I Believe in Father Christmas

[BuzzKill]

//Why is it that you all can't have a civil, CRITICAL THOUGHT discussion? CRITICAL THOUGHT being the operative words here.//

Anon atheist, I'm sorry if I seemed un-civil. It wasn't my intent.
Critical thought?
I think I can handle it well enough.
I would say, you seem to be the one upset by it; at least when it is not in agreement with your thoughts.

you explain:  The reason for the quotes was to ask if they believed also that some of our founding fathers and some very prominent scientists were schizo as well.

OK, fair enough. And I told you what I thought about the Founding Fathers. Isn't that also fair enough?

You write: We 'atheists' were responding to some of the holier-than-thou posts that have been written here.

Define "here." Do you mean the forums in general; or just Charlie Brown's thread on Christmas?
I feel like you are upset and offended by ALL Christian thought, anywhere. Am I wrong?
I feel like you, and maybe other anons (who can tell?) Were annoyed by the subject and felt compelled to jump in with thoughts and quotes you felt would put the Christian's in their place. Their place being (you seem to think) among the ignorant, unthinking, dull minded masses.  And then, you seem to want to take offence at my defending my faith with an explanation of why I hold to it. How was anything in that un-civil?

This *is* the Open forum - where we may talk about whatever. So, no reason for you to be so bent out of shape, that the Christians are having a discussion on the subject of Christmas and the Bible.

Personally, I try not to bring the subject up on the other forums Ginger has; because I know it isn't welcome. I have on occasion; when some one else brought up the subject; explained some Christian ideas and theology on the other forums.
But I don't think you can find an occasion where I was less than civil in such cases.

I think this is also you:
 I'm just asking for you accept that I might understand all of what you're saying and still disagree with it. Can you do that?

Sure. I think I was very clear on that point.
"its fine if you don't believe. Fine with me, I mean. I don't want to argue with you about it."
[ This Message was edited by: BuzzKill on 2004-12-03 14:53 ]

[Tony Stark]

It's an old testament promise I am keeping my mindset to. A new era promised by he prophets. In the book of Issiah, and Jeramiah, and other books of the apocalypse. I'm not a holier tan thou. Shit, I can't even make it to the toilet or the shower in time before somebody else does before me. Kids are kids. Just baby goats. Parents should take their children to church and they should set a good example and rear their children up to be children of God. Shit, if it means sparing the rod your gonna spoil the child. And they make all kinds of rods. Sometime in their lives they'll come to a crossroad or a crisis and they'll make a decision that will effect their whole life on this planet. And it's not a religious decision. It's a spiritual question. So I should say I don't belong to any church or temple or mosque but I can tell you I've always found refuge in the good book in times of trouble. Now I've gone past it and come to a different level because I'm not childish anymore. I suggest a good sit down with your child and have them baptized with water and then taught the scrpture and teach your child wisdom from the good book. Not from programs. Not from self-help books. Just train them up and then let 'em go when they're ready to fly the nest out into the earth and into the kingdom. Always be there for your child even if he is under trials and forsake him not if he or she is sincere. But don't force things on a grown-up child of yours. Let them come home when they chose. I don't know what else to say..........I don't have all te answrs since I don't know any of you all either. Just remeber kids are kids and they are little monsters. Children are of all ages.

Next the statesmen will invent cheap lies, putting the blame upon the nation that is attacked,  and every man will be glad of those conscience-soothing falsities, and will diligently study them, and refuse to examine any refutations of them; and thus he will by and by convince himself that  the war is just, and will thank God for the better sleep he enjoys after this process of grotesque  self-deception."  
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0517150735/circlofmiamithem' target='_new'>Mark Twain, The Mysterious Stranger, 1916, Ch.9

[Anonymous]

Buzzkill, I have nothing against you and respect what you have written here.  My comments are more directed to Charlie Brown.  Sorry for the baghead but I just can't get into another personal war here and every time I come out from under the bag it immediately goes there.  I try hard not to engage in the attacks.  I admit that the occassional remark comes out but mainly after I've felt it coming towards me.  

As I explained, I have no problem with people believing.  I"m not trying to make them not believe.  I stated my opinion after seeing other do the same.  Some of the discussion has been useful, if you pick through the bullshit.  I just don't like it when people assume that because I don't believe that it means that I'm just missing something that the other 'enlightened ones' are getting.  Again, that implies that they are completely right and I just don't get it yet.  THAT'S where a lot of my problem with this lies.  

For the record, I do not have a problem with all Christian thought.  Quite the contrary.  I think there are wonderful lessons to be learned from the Bible.  Does that mean I believe it to be true?  Absolutely not.  

If I've come across as snotty or demeaning to you then I sincerely apologize.  Charlie Brown however comes across with that holier than thou shit and sorry, I'm going to respond to that.

[Anonymous]

I went back and re-read the thread.  As far as I can see this is where the attacks began.

On 2004-12-02 18:25:00, Charlie Brown wrote:

"Oh them? They don't have any idea of what reality is. Pity their philosophied disgrace. The only thing they see in the Bible is their own Personal loss of God in their lives. Let 'em bitch. They're freemason dogs. Totally without.

If triangles had a God, He'd have three sides.
--Old Yiddish proverb

"

Sysyadmin, did you know Mark Twain was as delusional and schizophrenic as you are?

The problem may be that Charlie thinks that SysAdmin is putting certain quotes after his posts.  The quotes pop up randomly.  There are quite a few anti=religious (if that's what you want to call them) in there so if he doesn't want them poppin up in his posts, he can simply turn off the quote feature.

[Anonymous]

On 2004-12-03 14:53:00, Charlie Brown wrote: Parents should take their children to church and they should set a good example and rear their children up to be children of God.

 

I suggest a good sit down with your child and have them baptized with water and then taught the scrpture and teach your child wisdom from the good book.

THAT'S what I'm talking about.  "Parents should do this..."  not 'this is how I would raise my kids'...just "parents SHOULD take their children to church.  I know, semantics.  But it contributes to how he comes across.

 

Just remeber kids are kids and they are little monsters. Children are of all ages

I have no idea what[/b] to say to this.

[BuzzKill]

I think you might be right that the "random" quote feature sometimes causes confussion and offence.

As for some of what is upsetting you - try and not take it so seriously. We all have our personal situations to deal with, and Charlie sometimes has trouble getting his thoughts down clearly. This is an occassion for compassion, not argument.

[Anonymous]

Point taken Buzzkill.  I'm not as anti-God as I might come across.  I don't believe in the same type of a god as you all do, but I have my own spirituality.  It's more actual religion that I have a problem with.  And people that can't seem to understand the separation of church and state.  That really bothers me.