Did the seed introduce us to a higher power?

[Jimmy Cusick]

Ive been wondering what role the seed played in my present day spirituality. When we worked the 3rd step-Turned our life and will over to the care of a higher power- Did that mean to assume we had a god of our understanding or to invent one or to use the group as a higher power?
As I remember Jesus Christ was the God of my childhood but I dont remember using him much in my teenage seed years. I did use the mountains, the tree's, the universe as cosmic higher power but I think that was after the seed.

I dont think I learned much about spirituality in the seed as I was taught to rely on self for the power to accomplish whatever it was that I was attempting to do. Why cant I remember learning anything about God? Did any other seedlings have similiar experiences? Let me know.
 Jimmy

[GregFL]

Jimmy, in st pete, in 1973, "the group" was most everyone´s higher power.

I always thought this was so hippocritical, art used to tell people their kids would be straight, love God and country, but in reality the seed had a definite athiestic bent.

In answer to your question I can so with absolute certainty the seed played and plays no role in my spirituality or lack thereof

[GregFL]

Also, you were never taught to rely of ¨self¨but rather were taught that your ¨self¨was weak and powerless and doomed to ultimate failure without the seed.

[cleveland]

I didn't learn anything about god or my own spirituality. I just learned to follow the group without question...

Religion was discouraged, like anything else that wasn't 100% Seed...I can't imagine somebody actually praying, wearing religious clothing, attending church or temple, or having a religious discussion at the Seed. "My Higher Power is the Group" was the only thing we were encouraged to say.

[marshall]

Some oldcomers did attend church while I was on the program. But it was rare. I recall a few oldtimers visiting and speaking about finding god or getting born-again, etc. We were told that art borrowed ideas from many of the major world's religions as well as psychology when he constructed the seed program.

The seed was too close to being a religion itself to encourage or allow too much religious involvement. I remember being actively discouraged from asking any 'deep' or existential questions. Such inquiries as to the meaning of life, what happens when we die or the origin of the universe, etc.  were dismissed as 'philosophical bullshit' and getting into your head. I remember one oldtimer acquantance that was struggling with these sort of questions and the seed concluded that he was crazy and the seed couldn't help him. He hadn't used drugs or alcohol, yet the seed rejected him and urged him to see a therapist. I knew him. He wasn't insane. Just asking the kinds of questions lots of people have asked through-out the ages. If the seed didn't have the answer...it was not a valid question.

If anyone questioned communism or the party-line, the soviet union routinely placed them in psychiatric hospitals. Since communism was obviously the perfect system, anyone doubting it 'must' be crazy!

[Fran]

I had always thought that a higher power was God. And I do remember everynight to hold hands and say the Lords Prayer. I do not recall talking about religion or beliefs but I also do not recall religion,God or beliefs to be put down either. But again this was in 73-early 75...I do not know what happened later on.[ This Message was edited by: Fran on 2005-01-20 19:32 ]

[Tony Stark]

It was not the creator we were introduced to but somewhat of a counterfit, but that was then. "Synanon" also uses world religions too. Google search it. But Bible study was encouraged to me by staff. :smokin:

May the fleas of one thousand llamas infest your armpits
--One ticked off sysadmin

_Don't be pissed at me sysadmin. I'm not going to cut your toungue out or gouge your eyes out. ________________
"This is a Republic"-VA Man.[ This Message was edited by: The Seeker on 2005-01-20 21:54 ]

[GregFL]

On 2005-01-20 19:26:00, Fran wrote:

"I had always thought that a higher power was God. And I do remember everynight to hold hands and say the Lords Prayer. I do not recall talking about religion or beliefs but I also do not recall religion,God or beliefs to be put down either. But again this was in 73-early 75...I do not know what happened later on.[ This Message was edited by: Fran on 2005-01-20 19:32 ]"

I think you are confusing "the lords prayer" with the serenity prayer, and in the context of saying "god grant me the serenity...", you are really asking the group to grant you these things.

In affect, you are in a very creepy way praying to the group.

[Fran]

No I remember everynight holding hands and saying the Lords prayer this basically closed the meetings even the open meetings where the parents came in we did this...and also we did say the Serenity Prayer. This prayer I use today without thought of the seed. Also the mustard seed was a big thing...I remember buying a necklace of a mustard seed and wearing it.
Like I said, I was there full time other then school from Jan-April 73 then I was an oldtimer for a year in half...we also said the Lords Prayer after every oldtimer meeting.
This was in Ft Lauderdale on 84....maybe after that time things changed.[ This Message was edited by: Fran on 2005-01-21 08:49 ]

[GregFL]

hmm...anyone else remember this?  I have a hard time believing the seed would say the lords prayer, but I certainly remember saying the serenity prayer...

Looking for independent verification of Fran's memory here.

[TRUCKER]

Thats how I remember it.

TRUCKER

[TRUCKER]

Just like Fran said.

TRUCKER

[Ican'tTalktoYou]

I was there in '73 and I do not remember ever saying the Lord's Prayer at the seed.

As a matter of fact, I was there two different times (commonly called a screw up) and I don't remember saying it either time.  The second time was late '74 or early '75.

My only experience was at the SR84 gate to hell, I never visited any of the others.....thank God.

[Anonymous]

On 2005-01-21 08:44:00, Fran wrote:

"No I remember everynight holding hands and saying the Lords prayer this basically closed the meetings even the open meetings where the parents came in we did this...and also we did say the Serenity Prayer. This prayer I use today without thought of the seed. Also the mustard seed was a big thing...I remember buying a necklace of a mustard seed and wearing it.

Like I said, I was there full time other then school from Jan-April 73 then I was an oldtimer for a year in half...we also said the Lords Prayer after every oldtimer meeting.

This was in Ft Lauderdale on 84....maybe after that time things changed.[ This Message was edited by: Fran on 2005-01-21 08:49 ]"

Fran is right. It was done this way until the day it shut its doors forever.

[Ican'tTalktoYou]

Well Greg, looks like you and I are the only ones that do not remember this.  I wonder why???  We both seem to have been very unhappy there.  Maybe we said it by rote every night. I can see how feelings of abandonment and unhappiness could do that.

What do you think?