Author Topic: Moral Relativism and WWASPS  (Read 1666 times)

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Offline Anonymous

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« on: August 02, 2006, 06:04:23 PM »
There is no right or wrong.

There are no accidents.



These are the values of WWASPS. Anyone who has been in a seminar knows this, these points are driven home repeatedly. It is convenient for an organization to throw out the idea of moral absolutism -- perhaps -- that child abuse is ALWAYS wrong no matter what reasoning behind it.

To WWASPies, everything that happens in their life, is directly caused by their actions. If a mugger comes up and robs you and shoots you, it's your fault. What could you have done to prevent that attack?

Sound confusing and contradictary? It is, and this is what they are teaching -- (clears throat) -- forcing down the kids throat with threat of isolation, more lockup time and even violence if they do not comply.

There is no right or wrong. Now that is a bold statement if I ever heard one. WWASPS philosophy is to destroy the 'old self' and to rebuild a 'new self', but in order to do that the facilitator must DESTROY any and all sense of previous value systems. This is done through high pressure, high drama, LGAT trainings. People throw around the term brainwashed as if it can only be done in the movies. Let me tell you right now, it is extremely easy to accomplish.

Imagine a David Duke scenario, inolving kids and parents and you might get an idea of what a seminar is like. Heard the final tapes of the Duke cult finally killing themselves? If you haven't, go take a listen, it could have been David Gilcrease himself making. Scary.

There is no right or wrong. If there is no right or wrong, then why would it be an issue for anyone if I decided to go assasinate top leaders of WWASPS. According to their own logic, there is nothing wrong with this. Heck, it would even be THEIR fault because remember, there are no accidents.

Oh, I see. Moral relativity works for the people in power, because they use force in order to enforce their version or morality, whatever that might be. When truly sick individuals are in charge of an organization, they make the rules and decide what is moral or not. Suddenly, locking a child in a dog cage is not immoral. Suddenly, and forcing children to lay face down on cement for eight hours a day is not child abuse. They somehow are able to justify pepper spraying and beating kids up.

Do you see where moral relativism leads too? It leads to thousands of parents sending their kids away, knowing full well of the damage it might cause, but they make the decision it is worth the risk. It's worth destroying the old kid's value system in order to have a new one. One that might mesh better with the parents plans, or hopes, or dreams.

What happens if a program decides that throwing kids off a cliff, in order to weed out the ones who don't really want to survive off. After all, there are no accidents. If they don't survive the fall, then they must have done something wrong. Oh, but wait, there are no right or wrongs, so maybe the kid didn't graduate the program fast enough? Gets confusing, doesn't it. That is why kids come out of these places so jaded. The kids who accepted the false teachings of WWASPS as true ARE brainwashed. They are brainwashed in the same way militant islamists and nazis and north koreans were brainwashed. This is nothing new.

Listen to a program graduate speak. First thing out of their mouth -- did you graduate the program? The reason they ask is because if you didn't they cannot be your friend. Seriously.

When there are no right or wrong, violence, murder and death occur. Are we really all that susprised at the outcome of this horrible social experiment?


Aparently, not yet.


 :(
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2006, 06:16:54 PM »
I'm strongly reminded of Scientology.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Deborah

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« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2006, 11:00:22 PM »
***There is no right or wrong. If there is no right or wrong, then why would it be an issue for anyone if I decided to go assasinate top leaders of WWASPS. According to their own logic, there is nothing wrong with this. Heck, it would even be THEIR fault because remember, there are no accidents.

The irony here, is that if there's no right or wrong, why are kids packed in their warehouses? I'm sure they're not there for doing something "right".
Double standards. Their "logic" applies when it benefits themselves.
And, how can it be the pizza's fault if it's "half baked", didn't the baker fail to cook it long enough?
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Offline mbnh31782

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2006, 03:43:40 PM »
Moral and WWASPS should not be in the same sentence let alone the same planet.  There is nothing moral about sending a child to a Behavior Modification Program or a Therapeutic Boarding School.  Unfortunately, society looks to label and medicate "problem" children.  

Quote
The kids who accepted the false teachings of WWASPS as true ARE brainwashed. They are brainwashed in the same way militant islamists and nazis and north koreans were brainwashed. This is nothing new.

This is very true.

Quote
Listen to a program graduate speak. First thing out of their mouth -- did you graduate the program? The reason they ask is because if you didn't they cannot be your friend. Seriously.


That only applies to the "brainwashed" graduates.  Other non graduates or graduates who have come to their senses realize the level of brainwashing and conformity that is forced in the programs.

Anyhow, WWASPS have no morals though they pretend they do.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Anonymous

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2006, 02:48:32 AM »
This bit that gets me is this:

Behaviour does not occur in a vacuum. Behaviour is interactive. There's a sort of "Which came first" relationship at work in buch of behavioural science but it can be broadly understood that when a given behaviour occurs there is a pretty logical and well understood cause and effect pattern behind it. The cause generally comes boils down to one of two things

Neurochemical: A behaviour occurs because the brain is wired that way, there;s nothing you can do about this except to manage the brain chemistry through medication/diet/wtfever

Environmental: A behaviour occurs as a response to an external stimulus or series of stimuli. This is massively more common that the neurochemical explaination but it does bring us to a startling revelation.....
Children are not defiant/disobediant/disorderly for no reason.
If your child disrespects you then you've got to ask yourself "What did I did to earn this disrespect and how can I fix it"

You can't cure a problem by attacking the symptom and behavioural issues are only symptoms of larger problem.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »

Offline Nihilanthic

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #5 on: August 05, 2006, 03:24:19 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
This bit that gets me is this:

Behaviour does not occur in a vacuum. Behaviour is interactive. There's a sort of "Which came first" relationship at work in buch of behavioural science but it can be broadly understood that when a given behaviour occurs there is a pretty logical and well understood cause and effect pattern behind it. The cause generally comes boils down to one of two things

Neurochemical: A behaviour occurs because the brain is wired that way, there;s nothing you can do about this except to manage the brain chemistry through medication/diet/wtfever

Environmental: A behaviour occurs as a response to an external stimulus or series of stimuli. This is massively more common that the neurochemical explaination but it does bring us to a startling revelation.....
Children are not defiant/disobediant/disorderly for no reason.
If your child disrespects you then you've got to ask yourself "What did I did to earn this disrespect and how can I fix it"

You can't cure a problem by attacking the symptom and behavioural issues are only symptoms of larger problem.


Thats because they dont care, and they dont provide therapy. Theyre behavior modification programs and the parent is the consumer.

Its been made very clear, but only if you pressure them about it. And theyre pretty nonrepentant.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
DannyB on the internet:I CALLED A LAWYER TODAY TO SEE IF I COULD SUE YOUR ASSES FOR DOING THIS BUT THAT WAS NOT POSSIBLE.

CCMGirl on program restraints: "DON\'T TAZ ME BRO!!!!!"

TheWho on program survivors: "From where I sit I see all the anit-program[sic] people doing all the complaining and crying."

Offline 001010

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2006, 04:30:33 PM »
Those were taken from EST's Werner Erhard, David Gilcrease's mentor and trainer.
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2006, 04:46:13 PM »
It would help if you quoted it correctly...

"It's NOT ABOUT right or wrong, it's about what's working or not working."

Does that make more sense or will it be about being right?

 :lol:
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Offline Anonymous

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2006, 06:40:26 PM »
POsters on the wall at the seminars "THERE IS NO RIGHT OR WRONG"
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Offline MightyAardvark

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Moral Relativism and WWASPS
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2006, 10:53:39 AM »
Quote from: ""Guest""
This bit that gets me is this:

Behaviour does not occur in a vacuum. Behaviour is interactive. There's a sort of "Which came first" relationship at work in buch of behavioural science but it can be broadly understood that when a given behaviour occurs there is a pretty logical and well understood cause and effect pattern behind it. The cause generally comes boils down to one of two things

Neurochemical: A behaviour occurs because the brain is wired that way, there;s nothing you can do about this except to manage the brain chemistry through medication/diet/wtfever

Environmental: A behaviour occurs as a response to an external stimulus or series of stimuli. This is massively more common that the neurochemical explaination but it does bring us to a startling revelation.....
Children are not defiant/disobediant/disorderly for no reason.
If your child disrespects you then you've got to ask yourself "What did I did to earn this disrespect and how can I fix it"

You can't cure a problem by attacking the symptom and behavioural issues are only symptoms of larger problem.



whoops, ghost post. This is me.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »
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Offline Anonymous

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« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2006, 12:22:21 PM »
There is no right or wrong - only what works - OH Hell Yes!

The damn program beats you over the head with this psychopathic philosophy.

Also - as has been noted - the idea of no such thing as a victim. If you were raped, it is because you put you self in a situation where by you would be raped - so there fore - you caused it -  so there fore - you are not a victim.

The only real damage done, was you let yourself believe you were a victim. The victim mentality is what is hurting you. You must acknowledge the part you played in the rape (Accountability, don't ya know) and quite thinking of yourself as a victim. Being a victim, is about the worst thing you can be. And of corse - once you get the kids well baked with this idea - you are pretty safe from any accusation of having hurt them. If you did hurt them - it was their fault - and did them good.  Once they have accepted the idea that there is no such thing as a victim - and 'thinking like a victim' is pitiful and weak and degrading - you are pretty safe from them ever claiming to have been victimized by you.

These ideas caused me All kinds of problems when I was on the BBS. All this is the total opposite of Christian thinking and belief. Lots of others too, know doubt - but I was relating to other Christians when discussing these ideas. How can you insist you are a Christian, and then embraces such a Godless philosophy?

Its about what Works! they would reply. Or, Your just stuck in your Head. Or, your all about being "right" - a terrible thing for anyone to be - stuck in their head, and thinking they are right. Well - Better than out of your head, and wrong. How hard is that to figure out?

Occassionally someone would write privately, and say that they agreed; but you just had to take the good with the bad. Take the best and ignor the rest was advised by these folks. But generally, not on the board.

I also had a hard time arguing that there are such things as Victims - and that it is no shame to be a victim - it is the perpetrator who did Wrong; not the victim.

The whole Program philosophy is much the same as you will learn in Scientology - it is very "New Age" in the beliefs it is imparting in the brain washing sessions. I pointed this out on the BBS as well - how "New Age" this thinking was - and how totally opposite this was of Christian, or Judaic, or Islamic thought.

One of the things that confirmed for me that this was a cult - and people were being brain washed, was the fact so many who claimed Christ had abandoned His teaching for this new age philosophy - altho they didn't seem able to understand this fact.

I had this strongly validated when I read Cults in Our Midst. She writes about Life Spring - and how much damage was done to men and women who were forced to attend by employers who had been sold on it, and thought this "Life Change" was something all their employees should experience.  It was forcing people to abandon long cherished ideas and belief systems, for one that was in total opposition - and this caused a good deal of mental anguish and the occasional mental collapse. She made the very same argument I had tried to make on the BBS - this is very New Age - and not at all in keeping with the beliefs found in Judaic/Christian beliefs, thought or traditions.

Once a person embraces the Seminar teaching, they replace God with the Program. "the Program" saved my family. The Program changes lives. The Program comes first - before family or friends or life long held, opposing beliefs.

From this Christian's perspective - "the program" is a plot hatched in the pits of Hell. It is leading people into the outer darkness. It is a tool of the destroyer. Any benefit felt gained from the Program is a deception - generated by the Great Liar himself.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by Guest »