but many fewer about CEDU. i wonder if that is becasue cedu was more damaging, in that people are more intimidated and stay confused about reality longer. There are still ceduites around, but you rarely see a pro striaghter.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on November 30, 2007, 11:30:25 PM
Quote from: ""Guest""
There are alot of great sites about straight and it's offshoots, but many fewer about CEDU. i wonder if that is becasue cedu was more damaging, in that people are more intimidated and stay confused about reality longer. There are still ceduites around, but you rarely see a pro striaghter.


You are wrong.  Pro seed/straight people are in existence. there are people who think all sorts of kooky things were good for them,


As bad as cedu was, I dont think the modality was nearly as harsh as being locked in a hot warehouse under guard,in florida from 10 to 10, with the temperature hovering over 100 degrees and being denied basic food,sleep, bathroom privelidges and being subjected to the humiliation of the game..seed style.  

There is/was a pro straight website in existence that pre dated fornits.  Go look on the seed discussion forum and you will see pro seed posts from the past. You can also find them archived from the very beginning on the straight site.

The reason the pro seed/straight people don't post is that they either get shouted down on the straight forum, or get the debate kicked out of them on the seed forum.   Don't think they don't read these forums, however...they do.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on December 01, 2007, 12:03:16 AM
I think to some degree it also depends on the person.  Some people are more vulnerable to being brainwashed, and the sheer physicality of conditions in some of these shitpits makes it easier to recognize them for what they are.  Sometimes the more subtler forms of subterfuge are harder to tease out, and hence recover from.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2007, 02:20:36 AM
Quote from: ""Ursus""
I think to some degree it also depends on the person.  Some people are more vulnerable to being brainwashed, and the sheer physicality of conditions in some of these shitpits makes it easier to recognize them for what they are.  Sometimes the more subtler forms of subterfuge are harder to tease out, and hence recover from.


Cedu is pretty bad, you don't get as many survivors talking expilclicitly, i find, but mel wassmer forcing a black kid to wash his feet in group while calling hin nigger.....thats indicitive of level 10 mind fuckery, and there wasnt regular sleep either.

What makes cedu so pernicious is that the brainwashing is not specific to drugs, it's tailored to each specific person. Each person has done something "wrong" in their lives, or had something painful happen and that something is used as prima ficiie- the "sickness".
Long term, it's harder to beleive you were addicted to a drug you never tried, and was saved from it, than you were a self destructively irresponsible teen becasue you cut class. That's a less obvious absurdity, and therefore, more confusing.

Also, being in an entirely resedentaly enviorment, instead of in private homes...never attending an outside school, no mattter how far along in the program you were...Mark S wrote about this in his peice about his seed experience regarding why today's treatment models can be more damaging, which i agree with. Major braindamage----me. Suicide-----my beloved. Prison-------my darling boy.............shhh these truths are too dark to speak aloud.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 01, 2007, 09:01:39 AM
did you go to cedu or rma?
you explain well.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on December 01, 2007, 11:09:37 AM
Quote from: ""Guest""
What makes cedu so pernicious is that the brainwashing is not specific to drugs, it's tailored to each specific person. Each person has done something "wrong" in their lives, or had something painful happen and that something is used as prima ficiie- the "sickness".

Probably something along the lines of what Joe Gauld is really talking about when he brings up "unique potential," ha ha!!  It was a constant hell of guilt and self-hatred that never ended.

On another note, I've always wondered at CEDU's copious usage of Kahlil Gibran's material, i.e., where does it come from?  Gauld also makes ample reference to Gibran: his quotes are sprinkled throughout his books, the Hyde website, even their Biggest Job materials and website.  Sometime in the last year, I transcribed something that Gauld wrote onto the Hyde forum here and it contained a Gibran quote.  One of the more recent students objected; she just couldn't stand to hear Gibran misused any more...

After I left (many years ago), I remember I felt I should really read this material for my own good -- in my attempts to become a better person -- and actually obtained Gibran's The Prophet with the full intention of doing so.  I think I might have made it through two pages.  Couldn't stomach any more than that.  That copy disappeared during one move or another and I actually went to the trouble of getting yet another copy.  Same problem.  As recently as this past summer I was still attempting to flog myself into doing this.  What's the matter with me?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 02, 2007, 08:17:43 PM
Quote from: ""Guest""
did you go to cedu or rma?
you explain well.


if you can log in, i'll pm that to you. I am paranoid

Is there a paper trail linking Mel to synanon? Something irrefutable?

thank you
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on December 02, 2007, 10:50:29 PM
Quote from: ""Guest""
Quote from: ""Guest""
did you go to cedu or rma?
you explain well.

if you can log in, i'll pm that to you. I am paranoid

Is there a paper trail linking Mel to synanon? Something irrefutable?

thank you


http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/p ... 5144.shtml (http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/publish/article_5144.shtml)

this is right from the horse's ass, er..mouth.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: GregFL on December 02, 2007, 11:37:56 PM
Quote from: ""Guest""

What makes cedu so pernicious is that the brainwashing is not specific to drugs, it's tailored to each specific person. Each person has done something "wrong" in their lives, or had something painful happen and that something is used as prima ficiie- the "sickness".
Long term, it's harder to beleive you were addicted to a drug you never tried, and was saved from it, than you were a self destructively irresponsible teen becasue you cut class. That's a less obvious absurdity, and therefore, more confusing.

.


CEDU and the Seed/Straight shared more in common than you may think. The Seed also went for you darkest secrets and then attacked you at that level. It wasn't all about drugs even tho that was the main focus.  the basic techniques were the same...rip you up, break you down to nothing and then replace the void with Seedling doctrine.

It was not uncommon to stand up a 13 year old girl in a group of almost 1000 kids and have people take turns screaming at her, telling her they knew her "on the streets" and she was a big joke, not pretty, ackward, ugly..freckeled..skinny...fat..whatever.. Then guys would scream at her that they would have screwed her and laughed at her and  throw her out/ girls would say  she was so lame she couldn't even fuck a coke bottle. This wouldn't stop until she was reduced to sobbing.  Then it was off to girls/boys rap, where they seperated us and made us confess our sexual secrets, only to be used against us later. I will never forget one boy, about 16, who confessed in boys rap to having oral sex with a neighbor boy.  Later, they stood him up in group and made him recant the story but now in front of the girls, then all the kids hands shot up and the staffer called on them one at a time to rip him apart for what seemed forever, took turns just shredding him.  The next day he was gone and never spoke of again.  That was the way of the seed, once someone left they were never to be spoken of again, and when it was time to destroy someone's ego/self worth/and humilate him/her, if you didn't not only participate but participate in an enthusiastic and convincing manner, you were in more trouble then the kid being focused on.  It wasn't unusual if you failed in your endeavor tthat they would  let the original kid sit down and then they would focus on you.  In this manner they always kept you off guard, suspicious, scared, uncertain...and most especially, unwilling to let your brain be filled with your thoughts...it had to contain Seed dogma at all times.  They also had everyone convinced that the Seed made you 'aware' and that staffers and Art barker  were so aware they could read your minds.  It was in a word, terrifying.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on December 03, 2007, 03:02:50 AM
If you don't mind, Greg, I'm going to copy out that Bill Lane link.  It has been my experience over time,  that a lot of these pieces have a way of disappearing.  When Bill Lane finally retires, that'll be the last of that link...


BILL LANE (http://http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/publish/article_5144.shtml)
Interviews
Posted: Jun 24, 2005

(http://http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/uploads/lanebill050518-web.jpg)
Bill Lane visits Woodbury Office.

BIGGER THAN LIFE
A personal journey into the history of CEDU

By: Kathy Nussberger

Great sense of humor and quick wit describes the fun side of Bill Lane, but you can't help but feel the deep dedication and loyalty Bill has for the families and students he served for the 31 years he worked with the CEDU Family of Services. Today, he continues to serve those families with his new company, Bill Lane & Associates. Bill explained how he met and became friends with CEDU's founder, Mel Wasserman, several years before the first program began.

"I met Mel in San Francisco several years before he started CEDU, while I was working for Synanon, a drug rehabilitation center," Bill said. "I remember talking with him about his ideas and thought he might have a better way of working with teens and younger students. But as the years passed, we went our separate ways with Mel moving to Palm Springs, and I never really thought much more about it, until I began hearing about a new non-profit organization that had opened a school in Running Springs, CA."

According to Bill, Mel started the first program in about 1966, but it was several years after that when Mel approached him about working for CEDU.

"A few years after the program opened, I started reading and hearing about it, and we began communicating back and forth, but I was pretty content at Synanon, which was how I became involved in working with all ages, from teen to adult," said Bill. "However, when Mel asked me to come down and take a look at CEDU, which at the time consisted of a very small school in Running Springs and an office in Los Angeles, I agreed and was pretty excited about what I saw at the program. He offered me a job and I started working for Mel in January 1974, 'I was only nine at the time,' he joked."

In the early days of his work with CEDU, Bill's expertise was in public relations/ fundraising and he traveled all over the country to locate whatever the program needed.

"At that time, they had very few private pay, it was mostly adjudicated kids, so I used to work very closely with the families who donated money to the school," he said. "But then I began traveling a lot when we needed funding for building projects. If we needed materials, I would move to Oregon for a month and go to every saw mill and lumber yard in the state with a list, and based on that list, I would get them to donate the materials we needed. After that I would contact trucking companies to get them to donate their services for picking up and hauling the materials to the school. That's how we helped to fund the organization. If we needed beef, I went to Texas for a month and visited every cattle yard to "get the beef."

As time went on, Bill moved into admissions and every other aspect of the organization, culminating in his becoming president of CEDU High and Middle Schools, director of Hilltop and finally, his ultimate love, director of the transport service CEDU began providing.

"I fell into what has become a passion for me when Mel suggested starting a transport service, I love what we do and the services we have to offer the families, educational consultants, psychiatrists, etc. that I work with throughout the country," Bill explained. "Mel approached me about 12-years-ago with the idea because it was evident that we were getting a lot of students who required transport services. We felt we could do a good job of transporting them ourselves, and we could better prepare the students in their understanding of the schools they were coming too. Whenever Mel was considering a new venture, he would say to me, 'Bill, look into this, see if it is feasible and if it will work.' The transport service was a very successful venture."

Bill explained how escorting students to a school is often a very scary situation for both the parents and students, so he quickly addresses the anger and fear and defuses it by describing the program and explaining what the child may expect upon arrival at the school.

"Although the company name is different today, I still have the same employees and implement the same beliefs as I did when CEDU was running the service," he said. "Everyone who works for me is very well trained with CPR and First Aid certifications, and all employees must pass both a federal and state background check to escort a student. I employ a lot of people up here in North Idaho, and when CEDU closed down in March, I immediately incorporated under Bill Lane & Associates Inc., and we continued with business as usual."

Bill said he also fell into an entire industry that he truly loves, "quite frankly, going to work for CEDU in the 70's was a godsend to me because it was new, the only place available at that time and it was a major contributor in spearheading today's movement in the struggling teens industry. A lot of the folks who work in the industry today also worked for CEDU. It's really been a great experience; I wanted to continue doing it even after CEDU closed because working with students and parents is wonderful."

When the IECA first started over 20 years ago, Bill said he was one of the first people to bring CEDU to the attention of the educational consultants who were members of the organization.

"Personally, I believe Mel would be devastated by the closure of the CEDU schools," Bill said. "I think what's taken place is unconscionable; Mel as the inspirational, big man and visionary, was a very dynamic guy. He knew what he wanted and what he had to do to get it. He was a tough guy to work for on the one hand, but was also the fairest person I knew and treated his employees very well, which is why he had one of the biggest programs in the industry."

Bill explained that when Mel sold CEDU to the Brown Schools, the company was at its peak in the market. All the schools were full and everything was going great. "However, after the first and second year the company was owned by Brown Schools, the staff turnover at the highest levels was unbelievable. There was no one left with any time or stability in the company, and the organization went backwards. Mel saw what was happening, and he would say, 'well, we don't own it any more,' but you could tell he was very disappointed."

The day of the infamous phone call announcing the CEDU closures caught everyone off guard, including Bill who said he was in the middle of transporting a student to the Ascent program in North Idaho when he was told they couldn't take the boy. "I spent time with Mel on his 70th birthday, which was shortly before he died, and I can say that what was done to the parents, students, staff and consultants that day, probably made him turn over in his grave. To not give any notice to anyone, especially the parents, students and staff was unconscionable. The legacy is wounded, but lives on in the industry. The family can't believe what happened to the CEDU name; they are stunned that it progressed to that point because Mel put his heart and soul into that company."
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 03, 2007, 05:03:06 AM
thank you ursus
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 03, 2007, 09:42:35 AM
Vomit.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 05, 2007, 07:29:54 PM
for what sayin thanks?

it's good to have that self admission about wassermans past at the ready.

How many cults went into cedu?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on December 05, 2007, 09:34:42 PM
Quote from: ""Guest""
it's good to have that self admission about wassermans past at the ready.

How many cults went into cedu?

My thoughts exactly, Anon.  The more we understand about how and why these places evolved, the better equipped we are to unravel the damage they did to us.  Hopefully also to lessen the impact they have on others in the future.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Nihilanthic on December 05, 2007, 10:38:28 PM
Well that's what fornits is for right now.

Exposing and stopping these damned programs.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on December 16, 2007, 12:03:53 PM
Wee update on Bill Lane, i.e., he's still doing what he's been doing of late...  For relevance, please see previous post. (http://http://wwf.fornits.com/viewtopic.php?p=298817#298817)  From the StrugglingTurds website:

==========================================

BILL LANE STOPS BY FOR A VISIT (http://http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/publish/SnHOct07_071121.shtml)
(http://http://www.strugglingteens.com/artman/uploads/billlane_071014web.jpg)

(October 14, 2007) Bill Lane, Founder/ President of Bill Lane & Associates (http://http://www.billlaneandassociates.com/), San Diego, CA, 858-488-5319, stopped by to pick up his T-Shirt and get his picture taken by the Woodbury Sign while in town visiting.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 16, 2007, 03:03:46 PM
who is the evil bill lane?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 16, 2007, 03:10:35 PM
oops, just clicked the link. nevermind
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 18, 2007, 11:15:51 AM
will the pigfucking mindgames of cedu that ruins kids' lives never end? I ask again.
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 19, 2007, 02:13:03 AM
Quote from: ""Guest""
will the pigfucking mindgames of cedu that ruins kids' lives never end? I ask again.


not for awhile
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 19, 2007, 03:47:21 AM
pesoanlly, i want to kill woodbery
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Anonymous on December 22, 2007, 05:00:07 PM
What i don't understand is how a man, who openly got his start in the industry by working for cedu- which has been officially catagorized as a cult by Singer, can get away with stting himself up as a "educational consultant" sening kids to the same sort of organizations as cedu, which was shut down for organized torture.

How are the lawsuits against cedu going?

How did they end?
Title: synanon cedu and the seed
Post by: Ursus on December 22, 2007, 06:25:20 PM
Quote from: ""Guest""
What i don't understand is how a man, who openly got his start in the industry by working for cedu- which has been officially catagorized as a cult by Singer, can get away with stting himself up as a "educational consultant" sening kids to the same sort of organizations as cedu, which was shut down for organized torture.

How are the lawsuits against cedu going?

How did they end?

Mmm, perhaps Lon Woodbury's working on the Nixon-For-President campaign in 1968 might shed some insight...  

Coming just after the "Summer of Love" (1967), with the assassinations of Martin Luther King, Jr. and Robert F. Kennedy having already occurred earlier in the year, not to mention the ongoing build up of anti-Vietnam War protestations, the scene at the 1968 Democratic National Convention in Chicago was one hell of a fracas, galvanizing many on one side or the other of the liberal/conservative divide.

(http://http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/7/71/Chicago8.jpg/200px-Chicago8.jpg)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Seven (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Seven)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Democ ... Convention (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Democratic_National_Convention)
http://www.stg.brown.edu/projects/1968/ ... eline.html (http://www.stg.brown.edu/projects/1968/reference/timeline.html)
http://www-cgi.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1996 ... e/9609/06/ (http://www-cgi.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1996/analysis/back.time/9609/06/)[/list]