Author Topic: 13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program  (Read 6562 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #30 on: November 22, 2005, 08:00:00 AM »
I know one of the counselors well and know that he would never intentionally harm a child, even one that hit his own grandmother and threatened her with a knife. I agree, the camp should shut down, but those in charge of the camp should face charges as well. This is just like the government trying to get away with torturing prisoners in camps - only those who are following orders get in trouble and when attention is drawn their way, in this unfortuate case when the young boy died, they (the authorities) act like they didn't know what was going on.

I am against the death penalty and your comment about the counselors rotting in hell disturbs me. Vindication should come from making the situation right - cursing those who are responsibe, even inadvertently and involuntarily, will not make the situation better. Keep working to shut down the camp and work to better our communities so children have better role models and learn how to act in society and we won't need places like this.

I hope that justice is granted, not that the conselors get what they "deserve."
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Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #31 on: November 22, 2005, 09:02:00 AM »
ummm...maybe its just me but I'm sitting here wondering why 6 adults are needed to restrain a 13 yo boy? I'm sure they weren't taught that when they received their training. :???:
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Offline CCM girl 1989

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #32 on: November 22, 2005, 12:56:00 PM »
Poor kid, I know how they feel. When I was 15, and at one of these schools in Provo, Utah I was restrained by 5 women for refusing to take a time out. A time out there was taking a seat, and facing the wall sometimes for hours on end while all the kids, and staffed pretended you were not there. It doesn't sound that bad does it? What is bad about it, was that these staff members had control issues, and it made them feel good to take out their shit out on us! Anytime I did the slightest thing wrong, or expressed my feelings about something it resulted in a time out. I was a ticking time bomb, waiting to explode. I was being forced to stuff my feelings in, and just do what your told. After 3 years of this, when it was only supposed to be a year I started becoming totally outta control. I think it actually felt better, even though I had no privelages whatsover, to fight the staff, to tell them off, not to be afraid to defend myself if another girl started a fight with me, look kids in these places get bored very quickly, and start teasing eachother relentlessly. Being 12 years old when I was sent there, it really sucked. Everybody picked on me for atleast the first 2 years really bad! We were cruel to one another. I remember being 15, and my friends, and I teased this girl, she threatened suicide all the time, she was drinking nail polish remover, hair spray, I think she even broke a mirror, and carved on herself? Anyway, on our way back from breakfast as we decented down the hill we were still teasing her, she broke away from us all, climbed a radio tower, and jumped from a platform about 40 feet up. On her way down she hit a wire or something that semi broke her fall, but she still shattered all the bones in her feet, ankles, legs, vertabrae. We never saw her again, and I don't know if she ever walked again? Her name was Katie Ernstein, I am still to this day haunted by the memory. The point I am trying to get across here, is nobody cares about your kid the way you parents out there do. Had she been at home, and been getting teased by kids at school atleast she would have had her parents to turn to. Atleast she would have had a home to go to where the walls would have protected her. We were mean, it was wrong, but you just don't understand the craziness of these places, until you find yourself in one of them. :cry:
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
f you were never in a program, or a parent of a child in a program, then you have no business posting here.

Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #33 on: November 30, 2005, 05:38:00 PM »
Sorry to say.........that's what happens when you feed your children to the wolves.
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Offline Deborah

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #34 on: January 16, 2006, 11:59:00 PM »
DA may have to start over in OTC murder case
By Will Davis
 
Ryan Chapman, one of six OTC counselors charged in the death of a 14-year-old camper, sits with his attorney durng Friday's hearing. (Staff photo/Will Davis)  
Technical errors on murder indictments against six former White County Outdoor Therapeutic Camp (OTC) counselors may get the charges thrown out, forcing prosecutors to start over.

Superior Court Judge Hugh Stone heard arguments Friday from defense attorneys claiming the errors should compel him to quash the indictments. If Stone throws out the indictments, it would force District Attorney Stan Gunter to seek new indictments from another grand jury. Stone said he would rule soon.

Defense attorneys claimed the indictments contained two errors. One, the indictments listed all 23 grand jurors when only 17 heard evidence and voted to indict. Secondly, the assistant foreman signed the indictments as the foreman because the foreman was out of town.

A White County grand jury handed down the indictments in July for an April 20, 2005 incident that led to the death of 14-year-old camper Travis Jackson. The six defendants, who worked as counselors at the state's Appalachian Wilderness Camp near Helen for juvenile delinquents, were Johnny Harris, 26, of Helen, Phillip Elliot, 35, of Chattanooga, Tenn., and Paul Michael Binford, 28, Ryan Chapman, 29, Matthew John Desing, 26, and Torbin Vining, 27, all of Athens.

The men allegedly restrained Parker using a tactic called a ?full basket,? pinning him to the ground for more than an hour after a behavior outburst. Counselors said he wouldn't stop fighting their efforts. The medical examiner ruled that Parker died from positional asphyxia and deemed it a homicide. The six men are charged with felony murder, cruelty to children and involuntary manslaughter. Five were fired and one, Harris, resigned. The state Department of Human Resources said they were fired for withholding the boy's asthma inhaler and a regular meal.

But the facts in the case weren't at issue in Friday's hearing in the White County courthouse, only the names of grand jurors on the indictments. Defense attorneys called two members of the grand jury for testimony.
 
Jury foreman Rodney Snapp testified he was excused from the OTC case because he had already planned to be in Florida during the deliberations.

?I was celebrating my 25th wedding anniversary,? said Snapp. ?Because I wanted to have a 26th anniversary.?

Defense attorneys also called assistant foreman Aubrey McIntyre. Attorney Doug McDonald questioned McIntyre for 25 minutes about which of the 23 grand jurors took part in the deliberations. McIntyre noted that several jurors were excused due to health problems or conflicts. McDonald noted that McIntyre didn't bring with him his personal notes on the deliberations that the state had subpoenaed. McIntyre, after the first 20 minutes of such questioning, shot back that he only got his subpoena on Thursday.

?Kerry (assistant district attorney Banister) came by my shop yesterday and I asked her why we had to come back and she didn't tell, and I still don't really know,? said McIntyre, adding later, ?I didn't think a vote (to indict) already registered with the clerk mattered.?

McDonald got McIntyre to concede the indictment is inaccurate because he signed it as foreman when he was only the acting foreman. McDonald also noted that McIntyre didn't take the oath of the foreman.

?I just don't think the law could be any clearer,? said defense attorney Dan Summer of Gainesville in his closing statement. ?The indictments must be perfect.? Summer conceded the issue doesn't reflect on the merits of the case, but said it's very important for government to constrain itself to proper form, or else it becomes tyranny.

If Judge Stone quashes the indictments, a new grand jury set to be seated Jan. 27 may be asked to re-indict the case, said prosecutors. Dozens of family members and friends of the six defendants were on hand Friday, but no family members of the victim were present.
 
Last Updated: Thursday, January 12, 2006
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Offline LauraLee

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #35 on: January 21, 2006, 12:53:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-22 05:00:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I know one of the counselors well and know that he would never intentionally harm a child, even one that hit his own grandmother and threatened her with a knife. I agree, the camp should shut down, but those in charge of the camp should face charges as well. This is just like the government trying to get away with torturing prisoners in camps - only those who are following orders get in trouble and when attention is drawn their way, in this unfortuate case when the young boy died, they (the authorities) act like they didn't know what was going on.



I am against the death penalty and your comment about the counselors rotting in hell disturbs me. Vindication should come from making the situation right - cursing those who are responsibe, even inadvertently and involuntarily, will not make the situation better. Keep working to shut down the camp and work to better our communities so children have better role models and learn how to act in society and we won't need places like this.



I hope that justice is granted, not that the conselors get what they "deserve.""


Hey, I'm not for the death penalty either, but sometimes people just need to get what's coming to them. Restraining a little 13-year-old not only is abuse, torture, but it's also murder. Now the law in North Carolina says that 1st degree murderers are eligible for the death penalty.

Trial by jury, anyone?  :grin:
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Offline Nihilanthic

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #36 on: January 22, 2006, 05:27:00 PM »
Quote
On 2005-11-22 05:00:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I know one of the counselors well and know that he would never intentionally harm a child, even one that hit his own grandmother and threatened her with a knife. I agree, the camp should shut down, but those in charge of the camp should face charges as well. This is just like the government trying to get away with torturing prisoners in camps - only those who are following orders get in trouble and when attention is drawn their way, in this unfortuate case when the young boy died, they (the authorities) act like they didn't know what was going on.



I am against the death penalty and your comment about the counselors rotting in hell disturbs me. Vindication should come from making the situation right - cursing those who are responsibe, even inadvertently and involuntarily, will not make the situation better. Keep working to shut down the camp and work to better our communities so children have better role models and learn how to act in society and we won't need places like this.



I hope that justice is granted, not that the conselors get what they "deserve.""


Now, if only the programs had that attitude towards the kids, instead of the punitive one you feel the programs dont deserve (but the kids... do?) we wouldn't be here, because they wouldn't be abused OR dead!

Shouldnt you be whining to the people hurting children to change their ways instead of asking us to go easy on those who we want held accountable?

Struggling Hypocrites...  :roll:

We should be careful to get out of an experience only the wisdom that is in it - and stop there;  lest we be like the cat that sits down on a hot stove-lid.  She will never sit down on a hot stove-lid again---and that is well;  but also she will never sit down on a cold one anymore.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/external-search?tag=circlofmiamithem&keyword=mark+twain&mode=books' target='_new'> Mark Twain

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #37 on: February 11, 2006, 12:46:00 PM »
Have any of the people here freaking out on this reply list ever had to work with at risk children, brain damaged children ,or developmentally delayed children?
    There are always two sides to every story. I worked in D.D. services for 3 and a half years during my time in this field when this kindof preventitive hold was shown to be dangerous and we were told to stop using it. I have worked with some clients where most people couldn't imagine the type of crap that they pulled. And I had to learn to do all kinds of preventitive intervention methods. Like holding clients in approved holds until they were ready to calm down and it seemed like they were no longer a danger to themselves or to others.
    I don't know about this situation. I wasn't there and just from this little description I wouldnt exactly say that the evidence is all in.You know I think it can be so easy to respond to a situation like this with blame. So many people want to curse whoever was involved when a child dies. Unless your doing this kindof work unless you've done this kindof work; one might ask oneself-what was I doing the night all this was going on?What kindof service to I give to the world? Do I have a right to jump to conclusions? What if my child was on both sides of this situation. What if my child was the counselor? Would I be as quick to jump to a conclusion.
     And for the jujitsu master that's wondering why anyone with a behavioral problem should be in the woods?!?   Simmer down naw!
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Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #38 on: February 11, 2006, 04:18:00 PM »
Excuse me!  You are trying to relate "service to the world" to  a dead child?  
There is no excuse for this child being dead. NONE!
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Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #39 on: February 11, 2006, 07:13:00 PM »
Quote
On 2006-02-11 09:46:00, Anonymous wrote:

Have any of the people here freaking out on this reply list ever had to work with at risk children, brain damaged children ,or developmentally delayed children?


yes
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Offline cherish wisdom

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #40 on: February 12, 2006, 01:25:00 AM »
I've worked with them and they respond really well to kindness and love. Something they get little of in residential programs.

I think the human race encountered Peak Intelligence decades or centuries ago. The human race has been degrading into imbeciles ever since.
http://www.erichufschmid.net/Conspiracies_Underdogs_Main.html' target='_new'>Eric Hufschmid

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If you lack wisdom ask of God and it shall be given to you.\"

Offline Anonymous

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #41 on: February 12, 2006, 02:06:00 AM »
I'm with you, Cherish Wisdom. Love and kindness and children all go hand in hand.
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Offline Deborah

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #42 on: February 19, 2006, 07:51:00 PM »
Sorry, this post lost
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Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline Deborah

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #43 on: February 19, 2006, 08:30:00 PM »
Sorry, this post lost
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700

Offline Deborah

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13 year is killed in Teen Residential Program
« Reply #44 on: June 13, 2007, 07:09:06 PM »
Judge Dismisses Charges
More discussion:
http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.ph ... 763#265763
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Hidden Lake Academy, after operating 12 years unlicensed will now be monitored by the state. Access information on the Federal Class Action lawsuit against HLA here: http://www.fornits.com/wwf/viewtopic.php?t=17700