My Son At Thayer

[Antigen]

Nemo, that really doesn't ruin my day. In fact I'm glad to know it. I've said from the beginning (of my interest in drug policy) that the conservatives and law-n-order types will be the first to step up and make a real difference in this tragic comedy.

But first they'd have to come to terms w/ the realization that the neocons who have taken over the GOP are not their daddy's conservatives! And that's happening. I'm confident we'll soon put down this silly, myth based war and move on to the next silly, myth based war. Looks like next round will be fought over more overtly religious dogma.

As de dawg chases his tail...

I believe that all important matters have to be settled here, not in the clouds somewhere after we kick off.
--Billy Joel, American musician

[Anonymous]

Dear Nemo,

As I looked through this web site it struck me that your remarks were made with some intelligence. My wife and I were also blessed with a hard case child who was worth more than the life in which he was headed.

I also cannot commment on other peoples experience with Thayer but, my wife and I have seen our child and the school, and it appears to be working very well. We have a child who is grateful and working to his potential. Our own son has told us that he needed the regimented program and that he is feeling better about himself.

I thank you for posting the information you have given. Any program that makes a child stronger by not coddling them, and does not hit everyones warm and fuzzy buttons will be criticized.

I take this in stride because we also are seeing our child's growth. Thank you for being a positiive voice in this cesspool of negativity.

A loving parent

[Antigen]

One name, fool; Roberto Reyes.

Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0688163157/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'> John F. Kennedy

[Anonymous]

A loving parent"

You sent your kid to a highly abusive program in which there has already been one death, and you dare call yourself "loving"? You dumped your kid in a hellcamp when he needed you most. Shame on you.

[TheWho]

Its a horrorable thing that one person has died at this school, but the missing piece is how many have been saved!!!  If the school did not exist how many would be dead -- none?  5  10 ?? Try to determine the cause of that childs death and try to change it.  Education, training, policy change overseeing, staffing, new model etc.  Shutting down the entire Auto industry isnt a solution to saving people from dieing in auto accidents, They make Ambulances too.

[Antigen]

Nah, bullshit. It's not just the fact that this one kid (that we know of) died while attending Thayer. You should read up on the investigation. The circumstances which brough about his death were 1) horrendous and 2) likely still extant at Thayer.

They tortured that boy. Not only that, they coerced other inmates to take part in the torture and death of that boy.

You're a damned fool if you don't know the details. It's all quite public and easily knowable. And your kid will figure that out sooner or later.

Step 1. We came to understand that the government is powerless over people's private use of drugs and that the War on Drugs was making the government's life unmanageable.

--Scott Tillinghast

[tlcrescue]

On 2005-09-13 11:20:00, Anonymous wrote:

"Its a horrorable thing that one person has died at this school, but the missing piece is how many have been saved!!!  If the school did not exist how many would be dead -- none?  5  10 ?? Try to determine the cause of that childs death and try to change it.  Education, training, policy change overseeing, staffing, new model etc.  Shutting down the entire Auto industry isnt a solution to saving people from dieing in auto accidents, They make Ambulances too.  "

they key word here being "accident".  You cannot possibly compare an auto accident to abuse.  Besides, if someone drives a car negligently and causes an "accident", why should the auto manufacturer be held liable?

Try another comparative to get your point across, because that one just doesn't fly.

And, to all you anons, why do you not register and provide your contact info?  You praise this place, yet don't say who you are?  Those of us against this type of abuse have no problem providing our information to show we are legit.

[TheWho]

I guess my point is more comparative data is needed.  To say someone died from neglect at a TBS has no substance !!! A lot of people care but what should be done?  What is the cause?  The counselor, the school?  Is this an isolated case?  How about the football coach who sends a slow halfback around the track one more time in 90 degree heat and he dies.  Is 1 too many?  Should we shut the football programs down?  Close the schools?  What we should be looking at is how many kids are dieing at TBS vs high schools or kids that run away and end up dead.  How many kids will die if the parents/system sit back and do nothing?

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-27 10:32:00, Anonymous wrote:

"I guess my point is more comparative data is needed.  To say someone died from neglect at a TBS has no substance !!! A lot of people care but what should be done?  What is the cause?  The counselor, the school?  Is this an isolated case?  How about the football coach who sends a slow halfback around the track one more time in 90 degree heat and he dies.  Is 1 too many?  Should we shut the football programs down?  Close the schools?  What we should be looking at is how many kids are dieing at TBS vs high schools or kids that run away and end up dead.  How many kids will die if the parents/system sit back and do nothing?"

This is the oldest and most lame argument used by the pro-teen help industry.

Yes, one death if caused by abuse, neglect, exploitation and/or victimization is one too many.

These are NOT ACCIDENTS.

You would know that if you didn't have your head stuck up your progamized ass.

I'm sorry, but you are not doing families or kids any favors by falsifying the truth about the teen help industry which is grossly under-regulated and rife with allegations of abuse, and fatalities caused by criminal negligence.

 :eek:

[TheWho]

Yes, one death if caused by abuse, neglect, exploitation and/or victimization is one too many.



These are NOT ACCIDENTS.

 :eek: "

Okay so we found common ground, back to the football coach who victimizes the kid, forces him to run around the track in 90 heat while the rest of the kids take showers and he dies:
Based on your logic we should shut all the schools down or stop playing football in the U.S.

I feel we should address root cause and start by punishing the coach.  It wouldnt be fair to all the kids who have good coaches and benifit from the game
Next, start putting oversight in place to prevent this from reoccurring.  But to just shut everything down !!!  Come on !!!! That will never fly in a million years and you will just lose credability for waving that flag.  Try being proactive, constructing and try to push for improvements, oversight etc.

[Antigen]

On 2005-09-27 16:11:00, Anonymous wrote:

Okay so we found common ground, back to the football coach who victimizes the kid, forces him to run around the track in 90 heat while the rest of the kids take showers and he dies:
Based on your logic we should shut all the schools down or stop playing football in the U.S.

I won't argue with you. We should stop playing football. Soccer is just a more friendly, international sport. Plus, it takes less equipment and doesn't beat up the players half as much.

Seriously, though. If there were a pattern among a bunch of affiliated schools over years, kids were dropping left and right, such coaches were rarely, if ever, sanctioned in any meaningful way, then yes, we'd have a problem on the magnitude of what we're talking about.

In the more commonly accepted reality, if one highschool athalete dies under suspicious circumstances, the coach is investigated by default and, likely, would be fired. Who the hell wants a coach that kills kids? So his future in highschool sports is over. He'd have to go looking to the troubled parent industry for work. I wonder how often that happens?

The right of self-defense is the first law of nature . . and when the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction.

--St. George Tucker, in his edition of Blackstone's Commentaries

[TheWho]

Thank you Antigen -- sometimes its hard to get a point across.  The problem needs to be quantified.  If we write to our congressmen and tell them about a boy who was killed in a boarding school it will be filed right next to the one who is trying to have Peanuts banned from the stores because his wife choked on one.
If you approach them with figures:
Example
"4% of all students at TBS are restrained and of those, 6% suffer brain damage and 1% die.  30% of all graduates relapse back to their old patterns, 60% move on to better lives and 10% drop out.

Nation wide less than 1% of the children die or are restrained etc, etc,"

This will raise eyebrows, the numbers the facts.  Trying shut places down is a dead end.

[Anonymous]

Bottom Line:  There is no excuse for abuse and until this country adopts a ZERO TOLERANCE POLICY for parental abuse by proxy, the teen help industry will continue to thrive.

Now ... to the program mental midgets ... when a car is defective and seriously injures or kills somebody, the manufacturer will call for a RECALL of the model and make of that car.  

Teen Help programs are a PRODUCT used by parents to control/change their child's attitude and behavior.

If a program seriously injures or kills a kid, that program should be immediately shut down, not allowed to stay open pending a criminal or civil investigation.  Why?  Because it is unsafe at any speed.

This is one of the REFORMS that anti-teen help advocates are pushing for.

Deal with it!

 :smokin:

[TheWho]

If a program seriously injures or kills a kid, that program should be immediately shut down, not allowed to stay open pending a criminal or civil investigation.  Why?  Because it is unsafe at any speed.



This is one of the REFORMS that anti-teen help advocates are pushing for.



Deal with it!



 :smokin:



"

Good start
Of course this will need to be applied to all TEEN PROGRAMS, football, band camp, soccer camp, boy scouts, girl scouts, baseball camp, all youth outreach programs, all boarding schools therapeuticor or otherwise, any program is unsafe if someone dies.
They are doing that now in Massachusetts.  If a child dies during a sport practice or a camp an investigation ensues and the camp or team can be shut down until cause is determined, maybe they can use this as a model

[Anonymous]

On 2005-09-27 19:17:00, Anonymous wrote:

"

If a program seriously injures or kills a kid, that program should be immediately shut down, not allowed to stay open pending a criminal or civil investigation.  Why?  Because it is unsafe at any speed.





This is one of the REFORMS that anti-teen help advocates are pushing for.





Deal with it!





 ::bigsmilebounce::