Treatment Abuse, Behavior Modification, Thought Reform > The Seed Discussion Forum

Sorry Folks, the Seed helped me!!!

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Ft. Lauderdale:
Antigen what the f--- do you sugest Jimmy and your brother do?  If you hate seeing people go through the RINGER? No one is perfect.  Life is a journey filled with ups and downs.  I'm sorry -you repulse me.  I feel sorry for you.  You sound like you need help and don't try to tear down anyone else for trying to help themselves.  I'm sorry if I sound harsh but don't f--- with people trying to help themselves.

GregFL:
I think you miss the point Ft Laud. There is a contigent of people that, having gone thru stepcraft treatment and being told that only defective people can't stay straight after receiving these "gifts", repeatedly run themselves "thru the program" the rest of their lives setting up failure after failure. The latest success validates them, and their next failure knocks them off their high horse and totally ruins their self worth. The founder of AA himself said only genetically defective people couldn't work the program sucessfully. Funny saying when the best they can come up with is a 5% "success" ratio.

Anyway, this is the ringer Antigen speaks of... thinking somehow you failed the program, not that the program failed you.  AA and the seed share this dogma and it is destructive. Getting sober is a matter of wanting to do it and finding the willpower from within, not recanting magic formulas or singing silly songs.


As far as giving Jimmy a break, I only wish him the best, including wishing he would give himself a break from all this self loathing he has been doing around here. I suspect Jimmy is a real good guy that just keeps getting stuck. He is obviously conflicted about his seed experience but seems to feel it beneficial for his current situation if he finds good in what happened back then.

Jimmy, we are all with you here. All of us. Believe that.


Relax Ft Lauderdale, you will never like everyone you meet nor will you ever like everything said here. That is not the point. The point is freedom of expression about a common experience.

Anonymous:
:nworthy:  :nworthy: Cheers Greg.  I was just getting ready to write a very similar post.

Jimmy, we ARE with you.

cleveland:
Hey, I have to chime in here too...

I know 'Ft. Lauderdale' personally and he is one of the kindest people around...notwithstanding telling Antigen to 'f---off'...!!!

Jimmy sounds like a damn fine guy to me who is trying to do what's right for him - if 'the program' tools are honesty, trust and doing what's right then fine, I'm sure he can figure it out for himself over time..if not, then no program helps...it's really up to us in the end. And our families and friends. "Take what you want and leave the rest."

As for me, I think there's a dark side to the program - and an even darker side to other programs that use coercion and peer pressure. Let's face it, you can use coercion and peer pressure to cause a person to do good things...but those same tools can be used in a destructive way. There is absolutely no doubt about that.

So, for me, any 'program' - or political party, corporation, religion, or group - that uses group think, that shames those who disagree, that thinks only 'they' have the answer - I will have to say - no thanks.

I know Antigen has a strong viewpoint, Ft. Lauderdale equally so. You guys can agree to disagree at some point and keep the dialog open, or just shut each other down, which I think would be a loss to us all. We are all just middle-aged people trying to figure life out, yes?

GregFL:
yes

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