Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > Who Am I Discovery/Whitmore
EMAIL FROM JOYCE HARRIS
Anonymous:
GOD HELP YOU, nothing justifies that, nor the fact that a law was broken, but that doesn't seem to factor in, does it? Bet it will later.
Antigen:
--- Quote ---On 2005-03-11 16:12:00, Anonymous wrote:
"hi antigen,
i have no connection, i am just parent that has been there done that, and honestly, not employed right now, so been spending a lot of time on the net. obviously, i am not the most computer literate, and i have to learn to type better.
what bothers me about this thread, is the poor child. weather she was abused or not i am not to judge, but i feel that the mother, joyce, is totally exploiting her. it is like the mother craves all this attention. when i had issues with my child, and believe me we had a lot, i would never dream to her there name here and the personal details. god forbid that child get on the net and see all this. god knows some is really ugly.
i am not sure you have kids or not, but i would hope you wouldn't do this to them. i feel for the child, that is all i can really say."
--- End quote ---
I do have kids. And I understand what you're saying, believe me! I'd have to go back and look to be absolutely certain, but I think the first person to drop this girl's (unusual) first name was someone posting from the Whitmore. And you have to admit that Harris is a pretty damned common name, so would probably never have come back on the kid if it had been left at that.
But then there were all the other really horrible posts about a couple of the kids who have either made complaints to the police or posted less than flattering things about the Whitmore.
And when I say "less than flattering", I mean just that! No one has described anything half as frightening as we routinely hear about some of these programs. It's also not shaping up to look quite like the pretty website they used to have. And, according to some of the parents, it's not what they agreed to pay for when the edcon sold them the program, either.
The thing about the horses is a little disturbing. But it also seems to be about negligence and incompetence, not so much intentional, sadistic torment. Just look over some of the claims about CEDU schools and how they employ animals in their 'therapeutic' programs. :eek: And those claims are coroborated by former employees, not just allegedly troubled kids.
It's all very telling about what kind of program the Whitmore offers and what kind of people the Sudweeks are. But I don't see anything here that tells a story that warrants the level of threats and intimidation we're seeing here. Do you?
I mean, if someone wants their kid to learn to behave the way we're seeing Whitmore defenders behave here, then by all means, that probably does beat hell out of 18 straight months on their faces under threat of serious physical injury! But they ought to know what they're getting.
All religions bear traces of the fact that they arose during the intellectual immaturity of the human race - before it had learned the obligations to speak the truth. Not one of them makes it the duty of its God to be truthful and understandable in his communications.
--Freidrich Nietzsche, German philosopher
--- End quote ---
Anonymous:
hi antigen,
my only concern really, is about the child. there is a lot uglyness here. i am embarrass to say, but that is why i kept reading it all and was totoally blown away. has much mud that has been slung, all i can think about is how can this mother, joyce, exploit this child and continue to air her complaints. take them to the lawyer, protect the child. children first! she is a very selfish lady from what ihave read. i read that note she sent to the shcool and honestly, it could probably be written by many parents. i think most of us have seen troubled times, we are here arent we.
but most disturbing is this mother totally wont stop about the sexual abuse, mental, physical and whatever else she is claiming. most normal people know you take it to the lawyers first.
in my defense i read a posting that had a phone number for the ag severson. the post said to call to confirm the abuse or the allegations. since i am home doing nothing, curiousity got the best of me, i called. nothing in the conversation backed up one thing joyce has said. nothing. this was the ag! they are who files criminal charges, and nothing, nothing is pending and nothing is filed.
in my opinion, joyce needs to take care of her own mental being as well as try to take care of that young child. i just feel for that child. no matter who was the first one to post the child's name, joyce certainly provoked it all. you have to admit it. she is not stopping. i am intrigued, but it is out of the feelings of sadness for zita. the other ridiculous thing the mother, joyce, keeps saying, read isac! who cares about them? i did care about the ag's office, now that is credible. can isac defend zita in a court room? can isac offer mental therapy to zita? what credence can they give? are they lawyers? are they any type of professional? no! they are not. so my heart goes out to the child.
thanks antigen for listening.
Antigen:
Look, again, I agree w/ you about publicly discussing some of these sensitive issues. That was my advice initially. I haven't changed my mind. FWIW, I'm just as deeply offended by just about everything that goes under the banner "daytime talk". It makes me physically ill to see Maurey Povich hook a little girl up to a "lie detector" machine and then start grilling her in front of a live studio audience about her sex life.
But different strokes for different folks. People don't always take my advice. But then, they're not bound to. I'm not anybody's mama but my own kids.
So we agree on that. Can we move on now?
About ISAC, they're an industry watchdog.
"ISAC's mission: To ensure through research, investigation, and publication that all children maintain their dignity, are treated with respect, and their civil rights are not abridged."
http://isaccorp.org/aboutus.html
That's what they do. They take statements from consumers, verify the ID of the person making the claims and then add them to the collection. They also verify documents and include citations in case you want to check up on their checking. They don't hold themselves out as doing anything other than that. If you don't like that they're asking for donations then don't donate. Works for me :wink:
Trust me on this one (or not), if you spot any inacuracy, Shelby is the first and most grateful to want to know about it. At least that has been my experience whenever I've asked for verification of anything on the site.
I don't know who's pursuing what investigations. I do know that Nephi PD has been interested at some point because they asked me for logging info on a couple of posts. I'll leave it to your imagination to guess which posts and whether or not they got what they asked for. I wouldn't want to give away info. that might complicate the investigation.
If you believe that people cannot be trusted to govern themselves,
then can they be trusted to govern others?
--Thomas Jefferson
--- End quote ---
Anonymous:
thanks antigen. agree to not to agree. works for me.
as far as isac, i understand what you are saying and even give them credit for the reports, but it is sad to say, they really have no authority or credence. you mentioned a person male/female, shelby. is this person a licensed private eye, lawyer, professional of any kind? what make this person different then you or i? if they are a layman, which is not bad, just goes to show that there is no real authoritive basis. you have good information here too, we are all sharing our stuff. so maybe this person is somebody with credentials, but i certainly didnt see any listed on the site.
on the other side, http://www.emancipationproject.org has very qualified people, there backgrounds and resumes are there. doctors and lawyers! now this is a group i would align with and plan to.
only my opinions.
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